HOMEBREW Digest #3297 Wed 12 April 2000

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Solder Saga ("Francois Zinserling")
  Chicken Feed (William Frazier)
  Re: RIMS electrical connections & question (Jeff Lutes)
  RIMS ("James Johnson")
  Sorry Phil Wilcox (Dave Burley)
  Hello Fellow Brewers (GarthFanY2k)
  Yeast question for the Guru (Graham Sanders)
  Clayton Cone question ("Micah Millspaw")
  yeast questions on flavor profile ("Czerpak, Pete")
  high hops UK barleywine and water minerals ("Czerpak, Pete")
  Hey Mabel/Popcorn (Richard Foote)
  Re: Infusion Mashing help - Jeremy Arntz ("Sieben, Richard")
  A Poem ("Drew Avis")
  Everything you know is wrong ("Pannicke, Glen A.")
  Re: Budweiser Engineered Barley (Jeff Renner)
  Re: Hey Mabel... (Jeff Renner)
  infection? (cbuckley)
  Yeast Hydration, Infusion Mashing and England (Dan Listermann)
  RE: Eric Murry - Everything you know is wrong (NYBombersFan)
  Infusion Mashing Help (Lance Levsen)
  Re: soldering connections (Susan/Bill Freeman)
  Hot-Side Aeration ("Michael A Nemier")
  Repost on Lager Yeasts at Ale Temperatures ("Dittmar, Robert D")
  Bob Bratcher Writes ("Phil & Jill Yates")
  RE: Soldering RIMS heater connection (Rod Prather)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 22:25:04 +0200 From: "Francois Zinserling" <francois at designtech.co.za> Subject: Solder Saga Tom and Dee wrote about solder power connections for a RIMS: >in a word don't. Heavy current carrying wires can heat up. If they >heat up to much, the solder may melt and run or fracture and >create a bad joint which will heat even more. If it runs and ends up >on some portion of the metal frame and you touch it - crispy critter. >So..... even if you think crimp or screw connectors are a pain, for >heavy current wire, they are what you should be using. and they got creamed by just about everybody, for trying to be helpful. Now, me, I'm still smarting from the wallopping I received on the "water in the microwave" saga, when I justly had to maneuvre my foot out of my mouth after being bowled over on a technicality. However, I cannot leave all of you to kick Tom while he's down, so here's to his defense : The most widely used solders are those containing about 40 percent tin and 60 percent lead, sometimes 50/50, with or without small per centages of antimony. Some lead alloys, which could easily be mistaken for "the most widely used solders" contain bismuth, tin. cadmium and mostly lead, to form a low melting point eutectic. These are typically used for the manufacture of, wait for it : .... FUSES .. and .. FIRE DETECTION (sprinklers). Designed to melt quickly, and at relatively low temperatures. On the other hand tin/lead solders containing 5 percent antimony (or silver) are preferred for electrical equipment because of their higher electrical conductivity than high-lead alloys. It is therefore technically possible for "solder" to melt !before! the insulation, given certain circumstances. However, Tom, in most cases the solder will crack first, when subjected to excessive physical stresses (ever noticed that the part that's been soldered just refuses to bend ... !%$! at % and you cannot fit it back into that little enclosure ?) It is also possible to cause a "dry" joint if you don't hold steady while the liquid solder solidifies. A stress crack or dry joint normally leaves little area for electricity to flow through, forming a high resistance point, and turns your solder joint into a very effective heater element, quite capable of self-destructing, or more hazardous events. Therefore : If your solder melts like butter : you've got the wrong stuff. If all your wires are melting : you're overloading your circuit, with little or no protection circuitry. If only your solder joint melts : you may have cracked the solder connection, or a combination of the above. If you receive a jolt : you are playing with the lions' balls! Get a qualified person to check it! (the wiring, not the balls) For permanent connections I prefer to solder, rather than a physical connection (screw, clamp or splice). I make sure that I use an electric grade solder, (hardware stockist knows the difference) a hot enough (and big enough) solder iron, and a steady hand. For a good solder connection : Make sure you get a good overlap of wires (don't solder end to end). A twist or a splice with solder (if possible) is even better. When soldering, heat the wires, rather than the solder. Apply a little solder to the iron tip to improve heat conductivity. Try to heat up both wires (on the overlap) simultaneously. Do not heat the solder! Heat the wires! Apply the solder at the joining area between the overlapped wires until the heated wire melts the solder. If the wire seems to soak up the liquid, then you're doing it right. Apply a generous amount until the whole joint seems "saturated" with solder. Remove iron and hold steady for a few seconds. (dry joints are formed, if you shake) Try not to blow it cold either (except if your fingers are burning !) BE SAFE Cheers ZING (ZA) Title : ................ Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 21:45:30 +0000 From: William Frazier <billfrazier at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Chicken Feed First, thank you Jeff Renner for the CAP recipe. I LOVE THESE BEERS as they taste like beer did back in my youth and in my father's time. Excellent! I've modified Jeff's recipe to use all Saaz leaf hops and my wife (she who only drinks Schaeffers Light) even likes it. Joe Kish says "If Lou Heavner's grandmother can take a sip of his "Carlings Red C.A.P.", she will recognize the beer from her youth if he uses regular corn. Go to an Farm animal feed store and buy a bag of 'cracked corn'" Well, today I stopped by the Farmer's Union Coop in Spring Hill, Kansas and bought a 50 pound bag of Farm Land Cracked Corn for $4.85. This works out to 9.7 cents per pound. This will really put a dent in the price of homebrew and I expect great things out of this corn. Why not ~ everything else I buy from the Coop works great! The corn is cracked, just like Joe Kish describes it. Looks like it could use a pass through my Corona Mill. If any of you local guys/gals would like some of my 50 pounds get in touch. At 2 pounds per 6 gallon batch this will last me 25 batches of beer. Makes me thirsty. Regards, Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 17:42:04 -0500 From: Jeff Lutes <jlutes at osprey.net> Subject: Re: RIMS electrical connections & question After reading my own reply to this message, I must apologize to <bigger>Tom and Dee. It was not my intention to be rude...it was a very bad day. I also have a question about soil composition for hops. I live in an area that has quite a bit of clay and was wondering if I should add sand, peat moss, or something else for a decent hops crop. Gemus Brauen Haus</bigger> Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2000 20:29:58 -0700 From: "James Johnson" <JaScJohnson at worldnet.att.net> Subject: RIMS I have a ten gallon polorware brew pot, false bottom, and temp gauge. I also have a magnetic pump. I use a cajun cooker for a heat source. Is it possible to use the above as a RIMS with out a hot water heater element? Has anyone done this with sucess? I mostly wonder about mash in. Do you mash in by stirring with a mash paddle let the mash set (wording?) and then start the recirculating? Or do you run the pump while mashing in? Also, do you recirculate only during temp boosts or do you recirculate the whole time you are mashing? Thanks for any advice. Scott Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 22:46:03 -0400 From: Dave Burley <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: Sorry Phil Wilcox Brewsters: Well, I made my one mistrake for the year already. Calling Phil Yates, Phil Wilcox and blasting him was a looloo. Please excuuuse me Dr. Wilcox! Phil Yates, I do find your <obvious> humourous writing to be just that and have had many smiles at your cleverness as a result. Unfortunately, as I have often said, this medium is not a subtle one and I often find that fine line between humor and insult difficult to see even with my glasses on. Sitting over a beer and making remarks is one thing, putting it in writing which is open to imterpretation is entirely another thing. Facts are that one must try something and do careful experiments or prove that another researcher has before you declare someone else is full of BS for commenting or suggestting something. It is not only impolite it is misleading or to be blunt, lying unless you say "I have an opinion based on absolutely no information and that is...." You will recall that I suggested that others try to understand how important oxidation was to homebrewed beer by actually trying it on their <own> system. I have tasted a lot of homebrew and hot wort oxidation is probably the most prevalent and universal fault. If you have always made your beer by open boiling and pouring hot wort through the air then you would probably not recognize the effect of a minor change in procedure. Which was my point on Pivo's supposed experiment. If his homebrews are heavily oxidised already by other practices then he wouldn't recognise any difference by a minor oxidation. That was my point that his conclusions were not necessarily logical, since it assumed his control was not oxidised. I don't know that. Frankly, I will believe that scientific literature and my own taste buds that says wort oxidation at high temperatures is not a good thing. Check it out on your own system. - -------------------------------------- Regan, Check with the professional wine equipment suppliers in Oz. A hand held refractometer is a standard piece of equipment. - -------------------------------------- Keep on Brewin' Dave Burley Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 23:03:56 EDT From: GarthFanY2k at cs.com Subject: Hello Fellow Brewers This lowly extract brewer has a question. I just brewed my third batch ever. When i say JUST i mean JUST. I brewed a English Brown Ale from a Brewer's Best Kit. My S.G. is too low. It is supposed to be 1.040-1.047 and it started at 1.028 or so. I think i added too much water. First question is, did I ruin this batch forever? Second question is, if not how, do i fix it. I would appreciate any help the experienced HBD subscribers can give me. Thank you. You guys and gals are a WEALTH of info to a beginner like me. Brewin in Virginia, Rick Hyburg Private E-Mails appreciated!!!!! Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 14:35:26 +1000 From: Graham Sanders <GrahamS at bsa.qld.gov.au> Subject: Yeast question for the Guru G'day all Lets set the ball rolling. I use a counterflow cooler and let the cold break go into the fermenter through a simple natural airation tube. Given that this is not the ideal "saturation" of O2 that many say is necessary, I believe that if you under-airate the wort like this, it is actually benefical to have the cold break left in, as it allows more O2 to be diverted to sterol and other essential membrane production, as the yeast can use the cold break in other areas (yes I'm not THAT technically minded). If this is true, would it be benefical for most homebrewers, (who dont airate their beers enough, to leave the cold break in the main wort. Shout Graham Sanders Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 06:39:48 -0500 From: "Micah Millspaw" <MMillspa at silganmfg.com> Subject: Clayton Cone question Mr. Cone, I would like to hear your opinion on oxygenation vs. aeration of wort for the purpose of: 1. yeast propagation (increasing boimass) 2. normal yeast fermentaion (just making beer) By aeration I mean the use of atmospheric gases in the naturally occuring varieties and volumes. Oxygenation being the use of almost pure oxygen. Micah Millspaw Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 08:12:04 -0400 From: "Czerpak, Pete" <Pete.Czerpak at siigroup.com> Subject: yeast questions on flavor profile A few yeast questions that resulted from some competition comments: 1) Is the Wyeast Fullers strain, 1968, thought to throw off deacetyl type compounds? Could use of about 10% flaked maize contribute to this taste? 2) What would low temperature conditions do to the flavor profile of the Wyeast Weihestephen yeast in terms of phenol, clove, banana tastes? Are these sensitive greatly to a 62deg F ferment temperature? Thanks for the help. Its about time to be brewing again. Pete Czerpak Albany, NY Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 08:23:21 -0400 From: "Czerpak, Pete" <Pete.Czerpak at siigroup.com> Subject: high hops UK barleywine and water minerals Good morning again, I'm slowly drinking down the results of my double barley wine batch from early this winter. Not exactly now, but a bit later in the day.... Does anybody know of or have dranken a UK brewed barley wine that is high in hops as opposed to more malty? Does Fullers version taste like this? Anchors Old Foghorn and G. DePiros Ol'Musty are good examples of american brewed barley wines that are more malt and less hops. Do the English ever overdue the hops and imitate more the american style? Final question for the day - if my mash water is fine for mashing, can I just added my minerals (mainly gypsum) at boiling to get my Albany water closer to UK water to bring out the crispness in my bitters and IPAs? Or will the mash really benefit as well? Thanks. pete czerpak Albany, NY Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:13:23 -0400 From: Richard Foote <rfoote at mindspring.com> Subject: Hey Mabel/Popcorn Joe Kish <JJKISH at worldnet.att.net> advises: >Go to an Farm animal feed store and buy a bag of 'cracked >corn', also called Albers' Chicken Scratch. It's not as fine as >corn meal so it won't give a stuck mash. One concern about using a product produced for livestock would be the possibility it might have some additives you don't want in your beer. Being from the self- proclaimed "poultry capital of the world" in Gainesville, Georgia and working in a building that in a former life was used for blending pharmaceuticals into chicken feed, I'd caution that one should check the ingredient content first to be sure. Jeff Renner writes: >The problem with cracked corn is that it has the corn germ with all the corn oil. >It can easily go rancid. The old brewing texts are quite explicit about this, >but George DePiro and Jack Schmidling have both reported success with >freshly ground whole corn. If I were to use cracked corn I think I'd grind >it myself so it was fresh. Don't use anything that smells like old oil >paint. The point Jeff makes about oil content is well taken. I remember a tour of Jack Daniels Distillery I took a few years back (highly recommended BTW). You could walk on an elevated walkway within an arms length of open top fermenters full of corn mash. As I recall, the tour leader encouraged us to dip a finger in and taste it if we wanted. Spying a likely looking pool of liquid, I did just that. Not what I expected--pure corn oil! I have brewed sucessfully with popcorn--sort of a cream ale. It was popped w/o oil, of course, using a skillet shaken on the stove top so as to prevent burning. It was a pain. An air popper would have been the equipment of choice, but I did not have one. It was entered in this "wierd beer" competition and got a third place overall. The popped popcorn was simply added to the grist just prior to mash-in. Everything seemed to convert quite well, yielding a clear beer w/o any noticeable starch haze. The beer had a slight, toasted popcorny aroma when young that faded as it aged. Hope this helps, Rick Foote Whistle Pig Brewing and Home Remodeling Murrayville, GA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 08:45:31 -0500 From: "Sieben, Richard" <SIER1 at Aerial1.com> Subject: Re: Infusion Mashing help - Jeremy Arntz Jeremy lists equipment and his intended procedure to make 2.5 to 3 gallon batches. Sure, you can do this, but it really doesn't take any more time to do a 5 gallon batch. I would skip the purchase of a 5 gallon stainless pot and spend the same money for a 33qt enamle pot so you can do full wort boils on 5 gallons. Also, for the same price you can get a 10 gallon square picnic cooler as the price you specified for a 5 gallon one. I prefered this type of cooler because I could make a