HOMEBREW Digest #1662 Mon 20 February 1995

Digest #1661 Digest #1663

		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

  Extended Mashes ("Robert W. Mech")
  Beer Recipes/Head Retention/down-scaling batches (Ray Robert)
  RE: Infected Starter Wort ("Keith Royster")
  Re: Fix Mash Schedule (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  Steam infusion ("Michael Bonner")
  Otter Creek quest, decoction/maltiness (Keith Frank)
  Confederacy&Beer (Charlie Papazian/Boulder)
  Chicago Beer Houses (Ed Holderman)
  Brewpubs in San Diego (Walt Thode)
  Dr. Lewis and Mashing (Jim Busch)
  5l party Kegs, Is Aluminum a problem? ("Robert Bloodworth                            ZFBTO    - MT0054")
  Canadian Lagers / Moosehead Replicas Sought ("Wood, Les")
  Guinness sourness/sour first batch/IBUs/more IBUs (Ken Appleby)
  Guiness (Steve Robinson)
  Re:  IMMERSION, STIR OR NOT (Mel E. Martinez)
  BJCP Judge-Rank Questions... (James Powell)
  Recipe for Blackened Voodoo (Jill Martz)
  Infected starter wort (John Keane)
  Homebrew U - Seattle (GARY SINK 206-553-4687)
  What Garetz says/Using pressure barrels (David Draper)
  Info on Growing Hops (Blake Meyers)
  Where's the hops (daniel eugene gates)
  Slant Explodes--No Injuries Reported (Kirk R Fleming)
  single infusion mash ? ("Frederick L. Pauly")
  hop garden ("Bummer, Paul")
  Corrected IBU Post ("George A. Dietrich")
  Re: AHA, IBU, DO RE ME . . . (PatrickM50)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 05:02:58 -0600 (CST) From: "Robert W. Mech" <rwmech at eagle.ais.net> Subject: Extended Mashes For a while now, ive been mashing, usuing a regular time schedule. Meaning, such things as, "Protein Rest:30 Minutes" or "Sparge:45-90 Minutes" etc. For the most part, they have very specific times, and my curiosity is why that these times are not sometimes longer. I would think that if for instance the mash time at 154 for 1 hour, was extended to lets say 1.5 hours, you could increase your extract efficency. Does this apply? Is there some reason that it would not increase your efficency? Is there some sort of saturation going on here? Or am I on the ball here and should increase some of the times im allowing the grains to be subjected to the mash, before extracting the wort. Typicaly, I get about 70% efficency. Its not fantastic, but id like to know if I can improve this simply by increasing my mash durations. And before you all start yelling "Do a decoction", I know I can raise my efficency that way. Im looking for an alternative method. - -- Robert W. Mech | All Grain HomeBrewer. President, Fermentors At Large Elk Grove, IL. | Author Of "Frugal Brewers Guide To Brewing Aids" rwmech at ais.net | For More Information: http://www.cl.ais.net/~rwmech Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 08:11:00 PST From: Ray Robert <rayr at bah.com> Subject: Beer Recipes/Head Retention/down-scaling batches Greetings! I have a few questions for the collected wisdom of the digest. 1. I went to a recent beer tasting festival and was impressed with a few of the beers from regional micros and was wondering if anyone might have recipes for the following (preferably extract): JW Dundee's Honey Brown Saxer's Lemon Lager Dixie's Blackened Voodoo Samuel Adams' Double Bock 2. I know of several methods to get head retention prior to the ferment, but is there anything you can do at bottling time to increase head retention. Will the type of priming sugar used affect the head retention? 3. Is there a general rule of thumb for down-scaling say a 5 gallon batch to a 2.5 - 3 gallon batch? Thanks Robert Ray, rayr at bah.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 09:57:32 EST From: "Keith Royster" <N1EA471 at mro.ehnr.state.nc.us> Subject: RE: Infected Starter Wort In HBD1660 Arthur McGregor is having problems with infected starter worts. He states: >I use 4 oz of light DME in 1 qt of water (SG~1.040, but no hops >though) and boil for 5-7 minutes, cool the pot in cold bath, then >bottle with previously sanitized bottles and caps with previously >sanitized caps. These starters are stored unrefrigerated in my >basement, and within a week or two there is all kinds of critters >growing in them. All it takes is one viable 'critter' to fall in your wort and your pre-made starters will be ruined. I don't make my starters until I'm ready to pitch the yeast in them, so I won't pretend to be an expert on making bottles of pre-made starters, but I do remember reading about them (Steve Miller's book?). From what I've read, I think the week point in your process is the cooling of the wort before you bottle it, which exposes the wort to the atmosphere (full of bacteria laden dust, etc..) I beleive a better way is to follow a similar method to canning using mason jars. The cooked wort would be poured into the mason jars which are then placed in a pot of boiling water (similar to a double boiler) and brought back to a boil for about 5 minutes. This should kill everything in the wort and in the jars. The lids should also be sanitized, either by boiling or other methods you are comfortable with. Then, turn the heat off and screw the lids back on the mason jars. As the jars cool down, the condensing steam will draw a vacuum on the lids for a perfect seal. This method eliminates (almost?) all ways for your wort to become infected. *Note* Be careful with drastic temperature changes to glass (ie pouring boiling wort in cold