HOMEBREW Digest #3466 Tue 31 October 2000

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  Stuck Stout (Petr Otahal)
  Malto-dextrin and amylase enzyme (Jacob Jacobsen)
  Aireation with Venturi tube ("Jens P. Maudal")
  Fermenting in Plastic (Ant Hayes)
  Bob's Missed Expectations ("Houseman, David L")
  re: no kraeusen ("Kensler, Paul")
  Re: Frozen Lager? (Jeff Renner)
  Keg cutting ("Pannicke, Glen A.")
  Re: Frozen Lagers (John Palmer)
  Ahhh, Ambrosia! (Smith Asylum)
  Re: Cleaning CF Chillers ("Martin Brungard")
  Re: Cleaning CF Chillers (Demonick)
  Where to get PBW (Danny Breidenbach)
  chiller (Matt Marino)
  SG to Alcohol (Jeff Lutes)
  Stupid Keg Tricks... ( Dmitry Vosky )
  New club in Adelaide ("Dave Edwards")
  Gleanings from the field on ready to pitch yeasts ("Dan Diana")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:11:29 +1100 From: Petr Otahal <potahal at utas.edu.au> Subject: Stuck Stout Got a bit of problem. I brewed the following extract recipe about 12 days ago. 2kg light DME 200g wheat DME 300g Roasted Barley 300g Dextrose 4 tsp CaCO3 (is this too much) 40g (8.9%AAU) NZ Hallertauer Aroms whole hops (60min boil) OG: 1.047 Vol: 20L I steeped the cracked roasted barley in 10L of water in a grain bag for half an hour, then took it out and added my extracts, dextrose and CaCO3. I have very soft water with low alkalinity so I didn't think 4 tsp was too much. Once boiliing added my hops and boiled for an hour. Cooled in laundry tub with fairly frequent water changes. Got it down to 25C in about 20 minutes. Added this to another 10L of cold water and mixed thoroughly and whipped a bit of air into it with my brew spoon. I then poured the whole lot onto the yeast cake of Wyeast British 1098, which had just finished fermenting an 1.041 OG batch of Pale Ale, and proceded to bottle the Pale Ale. As can be expected it took off like a rocket and was fermenting strongly within a couple of hours. The gravity was 1.020 two days later. Four days after pitching I took another reading expecting it to be finished and it was at 1.018. The temperature was 16C which was bad because it meant that something was wrong with my heater. I took it inside to warm up. I slowly warmed it to 20C in the bath tub thinking it was too cold. 8 days after pitching and the gravity hadn't moved so I rehydrated some Danstar Notingham yeast and pitched it. I took a reading today (12 days after pitching) and it is only at 1.017. The beer is not as dark as I expected, if fact it looks like liquid chocolate. It doesn't have that roasted taste I expected, and in fact is fairly sweetish, but it doesn't have any off flavours. I doesn't look like the yeast has settled out very much either. Does anyone have any ideas as to what happened to my stout??? Cheers Pete By the way the Pale Ale tastes alright Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 21:23:21 -0800 (PST) From: Jacob Jacobsen <beermakerdk at yahoo.com> Subject: Malto-dextrin and amylase enzyme Can anyone help me with guidelines on the use of malto-dextrin (for mouthfeel) and amylase enzyme (for fermentability)? I understand in layman's terms how these work but am unable to determine the quantity one adds to a recipe. Thanks, Jake __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:49:21 +0100 From: "Jens P. Maudal" <Jens.maudal at c2i.net> Subject: Aireation with Venturi tube I was wondering if anybody have contsructed a "Venturi tube" for adding air to the vort. I don't know an awful lot about it but what i do know is that in simple words it is a small piece of tube that is used for inline aireation and fitted to the beerline between the chiller and the fermenter. It is constructed in such a way that it reduces the diameter of the beerline so as to cause an increased vort speed, here the air is pumped in (or by vacum) to the vort sream with a following sudden increase of line diameter. This is supposed to cause a violent turbulance and consequently mix the air/vort. Is this system of any use and will it perform almost as well as an air stone, have anybody tried it? SKAAL! Jens Jens P. Maudal jens.maudal at c2i.net Greetings from "BottomsUp Brewery" ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Visit my humble RIMS and homebrew page: http://home.c2i.net/bottomsup/index.htm Norbrygg bryggeside: http://www.norbrygg.com ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 12:38:39 +0200 From: Ant Hayes <Ant.Hayes at FifthQuadrant.co.za> Subject: Fermenting in Plastic Clifton Moore stated, "I have never understood how people can get away with fermenting in plastic. Under magnification the surface looks like a pile of hay." Having fermented in plastic since mid 