HOMEBREW Digest #1809 Wed 16 August 1995

Digest #1808 Digest #1810

		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

  Re: Mini keg carbonation (Fredrik Stahl)
  Prickly Pear fruit technique ("Steven W. Smith")
  Re:  Mead ("Lee C. Bussy")
  More on B-Brite (DONBREW)
  PVC braided tubing (BF3B8RL)
  Home Grown Hops (Bruce Kiley)
  Siphons ("David Wright")
  Minneapolis Brewpubs??? ("Bessette, Bob")
  re Bass fermentation (Tim_Fields_at_Relay__Tech__Vienna)
  Cooling the Wort (Dan Walker)
  Re: Bathtub "fermenting" (TJWILLIA)
  Oops. (Ed Hitchcock)
  Hazelnut extract in Nut Brown Ale ("Michael R. Swan")
  party pig (Help !!?!!) (Robin Hanson)
  partial mash kits (kpnadai)
  Wholesale Malt (Greg Holton)
  Hunter Energy Monitor Trouble (rone)
  SG Corrections/Sanke Dip Tubes/Chill Times (Kirk R Fleming)
  H2O2--not in my wort (Glenn Tinseth)
  Emergency:BrewPubs in Manhattan (Ray Gaffield)
  Pitching temp (Brandon's Daddy)
  Mega Craft Breweries (John DeCarlo              )
  Finings for Wheat? (Mark Kirby)
  Mega-craft brewing. (Russell Mast)
  Re:  Pitching temp (SoarMoose)
  Dead Thread. (Russell Mast)
  Re: More on B-Brite, wort chilling (Jim Dipalma)
  Brewing Women. (Russell Mast)
  Re: Mash-out and extract efficiency (Dan Sherman)
  Re:women brewers (Suzette Smith)
  Wort Dilution (A. J. deLange)
  Pouring Agar Plates?? (BixMeister)
  Iodophor use; racking question ("Fr. Bradley A.M. Barber")
  Wort chilling/Peroxide oxygenation (Philip Gravel)
  Re: pitching temp clarified (PatrickM50)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 11:23:18 +0100 From: fredriks at abel.math.umu.se (Fredrik Stahl) Subject: Re: Mini keg carbonation In HBD #1807, Geep writes: >Also, I have been using the 5L mini kegs sicne March and seem to have a >problem with foam generation vs. carbonation. In those batched where I use >the standard 3/4c priming sugar, the beer seems to be nicely carbonated, bu= t >foam like crazy coming out of the keg (regardless of whether it's the >initial, no CO2 added, pour, or the later pours). When I switched to 1/2c (= as >I've seen recommended in various places in the past), I get an >undercarbonated, yet drinkable, beer with no head. Any suggestions???? I use the 5L mini-kegs as well, with the "Party Star" tap. I usually find the beer foaming a lot when the keg is full but this is not a problem after the first few pints. I think I should say here that I brew British ales mostly, with the corresponding lower carbonation level. I have never brewed a lager, but some months ago I bought three mini-keg with Beck's, and I remember them foaming a lot. This was not a problem though, since I simply waited for the foam to recede a little, refilled the glass, waited and so on. It took a few minutes to pour a glass but in the end the beer had good carbonation and a nice head. (I won't say that about the taste of Beck's though. Filled mini-kegs in Germany are cheaper than empty ones in Sweden.) I have noticed that I get a "sparkler" effect from the tap when I don't open it fully. I use this to get a nice head on some northern style British beers. You could try opening the tap fully if you don't do it already. I have to admit that I really love the foam. Maybe I'm a "foam-head". ("head-head"?) /Fredrik Stahl (fredriks at abel.math.umu.se) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 02:32:06 -0700 (MST) From: "Steven W. Smith" <SYSSWS at gc.maricopa.edu> Subject: Prickly Pear fruit technique All this recent talk about Prickly Pear beer drives me to share an official Desert Rat secret for dealing with cactus fruit: BURN EM! Carefully. Those "little fuzzy spots" are nasty little thorns that are orders of magnitude worse than fiberglass on sweaty skin. Washing over the fruit with a propane torch will zap the thorns so you can safely pick and peel the fruit - Note: PEEL THE FRUIT. FWIW, the real DR technique is to whack the fruit off of the cactus with a stick, then flame them over an open fire on some sort of rack. Peel, and eat (the fruit, that is. Nothing worse than naked idiots standing in the desert with red goo on their chins. Geez.) I personally would still wear the gloves. I like the heavy black neoprene(?) "chemical proof" work gloves rather than leather for working around cacti. They're hot, but they resist thorns much more effectively. Warning: don't set your hair, bystanders, or the terrain on fire whilst fulfilling your bizarro urge for cactus fruit, eh? P.S. This is on topic; I said "beer" in the first line. B-) _,_/| \o.O; Steven W. Smith - Systems Programmer, but not a Licensed Therapist =(___)= Glendale Community College, Glendale Az. USA U syssws at gc.maricopa.edu or smith at peabody.gc.maricopa.edu "I see a BIG telephone bill in your future!" - my Psychic Friend Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 05:55:03 +0000 From: "Lee C. Bussy" <leeb at southwind.net> Subject: Re: Mead James Giacalone (nice Irish name! :) ) asked about mead: > I started a honey mead in June. I recently racked it over to > another carboy to help clarify it and leave the yeast sediment > behind. I now have a large airspace between the top of the mead > and the airlock. My questions are; Should I add ascorbic acid at > this point? Will the mead become oxidized as wine does in this > situation? Should I top off the mead with other mead; sterile > water...? Yes, do