HOMEBREW Digest #1844 Fri 29 September 1995
Digest #1843
Digest #1845
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Keg Insulator Recap (JJBrewer)
RE: Legal drinking age (Costello #1842) (Michael Genito)
(U)Cigars & Brews (rich.byrnes)
Natural Gas Burners? (Paul Sovcik)
Wort Chiller Schematic (paragraph form) (Kenneth K Goodrow)
re: Brewing/Drinking Age. (Kenneth K Goodrow)
Petitioning to repeal laws against homebrewing... (Kenneth K Goodrow)
Brains Special Bitter (C JOHN MARE)
re:Homebrew Digest #1842 (September 27, 1995) ("Matthew W. Bryson")
Famous Urban Knaves of Grain competition (Stephen T. McKenna)
RIMS (Algis R Korzonas)
"Oversparging" during RIMS (CHARLIE SCANDRETT)
RE bottling yeast (Tim Fields)
US PLASTICS INFO ("Dave Bradley::IC742::6-2556")
green beer (Andy Walsh)
Little "Boinks". (CHARLIE SCANDRETT)
HBD for AOLers (PatrickM50)
lotsa questions from a lurker (Andy Walsh)
Medieval Beers (Fred Hardy)
Yeast for bread? (Marla Korchmar)
drinking and candling (Pierre Jelenc)
Signatures, please? (Spencer W Thomas)
(U)Organic Beers (rich.byrnes)
Crusader Update (that Nazi stuff) (Russell Mast)
Low alcohol cream ale recipe (Jeff Renner)
Even heating (Jim Busch)
RE: PID temp control (David Pike)
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Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 15:14:51 -0400
From: JJBrewer at aol.com
Subject: Keg Insulator Recap
HBD Crowd --
Many thanks to all that replied to my question on insulating 15.5 gal ss kegs
for use in a RIMS system. Sorry for the long response time, but I been
traveling,
busy etc. etc. The responses were varied but included:
A) Insulators are not really necessary. Jim Overstreet ran a little
experiment - 12 gallons of sparge water while doing a 12 hour
decoction. The sparge water in a 15 gallon keg lost only 2
degrees in over 3 hours. The temp was at 170.
B) Fabricate a metal shield (chimney like) or box of sorts that would
"reflect" the heat in towards the keg.
C) Buy a keg jacket (similar to water heater jacket?) from a
resturant supply store (flamability still in question)
D) Aluminized mylar acoustical foam in the Grainger catalog that says
it meets the Flame Retardant Tests UL-94 & ASTM E1692-76 with
temp limits from 20F to 120F continuous. It's a 54" x 10' roll
that's $97 bucks. Obviously not resistant enough for king, cajun,
camp etc. cookers with alot of flame"spillover." Expensive too.
E) Jim Merrill's method - "A simple solution I use, yet not flame
proof, is some insulation I bought from home depot, a local
harware chain. It's metalic on both sides with some air space in
the middle, about 1/2" thick in all and very flexible. I got some
self stick velcro and put a strap on the top and bottom in front. It
works great for me. I use cajan burners but I can control
the flame enough to raise the temp 1 degree / min if I
choose. The flame is so low it doesn't damage the
jacket. I have cranked up the flame before and the jacket
shrinks/melts a little along the bottom.
The stuff was about $15 for a small roll. It fits the keg size
very well. I've been using the same jacket for a year now."
F) Carl Steven writes -"You could try one of the water heater
blankets, though the covering might burn. You could also make
one that was non flamable by using fiberglass insulation. Take
off the backing and replace it with a fiberglass cloth. A bi-directional
weave cloth might be a good choice. (It is what I use for
parts of my airplane.) You could sew all of this together with
fiberglass strands or try and keep it attached via stainless
wire."
None of these suggestions are my own, but they do present some interesting
possibilities. Certaintly for a RIMS system I don't need to be overly
concerned with the type of insulation on the mash tun, but as for the hot
liquor tank and kettle..............
