HOMEBREW Digest #2588 Sat 20 December 1997

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Results. PALE ALES "Hoppiest Show on Earth" Competition! (Small Change)
  Fermentation Pressure (Joe Stone)
  Phytic Acid/Whirlpool Articles (ajdel)
  re: Carboy Spigots (Sean Mick)
  Air pump filters (Edward J. Basgall)
  marris otter defense (SClaus4688)
  Humor (Chris Cooper)
  BJCP Test Preparation (Charles Burns)
  Wine Making, Plastic Fermenters (Jack Schmidling)
  Re: Maris Otter malt..Stuck Sparge (Jim Wallace)
  Compost, Blowoff, and east vs. west. (GuyG4)
  Mash efficiency (Jason Henning)
  Re: Topping off/Adding water during the boil (Attila Thuroczy)
  Netscape 3.0 use (kathy)
  War of the Worts email address (Alan Folsom)
  Undercarbonated batch ("Spies, James")
  Glass Airlocks (Jim Anderson)
  Wassail recipe request (Tom Williams)
  RE:Nitrogen and stout taps (Kit Anderson)
  Motorizing Corona Mills/Converted Keg Fermenters (Bill_Rehm)
  Heavy Metal brew (Mike Spinelli)
  Re: A-B attacks (Graham Barron)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 13:24:52 -0500 (EST) From: Small Change <schd at pluto.njcc.com> Subject: Results. PALE ALES "Hoppiest Show on Earth" Competition! PALE ALES "Le Premier Spectacle de Houblon du Monde" held Dec. 7, 1997. Six people took the AHA/BJCP TEST on Dec. 6. A total of 340 entrants marked our first AHA/BJCP competition, total retail cost ofthe prizes exceeded $5000. The Award Ceremony, Best of Show panel and Bitterest Beer (which was won by Dave Albert) Face Contest attracted more than 250 people on Dec. 8th in Princeton. Our congratulations to all the winners. Their prizes and medal associated with the prize, and individual score sheets can be arranged to be picked at Princeton Homebrew or they can be mailed to the winners, please promptly reply tothis message (schd at pluto.njcc.com) or write to PALE ALES, 82 Nassau St., #20, Princeton, NJ 08542. Sorry, shipping costs of the prizes are the responsibility of the winners. We have already started preparations for our competition next year - which will be even bigger. We wish to thank all involved. Some categories were collapsed and best of category was chosen. Further information concerning the winners of individual subcategories will be shown our web page http://www.angelfire.com/biz/paleales. THE WINNERS Best of Show - Mike Jarrett, Barley Wine, Awarded Groen S.S. Steam Jacketed Kettle, donated by Highpoint Brewing Company. Second Place Best of Show - Ed Basgall, Cranapple Cider, Awarded "A Textbook Of Brewing" by Jean De Clerk, donated by Siebel Institute. Third Place Best of Show - Mike Jarrett, English Mild Ale, Awarded a Valley Mill Grain Mill, donated by Valley Mill. Note: All Category Winners receive a One Year subscription to Beer Notes. 1 Barley Wine 1st - Mike Jarrett, 55lb Pale Malt from Crisp Malting Co. 2nd - Marc Sedam, One year membership to A.H.A. 3rd - Hoyt Holley, Triumph Brewing Company Dinner for 2 2 Belgian and French Ale 1st - Bob Hall, Case of Duvel from Vanberg & DeWulf 2nd - Bob Hall, One year membership to A.H.A. 3rd - Hoyt Holley, One 5 gallon Carboy 3 Belgian Gueuze and Lambic Collapsed 4 Mild and Brown Ale 1st - Mike Jarrett, Case Edme Marris Otter Extract 2nd - Tom Smeraldi, 55lb Bag Pale Malt from Crisp 3rd - tie Randy Smith/Billy Klinger L.D. Carlson Gift Cert. at Princeton Homebrew 5 English Style Pale Ale 1st - David Levesque, Gift Cert. at Princeton Homebrew 2nd - Rich Koch, 12 Samuel Smith Nonik glass, Merchant du Vin 3rd - Ted Hull, FERMENTAP Fermatap 6 American Style Ale 1st - Al Boccardo, Hop Plug variety from Morris Hanbury 2nd - John Lyga, 6 Pint glasses from Dock Street 3rd - tie Brian Rezac, Ale Street News 2 yr. subscription t-shirt/Craig Fairchild,The Beverage Machine Gift Cert. at Princeton Homebrew 7 English Bitter 1st - George DePiro, 12 Fuller's Nonik Pint glasses from PNA 2nd - Paul Krupa, Gift Certificate from Cherry Hill Homebrew 3rd - Andrew Koontz, Highlander Homebrew Best Bitter Kit 8 Scottish Ale 1st - Michael Fenessy, One year Subscription to AHA, 2 T- shirts from Alan Moen 2nd - Dave Bush, Brew Magazine One-Year Subscription, RJ Grape Ballcap T-shirt 3rd - Rich Koch, South Jersey Fermentors case Liter Growlers 9 Porter 1st - Shawn Bosch, Gift Cert. from Homebrew Unlimited 2nd - Ron Thomas, 1 yr. Sub. from Brewing Techniques Magazine 3rd - Will Fields, Two T-Shirts from Independence Brewing 10 English and Scottish Strong Ale 1st - Roland Pena, S.S. Converted Keg from The Beer Cellar 2nd - Paul Karasiewicz, Samuel Smith Sweater and Towels from Merchant du Vin 3rd - Lester Lewis, 2 year subscription from Malt Advocate 11 Stout 1st - Donald Rice, case Coopers Stout Extract from Cascadia Importers 2nd - Curt Blanchard, Hop Pellet Variety from Hop Union 3rd - Kennedy & Rosenfield, South Jersey Fermentors case Liter Growlers 12 Bock 1st - Jim Wagner, 6 Celebrator glasses from Merchant du Vin 2nd - Chuck DiSanto, 6 Fuller's Nonik Pint glasses from PNA 3rd - Tim Toscano, 2 year subscription to Malt Advocate 13 German Dark Lager 1st -Dean Fikar, Oktoberfest CD-ROM, Shirt from Wild Goose Brewing 2nd - Jeffrey North, 6 Fuller's Nonik Pint glasses from PNA 3rd - Rich Koch, Climax 50lb bag DWC Pale 14 German Light Lager Collapsed 15 Classic Pilsner 1st - William Bonorden, 55lb DWC Pilsen from Flying Fish 2nd - George Fix, Hop Pellet Variety from Hop Union, RJ Grape Sweatshirt 3rd - Bob Halk, Variety Pack from Weyerbacher Brewing Co. 16 American Lager 1st - Paul Thompson, Kaiserdom Pils glasses from Merchant du Vin/Two