pipe manifold for lautering out of pvc plastic pipe. As an added bonus, you can mash in the same cooler, and since you already have the smaller aluminum pot, you could use that for heating decoctions, should you decide to try your hand at that type of mashing. (I did that on my first all grain batch becuase I found I couldn't really do step mashing in the cooler as it took too much water to raise temps!) I would skip the mesh bag idea because, 1)it is just another thing to clean 2) it will decrease your mash efficiency, thus causing you to need more grain 3) your grain bed in the mash/lauter tun -cooler- will act as a filter anyway. The cost of the pvc manifold (which I just pieced together, not glueing any parts so it can be disassembled and cleaned after each use) is about the same as the mesh bag. So for no additional cost beyond what you stated, you are now set up for single, step infusion or decoction mashing! As to procedure, your mash in temp looks ok, you may need to infuse additional amounts of boiling water to maintain the 150 degree temp, so have some on hand. When you mash out, start by running off some of the wort into a small pot and recirculate it through the mash bed until it runs clear. Try not to splash too much if you are planning on keeping this beer for an extended period of time (1 year) to avoid the much dreaded HSA. (but if you drink it faster than that, splash with impunity if you so wish). {another log on the HSA fire, hehehehe} You add your sparge water as needed, needed defined as 'don't let the top of the grain bed appear above the level of liquid in your mash'. This is to prevent 'setting' the mash and liquid will not continue to run through it, but rather cracks will appear in the surface of the bed and will let any additional sparge water run around it,leaving your sugars trapped in the grain. I would have 5 gallons of sparge water on hand, you may not need it all but you can tell by hydrometer reading when you should stop. (at sparge temps the hydrometer should read 1.000, at least it worked well for me). Grains: all malt is by definition 'modified', but maybe what you are asking is which ones have enzymes still availble for the mashing process. Basically any light malt still has them as they have not been heated to the point of denatureing the enzymes, 2-row, 6-row, pale malt etc. Any specialty malts such as carmel, black patent, chocolate malt do not have little or no enzymes left to work with so that they will not convert themselves, which is why you need to use mostly base malt in your recipe. To answer your question about whether or not the specialty grains are included in calculating your recipe, yes they are, but the extract yields are different. Finally, get a brewing program like Suds or Promash if you have a computer (how else did the e-mail get to the HBD?) and it will have the info you need for calculating your recipes. Also there are books availble that have this info as well. I can recommend many, if you want to drop me a private e-mail. Have fun, and hope this helped you out. Rich Sieben Island Lake, IL Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 06:47:16 PDT From: "Drew Avis" <andrew_avis at hotmail.com> Subject: A Poem When I last visited the Royal Ontario Museum, I jotted this verse down as it struck me not only as possibly one of the earliest examples of beer marketing, but also a beautiful description of what it's like to sip a particularly good homebrew on a hot day. This is from a 13th or 14th Century Yuan Dynasty lable (beer / wine / fermented beverage, it was unclear): "Branches coated with a thin, thin ice of spring, a pure fragrance imparted by the Goddess of the Moon. It is suddenly, after the long fading of a hot summer, like the white dance of an old snow-ladden pine." (It was amazing to see an example of a rice wine bottle from 1988 with the same form as the 13th century bottle - a form that had lasted 7 centuries or more - I wonder if swing tops will last that long?) Cheers! Drew AKA Dr. Pivo III - -- Drew Avis, Merrickville, Ontario Visit Strange Brew with Drew: http://fast.to/strangebrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:41:14 -0400 From: "Pannicke, Glen A." <glen_pannicke at merck.com> Subject: Everything you know is wrong On Mon, 10 Apr 2000 Eric Murray commented on the following: >I have not been around the HBD that long, and I do find very helpful and >insightful information from many of you, including Dr. Pivo. I am grateful >however that I have been brewing a few years prior to finding the HBD. If I >would have found it when I started, frankly I would have been scared out of >brewing. Many of us make it sound so much more complicated in a search for >that perfect brew than it needs to be. Eric, Bravo! Bravo! Great point. I think that many of those who post here have been brewing for a number of years and may be looking for that "little extra" which makes their beer seem (at least to them) so much better than the next guy's. I'm enthusiastic about brewing (and I'm sure I'm not alone) so I'll discuss a point until there is no more left to talk about. I'll read up on it and use what the new guy would consider "techno-babble" in my discussions. I've also been know to beleaguer a minute point. It's all either confusing, intimidating or boring to the new guy. I'll probably be flamed by the homebrew snobs for saying it, but thank God for Charlie Papazian! Charlie gave a talk this past Saturday at our club in Princeton, NJ. The subject was "The Future of Homebrewing" but I wanted to know about the past. I asked Charlie: "Many of us were introduced to homebrewing with the help of your books, but what did *YOU* have as a guide when you first started homebrewing." In short, Charlie seemed to chalk it up to first hand experience and experimentation after learning the basics from an old "moonshiner". Charlie may write much better than he speaks, but I'm glad I started with his books. I think if I had to start here, I run screaming into the mouth of madness ;-) And while he still uses that annoying "Relax. Don't worry. Have a homebrew." line, there is no advice which I can find to be of more value. Glen Pannicke Merck & Co. Computer Validation Quality Assurance email: glen_pannicke at merck.