top it off with boiled and cooled water. This will help to prevent oxidation and that little amount of water won't dilute it much at all. Alternitavely if you are concerned you can add some new must from a supsequent batch but I don't feel this is necessary. I had heard of some old wime makers here in town dropping (sterilized) marbles into the fermenter to decrease the headspace. This sounds like it would work but I never tried it. Anyone? And by the way, yes, I am alive. I have not been consumed by flames and I have promised to have my coffee first before answering posts! :) I also saw the tail end of a post regarding AOLers. Yes, they have a bad name, yes, I hate their mailler too (no real names) but a point was made to just sign the post. Very good idea. Unless your memory is like mine of course! There is a program (sorry to get off track here... no affiliation, etc) called Spell Check from Next Generation Software that I used while on AOL that appended a tagline automatically after spell checking (another good idea). Maybe this will help. Now, back to our show! - -- -Lee Bussy | When guns are outlawed, how are | leeb at southwind.net| we going to shoot the liberals? | Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 08:44:29 -0400 From: DONBREW at aol.com Subject: More on B-Brite I happened to be reading the label of the Electro-Sol box the other day, (don't ask why) and to my surprise I found that it was very nearly the same as the label on B-Brite. Being a frugal type, I set about looking for the cheapest dishwasher detergent available and reading labels, Ah Ha The local discount drug store (CVS) carries a brand containing no perfume, the rest of the ingredients are identical (listed in the same order, I'm assuming that the law is the same as for food) with some bleach added. I have used this stuff to soak bottles for over a week in an aluminum tub, I did not notice any pitting of the Al, so I guess that the bleach level is pretty low or not chlorine. Worked as well as B-Brite maybe better! B-brite costs about $10 per pound, diswasher stuff cost $1.19 per 5 pounds, Hummm which is the better deal? Don Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 08:55:20 -0400 From: BF3B8RL at TPLANCH.BELL-ATL.COM Subject: PVC braided tubing HBD Collective - I am stepping into all grain brewing this season, and am interested to hear if any of you have used braided PVC tubing to handle hot wort out of the mash/lauder tun. This tubing is double thick -- I'm guessing it won't collapse like vinyl tubing does when in contact with hot wort. It looks like normal clear tubing with blue/white "braids" running through it. But unfortuantely I'm unable to relax with this tubing. I remember reading somewhere (Zymurgy?) that you should only use vinyl tubing. But I've also seen hop back designs using PVC pipe. So what is the deal here? Is the Poly-vinyl Chloride (PVC) tubing safe for brewing? Does anyone have any experience with this PVC tubing? Is there another type of tubing I should be looking for? Will PVC tubing add toxins/mess with my beloved beer? Send private email to charles.b.peterson at BELL-ATL.COM or simply post. Thanks, Chas Peterson Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 08:56:32 -0400 From: Bruce Kiley <bkiley at sni-usa.com> Subject: Home Grown Hops I planted my hops last summer and they didn't grown much. This year they are growning like crazy. The only proplem is that they have all grown together. I have them planted next to my garage with a "trellis" up to only one single point.(I didn't think they were going to grow). My question/problems is, how do I know which one is which, they have all grown together? Second, how do I know they they are "ready"? Bruce bkiley at sni-usa.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 09:06:19 EST5EDT From: "David Wright" <LSMAIL at osp.emory.edu> Subject: Siphons Here is another siphon trick. If you siphoning from a carbouy, get a blow off cap and insert a racking cane through the large diameter spout. Attach tubing to the top of the racking cane and put the cap onto the carbouy. Run the tubing to the new vessel. Here is the easy part but some of the infection paronoids will cringe. With you mouth blow into the unused spout on the cap. No pump, no mess, very little time. You only have to blow for about 2-3 seconds and you have a great siphon going. I have yet to have any contaminated brews so I dont think there is any real risk of contamination using this method. David Wright Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 09:42:00 PDT From: "Bessette, Bob" <bessette at msmailgw.uicc.com> Subject: Minneapolis Brewpubs??? Fellow Brewers, I am travelling to Minneapolis on business during the week of August 21st and would like to know the lowdown on brewpubs in the area. Am I correct in assuming that Rhino Chasers is made in St Paul? Please send me private email with any information at bessette at uicc.com. Thanks... Bob Bessette Unitrode I.C. Corporation Systems Analyst 7 Continental Blvd Information Systems Dept Merrimack, NH 03054 Email Address: (W) 603-429-8553 bessette at uicc.com (FAX)603-424-3460 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 10:10:46 EST From: Tim_Fields_at_Relay__Tech__Vienna at relay.com Subject: re Bass fermentation In #1807, af509 at osfn.rhilinet.gov (Rolland Everitt) writes re his all-grain Bass clone: >Five hours after pitching the yeast (70 F. O.G.