mason jars) or you could easily break them. I would either have the mason jars already in the boiling pot, (or at least warmed in hot tap water) or I would let the wort cool before pouring it in the jars. I also have no idea if it is safe to use beer bottles instead of mason jars to do the same. +------------------------------+-------------------------+ | Keith Royster | NC-DEHNR / Air Qualtiy | | n1ea471 at mro.ehnr.state.nc.us | 919 North Main St. | +------------------------------+ Mooresville, NC 28115 | | "I think I ran over my | Voice: (704) 663-1699 | | Dogma with my Karma." | Fax: (704) 663-6040 | +------------------------------+-------------------------+ Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 10:02:15 EST From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu Subject: Re: Fix Mash Schedule This question has come up several times recently, so I went to the back issues and dug out the original articles (from HBDs 1506, 1511, and 1514). They're now available through the FAQ link on my "Web" beer page (http://guraldi.hgp.med.umich.edu/Beer/). Look under the heading "Mashing Systems". =Spencer in Ann Arbor, MI Return to table of contents
Date: 17 Feb 1995 10:44:40 U From: "Michael Bonner" <Michael_Bonner at smtpgw.musc.edu> Subject: Steam infusion Steam infusion Last weekend, I used my steam injection system for the first (and so far, the only) time. It is based on the one described in Brewing Techniques (July/Aug, '94) with a few differences dictated by the availability of materials. Basically, I mounted a gas valve directly on the lid of a pressure cooker. This leads to a ~6 foot length of 1/4 inch soft copper tubing which is pinched off at the far end. 1/16 inch holes are drilled about 1/2 inch apart in the last 12 inches of tube, which is coiled into a loop parallel to (and above) the false bottom of the 5 gallon Gott that I mash and lauter in. I purge the system of air while I dough-in, and make the first temperature adjustment with heated water to thin the mash to a consistency favorable for amylase activity. After that, all adjustments are made by opening the steam valve and stirring gently and almost constantly. At 1 or 2 degrees below the desired temp, the steam is turned off while the thermometer equilibrates. I can raise the temp about 2 degrees F per minute and reach mash-out temp very easily. I then give the mash a good stir, remove the copper tube, and let it rest to mash-out and to form the filter bed. Even in a first-time use, it was by far the easiest mash I have done, and I was able to dough-in, mash-out, and lauter all in the same container. In HBD 1660, Steve Robinson expressed concern that the heat pumped into the mash this way will not heat the liquid below the false bottom and I agree that would be a problem with any combination mash/lauter tun (other than a RIMS). I try to minimize this by filling that dead space with hot water before doughing in. That way, it's an enzyme- and starch-poor environment to begin with. Also, the volume under the false bottom really is very small compared to the total mash volume, so I think (or maybe just *hope*) that the loss of efficiency is minimal, even negligible. Steve also mentions that, if the steam outlet were *below* the false bottom, the heat would not be transferred to the rest of the mash, and I've got to agree with him there. Someone else (sorry) a while back, mentioned the steam bubbling up through the false bottom, but that just won't happen. As SOON as the steam hits the mash, it condenses. It really surprised me when I tested the system with just water, and no bubbles came up. I have NO experience with EasyMashers, but if I understand the design, they may be perfect for use in a dual-purpose system (steam-in, wort-out through the same tube). All in all, my system is VERY cheap and easy to use (certainly cheaper and simpler than a RIMS), and impresses the hell out of the uninitiated. YMMV. Michael_Bonner at smtpgw.musc.edu in Charleston,SC, where the Ashley and Cooper Rivers meet to form the Atlantic Ocean. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 09:46:25 -0600 From: keithfrank at dow.com (Keith Frank) Subject: Otter Creek quest, decoction/maltiness From: Bruce DeBolt I'm slowly working on an Otter Creek Copper Ale (Vermont) clone and I have some related questions from recent posts. The Otter Creek label says something like - inspired by Dusseldorf style alt beer - but since I've never been to Dusseldorf I can't verify. First attempt was to use a slight variation of the recent Dusseldorf Alt recipe in Winter 1994 Zymurgy issue - 8 lb Shrier 2-row, 1 lb Vienna, 1 lb Munich, 1/2 lb wheat, 1/2 lb Carapils; 156F single temp infusion (Gott cooler); lots of low alpha hops; Wyeast 1338(?) European Ale. It was an excellent beer but not quite what I wanted. It lacked some slight roast character I noticed in Copper Ale. Keith Frank wanted to repeat it and I recommended some roast barley to replace the 2 oz. of chocolate malt. He used 1 oz. of roast and it was definitely closer to Copper Ale, in fact it may be there but since I can't buy their beer in Texas I can't do a side by side. Keith uses upward temp infusion so our mash programs are not indentical. The brewer at Otter Creek told me they use single temp. infusion on all their beers. I will share more details when the experiments are complete but for now I have a question. My next two attempts will be: #1 - replace 1 lb of Munich malt with 1 lb of D-C Aromatic Munich (to get a little more malt flavor) #2 - do a simple decoction to increase maltiness further I'm trying to determine if a simple 2-step decoction will be beneficial for increasing maltiness. I figured I could save about an hour if I skipped the dough in/decoction step at 104F (recent posts) and: - went straight to about 140-145 on the first strike, hold x min. - then pull about 1/3 volume, heat to 158, hold x min., boil - return to mash and hold at about 158 until saccharification is complete - either skip mash out (don't do it now) or do another, mainly liquid, decoction to mash out temperature Mark Thompson's post from 2-15 on M. Lewis' talk had me wondering if I should employ those temperatures when I finally do the decoction: > Subject: Klages and protein rest ..... A sample two temperature program, utilizing the popular "camp cooler" mashing method, would be something like this: 1. Stir in enough hot water at around 70^ C. (approximately 158^ - 160^ F.) to make a thick mash, so the temperature settles in between 55^ - 60^ C. (131^ F. - 140^ F.) Initial mash temperatures as low as 50^ C. (122^ F.) are acceptable. Hold for 20 - 30 minutes at this temperature. 2. After 20 - 30 minutes, add enough hot water just off the boil to raise the temperature to 70^ - 75^ C. (158^ - 167^ F.) for the remainder of the mash period. > Rather than use hot water, I would do an actual decoction. I've never seen temps above 158F recommended before, I thought this was the upper limit for the enzymes. The questions are: - I've heard good things about the Aromatic Malt in recent postings, will my planned simple substitution for 1 lb of Munich malt have much affect on "maltiness" taste or perception? - will a 2-step decoction increase maltiness signficantly beyond my typical single temperature infusion? - dare I do a decoction where the second temp hold is from 158-167F? TIA, Bruce DeBolt keithfrank at dow.com Return to table of contents
Date: 17 Feb 95 10:52:24 EST From: Charlie Papazian/Boulder <72210.2754 at compuserve.com> Subject: Confederacy&Beer I have a question I'd like to ask anyone who may be able to help. I have a friend at the Stroh Brewing Company that is working on a project that requires information on brewing in the American South and the Confederacy in the period of 1850-1880. Does anyone have or can they provide some insight or resources on this subject, either any known published material or a contact with an individual that has an interest in this subject. This person, Joe Hertrich (VP of Brewing at Strohs) doesn't have an email address that I know of so you could forward any leads you have to me and I'll forward it to him. Thanks. I can also be reached directly through internet. My internet address is Charlie at aob.org. Thanks all, Charlie Papazian Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 10:59 EST From: Ed Holderman <0006776088 at mcimail.com> Subject: Chicago Beer Houses This is in response to questions about drinking beer in Chicago. I moved away from there in March '94, so some of these may not be there anymore - call first. - Goose Island Brewery/Restaurant (in city on Clyborne)- great micro brew, but could be gone. - Berghoff's (in city near west)- Nice steak house/micro brew. - The Mill-Rose Brewery/Restaurant (in Schaumburg area off I-90, far n/west), $$$. - The Beer Palace (in city north on Lincoln?)- Best beers from around the world, ask about the Viking. - Rumors of a u-brew from Paul Sovcik (pjs at uic.edu) in previous HBD. - Get the "Reader" weekly mag for more info. You will not go thirsty, Ed Holderman. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 08:20:04 -0800 From: thode at nprdc.navy.mil (Walt Thode) Subject: Brewpubs in San Diego > Date: Tue, 14 Feb 95 16:10:00 EST > From: cem at cadre.com (Chuck E. Mryglot) > Subject: San Diego > > Where should one go in San Diego to drink beer? There are 10 brewpubs I know of -- this assumes you want a brewpub; there are lots of places selling microbrewery beer, mostly from the Pacific Northwest, but this list is of San Diego area brewpubs: Old Columbia Brewpub - downtown, in amongst the highrises Karl Strauss Brewery Gardens - in a Sorrento Valley business park n. of town, operated by the Old Columbia folks (it's hard to believe, but this one has the nicest surroundings) Riptide Brewery - in the renovated Gaslamp Quarter downtown; perhaps the busiest one in town Pacific Beach Brewhouse - in the part of town known as Pacific Beach, about two blocks from the beach (I generally like their beer the best of those I've tried) La Jolla Brewing Co. - in La Jolla (naturally); not bad beer Hops! - in University Towne Center, one of the main malls; yuppified San Diego Brewing Co. - in the Mission Gorge area, east of the stadium; pretty good beer Callahans - in a very unlikely place in a neighborhood mall in the Mira Mesa part of town; same ownership as SD Brewing Co. Pizza Port (Solana Beach Brewing Co.) - along old 101 in N. SD County (I haven't tried their beer) San Marcos Brewing Co. - further north, and inland (I haven't tried their beer either) - --Walt Thode (thode at nprdc.navy.mil) Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 11:48:46 -0500 (EST) From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov> Subject: Dr. Lewis and Mashing >From a paraphrasing of Dr. Lewis: <The best plan for mashing American