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:27:37 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu> Subject: Re: Budweiser Engineered Barley Joel Plutchak <plutchak at ncsa.uiuc.edu> wrote: >Anyway, after the MCAB tour of the research pilot >plant in St. Louis, I took the public tour. I made a point >of comparing Bud to Michelob, since my notes indicated they >both have about 30% rice but differ in the barley portion of >the grist: 2/3 6-row and 1/3 2-row for Bud, with 80% 2-row and >20% 6-row for Michelob. I didn't take notes, but my recollection is that Steve Michalak said that Bud was 1/3 rice and the balance was 2/3 6-row and 1/3 2-row. I didn't hear what the 2-row:6-row balance was with Michelob, but I remember his saying it had only 20% rice. There was an awful lot of information that weekend that pertained to my interest in CAPs, but I couldn't process it all. Fortunately, Jethro is sending me the tape from Steve's and George Fix's talk that I missed due to judging. Maybe it will be covered there. I was able to have lunch with Steve after the talk and pick his brain about CAPish things. He was very open and said that A/B has very few trade secrets. He said that no one else can afford to do what A/B does. He really in single minded about A/B being the best. Says that Augie Busch won't hear of problems with cost if it pertains to the qualilty of the beer. I did find out a secret - Augie occasionally is found in a St. Louis brewpub (sorry, I didn't recognize the name), whose beers he admires. Don't know if he wears a fake mustache, nose and glasses like Charlie P occasionally dons. Jeff -=-=-=-=- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:49:35 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu> Subject: Re: Hey Mabel... I realize that I forgot to make a yeast suggestion Lou Heavner requested. I have had good luck with the New Ulm (American Lager?) variety even though it says it is not a pilsner strain, several German strains (Bavarian. I think Wyeast calls one, but not Munich), and my favorite, YCKC Ayinger (not in catalog but available). I also had good luck with the Danish strain, which emphasizes hops over malt. It's been years since I used it, but I've been wanting to try to make a crisper, drier CAP sometime and think this would be a good choice for that. My current ones are richer, which I generally like, maybe more Bohemian/US than German/US, but change can be interesting. I think that the A/B strain (Wyeast Pilsner, I think, also labeled St. Louis) might be a little lacking in character, but that's not based on personal brewing experience, just prejudice. The one CAP I had made with it was very heavy with diacetyl (I guess that's character!), but that could be avoided with a rest. Jeff -=-=-=-=- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:49:17 -0400 From: cbuckley at newsoft.com Subject: infection? Hello fellow lovers of good beer......... I hope this is not bad news.... I have two batches of beer in my basement, both were bottled on the same day. One is a lager and one is a regular light brown ale. I bottled them about a month ago. Every week I go grab one (or two) of each to try. I want to learn how beer conditions in bottles so I like to sample them frequently to check for improvement. Two days ago I noticed that both batches are developing a ring on the neck (insert - expletive). Clearly we all know that could be an infection. I have made seven batches of beer. this is my first sign of trouble. To my question(s)- If a bottle has a ring on the neck does that mean there necessarily is an infection? Could the ring be caused by something else from the original wort? Could it be wild yeast or is it bacteria? Assuming it is an infection, is it likely to get worse in these bottles? What's the best course of action? Should I just dump them? I have two batches fermenting currently and I am concerned that they too might get the dreaded neck ring after I bottle them. How worried should I be? Clearly I need to do a lot of cleaning and sanitizing. thanks folks - - - - The careless cleaner ? - - Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 10:04:46 -0400 From: Dan Listermann <72723.1707 at compuserve.com> Subject: Yeast Hydration, Infusion Mashing and England My question to Dr. Cone regards yeast rehydration. All the packages of yeast contain instructions for rehydration yet they all ferment just fine without it. I have to believe that such a procedure may be theoretically beneficial, however it would seem to be margionally usefull at least on a homebrew scale. I own a home brew shop and a very common phone call is the " My beer is