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Brews & Views Bulletin Board Service * Brews and Views Archive 2003 * April 15, 2003 * Looking for an IPA recipe that screams HOPS!!!! < Previous Next >

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JT (24.169.130.250)
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2003 - 11:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've brewed SSOS but want something even hoppier. Something along the lines of Victory Hop Devil or Three Floyds Dreadnaught.
 

Bill Pierce (208.57.122.28)
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2003 - 11:55 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have trouble imagining a beer hoppier than Sister Star of the Sun, at least one that has enough malt to provide balance for all those hops. Less malt in the grain bill would lower the gravity and make the bittering unpleasant. It's not possible to achieve any more bittering than SSoS, as it already exceeds the solubility of alpha acids, and SSoS has an abundance of hop flavor as well. About all I can think of would be to very generously dry hop SSoS and serve it young before the hop aroma mellows somewhat.
 

JT (24.169.130.250)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 12:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I should clarify. It's not necessarily more bitterness that I'm after. After all, my version of SSOS is well over 100 IBU's which, I'm sure, is well beyond the limit of solubility and or perception. I'm looking for something that screams hops from start to finish.
I want it to burn my nosehairs. Is there a limit to dryhopping or aroma additions?
 

Mike Mayer (152.163.188.67)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 02:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

JT, check this one out (beer recipator, Hopped up IPA).

http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/recipator/recipator?group=2&item=3256

I tried this one about 6 months ago, and it is definetly for those who crave an overwhelming hop aroma/flavor in their beer. I will brew this one again for the summer. It takes about 2 months in the keg to really smooth out nicely.

Mike
Cleveland, OH
 

don price (65.32.41.146)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 04:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

JT,

Find a bong, fill it with SSOS, pack the bowl with cascades, and light it up. You might even burn your nosehairs.

Or use a really big hopback.

Don
 

Kevin Collins (64.154.108.205)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 04:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Don, that was funny.
 

Walt Fischer (24.221.196.114)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 06:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

R O F L ...........!!
peffffft...pfffffIIIFFTTTtttt....
pass the ipa, dude...

walt
----
 

Craig Johnson (172.195.87.203)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 11:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Don't bogart the IPA!
 

JT (24.169.130.250)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 12:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

whats a bong?....
 

Beerboy (81.134.197.39)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 12:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm hungry....
 

Jake Isaacs (128.163.110.72)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 04:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did you post at that exact time on purpose, don? :)
 

Denny Conn (140.211.82.4)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 05:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

JT, of course there's no limit to flavor or aroma additions. Maybe try another batch of SSOS and FWH the crap out of it, then dry hop with a couple of ounces of Columbus, then dry hop in the keg with either Cascade or Centennial. IIRC, SSOS uses a bunch of wimpy (!) English hops...replace them all with PNW varieties and double the amounts.
 

Hophead (167.4.1.38)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 08:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Double the amounts... That's a good one. Better make an extra gallon of wort to make up for all the absorption loss!

There's no limit to the additions, it's more of a less bang for your buck curve, as you continue to add past the taste/smell threshold...
 

Denny Conn (140.211.82.4)
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2003 - 09:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, maybe if you don't use the English hops you could get by with less amount...hey, he wanted ideas!
 

Todd Metcalf (129.42.208.182)
Posted on Thursday, April 03, 2003 - 12:07 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Rather than adding hops for the full boil (60 or 90 minute additions), add more at 45, 30, or 20 minutes. You'll need more hops because of the decrease in utilization due to the shorter time in the boil, but the bitterness may have more of a flavor behind it.

In one book I have ("Secrets from Master Brewers", or something like that), Greg Noonan wrote that he felt the beginning hop additions gave a harsher bitterness and prefered bittering hops added at 45 minutes instead. Still boil for the full 60 to 90 minutes.

I've tried his pub's IPA and it does have a great hop flavor.

Now for hops that will burn your nose hairs, I suggest mixing some hop pellets with grain alcohol and light a match. Sorry couldn't resist.
 

