HOMEBREW Digest #3771 Fri 26 October 2001

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  RE: Raspberry beer ("Bissell, Todd S")
  Re: beer distance ("Jack Tourette")
  Massive over-carbonation problem ("Jeff Woods")
  Re: n/a beer ("RJ")
  Hot Scotchies ("Ray Daniels")
  high FGs (Rolf Karlsson)
  Stuck Sparge (Ant Hayes)
  Beer miles (Ant Hayes)
  Hashing and engineering (Bjoern.Thegeby)
  Rennerian Distance, Laval (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Re: San Antonio (Jason Mobley)
  Rye pils update ("Joel Halpine")
  a modest proposal re: pumpkin ("Bret Morrow")
  topping up ("steve lane")
  Airlocks ("Crouch, Kevin E")
  regarding fruit beers (raspberry, pomegranate) ("chris eidson")
  UNC Chemists figure out what causes skunkiness (stpats)
  San Antonio / Raspberry Juice (stpats)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 21:58:40 -0700 From: "Bissell, Todd S" <tbissell at spawar.navy.mil> Subject: RE: Raspberry beer > Stephan asked..."With the onset of fall, I have been > brewing more and have decided that I would like to add > a Raspberry pale ale to the list. With so many > recommendations as how to go about using fruit in a > pale ale, I am starting to get confused. What is the > proper way to utilize raspberry in a pale ale? " > Denis responded..."I just returned from a visit to Austin, > during which I made a couple of trips to St. Patricks of > Texas...and they have a Belgian Raspberry juice that you > add at bottling/kegging that supposed to be just the ticket. > This would eliminate much of the haze problem. It's > about 7.5 USD for a pint, but very pure stuff. I'm > going to try it later this Fall...." I'm in the process of experimenting with that exact same juice, Denis. I poured in a shot-glass of it into my 5 gallon Secondary fermenter full of Porter, about three days before I planned on bottling it (I figured that the three days would ensure an uniform dispersal). During bottling, I had a taste of the finished product (as finished as warm, flat beer can be, that is!), and I think I may be onto to something interesting...! Seeing that a Raspberry Pale Ale is no stranger than a Raspberry Porter, I would give my tentative recommendation for trying out St Pats' Raspberry juice. Good luck! Cheers! Todd Bissell Imperial Beach, CA USA, North America Earth, Sol, Milky Way This Here Universe... :} (Sorry, the Rennerian thing has become a bit old hat...! :) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 07:11:30 +0500 From: "Jack Tourette" <tourette at crosswinds.net> Subject: Re: beer distance > Surely someone on the list is a member of a Hash House > Harrier group and could give us their guidance on the beer- > to-distance conundrum. Over the years I have run as a > guest at three H3 groups. All shared the "running club with > a drinking problem" spirit and dedication. I think the > courses, not counting false trails, tended to be concluded > in an hour to an hour-and-a-half and probably were about six > to seven miles. That's "A drinking club with a running problem" :-) Different clubs do different distances; distance also depends on the hare (drunken slob, marathoner) and the terrain (swamp, mall, airport, suburban neighborhood, etc.), weather, and myriad other factors (e.g., bar proximity, shortcut potential, access to public transportation). The Hashes I drank with tended toward ~60 minute courses, average distances of 4-5 miles, with at least one beer stop midway. See my stupid collection of Hash-related quotations in FFT->H->Hash House Harriers. ============================== Jack Tourette tourette at crosswinds.net www.crosswinds.net/~tourette/fft.htm Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 21:11:27 -0400 From: "Jeff Woods" <woodsj at us.ibm.com> Subject: Massive over-carbonation problem I have a massive foam problem in a corny keg draft system. Made a Belgian strong Ale recently that's 90% foam coming out of the tap. I had force carbonated a few weeks ago. Turned the gas to 25 psi for 2 days. It was real foamy at first so the gas was disconnected and pressure vented. I kept venting the pressure twice per day over a 7-10 day period. There was pressure released each time I pulled to relief valve. Over last weekend I hooked the gas again and it's still 90% foam. I checked the gravity and it's the same as when it finished fermenting. When you pour a glass the head reduces over a few minutes and looks like a nitrogen head churning. I don't suspect an infection problem but who knows. This is my normal carbonation procedure but I've never had this much foam for sooooo long. HELP, it makes the beer practically undrinkable. Do I keep releasing pressure ?? At this point I don't know if there's anything else to do. Jeff Woods Camp Hill, PA, USA, North American