pale malt is a <"temperature program, " in order to obtain the optimum balance of <extract and fermentability. This is a comment from the same person who used to advocate a single infusion system and sold such systems to craft brewers. < What many American home brewers don't realize is just how low a <temperature American pale malt needs for optimum fermentability <and how high a temperature it needs for optimum extract. Key word: optimum. We're homebrewers, not Budweiser. Optimum to me is defined as acceptable results in a resonable time. My time is more important to me than a few pennies worth of malt. If I can get accpetable results using an infusion at 152F followed by a mash out at 170, then I dont do any additional steps. Id also point out that a whole lot of beers made in the US that homebrewers would suggest are excellent are made with a single infusion program. A large selling pale ale on the east coast is made with a very quick single infusion, which the brewers like to boast about; "get it in, get it out , get on with it". Homebrewers are natural experimenters. Do two identical batches, and use the 135/140, 158F Lewis program for one, and the 152F/170F program for the other. Compare OG, FG and taste/flavor of the beer. See for yourself if any significant distinctions can be made. <1. Stir in enough hot water at around 70^ C. (approximately <158^ - 160^ F.) to make a thick mash, so the temperature settles <in between 55^ - 60^ C. (131^ F. - 140^ F.) Initial mash <temperatures as low as 50^ C. (122^ F.) are acceptable. Hold for <20 - 30 minutes at this temperature. Do these numbers look like reality for any homebrewers? If I dough in at 160, my mash rests at 145, never below 140. I also question the advice to mash between 131-140 from a beta rest/maltose rest, as beta amylase is most active between 140-149F, and survives into the low 150s, which is why a significant amount of maltose is produced in a single infusion at 152F. Also, if one is using a very low temp beta rest, below 140, dont jump to above 160F and expect to get good saccharification, especially of you infusing boiling water, as opposed to adding heat to the mash. - -- Jim Busch busch at mews.gsfc.nasa.gov "DE HOPPEDUIVEL DRINKT MET ZWIER 'T GEZONDE BLOND HOPPEBIER!" Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 11:47:10 EST From: "Robert Bloodworth ZFBTO - MT0054" <debaydr9 at ibmmail.com> Subject: 5l party Kegs, Is Aluminum a problem? This may have been discussed previously but I'm new to the list. Please steer me to a faq or answer by e-mail if this is old hat. Where can I find information on using 5l minikegs for storing homebrew. I just bought a Frisch CO2 tap (16g catridges) and have ordered a catalog of additional goodies from the nice folks at Grittman-Fass-Frisch Gmbh. I'm looking for hints and tips on: Filling and sealing Priming for cask conditioning, is sediment a problem? Forced carbonation, is it possible with the cartridge setup? Another question: What problems are there with aluminum containers and hot wort? A local restaurant supply store has some 60 and 80 liter aluminum alloy boiling pots complete with a draining valve which cost less than half that of stainless. Thanks in advance. Bob Bloodworth Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 11:52:00 PST From: "Wood, Les" <WoodL at VYVX.TWC.COM> Subject: Canadian Lagers / Moosehead Replicas Sought Oh, Canada!! Does anyone know who sells Canadian Lager yeast by mail order (Williams and St. Pat's/Austin don't)? A buddy and I feverishly want to attempt a Moosehead beer, which brings up the next question: does anybody know of a replica recipe for Moosehead? We've checked all of the brewing books around and they never make mention of Moosehead! Also, what's the secret behind that unique aroma of the Moose? Replies desperately sought!! The Lesmon "WOODL at VYVX.TWC.COM" ***Beer...its does a body good*** Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 17:05:54 GMT From: Ken Appleby <ken at harlequin.co.uk> Subject: Guinness sourness/sour first batch/IBUs/more IBUs >>> Algis R Korzonas writes > No, Keith is right. Guinness does set aside a certain portion of beer > (3% if memory serves) and intentionally sours it. This soured beer is > pasteurized and then blended back into the main beer. It is true, I've heard this stated a couple of times here, and it's very plausible, but I've never seen any source quoted for the original information. The Guinness FAQ at ftp.stanford.edu doesn't mention this and neither do many recipes that I have seen. My own experience with home-brewing Guinness clones suggests that it isn't necessary. Can you remember where this information originates? Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 12:32:55 EST From: Steve Robinson <Steve.Robinson at analog.com> Subject: Guiness Brian Gowland points out that his Guiness posting referenced the Guiness brewed in England. This is different than the Guiness exported to the states, and both of these are different than Irish Guiness. Due to folklore and hearsay (ah, those two old devils) I'd always attributed this to differences in the brewing water, and the fact that the stuff they ship here is pasteurised. On reflection, it seems obvious that with modern water treatment and quality control techniques it should be possible to brew the same beer anywhere. Hell, A-B do it. Are the differences attempts by Guiness to brew to local taste, like the Beck's and Heineken products that are brewed specifically for the US market? Does anyone know what the specific differences are, in either ingredients or technique, between the various versions of Guiness? Also, I am familiar with the reference in Charlie P.'s THC to Guiness adding soured, pasteurised beer to their product. Does anyone have some independent corroboration of this, or are we left taking Charlie's word for it? Brew on, Steve Robinson in North Andover, MA steve.robinson at analog.