I think the type of "cooker" will make a difference in terms of how well the
flame can be controlled. I think some personal experimentation is in order
too since there is no such thing as a standard 1/2 barrel brewing system.
Perhaps keg insulation is something Dion Hollenbeck's RIMS book will address.
I think I will wind up trying more than one of these ideas.
If anyone has addtional ideas or questions, please feel free to post here or
email me.
Good Brewing
Jamey Johns (JJBrewer at aol.com)
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 16:00:14 -0400
From: genitom at nyslgti.gen.ny.us (Michael Genito)
Subject: RE: Legal drinking age (Costello #1842)
In #1842, Andrew Costello wrote:
>Does anyone out there know if there is a legal age attached to hombrewing?
New York State requires the same age limit (21) for homebrewing as it does
for any other public alcohol purchase or consumption.
>Does it vary from state to state ?
Some recent HBD postings suggest homebrewing at any age is illegal in some
states. This would seem to suggest that states may make individual rulings
based or not on the legal drinking age of 21. BTW, all states now require 21
for drinking or purchasing.
>I am also interested to find out your thoughts on the 21 year old drinking age.
If the govt considers you mature enough at 18 to be drafted and sacrifice
your life, they should consider you mature enough to drink. If car accidents
are the problem, set the minimum age of 21 for driving, not drinking. In any
case, dont punish the vast majority of mature adults for the irresponsible
actions of a few. Drinking of alcohol across various countries and various
ages has differed, and you will not find the paranoia among those raised in
households where wine or beer was a common table drink because the water
couldnt be trusted. The paranoia exists, as it always has, in extreme right
wing tea totallers who cannot tolerate any culture or enjoyment different
than their own.
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 16:05:07 EDT
From: rich.byrnes at e-mail.com
Subject: (U)Cigars & Brews
THIS IS A CORPORATE DOCUMENT - AS IF ANY OF YOU PEOPLE REALLY CARE!
FROM: Rich Byrnes
Subject: (U)Cigars & Brews
The subject says it all, sort of. A local cigar fanciers club has invited
our club to help coordinate a combimation cigar/beer tasting. I know Fred
Ekhardt has written a good article on this subject and I was sure I had it,
but couldn't put my finger on it yesterday. If anyone can help me with the
issue of the magazine this article appears in, please contact me. Even if
there's no interest from our club in this event (Meeting tonight, I'll find
out then....) I would like to help this club put together a tasting.
Please don't turn this into an anti-smoking thread because we as a club
prohibit smoking during all tastings/competitions at meetings, and the
members that do smoke go to a neutral area (and please no pro-smokers
spouting off about smoking discrimination, sheesh!). If this does
generate some bandwidth about cigars and beer, great, I'm curious what
other people have experienced.
TIA!!
Rich Byrnes
Founder of Fermental Order of Renaissance Draughtsmen
Ignore the next few lines, I often do!
Regards,_Rich Byrnes Jr
B&AO Pre-Production Color Unit \\\|///
phone #(313)323-2613, fax #390-4520 (.) (.)
Rich.Byrnes at E-mail.com_____________________o000__(_)__000o
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 95 15:54:45 CDT
From: Paul Sovcik <U18183 at UICVM.CC.UIC.EDU>
Subject: Natural Gas Burners?
I have recently moved and my new house has a nifty heated garage (a nice
touch for Chicago winters...) that uses natural gas as a heating source.
I have a gas line that runs thru the garage that would be very easy to
tap into and have a nice brewing set-up that will allow me to brew in the
garage all winter without the wife complaining about the smell.
My question is: what type of burner can I use for this setup? I know
King Kookers etc. are popular, but these seem to run off propane, and I
thought they are not suitable for NG.
Anyone have suggestions as to what type and how powerful a burner I will
need? I will probably be brewing 5-10 gallon batches.
I also have access to a bunch of free (food grade) pumps. Im trying to come
up wiht ideas of how to use these in my setup (extract/partial mash).
Any ideas?