continent, Western Hemisphere of Planet Earth, Third planet from the sun, Milky Way galaxy, the rest I don't know (Rennerian coordinates unknown) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 08:32:54 -0400 From: "RJ" <wortsup at metrocast.net> Subject: Re: n/a beer Lonzo McLaughlin lonkelm at netzero.net wrote: Subject: n/a beer >Is there a way to make a n/a beer at home or with some basic >equipment. I'm looking for ideas outside of watering down beer. Lonzo, Here's a method and recipe from years back: #156 LA East 3# Belgian Pilsen Malt 3.75oz Belgian Aromatic Malt 4.25oz Honey Malt Dough-in 4-1/2Qts H2O at 64F, raise to 136F in 18 minutes; Hold 10 min Raise heat to 148F in 10 min, hold 10 min Add 1-1/2 Qts 210F H2O to raise temp 158F; Hold 60 min Sparge with 7-1/2Qts H2O Treated with Lactic Acid to 5.2pH 90 min boil 2 HBU Ge. Mittlefruh cones at FWH 0.9 HBU Ge. Hersbrucker T-90 at 60min remaining 1 HBU Ge. Mittlefruh cones & 1/2tsp Irish Moss at 40min remaining 1/2 oz Ge. Mittlefruh cones at 1 min remaining in mesh bag; Let steep for 20 min then remove bag before counterflowing. 5-3/4 gals captured. Pitch 250ml Germ Lager Yeast, let stand overnight at 50F then rack to primary. Ferment at low end of yeast's temp range, 7 days. Rack to 2ndary & Allow 1 day at 65F before lagering. Lager 8 days at 38F. Keg and force 2.7vol CO2. 0.8% ABV Note: Had a bready flovor not unlike Morretti's from Italy, must be drunk within a month as the flavor fades fast! >What is this vacuum method of removing alcohol? Sorry don't know this method.. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 07:57:24 -0500 From: "Ray Daniels" <raydan at ameritech.net> Subject: Hot Scotchies My good friend and most devoted student of the brewing literature, Zemo, points out the appearance of Hot Scotchies in one of my books. I may have been the most recent author to publish the practice of infusing a glass of wort with a bit of (cheap) scotch, but I'm certainly not the first nor am I the inventor. I learned this trick from Jim Parker, co-author of the Brown Ale book (which is where it is actually published). Jim is an experienced brewer, bartender, writer, publisher and brewery association manager (AHA, briefly and now Oregon Brewers Guild). He also happens to be one of the funniest people I know and a very dangerous man to drink with (stories best left for another day . . . ). In any case, the beverage is a wonderful brew-day restorative and one I now enjoy with regularity. TTFN, Ray Daniels Editor, Zymurgy & The New Brewer Director, Brewers Publications ray at aob.org Call Customer Service at 888-822-6273 to subscribe or order individual magazines. For more information, see www.beertown.org Don't Miss: Real Ale Festival - Feb 27 - March 2, 2002 - Chicago, IL www.realalefestival.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 09:00:44 -0400 From: Rolf Karlsson <bz4n8v at naeng.gm.com> Subject: high FGs The other day Jeff mentioned that Laaglander is notorious for finishing high, and that's not the first time I've heard that. I am now finding out firsthand, though I think it's almost at a point where I can bottle a potable product (Laaglander Dark Dutch extract and a couple pounds of dark spraymalt: OG 1.043, FG 1.015 despite adding amylase and agitating in secondary). Does anyone with more experience have any theories as to why Laaglander tends to be this way? Rolf Karlsson [44.2, 9.3] Rennerian or (42.928, -83.6854) - -- "Hey, mighty brontosaurus, don't you have a lesson for us?" -The Police, "Walking In Your Footsteps" Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 16:18:09 +0200 From: Ant Hayes <Ant.Hayes at FifthQuadrant.co.za> Subject: Stuck Sparge Tidmarsh Major differed with Jeff Renner's definition of sparge, saying, >Modern usage here (and I suspect elsewhere) makes sparge more or less synonymous with lauter, with >sparge usu. a verb or noun ('stuck sparge') and lauter usu. an adjective ('lauter tun.') Here in Africa the term would be "stuck mash" or "set mash". You might get a stuck sparge arm - but I have never heard of a stuck sparge. You sparge your mash with sparge liquor. You collect your run off/ runnings from your lauter tun. Sparge liquor becomes runnings after percolating through the mash. Ant Hayes Johannesburg [13 656 km; 125] Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 16:18:28 +0200 From: Ant Hayes <Ant.Hayes at FifthQuadrant.co.za> Subject: Beer miles >For those of you in more urban settings where cops might be inclined to jail >you, why not use one of those walking exercise treadmill thingies! Bottle stout in a Coke bottle and off you go. Ant Hayes Johannesburg [13 656 km; 125] Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 16:09:50 +0200 From: Bjoern.Thegeby at cec.eu.int Subject: Hashing and engineering