not fermenting." problem. I go through the list of potential causes ( plastic bucket lid leaks, too cold, ect.) About twice a week the caller will indicate that he rehydreated the yeast. This is a strong signal that the yeast has been damaged and will need to be replaced. I have come to the conclusion that, since rehydration is not necessary to ferment beer properly and there is a strong chance that the yeast will be damaged in a botched rehydration, it is not desirable to recommend such a proceedure. Just how important is rehydration and is it worth the risk? Jeremy Arntz (arntz at surfree.com) asks about infusion mashing. Check out "Wanna Mash?" at listermann.com and relax and have a homebrew. Dr. Pivo (dp at pivo.w.se ) asks about things to do in England. Try to take in the Orange Brewery Brewpub at the corner of St. Barnabus and Pimlico. My wife limited me to only one while we were there. :( Dan Listermann dan at listermann.com 72723.1707 at compuserve.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 10:38:59 EDT From: NYBombersFan at aol.com Subject: RE: Eric Murry - Everything you know is wrong Regarding Eric Murray and his comments on Everything You Know is Wrong You took the words right out of my mouth! Way to go! As a relatively new brewer, I was beginning to feel (after reading HBD) that I was using illiterate brewing practices. The great equalizer, however, is without a doubt, THE TASTE TEST. If your beer tastes great and is appreciated by legions of your friends and family then who gives a crap about 3/4 of the dissertations on HBD? Recently, I have found HBD to lack, shall we say, fizz? It seems the board is dominated by a few pontiffs each trying to out wit the other regarding brewing practices and techniques. While I view their information as extremely valuable and thought-provoking, very little of their ramblings actually help me brew better beer. As a working man with a tie, a wife and a 12 year old, do I really need to know about how many yeast cells it takes to make my wort turn into beer? Hardly and certainly not on this "amateur" forum. Reading this digest lately has reminded me of the words of French poet and critic Paul Valery: "Science means simply the aggregate of all the recipes that are always successful. The rest is literature." Great literature this Homebrew Digest. Let us not forget, however, that beer is an ancient drink most likely discovered by accident. It has been enjoyed for centuries by royalty as well as plebeians. It is a simple drink, concocted not by man, but by yeast. To overly complicate the process is folly. Can you imagine if Michelangelo had to worry about the density and porosity of the bristles on his brush or the chemical composition of his canvas? The world may have been spared his great masterpieces. Each brewer is his own artist. Your "fabulous" beer may get flushed (gasp!) down the sink at my house and/or vice-versa. Who is really to say? Taste is a fickle and subjective thing. Brewing beer is as simple as using the freshest ingredients and following basic brewing and sanitation techniques. Is there REALLY anything else? Sure there are a myriad variables and unknowns, but like Eric stated in his post, I too, quite frankly, find it hard to brew lousy beer. I hope that a few of you can come back down and join the rest of us unsophisticated brewers once in a while. But until then, SHOW ME THE BEER! ALEX Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:20:36 -0600 From: Lance Levsen <l.levsen at printwest.com> Subject: Infusion Mashing Help "Jeremy J. Arntz" <arntz at surfree.com> asked about starting to mash. You can do any size of mash that you want. 19 l (5 US gal) is a nice size. If I'm doing smaller batches it's usually for testing purposes. Mesh Bag. You can use it, but when I first started it turned into a total disaster. Make sure the bag is _plenty_ big enough so that the weight of the grains doesn't pull the bag into an inverted cone. It's much easier to use a slotted manifold. Quite simple to build too. For you sparge, you'll get better results if you could raise the grain temp up to 170 before the sparge. I can't do that so I use boiling water to fill the vessel, then let it sit for a while, then sparge. Collect the runoff and boil as per normal for a full hour, you need the extra time compared to extract because there is a lot more protein in the runoff from a mash. The boil coagulates the protein and with a little wait after the boil (or using irish moss) will settle the proteins to the bottom of the boil pot. I don't know about any grain conversion charts on the 'net, but I use the Zymurgy Great Grain Issue, Special Issue '95. It works well enough for me. Yes the total grist includes the specialty grains. Good Brewing. - -- Lance Levsen, Programmer Product Innovation,Web Development PWGroup - S'toon. 477-3166 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:16:46 -0500 From: Susan/Bill Freeman <potsus at bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: soldering connections The day that my local power company, the makers of my breaker panels, the manufacturers of the 7 kilns I use, the water heater manufacturers and the manufacturers of the solid state relays I use begin to solder or presolder the connections they make, then will I follow suit. Without exception these entities and devices all use screw connections. In spite of the fact that there should never be enough heat to actually melt