HOMEBREW Digest #3919 Fri 19 April 2002

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  RE: Adventures in Bottling ("Parker Dutro")
  re: guidelines ("Mark Tumarkin")
  Hefeweizen Yeast (Len Safhay)
  cooling option on conical (Daveandbetta930)
  Cleaning Stainless Steel ("Dennis Waltman")
  re:Fermentation Temperature Control (Jim Adwell)
  RIMS Heater limitation ("Steven Parfitt")
  Re: Adventures in Bottling (Demonick)
  Crystallization ("James Sploonta")
  RE: AHA, competitions and other forums (Brian Lundeen)
  RE:  Lynne/Business Bashing ("Biffy The Brewer")
  Carafa & De-Husked Carafa (Paddock Wood Customer Service)
  Lower the pH ? (Arnaud VIEZ)
  quick disconnects - source ("Roy Strohl")
  re: Adventures in Bottleing (Rama Roberts)
  Beer Description (kingkelly)
  constant sparge flow rate ("Ryan and Shelly")
  HSA problem? (alastair)

* * 10th annual Spirit of Free Beer entry deadline is 5/11/02 * Details at http://www.burp.org/events/sofb/2002/ * * 2002 Bay Area Brew Off entry deadline is 5/20/2002 * Details: http://www.draughtboard.org/babopage.htm * * Show your HBD pride! Wear an HBD Badge! * http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/shopping * * Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy! * Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org FROM THE E-MAIL ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!** IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, you cannot subscribe to the digest as we cannot reach you. We will not correct your address for the automation - that's your job. The HBD is a copyrighted document. The compilation is copyright HBD.ORG. Individual postings are copyright by their authors. ASK before reproducing and you'll rarely have trouble. Digest content cannot be reproduced by any means for sale or profit. More information is available by sending the word "info" to req at hbd.org. JANITOR on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 01:19:17 -0700 From: "Parker Dutro" <ezekiel128 at edwardwadsworth.com> Subject: RE: Adventures in Bottling Mark, after reading your post I thought I'd make a couple comments to see if they might help you out. I have never used prime tabs, only corn sugar, however I do know that a head space of an inch or so allows the yeast to utilize the trapped O2 in their coversion of the sugar and production of CO2 (not sure how), and for some reason no headspace can prevent full carbonation. Now will this mean your beers won't carbonate, maybe, but you have options. First of all, bottled beer will finish and mature better if stored at about 75 degrees or so. This can be higher if you hope to speed up carbonation, but not too high. Try this, first, and give them a couple more weeks. You can disturb the yeast by shaking a little to re-suspend them, but only if the beer has been in the bottle more than a couple weeks already. If not, there are still a good amount of yeast floating. Next time you bottle, use a bucket. This lets you siphon a tablespoon or two of the yeast sediment into the bucket which then puts a very small but potent quantity of yeast into each bottle. This will assure good carbonation. If your beers aren't carbonated in a couple more weeks, you can get some CO2 cartridges and empty two litre soda bottles. I don't know how exactly, but you can carbonate your flat beer with the right device attached to a 2 litre. This way you could have a couple at a time and just keep the rest in the bottle till you want them. In the meantime, bottle your next batch, you deserve it! Parker Dutro, Portland Oregon Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 06:48:16 -0400 From: "Mark Tumarkin" <mark_t at ix.netcom.com> Subject: re: guidelines Spenser wrote: "Gee, I took my mutt to the dog show, and they told me it wasn't a good poodle. But I love my mutt, she's the most wonderful dog in the world? I looked at the rules, and my mutt doesn't fit into ANY of the categories! Why can't dog shows lighten up and stop being so focussed on conformity? Why can't they be about how wonderful the dog is?" but Spenser, My dog's a hophound, I think we ought to set up a category for that. Besides, he's a trained Guide dog. Mark Tumarkin Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 07:29:03 -0700 From: Len Safhay <cloozoe at optonline.net> Subject: Hefeweizen Yeast <Mike Wescott wrote: On another note, I'm curious about the hefe yeast that other brewers are using. For the last 4 hefes I've done, i've used the white labs yeast(WLP300). > Mike, for my inaugural effort I