=1.060), I had 2-3 >inches of foam, followed the next day by a rocky head. Two days >after pitching, fermentation had slowed, and S.G. was 1.022. The >krausen had sunk into the wort. I racked to my secondary fermenter, >a glass carboy. >A day later, activity seems to have about ceased (no bubbling in >the fermentation lock, no bubbles on surface of liquid). >I had a similar experience with my first batch (a pale ale, >different yeast). That batch is in bottles now, and after ten >days at 70 F. and he asks: >Do ale yeasts ferment this fast at 70 F.? Is 2-3 days for the >beer to ferment and begin to clear unheard-of? Is it too >soon to bottle? I would have pitched a bit cooler than 70F, but 70F should work for these yeasts. If your F.G at bottling was really 1022, and given your good initial ferment and the tailing off effect you experienced, my guess is you may have under-aerated. Did you aerate the wort, and for how long? I had similar outcomes that were caused primarily by under-aeration. As to when to bottle, I do so when 1) the F.G. is stabilized, and 2) when it clears in the secondary. But pls take this with a grain of salt. I am curious about possible taste benefits of "aging" in secondary (and in frig) beyond simple "clarification", but that is part of another question I am trying to find time to look into :-( And as I can't resist Rolland's query: >Will Ross Perot run again? If he can pull votes from to-b-or-not-to B. Clinton, I *do* hope so ;-) ... dousing myself in homebrew flame retardant inside and out :-) -Tim Tim Fields / Vienna, VA, USA / timf at relay.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 09:26:27 -0500 From: mfpdw at uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Dan Walker) Subject: Cooling the Wort I have good luck using two methods of adding Ice to the wort to cool it down. One great way is to use zip lock bags (the large ones) put a gallon of water in and freeze the puppy. When it's time to cool things down I dip the bag in a cool sanatizing agent, B-bright etc., and float them in the firmenter. This takes about three bags to bring things to ptiching temp for ales. If, heaven forbid, I haven't planned ahead or my lovely spouse has made room for "more ipmortant" items I just top off the firmenter with ice cubes. Now we have clorinated water that I run through a clean charcoal filter but it works out fine. Relax have a home Brew... Dan.. Dan Walker mfpdw at uxa.ecn.bgu.edu 1-University Circle 309-293-2372 318 Stipes Hall FAX:309-298-2142 Macomb, IL 614551 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 10:34:55 EDT From: TJWILLIA at VM.OCC.CC.MI.US Subject: Re: Bathtub "fermenting" I just picked up the lowdown on bathtub brewing from someone who actually did use a tub - my grandmother. She informed me that they would ferment in a tub to ease cleaning up the beer that escaped the open ceramic crock fermenter. This still didn't help with all those exploding bottles (and they had quite a few) :{). Keep on brewin' Tom Williams (the other one on HBD!) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 11:53:01 -0300 (ADT) From: Ed Hitchcock <ehitchcock at sparc.uccb.ns.ca> Subject: Oops. Okay, so there's a bug in the recipe-edit programme. I've submitted a fixed version, it should be in the ../programs directory soon. If anyone has already downloaded it and had problems I can e-mail a fixed EXE file. If you have saved any recipes with the defective programme, use a text editor to put a comma between each of the parameters in lines 2 and 3 of the recipe and it should be fine with the fixed version. Sorry for the inconvenience. ed ---------------- ehitchcock at sparc.uccb.ns.ca the Pick & Fossil Picobrewery Because there's more to life than just coffee Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 11:07:47 -0400 From: "Michael R. Swan" <mswan at fdic.gov> Subject: Hazelnut extract in Nut Brown Ale In HBD #1763, Jeff Frane responded to a question about Rogue Nut Brown Ale: >> From: Barry M Wertheimer <wertheim at UTKVX.UTCC.UTK.EDU> >> Subject: Rogue Nut Brown Ale >> Had the good fortune to taste some of Rogue's Nut Brown Ale while >> traveling through a neighboring state. Very nice nutty, chocalate >> flavor, plus something else that was very familiar, but I could not >> place. Any comments on this brew or speculation as to its ingredients? <<<Hazelnut extract is the "secret" ingredient. <<<-Jeff Frane Has anyone brewed a batch using hazelnut extract? How did it turn out? Any ideas as to how much extract should be used? Should it go in the secondary or the bottling bucket? Thanks in advance. Mike Swan Dallas, Texas mswan at fdic.gov Standard disclaimers apply Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 09:27:33 -0600 From: rhanson at nmsu.edu (Robin Hanson) Subject: party pig (Help !!?!!) Michael wrote the following >Pumping, then the figin pump hose shot off and un-carbonated beer ejected out >of the pig. I assume I pumped the required amount of air to start the air bag >going so I closed it up and let the excess air out,and put it in my basement >for conditioning. I hope I dont go down there and find pig guts all over my >walls. I found that after about 30 pumps that it is best to just give it a try. You may not have heard the pouch pop, but it is usually ready. After about 30 pumps the pump starts to get hard use. This is when you should release. Sometimes it works sometimes it does not, but you do not get any spillage that way. Robin Robin Hanson Rhanson at nmsu.