Button-up Shirts from Wild Goose 2nd - Shawn Bosch, Sam Adams Pullover from Boston Brewing Co. 3rd - Jack Cheeseman, Market Guide & T-shirt from Brewing Techniques Magazine 17 Vienna/Marzen/Oktoberfest 1st - Dean Fikar, 5, one liter Paulaner Munchen mugs from PNA 2nd - Roger Whyman, 12 Pint glasses from Independence Brewing 3rd - George DePiro, Gift Cert. from Brewers Apprentice 18 German Style Ale 1st - Dave Bush, Gift Certificate for Princeton Homebrew 2nd - Dean Fikar, "Analysis Brewing Techniques" from AHA 3rd - John Lyga, 6 Pint glasses from Independence Brewing 19 German Style Wheat Beer 1st - Bob Halk, 6, Half Liter Paulaner Wheat Glass from PNA 2nd - Roland Pena, "Analysis Brewing Techniques" from AHA 3rd - Al Boccardo, One Corny Keg from C & C Distributing Co 20 Smoked Beer 1st - Lester Lewis, Gift Cert. for Homebrew Seminar from American Brewer's Guild 2nd - William Bonorden, Vinotheque variety pack 3rd - Will Fields, Knight Dreams Gift Cert. 21 Fruit and Vegetable Beer 1st - Brian DeLorenzo, Gift Certificate from Salty Dog Gifts 2nd - Paul Stackelberg, Beer Maps from Lone Mountain Design & (6) Variety of Liquid Yeast from Wyeast 3rd - John Signorin, 6 Pint glasses from Independence Brewing 22 Herb and Spice Beer 1st - Mark and Sue Thompson, Dinner for Two at the Alchemist & Barrister 2nd - George John, Case Winter Warmer, Independence Brewing 3rd - Bob Wayersberg, Hop Plug Variety from Morris Hanbury 23 Specialty Beer 1st - David Houseman, Two Corny Kegs from C & C Distributing 2nd - Getzel and Scorazzo, T-shirts and Gift cert. from Double Springs Homebrew Supply 3rd - Steve & Donna Ashton, One Corny Kegs from C & C Distributing Co 24 California Common Beer Collapsed 25 Traditional Mead and Braggot 1st - Doug Hood, Gift Certificate from Crosby and Baker 2nd - Doug Hood, (6) Variety of Liquid Yeast from Wyeast 3rd - Steve & Donna Ashton, Climax 25lb bag DWC Pale 26 Fruit and Vegetable Mead Collapsed 27 Herb and Spice Mead Collapsed 28 Cider 1st - Ed Basgall, 2 CWE Cider Kits, 10lb Marris Otter Malt from Zymotic Importers 2nd - William Drach, Gift Certificate for 5 Gallons Cider from Terhune Orchard 3rd - Ed Basgall, Wyeast t-shirt 40 White Wine 1st - Jim McHale, Cuvee Vendange Wine Kit from Vinotheque USA 2nd - Arturo Ongaro, Vino Del Vita wine kit from Spagnols Wine Beermaking Supply 3rd - Margaret Steinbugler, RJ Grape Prod. Merlot Wine Kit 41 Red Wine Collapsed Door Prizes BrewCo - A BrewCap System, incl. hose brush BrewTees - 2 Homebrew T-shirts Cindy Renfrow - "A Sip through Time" book Climax Brewing Company - PhilChil Fittings Down East Books - 3 copies of "What's Brewing in New England" Fermentap - 5 Carboytaps, 3 Siphontaps, 4 Siphon Sprays Jack Schmidling - One Gott EASYMASHER door prize John Haas - 3 Hop Varieties T-shirts Johnston Assoc. Int'l - Brewpub Explorer of the Pacific Northwest Liquid Bread, Inc. - 6 carbonators & 3 Tote bags Lone Mountain Designs - Brewery and Microbrewery Maps of the US Pat Anderson - 6 copies "Using your Cornelius Keg Draft Red Bank Brewing - 110 lb bag of Steinbach Smoked Malt Sheaf & Vine - 5 copies of Homebrewing - Vol. 1 Vinotheque - Grab Bag of Goodies, Wine & Beer Labels, 2lb grain Walnut Creek CDROM - Beer Homebrewing Guide CDROM Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 12:01:11 -0800 From: Joe Stone <joestone at cisco.com> Subject: Fermentation Pressure Bret Schuhmacher referred to Dion Hollenbeck's use of an adjustable pressure relief valve to vent a Cornelius keg. Dion's technique involves replacing the stainless steel spring of a 25-50 PSI Norgren pressure relief valve with a Cornelius poppet spring to form a 15-40 PSI pressure relief valve. Is there a general "rule of thumb" in terms of fermentation pressure? I assume that there is a reason why Dion felt the need to drop the Norgren pressure relief valve down into the 15-25 PSI range. At what point does pressure begin to affect fermentation? Joe Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 15:15:25 -0500 From: ajdel <ajdel at mindspring.com> Subject: Phytic Acid/Whirlpool Articles Al wrote that I wrote: >>water quite a bit. From memory, a kg of patent malt contains the >>equivalent of several (5?)mL of concentrated (hardware store strength) >>hydrochloric acid. >This implies that we can use hardware store hydrochloric (Muriatic) >acid for brewing. I would certainly not advocate (or even admit to) the use of hardware store HCl in brewing in this forum. The intent was only to illustrate that there is quite a bit of acid in a couple of pounds of black malt. And then... >>One of the advantages of decoction mashing with low kilned >>grains is that more phytin gets hydrolyzed releasing (assuming calcium >>is available) more H+ thus dropping the pH further at each decoction. >Are you sure about this? No! I think what happens is something like the following. Malt contains the mixed calcium/magnesium salt of phytic acid and the enzyme phytase catalyzes hydrolysis of this salt to phytic acid. The phytic acid is then further hydrolyzed to myo-inositol and inorganic phosphate and the inorganic phosphate reacts with any calcium present to form the phosphate which precipitates causing, respectively, monohydrogen and dihydrogen phosphate to release H+ ions and convert to, respectively, phosphate and monohydrogen phosphate. Thus, while both pilsner and ale malts are kilned to an extent which allows phytase to survive and presumably therefore roughly equal amounts of phytic acid are produced at dough-in the boil of a decoction hydrolyzes more of this phytic acid than would be hydrolyzed without it so that more phosphate is released which, providing calcium is present, releases more H+ into the mash. Richard Steuven wrote: >There's an excellent discussion of the physics of the whirlpool in >the new "Brewing Techniques" issue. Are you sure you don't mean "New Brewer"? I haven't seen the Dec/Jan BT so perhaps you don't but NB did have an article on whirlpools in the last issue. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 12:17:46 -0800 (PST) From: homebrew at dcn.davis.ca.us (Sean Mick) Subject: re: Carboy Spigots Mark: I recently called the local wholesaler who was listed on one of those ads for the "Siphonless Carboy" to see if they were indeed selling them. I thought it would be a good thing to sell in my shop providing it worked as indicated and was well designed. It turns out that the wholesaler did not stock them, was not aware of the ad, and had to return the sample sent to him because it had cracks in it from the hole drilled. It was also difficult, if not impossible, to consistently assemble/remove the coffee/urn-type spigot with the long handled plastic wrench included. The manufacturer told him that due to the drilling process involved, there was always going to be a certain percentage of carboys that would have cracks. The wholesaler, at that point, has refused to carry this product until those problems have been corrected. It is our combined opinion that these problems cannot be corected for a reasonable price, if at all. The glass is thin through the middle of a carboy, and this makes drilling difficult. I know some of you have done it successfully, but for a manufacturer to claim they can do it with consistency is very unlikely. So, at least we have conscientous people in the industry looking out for us. I was approached by the manufacturer about a year ago to buy this product directly and I had the same reservations, compounded by the fact that it would retail for at least twice the price of a regular carboy (and who wants to pay $35 or more for a carboy with a $3 spigot attached?). With the information gotten from the wholesaler, I do not plan on carrying this item. Caveat Emptor! Sean Mick Mick's Homebrew Supplies http://www.dcn.davis.ca.us/~homebrew Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 16:43:28 -0500 From: ejb11 at psu.edu (Edward J. Basgall) Subject: Air pump filters Neal Parker asked about simple "in line" sterile filters for aquarium air pumps. I've found a suitable 0.2um pore size sterile filter unit housing with small hose barb fittings on each end. I will be ordering a box of them to use with my aquarium pump. If you or anyone else is interested I can send you one filter for $12US each which includes shipping. To order: send check or money order with shipping address to: Ed Basgall, 1176 S. Atherton St. State College, PA, 16801. cheers Ed Basgall State College Underground Maltsters State College, PA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 17:17:07 EST From: SClaus4688 <SClaus4688 at aol.com> Subject: marris otter defense The suggestion that Marris-Otter can cause stuck sparges is once again popping up in HBD posts. I thought I'd provide a data point in defense of this excellent malt. A couple years ago, through very happy coincidence, I acquired about 300 pounds of Marris-Otter from Beeston Malting Company for next to nothing. I used it exclusively for about a year in both single and multiple temperature infusion mashes. My mash/lauter tun has a perforated SS false bottom and I usually do a 167f mash out. I NEVER had a stuck sparge with it or even a slow sparge. (BTW, there's nothing like having 300 pounds of grain in the basement to give you that nice warm fuzzy feeling that all is right with the world!) -Steve Claussen in PDX Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 17:14:33 -0500 From: Chris Cooper <ccooper at a2607cc.msr.hp.com> Subject: Humor Greetings All! The following joke comes from the ORACLE SERVICE HUMOR MAILING LIST: > A man went into the proctologist's office for his first exam. > The doctor told him to have a seat in the examination room > and that he would be with him in just a few minutes. > > Well, when the man sat down in the examination room, he noticed > that there were three items on a stand next to the doctor's > desk: a tube of K-Y jelly, a rubber glove, and a beer. > > When the doctor came in, the man said, "Look Doc, this is my first > exam... I know what the K-Y is for... and I know what the > glove is for... but what's the BEER for?" At this instant, the > doctor became noticeably outraged and stormed over to the door. > > The doc flung the door open and yelled to his nurse, > "Dammit, nurse!!! I said a BUTT LIGHT!!!" Hoppy Brew Year to all! Chris Cooper , Commerce Michigan --> Pine Haven Brewery <-- Chris_Cooper at hp.com --> aka. Deb's Kitchen <-- (about 20 miles ENE of Jeff Renner) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 97 20:11 PST From: cburns at egusd.k12.ca.us (Charles Burns) Subject: BJCP Test Preparation My posting last week about taking the BJCP test drew more attention than I expected. A number of people wrote me to ask for advice on how to study, what to study, where/when tests would be given, etc. I thought I=92d try to jot down some of my advice on how to get ready for the test while this stuff is fresh in my mind. I know there are lots of others that subscribe to this digest that can clarify, correct, enhance what I=92ve come up with and I hope they do. First, if you