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Brews & Views Bulletin Board Service * Brews and Views Archive 2004 * Archive through August 18, 2004 * DFH 90 Minute clone? < Previous Next >

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Continuous Hopping MachineVance Barnes08-10-04  02:55 pm
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Aric Datesman
Junior Member
Username: Oxsnot

Post Number: 32
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Wednesday, August 04, 2004 - 11:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anyone have a recipe for DFH 90 Minute they wouldn't mind sharing? Did a bunch of searching and couldn't find one in the archives or floating on the net.

Thanks.
-aric.
 

Jim Keaveney
Intermediate Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 495
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 01:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

well it looks like nobody has one. you could take a fairly blind stab based on what we know. The hops are columbus, chinook and cascade. Hops are continuously added throughout the boil. not sure about the order/dryhopping. use promash to get to 90 ibus

I would imagine mostly pale malt with maybe a bit of medium crystal. mash temp on the high side as this one has a residual sweetness to balance the hops. tons of pale aiming for 9% abv.

if you can get any of the bottle conditioned version, you could culture up the yeast. If not, I would guess 1056 would be appropriate.
 

Wykowski
Senior Member
Username: Bigearl

Post Number: 1093
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 05:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

check out the recent Double IPA thread, that will get you close
 

Jim Keaveney
Intermediate Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 499
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 07:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

oh yeah, and DFH uses a machine which constantly hops the wort during the boil
 

JT
Intermediate Member
Username: Jt100

Post Number: 265
Registered: 04-2002
Posted on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 09:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I read they used to use an electric football game from the 70's to add the hops. The one with the vibrating metal field. Does anyone else remember these? You know, the game where the players did nothing but go in circles. A far cry from Madden 2005.
 

PalerThanAle
Senior Member
Username: Palerthanale

Post Number: 1018
Registered: 04-2002
Posted on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 11:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Funny you should ask this... there is a recipe in this months (September 2004) BYO. Let me know if you don't get this magazine and I will first scold you for not subscribing then I'll post their recipe which was constructed with the help of Dogfish Head themselves.

PTA
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 502
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 12:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

they used the football game originally. but now they have a machine that is patented i believe
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 503
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 01:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well PTA? How 'bout that recipe?
 

PalerThanAle
Senior Member
Username: Palerthanale

Post Number: 1019
Registered: 04-2002
Posted on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 02:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alright I thought I would wait until everyone got their mail...
5 gal
OG 1.088 FG 1.021
IBU 90 SRM 13 ABV 8.7%

16.5 lbs Pilsner Malt
1.66 amber malt

2.00 oz Amarillo 8% AA 90 - 0 minutes
.62 oz Simcoe 10% AA 90 - 0 minutes
.53 oz Warrior 15% AA 90 - 0 minutes
1.00 oz Amarillo Dry
.50 oz Simcoe Dry
.50 oz Warrior Dry

Irish moss
Wyeast 1099 (Whitbread)

Mash @ 122F then raise to 149F until conversion is complete.
Boil wort for 105 Minutes
With 90 minutes left to the boil slowely and evenly start adding hops. (Works out to .25 oz every 7.5 minutes)


PTA
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 505
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 03:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Unless they have changed their hops (a possibility given their experimental nature) they used to use chinook, columbus and cascade. I have never used warrior but simcoe and amarillo would have somewhat similar characteristics. Also, the boil is 90 minutes historically and still so according to their website. I am surprised by the use of pils malt and a step mash. I would think a single step using marris otter would do the trick. but what do i know? (dont answer that)
 

PalerThanAle
Senior Member
Username: Palerthanale

Post Number: 1020
Registered: 04-2002
Posted on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 03:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Maybe Chris can explain what is up with the differences you suggested. The article does say the recipe was built with the help of Sam Calagione and Andy Tveekrem of Dogfish.

PTA

(Message edited by palerthanale on August 06, 2004)

(Message edited by palerthanale on August 06, 2004)
 

Chris Colby
Member
Username: Chriscolby

Post Number: 231
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 04:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When compiling the 90-minute IPA clone, I got the numbers (OG, IBU, etc.), ingredients and their relative amounts, and some hints at their procedures from Andy Tveekrem of Dogfish Head. I drew up a homebrew clone and emailed it back to him to look over. He made a few suggestions and that's where the recipe came from.

I would not be at all surprised if they have changed their hop schedule. Happens all the time. The mash details came from Andy.

The boil time change from 90 to 105 minutes was made by me. I think this will work better for homebrewers given the amount of wort you'll have to evaporate. (Change it back to 90 if your homebrew system makes this feasible.) The amount of time the hops are boiled was not changed.

The proportion of amber malt is also a little higher in the clone than in the commercial beer. The (calculated) color in the homebrew clone ended up too light with their amount. (I'm guessing that they may develop more color during the boil than is realistic for most homebrewers.)

Finally, Dogfish Head uses their own proprietary strain of yeast. The Wyeast 1099 was Andy's suggestion for a substitute.


Chris Colby
Bastrop, TX
 

Steve Fletty
New Member
Username: Cheesehead

Post Number: 25
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Saturday, August 07, 2004 - 03:53 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dog Puke Head makes a decent IPA, but their beers are severly over-priced. When I pay $8+ bucks a six pack I expect a much better beer than Dog Puke delivers.

