HOMEBREW Digest #4218 Fri 11 April 2003

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  Wyeast - Ready or Not? ("Matt Harrington")
  Oily lingering bitterness (Hayes Antony)
  Re: Re: indoor boiling (Teresa Knezek)
  CO (Randy Ricchi)
  Campden Tablets ("A.J. deLange")
  RE: Where do you brew and what is in storage... ("Sven Pfitt")
  Beer Bottle Organ (Nathan Kanous)
  ALE vs Lager (Randy Ricchi)
  Re: Rescue Shelter Available... ("Pete Calinski")
  corn flakes (tm) and reusing yeast (Marc Sedam)
  source of excess iron - was: Fixing excess iron problems ("-S")
  Keg Refridgerator (IAN FORBES)
  Environmental brewing temperature ("Dave Burley")
  Moving Brews ("Marcoux, Eric P")
  SWMBO ("Tom White")
  Re: What's a lager? (NO Spam)
  RE: contents of beer cellar ("Dan Gross")
  slow fermentation / low attenuation (Mark Beck)
  Movin' On Up (Mark Guard)
  drill bit for stainless (Marc Sedam)
  secondary/priming combined in cornies??? ("Steve Dale-Johnson")
  brewing images to stained glass (Jim Liddil)
  4 gallons, not 5 (Steve Hanlon)
  Outdoor brewing (was Indoor boiling) ("Kevin Morgan")
  Re: Where do you brew? (mjkid)
  What's a lager? (Leo Vitt)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 00:56:10 -0400 From: "Matt Harrington" <mph1399 at hotmail.com> Subject: Wyeast - Ready or Not? Today is April 9, I have a Wyeast that I started yesterday that has already swelled to where the bag looks like it's going to pop. The date on it is Nov 10 2002. Should I use is now or wait the one day per month rule? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:34:39 +0200 From: Hayes Antony <HayesA at aforbes.co.za> Subject: Oily lingering bitterness In my quest to clean up my lagers, a new defect has surfaced. My latest attempt was described as having an oily lingering bitterness. Not too bitter, or astringent, or out of initial balance, but an unwelcome aftertaste. What is the likely cause? The beer was hopped to 30 IBUs, estimated using the Tinseth method 10% for 90 minutes 70% for 60 minutes 20% for 20 minutes Followed by a 20 minute whirlpool and 30 minute heat exchange. I used Tettnanger pellets at about 4,5% alpha acid. Ant Hayes Johannesburg Confidentiality Warning ======================= The contents of this e-mail and any accompanying documentation are confidential and any use thereof, in what ever form, by anyone other than the addressee is strictly prohibited. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 23:22:57 -0900 From: Teresa Knezek <teresa at mivox.com> Subject: Re: Re: indoor boiling On or thereabout 4/10/03, Barrett, Bob (R.A.) spoke thusly: >Teresa says she brews inside, but then she does it in her attached >garage. Unless it's heated by something other than her propane >burner, I would call that brewing outside. Umm, it's heated by the large, attached, warm mass sharing a wall with it, called the house. :-) Actually, due to the lousy job the owner/builders we bought the house from did on the furnace ductwork, it's also heated by backpressure from the leaky ductwork connections on the furnace. Last winter, before we re-did part of the ductwork, the garage was usually warmer than the house. > Teresa also thinks by living in Alaska you automatically qualify as >brewing in the coldest place on earth. Actually, I think Talkeetna, Alaska enjoys the distinction of the coldest recorded temperatures of any year-round non-research/industrial-facility human settlement (which excludes the South Pole research station, and Prudhoe Bay's oil facilities). At least that's what I've heard. I don't know anyone from Talkeetna though, so I can't say whether or not anyone brews there. But Fairbanks does spend most of the winter below zero, and Two Rivers is actually usually about 5-10 deg. colder than the recorded temps for Fairbanks, because the airport (where the weather is recorded) is in a low, warm spot. - -- ::Teresa : Two Rivers, Alaska:: [2849, 325] Apparent Rennerian "It has been my experience that folks who have no vices have very few virtues." -- Abraham Lincoln Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:22:08 -0400 From: Randy Ricchi <rricchi at houghton.k12.mi.us> Subject: CO Jeff R. mentioned in yesterdays HBD that the CO from these cast iron burners we all use can build up pretty fast. I don't doubt that he's right. What I am wondering is will the CO output be significantly lower if the burner is turned down