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Brews & Views Bulletin Board Service * Brews and Views Archive 2005 * Archive through May 05, 2005 * Re-hash: Lube for counterflow chiller < Previous Next >

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Joseph Listan
Advanced Member
Username: Poonstab

Post Number: 634
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 03:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Building a counterflow chiller with 45' of inner copper coil and garden hose. The hose sticks to the copper after the first coil (there are 24 loops). I stuck a short piece of plastic hose on the leading end of the coil so that the vinyl-to-vinyl would have less friction, but I didn't expect that to be 100% effective when dry.

So what's the best lube to use to ease in the tube?
 

ScottDeW
Intermediate Member
Username: Scott

Post Number: 291
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 03:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hand soap works fairly well.
Scott
http://texanbrew.com
 

Pete Mazurowski
Member
Username: Pete_maz

Post Number: 110
Registered: 07-2003
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 03:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You've already got the copper coiled up? That'll make it much harder. You should straighten it all out first, feed thru the hose, then coil.

I used hand soap, too. Just be sure to soap the piss out of the first few feet of the copper, cause it's got to lube up the entire interior of the hose. I eventually filled my hose with some soapy water too, to aid in the process.
 

Geoff Buschur
Advanced Member
Username: Avmech

Post Number: 738
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 04:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I ended up cutting my garden hose and sliding it on in several pieces. I used these to mend it back together. http://www.gilmour.com/Watering_Hose_End/Hose_Repair/NylonMenders-Couplers.asp
 

Paul Edwards
Advanced Member
Username: Pedwards

Post Number: 670
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 04:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dittoes, Pete. Matter of fact, I think the instructions in the Phils' Fittings I used said to do it that way.
 

Joseph Listan
Advanced Member
Username: Poonstab

Post Number: 635
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 04:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Drat! I had hoped to avoid that step. The coil is perfect right now (it used to be my IC). But I suppose if I can't do it the hard way, I will have to resort to the easy way.

I might also first try to just uncoil it to the same radius as the garden hose's "natural" curve, slip the hose on, then re-coil around a corny. One would think that if the two radii were the same, then the resistance would be least. If the coil were perfectly straight then you have the same issue, just on the other side of the coil. Dan could be wrong about all this, though.
 

Mike Huss
Advanced Member
Username: Mikhu

Post Number: 611
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 04:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I musta been lucky, I just straightened both of them out and slid them together? I think getting them as straight as possible is key...

Geoff, those worked ok for you? When I've used those in the past for my regular garden hose they've never worked that well. They always leak...
 

Geoff Buschur
Advanced Member
Username: Avmech

Post Number: 740
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 05:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

No problems with the hose menders. I used the CFC with an unregulated water source so I was running very high pressure through it and no leaks.

It may help if you assemble it "wet" with RTV.
 

David Lewinnek
Junior Member
Username: Davelew

Post Number: 100
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 12:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Assembling it straight is better, otherwise you have a reverse capstan problem. A buddy of mine wrote his PhD thesis on this at MIT (he was concerned with assembling a coaxial electric cable, not a CFC, but the physics are the same).
 

Joseph Listan
Advanced Member
Username: Poonstab

Post Number: 637
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 12:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Gave it a shot this morning with soap, but without uncoiling it...

Yeah. I will be uncoiling it this evening.
 

Aaron Meyer
Member
Username: Meyeaard

Post Number: 178
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 02:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

For added beer karma you could donate (or sell) your immersion chiller to a brewbie and start with a fresh coil of copper... just a thought. ;-)

Really depends on how much work you originally put into it. My immersion chiller is soldered with supports and sweated fittings. No way am I dismantling it!
 

Nick Zeigler
New Member
Username: Ziggy

Post Number: 9
Registered: 09-2003
Posted on Friday, April 29, 2005 - 08:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How much more efficient is CFC than an IC?
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 2981
Registered: 01-2002
Posted on Friday, April 29, 2005 - 09:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It depends on the temperature of the chilling water and the batch size, Nick. For 10 gallon or larger batches, a counterflow chiller will reduce the time for chilling, especially if the chilling water is not very cold. For 5 gallon batches an immersion chiller is sufficient if the tap water stays relatively cool.

Of course no chiller will cool the wort below the temperature of the water. You will still need ice and a water pre-chiller or wort post-chiller if the water is warmer than the desired pitching temperature. This is important for those who live in warm climates. Some people in Texas and Arizona, for example, report summer tap water temperatures in the mid-80s F. On the other hand, when I lived in Salt Lake City in January the water was 38 F as it came from the tap. At the brewpub we could chill 11 barrels (about 340 gallons) of 200 F wort to 65 F in about 10 minutes.
 

Tim C.
Junior Member
Username: Timc

Post Number: 47
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Saturday, April 30, 2005 - 01:08 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The easiest way to thread the smaller copper through the larger garden hose is to pull, not push, it through. Straighten both parts out as straight as possible. Pound the end of the copper flat and drill a small hole. Tie some aircraft cable to the copper and thread the cable through the garden hose. Tie the opposite end to something solid and apply a bit of dish soap to the copper tube. Pull the larger garden hose over the smaller copper. Trim the ends as necessary and connect your fittings.
 

Dan Listermann
Senior Member
Username: Listermann

Post Number: 1077
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Saturday, April 30, 2005 - 02:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We make counter flow chillers fully assembled as well as just the fittings. If the copper is relatively straight, it should not be a problem to slide one into the other. We have only rarely resorted to using hand soap as a lubricant.

One warning! Do not buy "kink resistant hose." It has internal ribs that make assembly difficult and sealing about impossible.

Dan Listermann
Listermann Mfg.,Co. www.listermann.com

 

Joseph Listan
Advanced Member
Username: Poonstab

Post Number: 665
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, May 02, 2005 - 01:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Took it on its maiden voyage yesterday. Wow. So efficient, even the exit water was cool. That I didn't fully understand, but I am not asking any questions.

Once I get my pump in action and it drains 10 gallons faster than 45 minutes (stupid gravity!), then I am sure the exit water will be hot.