HOMEBREW Digest #4279 Tue 24 June 2003

[Prev HBD] [Index] [Next HBD] [Back]

		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org


          Northern  Brewer, Ltd. Home Brew Supplies
        http://www.northernbrewer.com  1-800-681-2739

    Support those who support you! Visit our sponsor's site!
********** Also visit http://hbd.org/hbdsponsors.html *********

  Reports on National Homebrewers Conference? (David Radwin)
  brewery automation (J & B Gallihue)
  Scottish Ale (darrell.leavitt)
  HB shop back in buisness.. ("Eyre")
  Stupid Brewer Tricks (Todd Goodman)
  Re: Smoking, enough already (Michael Hartsock)
  ss turkey fryer (Michael Hartsock)
  Lemongrass (Alan Meeker)
  Barley.. ("Eyre")
  Re: ok, now back to Brewing: (Teresa Knezek)
  Re: Issue Number 5 ("Mike Sharp")
  Beer Poll(s) ("Steve Dale-Johnson")
  Lemongrass Wheat ("Steve Dale-Johnson")
  Re: Lemongrass ("Jeff Swearengin")
  Brewing with Kids ("Lee and Ant Hayes")
  Chili Cascade Beano Ale (David Wilbur)
  Fridge Drilling Horror Stories ("Dave Larsen")
  Herms wiring (bruce.dir)
  Porcelain repair and Lemongrass ("Jerry Sadowski")
  Rock Bottom discount card ("Leonard, Phil")
  Altbier ("Greg R")
  Greed?/Correction (Donald and Melissa Hellen)
  Brew Tree (Paul Mahoney)
  Substance Dependence ("Edward D")
  Re:  Alcoholism ("Dan McFeeley")

* * Show your HBD pride! Wear an HBD Badge! * http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/shopping * * The HBD Logo Store is now open! * http://www.hbd.org/store.html * * Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy! * Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org FROM THE E-MAIL ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!** IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, you cannot subscribe to the digest as we cannot reach you. We will not correct your address for the automation - that's your job. HAVING TROUBLE posting, subscribing or unsusubscribing? See the HBD FAQ at http://hbd.org. The HBD is a copyrighted document. The compilation is copyright HBD.ORG. Individual postings are copyright by their authors. ASK before reproducing and you'll rarely have trouble. Digest content cannot be reproduced by any means for sale or profit. More information is available by sending the word "info" to req at hbd.org or read the HBD FAQ at http://hbd.org. JANITOR on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 22:20:46 -0700 From: David Radwin <dradwin at sbcglobal.net> Subject: Reports on National Homebrewers Conference? > From: "Steve Jones" <stjones1 at chartertn.net> > > PS - Those of you who missed the conference really missed > out on the best homebrew event of all time. Those Chicago > folks really raised the bar for upcoming conferences. Steve and other attendees, would you mind taking a few minutes to share with the group what you did at the conference and why you liked it? In other words, what made the experience worth the time, expense, and travel? This is not any sort of challenge, it is just a sincere request for information. Thanks, David - -- David Radwin in Berkeley CA news at removethispart.davidradwin.com Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 05:55:48 -0400 From: J & B Gallihue <jgallihue at comcast.net> Subject: brewery automation Folks, I spent a sunday screwing around with our broken icemaker and determined the solenoid controlled water inlet valve needed to be replaced. Not too bad for a city planner. Now that I understand how these valves work I can better understand the automated RIMS and HERMS systems out there. If I can resist the temptation to rush out to buy a PID, the do-it-yourself repair will be justified. : -) http://fixitnow.com/sbrvrs/icemakers.htm Joel Gallihue Columbia, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 06:19:38 -0400 From: darrell.leavitt at plattsburgh.edu Subject: Scottish Ale David < david.j.edge at ntlworld.com > : you are right...the names of my brews usually follow from the name of the yeast used,...and I don't usually pay real close attention to style..but never the less I think it will be good.. I am sorry that I no longer have the bag that the peated malt came from so I cannot determine its degree of smokiness...I believe that it was Weyerman's... ..Darrell Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 09:21:49 -0400 From: "Eyre" <meyre at sbcglobal.net> Subject: HB shop back in buisness.. Good news! That HB shop that I pronounced dead a few weeks ago? Sure enough, she came back to life. I got a post from a fellow in the area a few days after I made the pronouncment, telling me that he thought they might not be closing, but rather