Greg Beron (24.126.4.201)
Posted on Saturday, April 05, 2003 - 08:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you want to take Todd's suggestion to the extreme, there's another recipe from "Secrets of the Master Brewers" that's worth considering. It's called Columbus IPA and the hop schedule is 4 oz. of Columbus at 20 min. It's an extract recipe, but there's no reason why you couldn't use the same hop schedule in an all-grain batch.

I tried it a couple of years ago after a discussion here (or maybe rec.crafts.brewing) got me started thinking about reducing boil times for extract beers. My recipe called for 3 oz. Columbus at 20 min., 1 oz. EKG at 10 min. and 1.5 oz. EKG dry hops. The hop heads loved it and I'm thinking about adding it as one of our standard store recipes.

Incidentally, if you're going to try the recipe from "Secrets...", there's a typo. According to Don Gortemiller, the correct recipe calls for 1 lb of Crystal 20, instead of what's in the book.

Greg Beron
Culver City Home Brewing Supply
 

Doug E. Fresh (64.26.199.51)
Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 06:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Gonna try this one soon. Just made it up with the HBD Recipator. I cannot wait to try it. Bring on the hops!

Hoppy Hoppy Joy Joy
7 lbs Light DME
1 lb Wheat DME
1 lb CarPils for steeping
1 lb CaraVienne for steeping
1 oz Columbus (45 min)
1 oz Columbus (30 min)
1 oz Columbus (15 min)
1 oz Columbus (dry-hop)
Irish Moss (15 min)
Full boil in 6.5 gal to make 5.5 gal.
 

Bill Pierce (208.57.122.28)
Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 07:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I know I harp on this one, but Carapils malt should not be steeped. If you are looking to increase the body of an extract beer you can add 4-8 oz. of malto-dextrin powder at the end of the boil.
 

Ray Danen (143.183.121.1)
Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 08:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you really want some hop flavor, add a few ounces of hop oil (or maybe a gallon). That should lite you up.

Cheers! :)

-Ray
 

Doug E. Fresh (64.26.199.51)
Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 09:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It's funny that so many extract w/ specialty grain recipes call for Dextrine (CaraPils) malt to be steeped. I've relied on this nice little chart for a while now and they seem to disagree with you, Bill: http://brewsupplies.com/grain_profiles.htm. You'll notice they supply a column indicating if the grain needs to be mashed or not.

I've used CaraPils in nearly every extract IPA I've done and since I've never tried making one without I couldn't tell you if it actually makes a difference or not. I will however give the malto-dextrin powder a try instead to see if that does make a difference. Maybe I just don't know what I am missing.

BTW, I am doing full boils for my extract recipes and with that I can DEFINITELY tell the difference. Everyone needs to go get a 10 gal SS pot and a outdoor propane cooker if you're still trying to use your stove to brew. It's the single best thing I've ever done to my homebrew. I've liked the full-boil extract brews I've done as much as the all-grain stuff I've done.
 

Bill Pierce (208.57.122.28)
Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

According to Mary Anne Gruber of Briess Malting, Carapils malt should be mashed and not steeped. It contains starches that will be extracted into the beer, potentially causing haze and serving as food for beer spoiling bacteria that can shorten the life of the beer. Nearly all of the benefit of Carapils (increased body) can be accomplished by adding malto-dextrin at the end of the boil. I would recommend using about half the amount of Carapils malt called for in the recipe. I should also mention that many extracts are already high in dextrins and it may not be necessary to make any additions for body.
 

Doug E. Fresh (64.26.199.51)
Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 11:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am going to try a couple of things from this thread to see how they differ from my normal brewing. I am going to try my first hop addition at 45 minutes and I am going to scratch the CaraPils and use 4oz of maltodextrin instead. After all, it's all about trying new things. As a matter of fact, this recipe is all about ingredients I've never used before. Here's the new recipe:

No Steepin' or Mashin' IPA
8 lb. Alexanders Ultralight LME
1 lb. Amber DME
1 oz. Horizon (14.5% AA, 45 min.)
1 oz. Horizon (14.5% AA, 30 min.)
1 oz. Santiam (6% AA, 10 min.)
1 oz. Santiam (dry-hop)
4 oz. Maltodextrin (finish)
60 min boil in 6.5 gal of filtered S. NH well-water to make 5.5 gal.
 