low as compared to when it is opened way up and roaring. The reason I ask is I have been experimenting this winter (I brew in my basement) with covered boils. I use sankey half barrels for boiling, and I find that I can completely cover the keg with the lid from my 10 gallon Vollrath pot. The steam escapes through the handles on the side of the keg. There is enough back pressure that I can get a vigorous boil (without boiling over) with the flame turned WAY down from where I would have to have it if the keg wasn't covered. With this arrangement I am now getting the 10% evaporation rate that George Fix used to promote (as opposed to my usual 20+%), I am using far less propane, and I assume I am getting less darkening of the wort, all while achieving a good, kicking boil. But what about the CO output? I assume it would be lower as well. Randy Hancock MI Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 12:35:15 +0000 From: "A.J. deLange" <ajdel at cox.net> Subject: Campden Tablets For Peter: The number of Campden tablets required depends on 1)whether they contain the potssium or sodium salt 2) how much they weigh 3) how much total chlorine is in the water 4) what fraction of the total chlorine is free and what fraction is bound as chloramine. Taking all these factors into accout the 1 tablet per 20 gallons number was concocted as being sufficient for nearly all conceivable combinations of 1 - 4. It is overkill in most cases but since the excess metabite winds up as sulfur dioxide (which will either reduce something in the mash - generally considered a desireable thing) or be expelled during the boil a little overage is not problematical. Test kits for chlorine (types which only test the total and types which distinguish between chlorine and chloramine) are readily available at pet stores that sell fish. It would be a simple matter to experimentally determine how much metabite is needed. For example, one could put in a quarter of a tablet, test, add another quarter if necessary, test and so on. Note that Campden tablets are not exactly easy to dissolve. Crushing them first makes it a little easier but it is likely that there will be small bits floating around even after extensive stirring. This is OK. A.J. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:54:03 -0400 From: "Sven Pfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com> Subject: RE: Where do you brew and what is in storage... I generally brew outside even in the winter which can get as cold as -15F, but I don't brew then. If it is below 40F I wait for better weather. My biggest issue is rain. If it is raining, I can brew in the garage with the door all the way up so I have a 6' X 10' opening. I set up a fan to blow the steam out. My main stores (recently bottled) are: Belgian Strong Golden Ale 1.102 Belgian Strong Dark ale 1.092 Belgian trippel 1.082 Rasberry Strawberry Saison (super) 1.079 Rasberry Currant Saison (super) 1.079 Belgian Grand Cru 1.091 Belgian Wit (super)1.069 Belgian Wit 1.050 along with some remnants from last year. I will continue brewing through the summer for lighter beer to keep in kegs in the refrigerator. Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery http://thegimp.8k.com Johnson City, TN [422.7, 169.2] Rennerian "Fools you are... who say you like to learn from your mistakes.... I prefer to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid the cost of my own." Otto von Bismarck Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:06:28 -0500 From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu> Subject: Beer Bottle Organ Fun with beer bottles.....audio clips in the right hand column. nathan in madison, wi http://www.petersontuners.com/news/bbo/index.cfm Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 09:18:45 -0400 From: Randy Ricchi <rricchi at houghton.k12.mi.us> Subject: ALE vs Lager Ed Dorn asked about explaining the differences between ale vs. lager to non-brewers from the drinkers perspective. I think from that perspective, the first thing that comes to my mind is esters (ale) vs. clean (lack of esters) lager. Even then, you can think of some style that will muddy the differentiation, such as kolsch or alt (ales that are fairly clean), but overall, I think esters vs lack of esters is a pretty good distinction. Randy Hancock, MI Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 09:34:59 -0400 