just moving. Sure enough, in a bigger, barn shaped building out in the back of the old place is the new shop. They have a big banner up now letting everyone know they've moved.. before, they didn't really advertise the HB aspect to much. Very little, in fact. Maybe they'll give it a better installation this time around, instead of the cement block dark room way in the back. The place is called Wine and Beer Art, and it's on Route 202 in Torrington, CT, for any lurkers out there.. Mike meyre at sbcglobal.net Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 09:30:23 -0400 From: Todd Goodman <tsg at bonedaddy.net> Subject: Stupid Brewer Tricks Well, I can no longer laugh quietly in the background with smug assurance that *I* would never do something so stupid when others post a stupid brewer trick. I have just finished getting my new brewroom cleaned up enough to begin brewing again after moving everything out of the house while work was being done on it. I decided to brew a CACA as my inaugural batch. I had concerns about the yeast as it was over a year old, but a starter made Tuesday assured me that it was in good shape once started. I printed out my recipe from Promash and brought it down to the brewery and started to mash. Hmm, temps don't seem right. I've never had any trouble keeping it cool enough for mashin before (DOH!) Well after an hour of mashing I finally realized I'd succumbed to my own Mars Lander Debacle. All the temps were printed out in Celsius! Yeah, I was mashing way too cool! How could anyone be so stupid? Am I brain dead? I knew it was wrong, why didn't I double check? Well I bumped the temp and mashed at a more proper temperature. I suppose it will be thin and not very malty. I guess I'll just call it a "Lite" beer and give it to the neighbors. All I can say is that I'm now on the road to recovery and have accepted that I have a problem. Yes, I'm an equipment and ingredient abuser. All my equipment and ingredients have sat (ingredients in freezer and airtight containers) for far too long. They've been neglected and I just feel terrible about it. I'm just glad I received my wake up call before someone got hurt. I'll definately be brewing more often now so that I don't make a stupid mistake like that again. Todd Brewing again in Westford, MA [630.3, 84 Apparent Rennerian] Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 06:55:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Hartsock <xd_haze at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Smoking, enough already A small correction: The ads maligning SUV owners with terrorism were a spoof on the ads that maligned marijuana smoke with terrorism. Remember the widely distributed adds about the kids smoking pot and fueling terrorism. The ads about the SUV owners were illustrating the absurdity of connecting marijuana smoking with terrorism (because if that was a close link then people that buy gas must be bedfellows with terrorists). Besides, it was 'dubya' who said that the growing popularity of gas guzzling SUVs and the like that entrenched a greater dependence on nations like Iraq. By the by... The homeland security act did more to devastate personal liberty than the Clinton Admin could shake a fist at. Michael University of Missouri-Columbia ===== "May those who love us, love us. And those that don't love us, May God turn their hearts. And if he doesn't turn their hearts, may he turn their ankles So we'll know them by their limping." Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 06:59:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Hartsock <xd_haze at yahoo.com> Subject: ss turkey fryer I am going to be very impressed if someone got a 7 gallon and burner for $30. It is probably aluminum. If it is Al, then it is fine for brewing (its what i use) but I don't recommend using it for fermentation. IF it really is a seven gallon SS pot for $30, where did you get it!!! Michael Columbia, MO ===== "May those who love us, love us. And those that don't love us, May God turn their hearts. And if he doesn't turn their hearts, may he turn their ankles So we'll know them by their limping." Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:34:10 -0400 From: Alan Meeker <ameeker at mail.jhmi.edu> Subject: Lemongrass Steve Jones is thinking about using dried lemon grass to spice up a wheat beer: Steve, as with many herbs and spices fresh beats out dried by a mile. This is certainly true of lemongrass. If you can find some whole stalks locally I think you will get superior results. This is a common item at Asian grocery stores. There are also web-based sources, such as Thai grocery.com but these will be pricey. If you can get fresh, you want to strip off the dried outer leaves and use the thick part of the stalk down near the base. The lemongrass flavor survives pretty well during a short boil so you can probably treat it as you would a finishing hop - throw it in about 10 minutes before the end of the boil. You might also want to reserve some for "dry-grassing." as well. Good luck! -Alan Meeker Lazy Eight Attobrewery Baltimore, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 11:18:24 -0400 From: "Eyre" <meyre at sbcglobal.net> Subject: Barley.. I'm looking for a website or some such resourse, to more familiarize myselr with the different types/brands/varieties/colors/countries/etc etc of barley.. but it's sorely lacking on the net, from what I can find. Other than a little blub I got off BYO's site, I'm a bit at a loss. Anyone have any good info on this stuff?? Mike meyre at sbcglobal.net Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 08:58:18 -0800 From: Teresa Knezek <teresa at mivox.com> Subject: Re: ok, now back to Brewing: On or thereabout 6/23/03, darrell.leavitt at plattsburgh.edu spoke thusly: >1 oz Tet (17 or so IBU) at start of 60 > >no finish hops.... I use an ounce of hallertauer at the very end of the boil. Drop it in, then turn the burner off. >wlp300 Hefe vial...1st use... Personally, the first time I did a hefe with a "proper" hefeweisen yeast, the result was a beer far too spicy/fruity for my tastes. The next time around, I used the same recipe, the yeast I saved from the first hefe (I've become a big fan of 'yeast washing' lately), and tossed in a couple packets of Coopers dry yeast with it... it toned down the yeast flavors, but left enough fruitiness to make it unmistakably hefeweisen. That's just me, but the beer gets raves from all the non-brewers I feed it to, and even garners compliments from a non-hefe drinking homebrewer of my acquaintance. - -- Teresa - Two Rivers, Alaska [2849, 325] Appt. Rennerian visit http://rant.mivox.com/ - mostly stuff and nonsense "It has been my experience that folks who have no vices have very few virtues." -- Abraham Lincoln Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:07:54 -0700 From: "Mike Sharp" <rdcpro at hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Issue Number 5 David Perez ruins my day with issue #5: Substance Dependence: (5) a great deal of time is spent in activities necessary to obtain the substance (e.g., visiting multiple doctors or driving long distances), use the substance (e.g., chain-smoking), or recover from its effects Damn. Does that mean I have to give up all-grain, and go back to extract brewing?? ;^) Mike Sharp Kent, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:30:54 -0700 From: "Steve Dale-Johnson" <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com> Subject: Beer Poll(s) Mike Eyre asked... Off the top of your head, what were the ABV %'s of your, say.. last three (3) homebrewed beers? Irish Red ale from 1.044 to 1.011, or approx. 4.28 % ABV Hefeweizen from 1.049 to 1.012, or approx. 4.81 % ABV Czech Pils from 1.048 to 1.009, or approx. 5.08 % Prior to that was a draught bitter at 1.033 to 1.010 (2.98 % ABV) and a tropical stout 1.054 to 1.012 (5.47%) Have to say most of mine are lower gravity rather than higher, but in the mid 1.040's to get a good body and flavor. I got off the high-test brew when I realized that the taste I didn't like in my brew was the esters from pushing it up to 7%+, and that the high-test limited me to only a pint before I was noticing the effects. My daily consumption, BTW, is 1-2 pints. Normally just one. Steve Dale-Johnson Brewing at (1918 miles, 298 degrees) Rennerian Delta (Vancouver), BC, Canada. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:38:10 -0700 From: "Steve Dale-Johnson" <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com> Subject: Lemongrass Wheat Steve Jones asks about making a Lemongrass Wheat. Sounds like a great idea. I have used lemongrass with other herbs (green tea, lemon verbena and mint) to make a "tea" before, and you can just pour boiling water over it and steep. If it's fresh, mincing it first helps. No tannins or off flavours to worry about. You can probably just add the tea to your wort. The other one that might be good in a wheat is lemon verbena. Very subtle, even in a tea. Left mine out in the cold over the winter and it died, though. Steve Dale-Johnson Brewing at (1918 miles, 298 degrees) Rennerian Delta (Vancouver), BC, Canada. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 13:15:13 -0500 From: "Jeff Swearengin" <beertracker at cox.net> Subject: Re: Lemongrass Steve, Was it the Outer Banks Brewing Lemongrass Wheat that you had? I've experimented with lemongrass on a couple of occasions & fresh is better than dried. I recently made a Lemongrass Wheatwine using 1.27oz. (36g) of fresh lemongrass in the secondary for a 5 gallon batch. I have a friend that's a chef at a local Chinese/Asian Kitchen & he suggested that I use only fresh lemongrass for better aroma. The kitchen makes a lemongrass tea that I really enjoy & they use ONLY fresh lemongrass tips (the top 4" or so) in it. After chopping the lemongrass into small pieces, I made a "lemongrass tea" & added it along with my dry hops to the secondary. The wheatwine ended up being very citrusy & received good marks (41 points) in the 1st Round of the 2003 AHA NHC. My wheatwine didn't have any luck up in Chicago, but the BIG BEER fans here in my neck of the woods have enjoyed it. Everyone that I've talked to so far thoroughly enjoyed this year's conference. Regrettably, I couldn't be there. However, I do remember meeting you in Texas last year at the conference & hopefully I'll see you again in Las Vegas. In my opinion, the wheat & lemongrass makes for an interesting combination. I hope SWMBO enjoys! CHEERS! Jeff "Life is too short, so exercise less & drink more!" --- Michael Jackson, The Beer Hunter Jeff Swearengin, FOAM Ex-Officio Officer, BJCP Judge, AHA 'Beer-Evange-ALE-ist' Fellowship of Oklahoma Ale Makers (FOAM), Est. 1984, Tulsa, OK beertracker at alemakers.com www.alemakers.com >From Homebrew Digest #4278 (June 23, 2003) Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 19:53:45 -0400 From: "Steve Jones" <stjones1 at chartertn.net> Subject: Lemongrass Let's get back to the subject of brewing. I had a beer last year at a brew festival called a Lemongrass wheat. I don't remember who the brewery was, but the guy serving said they really used Lemongrass, and not some spice or extract or something. SWMBO has asked me to try to brew it, and I'm planning to do so this week. However, I got to wondering how to use the lemongrass, and how much. She picked some up at the natural food store (dried), and I'm thinking there are a few different ways it could be used. 1. 'dry-grassed' in the secondary (how to ensure sanitization?) 2. Steep it in 180F water for 15 minutes, then add the water to the secondary. 3. Add it to the end of the boil. Has anybody used it before? Any suggestions? Steve I've been at [207.8, 265.3] AR until this morning - now back at [421.8, 168.5] PS - Those of you who missed the conference really missed out on the best homebrew event of all time. Those Chicago folks really raised the bar for upcoming conferences. BTW, each conference location is announced at the prior conference, and this year it was announced that next years conference will be in Las Vegas. I've been at [207.8, 265.3] AR until this morning - now back at [421.8, 168.5] Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 20:46:58 +0200 From: "Lee and Ant Hayes" <anleo at worldonline.co.za> Subject: Brewing with Kids I have read the comments made about kids killing a homebrew hobby with interest. My wife gave birth to twins on 14 April, and I have noticed the sudden lack of time. However, I managed to brew on Saturday without too much adjustment and I am now confident that I can keep up brewing at least once a month. The main trick was to coincide my brew schedule with their eat and sleep schedule. It pushed my brew day out to eight hours, and I cut a few corners - but I got to brew. The main sacrifice was to go from a multi-step mash to a 120 minute single infusion mash, followed by a mash out. Maintaining temperature was not possible as I was doing baby stuff at that time. I also went for one hop addition, for similar reasons. Otherwise, things went pretty much as before. I have discovered that I wasted a lot of time before. So now I am going through all of my recipes to see how I can adjust them to fit those parameters, and it is not turning out to be as difficult as I thought. So I challenge the guys who gave up brewing because of kids to have a rethink. Ant Hayes Johannesburg Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 12:13:18 -0700 From: David Wilbur <dave at infolure.com> Subject: Chili Cascade Beano Ale I've read a lot of complaints about "proper" beer ingredients here recently. Check this out: http://www.thinkgeek.com/stuff/looflirpa/beer.shtml -Dave Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 19:30:55 +0000 From: "Dave Larsen" <hunahpumonkey at hotmail.com> Subject: Fridge Drilling Horror Stories Maybe I just got lucky drilling my fridge, and did not hit anything. However, I got a number