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 10:27:04 PDT From: kpnadai at adsnet.com Subject: partial mash kits >Date: Sat, 12 Aug 95 17:47 EDT >From: vic at iglou.com (Victor Hugo) >Subject: "partial mash kits" and "specialty grain extracts" <snip> >I recently stopped in the Wine Art/Brewers Art store in INDIANAPOLIS, I >bought my kit from them and they seemed pretty knowledgeable (sp? & >disclaimer), the proprieter tried to sell me on a "partial mash kit". His >explinations of the kit said it inclued the ground grains and all other >essentials. <snip> >Vic Hugo I live about three hours North of Indy and I stop by Wine Art whenever I am in town. I was there a week ago today (Tuesday). Whenever I am in there, he tries to sell me real hard on those kits. As I understand, it is a complete, "advanced" extract kit. All the things you would do to spruce up a kit (specialty grains, flavor and aroma hops, etc.)are in there. I am not the most cost effective brewer. Here on the Southeast shore of Lake Michigan, homebrew shops aren't plenty. The few that are here, the prices are outrageous. (Like, three month old Wyeast packs for $11.95?) I mail order and since I travel for work, I stop by homebrew shops around the American Midwest to stock up. I buy Northwest extract by the case and whole hops by the pound (Just Hops, excellent service, SDA) But I think one of those kits at Wine art were around forty bucks! Even I won't pay that! Their three week wine kits are intriguing, beautiful packaging, but also forty bucks! Too steep for me... Brew bayou, Kevin Nadai Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 11:42:51 -0500 (EDT) From: holton at kgn.ibm.com (Greg Holton) Subject: Wholesale Malt Does anyone know of a malt house in the Western NY/Southern Ontario area that will sell to the general public? Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 10:03:05 PDT From: rone at mdhost.cse.TEK.COM Subject: Hunter Energy Monitor Trouble My Hunter Energy Monitor has decided to quit turning on my refrigerator. When the LCD display indicates that the refrigerator is turned on (flashing temperature), the voltage at the outlet is 0. It appears the mechanism that switches the AC is broken. Has anyone else had this problem - and if so, what was the fix? Ron Ezetta Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 11:04:25 -0600 From: flemingk at usa.net (Kirk R Fleming) Subject: SG Corrections/Sanke Dip Tubes/Chill Times RE: SG corrections for Temperature - ---------------------------------- Chris Vyhnal in #1808 mentioned that for temps between 35F and 80F that hydrometer corrections were about .002 or less. I noticed this because my table indicates the corrections for the range 30F to 73F are .001 or or less. This means there are a number of equations being used out there... I've been using a sg vs. temp curve I found in the HBD some time back, and which the author (I think) fit to data in the Handbook of Chemistry and Physics (the "CRC"). Anyway, this is a 3rd-order fit to allow you to correct a direct sg reading to any h-meter calibration temperature. Barring any transcription errors, I have: correction = 1.62860587e-05(tc - t) - 5.84994855e-06(tc^2 - t^2) + 1.53243635e-08(tc^3 - t^3) (1) where t is the sample temperature (deg C) and tc is the hydrometer calibration temperature (deg C). To see how this general equation compared to the one Chris presented (which was for a 60F hydrometer), I replaced tc with 15.56C (60F) and expanded: correction = -1.1622e-03 - 2.5334e-04t + 1.4155e-03t^2 -1.53243635e-08t^3 (2) Compare this with Chris's equation: correction = -2.0331e-03 - 3.2491e-05t + 1.1043e-06t^2 (3) The two equations provide the following corrections: sp grav temp range, F NOTE 1: This table covers the correct. Eqn 1 Eqn 2 range of 30F - 122F. - ------------------------ -0.002 na 30-41 NOTE 2: This table would be a -0.001 30-53 42-54 handy little item to 0.000 54-65 55-64 have on hand for most +0.001 66-73 65-73 brewers who haven't +0.002 74-81 74-80 found one elsewhere. +0.003 82-87 81-87 +0.004 88-93 88-93 NOTE 3: The Eqn 1 corrections +0.005 94-98 94-98 agree with the table that +0.006 99-103 99-103 appeared in the Spring 95 +0.007 104-108 104-108 Zymurgy (which were taken +0.008 109-112 109-113 from Noonan's lager book +0.009 113-116 114-117 p. 262) +0.010 117-120 118-122 Assuming the two equations have been transcribed correctly from the original sources, then I guess the question is whether the physics of the problem is better modeled with 2nd or 3rd order curves. If there is someone out there who has a handle on goodness-of-fit for these regressions it would be interesting to root this out a bit. Salvaged Sanke dip tubes. - ------------------------ Last week someone asked what use these tubes could be put to after dicing up Sanke kegs. I cut one off for use as a hydrometer jar--I found a plastic cap that fit over the bottom and just taped it on with electrician's tape. A more craftsmanlike job could be done by making a base/bottom cap from something like a hockey puck--whatever. I mentioned this before, but with tap water that hovers around 60F