HOMEBREW Digest #4441 Thu 01 January 2004

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  Re: Yeast Culturing in Baby Jars (Matthew Riggs)
  Re: Carb calculator ("Greg 'groggy' Lehey")
  Bru:hmalz ("A.J deLange")
  Homebrew shops in Phoenix (Mike Walker)
  RE:  HERMS exchanger design - will this work? (Bill Tobler)
  Happy New Year! (Pat Babcock)
  Cider--How to Sweeten ("Weaver Joseph T MAJ CENTAF-AUAB CAOC\\SG")
  Re: Brumalt enlightment (Thomas Rohner)
  Re: Yeast Culture in Baby Food Jars ("beer man")
  Carb calculator (Ricky Robbins)
  RE: Switching the neutral ("Ronald La Borde")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 23:46:44 -0600 From: Matthew Riggs <braumeister at cox.net> Subject: Re: Yeast Culturing in Baby Jars Alexandre Enkerli asked a bunch of assorted questions on yeast culturing. My suggestion for most all of your questions would be to look on some mycology sites to find the information you are looking for. There are a bunch that have actual video demonstrations. I would say more but would probably implicate myself by divulging the web addresses and content. But an obvious start would be www.fungi.com . This man has been growing mushrooms for a long time and has some excellent supplies for legal mushrooms. Also you can get your malt extract agar pretty cheap here along with the flame source you are needing. Not to mention if you wanted to make some real slants or plates. Hope this helps you out in some way. Search google for mycology, or shroom. - -- Matthew Riggs in San Angelo, TX Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 17:08:52 +1030 From: "Greg 'groggy' Lehey" <grog at lemis.com> Subject: Re: Carb calculator On Tuesday, 30 December 2003 at 7:32:43 -0800, Demonick wrote: > > Here is the formula I use for percent alcohol and carbs. The C code is > available at http://www.primetab.com > > <snip> Some time ago I picked up the C code, used it in my programs and modified it. It doesn't contain any copyright information. Can you tell me any details? May I redistribute it freely? Greg - -- Finger grog at lemis.com for PGP public key. See complete headers for address and phone numbers. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 13:20:36 +0000 From: "A.J deLange" <ajdel at cox.net> Subject: Bru:hmalz The Germans (at least Narziss anyway) spells it as indicated in the title which makes it clear that its name is derived from "bru:hen" which means to scald or soak in hot water. A.J. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 07:26:33 -0800 (PST) From: Mike Walker <doplbock at yahoo.com> Subject: Homebrew shops in Phoenix John, Tell your son to check out Homebrew Depot and talk to Ken. The shop is at Guadalupe and the 101. I'll also plug our local club, the Arizona Society of Homebrewers. 2655 W Guadalupe Mesa, AZ 85202 480-831-3030 Mike Chandler, AZ Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 09:44:13 -0600 From: Bill Tobler <wctobler at sbcglobal.net> Subject: RE: HERMS exchanger design - will this work? Steve wants to upgrade to a HERMS type system, but wants a separate heat exchanger. I say go for it. You will really like the hands off brewing. You can get a lot of other things done while your system is being watched over by your electronics. My system is an all electric HERMS, and I have found that the HLT water gets a thermocline right at the level of the heating element. It was actually cold to the touch below the element and hot above it. So I needed to mix up the water somehow. I first tried a submersible bilge pump from Rule, (They were supposed to be good to 200 degree F) but it warped so bad the impeller started to hit the case. So I quit experimenting and bought a small mag drive pump and I now circulate the HLT. It made a big improvement in the way the system works. The water heats faster and so does the mash liquid circulating through the HERMS coil inside. My point is that you will need to move the water around in the heat exchanger. I'm guessing you're doing 10 gallon batches. I think you will be stressing the system with just 2 gallons of hot water trying to heat up a 24 pound mash. Think about it. The heat exchanger is the very heart of a HERMS system. If it's under powered, your initial heat-up will be sluggish and so will the step-ups. On the other hand, once you get up to temperature, you will have to control the temperature of the small heat exchanger so you don't overheat the wort. If you're mashing at 148, you don't want the heat exchanger water to be much more than 10 degrees hotter than the mash setpoint, IMO. The HERMS coil in my system is a convoluted tube much like the ones inside a CFC. It's very efficient and I can get away with a very low differential temperature. A system I really like is Bill Freemans HERMS, "The Prefessor" (http://www.brewrats.org/hwb/er/). He uses a separate CFC as a heat exchanger. He circulates the HLT water with a separate pump, and the mash circulates through the inner coil. The mash temperature controller controls the on/off of the hot water pump. When the mash gets to temperature, the hot water pump shuts off and the