have access to the WWW, make sure to check out the BJCP home page at WWW.BJCP.ORG. You=92ll find test schedules, locations, study guides, style guidelines and email addresses for further information there. Its a great place to start. The test places a large emphasis on understanding and differentiating beer styles. Style definitions are an attempt to set up an objective set of criteria to measure creative recipes and processes (and the results thereof) to some kind of common, agreed upon, standard. Its a difficult process to 1) set those guidelines and 2) defend them, as can be witnessed by several recent discussion threads on this subject. But its all we have and until someone comes up with something better, that=92s what we have to strive to become good at, understanding and interpreting what the guidelines mean and how to evaluate a beer against those guidelines. That said, there=92s always the classical science and the process of brewing that=92s well covered in the exam also. Its just that the science part of it is fairly easy due to all the text available to read, reread and memorize. I can=92t tell you how many times I went back and re-read Dave Miller=92s discussion of malts in his Handbook of Homebrewing. Its a very good reference (imho). Our group consisted of me and 3 others. I was the neophyte, having only about 18 months of brewing under my belt before starting, and only about a year of that doing all grain brews. The others had been brewing for many years and had all been judging beers albeit without certification. They knew styles inside and out and the science/process was pretty much old hat to them. I used and abused them as much as possible, asking as many stupid questions as I could think of every time we met. We followed the outline from Brewing Techniques (Scott Bickam, May-August 97). We did 9 sessions, once a week for 9 weeks and skipped the DR Beer session (although I wanted to do it, nobody else was interested). A lot of what happened in those sessions was a little frustrating for me. My palate has never been trained to enjoy or understand complex flavors. I knew the difference between sweet and sour, but how about bitter and astringent? It takes a lot (lot!) of practice. I feel like my palate is beginning to become trained, but it will take lots more beer drinking before I=92m really comfortable about discerning aromas and flavors accurately. Good reason to practice! The outline in BT included a technical discussion for each tasting session. This was pretty much ignored by everyone in the group except me. I continued to bug my study partners with questions relating to the evening=92s= technical topic and thereby building up my knowledge base. Don=92t let the tech topic discussions get away from you. They are important. Its good healthy discussion, just like here on the digest. Here=92s some suggestions on how to run a study group. 1. Assign one person the responsibility for getting the samples (each meeting different person). Don=92t do it like we did. We tried a minimum of= 8 and up to 14 different samples each meeting. All you need is 2 to 4 maximum. It costs wayyy to much to do a lot of them, and all you do is get buzzed and lose interest in serious discussions. 2. Assign one person to the technical topic of the day. That person should do some research, provide some written materials to the others and come up with 2 to 4 sample test questions dealing with that topic. The questions and appropriate answers should be discussed during the session. Apply the discussion to the style of the evening if possible. 3. Do the technical discussion first, prior to any sampling. This is self explanatory. 4. Prior to doing any sampling, following the technical discussion, discuss the style. Assign 1 person to do some research on the history of the style being discussed. Origins, history and development of the style is good information to have when writing essay answers to beer style questions. It also helps to understand sometimes why the beers taste and look the way they do (or the way they should). Like the differences between Porter and Stout (part of one of our questions was to differentiate between Robust Porter and Imperial Stout). 5. Get some judging forms and judge each sample of the style you are working on that evening. If at all possible, especially for the first few sessions, get an experienced (good) beer judge to help you. There are very bad ways to fill out judging forms and there are really good ways to do it. I=92m sure you=92ve all experienced both. I can=92t tell you how much= difference it made to have Dave Sapsis and Dave Brattstrom help us develop our techniques for communicating back to the brewer what we were seeing, tasting, smelling. Constructive criticism is not easy, especially when that beer you just had is really really bad. Like some of those Belgians=85 There=92s probably a million other little things I=92m forgetting. The Gold Country Brewers Association (GCBA) (on the web somewhere) put together a really complete set of reference materials and their own study guide. Dave B was kind enough to share his with us. Listed below are the pieces which I feel were really the meat of the package: a. Excerpts from Beer and Brewing volume 6, 20 talks from the National Homebrewers Conference; Michael Jackson on Styles, Ted Konis on the Origins of Normal and Abnormal Flavor. b. A Homebrewers Guide to Beer Flavor Descriptors, Special Issue of Zymurgy 1987. c. A Spectrum of colors and Flavors - The Great Grain Special Issue of