From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net> Subject: Re: Rescue Shelter Available... Reminds me of the add in the newspaper. "Wanted, woman for long term relationship. Must like drinking beer, brewing beer and have own brewing equipment. Contact via box 123. Send photo of brewing equipment and sample of beer." Ok, Ok, I took some poetic license here. The add really asked for a woman that fished and had a boat. It said to send a picture of the boat. Pete Calinski East Amherst NY Near Buffalo NY *********************************************************** *My goal: * Go through life and never drink the same beer twice. * (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.) *********************************************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 09:45:56 -0400 From: Marc Sedam <marc_sedam at unc.edu> Subject: corn flakes (tm) and reusing yeast If you're intending to use breakfast cereal for your corn addition in a CAP, a large box will do nicely. You should use it just as Jeff uses polenta in his recipe. Whatever weight of corn the recipe states, use that weight of corn flakes. One suggestion I'll make is to crush the hell out of the flakes while sealed in the bag. That will help them dissolve in the mash. For the record I added 1/4lb of puffed corn cereal in my recent Rochefort 6 clone (was supposed to be a reproduction of the great Rochefort 8 experiment done by our friends in the Netherlands, but forgot to notice their recipes were for 2.5 gallons...damn metric system). Worked fine. Oh...and I'd use shredded wheat for the Belgian. As for reusing yeast from a dark to a light batch, there's no real problem. On a volume basis you'll barely get a color change. If this really bothers you in concept, then boil and cool a few quarts of water and wash the yeast. Add a quart of sterilized water to your yeast, shake like hell, and let the yeast settle. Decant the water on top. Repeat until you feel better. But really, don't worry about it. I've fermented a schwarzbier then dumped a CAP on it and did not notice any serious color change. - -- Marc Sedam Chapel Hill, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 10:58:01 -0400 From: "-S" <-s at adelphia.net> Subject: source of excess iron - was: Fixing excess iron problems Mike Sharp writes ... > However, I think world-wide, the main cause of iron in >drinking water is from steel or iron piping systems, i I seriously doubt that Mike - tho' I appreciate your otherwise excellent advice. Iron is the 4th most abundant atom in the earth's crust and I've seen bits of shale often containing very high levels of iron from all over the great lakes region . There are dozens and dozens of USGS reports on iron in aquifers from New England to New Mexico. Iron in aquifers is common. In the transition areas of low to higher oxygen conditions in water at moderate pH conditions a number of bacteria oxidize iron and reduce sulfate to sulfide. This reduces the water's pH and can lead to higher dissolved iron levels as well as sulfurous aromas. Anyone (In the US) interested in exploring their ground water has excellent on-line resources at USGS. http://capp.water.usgs.gov/gwa/gwa.html -S Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:39:52 -0700 (PDT) From: IAN FORBES <ianforbes at snet.net> Subject: Keg Refridgerator I have moved into an apartment and no longer have room for 2 refrigerators. I was wondering who has converted a small fridge or chest freezer into a dedicated keg fridge. Please feel free to provide details - like size of fridge, make, model, how many kegs, how did you set it up, web links etc. Thanks,Ian Meriden, CT (formerly of Hamden, CT) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 12:24:29 -0400 From: "Dave Burley" <Dave_Burley at charter.net> Subject: Environmental brewing temperature Brewsters, Jim Bermingham brews in Texas in his garage at 105F, Mark Sedam doesn't brew in the summer as it too hot. Some Northerners are still thawing out their noses in May. I just turn on the air conditioning in my vent hooded brewery/winery when it is too hot and the heater when it is too cold ( which it rarely is) . When necessary, fermentation is carried out in a temperature controlled fridge or freezer. Ain't I lucky! Keep on Brewin' Dave Burley Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 11:26:58 -0500 From: "Marcoux, Eric P" <EPMarcoux at pbsj.com> Subject: Moving Brews Hello all, I am putting together a RIMS system and I was interested in purchasing the RIMS chamber from Moving Brews. Unfortunately they seem to be out of business. Is there another source for these? If not I guess I'll be making my own out of copper. Thanks for any help. Eric Marcoux GIS Analyst Beltsville, MD 20705 1 (800) 697-7275 Ext. 296 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 13:53:53 -0400 From: "Tom White" <twhite at dminsite.com> Subject: SWMBO Does SWMBO stand for "She Who Makes Brewing Obligatory"? - --Tom "Health is overrated." Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 14:13:41 -0400 From: NO Spam <nospam at brewbyyou.net> Subject: Re: What's a lager? >"I have some ideas of my own which may or may not be true; >something along the lines of ales being more full-bodied and aromatic, >while lagers I perceive as crisper. But I'm really stumped to try to >explain the difference as perceived by the drinker. Any ideas from the >collective? The first part is not true. It is true that when the average Joe Sixpack thinks of beer, he almost always thinks of Miller Lite, Coors Lite, Bud, and that stuff. That's because they bombard us constantly with ads, and things like Spuds MacKenzie or the Swedish Bikini team, who we all love. But ales are not always more full bodied and/or aromatic than lagers. Lager styles include the bock family, Bock Beer and all its kin - Dopplebock, Maibock, Helles Bock, and Eisbock. (Weizenbock isn't a lager or really a bock). These lager styles are not all light in color or body, and are certainly more full bodied than many, if not most, ale styles. Lager styles also include Schwarzbier, Munich Dunkel, and things like Samichlaus, which claims to be the world's strongest lager - says so right on the bottle in German - "Das Starkste Bier Der Welt" or "The Strongest Beer in the World". I'm not sure where the pre-conception about dark beers always being ale or dark beers alway s being stronger comes from. Its not true, but I have run it to it myself. Lagers CAN be crisper, but again, that's not always the case. Pilseners are crisp, bocks are not. Lagers CAN be lighter in color, but again, that's not always the case. It gets further complicated by the fact that some big breweries advertise lagers as ales, or lead people to believe that lagers are ales. Killian's Red is a prime example of that. How many average Joe Sixpacks think Killian's is ale, because its "dark", and how many even know that its not even Irish, but brewed by that great Irish brewery O'Coors, in Golden, Colorado? Breweries play alot of games in competing with each other. Double Diamond is another one. I SWEAR there is no way that's an ale. It is way too smooth. I think that is actually a lager, but it says ale, right on the label. I'd say as a rule, in general, ales "have more esters" or are "a little fruitier", due to the yeast strains and fermentation temps. But even that is not always true. Altbiers can be as smooth as lagers, because they're aged cold, like lagers. But they're fermented with ale yeast. And California Common, even though it is fermented with lager yeast, is not very lager-like. Comparing the general category of "Ale" to the general category of "Lager" is comparing apples and IBM's. It's too general. You have to take each on a case by case basis. Bill Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 14:34:49 -0400 From: "Dan Gross" <degross at starpower.net> Subject: RE: contents of beer cellar Marc Sedam asks for a list beers in the cellar. Currently I have: American Amber English Stout Belgian Strong Ale CAP (my very first, in the secondary now for about three weeks) Also, I have a brand new baby boy, less than two days old, but he's not in the cellar ;) Dan Gross Olney, Md Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 12:01:06 -0700 From: Mark Beck <beckmk at whitman.edu> Subject: slow fermentation / low attenuation I've got about 6 all-grain batches under my belt after many years of extract brewing. However, with my all-grain batches I've noticed that my fermentations seem to be taking much longer than they did when I brewed with extract. For example: I've got an IPA that I brewed 12 days ago. It's still fermenting quite strongly (foam on the top, maybe 3 or 4 bubbles from the airlock per minute). In my extract days, this beer would have fermented out in a week; now at nearly two weeks it continues to ferment. I also