-Paul Sovcik PJS at uic.edu
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 16:19:06 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kenneth K Goodrow <goodrow at orion.etsu.edu>
Subject: Wort Chiller Schematic (paragraph form)
Well, for all of you who asked for "my" plans for self-made wort
chillers, they are as follows. Mind you others have made many more than
I have and I made my first last week, so this is from a greenhorn chiller
maker who just knows it works:
Purchase...
1. 20 feet of 3/8" diameter copper tubing from hardware store.
Usually comes in a coil. Bend this stuff to look like other wort
chillers you've seen in catalogs. Don't worry if the rings arent
straight. Just make sure they fit into your wort.
2. 2 pieces of 6 feet of plastic tubing with 3/8" internal diameter. Make
sure this fits easily over each end of the copper tubing. These will be
the "to" and "from" hoses to the chiller (copper tubing) and from the sink.
3. 3 hose clamps. These will be placed on the plastic-to-copper
tube connections (two of these), and one on the
plastic-tube-to-sink-adapter connection.
4. Something to adapt one end of the plastic tube to the
faucet/spigot, etc (this will probably entail 2 pieces of hardware).
This is what I did: Used my adapter that made my
bottle washer fit my sink. This made it so I could screw on a garden
hose to my sink spigot (if I wanted to -- just noting this here for
description). From here you want to purchase something to screw onto the
adapter and this something should have the plastic hose connected to it.
Get the picture? This something might also be called a hose
connector/etc. Just talk to the hardware person and he/she'll probably
know what you mean.
After you buy all the above, put it together. Clamp each piece of the
plstic tubing to an end of the copper tubing. Then clamp the hardware
for sink-fitting to one of the plastic tubing ends. One end of the
plastic tube will take water from the sink through the copper and out to
the other plastic tube and drain into the sink (or onto the floor, but I
would suggest the sink).
I tried to make this overly simplistic for the non-technical types, so
those of you at NASA/other overly-technical-places, please don't take
this as an insult to your techtelligence.
Hope this helps those of you who asked for the plans. It really is
easy. Just make sure the parts slide together easily. I would suggest
fitting, clamping, screwing the pieces together in the store so you know
the sizes are right.
Cheers,
Kenn Goodrow
East Texas State University, which will be
Texas A&M University - Commerce, in 1996
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 16:39:58 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kenneth K Goodrow <goodrow at orion.etsu.edu>
Subject: re: Brewing/Drinking Age.
Well, let me start by saying that I will let my son brew as soon as he
gains interest, if so. Laws create artificial barriers and often create
problems/beliefs that problems exist when they don't. Laws often
distract individuals and collude thinking. Am I trully safer if I drive
55 than 56 (no flames from statisticians, please. ha ha)? I think many
people have been conditioned to feel wrong about responsible "underage"
or "over-the-speed-limit" behaviors. I am not meaning to say that sex
with minors is o.k., but in the case of drinking age laws there needs to
be some rethinking going on. Many adolescents find drinkin exciting
because it "is" and adult thing to do, adult defined by 18 or 21. What a
crock of bologna (and other nasty words).
More later.
Kenn
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 16:22:56 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kenneth K Goodrow <goodrow at orion.etsu.edu>
Subject: Petitioning to repeal laws against homebrewing...
For anyone who was/did mail me about this, I just suggested that an Email
petition be started by anyone who would be interested and happens to live
in a state which outlaws homebrewing. I did not say that I am doing
this personally. In fact, my state (Texas) goes legal on homebrewing.
FYI,
Kenn
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 1995 14:59:05 -0700 (MST)
From: C JOHN MARE <MARE at vetsci.agpharm.arizona.edu>
Subject: Brains Special Bitter
On my recent (June, 1995) visit to Wales I visited several breweries,
but not Brains in Cardiff. However I did taste the Brains spectrum of
beers but no "Special Ale". The most widely available Brains Ale in
the OG 1041-1042 range is the "SA Best Bitter" at OG 1042. Since you
were asking about ingredients, here goes (ie. for the "SA"). All the
Brains ales are based on two-row pale malt with the addition of
crystal malt, glucose, and invert sugar. In their dark beer ("Red
Dragon Dark") the crystal malt is replaced with chocolate malt.