in the hottest part of the summer, I can cool a sample to calibration temp in just a minute or so. The metal hydrometer jar has the heat transfer thing going for it, and is unbreakable. Being stainless is another nice feature. Commercial micros I've been to seem to just use rigid copper pipe. Obligatory Chill Time Data Contribution - --------------------------------------- A 47ft dual-concentric coil of 3/8" copper with the maximum flow rate I can get from the kitchen, (running 55-60F water) cools 3.5 gal of your basic 40-60 gravity wort from 190F to 65-70F in under 4 minutes. The drop from 190 to 120F occurs too fast to time it with just two hands and binocular eyeballs. Last night, with the water at 60F exactly coming from a 3/4" copper supply line thru the garden hose, it took 4 minutes to chill 2.5 gal of 1.130-weight wort to 70F. A bit more of a challenge (in ALL respects) :-). KRF Colorado Springs Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 09:47:13 -0700 From: gtinseth at teleport.com (Glenn Tinseth) Subject: H2O2--not in my wort Rich Larsen <rlarsen at free.org> wrote: >>I took a yeast starter, transferred the living yeast to a larger flash >>and added some fresh wort. In the original smaller flask, I added some >>fresh wort also, about 50 ml, then about 10 ml Hydrogen peroxide. To which Bill Johns <rider at pullman.com> responded: >EGADS!! H2O2 is a hellishly strong oxidizer. It'll kill everything in >the pot. Not to mention oxidizing hop aroma and flavor compounds, reduced melanoidins, and a host of other things you don't want to oxidize. I'll stick with my little aquarium pump, bubbler, and HEPA filter. Glenn Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 11:36:36 -0500 From: ray_gaffield at il.us.swissbank.com (Ray Gaffield) Subject: Emergency:BrewPubs in Manhattan A colleague of mine who suddenly finds himself in Manhattan this week has ask me to make an Emergency request for any information on good brewpubs or other fine drinking establishments in the area, especially any featuring Belgian beers. Please help. Thank you. RAY Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 13:24:51 -0400 From: joep at informix.com (Brandon's Daddy) Subject: Pitching temp >>>>> Jim Busch writes: Jim> Pat relates: <Time to cool wort to 80 deg. F using 25'x 3/8" Jim> copper tubing immersion <chiller = approx 20-25 minutes Jim> I just wanted to point out to any newer brewers that pitching ale Jim> yeast at this high a temp is very bad. Im sure Pat does something Jim> to drop the temp closer to 70F prior to fermentation, but I didnt Jim> want others to get the idea that this is desirable. I aim for Jim> 60-65F prior to pitching ale yeast, but it can be a pain with Jim> water temps running 80F+ these days. I use an inline ice water <snip> I have always pitched around 80F without any problem. What are the risks of pitching at 80F (besides the risk of killing the yeast?). My house is kept at about 78F in the spring and summer (and fall :) ). That is my fermentation temperature. No problems with ferments in 13 batches. joe. +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Joe Pearl, Sr. Sales Engineer, Informix Software, Inc. | | 8675 Hidden River Parkway, Tampa, FL, 33637 813-615-0616 | | PGP'd email preferred | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Be wary of the man who urges an action in which he himself incurs no risk. | | JOAQUIN de SETANTI | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 14:19:56 EST From: John DeCarlo <jdecarlo at mitre.org> Subject: Mega Craft Breweries Well, since I regularly compare beer to bread, let's look at the bread market, even in your supermarket. In my part of the country, you have lots of "whole wheat" breads (even Wonder Bread whole wheat!) and very few "soft white white white" breads. Sure, the "mega bakers" have less flavorful, cheaper products and more market share, but the bakeries are selling more bread and even supermarkets are selling bread baked there or close by. John DeCarlo, MITRE Corporation, McLean, VA--My views are my own Fidonet: 1:109/131 Internet: jdecarlo at mitre.org Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 14:15:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Kirby <mkirby at isnet.is.wfu.edu> Subject: Finings for Wheat? I need some advice for a Bavarian Wheat (via CM3). It's currently in the secondary and all seems fine, but I'm wondering about finings. I understand that wheats are generally hazy, etc. (I used wheat malt like the recipe suggested). Is it ok to use gelatin to settle the yeast and still maintain the style? Should I stay away from polyclar (tm?) as an attempt to eliminate the protein haze for this beer style? I'm unsure at the moment so any experiences you can share would be appreciated. BTW, I love the clove aroma of this brew. I used 3944, which seemed to work great! TIA, Todd Kirby Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 13:22:32 -0500 From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> Subject: Mega-craft brewing. I tend to agree that craft brewing will not die when most are bought out by the megas. Sure, the desire for good beer is a fad for most people who are into it, but there are enough of us left to constitute a market worth selling to. The craft beer industry will probably be at half its current size in 15 years regardless of who