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Brews & Views Bulletin Board Service * Brews and Views Archive 2009 * Archive through April 10, 2009 * Helles Recipe < Previous Next >

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Ron Siddall
Advanced Member
Username: El_cid

Post Number: 758
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 63.80.182.130
Posted on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 11:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Time to try to brew a Helles.

Chumley what was that recipe that you had?

Anyone else have an authentic German tasting Helles?
 

ChriSto
Advanced Member
Username: Christo

Post Number: 532
Registered: 02-2006
Posted From: 68.51.203.123
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 12:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Here is one I have on tap right now. It's turned out really nice. After another month in the fridge the DMS has mellowed to the perfect corny pils aroma/flavor (had discussed some recent DMS "problems" I was having in earlier posts).

http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/recipator/recipator?group=42&item=8002

Just had a Weihenstephan tonight to go side by side with mine. The Weih is carbonated to a higher level (almost sparkling), a tad lighter in color (I added aromatic which brought the color to a solid 4L vs 2-3L) and finishes slightly drier (mine was mashed at a fairly high temp). I will definitely be making mine again, just reducing the mash temp next time plus a little longer boil.
 

Patrick C.
Advanced Member
Username: Patrickc

Post Number: 870
Registered: 01-2001
Posted From: 72.37.171.84
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 01:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do you always ferment on the low end (around 45F)? I keep my cooler at 45, so I guess it would be ideal (except for the extra humidity). I've got another fridge I could move it to to lager, but I'm guessing laziness would take over and I'd just leave it in the cooler.
 

Paul Erbe
Senior Member
Username: Perbe

Post Number: 1288
Registered: 05-2001
Posted From: 64.233.251.195
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 02:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

98% Pils
2% Carafoam

1 oz Hallertauer at 60 minutes
1 oz Hallertauer at 5 minutes

WY2308
 

Ron Siddall
Advanced Member
Username: El_cid

Post Number: 759
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 63.80.182.130
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 03:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Paul, is Carafoam the same as Carapils but just a different malter?

I am planning a single infusion at 148F.

Also 8z of acidulated malt to help the pH get down to the proper range.
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 10141
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.150.192.193
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 04:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yes, Carafoam is Weyermann's version of Carapils malt.

(Message edited by BillPierce on March 25, 2009)
 

Paul Erbe
Senior Member
Username: Perbe

Post Number: 1290
Registered: 05-2001
Posted From: 64.233.251.195
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 04:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

carafoam is carapils from weyerman. I have never worried about the ph of my mash. I am more of a dump and stir brewer.
 

Chumley
Senior Member
Username: Chumley

Post Number: 5780
Registered: 02-2003
Posted From: 63.118.227.254
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 04:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The helles I have fermenting right now was 9 lbs. pils, 1/4 pound each of Carafoam, Carahell, and Melanoidin malt, 20 IBUs Saaz and Hallertauer bittering only, fermenting with WY2206.

I would check your pH before adding that amount of acid malt...I always thought that I needed a couple of oz. of acid malt to brew light colored beers because my water is very soft....when I actually bothered to check it, though, I found out I didn't need any....and my beers seem to have improved a bit by leaving it out.
 

Graham Cox
Senior Member
Username: T2driver

Post Number: 2150
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.32.253.156
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 05:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Go light or eliminate any late hop additions. Helles is all about the Pils malt flavor.
 

ChriSto
Advanced Member
Username: Christo

Post Number: 533
Registered: 02-2006
Posted From: 216.176.226.154
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 09:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Patrick-
Yes, I ferment in my serving fridge at 45F at the top setting, which also remains in use as a freezer for hops, ice cream, pizzas, etc. Therefore I don't keep a temp override controller on it as my sacred ice cream would melt.
 

Ron Siddall
Advanced Member
Username: El_cid

Post Number: 760
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 63.80.182.130
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 09:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Damgummit Chumley just when I think I have it figuired out you go an add Carahell (11L) and Malanoidin (33L).

What are you gaining by adding those two malts?

Graham, would you eliminate the second addition of the Hallertauer and just add the first at the start of the boil?
 

Graham Cox
Senior Member
Username: T2driver

Post Number: 2151
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.32.253.156
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 09:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ron, what I would do is FWH about a third of an ounce and eliminate the late addition. Alternatively, you could cut it back to maybe half an ounce and leave it as is. A full ounce would turn it into more of a Pils-type beer. Of course, if you don't really care about style, then that wouldn't matter. Either way would make a good beer.
 