They use Fuggles and Goldings whole hops in all their ales.
I hope this helps you brew a credible "lookalike". I personally
prefer the Felinfoel ales and have based my Welsh Ales on them.
Happy brewing,
John Mare,
The Stables Brewery & John's Alehouse
Tucson, AZ.
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 95 19:08:21 CDT
From: "Matthew W. Bryson" <MWBryson at LANMAIL.RMC.COM>
Subject: re:Homebrew Digest #1842 (September 27, 1995)
Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that one must be 21 years old
to homebrew( legally) anywhere in the U.S.. As to the other question...
well, I was one of the last people in my state( by birthday) that could
legally drink beer at age 18. I don't think that extortion by the federal
government was necessary or morally correct; it is certainly illegal for
ME to hold states hostage by threat of monetary loss. I wish that states
could be allowed to make their own decision in this regard.
Back to brewing,
Matthew Bryson
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 95 18:28:50 CDT
From: stmckenna at amoco.com (Stephen T. McKenna)
Subject: Famous Urban Knaves of Grain competition
CALL FOR ENTRIES, JUDGES, AND STEWARDS
The Famous Urban Knaves of Grain Homebrew Competition
presented by the Urban Knaves of Grain and Famous Liquors
an AHA-sanctioned competition
Saturday October 21, 1995, 10:30am
Famous Liquors
105 E. Roosevelt Rd.
Lombard, IL 60148
ENTRIES: All styles are welcome. Ribbons will be awarded for 1st, 2nd, and
3rd place in each category judged; and for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd best of show.
Entries are due between Oct. 9 and Oct. 17 at Famous Liquors. The entry fee
is $5 per entry (if entering 1 to 3 beers) or $4 per entry (if entering 4 or
more beers). Please contact Steve McKenna (stmckenna at amoco.com, 708-961-7846)
for complete details and entry forms.
JUDGES AND STEWARDS: We need volunteers! Interested in learning to judge,
but haven't taken the exam yet? No problem--we will pair you with BJCP
judges. This is a great way to gain experience in judging. To volunteer to
judge or steward, please contact Chris Campanelli
(akcs.chrisc at vpnet.chi.il.us, 708-304-6355 days, 708-668-8081 evenings).
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 95 16:08:13 CDT
From: korz at pubs.ih.att.com (Algis R Korzonas)
Subject: RIMS
Keith writes:
>First, what *exactly* is a RIMS?
and
>I plan on building a system that simply heats the wort with my propane
>cooker under the kettle and recirculates it to the top with a pump.
>No heating element, no computer chips. But it does (R)ecirculate,
>and it is an (I)nfusion (M)ashing (S)ystem, but is it a RIMS?
Rodney Morris's RIMS was basically a system consisting of a mash/laeuter
tun that had a pump that would take runnings, heat them with an
electronically-controlled electric element and then put them back in to
the tun. I suppose that the heat could come from direct heat on a metal
tun, but part of the wonderfullness of Rodney's system was that the heat
was electronically controlled. I would like to have a system that would
allow me to dial-up a mash schedule and I sit back and drink a homebrew,
but I have two concerns regarding a RIMS in the style of Rodney's: 1) the
small heating area (as Charlie pointed out) and 2) over-recirculation
(see the article in Zymurgy by Bob Jones and Micah Millspaw a few years
ago).
I don't, however, believe that tannin extraction is an issue. Indeed,
as another poster (sorry) pointed out, there should be no more tannin
extraction if you stir than if you recirculate. As long as the pH if
the mash is not too high, tannins should not be a problem.
Now, regarding the name "RIMS," I must throw some cold water. Neither
Rodney's design nor Keith's proposed modification are (I)nfusion systems.
Infusion mashing is the heating of the mash with additions of boiling
water... period, end paragraph.