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 13:04:08 -0500 From: mem at rowland.pha.jhu.edu (Mel E. Martinez) Subject: Re: IMMERSION, STIR OR NOT William Biggin "Chief Bill's Homebrew" dw70151 at deere.com wrote: > >I stir the wort while cooling with my home made immersion cooler. It >was made of 3/8 OD copper. I used some of the coil (50FT) that was left >over to make a secondary immersion coil. This coil is 4IN in dia. and >about 4IN high. I chill the wort with the main coil until I do not feel >any heat in the pot when I put my hand against the outside. I then hook >the secondary coil in between the faucet and the main coil. The coil is >put into a mixing bowl full of ice cubes and water. This cools the tap >water before it goes into the main cooler. This method has been working >great for me. It takes less than 20 min. to get down to below 50 deg. >I also pinched the output tube partly closed on the main cooler to slow >the water flow (more efficient?). > Hi Bill, Try tossing some salt into the water and ice mix for the secondary chiller. That will drop the temp in that bowl to below freezing (I forget exactly what). I'll bet you can chill this even quicker doing that. Keep the water in the tube running, though or it may freeze. Also, why not leave the secondary (actually a 'pre-') chiller in line for the whole cooling process? Cheers, Mel Martinez The Johns Hopkins University Dept. of Physics mem at pha.jhu.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 12:20:08 -0600 From: jpowell at surgery.bsd.uchicago.edu (James Powell) Subject: BJCP Judge-Rank Questions... I would like to ask a few questions concerning the Beer Judge Certification Program (BJCP) and the ranks of BJCP Judges. What is the BJCP? How does one become a judge? How does a judge go about obtaining the next highest rank? Are there classes to take; fees to pay? Is there an anual membership fee for a judge to maintain his present rank? Does a judge have to take future classes/exams to maintain his present rank? What type of power is invested into each judge at each given rank? What can these judges do with their certificates? Can the obtained skills and knowledge of a judge be used to offer a service to breweries? If someone could please post the answers to my questions, I would appreciate it. I'm sure a lot of others out there would like to know a little bit more about BJCP, too. Thanks, Jim Powell Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 14:44:16 -0500 (EST) From: Jill Martz <SAL_MARTZ at sals.edu> Subject: Recipe for Blackened Voodoo Does anyone have a recipe for Blackened Voodoo or Dixie's Blackened Voodoo beer?? Please respond to "SAL_MARTZ at SALS.EDU" Thanks! Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 15:17:17 -0500 From: John Keane <keane at cs.rutgers.edu> Subject: Infected starter wort In HBD#1660, Arthur McGregor 614-0205 <mcgregap at acq.osd.mil> writes: >Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 08:47:28 -0400 (EDT) >From: >Subject: Dry Hopping, Infected Starter Wort > [...] > The other item is starter worts. I have often bottled some of my wort >prior to pitching yeast in the current batch, and refrigerated it in 12-22 >bottles for later use as starter wort for my next batch of beer. I cap the >bottles of unfermented, yeast free wort with previously sanitized bottles and >caps. I have never had a problem with infected starter wort. Recently, I >have tried to cook up small quantities of starter wort specifically for >bottling for future use, or keeping my yeast alive, but they've all become >infected before use. > > I use 4 oz of light DME in 1 qt of water ( SG~1.040, but no hops though) >and boil for 5-7 min, cool the pot in cold bath, then bottle with previously >sanitized bottles and caps with previously sanitized caps. These starters >are stored unrefrigerated in my basement, and within a week or two there >is all kinds of critters growing in them. Some of these unwanted visitors >coat the top layer of the starter wort with a 1/8 inch thick matt, and other >times there are fluffy looking balls (1/2 inch dia.) floating around the >bottom. All the bottled starter wort has some other junk sitting at the >bottom of the bottles, I'm guessing it is a combination of hot/cold break, >as well as more living creatures, as they tend to get larger over time. > > My concerns are that I use bottles and caps sanitized by the same method >for bottling beer, and I can't seem to make any safe starter wort. I sanitize >bottles with beach or iodophor, and bottle caps by steeping in boiling water >for 5 min. Is a small addition of hops to the starter batch necessary (and >now 30 min boils), and/or refrigeration needed, or should I cook up the >starter just prior to use? Any other suggestion would be appreciated. I >think this will be of general interest, so please post replies. TIA! I think what you're seeing here is the difference