Hophead (167.4.1.38)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 12:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I find it peculiar that you're looking for a lot of hop flavor, yet you have no flavor (15-20min) addition nor FWH in the recipe...
 

Doug E. Fresh (24.147.169.231)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Who me? Well, I didn't start the thread or ask for hop flavor but I guess I am looking for that too - in every recipe - so I thought I'd throw out one I thought would be full of hop flavor.

If you're addressing me and the recipe I posted, I do think it would be kinda hard to FWH when I am using all extract so I have no sparge kettle to add my FWH too unless there is a magic way to do it with extract like add while you're steeping your grains (of which I have none). Also, I believe any addition of hops at anytime is going to add some kind of flavor to the beer not just during the 15-20 minute window. That was the tip as I understood it from Mr. Noonan. As far I know, a lot depends on the type of hop you add and its characteristics and how long you boil it, etc. as for it's contribution to flavor. I also believe that dry-hopping adds flavor to beer too.

If that's all wrong please let me know. I guess I will see when I brew this beast. I've had no problems in the past 10 years or so of brewing getting some nice hoppy beers with mid- to finish-boil hop additions and dry-hopping. Granted, I've had many other problems all seemingly solved by full-boils and all-grain brewing.

I just cracked open a couple of growlers of an IPA I brewed about 8 months ago and it was great - very smooth, very hoppy and lots of Cascade and Columbus flavor, especially in the after-taste.

Thanks,
Doug
 

Doug E. Fresh (24.147.169.231)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 04:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bill: I think you are on to something. I have gone back over my notes from my many IPAs and all of them have come out somewhat cloudy (not chill haze necessarily) with the exception of the all-grain versions. Every recipe called for CaraPils/Dextrine malt. That's despite good hard boils, wort-chilling and irish moss. I bet this one comes out sparkling clear.

I have not had any spoil however - so at least that's good. I never would have thought it was the CaraPils.

Thanks,
Doug
 

Hophead (167.4.1.38)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 05:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Get your wort upto about 160-170 degrees (prior to boiling), then toss in the FWHs. Leave at this temp for 20-30 min, then raise to boiling and do as you normally would... (Sorry for mixing you up with the original poster too).
 

Doug E. Fresh (64.26.199.51)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 05:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for the tip. I always FWH when I AG and I like the results. I will try with this extract recipe too.

Now that I have a house and LP gas it's time to start thinking about building a 3-tier in the basement to AG full-time.
 

Mark Tigges (66.38.134.9)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 08:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi JT,

I thought I would chime in. My favourite hopped-up 'IPA' is not really an IPA (IMO). I take the recipe from Clone Brews for the Harpoon IPA and change the hop schedule, I call it Sharper Harpoon.

2 oz whole cascade fwh
~18 HBU Columbus @ 60 min (I use 1.2oz of 14.9%)
2 oz whole cascade @ 10 min
2 oz whole cascade @ 0 min

(If I was CFC'ing instead of immersion I would use a hopback.)

This has big bitterness aftertaste that blooms in your mouth (this starts to mellow after 3 weeks).

Both the hop aroma and hop flavour are huge. My LHBS guy was looking at me strange when I bought that much hops, he said he wanted to try a bottle when it was ready. Well, it passed his taste buds. And I love it.

I really love cascade for flavour/aroma and find it hard to overdo it. And I find columbus to be a very nice clean bittering hop.

All the best,
Mark.
 

Jim Keaveney (152.163.188.67)
Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 08:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

According to B3, there is only about 20% utilization when steeping carapils.

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