A lot of books and magazines incorrectly label non-infusion mashing procedures
as infusion mashing, upward-infusion or step-infusion procedures. They are
simply wrong. There is no consensus on the terminology if you heat the mash
with the application of heat directly to the tun. I tend to call it
"temperature-controlled mashing" or "kettle mashing."
Al.
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 95 20:48:14 +1000
From: CHARLIE SCANDRETT <merino at ozemail.com.au>
Subject: "Oversparging" during RIMS
Dion Hollen wrties,
>How about it Charlie, like to re-evaluate your comments in light of
>this? Were you maybe extending characteristics of over-sparging to
>recirculation which are not there because of the very different
>chemical makeup of the wort during recirc from that during sparging?
>I am not baiting you (no bait taken Dion, CS), I actually would like to know
about specifics
>that you feel are a down side of the recirc. I just feel that the
>chemical environment is very different in the two cases; different
>enough for me to not believe in the problems you seem to think exist.
>If you have hard evidence, I am open to it. And in fact, would
>welcome it and want to test it out.
You've stumped me on this Dion, I assumed that the dissolving of phenols by the
world's best all round solvent (water) was a function of contact time/volume
and that the alkalinity was a symptom. The possibility of remaining sugars
protecting the phenols is
intriguing, but wouldn't any recirculation remove sugars?
George Fix says "extraction tends to be proportional to the *ammount* of
sparge water used. Since pH of the runnings increases with extraction, maximal
levels of sparge water can be checked by pH measurement."
He goes on to state the increasing pH itself stimulates extraction, as do
temperatures over ~75C.
I repeat here my suggestion of putting a pH strip in a clear plastic hose
inline with the RIMS. Anyone want to do the experiment? I don't have RIMS.
Personally I set up a little winnower to remove >80% of husks from my grain to
combat this very problem. They are added to the mash in a bag and removed
before lauter. What's in my lauter tun to replace them as filters?
Bleached, boiled panty hose!
Charlie (Brisbane Australia)
"How long is a piece of string? Have you seen a HBD thread!" CS
Return to table of contents
Date: 28 Sep 95 07:14:19 EDT
From: Tim Fields <74247.551 at compuserve.com>
Subject: RE bottling yeast
> From: Kris Thomas Messenger <kmesseng at slonet.org>
> Subject: Re-pitching at bottling time
> Not wanting to have cloudy beer, I am wondering how much yeast I should add
> at bottling time to accomplish this.
The Belgian FAQ (available via lambic digest archives) suggests using the slurry
from a 1 pint starter for a 5 gallon batch.
-Tim
timf at relay.com
"How 'Bout Them TERPS!"
"Reeb!"
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 07:06:14 -0500 (EST)
From: "Dave Bradley::IC742::6-2556" <BRADLEY_DAVID_A at Lilly.com>
Subject: US PLASTICS INFO
Here is some info on some of the useful plastic fittings offered by
US Plastics (800-537-9724). I thought it would be of general interest.
I have two types of fittings I use with my Gotts. The material I chose
is polypropylene (NSF rated, -30 to +215 F temp range), though other
materials are available. One type is a "bulkhead union", the other a
"tank fitting". Both types have straight (non-tapered aka not pipe) threads.
BULKHEAD UNIONS = like a threaded nipple w/ a nut in the middle, with a
lock nut which sandwiches your cooler wall. Includes 2 hose (compression-
style) fittings for the ends for plastic tubing.
#61123 ($1.58ea) "For 3/8" Tubing"
Has 3/8" threads. Fits *perfectly* in cooler with Gott's
rubber bushing and O-ring!
#61124 ($2.10ea) "For 1/2" Tubing"
Threads are 1/2". Fits through hole in cooler w/o stock
bushing/O-ring. Usable but need a way to seal it w/cooler.
TANK FITTING = like a large, short bolt & nut, w/ hole bored through the
bolt which is threaded to make it a female socket. Includes 2 neoprene*
seals. * - neoprene is rated incompatible w/beer (70F) by US Plastics.