1988, my answer is "bleach is cheap". Between batches, my fermenter sits full to the brim with a strong bleach solution. Ant Hayes Gauteng; South Africa Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:59:56 -0500 From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com> Subject: Bob's Missed Expectations It's too bad that Bob the beer man spent 10 days in Scotland and really only enjoyed the Irish and English beers. Perhaps it was luck in not finding the beers of his expectations. Rather it was probably the expectations themselves, for as Bob states "lighter character, and mouth feel than I supposed they would have. The gravity was lighter, and by and large there was little hop character at all. The bitters I tasted were bitter only in comparison to the other ales. In other words not that dry or bitter. There was no significant hop nose." That pretty much sums up Scottish Ales and would be what I'd expect. The challenge is can he take what he learned about the Scottish Ale styles and replicate them authentically here? Dave Houseman Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 09:14:34 -0500 From: "Kensler, Paul" <Paul.Kensler at Cyberstar.com> Subject: re: no kraeusen "There is no kraeusen on the surface of the fermenting wort. <snip> - everything looks entirely normal yet there is only a thin layer 1/4-1/2" of large bubbled foam on the surface. Has anyone else seen this?" I experienced this once, on a Bavarian wheat beer. I attributed the problem to the fact that I screwed up the mash, and it spent WAY too much time <150F. The beer turned out very thin and very attenuated - it never could hold any sort of a head, even thought it was >50% wheat and highly carbonated. Think alcoholic wheat pop. I'm sure the extended time at lower temperatures over-did proteinase and amylase reactions, leaving nothing to support a kraeusen or head in the glass. I'd be curious to hear how your oatmeal stout turns out, and how the mash went. Hope this helps, Paul Kensler Gaithersburg, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 10:04:31 -0500 From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu> Subject: Re: Frozen Lager? Jim <Hop_Head at webtv.net> is worried Subject: Frozen Lager? >I just checked my lager and would you believe it? It was partially >frozen! Will this hurt it? Do I need to do anything to fix it (Besides >raise the temp.)? It won't hurt a thing. As a matter of fact, it might even help it. See the archives for George Fix's postings several years ago on ice beer. Jeff - -- -=-=-=-=- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 10:04:47 -0500 From: "Pannicke, Glen A." <glen_pannicke at merck.com> Subject: Keg cutting Rich wrote: >With Sabco http//:www.kegs.com selling Kegs with perfect tops and drains >professionally welded, >cleaned and polished for only $121 US. I see no reason to search down clean >kegs, buy, rent, beg, >or steal the tools to hack at the stainless steel and try to drill and weld a >drain coupling. >I do not know about the rest of you, but even with finding cheap kegs and >tools, the time factor makes >the few extra bucks worth the professional job. Don't get me wrong - Sabco makes some nice stuff. But money doesn't grow on trees. I'm just starting on a HERMS project. As I'll be sinking enough money into this project overall, I'd like to save a few $$$ along the way. ~$120/keg is not bad considering what you'll invest (time & money-wise) after buying a keg, destroying a few grinding disks or metal blades, hiring a welder or welding it yourself. But if you need three of them (for a HERMS or RIMS), it's at least $360. I can probably scrounge my 3 kegs and have 'em prepared by a welder for the cost of 1 SABCO keg. I also think it's a matter of pride. I can get a while RIMS or HERMS system with all the bells & whistles delivered to my home for something like $1500 - but I can't say that I made it. Hours on end of sweatin', cussin', spittin' and yes, sometimes bleedin' will give you that feeling of personal satifaction that can't be had any other way. So I'd say that it's really what the brewer wants out of their hobby. Some can't see why you'd want to do it yourself. Others can see why you'd give up on the opportunity. I'm of the latter opinion. Carpe cerevisiae! Glen Pannicke http://www.pannicke.net "He was a wise man who invented beer" - Plato Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:22:28 -0800 From: John Palmer <jjpalmer at gte.net> Subject: Re: Frozen Lagers Jim mentions that his lager has partially frozen and wonders if it creates any problems. Yes, and no. The yeast don't like being partially frozen. So, if you plan to prime and bottle you will probably have