recently brewed a Belgian triple using White labs abbey yeast (OG 1.083). After nearly three weeks in the primary (2 weeks of that it was held at 75 deg.) the gravity had only dropped to 1.040. I'm hoping it will drop more in the secondary, but there's not much activity now. Some details about my brewing: I have always done single step infusion mashes lasting 1 hour. I mashed the IPA at 154 deg., and the triple at 151 deg. Using the formulas in Ray Daniels' book, I calculate that my mash efficiencies are around 75%. I make 1 pint yeast starters, and in both batches mentioned above I had vigorous fermentations less than 12 hours after pitching. I have temperature control of my primary. The IPA has been at 68 deg. for two weeks; as stated above the triple was at 75 deg for nearly 2 weeks (when I had to make room for the IPA) and then the temperature of the triple dropped to basement temp (60-65 deg.) Why are these beers fermenting so much slower than my extract beers did? I first thought of low pitching rates and cool temperatures, but I've been making starters (which I didn't bother with before) and I've got the temp control system. Neither of these improvements has helped. Would a multi-step mash help? Would this provide more yeast nutrients? Could I just add yeast nutrient to my boils? Any suggestions would be appreciated. Mark Beck Walla Walla, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 13:02:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Mark Guard <rbaronsfan at yahoo.com> Subject: Movin' On Up Greetings, I have been brewing 5 gal all grain batches for several years now and would like to move up to 10 gal and I am looking for advice on a mashtun. Currently I mash in a 5 gal SS pot with EZ-Masher, heating my sparge water in a 2nd 5 gal pot. I have a 10 gal Polarware kettle (no spigot or anything) for boiling. I mash on stovetop, maintain temp by putting mashtun in oven and move sparge water via a 1/2 gal plastic measuring cup the good old fashioned way - manually. My plan is to beg, borrow or obtain from my local scrapyard a 1/2 barrel Sanke for my new boil kettle, maybe adding a spigot. But my inquiry here is about a new mash tun. I had thought for sometime now that I would just get a 10 gal Gott w/false bottom & spigot attached from BBMB (or install a Bazooka screen). But recently I've started thinking about the mash/lauter tun from Hobby Beverage Equipment (www.minibrew.com - their ads appear in Zymurgy). This is a plastic tun with built in false bottom Does anyone have any experience with this product? They say it holds up to 35 lbs of grain, more than a 10 gal Gott I believe. It also has a sight glass and a sparge head to distribute the hot liquor. Does this item hold mash temps well? I doubt that it would hold steady mash temp as well as a cooler designed for this but would there be much of a difference? How big of a spigot does it have (1/2 in??? - web site doesn't say)? I'll probably stick to manually ladling the sparge water for now... one thing at a time but at some later point wish to add a HLT to mechanize (or de-laborize) my workload some. Thanks for any help you can lend. Steve Nagley Old Forge, Pa (421.4 , 98.7 AR) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:43:23 -0400 From: Marc Sedam <marc_sedam at unc.edu> Subject: drill bit for stainless Hey all, I was searching the archives for drilling holes in stainless steel and Zymie suggested using a step-drill bit. I found two...one called a Unibit and another from Greenlee. Both will drill holes between 1/8 and 7/8". Did anyone actually do this? If so could you tell me which one you used so I know what definitely would work? The Unibit is made of molybdenum and coated with titanium, so I think that will work. The Greenlee bit was black with no mention of its composition. Could you respond to me directly as well as to the HBD? I have holes to punch this weekend. - -- Marc Sedam Chapel Hill, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 13:56:17 -0700 From: "Steve Dale-Johnson" <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com> Subject: secondary/priming combined in cornies??? My first post somehow got mangled, so let's try this again... I usually transfer to a glass secondary after the rapid fermentation has shortened the dip tubes on a few of my cornies to try priming for carbonation (after overcarbing a brown ale and getting a metallic taste) and I am flirting with the idea of combining the secondary and priming stages using a beer still at +\- 1.020 (an ale five days into primary) and about 1/2 the normal dextrose. Anyone doing this now?? Any concerns with overcarbonation or long-term autolysis from the slightly larger yeast residue??? Steve Dale-Johnson Brewing at (1918, 298) Miles Apparent Rennerian Vancouver, BC, Canada. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 17:09:18 -0400 From: Jim Liddil <jliddil at vms.arizona.edu> Subject: brewing images to stained glass I am looking for images or images of windows similar to that found on the apr/may issue of Ale Street News or like that at http://www.cmg.net/belgium/clubhub/message/. any body got any other similar designs or know of clip art collections that might contain such stuff? Jim Liddil North Haven, CT Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 17:50:28 -0400 From: Steve Hanlon <asciibaron at comcast.net> Subject: 4 gallons, not 5 my wort has been fermenting since the 4th in 4 gallons, not the full 5. seems i got distracted when my 2 yr old son came home. in my rush to get it out of the way, i forgot to add the final gallon. is my beer ruined? will it simply be very strong? please advise -steve Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:15:39 -0400 From: "Kevin Morgan" <kevin.morgan2 at verizon.net> Subject: Outdoor brewing (was Indoor boiling) For those of you that brew outside in below freezing weather, how do you chill your wort? This past winter I tried brewing out in the cold, then my garden hose froze solid while I was trying to chill the wort with my counter flow chiller. Of course this would also be a problem with an immersion chiller. Kevin, brewing in south jersey Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 20:24:56 -0400 From: mjkid at rochester.rr.com Subject: Re: Where do you brew? Greetings, As a long time subscriber and lurker who has very recently returned to brewing, I thought I'd chime in on this one. I stopped brewing for several years because it didn't work out in our townhouse. Way too cramped in the kitchen, and the basement...the less said about the basement, the better. Two years ago we bought a house, an old house, with a finished basement, with a full kitchen. Unfortunately, it was carpeted, and beer making and carpet do not a good combination make;-) So, last fall I finally got rid of the carpet and had the floor retiled. (Actually, I had to-our hot water tank burst while we were on vacation and ruined the carpet). So I now have my own kitchen to brew in! Plus, our family room is down there as well, so I have tunes and a big screen TV to pass the time while mashing and boiling. Makes brewing really enjoyable, and SWMBO doesn't have me cluttering up the upstairs kitchen. And I do a lot less lugging around of carboys, etc. Mike Kidulich 320.8, 76.8 AR Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 17:31:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Leo Vitt <leo_vitt at yahoo.com> Subject: What's a lager? Ed Dorn is looking for a description that explains the difference between lager and ale to a consumer. >not true. I have some ideas of my own which may or may not be true; >something along the lines of ales being more full-bodied and aromatic, >while lagers I perceive as crisper. Full bodied -- There are some very full bodied lagers. Doppelbocks, Icebocks, special lagers like EUK 28, Samiclaus. Sometimes I want to say - fruity esters are present in ales and abscent in lagers. However, there are exceptions about ales made like lagers - cream ale, Kolsch, alt. Some ales have more hop character than lagers. Belgian ales usually don't, Scottish dont. Pilsners can have a lot of hop character. It seems every way you might describe it, has exceptions. Ed, I don't have the answer for you either. - ---------- Boil inside or out? My history is more out if weather is near or above freezing. I have not made beer yet in the two months I have been in Nebraska. My brewing history is in southern Minnesota. I have been reluctant to boil in the garage, because I expect streem to become ice in the garage, causing damage to the building. When boiling inside (on the kitchen stovetop), I run the vent from the heat up to boil until well after the pot is removed from the kitchen. ===== Leo Vitt Sidney, NE Return to table of contents
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