HOMEBREW Digest #3742 Sat 22 September 2001

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  Brewing for Competitions (Len Safhay)
  hops (gsferg)
  Isinglass use & clear beers (Jay\) Reeves" <jay666 at bellsouth.net>
  Re: : sacc. rest and mash thickness ("RJ")
  HBD Red Cross Fund Progress (Pat Babcock)
  Bud Certified CO2 ("Ray Daniels")
  Total Yield (Alexandre Enkerli)
  sacc. rest and mash thickness (Roy Roberts)
  Palm Recipe ("Tomusiak, Mark")
  Montreal Brewpubs (Alexandre Enkerli)
  brewing in space (carlos benitez)
  RE: Palm (related) recipes? ("Bissell, Todd S")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 07:12:09 -0400 From: Len Safhay <cloozoe at optonline.net> Subject: Brewing for Competitions Never having attended a competition, I have a question: Are the bottle labels left on during the judging? If so, an obvious flaw is evident. The labels include the name of the brewer and the club affiliation. This cannot help but skew the judges perception of the beer. Let's say you are a judge confronted with two beers; one brewed by Joe Blow and the other by, say, George Fix. Or you harbor a personal bias against a particular club. There doesn't need to be an overt desire on the judges part to be unfair, but they will ineitably have some preconceptions that will effect their ability to be objective. Are the bottles that the judges see simply numbered? If not, they should be. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 07:12:02 -0400 From: gsferg at clary.gwi.net Subject: hops >From: JGORMAN at steelcase.com >Subject: hops > >I know hop rhizomes are best planted in the spring but I am not patient enough >to wait. Does anyone know where I can purchase rhizomes for a fall planting? >I am looking for Horizon and Mt. Hood plants. By the way, what are the >advantages/disadvantages spring vs. fall planting? I suspect the problem is they will try to grow if you plant them in the fall and might get killed by frost. Also, their growth cycle is based on the hours of sunlight available and in the fall the plant's instincts are to die back, not grow. Spring is certainly the traditional time to plant them- right after the frost is out of the ground, before the soil warms up appreciably but after the threat of frost is past. There is no reason you can't get a head start by planting them in pots in late winter, then transplant them outside after the threat of frost has past (I suspect I'll be trying that). I've got a half dozen plants growing that I'll be digging up and dividing next spring. I'll also be ordering more too- now that I've switched to all-grain brews I've discovered, to my chagrin, that the cost of hops is my major expense :) Check out http://www.freshops.com/ They sell hops of all sorts and the site has lots of information. George- Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 06:17:57 -0500 From: "James \(Jay\) Reeves" <jay666 at bellsouth.net> Subject: Isinglass use & clear beers In #3741, Colby says he tried Isinglass for the first time, following the directions and asks about a "goop" floating on top of his beer after using it. Colby, I can't answer what the "goop" is or tell you what it will do, but I wonder if the directions told you to use the Isinglass correctly. According to a few sources I have, Isinglass works when the temp of the beer is between 50-60F. One source says it works best on a beer with a rising temp starting from the low 50's. This has proved out in my experience. I tried Isinglass when I used to ferment in carboys at room temp but never had much luck with it. Now, I ferment in 10gal kegs and am able to cold-condition all my beers, letting them fall bright naturally with no finings (more on that in a sec). I use Isinglass (liquid) in the cask-conditioned beers I do. After fermentation is over, I chill the beer to 50F (some cask aficionados may say you should never get it this cold), rack to a pin (5.5 US gal), add an 8oz(lq) bottle of Isinglass, plug it and roll it around a bit (agitation), then stick it in a fridge at 57-58F. I don't know what stages it goes through or how it looks, but when I tap the cask in as little as two weeks, every one of them have been brilliant. Now another data point on clearing beer. As I said, I cold condition all my beer at 38F (except the cask-conditioned). In the past, I rack to the tank after fermentation, then let it sit under CO2 pressure. Even after several weeks, some beers were still a bit hazy. I read somewhere (don't recall) that "spunding" shortens conditioning time and speeds clarification. Spunding is the practice of transferring the beer to a secondary before it's finished, sealing the fermentor and letting it carbonate naturally. I have been doing this with the last several batches and can say that it apparently does work very good. I can't get complete carbonation of the beer this way, but it does carb the beer a bit. What I do get, which is more important for me, is that every beer so far has been brilliant after a few weeks. I sorta "wing it" when to seal the fermentor, attach a pressure gauge and monitor the pressure. Sometimes it gets up to 18psi. I have yet to feel the need to relieve the pressure during this. I still get good attenuation, so apparently the pressure isn't affecting the yeast much, if any - seems I read somewhere that yeast under pressure doesn't want to act right. Anyway, hope this is useful to some out there. -Jay Reeves Huntsville, AL Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 08:06:25 -0400 From: "RJ" <wortsup at metrocast.net> Subject: Re: : sacc. rest and mash thickness "Thomas D. Hamann" <tdhamann at senet.com.au> wrote: "Gregory Noonan in 'New Brewing Lager Beer' says the duration of the sacc. rest affects fermentability and flavour and that a 120 minute mash is going to eke out every bit of diastatic power that the malt has to offer. A 2 hour mash at 149 F (65 C) is going to give a beer with a lower FG than a 45 minute mash at the same temp. Therefore can I assume that if I do a 120 minute mash at 69 deg C (156 F) I will have a beer that attenutes well but is still high in dextrins or maybe maltier than a mash held at 65 deg C (149 F) for 45 minutes. The same thoughts I have with mash thickness e.g. a thick mash = dextrinous wort. But what if I mash for 2 hours! Surely if I do the 1. thickest mash possible 2. at 69 C and 3. rest for 2 hours plus... ...I won't have a thin flavourless bodiless beer ! I'll add that I am aware that the degree of attenuation doesn't dictate maltiness (or lack there of)." Thomas, I think that you're missing the point! The temperature of the mash is more important than the duration, but, longer times will eek out more of the "sweetness" of that particular step, esp. at the lower temperature ranges. Because you are allowing the enzymes to denature naturally by duration vs. denaturing them by heat. 149F (65C) is the top of the bandwagon for Alpha-Beta enzymes, which produce a more fermiable <sp> mash. If you were to start at 156F (69C) without the lower temp steps, the beta enzymes would be denatured (almost instantly) and the Alpha enzymes would be on their way out too. You would produce a less fermiable mash, with a higher dextrine value. The higher the rest temperature, the less time is needed. My forte is multi-step infusion mashes, that said... a single infusion range of 144F-158F with direct heat to step up with, requires longer times at the lower temp spectrum. You certainly will have a fuller bodied brew using your 3 step plan above, but, without the lower enzyme rests, you'll be missing the boat on attenutation, because there will be far less fermentable sugars (using conventional beer yeasts) available. My suggestion (if using all barley) would be to mash at 146F for 45 min, then add heat to 156F and hold for conversion (using the iodine test method), plus 20 min.. This should give you the desired effect. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 07:53:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org> Subject: HBD Red Cross Fund Progress Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... The progress of the Red Cross match drive is now being tracked on the HBD website, similarly to how we account for our server fund donations. Go to http://hbd.org and pick HBD Community Red Cross Match Fund to the right of the flag at half mast. Instructions for donating and clarification of the dates are on that site as well. - -- - God bless America! Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock at hbd.org Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org HBD Web Site http://hbd.org The Home Brew Page http://hbd.org/pbabcock "The monster's back, isn't it?" - Kim Babcock after I emerged from my yeast lab Saturday Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 07:38:33 -0500 From: "Ray Daniels" <raydan at ameritech.net> Subject: Bud Certified CO2 I'd love to get my hands on some of this Bud-certified CO2! When I was in the Siebel diploma course we discussed the fact that "beverage" CO2 is not very pure -- and one of the key contaminants is oxygen! So every time we force carbonate a beer, we are goosing it with a good bit of beer spoiling O2. Frankly I'm not sure it makes that big a difference for just pushing beer out of a keg--especially a beer that moves as fast as Bud--but for "production" work, including homebrew, it would be great. Guinness had a similar campaign four or five years ago related to mixed gas. So how do I get some of this good gas? Ray Daniels Editor-in-Chief Zymurgy & The New Brewer Phone: 773-665-1300 E-mail: ray at aob.org Call Customer Service at 888-822-6273 to subscribe or order individual magazines. Don't Miss: Great American Beer Festival - Denver, CO - Sept 27-29 For more info see: www.beertown.org Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 08:08:36 -0500 (EST) From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu> Subject: Total Yield Hi, I'm looking at my total system efficiency and I keep noticing the discrepancies between the batch size (i.e., the volume in the primary) and the actual number of bottles I fill. Is it normal to only be able to fill 24-30 tall bottles (mostly 660ml's with some 750ml's) from 23 l in the primary? What are your yields? Alex Enkerli Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 07:21:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Roy Roberts <psilosome at yahoo.com> Subject: sacc. rest and mash thickness Thomas, A good question - it turns out that at 69 deg C (156 F) the beta amylase needed for good fermentability doesn't survive very long, so a lower temperature rest is needed if you want a drier beer. If you search the HBD archives you will find others who describe the conversion processs in more detail. Roy Roberts NYC Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 08:17:21 -0700 From: "Tomusiak, Mark" <tomusiak at amgen.com> Subject: Palm Recipe Greetings all...Jan-Willem Van Groenigen asks for a Special Palm recipe. First of all Jan, I'm curious as to what your impressions are of how that bottle of Special Palm tasted compared to the same beer on tap in Belgium and Holland. Beers such as Special Palm and DeKoninck