of horror stories via email from people drilling their own fridges as a result of my post, including the top of the fridge where I was planning on putting a draft tower. All I can say is be careful and drill at your own risk. Dave Tucson, AZ Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:02:08 -0500 From: bruce.dir at TAP.com Subject: Herms wiring HBD, I am beginning to wire my HERMS system and wanted some feedback from members. I have decided to run the system by only brining in 125v into my project box (12x12 NEMA metal enclosure). I wanted to easily take the system to brew-in's and Big brew without requiring the host to supply 240v service. As a result I will use 2 x 5500 watt 240v heating elements which I realize will only run at about a third of full power. Question: 1. Can I connect these two elements into one plug (in to box). I have one PID that will control the HLT via a 25 Omega SS relay which inturn powers the heater recepticles on the box. 2. If not and I create two separate plugs, one for each element, can I run two 125v recepticles on the box to one SS relay? or will I need to get another relay so that each heater is controlled by its own relay with signal from one PID. thanks Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:27:46 -0500 From: "Jerry Sadowski" <jsadow1 at msn.com> Subject: Porcelain repair and Lemongrass I've used the Loctite/Duro Porcelain Repair product that Bill Tobler mentions. It comes in a 0.5 oz. tube and works well. I repaired some dents in enameled pots that were showing signs of rust. I used a Dremel with a wire brush attachment to remove the rust, first. Its been 4-5 years since using it and it seems to be holding up although I don't use the enameled pots as much, now that I have SS. I talked to Fred Sheer at the NHC last weekend and he mentioned using Lemongrass in a Weizen and said it was great. I think he recommended dryhopping a handful of fresh in 5 gal. for 3 days. Maybe Fred is listening and can verify this. Jerry Sadowski Crete, IL Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:47:07 -0500 From: "Leonard, Phil" <Phil.Leonard at dsionline.com> Subject: Rock Bottom discount card A bunch of us on one of the "unofficial pub crawl" groups tried to use our Rock Bottom card and it was refused. The server said that they couldn't get discounts because of a Chicago law that forbid it. Did this happen to everyone else that tried to use the card? Philip [612 251.4 AR] Overland Park, KS Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:52:47 -0500 From: "Greg R" <gmrbrewer at hotmail.com> Subject: Altbier I recently tried some Frankenheim Alt, which I enjoyed immensly. It was hugely malty with balancing bitterness but no hop flavor or aroma, something like an Ofest with lots more bitterness, yet with a very crisp finish. The BJCP style guidlines state a relatively high finishing gravity (1.012-1.019), but I tested the Frankenheim and it was 1.007. Is Frankenheim an exception to the rule, or are the guidelines in need of revision? Is Frankenheim a good example of the altbier style otherwise? It is quite different and much better than the domestic altbiers I have tried, generally unremarkable variations of brown ales (a notable exception being the altbier from Fordham Brewery in Baltimore, available only there AFAIK). I have never been to Dusseldorf, but was hoping someone who has can compare Frankenheim to other genuine Dusseldorf altbiers, e.g. Zum Uerige. I have read here that Zum Uerige's brewer claims they do not use any munich malt, but if it is anything like Frankenheim, I can see why so many clone recipes include munich. I have brewed several alt recipes, usually including lots of munich malt, with up to two decoctions, but none have turned out as malty and crisp as the Frankenheim. Any recipe and brewing suggestions from someone who has brewed a credible clone? Cheers! Greg in Chicago Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 19:31:26 -0500 From: Donald and Melissa Hellen <donhellen at horizonview.net> Subject: Greed?