owns what. At the same time, when they "dummy up" or "water down" beers, this is a major loss. If they can make as much or more money making good beer, they will continue to do so. As for betting on which companies will be bought up, I would think that either Grant's or Sierra Nevada would be a real nice addition to any mega's portfolio, but both are a bit too big for a hostile takeover. (If they're even public, which I don't know.) The Win-It-Too company was engineered for a takeover. My prediction - early '97, they'll be bought (or bailed) out by Stroh's, Leinenkugel's or Interbrew. (In that order of probability.) -R Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 14:57:26 -0400 From: SoarMoose at aol.com Subject: Re: Pitching temp > >I just wanted to point out to any newer brewers that pitching ale yeast >at this high a temp is very bad. Im sure Pat does something to drop the >temp closer to 70F prior to ferm > Please specify what you mean by "Very Bad" when you talk about pitching at 80. I pitch at higher temperatures all the time and get good, vigorous fermentation and no off flavors. I use a strain of Chico yeast that I get from a local brewery and find that my ales come out just right. -Chris (C&S Nanobrewery) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 14:09:06 -0500 From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> Subject: Dead Thread. I've been getting my HBDs out of order, and I think I've been dropped from the list twice in the past two weeks. Anyone else having similar problems? > From: Rich Larsen <rlarsen at free.org> > Subject: Yeast & H2O2 > I declare this thread DEAD. You can't do that. If you try, a bunch of kneebiters like me will post saying that you can't kill a thread, only a thread can kill a thread. (Guns don't kill people, bullets kill people.) Then, the next thing you'll get is a bunch of goobers lampooning it, making stupid jokes for years. "My mercury LeSable runs on Peroxide, is my coriander ruined?" Har har. No, the only way to kill a thread is to just let it die of natural causes. Declaring it dead just opens the digest up to a bunch of wasted bandwidth on obscure jokes. We wouldn't want that, would we? -R Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 15:22:52 EDT From: dipalma at sky.com (Jim Dipalma) Subject: Re: More on B-Brite, wort chilling Hi All, In a recent HBD, Harry writes: >I too have noticed a >change in the B-Brite formula. It now suds up more like a detergent than >before. I liked it better before. I liked the old BBrite better, too. The new formulation is suspiciously similar to dishwasher detergent. I switched to iodophor. >do you folks rinse >after the B-Brite? I've seen somewhere that you don't have to but have >never believed it. Don't believe it. Rinse. Trust me. This past spring, I entered a bock in a competition. The judging was done at a site in my hometown, so I made arrangements with the organizer to hand deliver my entry. The night before the competition, I CP-filled the bottles, which had been soaking in a bucket of BBrite. It was 1 AM, I was just a little groggy, and inadvertantly neglected to rinse out the bottles, just filled them and capped them. Next day, I was sitting next to the panel that was judging the sub-category that I'd entered. On that panel was a National judge, who's also a friend and a fellow member of the same homebrew club. I listened as nearly the entire flight was scored in the low to mid 20s, a very dismal collection of beers indeed. At the end of the day, I retrieved my scoresheets, and saw comments like "sulfury" and "solvent-like", along with a score of 22. I *knew* these flavors weren't in the beer, so I went back to where the stewards were, and asked them to pull one of the remaining two bottles. Sure enough, the judges' comments were right on the money, the beer had a harsh, chemical solvent-like taste. Fast forward two weeks, I was sitting in the living room of this same National judge, and poured him a glass of the same bock from a bottle that had been rinsed. He remarked that it was "really quite good", then asked me why I hadn't entered it as "I'd score this a 35, at least". BTW, the beer that won the competiton scored just over 37. ********************************************************************* Picking up the thread on chilling times, Dion writes: >Due to some replies I have gotten personally on this subject, maybe a >good plan would be for people with experiences similar to Doc's >(i.e. short chilling times without stirring) to submit temperature >readings of their input water. Mine here in San Diego is usually >around 65-70F which I know certainly accounts for the extremely long >time to come down from 90F to 75F. I think the temp of the input water is key. I have a deep dug well, and in the depths of a New England winter, its temperature is typically 40F-45F. I use an immersion chiller, 50' of 3/8" copper, and can chill a 10 gallon batch in about 20 minutes during the winter, no stirring. This time of year, using the same chiller and volume of wort, it takes ~35 minutes, almost twice as long. I haven't measured the temp of the water, I'd guesstimate it's about 70F. I'm brewing this coming Saturday, I'll measure both the temp and the chilling time, and report back. A couple of notes on the "design" of this chiller. I used 50' because it came in a 