I can pay $6 bucks for a bottle of Orval. I can pay $7 for any six pack of Rogue. But most Dog Puke I've bought has been extremely underwhelming.
 

PalerThanAle
Senior Member
Username: Palerthanale

Post Number: 1024
Registered: 04-2002
Posted on Saturday, August 07, 2004 - 05:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I picked up a 4 pack of 90 min tonight for the first time. Cost $10.00. $2.50 per bottle - I think my brother pays more than that for MGD in a bar. Not a bad price for a descent beer. Severely over priced - nah, more than a sixer of PBR ...definetly

PTA
 

Pacman
Intermediate Member
Username: Pacman

Post Number: 312
Registered: 04-2003
Posted on Saturday, August 07, 2004 - 03:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Man Steve, how do you REALLY feel about Dogfish beers?

I agree that their beers are severely overpriced but I can't stop drinking them, especially the 90 minute, anyway... I love that beer right now... I've not gotten myself to pay the $9-10 per bottle for the 120 minute or WWS yet though.. that's just crazy...
-------

May be too intense for some viewers
Damn Brewing's Fun!!!!
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 507
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 06:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you pay $9-10 for a bottle of wine, why would you complain about spending the same on a world class beer? How many IPAs can you name that are over 20% abv? There is a reason for the hefty price tag and it is not to make Sam rich.
 

Steve Fletty
Junior Member
Username: Cheesehead

Post Number: 33
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 07:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

That's the problem.

Aside from the IPA, I don't consider Dog Fish world class. Most of their beers remind me of that certain type of homebrewer who just can't resist throwing in the oddball ingrediant just to be unique, not because it will be particulary good. The guy who can take a proven recipe and totally screw it up.

Of the many Dog Fish beers I've tried, the IPA is the only one I'd ever buy again. And why do that when I can get Summit Extra Pale ale a lot cheaper . Or make a batch of RyePA that is just as good or better.
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 508
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 08:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nobody makes a beer similar to the 120 ipa so there are no alternatives. I have never tried to brew a 21% ipa so i dont know if that is a possibility for you. the 60 minute which is a "normal" ipa is not overly expensive. i think the 90 is the best ipa i have ever had. $10 a four pack is a bit high but i will pay it on occassion. it is 9% abv so 4 is plenty.

I dont like all of their beers but i have noticed that the higher alcohol content beers are higher priced.

i like the experimental/creative nature of the brewery. some of the beers i have had were awful to my taste but others are exceptional. I have never been underwhelemed except for perhaps the shelter pale ale.
 

Pacman
Intermediate Member
Username: Pacman

Post Number: 313
Registered: 04-2003
Posted on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 08:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I don't buy wine so I can't really make that comparison...

I guess my reasoning is i can spend $10 on a single beer and enjoy it one evening or i can spend the same $10 on a good sixer of beer and enjoy that for 2-3 evenings...

i've had the 120 minute ontap and it was good. i'd buy it again if i saw it on tap somewhere but it's not $10/bottle good though... Now the WWS I may end up buying one bottle just to say i've tried it... that will most likely be a one time purchase too unless i would happen to find it on tap somewhere...
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This product is sold by weight, not volume; some settling of contents may occur in shipping.
Damn Brewing's Fun!!!!
 

Chris Smedley
Member
Username: Lookitschris

Post Number: 240
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 09:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I was once a staunch DFH supporter. That was when they had six beers, all variations on accepted styles. Lately the DFH mindset has seemed to shift from experimentation and variations (good things, the things which drive American craftbrewing) to gimmick (a marketing tactic). The 60-minute IPA and Immort were great beers for the sake of great beer, style be damned. The new malt liquor in a brown bag, Pangea, etc are "concept beers" - selling a quirky ideas with beer as an after-thought.
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 511
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 10:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

i hear ya chris. i take a lot of the gimmicky crap with a grain of salt. i think they are trying to be comedians/rappers/whatever as much as brewers sometimes. they definitely laugh at themselves tho.
 

Steve Fletty
Junior Member
Username: Cheesehead

Post Number: 37
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 - 03:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'd be laughing too if I were selling 12 oz bottles for $8. Luckily, I got to sample the World Wide Stout at a tasting and didn't waste any cash on what I like to call Vick's Formula 44 meets cheap schnaps.
 

Jim Keaveney
Advanced Member
Username: Jimkeaveney

Post Number: 512
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 - 02:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"I'd be laughing too if I were selling 12 oz bottles for $8."

Who is stopping you? Good luck with that. You are not the first or the last to complain about the price. We are fortunate to have so many options. There are a lot of beer drinkers who would question why you would pay $6 for an 11 oz bottle of orval.

The cost of wws is high largely due to the quantity and quality of ingrediants, number of different yeast strains and effort that goes into making that beer. If you buy a case and split it with friends it comes out to ~$5.60/bottle. It also varies somewhat from year to year since making a beer like that is far from an exact science. The 2002 version was a lot different than the 2001 and 2003. I half 1/2 case of each of the 02 and 03 and will get the 04 when it comes out in a coupla months.