are among my favorites, and I have noted that the bottled versions seem to taste drastically different than the draught versions. DeKoninck on tap is a wonderful beer, but in the bottle I have found it to be rather one-dimensional and uninspiring. I think that you are probably correct in your assessment of oxidation being the source of the sherry notes. Although I haven't tried to clone Special Palm, I have finally developed a good DeKoninck recipe, and found that the key element to making these beers at home is the yeast. After many attempts, I found that using Wyeast 1388 (Belgian Strong Ale) with a warm (70 F) primary and a cold (40 F) secondary yields the desired subtle fruit and spice esters but with the relatively clean finish that makes these beers so "more-ish". If you are interested, I can provide more details on the recipe. Cheers, Mark Tomusiak Boulder, Colorado Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 13:24:54 -0500 (EST) From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu> Subject: Montreal Brewpubs Oops! I had missed this thread... I'll second the votes for Dieu du Ciel and Cheval blanc and would love to join any number of homebrewers there. DdC is especially close to my place. There are other brewpubs in town, though, and they display the variety of tastes characteristic of Mtl. L'amere a boire on St-Denis specializes in Czech lagers. Their Imperial Stout is also really good. Sergent Recruteur on St-Laurent (4650) is a Real Ale pub with associated variation in quality from really good to not-that-awesome. Actually, I didn't go very often but one homebrewer who did had that to say. Brutopia on Crescent is AFAIK the only English-speaking brewpub in town. Their beers are closer to styles common in the US, especially when compared with the Belgian styles at DdC. One great advantage to Brutopia is that it's next door to Hurley's, one of the best Irish pubs in town. While it's not a brewpub, they serve some of the best Guinness Stout you can find and also have local dry cider. I think they call the Stout and Cider "Black Velvet" but I get confused because some call it "Black and Tan" and even "Snakebite." There were other brewpubs in town but those are the main ones now. Great places for microbrews and imports in draft include L'Barouf on Saint-Denis and Bobards on Saint-Laurent. Getting a full 20oz. pint of Leffe brune for Cdn$6 or less is pretty good around here. So, if you want a tour of some of these places and/or just want to talk homebrewing at DdC, feel free to contact me directly. Alex aenkerli at indiana.edu (514)277-0715 Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 20:28:23 -0700 (PDT) From: carlos benitez <greenmonsterbrewing at yahoo.com> Subject: brewing in space Hi All ! A while back people had been talking about beers in space check this out: Faraway astronauts must yearn sometimes for the simple comforts of Earth - -- like a refreshing soda or a beer after work. But one wonders: Would the cheerful bubbles of a space-soda rise to the top and tickle one's nose? And could a frosty space-beer form a proper head? These questions sound tongue-in-cheek, but researchers are serious about finding the answers. Recent experiments with orbiting beers and sodas promise a more normal day-to-day life for space settlers and offer revealing lessons about physics and biology in microgravity. FULL STORY at Suds in Space - http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast21sep_1.htm This is from the newsletter I get from NASA - Enjoy ! ===== BIBIDI ! Brew It Bottle It Drink It Carlos Benitez - Green Monster Brewing Bainbridge, PA, U.S.A. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 20:43:33 -0700 From: "Bissell, Todd S" <tbissell at spawar.navy.mil> Subject: RE: Palm (related) recipes? Hi all: I'm familiar with this beer, and Jan has described it to a tee -- though the sweetness is more noticeable -- IMHO, and to my typically Hophead-indoctrinated taste buds, that is...! :) Along these same lines, has anyone else seen and tried Mongozo...? It's an African-Belgian hybrid ale, with the principle ingredient being the "Palm Nut". It tastes similar to what Jan has described for Speciale Palm, with a slightly sweet chewiness to the finish. (Have only seen at the High Times store in Costa Mesa, CA... so far) Info: http://www.globalbeer.com/web/body_pages/pages-beer/Mongozo/Mongozo.html ) Anyway, assuming that both of these ales use the same "palm"-related ingredient(s), I'm in the same boat as Jan, in that I have no clue how to obtain such ingredient(s) and such. Anyone else have any further experience with this to draw upon...? Cheers! Todd Bissell Imperial Beach, CA >Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2001 12:15:44 -0700 > From: Jan-Willem van Groenigen <groenigen at ucdavis.edu> > Subject: Palm recipe? > > > > Hi all, > > as a Dutchman living (and brewing) in California, my wife brought me back > some Belgian beers from her trip back home. Last night I drunk a 'Speciale > Palm', which used to be one of my favorite beers, and I was struck by how > different it was from anything I have tasted here in the U.S. Hops are > virtually non existent, there is a sweetish tone, and sometimes it's almost > like it tastes a little bit oxidated (slight 'sherry-taste'). Since I only > recently started brewing, I don't have a clue how I can brew a beer like > this. Is there anybody who has a recipe for a Palm - style beer? I would be > forever greatful... > > Thanks, Jan Willem. > Return to table of contents
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