used yeast I had cultured up from a slant I innoculated from the dregs of a bottle of Schneider's. Aroma was good in starter and at end of primary. And thanks for your response to my prior questions. Len Safhay Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 08:52:20 EDT From: Daveandbetta930 at cs.com Subject: cooling option on conical Mark Lane writes: > I purchased the 7.1 gal fermentor with external cooling option. Was this cutom made for you? Their catalog states that only the internal cooling option is available on the 7.1 gal. They describe plastic parts that sound hard to clean and might not hold up well. Does you wife have a sister? Dave Balto.,MD Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 09:12:44 -0400 From: "Dennis Waltman" <PDWALTMAN at sablaw.com> Subject: Cleaning Stainless Steel In our brewhouse (I brew with a partner) stainless steel is cleaned with lemon juice and salt and lots of elbow grease. No cleaners especially are used on inside of the brew pots. The lemon skin with remains of pulp makes a nice scrubbing tool. Its definitely not the job for anyone with cuts on their hands. Dennis Waltman - --------------------------------------------------- The information contained in this message from Sutherland Asbill & Brennan LLP and any attachments is confidential and intended only for the named recipient(s). If you have received this message in error, you are prohibited from copying, distributing or using the information. Please contact the sender immediately by return email and delete the original message. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 10:30:43 -0400 From: Jim Adwell <jim at jimala.com> Subject: re:Fermentation Temperature Control Another option: http://brewery.jimala.com/fermcooler.html Cheers, Jim Jim's Brewery Pages: http://brewery.jimala.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 10:31:57 -0400 From: "Steven Parfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com> Subject: RIMS Heater limitation I test fired my RIMS heater that I added to my brewery the other night, and was rather dissapointed in the temp ramp capibility I achieved. I'm using a 4500W 240VAC heating element on single phase 115vac (60hz)line for the heat source. Actual measured voltage at the element terminals is 109VAC (the rest is lost in line loss, TRIAC drop, circuit breaker drop, etc. I ran a 7.5 Gallon test run starting at 63F. In a half hour it was only up to 83F, which gives a temp rise of only 0.67F/min, or 0.37C/min. I choose 7.5 gallons to simulate 20L water and 20# grain. The Specific heat of grain being much less than water. It will take roughly 30 minutes to ramp 10C. Is this going to be a fast enough ramp to do multi step mashes? It looks like I will need to mash in at 50, and immediatly start the ramp to 60. My hold time at 60 will be just about nill, and I will need to start ramping to 70, etc. For smaller batches there will be sufficient power to ramp and hold. It appears to me that I'm going to be limited to around 20# of grain if I'm going to do multistep mashes. Comments? Suggestions? Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery http://thegimp.8k.com Johnson City, TN 5:47:38.9 S, 1:17:37.5 E Rennerian "Fools you are... who say you like to learn from your mistakes.... I prefer to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid the cost of my own." Otto von Bismarck Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 07:37:32 -0700 From: Demonick <demonick at zgi.com> Subject: Re: Adventures in Bottling Wed, 17 Apr 2002 06:04:14 Mark Anderson <MarkA at NHWA.ORG> >... The Primetabs were easy to handle and there was no foaming, as someone >had warned me there would be, and they were quickly in solution. My >bottling time was nearly cut in half, and there was much less fussing >around with sanitizers, etc. It really is a great way to bottle. The >only real drawback is that after three weeks, there isn't a hint of >carbonation. Not a puff. >The problem may be that I didn't allow headspace in the neck of the >bottle. Perhaps. Others will better address this idea. >... Or perhaps it's the nature of Primetabs to take a while longer to >ferment. Nope. It's just pressed corn sugar. You may want to turn the bottles over if you are concerned about stratification. Yeast don't care where the sugar is in the bottle. You can't hide it in the bottle from the yeast. >...Bottled and stored at 65 degrees. 