Zymurgy, 1995. d. The Essential Oil of Hops: Hop Aroma nd Flavor in Hops and Beer, Glenn Tinseth 1993 (not sure where this was published). Are you there Glen? e. Why Water Matters, Zymurgy Special issue 1995 f. Yeast Cycles: Ethanol, C02, and Byproducts, George Fix, Zymurgy Special Issue 1985. g. Stepping up to Advanced Techniques, Mashing Basics, Jim Busch, Brewing Techniques March/April 1995 (and he does it again only better in 1997). For my own studying, I went out and bought the latest revision of Michael Jackson=92s Beer Companion. Its recently revised, like 1997 I think (Brian borrowed it last week). Its got a ton of wonderful history, recipies, anectdotes and commercial examples of every style imaginable. Enjoyable reading, makes a great coffee table book. The best, most complete reference I used was Dave Miller=92s Handbook of Homebrewing. It just has so much information organized so well, its like my encyclopeadia and where I go first. I gave up with NCJOHB long ago. I have Gregg Noonan=92s New Brewing Lager Beer and read it cover to cover, but= found it not as well organized as Miller=92s book. For chemistry, George Fix=92s Principles of Brewing Science is great. It= even has a primer on basic chemistry in the appendix for those of us that need= it. For Hops, I personally enjoyed Mark Garetz book "using hops". I continue to use it every time I formulate a new recipe and have any question on hops. All in all, nearly everything you need to know to pass the test is in the BJCP studyguide on the net. Charley (60 miles west of some of the best skiing in the World) in N. Cal Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 13:27:06 -0800 From: Jack Schmidling <arf at mc.net> Subject: Wine Making, Plastic Fermenters From: Jorge Blasig - IQ <gisalb at elmer.fing.edu.uy> Subject: Question about winemaking "I have a question though: how should I use sulfite (methabisulfite) to stop fermentation and stabilize the final product according to my taste? Use 1 tsp of sulfite for 5 gals of must. Let sit at least 24 hours before pitching. If you are using an exotic yeast, pitch a sample in a small amount of must to make sure it is ready. If you let the wine ferment out fully before bottling, there is no need to stabilize it. ........... From: George_De_Piro at berlex.com (George De Piro) Subject: Don't go rushing to throw out your carboy.... " While you can get acceptable results using his method, plastic pails are actually quite a bit more difficult to keep in sanitary condition than glass carboys. Plastic scratches easily, and once it is scratched, it is no longer useful as a sanitary vessel. I think we have here another classic MOMILY. This has been repeated so often it has become dogma but doesn't seem to stand the test of reality. First of all, how could sloshing some bleach around in a bucket be more "difficult" than wrestling with a large glass carboy? It needs to be proven that bleach sloshed around in a scratched plastic fermenter is any less sanitary the a carboy sanitized any way you wish. One further note on bleach.... it has been years since I followed the advice of tsps per gallon. Bleach is dirt cheap and pinching pennies with it may be the key to the notion that scratched plastic is deadly. I use bleach almost full strength in kegs, fermenters or anything else that I can not sanitize with steam. If you don't like the smell or what it does to your hands, cut it in half or ten to one but the teaspoon is a joke. Obviously, when used this way careful rinsing is a must and you end up with a vessle no more sanitary that the rinse water but that is usually more than adequate. Back when I used a plastic fermenter, I would put a cup or so of bleach in it before putting it away. When I wanted to use it again I simply rinsed it out and used it. Bottom line is that there is no more convenient fermenter than the traditional plastic one with the lid that homebrew retailers have been selling for years. js - -- Visit our WEB pages: Beer Stuff.........http://ays.net/jsp Astronomy.......http://user.mc.net/arf ASTROPHOTO OF THE WEEK..... New Every Monday Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 16:05:10 -0500 From: Jim Wallace <jwallace at crocker.com> Subject: Re: Maris Otter malt..Stuck Sparge Date: Sun, 07 Dec 1997 22:44:05 -0800 .....................From: smurman at best.com........................ I recently did 3 batches with the Hugh Baird Maris Otter malt, and I can relate that if the crush is not done carefully, this malt is indeed prone to the "sparge from hell". My Phils Phloating Bottom wouldn't handle it, and I had to switch to my old Zapap, with it's larger hole size. I think the main problem is that this malt is ............................................................................ ............................. Yikes... I thought it was my sloppy mashing technique... I have made 10-15 batches using Brit Pale malt in the last year or so. My supplier provided me with a bag of Crisp Marris Otter a few weeks ago and sure enought that batch stuck near the end and I had to restir and recirc to finish. This was my FIRST STUCK SPARGE. I didn't pay it much mind but on reading above item I remembered the thread from a while back. This is looking like a bit more than coincidence to me.. perhaps the Marris Otter is overmodified and crushes too fine under conventional mill gaps. ___________________________________________ JIM WALLACE ... jwallace at crocker.com www.crocker.com/~jwallace ___________________________________________ Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 00:17:52 EST From: GuyG4 <GuyG4 at aol.com> Subject: Compost, Blowoff, and east vs. west. Dan Asks: >I'm curious if anybody out there has experience with composting their brewing waste? Yeah. Grain plus grass clippings goes fast, works good. Grain has lots of Carbon relative to grass..it seems to help things along nicely. Follow traditional composting techniques, eschew expensive composters...call your local extension agent for help on low cost, effective composting, become a master composter, and help other folks. Smell, yes, but I've no oversensitive olfactory. Don't put it on your patio. I don't compost spent hops....dogs love trucks, but my golden retriever really loves compost. Especially if there might be a pheasant in it...which he must of course investigate. In HBD 2584, George DePiro (one of my favorite brewers...I'm a big fan, how's your steinbier?) notes: "Dave Burley writes (again) about the evils of blow off tubes and closed fermenters (i.e., carboys). He encourages the use of a plastic pail covered with plastic wrap. While you can get acceptable results using his method, plastic pails are actually quite a bit more difficult to keep in sanitary condition than glass carboys. Plastic scratches easily, and once it is scratched, it is no longer useful as a sanitary vessel. While I agree with Dave that a dirty blow off tube can cause infection of the batch, there are some VERY easy ways to avoid problems" Yes, it's seems to be time for Dave's semi-regular notation that closed fermentation with a blowoff tube is horrible. George, as usual, outlines sensible and practical methods to avoid the heinous threat to our beer from Dave's lurking bacteria. I would like to add to George's list the use of the glass (yes, glass!) blowoff tube. Buy one at your local homebrew supply or make one out of 5/8 inch (say 1.5 cm) inside diameter laboratory glass tubing bent over a propane torch, and never sweat this argument again!! Drill your stopper to accept the OD of the glass and you're in business. You can also make one out of copper tubing if you want. You may invest several dollars in one, or you can make one for bloody near free. Open fermentation for those of us who must live in homes with dogs, children, cats, etc. doesn't work very well. Too much dust and hair. Ferment in carboys with a blowoff, either as George suggests, or use a glass or copper or other tube, and you won't be sorry. Then, you too can lurk through Dave's next post on this subject, and you can continue to have fun. A question: Jeff promotes classic American Pilsener...I've made it several times, and drunk it a lot...real good beer. But as Jeff notes, it is an "eastern" beer. What was the difference between "eastern" beer and "western" beer, if there's anyone out there old enough to remember when there was a distinction? GuyG4 at aol.com Guy Gregory Lightning Creek Home Brewery Spokane, WA Blowing 'em off durn far west of Jeff and also in the Rose Bowl Go Cougs!!!! Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 09:49:26 GMT From: huskers at olywa.net (Jason Henning) Subject: Mash efficiency Merry Christmas- =46rom 2574, Brian Dixon said: =20 + This brings up an interesting point for me, Kent. My efficiencies + consistently come in at around 90-94%, which seems ungodly high. And in 2575, Kent Townley responded with: + Assuming my hypothesis is correct, my guess would be a measurement + error in grain weight and/or specific gravity. Since efficiency is measured in point-pound/gallon, you need to measure grain weight, specific gravity, *and* gallons correctly. All three need = to accurate. Let me illustrate this point. I bought a 10 gallon kettle about two years ago. For my first batch, I = was in a pinch and I needed to be able to measure the volume. So I measured = the kettle's height, 16", and divided by 10. I plugged the number in to a spreadsheet to convert to 1/16ths of an inch. I marked off a stick and = have used it for about 50 more batches.=20 The other day, I decided to mark a dowel off and retire the stick. I discovered that I was a little more than a half gallon off at the 5 = gallon mark. I thought I had 5g when it was really 5.5g. I increased my efficiency 10% just by correctly measuring the volume! BTW, if Freud had been a homebrewer, mash-efficiency envy would've been = the biggest disorder of the day (followed by is-my-beer-ruined paranoia). Since Jeff ranted about signing post with your locations, I'd like to = vent my peeve. Yeast numbers. I haven't the foggiest idea which strain your referring to when folks post 3787, CL-160 or A04, . Please mention the strain by name at least once then you can drop into shorthand notation. Happy New Year, Jason Henning <huskers olywa net> Big Red Alchemy and Brewing 1930 miles WNW from the Pre-prohibition Lager Revival Center. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 13:23:08 +0100 From: Attila Thuroczy <Attila.Thuroczy at sds.no> Subject: Re: Topping off/Adding water during the boil >Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 08:50:05 -0800 >From: Steve Armbrust <SteveA at thepalace.com> >Subject: Topping off/Adding water during the boil >In HBD #2580, Tom Clark asks about topping off his boiling wort with >boiling water. >I do something similar. I too use a 6-gallon brewpot, which isn't quite >big enough to hold all the wort after sparging an all-grain batch. So I >add as much to the brewpot as will fit comfortably without danger of >From HBD #2583 >Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 08:50:05 -0800 >From: Steve Armbrust <SteveA at thepalace.com> >Subject: Topping off/Adding water during the boil >In HBD #2580, Tom Clark asks about topping off his boiling wort with >boiling water. >I do something similar. I too use a 6-gallon brewpot, which isn't quite >big enough to hold all the wort after sparging an all-grain batch. So I >add as much to the brewpot as will fit comfortably without danger of >boilover, and then I start a smaller 5-quart "staging" pot boiling with >some of the remaining wort. Once the the wort in the brewpot starts >boiling and the foaming subsides, I add boiling wort from the smaller >pot to top it off. Then I add more to the smaller pot and get it >boiling again (much faster than the large pot) and top off when enough >evaporates from the brewpot. This way I end up with a full five gallons >at the end of the boil. The only drawback is the lack of boil time for some of the added wort. Here I am thinking about a residue of nonbreaked proteins. Should be a minor problem though. Myself I add some boiling water, but to get the right amount of wort, I later add boiled and cooled water to the fermenting wessel. It's a easy way to reach the target OG. (Small corrections of IBU and colour should then be done). at ttila Email: attila.thuroczy at sds.no Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 08:35:46 -0500 From: kathy <kbooth at scnc.waverly.k12.mi.us> Subject: Netscape 3.0 use If there is a reader out there that reads the HBD on Netscape 3.0 as I do, I would dearly love to ask you some Netscape 3.0 use questions. TIA cheers, jim booth, lansing, mi and Private mail of course to kbooth at waverly.k12.mi.us Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 08:12:21 -0600 (CST) From: folsom at ix.netcom.com (Alan Folsom) Subject: War of the Worts email address It has been pointed out to me that I misprinted the email address for the War of the Worts judge coordinator, it should be Nate Brese at: rahneb at rohmhaas.com, not "rohmhass". Two a's, one 's'. This mistake was made both in announcements on this forum, and in the flyers. Oops Thank you, astute reader! "Judges, We Need Judges, We need lots and lots of judges..." Please remember the War of the Worts January 17th, requests for info can be addressed to me at: folsom at ix.netcom.com (I think that's right...) For judgenet readers, please assume I've trashed someone for how many bottles they require, or for being an uncouth idiot in how I did so. It's the 'in' thing. Al Folsom Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 09:19:19 -0500 From: "Spies, James" <Jams at mlis.state.md.us> Subject: Undercarbonated batch Greetings All - Venturing out once again from my lurker status . . . I recently brewed an I.P.A. which was pitched directly on the yeast cake of a previous batch of I.P.A. which had just been bottled. The yeast was Wyeast 1968 ESB, and the initial batch came out fine. Some of your regular readers may remember my earlier post regarding reusing the yeast cake (thank you all for your responses, the unanimous opinion was "pitch away"). The first batch came out wonderfully, very hoppy with a some nice complimentary caramel notes in the nose. The problem, however, and the reason for the post, is batch #2. Fermentation was fast and furious, and the yeast cake after the second batch came out of primary was HUGE. However, the batch never carbonated, even after doing exactly the same procedures as batch #1 (boiling 2 c water, dissolving 3/4 c corn sugar, cooling, adding to fermented beer, mixing and bottling.) Was there not enough yeast in suspension when I siphoned the beer off of the cake? I know 1968 is flocculent, but geez! How can I remedy this situation? The batch has only been in the bottles for 2 weeks. Should I just let it sit and hope for the best, or uncap, add a pinch of sugar to each bottle and recap, or what? Please help!! I would love this batch to be carbonated, as the taste is wonderful. BTW, there is no sugary taste in the beer, so the yeasties apparently ate what food I fed them at bottling (which makes the lack of CO2 even more puzzling . . . ) Posts can be made to jams at mlis.state.md.us or to the collective as a whole if you feel that the information would be helpful to the masses (I feel that it would, as undercarbonatd beer is one of homebrewing's most frustrating situations.) TIA for your help . . . Jay Spies Wishful Thinking Basement Brewery Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 07:30:39 -0700 From: Jim Anderson <jander at xmission.com> Subject: Glass Airlocks In HBD #2584 Rust1d answers a query from "Mike": > Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 12:40:22 -0500 (EST) > From: Rust1d <rust1d at usa.net> > Subject: Glass Airlock > > Mike writes: > >Also, does anyone know where I might get a glass airlock? I somehow missed Mike's original post here. I've gotten several really nice glass airlocks through The Gourmet Brewer (no affiliation, blah blah). If memory serves, they're in the $7 ballpark. IMHO, they're worth it, as long as you're gentle with 'em ... I've already broken one. - Jim Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 09:29:17 -0500 From: Tom Williams <brewman at mail.wwnet.net> Subject: Wassail recipe request Can any one (or a number) of you good folks here provide some Wassail recipes? If this has been asked recently, please forgive and point me in the right direction. Gun Bai!! and Happy Holiday's Tom Williams <brewman at