As a hasher of twenty years, I can seen one major problem in using hashing skills to solve Rennerian measurements. The basic assumption revolves around the concept of a straight line. I have never seen a hasher do anything in a straight line, much less so after the beer check. As the soul of hashing is shortcutting the trail, there is even an in-built bias against straight lines. On another topic I just ordered my RIMS chamber. Unlike in the States there are no stores or mailorder houses providing convenient parts and I was reduced to go to a local metal workshop, run by a friendly Arab. We agreed on a price (don't ask) and I left him to do the job. When I came back, he had turned the whole chamber from one piece of stainless steel, painstakingly gutting it into a tube adding 2-inch BSP threads on one side and, wonder upon wonders, from the same piece, turned a half-inch nipple at the bottom to serve as a drain. This magnificent piece of overengineering will survive when cockroaches go extinct. The weight meant that I had to carry it cradled in my arms. My only problem was that it bore an uncanny resemblance to a Vickers machine gun and I had to carry it past the British Embassy. Even this would have been easier, if I hadn't been given it in a gaudy plastic bas saying "Mohammed's groceries". Oh well, I survived. Bjorn Thegeby Alright then: [81.8, 3987] Rennerian (but still five miles from Lembeek) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 10:32:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu> Subject: Rennerian Distance, Laval Piggybacking on Jeff Renner's mention of my situation (Indiana email, leaving in Montreal), I'd mention that I really value location sigs because such situations are fairly common in this era of mobility. In fact, I might even add that while I live in Montreal, I brew in Laval (in the suburbs) where the water treatment is somewhat different. So, just to make sure local brewers might notice, I've put this name in the tile. But maybe Pat Babcock has a way to have Rennerians show up in the summary??? Now, because it's so much fun, a comment on measuring Rennerian distance. To put pressure on Jeff Renner, we should, first of all, ask *him* to do the measurements. If he's the focal point, he should also provide the unit of reference. So, *he* should do the walking while drinking experiment. The threadmill idea seems fairly good. In fact, we could use the calorie information. How many miles does Jeff Renner have to do to burn the amount of calories in his favorite beer? The best thing would be to have JR burn as many calories as he drinks in the same amount of time. Otherwise we have to take into account the format of the unit beer which could be 12oz., 16oz., 20oz., 1 quart... Until we get those measurements done, I'll stick to metric. ;-) Alex, in Montreal [893.3km, 62.8] Apparent Rennerian Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 10:21:21 -0500 From: Jason Mobley <jmobley at satx.rr.com> Subject: Re: San Antonio Welcome to SA. The River Walk is a tourist trap....many of the resturants/bars are no different than what you will find in any other US city (Hard Rock, Planet Holleywood, etc,...). HOWEVER, there is ONE great brewpub/resturant that has a Real Ale and great food, it's called Blue Star Brewing. It's not far from the River Walk but you will need to take a cab because it is not within walking distance. When you get here, you can find the address in the phone book. - --J > ------------------------------ > > Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 10:51:58 -0400 > From: "Spencer W. Thomas" <spencer at umich.edu> > Subject: San Antonio? > > I'll be in San Antonio, TX Nov 28 - Dec 1. From pubcrawler, it looks > like the brewpub scene is pretty much not, with a single brewpub worth > going to. Any other recommendations? I'll be staying near the River > Walk, and won't have a car. > > =S Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 10:39:35 -0600 From: "Joel Halpine" <jhalpine at esu4.org> Subject: Rye pils update I remember when I asked for advice in brewing with rye, someone asked me to post the outcome of a rye pils I was planning. Keep in mind that this is coming from a guy regularly humbled by the intricate topics regularly discussed here. 5 gallons of a Rye Try: 6 lbs British Pale Ale 2 lbs flaked Rye 8 oz Crystal (40L) 1.5 oz Hallertauer Hersb. at boil .25 oz Hallertauer at last 15 min .25 oz Saaz at last 15 min .5 oz Saaz for last min WLP German Lager (repitch--I think the 3rd recycling). I igloo mash, so I followed the recommendation of using flaked rye. Mashed around 150 for about an 1.5 hrs, and then infused to 155 or so for another 30 or so min. Stickiest mash I have ever encountered. The iodine test didn't change color, though there was that little