50' roll, and I was too lazy to cut it. I just left a few feet on the ends for the inlet/outlet connections, then coiled it around a corny keg. I used some copper wire to arrange the coils so the ones near the top of the chiller were spaced more closely together than the coils near the bottom. I also connected the inlet so that the cold water entering the chiller went through the top coils first. It seemed to me that these latter two steps would allow the chiller to work with the natural convection currents, rather than fight against them, though I could be way off on this. I haven't taken a course that required me to solve a heat transfer problem since the late '60s. I'd like to hear from those who report 40 minutes to chill 5 gallons with an immersion chiller. What length and diameter of tubing are you using? Which end of the coils are you connecting the inlet to?? One final observation. I've noticed when the wort is done chilling, the outside of the kettle below the liquid level is quite cool, whereas the outside of the kettle above the liquid level is still very warm, almost hot to the touch. I think the poor heat conductivity of SS has something to do with it. Anybody else notice this?? Cheers, Jim dipalma at sky.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 14:24:40 -0500 From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> Subject: Brewing Women. I was so peeved that Suzette Smith accused me of being sexist and "unwelcoming" towards women that I went back and re-read my original post. Apparently, the word "nice" was dropped, probably due to my own "user error". What I meant to say was that I think that women should be made to feel welcome to our hobby. If they don't want to brew, that shouldn't bother us - unless their reason for not wanting to brew is that we make them feel unwelcome. I -do- think that the sundry issues of why men prefer certain hobbies more than women is an intractable mess, and just plain dull. The answers to the question "why do fewer women brew?" are usually rife with BS, people's pet theories, and finger-pointing. It's just not a thread worth pursuing. Maybe it's dead now... Seriously, if you encounter some guy who is making women feel uninvited to our homebrew party, tell them what an idiot they are. If you encounter someone who'd rather talk about hops than pop-psych, well, give them a beer. -R Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 12:42:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan Sherman <dsherman at sdcc3.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Mash-out and extract efficiency John ?Lastname? told how his extract efficiency skyrocketed when he started doing a mash-out. Though a little personal experience and several conversations with other brewers, I have found the same thing. It seems that grain bed temperature has a definite effect on lautering efficiency. Even the simple act of covering the lauter tun while sparging helps to keep the grain bed temp. up and increases the amount of sugar that is dissolved into the sparge water. Dan Sherman San Diego, CA dsherman at ucsd.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 16:59:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Suzette Smith <SSMITH1 at drew.edu> Subject: Re:women brewers Date: 15-Aug-1995 04:52pm EST From: Smith, Suzette SSMITH1 Dept: FAC/STAFF Tel No: (201)-408-3208 TO: Remote Addressee ( _in%HOMEBREW at HPFCMI.FC.HP.COM ) CC: Remote Addressee ( _in%RMAST at FNBC.COM ) Subject: Re:women brewers I want to publicly thank Russell for taking the time to craft a response to the women brewers thread. Put in the proper context, his original message (HBD #?) doesn't ruffle as many feathers. I apologize if I ruffled any feathers with my own comments. I guess I think homebrewing is so much fun that EVERYONE should do it, and am quite confused when I find *any* individuals that seem less than fascinated by the hobby. Now the reward for living another day---a homebrew for each hand and all my friends! Suzette Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 19:05:02 -0500 From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange) Subject: Wort Dilution As there has been some discussion of wort dilution in the last few numbers I thought I'd toss in my method. I assume the problem to be solved is: I have x gallons of wort at gravity y and want gavity z < x. To what volume should I dilute?. I do this by first finding the pounds of extract I have. The pounds per gallon of wort is approximately w = .0834*y + .000317*y*y where y is the desired gravity in degrees Plato.The total extract is then W = w*x. Next find the amount of extract per gallon required to give the desired gravity, z. The same formula gives r = .0834*z + .000317*z*z. After the dilution r is equal to the total extract, W, divided by the diluted volume, V i.e. r = W/V. This is easily solved for V as V = W/r and the water to be added is approximately, but not exactly, V - x. A related problem is: I have x gallons of wort at gravity y. What will the gravity be if I dilute to V gallons? The first step is the same i.e. I calculate that I have a total of W pounds of extract in the x gallons. After dilution the pounds per gallon are r = W/V and we want the gravity for this concentration. It is obtained from P = 11.987*r -.54376*r*r + .0215*r*r*r. For those working with specific gravity the Plato gravity can be obtained from P = .016 + .2569*u - .000192*u*u where u = 1000*(SG - 1) for example if the specific gravity is 1.036 then u = 36. A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore! ajdel at interramp.