between "sanitizing" and "sterilizing". In most of home brewing, it is sufficient to knock down the population of nasties (bacteria, molds, wild yeasts, etc.) to _low_levels_ rather than guaranteeing that they are _all_ killed because you will soon be introducing a vigorous, healthy culture of yeast that will quickly establish itself and provide enough competition for the available resources (sugars, oxygen), that the other organisms will have a hard time making any progress. Thus, sanitizing is sufficient. On the other hand, when you are canning wort for later use, if *anything* is alive in there when you seal the bottle, it will have plenty of time to get itself together and take advantage of a fantastically rich growth medium (yum!). Result: within a few days, infection city! Charlie Papazian gives a procedure for canning of sterile wort in beer bottles in _The_New_Complete_Joy_of_Home_Brewing_, but I prefer (and use) the method suggested by Dave Miller in _The_Home_Brewing_ _Handbook_. Miller suggests that you go out and buy mason jars for home canning (pints or quarts, about $5/doz), and follow standard canning procedures for sterilizing and sealing them. The key to these jars is the way the lids seal: you heat them to boiling temperatures with the wort in them and the lids in place (ensuring the demise of anything likely to eat wort), and allow them to slowly cool, forming a vacuum seal. I have successfully stored jars of wort preserved this way for 9 months at room temperatures before use. You will need to buy new lids each time you can a batch, at a cost of about $1 for 12. Check your local hardware store for supplies. I have punched a hole in a used lid large enough to allow me to fit an airlock in it, so when I need to make up a starter, I sanitize the holed lid and the airlock, shake the sealed jar of wort thoroughly to aerate, pop the lid, dump in the yeast, and put the lid and airlock on. It takes less than 5 minutes to get a starter going. _John_ Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 16:14:00 -0500 (EST) From: GARY SINK 206-553-4687 <SINK.GARY at epamail.epa.gov> Subject: Homebrew U - Seattle Someone asked about logistics for Homebrew U, the one day seminar held in Seattle each year. It's sponsored by Liberty Malt/Pike Place Ale/Merchant du Vin Importers, all owned by Charles Finkel. Anyway, this event has been held in March the last few years, so I went to the store to ask them about it. They are changing the time of year to autumn starting this year, specifically October 14th, so make your travel plans now. No word on location or guest speakers (which usually include the likes of Jackson, Eckhardt, Mosher, Burch, and professional brewers as well). I'll post specifics when they are announced (unless I get feedback that it is local interest only), and plan to summarize the event afterwards (especially the food/beer match-up, -hic-). Gary Sink Environmental Protection Specialist and Homebrewer (sometimes at the same time) Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 1995 08:54:25 +1100 (EST) From: David Draper <David.Draper at mq.edu.au> Subject: What Garetz says/Using pressure barrels Dear Friends, in #1660 Al K. commented again on his low opinion of Mark Garetz's book Using Hops. Now, I share most of his misgivings, particularly with respect to the IBU formulation section. I know that Al has even more bones to pick, and he has admitted publicly that his distaste borders on vendetta. Having said all that, though, I feel that, at least in Al's most recent post, he's got some facts wrong. In particular, about the IBU formulations being presented "as law" and the IBU taste-titration methods perceived flaws. To set the record straight, here are a couple of verbatim quotes from the book. 1. On the subject of how close the Truth the IBU formulas are, p. 128: "I would be remiss if I didn't mention here that *all* IBU prediction formulas, (no matter how many factors we try to account for) are subject to errors because we're really just making educated guesses as to what's going on with each brew. [Italics on] So be prepared to make your own adjustments to the formulas if they don't seem to be working for you. [Italics off] If the beer doesn't have the right amount of bitterness, most brewers will blame everything *but* the formula, when it is the formula itself that is at fault. Just because it's math, that doesn't make it science! Also, if you want to use some of these correction factors, be aware that they are new and still largely unproven. They were based on published research (see refs in Biblio) and utilization data from a few batches where the IBUs were measured and the brewing variables were known, but I would have liked to have much more data. Research is continuing, but in the meantime your feedback on how well the new formula and factors work for you is encouraged." My comment: I agree he should have gotten those additional data before going to press, as I am sure Al would; but it's just not fair to say he presents the formulas as carved in stone--the above is to my mind a respectable disclaimer, just like all of us who say "your mileage may vary" in our HBD posts. I still think the formula is way off for my own setup, as I have posted many times. 