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Brews & Views Bulletin Board Service * Brews and Views Archive 2006 * Archive through January 20, 2006 * Ball Valve Sanitation for Boil < Previous Next >

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Beee-yah
New Member
Username: Beeeyah

Post Number: 1
Registered: 07-2005
Posted From: 63.200.50.111
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 08:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've read the similar topics for posts in the last year, but still am not sure about this... If the valve cannot be taken apart, would it be best to sanitize by passing a few quarts out and recirculating, or trying to spray the inside of the outlet with sanitizer? It seems that this would be a weak link in many attempts at sanitizing... Also, how about for the dump valve/racking arm on a conical fermenter? I suppose in this case you could sanitize the valve separately before transferring to the fermenter, putting some tape over the opening of the valve, and then removing the tape when it's time to transfer/remove trub. What do you think?

Also, for those that fuss over 'sanitary' welds, the seam on the inside of cornies is not 'sanitary.' Is this much less important once there is alcohol present?

Thanks...

OK another question... for those that have Sabco dealies with the TC connectors... what do you use to connect a ball valve to the TC connector? It seems to me that the point/ease of TC rigs is that there are no NPT connections. Why do they use TCs for HLTs when sanitation at this point is not important? Lastly, why would somebody put a sight glass on a boil kettle? Seems to me that the fluid in the tube would not be at 212... Cheers..
 

Beee-yah
New Member
Username: Beeeyah

Post Number: 2
Registered: 07-2005
Posted From: 63.200.50.111
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 09:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh yeah, great forum... I've been following for about a year now.

Cheers
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 4409
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.57.229.8
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 04:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There are (pricey) adapters to connect ball valves to Tri-Clover fittings. I believe B3 has them in stock. Frankly, I think T-C fittings are overkill for homebrew applications, but to some people price is no object, and more power to you if you are among them.

Yes, I suppose the welds in corny kegs may not be strictly sanitary, although I'd hardly worry about it. They are relatively easy to clean and many homebrewers use them successfully as fermenters. I've also seen them adapted for use in food processing plants.
 

Beee-yah
New Member
Username: Beeeyah

Post Number: 3
Registered: 07-2005
Posted From: 63.200.50.111
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 11:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah, seems overkill to me as well. Oh, another question... why do we need to weld fpt inserts in our containers? Why not just tap the threads right in? Sankes might be to thin for this, but many other kettles are quite thick. Even the modified kettles have fittings that are welded. Why? Seems that tapping would just be a 5 minute job. Thanks for the advice.
 

Randy McCord
Advanced Member
Username: Mccord

Post Number: 547
Registered: 02-2003
Posted From: 216.174.177.203
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 11:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Beeeyah, check out the link that Skotrat posted on the post titled "keg drilling".
 

Sean Richens
Intermediate Member
Username: Sean

Post Number: 261
Registered: 04-2001
Posted From: 142.161.38.219
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 02:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Use a 3-piece ball valve, then you can take it apart for a proper cleaning. There's a cavity between the ball and the valve body that collects wort and can't be cleaned otherwise.
 

Beee-yah
New Member
Username: Beeeyah

Post Number: 5
Registered: 07-2005
Posted From: 63.200.50.111
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 04:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Checked the link... good tutorial. Still, the npt on the outside of the kettle... this won't get to 212, right? So it would have to be unscrewed each time and new, sanitized teflon tape wrapped. Right? The three piece valves I've seen are fpt on both sides, so you'd have to have an mpt-mpt connector... I'm just trying to figure out if I want a clover flange on the outside of the kettle. If I still need to deal with npt, it seems there's no point to the clover flange. Thanks.
 

Randy McCord
Advanced Member
Username: Mccord

Post Number: 555
Registered: 02-2003
Posted From: 216.174.177.183
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 07:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Here's your options:
-Do what Skot's link says
-Weld a coupling into your kettle
-Buy a bulkhead fitting(Zymico)
-Make a bulhead fitting

Everyone on this board has one or the other so don't worry about it. It's on the boil kettle so it's not to worry about really.

I use a homemade bulkhead fitting that I rarely take apart. Just run some boiling wort through it if you're worried about it.
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 4418
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.57.229.8
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 11:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What Randy says. Bulkhead fittings and valves on mash/lauter tuns, hot liquor tanks and boiling kettles do not need to be strictly sanitary. Reasonable care in cleaning is sufficient. Nor is it necessary for the temperature to be at 212 F in order to sanitize. The prolonged exposure to nearly boiling temperatures that the outlet valve on a kettle receives allows for good sanitation.

The only situation where I would be more concerned about sanitation would be in a fermenter. As Sean mentions, three-pierce ball valves are available that can be dissaembled, or you could use a butterfly valve. As for a fermenter bulkhead fitting, you could have it sanitary welded, or you could accept the fact that the fitting should be periodically (not every batch) disassembled and carefully cleaned.

Brewing does not require the sterile environment of an operating room, merely reasonable cleaning and sanitation.
 

Beee-yah
New Member
Username: Beeeyah

Post Number: 7
Registered: 07-2005
Posted From: 63.200.50.111
Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2006 - 06:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah, I suppose I'm getting to picky about it. Although, it is the outlet to the fermenter after the boil, so in some sense might as well BE the fermenter, right? I think I'll go with a bulkhead and npt ball valve. Thanks.

Oh, a side note... I brewed up an extract hefe with bavarian WL last night. It was to 1.070. I used about a pound of malt as well. I mashed in a pot on the stove. Temp. only drifted 3degF during the half hour. The only thing is, is that I used the pound of grain that I meant to use for an APA. It was half vienna and half munich. The hefe is quite dark. I wonder what it will taste like. Hops were 2oz hallertaur 60minutes and the same again at 15 minutes.

This was the first time I used a starter, and stepped from a quart to another quart. This second quart was fermenting in less than 90 minutes. The main 5 gallons last night started in about 3 hours. The growler I made the starter in gave a wasabi nose sting when I wiffed it after pitching. Is this the yeast or the alcohol, or perhaps an infection?
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 4431
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.57.229.8
Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2006 - 01:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The stinging sensation was from CO2 reacting with the moisture in your sinuses to produce carbonic acid.
 

Pascal Desbiens
New Member
Username: Aumaitrebrasseur

Post Number: 13
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 66.130.39.3
Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2006 - 01:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bill, did you say 'three-pierce ball valve'?

 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 4433
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.57.229.8
Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2006 - 01:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Me and my wandering fingers.
 

Sean Richens
Intermediate Member
Username: Sean

Post Number: 265
Registered: 04-2001
Posted From: 142.161.34.71
Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 - 02:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

To me, even a 3-piece ball valve on a fermenter is a one-use-only device once it's been sanitized. For a fermenter, you could track down one of these:
Centre drain ball valve.

You'd have to use a little nozzle or something to squirt sanitizer into the ball between uses, or drill it through and braze on a matching port the other side. You could even leave a bottle of sanitizer on-line!