65F is pretty cool. Warm it up above 70F, say room temp or even better, 75F. Wait a full week and open one. You should have some carbonation. Open one per week to track the progress of the carbonation. Domenick Venezia Venezia & Company, LLC Maker of PrimeTab (206) 782-1152 phone (206) 782-6766 fax Seattle, WA demonick at zgi dot com http://www.primetab.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 11:14:05 -0400 From: "James Sploonta" <biere_god at hotmail.com> Subject: Crystallization "Abita's slight, bitter MOUTHFEEL insinuates itself intp a more encompassing malty character, providing good counterpoint to the emerging malty sweetness. The golden-amber BODY is slightly fruity at the swallow. Though relatively smooth overall, hints of sharpness and complxity are evident at the end. The friendly malt-hop presence is bid adieu with a slight, sugary sweetness on the final sip. An unpretentious red ale that's a comfortable companion." After reading this, I can finally crystallize my complaint against Klein's drivel. For the most part, I can relate to what the guy is trying to say, but only because I do (even if it's not apparent from my writings) read them with an open mind. Seek ye understanding first, and all that. Anyway, my problem is that Klein seems to run willy-nilly down the road of his prose, casting terms about without any concern regarding how those terms are actually used, in current mainstream beer conversations, to describe the beer. For instance, not many would associate the term "mouthfeel" with bitterness or sweetness. Those are flavors. I have less difficulty with his wanton destruction of the meaning of the term "body" (to us, a class of "mouthfeel" descriptors - light, thin, rich, heavy, watery...) by using it to describe the physical touch-feel-see instantiation of the brew, but even this does not fit with our beer culture. It is this total disregard for the existing culture that I find so irksome. Oh, then we have gems like "...laser-quick, fresh Concord grape aroma precedes a well-orchestrated mix of malt punctuated with sharp, quick jabs of hops." to blow any attempt to be reasonable about this guy away. This beer sounds like a bad karate film... Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 10:34:07 -0500 From: Brian Lundeen <BLundeen at rrc.mb.ca> Subject: RE: AHA, competitions and other forums Steve Alexander wrote: > The phenomena of phils phonic phermentation phinishing phrobnicator Carephul, Dan will be aphter you phor trademark inphringement. Paul Gatza of the AHA wrote: > If you are an American Homebrewers Association member, you > will be receiving the details of the AHA Membership Class > Restructuring in a letter coming shortly. The letter details > the price change in an individual AHA Membership to $38, the > addition of a new Family Membership option, the addition of a > joint AHA-Institute for Brewing Studies Membership and a > merging of the Canadian and International memberships into an > International Membership class. After your impassioned plea for members, I was moved to head straight to your online sign-up page at https://www.beertown.org/membership/joinaha1.htm Could it be that you are eliminating the Canadian membership class simply because of your inability to spell the word correctly? We find two occurrences of the letter 'n' to be quite sufficient for our purposes. In all seriousness, I can accept Canadian rates going up to better cover your costs. However, it appears by combining the classes you are having Canadian members subsidize the costs of international memberships. Unless I hear back from you with a valid rationale for this, I shall be writing a letter to CABA (our association), and posting in brewing forums (such as this) encouraging all Canadians to discontinue their memberships in the AHA. Hell hath no fury like a howling savage scorned. Anyway, let's get back to my good-natured side with Spencer Thomas' comments: > [Stick tongue firmly in cheek] > > Gee, I took my mutt to the dog show, and they told me it > wasn't a good poodle. But I love my mutt, she's the most > wonderful dog in the world? I looked at the rules, and my > mutt doesn't fit into ANY of the categories! Why can't dog > shows lighten up and stop being so focussed on conformity? > Why can't they be about how wonderful the dog is? > > [Remove tongue from cheek] Can we not all learn from the shining example set by the Miss Universe pageant? There is no Best Hispanic or Best Oriental awards presented there. Every year, the judges amaze me by being able to select the most beautiful, talented and articulate woman from an incredible variety of ethnic origins and