one of these connections, the addition of solder to the end of a stranded wire prior to either clamping or crimping is a no no. There IS enough heat generated to expand the connection and when it cools the contact is less than tight, resulting in additional heat being generated in that connection. This is the reason that the aluminum wire used in house wiring during the 60s is now suspect where house fires are concerned. This is also why there is a special connection grease is applied to the connections of drop coming into your house power panel from the pole outside. Solder is for radios and copper pipe - not for electrical connections where the load can generate heat. Bill Freeman aka Elder Rat KP Brewery - home of "the perfesser" Birmingham, AL Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:47:59 -0400 From: "Michael A Nemier" <Michael.Nemier at ipaper.com> Subject: Hot-Side Aeration Gang: I'd like to throw a big old can of fuel on the (already raging) HSA fire. I'll spare you the suspense and tell you that I believe this phenomenon to be both real and harmful, and that I have experimented (perhaps a stretch of the term) to a great degree on this very topic. When I first went to all-grain brewing back in 1994, I designed and built a custom stainless-steel lauter tun that, with my then-simplistic understanding of brewing techniques/chemistry, represented the pinnacle of modern wort production technology. On the plus side, it had the most beautiful, geometrically perfect, tightly-packed system of (dual-sized for tighter packing) hand-drilled holes in the "false bottom". Still impressive to look at and fully suitable for framing. As far as negatives, this evil piece of chromium-fortified crap featured a six-inch free-fall of the finely dispersed wort (through all of those little holes) into the bulk of the wort, with all of the obvious bed-compaction and aeration drawbacks of such an arrangement. Naturally, I wasn't successfully lautering anything with a grain bed thicker than a couple of inches. Instead of recirculating the wort through the bed (a tough proposition, as the bed usually took on the texture of concrete), I ran it through successively finer strainers (again, spraying wort in free air) between vessels until it was finished-beer-clear after trickling through the last, very fine (maybe 100 mesh) stainless screen. This entire process slowly produced brilliantly clear wort, at good yields (typically 32 SG point/lb/gal), which was aerated/oxidized within (actually, "beyond") an inch of its life. By way of background, the grist was Corona milled (another bad one), and step-infusion mashed at 122/150/156/165 degrees F with lots of stirring (yet another bad one). I would describe the rest of the brewing process at that time (other than wort production) to be up-to-par, as I was sanitizing well, using liquid cultures with starters, and, by and large, using most of the other techniques that I know to be "right" today. Needless to say, the beer produced with this setup was poor-tasting due to very obtrusive levels of oxidation. The malty flavors were very "dull" and "papery", even for styles that should have heavy malt-derived flavors (Scotch ales, barley wines, brews with high proportions of crystal and/or Munich). The "dark grain" flavors were particularly "flat", with none of the pleasant coffee-like roastiness of chocolate malt or roasted barley making it through to the finished beer. The beer was "dead" and "lifeless", to use some more useless, non-descriptive terms. I had tasted a lot of stale, oxidized commercial beers up to that point, and knew from the get-go that oxidation was what was kicking my ass. It didn't take a genius to identify the lautering equipment as the bad actor, particularly after reading some articles by Fix implicating HSA in a host of beer "crimes". I quickly built a Zapap (with the same sort of geometrically perfect drilling) and got unhealthily paranoid about HSA (from every possible silly source). The quality of beer produced (from, at the time, the same milling/mashing/everything regimen) was immediately and immensely improved, every time, to what I would consider competition-contender quality. The obvious change, to any taster, was the elimination of the potent, unpleasant, oxidized character. Admittedly, this was an unwitting experiment that tested, essentially, the extremes (at least on the "bad" end) of the HSA spectrum. There is a clearly discernible difference in the quality of beer produced by these two methods, with all other variables held constant. I can't comment on the incremental effect of "just a little more than my current level" of HSA, but I'm right now clinging to the "if a lot is a lot bad, than a little is a little bad". I've tangled with the HSA demon, and it whupped my ass. I don't want anything to do with it again. I suppose that the reason why there haven't been a lot of good experiments done on this one is that it takes great nerve to perform such peculiar and ultimately fatal torture on otherwise lovingly-crafted wort. Understand that I didn't post this epistle to highlight the stupidity that is my brewing past (and there's plenty more where this came from). I simply wanted to weigh in on a current "hot topic" for which I have some useful insight, and to perhaps steer folks in what I consider to be the correct direction. Mike Nemier - Extreme Suburban Cincinnati Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:18:36 -0500 From: "Dittmar, Robert D" <Robert.D.Dittmar at stls.frb.org> Subject: Repost on Lager Yeasts at Ale Temperatures I thought I'd repost a question that I had for the collective last week both because my post may have been misunderstood, and because a recent post by Paul Shick dealt with a similar question. I have tried all the ale yeasts that my homebrew supply shop routinely has in stock. They are happy to order any others I would like to try, but instead of going to all that trouble, I was wondering if I could try out some of the lager yeasts that they have in stock. As I previously mentioned, I can only ferment at ale temperatures (around 60-65 deg. F) so I'd have to pick one carefully. I wanted to thank Rick and Charley for telling me about good results with 2112 (California lager). I had thought originally that that would be my best bet, and I will probably be giving it a try. I'd also like to thank J, who recommended trying the Koelsch strain, and Lee for recommending 1056 as a clean yeast. However, I think I may have been misunderstood. I am not looking to make beers with a clean lager-like profile. I'm not really interested in making a California Common beer at this time either. I know that any lager yeast used at high temperatures will produce many ale-like esters, phenolics, and possibly a lot of diacetyl. I was wondering if any of the Wyeast lager yeasts would none-the-less produce a good ale, i.e. American pale ale, British bitter, porter, etc., when used at higher temperatures, or if, in general, the beer would be so estery, phenolic, and/or buttery as to be undrinkable. Sorry about the repost, but I saw Paul Shick's post about using 2206 as a "steam" yeast, and I was hoping that any information sent to him about this would be posted to the HBD or sent my way. Any experiences with any of the lager yeasts other than 2112 at higher temperatures would also be appreciated. Again, a clean lager-like flavor at the higher temperatures is not what I'm looking for, but I would want the beer to be drinkable before I took the chance. Thanks again, Rob Dittmar St. Louis, MO Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 06:46:29 +1000 From: "Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au> Subject: Bob Bratcher Writes >I have a >feeling that if more of us actually knew each other in the flesh >(no >comments from the Baron or Fouch please) there would be allot >less bickering >and name calling. Now I know I have been asked not to comment here, but I think what Bob has to say is true. Well I know Bob you are not implying that you would like to see Fouch in the flesh, nobody wants to see that!! Just in his tutu is quite far enough. But I often think how fascinating it would be to actually meet some of the characters of the HBD. I guess it is particularly intriguing for the likes of me, living so far from the American scene, of which most of you are a part. On the other hand, it would be a shame to give away all the name calling and actually have to be nice to each other. I think this would spell the end of the HBD, certainly as we know it. One person I would be particularly curious to meet is Steve Alexander. I can't imagine how a person can consume literature at the rate that Steve apparently does and still find time to brew beer, make wine and vinegar, and churn out the occasional piece of Japanese poetry, as the Secret Squirrel once observed. By contrast I make beer, drink beer (probably too much), fight ferociously with Jill and hallucinate over naked deceased film stars knocking on my bedroom window late at night. Probably most everyone else fits somewhere in between. Except of course Doc Pivo, he's way out on another limb again. And don't he and Steve just love each other!! Yes it would certainly make an interesting party if we all did actually get together. Well I'll rack up the balls and gas up the rice lager, the Billiard room is just waiting for a ding dong party. But let me know approximate numbers so I can round up the appropriate number of scantily dresses women, looks like it's going to be a wild one! Cheers Phil PS Dave Burley can come along too, providing he gets my name right. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:47:57 -0400 From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net> Subject: RE: Soldering RIMS heater connection Ron Laborda pointed out that a solder coated wire which is crimped or placed in a screw terminal will overheat and melt the solder. This can result in circuit damage, equipment damage or even fires. You should never solder the wire prior to putting a crimp on. When you crimp a connector it flattens the stranded wire and allows for a large surface area to contact the crimp. If you solder the wire first you end up with a small contact area with high current going through a poor conduction interface i.e. copper, solder, solder, copper. In any condition the connections must be clean and tight. I still recommend mechanical copper to copper connections for the best long reliability. Since many RIMS systems are used and stored in garages or out of doors, you should also consider coating the wires with silicon grease to stop any corrosion of the copper wires. If you feel you must use crimped lugs make sure you have terminal strips and lugs with a rating large enough for the current. - -- Rod Prather Indianapolis, Indiana Return to table of contents
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