mash keeps circulating. This system heats the wort to within one or two degrees of the HLT temperature, so you would have very exact control. And the HLT gets circulated at the same time. I think your idea will work if it's powered enough to keep the water hot during steps. I put 14 gallons of water in the HLT for every brew session, and that gives me a heat sink that doesn't quit. (Having a 7000 watt element inside doesn't hurt either!) You already have a big tank of hot water in the HLT, and you should try to use some of that heat I think. Cheers and Happy New Year to everyone!! I'm staying home and brewing an American Larger tonight. Bill Tobler Lake Jackson, TX (1129.7, 219.9) Apparent Rennerian Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 11:28:14 -0500 (EST) From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org> Subject: Happy New Year! Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... Just wanted to wish all a Happy and Prosperous New Year! - -- - God bless America! Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock at hbd.org Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor at hbd.org HBD Web Site http://hbd.org The Home Brew Page http://hbd.org/pbabcock [18, 92.1] Rennerian "I don't want a pickle. I just wanna ride on my motorsickle" - Arlo Guthrie Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 20:13:35 +0300 From: "Weaver Joseph T MAJ CENTAF-AUAB CAOC\\SG" Subject: Cider--How to Sweeten Collective, This fall, I brewed two 5 gallon batches of apple cider. Easiest brewing project so far. Drove out to a beautiful family owned orchard near the Snake River in Idaho, put 2 sanitized carboys under the tap of a cider tank (while the cider was being pressed..no preservatives), filled them up and pitched the yeast (Lalvin K1-V116). Pretty sure the juice was a blend of popular apple varieties and probably not cider apples but a 2 gallon test batch from this orchard last year was excellent! My goal was to make one batch dry and one batch slightly sweet. I had planned to arrest the yeast in the sweet batch with potassium sorbate and then sweeten but then realized that it would not undergo secondary fermentation and carbonate when bottled. How do I sweeten this batch without creating bottle bombs? Add lactose? How much for a 5 gallon batch? JOSEPH T. WEAVER DVM, Maj, USAF, BSC CENTAF(F)/SG PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICER AL UDEID AB, QATAR DSN 318-436-4112 FAX XXX-XXX-4427 NIPR ph at auab.aorcentaf.af.mil SIPR ph at auab.aorcentaf.af.smil.mil A disproportionate representation of young males in their first through third decades is readily apparent, as is the concurrent use of intoxicants and various illicit substances with deliberate handling of the offending reptile. Medical Treatment of Reptile Envenomation Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 18:50:06 +0100 From: Thomas Rohner <t.rohner at bluewin.ch> Subject: Re: Brumalt enlightment Hi Wes as a german speeking guy, i hop i can translate it for you. It's not Bru-malt (at least that's what i think) it's Bruehmalz. (Normally it would be a u with those double dots on it, instead of the ue, but i can't post this character on the HBD) The word means exactly what you guessed, bruehen=brewing. But it comes from the malting method. In the traditional floor- malting, they used thicker layers of wetted grains. By doing that the stuff heated up(brewed). That's what the maltsters want to avoid, for regular malts. Happy new Year to all Thomas Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 10:15:04 -0800 From: "beer man" <westcoastalt at hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Yeast Culture in Baby Food Jars Alexandre Enkerli writes: >Been reading a bunch of things on yeast culturing [1-11] and pretty > >much decided on using baby food jars in a pressure cooker [2]. Found the >agar-agar, secured a deal with parents of a very young baby nearby, will >borrow a pressure cooker from someone else and will manage to find a flame >source. >It's still a lot of information to digest and some of it's slightly >contradictory. Alex, Pierre Rajotte's book First Steps in Yeast Culture is the essential read on the topic. It is a practical manual of microbiological technique. It has diagrams of specific techniques, provides information on the types of supplies to use and gives advice from Pierre's own experience in homebrewing and in the brewing industry. Given your questions about autoclave use (amount of water, sealed jars), this book should help you a lot more than individual responses from the digest members. You can find it at your local homebrew shop or online at amazon.com or morebeer.com I am anxiously awaiting "part two" of this book. I put in a call to Pierre's publisher (his wife I believe) to see when it would be out, and no response. Anyone out there have any info on this? Also, thank you Steve (-S) for your responses to my yeast flocculation questions back in November. Your responses were very helpful and informative. As a result, my beer is improving dramatically. Cheers, Oregon Alt Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 