to use some fresh yeast as well. If you are going to force carbonate then it is not a problem. How far into the lagering cycle were you? Do you think you have achieved the majority of your attentuation? If not, you may need to warm it up to normal lagering temp and add your fresh yeast now. Keep in mind that you will need to attemperate them to that temperature first or they will just go dormant and not do anything. Hope this helps, John - -- John Palmer Palmer House Brewery and Smithy http://www.realbeer.com/jjpalmer How To Brew - the online book http://www.howtobrew.com Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 10:04:09 -0700 From: Smith Asylum <smithly at neta.com> Subject: Ahhh, Ambrosia! Well, I put a couple of the Belgium Wits on ice last night and I was truly amazed at the results of my efforts a month ago. It's a little too fizzy if opened cold and doesn't come to full flavor until temp reaches about 50 deg, but oh, great head retention, mellow and lightly spiced with the body approaching an all-grain. Jeff Haines of Brewers Connection was right. "The best brew you'll ever taste is the one you brew yourself." Or something like that. Threw together a Hefe-Weizen last night and used my newly fabricated counter-flow wort chiller. Worked like a champ! 212 to 80 in 3/5 of a seconds (you'd have to be an old Jefferson Airplane fan to recognize that). I do have to work on the co-ordination of flow from brew pot to chiller to carboy. Siphoning is a big hassle for me. I think I'll try and arrange a gravity feed setup to expedite the transfer and chill process. Many thanks and much credit to Andrew Roberts of, http://www.trends.net/~aroberts/brewery/chiller.html for his clear and humorous instructions on the fab of the chiller. I can't wait to do it again! Lee Smith Amateur Brewing Chandler, AZ Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 13:27:46 EST From: "Martin Brungard" <mabrungard at hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Cleaning CF Chillers Domenick had a good comment regarding sanitizing with bleach, Although I think that some of his comments may be troublesome to some brewers. He keeps a bleach solution in some of his equipment for long periods of time. In some parts of the world, water hardness may make that habit more of a problem than a solution. Here's the reason why. A bleach solution raises the pH of the water. Minerals in the water are then more likely to precipitate out of the solution and deposit themselves as crystal growths on surfaces in the equipment. We don't need anymore hiding places for critters. I have found that rinsing out the equipment with water does not remove the crystals. A mild acid solution like distilled vinegar can be used to dissolve the crystals in that case. If you're lucky, your water supply will allow you to get away with storing your equipment full of bleach solution. If not, you'll get those pesky crystal growths. I prefer to limit my bleach solution contact time to a day or so to reduce this tendency with the moderately hard (140ppm as CaCO3)water I have in Tallahassee. On this same equipment cleaning subject, I echo others who use PBW to clean their equipment. I have one caution, I use PBW in my RIMS and recirculate while heating the solution. One time, I let the system run for a while and let the solution temp get up to 160F. There was a definite darkening of the solution that wasn't present when the solution was around 140F. I can only assume that getting the solution this hot is not a good idea. I don't exceed 140F anymore. Does anyone have a comment on what might have happened to darken the solution. By the way, my RIMS piping is all copper. Yes, my piping was very clean after that overheating event. Does PBW become more aggressive at high temp? Martin Brungard Tallahassee, FL "Meandering to a different drummer" _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:19:48 -0800 From: Demonick <demonick at zgi.com> Subject: Re: Cleaning CF Chillers On Mon, 30 Oct 2000, Martin Brungard wrote: >Domenick had a good comment regarding sanitizing with bleach, Although I >think that some of his comments may be troublesome to some brewers. He keeps >a bleach solution in some of his equipment for long periods of time. > >In some parts of the world, water hardness may make that habit more of a >problem than a solution. Here's the reason why. > ...