/Correction I wrote: The goods that made it into the city were sold at pre-hurricane prices, but since anyone could purchase these goods, those who needed them the most (and would pay much more than pre-hurricane prices, such as grocery stores, gas stations, etc.) could not obtain these since others who did not need them could obtain them and deplete the supply. - ------------ ------------ ------------- ------------ I wrote that "others who did NOT need these goods" bought them. What I meant to write was that "those who did not need them as badly as others who would pay a higher price" bought them. However, it's interesting to note that many people bought many different goods in the city under that temporary price ceiling and transported them outside the city to sell at market (much higher) prices where the law did not apply. When that happened, the goods moved to where the need was greater anyway, just as it would have if there were no price ceiling. Was greed involved in this case? Certainly. But that greed in a free market economy (with no price ceiling imposed in the city) also tended to serve the best interests of society when those who needed these goods the most paid the higher market price. This, of course, is an extreme example, and it does not account for some situations. A poor family who needed a generator to run medical equipment for their aged parent would need it as much or more than someone who would pay three times the normal price. But, realistically, there would be less expensive alternatives that, though inconvenient (like traveling to another area), would serve the interests of the poor family. Donald Hellen Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 14:57:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul Mahoney <pmmaho at yahoo.com> Subject: Brew Tree Brewers: Yesterday I came across the following website, advertising a brewing system at a very affordable price. (I am not affiliated with these people, etc.) http://www.brewtree.com/ Has anyone on HBD purchased such a system? If so, could you give us a review of it? I know of several people who have acquired a "brewing sculpture" from More Beer, and they are very happy with these systems. Earlier discussions on the HBD about the future of homebrewing raised the point that a VW-type system (cheap, reliable, easy to use) was necessary for this hobby to expand. The makers of the Brew Tree system argue for a simple, single infusion approach to brewing, and are negative in their comments about RIMS and HERMS systems. I understand the points raised, and do not wish to trigger this kind of debate. Rather I wonder if 1) a 15 gallon system, 2) single infusion, 3) based on gravity, 4) in the $800-$1200 price range, 5)with a small footprint, 6) designed for outdoor use (propane burners) may satisfy this VW-type standard? Paul M. Mahoney Star City Brewers Guild Roanoke, Va. (credit to -S for the sig line) ===== 'Caesar, [...] fearing the fickle disposition of the Gauls, who are easily prompted to take up resolutions, and much addicted to change, considered that nothing was to be entrusted to them;' - De bello gallico, book 4 script 5, Julius Caesar, 55 BC Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:34:01 +0800 From: "Edward D" <edwardd at dodo.com.au> Subject: Substance Dependence David Perez gave definitions for Substance Dependence in hi post Is Bill W. an Alcoholic. I cheeked myself against it considering especially 3 events at witch I drank excessive amounts of alcohol over 2 months. Point 1 if memory serves I stoped du to feeling ill on all 3 occasions and drank significantly more at the third. Point 2. I suffered a major hang over on all 3 occasions. Point 3 I defiantly drank more than is recommended on all 3 occasions Point 4 not guilty Point 5 not guilty Point 6 after one event I failed to wake up in time for a social gathering on time and after another I went to tafe (tertiary education) but could pay no attention for the first half of the day. Point 7 I engaged in all 3 binges knowing they were not good for me although I had no lasting problems that can be directly linked to drinking I had 5 points but I don't think I was or am an alcoholic. In 2 months I had 3 binges and no other alcohol or indeed for several months before or after did I have more than 3 stubbies (375ml) a week. I don't doubt that I did myself harm doing that however I tell you this becos it shows the problem using a point by point diagnosis system. Some will be falsely found positive and some presumably falsely negative. Edward Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 22:44:03 -0500 From: "Dan McFeeley" <mcfeeley at keynet.net> Subject: Re: Alcoholism Although this thread has gotten a little heated, it's really not all that bad a topic to discuss on this forum. Alcoholism respects no one, whether brewer or nonbrewer. Having an informed background can be helpful. A quick note of biographical interest: In my working abode I do emergency room psychiatric intake, including substance abuse assessment, and provide staff support on the psychiatric unit of our hospital. I am also well acquainted with substance abuse issues on a personal level, however, that's all I'll say here on this forum. Whether