wwnet.com> Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 09:46:57 -0800 From: Kit Anderson <kitridge at bigfoot.com> Subject: RE:Nitrogen and stout taps JC Ferguson asked; > I have a "stout" fawcet that I use to serve homebrew with the N2/CO2 > gas mix, ala guinness. I serve the beer out of cornelius kegs in a fridge > that has a temp at about 40F or so. The N2/CO2 tank sits outside the > fridge at room temperature. > > My problem is I can never get the beer to dispense ala guinness! > When I keg, I do not prime at all, since that would generate CO2. > I tap the keg, turn on the guinness gas, and pour a pint, but it comes > out with NO head! i have tried force carbonating with the guinness > gas on at 28 PSI and shaking the keg without a whole lot of luck. > what I have observed is as the keg gets lower, the head starts to get > better. There will probably be lots of responses, but... First, 40F is too cold to serve a stout. Second, Guinness is CARBONATED with CO2 and DISPENSED with CO2/N2. So, force carbonate with CO2 at 30 psi and serve with your stout gas. That should solve your problem. - -- Kit Anderson ICQ# 2242257 Bath, Maine <kitridge at bigfoot.com> "I had the right rib, but it musta been the wrong sauce" - Dr. John Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 08:52:16 -0600 From: Bill_Rehm at DeluxeData.com Subject: Motorizing Corona Mills/Converted Keg Fermenters A while back I posted a question about motorizing my Corona Grain Mill, I received many responses and the general consensus was to remove the handle get a bolt that fits in the threaded hole used to secure the handle, cut the head off, thread it into the hole and attach the drill. Thanks to all who responded. I also talked with the brewers at a local Micro, Lakefront Brewery in Milwaukee WI (no affiliation..yada yada) and he had the same idea, he even went so far as to say that when they started out they used a Corona at the brewery. Another idea I've had was to convert a keg to use as a primary fermenter, has anyone out there in the collective done this? How can it be done and what are the results (good and bad). Any input will be greatly appreciated. Thanks. bill rehm Milwaukee, WI Merry X-mas to all, and to all a good brew! Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 97 09:43:57 est From: paa3983 at dpsc.dla.mil (Mike Spinelli) Subject: Heavy Metal brew HBDers, I'll take a stab at what causes beer to taste like metal. We all know that SS needs to passivated, meaning to allow the protective oxide layer to form BEFORE you brew with it. What IF the tanks/tuns where improperly cleaned thus removing the oxide layer and exposing the wort/beer to the raw SS. Wouldn't the brew then take on the metallic taste? Mike Spinelli Mikey's Monster Brew Cherry Hill NJ Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 10:04:32 -0600 From: Graham Barron <gbarron at cq.com> Subject: Re: A-B attacks Raymond Estrella wrote a defense of A-B's most recent tactics in trying to drive out competition in the craft beer industry. He wrote: > I am not a fan of A-B but I would not mind seeing the true birth (brew) >place >of the beers that I buy. > Your buddy Sam Adams, (J.K.) makes his Oregon Originals, that are not >made in Oregon, nor are original. It is called misleading marketing, and it >works. Boy, are we gullible. Right, but I think you're missing the point of the case. A-B is pushing this thing because they won't have to change ANY of their labels. A-B has won a ruling in the past (I guess from the BATF or a judge somewhere) that says its allright for them to put "St. Louis, Missouri" as the source of their beer regardless of where its made. And as we all know, A-B has many breweries all over the country manufacturing their filth. So what does this labeling law cost them? Nothing. However it would require Sam Adams, et alia, to change many of their labels, at much expense. He continues: >A-B's main >stream products don't have many IBUs, and do not sit on the shelves as long >as the green bottled brands that they pick on in the ads. The clear bottled products use a >specially treated hop extract >that >wont skunk. So this justifies their ad campaign that they're really concerned about freshness and "truth"? I don't think so. I doubt their is any difference between a skunked Bud and a fresh Bud (at least to my taste "buds". The local craft brewers and brewpubs are the ones really concerned about quality and freshness. >>You don't hear ads from Pete's, >>Rogue, whatever saying A-B beer isn't any good because they use lots of >>adjuncts. They have too much class to do so, and are too busy pushing >>their own product. > > They would not say that because a lot of the worlds great beers use >adjuncts. Belgian, Scotch and English Ales come to mind. Right, but are those adjuncts designed to cheapen the beer in both quality, flavor, and cost? No, they generally improve the product or make it unique. What does rice or corn add to the beer to make it better, in other than financial terms? Please don't interpret this as a flame or personal attack, but I'm really dismayed that there are craft beer drinkers/home brewers out there that will go to such lengths to defend A-B and their anti-competitive, anti-craft brew tactics. Graham L. Barron Washington, DC, USA Life is too short to drink cheap beer. Beer. If you can't taste it, why bother! Friends don't let friends drink Light Beer. If nothing beats a Bud, given the choice, I'd take the nothing... Return to table of contents
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