<snip - lots of good information> Indeed, Seattle city water is nearly distilled. If you live in hard water country take Martin's advice to heart. Alkalinity (as CaCO3) 13.0 mg/L Calcium (as CaCO3) 10.4 Hardness (as CaCO3) 11.7 Magnesium 0.34 Sodium 5.47 Chloride 3.7 Domenick Venezia Seattle, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:34:53 -0500 From: Danny Breidenbach <dbreiden at math.purdue.edu> Subject: Where to get PBW Hi all, I'm thinking I want to clean my chiller (a pseudo-counterflow model) with PBW, since someone recently reported getting all kinds of slime out of a chiller using it. Maybe that's the problem with my recent brews. Where does one get PBW? I'm supply shop challenged, and Northern Brewer doesn't show it in their catalog. Unless PBW goes by another name, perhaps? - --Danny in West Lafayette, Indiana. Go Boilers, indeed. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:42:44 -0500 (EST) From: Matt Marino <mattncherie at juno.com> Subject: chiller Im thinking about building a new immersion chiller and am wondering if anyone has had any luck designing a no-stir im. Ive seen them advertised, usually all the coils are at the top and convection does the work. Has anyone designed one that actualy works without having to stir. I love immersion chillers but hate having to stir the whole time. I also used an Easymasher for the first time today and it worked great! Thanks Jack. MADMAN Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:12:46 -0600 (CST) From: Jeff Lutes <jlutes at osprey.net> Subject: SG to Alcohol Brewers, I am looking for a formula that will use the starting and ending gravity of a brew and find the estimated potential alcohol content. I'm sure it's out there somewhere, but I can't find it! TIA Gemus Brauen Haus Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:46:03 -0800 (PST) From: dmitry at quickturn.com ( Dmitry Vosky ) Subject: Stupid Keg Tricks... I was preparing two stainless 5 gallon kegs two weeks ago, and after thoroughly cleaning with TSP solution and rinsing clean, added a cup of baking soda to each keg full of clean tap water. The intention was to leave this overnight to remove odors from prior contents. The kegging session was postponed, and two weeks passed before I finally had a chance to attend to these kegs. Rinsing the kegs I discovered the insides were covered with a layer of sand-like crystals, like sand paper with mini stalectites. These crystals are bonded to the stainless surface, but do come off when scratched with a finger nail. Has anyone out there ever ran across anything like this, in brewing context; an explanation or a possible fix would be highly appreciated. It would be nice to harness chemistry to remove these crystals, although I'm not above scrubing: it wouldn't be homebrewing with out it. - --Dmitry, Spilanking Keg Brewery (was The Rusty Fridge Brewery) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 13:20:37 +1030 From: "Dave Edwards" <eddiedb at senet.com.au> Subject: New club in Adelaide G'day, Just a notice to any brewers in the northern suburbs of Adelaide (I live in Modbury, so anywhere from Campbelltown to Salisbury really), I am looking at starting a club and would like to know if anyone is interested. Novice or experienced, it doesn't matter. Cheers, Dave. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 21:02:40 -0800 From: "Dan Diana" <dands at ftconnect.com> Subject: Gleanings from the field on ready to pitch yeasts Hi, I just wanted to provide an update from the field on my recent experiences with two ready to pitch liquid yeast cultures. In the first case, I had a White Labs WLP830 culture that was well within its Best Before date of 11/15/00. Given how close I was to this date, I chose to start the culture in 500g of a 1050 OG wort from a previous batch that I brewed. In short, the culture was dead even after two days of stand time at room temperature. Has anyone else had this type of issue? I doubt it was a procedural issue as this starter technique has been successful on about 20+ brews. Since I wanted to brew, I reformulated the recipe and fell back to a Wyeast pitchable tube of 1272 American Ale II. With the wort cooled to 72 degrees, I directly pitched the contents of the tube into a 1051 OG wort. It has taken about 41 hours to reach low krausen and cover the wort surface with a foam head. The culture was manufactured on 8/16/00 and I pitched 10/29/00 (75 days). This was within the four months after manufacture date that Wyeast quotes an ale culture should be viable. Does anyone have any data on how much additional lag time you incur as these ready to pitch yeasts age? These excess lag times make me nervous as they are prime times for infection. My take away learning from this experience is that these ready to pitch liquid yeast cultures reduce the up front time but do not offer the peace of mind that I get from an active starter. Dan Return to table of contents
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