friend of family, it's their story to tell, not mine. A little more on Dave Perez's post -- the section he listed is from the DSM-IV(TR), an acronym for The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. It's a publication of the American Psychiatric Society, giving a categorical diagnostic listing of clinical diagnoses. Although the DSM is intended to standarize psychiatric diagnosis and treatment, it takes a good clinical background to understand and make use of it. The DSM also makes distinctions between those who are physiologically dependent on a substance, and those who abuse it. The categorical listings are best used when seen as giving a "snapshot" view into a common pattern of behaviors and, in the case of dependence, physiological responses to dependency. I'm listing both sections, dependency, as it appeared in Dave's post, and abuse: Criteria for Substance Dependence (p. 197): A maladaptive pattern of substance use, leading to clinically significant impairment or distress, as manifested by three (or more) of the following, occurring at any time in the same 12-month period: (1) tolerance, as defined by either of the following: (a) a need for markedly increased amounts of the substance to achieve intoxication or desired effect (b) markedly diminished effect with continued use of the same amount of the substance (2) Withdrawal, as manifested by either of the following: (a) the characteristic withdrawal syndrome for the substance (refer to Criteria A and B of the criteria sets for Withdrawal from the specific substances) (b) the same (or a closely related) substance is taken to relieve or avoid withdrawal symptoms (3) the substance is often taken in larger amounts or over a longer period than was intended (4) there is a persistent desire or unsuccessful efforts to cut down or control substance use (5) a great deal of time is spent in activities necessary to obtain the substance (e.g., visiting multiple doctors or driving long distances), use the substance (e.g., chain-smoking), or recover from its effects (6) important social, occupational, or recreational activities are given up or reduced because of substance use (7) the substance use is continued despite knowledge of having a persistent or recurrent physical or psychological problem that is likely to have been caused or exacerbated by the substance (e.g., current cocaine use despite recognition of cocaine-induced depression, or continued drinking despite recognition that an ulcer was made worse by alcohol consumption) Criteria for Substance Abuse (p. 199): A. A maladaptive pattern of substance use leading to clinically significant impairment or distress, as manifested by one (or more) of the following, occuring within a 12 month period: (1) Recurrent substance abuse resulting in failure to fulfill major work role obligations at work, school, or home (e.g., repeated absences, suspensions, or expulsions from school; neglect of children or household. (2) Recurrent substance use in situations in which it is physically hazardous (e.g., driving an automobile or operating a machine when impaired by substance use). (3) Recurrent substance-related legal problems (e.g., arrests for substance-related disorderly conduct). (4) Continued substance use despite having persistent or recurrent social or interpersonal problems caused or exacerbated by the effects of the substance (e.g., arguments with spouse about consequences of intoxication, physical fights). B. The symptoms have never met the criteria for Substance Dependence for this class of substance. When we talk about the disease process of alcoholism, we're speaking from the general category of alcohol dependency. At this point the amount of alcohol abuse is severe enough to cause physical changes that can actually contribute to the addicion. Certainly, personal responsibility is not ruled out, after all, if addiction was purely a medical condition, there would be no point to establishing rehabilitation centers. Spence, in his original post on this thread, was careful not to leave out personal responsibility, in fact, in his suggesting that people who are having problems with alcohol need to find help, he made that the center of his post. This is probably much too brief -- the actual picture of substance abuse/ dependency is extremely broad. For instance, people with psychiatric diagnoses of Bipolar disorder, or ADHD, are much more vulnerable to addiction than the average person. <><><><><><><><><><> <><><><><><><><> Dan McFeeley Return to table of contents
[Prev HBD] [Index] [Next HBD] [Back]
HTML-ized on 06/24/03, by HBD2HTML v1.2 by KFL
webmaster at hbd.org, KFL, 10/9/96