Bill Pierce
Moderator
Username: Billpierce

Post Number: 10143
Registered: 01-2002
Posted From: 24.150.192.193
Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 10:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm not sure I agree about the need for Carahell, but I assume it's there in an attempt to increase body. Helles is a style that has somewhat more body than its gravity might indicate. As crystal malts go, Carahell is not very dark or sweet, but it does have a slight caramel quality. I think Carafoam (or Carapils) might be more appropriate. Despite the malt, helles is a style that finishes on the dry side.

The melanoidin malt is to increase the perception of malty aroma and flavor. I suppose it's a substitution for decoction (an endless debate, of course).

My own helles grain bill is 92 percent pilsner malt, 5 percent melanoidin and 3 percent Carapils. I agree with Graham about the emphasis on malt over hops. My recipe is bittered to 17 IBUs and uses no hops later than a 30 minute addition.

The very best helles I've had recently was at last year's NHC, when the local Hofbrauhaus (across the river from Cincinnati in Kentucky) brewed a one-off recipe for Pro Brewers Night at the conference. It was a pale, refreshing beer that made you recall what is so wonderful about German-style brewing.

(Message edited by BillPierce on March 25, 2009)
 

Chumley
Senior Member
Username: Chumley

Post Number: 5781
Registered: 02-2003
Posted From: 63.118.227.254
Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 08:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"What are you gaining by adding those two malts?"

I dunno....I just like to endlessly tweak recipes....Never brew the same thing twice!

Actually, I added all three small amounts of specialty malts because of a theory I have....that is, the best pils and helles are made with fresh malts. By the time we American homebrewers get a sack of German pils malt, that freshness, which gives a nice malty flavor, is gone. I am adding those small amounts of specialty malts in an effort to get that "fresh malt" taste again.
 

aleman
Member
Username: Aleman

Post Number: 185
Registered: 04-2003
Posted From: 96.2.117.141
Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 12:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Endlessly tweak!
 

Skotrat
Advanced Member
Username: Skotrat

Post Number: 881
Registered: 07-2007
Posted From: 173.9.91.69
Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 01:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Endlessly tweaking a recipe that you will only brewing once is rather silly. There are no benchmarks and you won't be brewing it again so why tweak it over and over?
 

Skotrat
Advanced Member
Username: Skotrat

Post Number: 882
Registered: 07-2007
Posted From: 173.9.91.69
Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 02:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ron,

I really love this recipe and it is very simple. I used Vangaurd the last time because Hallertauer Mittlefruh were so hard to find:

Helles For Children 

A ProMash Recipe Report

BJCP Style and Style Guidelines
-------------------------------

01-D Light Lager, Munich Helles

Min OG: 1.045 Max OG: 1.051
Min IBU: 16 Max IBU: 22
Min Clr: 3 Max Clr: 5 Color in SRM, Lovibond

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (Gal): 16.00 Wort Size (Gal): 16.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 27.50
Anticipated OG: 1.052 Plato: 12.7
Anticipated SRM: 3.2
Anticipated IBU: 17.5
Brewhouse Efficiency: 81 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Formulas Used
-------------

Brewhouse Efficiency and Predicted Gravity based on Method #1, Potential Used.
Final Gravity Calculation Based on Points.
Hard Value of Sucrose applied. Value for recipe: 46.2100 ppppg
% Yield Type used in Gravity Prediction: Fine Grind Dry Basis.

Color Formula Used: Morey
Hop IBU Formula Used: Daniels


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
100.0 27.50 lbs. Pilsener Belgium 1.037 2

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
2.50 oz. Vanguard Whole 5.20 14.5 60 min.
2.50 oz. Vanguard Whole 5.20 3.0 5 min.


Yeast
-----

WYeast 2308 Munich Lager


Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Type: Single Step

Grain Lbs: 27.50
Water Qts: 41.25 - Before Additional Infusions
Water Gal: 10.31 - Before Additional Infusions

Qts Water Per Lbs Grain: 1.50 - Before Additional Infusions

Saccharification Rest Temp : 150 Time: 90
Mash-out Rest Temp : 168 Time: 10
Sparge Temp : 170 Time: 70


Total Mash Volume Gal: 12.60 - Dough-In Infusion Only

All temperature measurements are degrees Fahrenheit.
 

Graham Cox
Senior Member
Username: T2driver

Post Number: 2155
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.32.253.156
Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 02:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I dunno, I'm kinda with Chumley on this one. I'll never brew the same thing over and over again, as in a "house" recipe for a pale ale, rather I choose to brew all of the BJCP styles and try to experiment with things as I go. It's been a great learning process, in that what you learn brewing one style can often be valuable when formulating a recipe or actually brewing a different style.

I don't look at the "perfect recipe" as a destination, but rather as a journey. The "perfect recipe" is a matter of subjectivity anyhow. So, am I also a "tweaker"? Guilty as charged.