12:33:47 -0800 From: Ricky Robbins <ricky at rlrobbins.com> Subject: Carb calculator From: "Peter A. Ensminger" <ensmingr at twcny.rr.com> > A Beer with 1.045 OG/1.017 FG has ~20 g carbohydrates/12 oz (=80 > cal/12 oz) and is ~3.7% ABV (=71 cal/12 oz). That's what I came up with, as well: 3.7% ABV with 151 calories and 20g Carbs per 12oz serving. > "Real Extract" is a measure of the sugars that are fermented and > accounts for the density lowering effects of alcohol. Basically, > it's your FG (in Plato) if you removed all the alcohol. Okay, it's the "measure of the sugars that are fermented" that I've been having problems with, because to my reading it's backward from the "FG if you removed all the alcohol" that comes later. If the sugars ferment then they are no longer sugars, but have been turned into alcohol and CO2, correct? (I'm asking) And if the real extract in the formula is accounting for the sugars that *are* (as opposed to *are not*) fermented, what exactly is contributing the carbs that it accounts for and what accounts for the carbs in the unfermented sugars? One thing to note: I'm reading the phrase "sugars that are fermented" to mean the sugars that undergo the fermentation process of turning into alcohol and maybe you are using the phrase to mean sugars that still remain unfermented (which in my way of thinking would specifically not include the "sugars that are fermented" - smile). In simpler terms, is the RE accounting for the unfermented sugars in the beer. If yes, then it makes complete sense. If no, I'm still confused. And, if no, feel free to point me to a reference (book or site) and I'll get out of your hair. 8) > BTW, Mr. Goodbeer and you should use the proper URL for my site: > <http://hbd.org/ensmingr/>. I just used the one he posted, sorry, but I will pass it on. I previously e-mailed him with my suspected error in his formulation and he has corrected the site to yield the carbs differently. From: Demonick >Here is the formula I use for percent alcohol and carbs. The C code >is available at http://www.primetab.com In wading through the formulas and playing with them it would appear to me that the real extract is a calculated measurement of the unfermented sugars in the beer, calculated to account for the fact that the alcohol content "skews" the effort to use the gravity measurement to measure the sugars because alcohol is less dense than water. If that is true then I understand the formulas now and my only problem all along was reading "sugars that are fermented" as sugars that fermented and were no longer sugars but were alcohol and CO2, so thinking RE was some sort of measurement of the difference in the OE and AE, a measurement of the sugars that fermented into alcohol. In other words, I think I've got it and if not I may be hopeless. 8) Thanks for the explanation, the additional formulas, and the link. From: "A. J. delange" <ajdel at cox.net> > Carbohydrates are specified (ASBC Method Beer-6) as the real extract > less protein and ash. Protein is a bit dicey to measure but is > usually small relative to the real extract as is ash. Thus, for a > rough approximation, estimate the sugars as the real extract. Thanks for the explanation. As above, I've either now got it or I'm hopeless, but I think I've got it (famous last words). If I don't have it I may decide I don't need it (but probably will still want it). 8) Ricky Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 14:40:33 -0600 From: "Ronald La Borde" <pivoron at cox.net> Subject: RE: Switching the neutral >From: "A.J deLange" <ajdel at cox.net> >Subject: Switching the neutral > >Since it was brought up again I'll mention another advantage to >switching the neutral: relays sometimes fail by having the contacts >fuze. If this happens (and it did happen to me on a chiller) a DPDT >relay with enough springiness in the armature to allow one contact to >release even though the other is fuzed would save the day. There's no question that YAF (Yet Another Feature) can be added, and in the name of safety, I suppose this could be good. However, there is a practical limit to how far one should go to achieve that end. If you look at most UL listed devices, I believe that you will find most power switches do not switch the neutral. You can do it, if you wish, but think about the relay or a switch similar to the above mentioned one. What if the hot side contact did stick, and the neutral opens, now you have a potential hot box. So is this good or bad? Look at the practical side. Take the power cord. It has an insulating material protecting the conductor. Gee, just one, why not insulation over insulation. It would be safer perhaps in a conduit, better yet an insulated conduit! What if the fuse fails, the line cord could get hot, better make it fire proof. Oops, not asbestos though. See my point. There's a sweet spot to design, that to be exceeded would be over design. Ron ===== Ronald J. La Borde -- Metairie, LA New Orleans is the suburb of Metairie, LA www.hbd.org/rlaborde Return to table of contents
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