#16422 ($5.65) ID=3/8", OD=3/4"
Gott easily bored to accept this larger size. Note this
IRREVERSIBLY makes it brewing equipment!
#16423 ($7.65) ID=1/2", OD=??7/8"?? (not sure, maybe 1")
I have one, but its too big to use for anything (yet!)
#16421 ($5.48) ID=1/4", OD=??5/8"??
Don't have this one, but OD estimated by sizes I do have.
Pretty small to be useful.
So the point: using #61123 you can add a valve and have a reversibly
modified lauter tun or hot liquor tank. Very easy. With #16422, and
drilling out the cooler to 3/4", a larger fitting is easily adaptable.
FWIW, I'm just a VERY satisfied customer. Good luck!
Dave in Indy
From: BRADLEY DAVID A (MCVAX0::RC65036)
To: VMS MAIL ADDRESSEE (IN::"homebrew at hpfcmgw.fc.hp.com")
cc: BRADLEY DAVID A (MCVAX0::RC65036)
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 23:08:28 +1000
From: awalsh at crl.com.au (Andy Walsh)
Subject: green beer
I've got 2 theories about green beer:
1) If it is green nobody will want to drink it.
(last St. Pat's (BTW out of the 10001 homebrew shops in the world, why is so
much written about this shop?) day, a club member served us a green weizen.
It was not too bad, but nobody would drink it because it was green).
2) stout with green food colouring will look just like stout. ( notice how
stouts have a white head unless they are really strong? This is due to the
diffraction effect bubbles have on light. ie. all heads are white. I guess
it *might* have some greenish tinges, especially around the base of the
head. If anybody actually wants to make "green stout" I'd really like to
hear how it ends up looking.)
Andy W.
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 95 23:18:18 +1000
From: CHARLIE SCANDRETT <merino at ozemail.com.au>
Subject: Little "Boinks".
Yes folks, I was talking about serious kegs. 20, 58 and 117 litres. We don't
have 5 litre minis here in the antipodes. The principle is the same. All
pressure vessels have a rated safe working pressure which is about 0.2 their
calculated failure pressure.
Now yeast can generate pressures well in excess of 100psi (6 ATM). It depends
on the
1/ Ammount of fermentables left. (possibly after stuck fermentation?)
2/ The headspace left in the keg. (Boyles Law PV=constant)
3/ The tolerance of your yeast to high levels of disolved CO2. Champagne yeast
just keeps going.
If the mini kegs are designed to handle 100 psi+, their calculated failure rate
would be 500 psi.
The wall thickness would have to be 0.66 mm for a 200mm diameter vessel. Are
they that thick?
Basically if you "boink" anything (and some people will!) then you are well
over half way to catastrophic failure, I just don't want to be in the room.
Charlie (Brisbane, Australia)
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 09:43:10 -0400
From: PatrickM50 at aol.com
Subject: HBD for AOLers
To Tom F and other AOLers who have noticed they are no longer getting the
entire HBD in their mailbox:
AOL recently made it possible for you to attach a file to your email and send
it across the gateway to other online service customers (Compuserve, Prodigy,
etc) as well as to anyone with Internet email access. It also allows you to
receive an attached file now as well - seems to use the MIME "translator" if
that means anything to you. UNFORTUNATELY for us HBD devotees however, if
the HBD is longer than about 25K, the entire issue is sent as a file and
automatically dumped into your normal AOL download directory in its entirety
- only the first 25K is readable as regular email.
I use the HBD Browser by Don Hatlestad (hbdbrow1.zip - available free from
the ftp.stanford.edu archives) to read each issue. Great program - use the
down arrow to read or skip each submission and the mouse activated scrolling
"thumbwheel" on the right side of screen to read each one. The Windows
program was written to search for keywords in single HBDs. Searches across
multiple HBDs will hopefully be in next version, according to the author.
BTW, AOL is aware of our problem and says it will fix the situation in the
next release.