reaction that reminds me of tiny explosions--I am having problems getting that British malt to convert completely. Maybe I am not treating my water properly, or maybe I should blend in a little American Pale. I would like any thoughts on that topic. I figured two hours mashing is enough, so I sparged patiently without probs. Boiled about 70 min. OG about 1.053 FG about 1.016 (or was it 17--can't recall without the log book) wanted about 1.012 First, let me say I do not like rye. However, I really like it. It has a rye aroma. I think the flavor is great. I do not know how to define the taste without the proper training in identifying flavors judges go through--seems kinda spicy, crisp, almost citrus orange. If I could, I would like to lighten the color more just to fit a pils profile, but I do not have access to lighter crystal. I did have one taster say she would prefer it with turkey and dumplings (which would be a great meal to it). It is hard to get others to be really critial--I think they are still afraid they will hurt my feelings despite my pleadings for brutal assessment. I would and will happily brew it again either as is, or try an ale yeast. If I figure out how to drop my final gravity, I might lighten up on the ingredients a touch to keep the alcohol around 5% (good for multiple refills). A side question: Recent topics on the HBD include modified malts. It seems I recently saw something about Weisseheimer (sp?) pils grain being appropriate for brewing without the protein rest. Many of you seem to have access to updated data on modification of malts. Where do you get that? Also, until I manage that, what base grains should I use or avoid with my brewing setup. I have always avoided pils grains, as they seem to require protein rests that my current set up doesn't allow. Joel Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 17:12:59 From: "Bret Morrow" <bretmorrow at hotmail.com> Subject: a modest proposal re: pumpkin Greetings all, The Jonathan Swift connection will be evident at the end of this post. I was baking pumpkin cookies while thinking how the pumpkin could really goo up a mash & an idea came to me. Why not do as the Sumarians did--make the pumpkin into a dry solid, then mash it. Basically, you could take pumpkin and mix it with crushed grain (maybe crystal) and spices, form it into "cakes" on a cookie sheet and bake it until it is dry. It should store for years! Then you could crumble it into a regular mash (without the crystal malt). This may prevent the mash from being stuck as easily. Potentially it may add some nice flavours from the protein:carbohydtrate interactions. (Now the Jon. Swift connection) I would try this and report to all, but I only like to drink English style ales and, therefore, have no desire to test this out. Bret Morrow (90976216320 mm, 92.9 degrees) Hamden, CT PS what ever happened to the Sumarians? I haven't seen them post@ HBD in years! Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 14:18:19 -0500 From: "steve lane" <tbirdusa at hotmail.com> Subject: topping up I am an all grain brewer who typically ends up with a little too much wort after the boil for my 7 gallon primary fermenters. Actually, it all fits into the primary's but when transferring to the secondaries, I always end up with an extra gallon or so. Not a big problem as I then syphon the balance over to a gallon cider jug and air lock it. Here is my problem, I have extract brewed the last two nights and have come up short on wort. Higher gravity than expected and less volume than expected...I guess that correlation is to be expected :) I haven't topped off the fermenters and am thinking I had better do it now... but then I am thinking I should wait and do it at the transfer to secondary. Does it matter when I top off the fermenters? I know I will have to pre boil and chill the top off water but when is the time to do this seeing as my fermenters are churning away? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 19:20:32 -0000 From: "Crouch, Kevin E" <Crouch.Kevin at emeryworld.com> Subject: Airlocks Phil Wrote: >I could be way off the mark in my advice to Gary, but I strongly recommend >to all brewers that you visually observe the goings on in your fermentation >rather than the poot poot poot chuffing out of your airlock. Throw the >silly thing away! Funny you should mention this Phil, as I have had a similar experience lately. I bought one of those orange caps the other day and used it on my latest ale and was very confused by the fact that I was at high krauesen and the airlock was just barely buzzing. I took a bit of glycerin and applied it to the rim of my carboy and stuck the cap back on and it started bubbling like mad. I knew I had a good fermentation but I was puzzled by the airlock activity. Smart