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 20:30:11 -0400 From: BixMeister at aol.com Subject: Pouring Agar Plates?? I have all the basic materials for pouring agar plates. For safety, however I would like to be able to have my agar/wort media in a container with the following properties: 1. autoclavable 2. small opening with tight seal capable of being opened quickly(possibly some sort of mechanically operated opening similar to the commercial safety gas cans that open with a trigger type mechanism. All ideas are welcome. BixMeister BixMeister at aol.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 1995 20:38:15 -0500 (CDT) From: "Fr. Bradley A.M. Barber" <bbarber at tenet.edu> Subject: Iodophor use; racking question I have conflicting information on the use of Iodophor. One source (Williams Brewing) says that iodine sanitizer should be used at the ratio of two teaspoons per gallon of water. One should then rinse to remove toxic iodine residue. Other sources say that one should not exceed 0.5 oz. per five gallons. No rinsing is necessary. Who is right? Secondly, I have read with some interest recently about *racking* from the brewpot to the primary. In my five or six batches so far, I have never racked to the primary, simply because my instructions said nothing about it. Is is beneficial to rack to the primary rather than simply pouring? TIA Fr. Bradley A.M. Barber Pastoral Institute Diocese of Corpus Christi 1200 Lantana Corpus Christi, TX 78407-1112 E-Mail: bbarber at tenet.edu ppwf22a at prodigy.com Telephone: (512) 289-5030 Fax: (512) 289-1867 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 95 23:49 CDT From: pgravel at mcs.com (Philip Gravel) Subject: Wort chilling/Peroxide oxygenation ===> Chuck Wettergreen comments about chilling times: >I'm sure you're all chilling five gallons, but five gallons of what? A >very high gravity wort should take longer to cool simply because of the >increased mass of the solution. Just think about cooling 5 gallons of honey >vs. five gallons of distilled water. Which will cool faster, given the same >chiller, inlet temperature, water pressure, and flow rate? Many factors come into play in chilling wort. One of the most important is the heat capacity (amount of heat (Kcal) needed to raise the temperature 1^C) of the medium being cooled. I would expect that a high gravity wort has a higher heat capacity than plain water or a low gravity wort and therefore would need more water to cool it to a given temperature all other things being equal. Something else to consider is the viscosity of the medium being cooled. Honey is very viscous and therefore forms thick boundary layers around the cooling coil which act as insulation and impede heat transfer. A high gravity wort is more viscous that a low gravity wort, but nowhere near as viscous as honey. ===> Bill Johns comments about oxygenating wort with H2O2: >EGADS!! H2O2 is a hellishly strong oxidizer. It'll kill everything in >the pot. Absolutely. >>I knew that would happen... but just had to prove it. H2O2 is NOT a >>source of oxygen. > >Oh yes it is. Gotta use it right. >As long as you're in the experimental mode, redo your experiment. First >get about the same volume of water you will use for your wart volume and >add some H2O2. Find a metal you can stir with that will cause the >decomposition of the peroxide. A stainless steel spoon or silver chain >should work. Just watch for bubbles. Then redo the experiment, this time, >add the H2O2 to the wort and stir with the metal thing you just determined >will work. When the bubbling stops, you've probably decomposed all the >H2O2 and can safely add the yeasties. I'd be concerned about ensuring that the peroxide is totally decomposed. To the extent that it's not, it is still available to act as a sanitizer and an oxidizer. Chlorine bleach will sanitize at the part per million level. I suspect peroxide would also. - -- Phil _____________________________________________________________ Philip Gravel Lisle, Illinois pgravel at mcs.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 16 Aug 1995 01:06:59 -0400 From: PatrickM50 at aol.com Subject: Re: pitching temp clarified In HBD#1808 Jim Busch correctly cautions re: an earlier post of mine: >Pat relates: > ><Time to cool wort to 80 deg. F using 25'x 3/8" copper tubing immersion ><chiller = approx 20-25 minutes > >I just wanted to point out to any newer brewers that pitching ale yeast >at this high a temp is very bad. Im sure Pat does something to drop the >temp closer to 70F prior to fermentation, Right you are, Jim, and my apologies to all for any confusion caused. Once the temp of the cooling wort has dropped to about 80 deg or so, I stop stirring, remove the chiller, and let the wort sit all quiet like and covered for at least 10 minutes to let the cold break settle. I then siphon using an aeration-tube at the end of the flex tubing and this further cools the wort as it fills the fermentor. By the time I'm done the wort is usually in the 65-68 deg. F. area. Cheers, Pat Maloney Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1809, 08/16/95