backgrounds. I don't know how they do it, although I suspect it may have something to do with tongues being stuck in cheeks, as well. The original poster is right. All competitions should strive to be what the Miss Universe pageant is: truly classless. Finally, Rick Lassabe writes: > Oh, and Brian; thank you very much for your "public > service" you provided. I'm just glad you didn't let it slip > what the other forum was. Can you imagine how many of these > mean ole St. Pat bashers would have enjoyed the gratification > of bashing on another forum??? Indeed, there are already far too many bashers over in rec.crafts.brewi... Oh, wait a minute. You clever lad, you almost got me to reveal it, didn't you? Gotta get up pretty early to fool this worm (or something like that). Cheers Brian Lundeen Brewing (yes, I'm actually going to be brewing as you read this) at [314,829] aka Winnipeg Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 16:22:25 +0000 From: "Biffy The Brewer" <spargewater at hotmail.com> Subject: RE: Lynne/Business Bashing Someone wrote: "If Lynne is only concerned that her opinion or expertise won't carry much merit because she is the owner of a home brew supply house, or that it may hurt her business, why can't she just post under the name of Mark Twain at hotmailusa.com ( or something like that). By posting under another name, she get her point across and no one has to know who she isor if she owns a business. Of course if she did that, the "weasels" would criticize her for being "dishonest". She can't win with the weasel-types. Now I remember why I quit reading this thing for a couple of months. Between the negative-nellies who lambaste the vendors and the guys who want to make their own hop pellets, this forum is more annoying than listening to Bill Walton cover an NBA game. Biff Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 10:35:54 -0600 From: Paddock Wood Customer Service <experts at paddockwood.com> Subject: Carafa & De-Husked Carafa In Homebrew Digest #3918 (April 18, 2002) Darrell (leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu) asks if 225gm / 0.5lb Carafa is too much for Dark Lager. We use just over 1lb Carafa Special III for a 12 gallon (46L) batch in our Schwarzbier for an estimated 25 SRM. 1/2lb of Carafa II in 5 gallons is about the same. Did you use the de-husked versions? Carafa comes in 2 versions, "Carafa" and "Carafa Special". The Special is de-husked Carafa, which by reducing the bitterness may lead you taste a little less roast, although all the roasty flavors should still be there. http://www.weyermann.de/chocolatemalt.html cheers, Stephen Ross -- "Vitae sine cerevisiis sugant." Paddock Wood Brewing Supplies, Saskatoon, SK, Canada experts at paddockwood.com www.paddockwood.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 21:11:49 +0200 From: Arnaud VIEZ <arnaud at viez.net> Subject: Lower the pH ? First of all : thank you Tony, I am now a happy reader of both HBD and UK-Homebrew! My question to all happy homebrewers (one more time about water, this is a rather delicate subject to me): my tap water has a pH of about 8 (carbonates = 239 ppm). A lot of carbonates is removed by boiling, and that makes a nice mash water, with a pH of 6,8, and calcium added by the use of calcium chloride. But I wonder about the best way to get a nice sparge water, too; I find it difficult to lower the pH to the recommended value (5,2-5,5) only by adding gypsum and calcium chloride, because I need to add a lot of them to lower pH, and that results in a high rate of sulfate and chlorides. So my question : is it valuable to lower the pH with acids (citric acid or mixed acids from Brewferm), and could it have any adverse effect on the finished product? TIA, Arnaud. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 15:58:01 -0400 From: "Roy Strohl" <lstrohl at mwc.edu> Subject: quick disconnects - source Several homebrewers, most looking for quick disconnects, have noted the apparent closure of Moving Brews. I managed to break one of the disconnects that I had originally bought from Bill and went out on the Web to find replacements. I have recently purchased CPC HFC10635, 3/8" nominal flow, Polysulfone, 3/8" NPT male straight and the counterpart CPC HFC22635, 3/8" nominal flow, Polysulfone, 3/8" ID hose barbs from: Flo-Products Co.,2305 Millpark Drive,Maryland Heights, MO,63043-3529 telephone is (314) 428-4000, ask for inside sales www.flo-products.com I dealt with a gentleman named Jim Bresnahan. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 13:17:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Rama Roberts <rama at retro.eng.sun.com> Subject: re: Adventures in Bottleing Mark writes: The only real drawback is that after three weeks, there isn't a hint of carbonation. ... The problem may be that I didn't allow headspace in the neck of the bottle. ... Or perhaps it's the nature of Primetabs to take a while longer to ferment. ... Bottled and stored at 65 degrees. I haven't used a Philler or Primetabs, but my guess is you'll just need to be patient. If you're waiting to bottle another batch, try altering one or more test bottles with a combination of increasing the temperature, a larger head space (pour out a couple inches), and more sugars. That should reveal your problem the fastest. Just be sure to keep an eye on it so it doesn't blow up from over-priming. Rama Roberts San Francisco bay area Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 22:49:07 -0400 From: kingkelly at juno.com Subject: Beer Description Now, this isn't Bob Klein, but what a description! Sounds like one you can't resist. Michael Jackson writes about ANDERSON VALLEY HOP OTTIN IPA: Full gold to bronze color with a dense head. Sexy, fresh-sweet aromas, then lemony notes. The first mouthful is spritzy; then it gets rough, with almost abrasive hop flavors. It seems to finish with a quick surge, but leaves lemon-pith and grapefruit bitterness. American IPAs are ever more dizzying in their hoppy assertiveness. I love them, though they are a style apart. The British never sent anything quite like this to India, but the Hindus did provide us with Kama Sutra. Esther King President Star City Brewers Guild The Roanoke Valley, VA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 22:25:38 -0500 From: "Ryan and Shelly" <furstenau at worldnet.att.net> Subject: constant sparge flow rate I just ran my all grain system for the second time and for the second time, I was unable to maintain a constant sparge rate. I have a modified keg for the mash tun and 1/2" copper tubing draining the keg. The tubing goes to a ball valve with a 1/4" port and then back to 1/2" copper tubing and hooks up to plastic tubing into the kettle. The tubing goes all the way to the bottom of the kettle. Here is the problem. I start at at good rate of about 1 pt./minute, but as the level increases in the kettle, the sparge rate decreases. I am maintaining a constant liquid level in the mash tun of about 1" of water above the grain bed. Am I getting too much back pressure when the sparge tube gets submerged in the kettle? I have to keep opening up the ball valve to maintain flow. As soon as I pull the tube out of the wort, I get tons of flow! If the solution is to keep the tube out of the wort, how do I avoid hot side areation? Do I keep the tube pressed up against the side of the kettle? Please help. My 1st sparge took almost 90 minutes. I would like to shoot for 45 minutes. Ryan, Omaha, NE, USA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2002 20:31:21 -0700 (PDT) From: alastair <alastair at odin.he.net> Subject: HSA problem? I've had to come to the conclusion that the 'oxygen' in my basement must be somehow different from the typical brewing environment. I always considered HSA as the brewing equivalent of an urban legend and paid it little attention. However, increasingly there seems to be a movement afoot that strongly suggests we should worry about this 'apparent' problem. I use a separate mash and lauter tun and happily slap my hot grain and wort from one to the other. I also collect my runnings in a separate container and pour it from a good height into my kettle in what I now call the 'salute to those who believe in HSA'. So far I've not noticed any oxidation problems by doing this, hmm, maybe I'm lucky and my local oxygen is a kinder variety? Once I got racking/bottling down to a fine art, oxidation is of little concern, even with my brutal handling before fermentation. A stout I made well over six months ago just keeps getting better. After my usual slopping of hot mash between containers, pouring of hot wort and all those melanoidins, it should be ruined by now? However, after a couple of ribbons over the last few months, it came in third BOS at the last competition... I just don't get it. I think someone should point out that if HSA is a real effect, it is so subtle that no one need worry about it. There are far more important things to waste time and effort on! Happy brewing, Alastair Return to table of contents
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