Pat Maloney
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 29 Sep 1995 00:14:29 +1000
From: awalsh at crl.com.au (Andy Walsh)
Subject: lotsa questions from a lurker
Kenny Eddy asks:
> Or is it so hopelessly complicated and dependent
>on the phase of the moon that we can never hope to nail that IBU rating on
>the money?
>
I suggest you buy a tide calendar.
IBU rating is hopelessly inexact. Tinseth's numbers seem to be well regarded
but give high bitterness in my setup so I use Rager's numbers.
I think the reason there are so many different numbers is that there are too
many variables in each system. Use the ones that give best results for you.
>But: how much of that OG is actually fermentable?
There are no real numbers because fermentabilty depends upon too many factors.
eg.
yeast strain (many don't agree with me here)
wort composition (ie. glucose\dextrin ratio)
If you want dry beer mash low or use dextrose etc.
malty beer mash high or use dextrin high adjuncts
cider use lots of sucrose!
This is what separates one good brewer from another and comes only from
experience. Experiment!
>On sorta the same topic, I would think that roasting grains would destroy
>some to all of the starch's conversion capability, yet I see malts like
>chocolate or even black patent listed with extractions not much different
>that pale malts.
Dark malts cannot convert themselves and rely upon enzymes from pale malt to
be converted to fermentable sugars. This should not *greatly* affect
possible extraction (yeah, yeah, I know it does to some extent). ie. mash it
with a pale malt and you'll be OK.
>(3) Force Carbonation: Now that I'm kegging, I'm enjoying the convenience of
>sediment-free beer-on-demand. I'm also enjoying variable and unpredicatable
>carbonation levels. My current approach is to add pressure immediately after
>racking, according to temperature/volumes tables, then tossing the
>unconnected keg into the fridge. This buys a little time by pushing CO2 into
>the beer as it cools. Now I suspect two things should be happening here.
> One, the free CO2 will reduce in pressure due to the cooling temperatures.
> Two, the cooling beer would allow more CO2 to dissolve in (or would it...?).
> But I should end up with a pressure at final temperature euqla to that in
>the chart for the same CO2 volume I was originally after. Right?
>
Wrong!
The charts tell you what pressure you should carbonate your beer if you
leave the same pressure and temperature on until things equalise ( a few
days). If you pull the hose off (as I do) you should whack on a much higher
pressure (eg. 3 times more). You must keep on adding extra gas periodically
until you reach the pressure in the chart for that temperature. I find this
simpler than keeping the pressure on constantly (who cares about gas line
leaks). The gas just dissolves in the beer as you go.
>Next question:
I don't really understand this.
Just drop the pressure off a little via the blowoff valve to minimise the
head foaming and you'll be OK. Be sure to re-apply gas after you finish
drinking for the night to maintain carbonation for later on.
Great stuff about your box but I have 3 fridges and 2 heaters!
Andy W.
>
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Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 10:20:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Fred Hardy <fcmbh at access.digex.net>
Subject: Medieval Beers
Carl Etnier posted Jeff Renner's comments on his (Jeff's)
impression of what English Beer must have been like at the time
of Henry VIII. IHO, "English ale back then was typically much
stronger in OG than now (>1.080), probably cloudy with yeast and
suspended starch and protein from poor mashing and sparging
techniques, sweeter (higher FG) and unhopped.
Carl goes on to add "and flat". Carl posts that he didn't know
when pressure vessels and thereby the possibility for carbonation
were introduced for beer, but he suspects they didn't exist then.
Perhaps I can shed some light on several of these areas. As for
carbonation, the Celts and Brits had the same pressure vessels as
did the Burton brewers who shipped IPA around the world. They are
called "Barrels", and the coopers' art was well established in
the British Isles before the Roman Invasion.
It had not been forgotten during Henry's time (The Renaissance),
since it was the vessel of choice of both the Burton brewers of
IPA as well as the modern day Real Ale advocates of CAMRA. The
carbonation was less than Bud, but equal to today's real ale
served in England. For a killer head the Norse (and probably more
than a few Brits and Celts) would plunge a hot poker into the mug
to release dissolved CO2 and produce accompanying foam. At a time
when central heating was unknown, the alcohol and actual warmth
of the drink were probably welcomed.