2. The IBU taste-titration method: on p. 146: "To use this method, you will need calibrated iso-alpha extract, [dropper, glasses etc], and a beer of known IBUs that is similar in style to the beer you want to know the IBUs of." Next page, when he does mention Bud, he says "If all else fails, you can always use Budweiser. Because it's not similar to any beer you're likely to brew, your results won't be quite as accurate, but it will probably be close enough." My comment: I think he covers his tail quite well by first saying "beer similar to the tested beer" and then "if all else fails..." I don't think what's here is fundamentally different from what Al argued (rightly) should be done. Again, I am no fan of many things in this book, but I think everyone deserves to be judged on *what they say*, not on what someone else *thinks* they say. Rich Larsen asked about my use of pressure barrels. Yes, Rich, it was thick HDPE plastic, but I don't think the beers I barreled ever survived long enough for simple age oxidation. I did mention a 2-week cutoff or so to define those beer that were consumed "rapidly" but those that survived longer than 2 weeks only did so for maybe a month at most. This is because, well, um, er, I drink more than I probably should (gasp). However, I was much less experienced then, so other forms of oxidation were much more likely than they are now. However, once I shed most of those baby diseases, the same trend continued, and the beer tasted pretty good and definitely not oxidized in the initial stages of barrel sampling. Can oxidation due to HSA produce flavors etc that don't show up right away? If so that could explain what I observed. Sorry for another long post. Cheers, Dave in Sydney - -- "Life is short; grain is cheap." ---Rich Lenihan ****************************************************************************** David S. Draper, School of Earth Sciences, Macquarie University, NSW 2109 Sydney, Australia. email: david.draper at mq.edu.au fax: +61-2-850-8428 ....I'm not from here, I just live here.... Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 17:56:41 -0800 (PST) From: Blake Meyers <bcmeyers at ucdavis.edu> Subject: Info on Growing Hops Thank you all for your help on my quest for hops growing information. I had a request to post the information that I recieved, so here it is. Please note that I am just regurgitating what others passed on to me - so if you recognize it as your own, thank you, and if the information doesn't pan out, don't blame me... >From what I can gather, you can buy hops from certain garden and nursery catalogs, and from many homebrew catalogs. You should order soon, because most places ship them out only once a year, about March, and apparently hops should be planted as soon after the first frost as possible. One suggestion was that if you are just starting out, you may wish to buy only Cascades, because they are a good all-around hop, and very difficult to kill. For more information on hops growing, it was suggested to trackdown a backissue copy of BREWING TECHNIQUES May/June 1994 (Vol 2 , No. 3). It has a great article on growing hops and getting cuttings by mail. Hops comes as rhizomes, not seeds, because it is diecious (sp?) and you only want female plants. They are vines which grow quickly and like a lot of space, as well as a lot of sunshine. Apparently they'll grow in most areas of the North America, but do best if the ground freezes in the winter. Everyone seemed to agree that they are easy plants to grow. The rhizomes should be planted aninch or two under the soil, and will grow up to a foot a week in peak season, reaching a maximum length of about 30 feet, and, of course, as vines they need something to climb on. Some of the suppliers ( I'm sure there are many more, but these are the ones that people suggested.): "Alternative Beverage" in NC 1-800-365-2739. Each rhizome was $2.25 Freshops 36810 Kings Valley Hwy Philomath, OR 97379 (503) 929-2736 Marysville Oast 866 NW 1000 Oaks Corvallis OR 97330 Nichols Garden Nursery 1190 N Pacific Hwy Albany OR 97321 (503) 928-9280 The Herb Farm 32804 Issaquah-Fall City Road Fall City WA 98024 (206) 784-2222 Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 19:24:49 -0700 (MST) From: daniel eugene gates <gatesd at unm.edu> Subject: Where's the hops Does anyone have a good supplier of hops rizhomes? It's getting close to garden time here in the southwest and I want to order a variety soon. Please repy here or personally - but not to personal. Here's one for you brew heads - tanks-a-brew-haha (never mind) Dan Gates gatesd at unm.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 22:31:06 -0700 From: flemingk at usa.net (Kirk R Fleming) Subject: Slant Explodes--No Injuries Reported You know, I read some of the weird stuff homebrewers do and read some of the weird things that happen to homebrewers, and I've always wondered, "When will my turn for weird stuff come?" I have my answer. I decided it was time to build a starter tonight from some Wyeast 1098 slants, so I put the kettle on the boil and pulled a slant from the fridge. While the water came up and I measured out 4 oz of M&F Plain Light DME, I warmed the vial in my hands, occassionally putting under my chin while I used both hands to tidy up the kitchen. I set the vial down on the counter while I checked the boil, and after a few minutes noticed the slant had liquified. This came as little surprise, since I already knew the mix I used was close to it's melting point at just above room temp. I proceded to shake the vial, and after a short time I had a nice, homogeneous