advice for sure, the krauesen, the vortex, and the visible bubbles are a much more reliable indicator of fermentation vigor than an airlock. One question, however, about your advice to free ourselves from the opression of the airlocks. Airlocks were concieved not to monitor fermentation, but to allow CO2 out, without letting air in. As soon as fermentation slows and the positive pressure inside the fermentor falls, how would one keep air out without an airlock? Kevin Crouch Vancouver, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 20:18:32 From: "chris eidson" <eidsonc at hotmail.com> Subject: regarding fruit beers (raspberry, pomegranate) In response to Stefan's post, I have found fruit added to the primary has most of the fruit flavor/aroma "scrubbed" out of the beer by the rigors of fermentation, with the finished product having a wine-like quality to it. Fruit added to the secondary seems to retain more of the fruit aroma and flavor but be prepared to add fairly large quantities, at least one pound per gallon if using fresh fruit. In response to Alex's post, I have seen pomegranate extract/puree at several middle eastern grocery stores. I don't know if it would be suitable to use or not, but it seems like a better alternative than grenadine syrup. Just a suggestion. Chris Eidson Birmingham, AL Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 16:22:09 -0500 From: stpats <stpats at bga.com> Subject: UNC Chemists figure out what causes skunkiness What isn't mentioned in the UNC press release is that one of the authors is a very recent convert to homebrewing. My husband told me about this research a couple of years ago. I don't know anything about the chemistry but I gleaned the following facts from a more general article by Denis De Keukeleire (de KIK ye lair ee) of Ghent University in Belgium. Half the hops produced worldwide are extracted with CO2. CO2 extraction of hops is a bigger industry than decaffeination of coffee! Most of us know that you only get 30% yield of potential hop bitterness using hop pellets or whole hops, even with 1-2 hour boil. The yield is 90% in hop extracts by a process developed by De Keukeleire. The reference in the press release to Miller's use of hop products that don't result in "light struck" flavor is about the "advanced hop products" of which there are two types. One type of hop extract has same bitterness as usual hop extract but doesn't react even in clear bottles under sunlight. The other type is the one used at Miller. It does react but makes a compound that is tasteless. This hop extract is particularly appealing because it also has twice the bitterness of the usual hop extract. The big point is that the hop extract used by Miller (and many others worldwide now) provides 6 times more bitterness/oz of hop cones than what we homebrewers use. Just speculating, but I'm almost certain that these "no-boil" Munton & Fison extract kits, use the 90% isomerized hop extract, which is already isomerized, so it wouldn't require any boiling. Factor in the trend toward less hop bitterness in beers worldwide as well as higher alpha varieties in production, and I think you get an idea about the plight of the hop growing industry. Lynne O'Connor - -- St. Patrick's of Texas Brewers Supply 512-989-9727 www.stpats.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 16:22:59 -0500 From: stpats <stpats at bga.com> Subject: San Antonio / Raspberry Juice Spencer Thomas asks about beer places in San Antonio. Blue Star Brewpub is excellent, both for beer and food. Bear in mind they are an account and the owners Joey and Maggie are good friends (we vacationed with them in Cuatro Cienegas this summer). Never the less, the pilsner is the closest thing you'll find to the "original Budweiser" outside Ceske Budejovice. Dryhopped (EK Goldings) pale ale and barleywine are wonderful as well. I eat the pork green chile almost every time I'm there, 3 or 4 nights a month (180 miles round trip) . ..Beer battered onion rings, pizzas are very good. Blue Star is on the edge of the King William district which is within walking distance of downtown although a cab is certainly easier. The other brewpub The Laboratory, is northwest and was never very good although they are making better and more interesting beer now including a prickly pear beer. I'd join Spencer for a beer but I'll be in Oporto sampling a few ports that week, as well as visiting cork groves. How's that for one-upmanship? Dennis Bekaert mentioned the Belgian raspberry juice. Please note it contains sugars so should be added during the secondary to let it ferment out before bottling/kegging. Lynne O'Connor - -- St. Patrick's of Texas Brewers Supply 512-989-9727 www.stpats.com Return to table of contents
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