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Brews & Views Bulletin Board Service * Brews and Views Archive 2006 * Archive through January 20, 2006 * Barley Wine Bottle Conditioning Problem < Previous Next >

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Kevin Davis
Intermediate Member
Username: Ktdavis98

Post Number: 346
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 64.136.26.235
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 10:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I bottled my first barley wine over a month ago, and have not gotten any carbonation yet! Some history- Brewed 2/6/05, let age in carboy until early 12/05, ABV 12%, initial fermentation by Nottingham, at bottling used 4 oz priming sugar, 2 packs Nottingham, mixed thoroughly and bottled. 4 to 5 weeks later and I could just barely hear any pssst when I opened one, and it was totally flat.

Should I,
1. RDWAHAB?
2. Open each bottle, and add champaign yeast, figuring 12% was too much for Nottingham?
3. Move to warmer area (already stored for conditioning at around 68 to 70 F)?
4. Your suggestion?

Early on (about 2 weeks) in the bottle it was cloudy, and looked like things were going fine, now they are clear as can be, with sediment on the bottom of the bottle, but no carbonation.

I thought I had read where Nottingham has been used for bottle conditioning in BWs with this high and higher ABV
I am leaning toward #2, but I hate to have to open all those bottles if time will help, but I would expect time and 12% to just kill the yeast again.

All suggestions will be appreciated. I didn't expect this to be ready to drink until next winter, and the winter after, but I did expect carbonation by now.

Thanks,
Kevin
 

Bob Girolamo
Member
Username: Brewerbob

Post Number: 119
Registered: 06-2002
Posted From: 192.91.171.36
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 11:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I would let it sit in a warmer area for at least 4 weeks. Remember, even with the fresh yeast you are asking them to do quite allot in a harsh environment of 12% ABV. I'd give'm time. Try opening a bottle in a month. If it needs more carbonation, try one in another 2 weeks etc. You should be fine though moving it to a warmer area for 4 weeks. What temp did you originally have the bottles at?
Ask not what your country can brew for you but, what you can brew for your country!

http://www.geocities.com/bob_girolamo
 

Kevin Davis
Intermediate Member
Username: Ktdavis98

Post Number: 347
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 64.136.26.235
Posted on Sunday, January 15, 2006 - 11:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bob,
They are being stored at around 68-70F.
Kevin
 

Bob Girolamo
Member
Username: Brewerbob

Post Number: 120
Registered: 06-2002
Posted From: 192.91.171.36
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 01:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Temp sounds right...I'd just give it more time.
Ask not what your country can brew for you but, what you can brew for your country!

http://www.geocities.com/bob_girolamo
 

Richard Nye
Senior Member
Username: Yeasty_boy

Post Number: 1211
Registered: 01-2004
Posted From: 68.225.248.227
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 02:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

In hindsight you probably should have added some yeast at bottling due to the long secondary. I'd give it another 4 weeks.
 

Richard Nye
Senior Member
Username: Yeasty_boy

Post Number: 1212
Registered: 01-2004
Posted From: 68.225.248.227
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 02:33 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thinking this over some more, could it be possible the priming sugar wasn't mixed thoroughly? Maybe some bottles got more than others? You may want to open another one just to make sure.
 

Bob Girolamo
New Member
Username: Brewer_bob

Post Number: 4
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 71.131.95.99
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 11:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Original Poster:
"at bottling used 4 oz priming sugar, 2 packs Nottingham, mixed thoroughly and bottled"
Richard Nye:
In hindsight you probably should have added some yeast at bottling due to the long secondary

I'd say he did all the right things. He just needs to sit on this high gravity brew and let it do it's thing ...wheather it's 4 weeks or 8 eventually it should carbonate. Patience is the key when dealing with these huge beers.
 

Bob Girolamo
Member
Username: Brewerbob

Post Number: 122
Registered: 06-2002
Posted From: 71.131.95.99
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 11:08 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Damn Twin...haunting me again
Ask not what your country can brew for you but, what you can brew for your country!

http://www.geocities.com/bob_girolamo
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 4423
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.57.229.8
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 11:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bob, if you wish you can log in as whichever twin you consider "evil" and then edit your user profile to completely delete that user account. Then you will only be able to log in as the "good" twin.
 

Richard Nye
Senior Member
Username: Yeasty_boy

Post Number: 1214
Registered: 01-2004
Posted From: 68.225.248.227
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 01:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bob, you're right. It looks like Kevin has done all the right things. Should carbonate.
 

Nick Zeigler
Member
Username: Ziggy

Post Number: 229
Registered: 09-2003
Posted From: 148.244.229.231
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 03:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would dumping the Nottingham directly into a 12% brew damage the yeast? If so, would rehydrating it first negate this problem?
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 4425
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.57.229.8
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 04:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nick, the short answers are no and no. Rehydarting it first improves the survival rate of dry yeast slightly, but not so much that this is likely to be a major factor. The reason I would rehydrate the yeast is to make it easier to dose in each bottle with an eyedropper. Obviously there will be some stress in an environment with 12 percent alcohol. I would say Nottingham is up to the task, but you could go ahead and use dry champagne yeast if you wished. This will not appreciably affect the gravity or flavor of the beer; flavor is already determined by the primary strain, and the yeast is more than happy to ferment the easily digestible priming sugar over the complex residual sugars.

Now whether Kevin's beer will carbonate sufficiently remains the question. It's true that the original yeast is likely tired and stressed. However, I'd give it about three more weeks at room temperature before I gave up on it and opened the bottles to pitch more.
 

Bob Girolamo
Member
Username: Brewerbob

Post Number: 123
Registered: 06-2002
Posted From: 71.131.95.99
Posted on Monday, January 16, 2006 - 06:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for the tip Bill...I think it's time to get rid of the twin.
Ask not what your country can brew for you but, what you can brew for your country!

http://www.geocities.com/bob_girolamo
 

Kevin Davis
Intermediate Member
Username: Ktdavis98

Post Number: 348
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 172.194.72.10
Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2006 - 12:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks guys,
I will wait a while longer and see what happens. I was going to bottle earlier this year after about 4 months, but Bill P. convinced me to keep it in the carboy as long as possible, so I left it about 10 months total.

I did rehydrate the yeast, then mixed it with my priming sugar, which had been previously boiled with water and cooled, then added it all to the bottling bucket, and stirred well. The yeast was already showing signs of coming to life after only a few minutes mixed with the priming sugar. Hopefully it is just the harsh environment slowing the yeast down, as Bob suggests.

Kevin
 

Campbell Ritchie
New Member
Username: Stillscottish

Post Number: 6
Registered: 04-2004
Posted From: 203.48.107.240
Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 - 12:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Give it more time. I brewed a Tripel last year and after 4 months, nothing. Sweet and flat.
At about 6 months I was almost at the point of uncapping and adding more yeast and I tried one. Perfect, and they have all been fine that I have had so far. Relax and let the little yeasties do their work.

Campbell