solution of the fertile stuff. After the wort went into a 1/2 gallon jug (about 100 mL of wort) and cooled, I put the airlock on lightly and grabbed my slant. I already knew the cap would be very tight, so I reefed into it with all the vigor of an impotent beach boy, and whooooaaaa jack! This puppy cut loose with near-explosive decompression that even caught the attention of my 12 year old across the room. What makes this story so bizzare is that the sudden release of pressure in the 24 mL vial foamed the culture so badly and so thoroughly that it wouldn't come out of the container. No amount of shaking or tapping would get it to pour out. I was at a loss for solutions to my problem, except for rinsing the vial out with tap water, which seemed doomed what with the chlorine. What to do? I sanitized the outside of the vial as best I could and dropped the whole thing into the jug, sloshed it around and airlocked it. Since I thought I may have really challenged the yeast with so much wort, a possibly dirty vial in the jug, and several other kinda questionable steps, I decided to add the contents of two other vials that had been in the fridge: about 50 mL of the original Wyeast pack contents. Now, for all you yeastheads out there: my slant is a 24 mL vial 1/2 full of medium populated with a yeast colony whose total area is less than 1.5 cm2, by my estimation. Are you surprised such a small amt of yeast produced that much pressure? Kirk R Fleming -Livin' right out there on the edge, baby -flemingkr at afmcfafb.fafb.af.mil Kirk R Fleming -flemingkr at afmcfafb.fafb.af.mil -BEER: It's not just for breakfast anymore. Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 1995 06:55:29 -0500 From: "Frederick L. Pauly" <flp2m at galen.med.virginia.edu> Subject: single infusion mash ? I have been following the RIM system talk for a few weeks now and in planning my 10 gallon brewing sytem using three kegs I believe that RIM is the way I would like to go, eventually. But to start out I would like to do it as simply as possible. And it seems to me that many micro breweries use a single infusion in the mash and make very good beer. Is any one using a keg for the mash/lauter tun and doing a single infusion? If so what is your water temperature schedule? How does it change with more or less grain? Any other advice along these lines would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Rick Pauly Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 95 08:35:38 EST From: "Bummer, Paul" <bummerp at uklans.uky.edu> Subject: hop garden The snow may still be flying in most of the country, but here in Kentucky, our thoughts are turning to the coming spring and planting season. I've been kicking around the idea of trying to grow hops in my backyard garden this year, but have not had any luck in finding a source of seeds. Local garden shops are no help and the local source of brew supplies is also stumped. Any help by fellow homebrewers-gardeners would be greatly appreciated. Paul M. Bummer, Ph.D. College of Pharmacy University of Kentucky Return to table of contents
Date: 18 Feb 95 09:07:12 EST From: "George A. Dietrich" <74543.310 at compuserve.com> Subject: Corrected IBU Post I'm posting this correction to my original post that appeared in HBD 1657. In the post I stated that the Garetz IBU formula gave me 26.47 IBU for the Pilsner beer. It seems that I can't read my own handwriting. The post should have said 20.47 IBU. This probably approximates the calculations of those who ran calculations with my numbers more closely. Hope I didn't cause too much confusion. George Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 1995 12:30:42 -0500 From: PatrickM50 at aol.com Subject: Re: AHA, IBU, DO RE ME . . . I like Rich Webb's summation of the current IBU quandry: <<<<< What does this tell us? It tells us that we are GUESSING as to what leads to hop utilization and bitterness. We know what makes it go up and down, but we are clueless as to the 'real' numbers. So how 'bout this. Find a method for determining IBUs. Stick with it. Test it. Explore it. Change it if you feel like it, but be consistant. >>>>> That philosophy works quite well for my own personal brewing satisfaction needs. I don't really care (too much) what formula I use as long as it serves as a reliable reference for me. But it seems that the real problem is when I want to make a beer that fits within the published style guidelines of the AHA. So my *real* question is this: How are the AHA *desired* IBUs determined? I mean, if you were me (or conversely, if IBU) and you wanted to enter an AHA competition, wouldn't you want to know how the appropriate IBU range for a particular style was determined? I mean, if I'm copying a recipe that just won the national AHA competition for that category but my IBU calculation is wildly different from what the AHA stylesheet says is typical of the style, what am I supposed to think? Is my IBU formula wrong or do the guideline numbers not really matter? So what I (and lots of others, I hope) would like to know, is this: What was the basis for determining the IBU characteristic of each AHA style? It seems logical to me that if we are going to be judged by how close we come to this ideal, we should at least know what went into calculating that number in the first place. No? Pat Maloney (PatrickM50 at aol.com) Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1662, 02/20/95