OG of medieval beers would have been at least 1.070 to insure a
reasonable shelf life. Spoilage was delayed by the higher
alcoholic content. FG could not have been much higher than what
we would have today from such a beer, or the preservation effect
would have been nullified. Please note that guidelines for a
number of today's brews (barley wine, English old ale, Scotch
ale, imperial stout, several Belgian ales, bock, doppelbock) may
have an OG which exceeds that of the Medieval brews.
As for flavors, the Medieval brewer did not have any black malts
or crystal malts. The black malts were not available before 1817.
Colored malts resulted from uneven heat control which would have
produced pale, amber and brown malts in the same batch, and
likely in random distributions. Brown malt was also intentionally
produced to reclaim slack malt.
Whether the Medieval beers were cloudy is open for debate. Young
beers would have had a higher degree of cloudiness than beers
which had been aged, just as today. An aged ale commanded a
higher price during the middle ages. By the standards of AB (St.
Louis, MO) probably most real ales are cloudy. Try to pour a
crystal clear glass of Th. Hardy's ale. Not until glass became
the common drinking vessel did beer clarity become much of an
issue.
Most English ales brewed before the 16th century would have been
unhopped. It is hard to say with any certainty that none were.
Hops were introduced into England by the Romans who valued them
as food. Since all manners of herbs and spices have found their
way into beer, who can say that someone in Medieval England did
not use hops in theirs? Documentation identifies sweet gale,
marsh rosemary and millfoil as herbs used as gruit in Medieval
beer. That is about as complete as saying only pale barley malt,
ale yeast, Cascade hops and water are used in modern beer.
Certainly ginger, cloves, cinnamon, ground ivy, nutmeg, mace,
honey, fennel, mint and a host of other additives were available
to the Medieval brewer. They ranged from common to rare and
expensive. Some imported ingredients were probably unknown in
areas of the English countryside, but available in coastal
cities.
Every age is arrogant, and we are no different. We assume that no
one before ourselves knew how to do anything well. In fact,
brewers throughout the Middle Ages produced excellent beer.
During the high Middle Ages (1000-1400) English beer was widely
exported and said to rival wine in clarity, color and strength.
It was even presented to foreign kings as a prized gift.
Sparging did not even become feasible until the introduction of
hops. We use sparging to extract the last bit of sugar because we
want to emulate BudMilCoors. It is about economics, not
necessarily about good beer. Try doing a Medieval style double
mash (mash, draw off the liquid, mash again and draw of the
liquid) and you will get two brews. One, a strong ale with OG
around 1.075, and a small beer with OG in the mid to upper
1.030s.
It is likely that both would have been spiced by the Medieval
brewer. The strong ale could be stored and the small beer was for
everyday family use. Today we put hops in the small beer and call
it English ordinary. We sparge so we can use minimal ingredients
and get the same effect as our ancestors got from a second
running of their mash.
Reproducing Medieval beers is both fascinating and rewarding. I
particularly like my first running strong ale from pale and amber
malts and spiced with ginger, toasted rosemary and fennel. I also
treat the second running as Medieval brewers often did - I add
honey to raise OG to over 1.070 and produce braggot. BTW, Wyeast
No. 1728 (Scottish ale) works well with both. Yield is about 3
gallons each of two very different beverages from a single mash
of 12 pounds of grain.
Let your imagination dictate the herbs, methods and uses for your
Medieval beers. Our ancestors did.
Cheers, Fred
==============================================================================
We must invent the future, else it will | <Fred Hardy>
happen to us and we will not like it. |
[Stafford Beer, "Platform for Change"] | email: fcmbh at access.digex.net
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 10:10:21 -0400
From: Marla Korchmar <marlak at pipeline.com>
Subject: Yeast for bread?
With all this talk about re-using yeast, I'm inspired to use some of my
next batch's leftovers for baking bread. Can any of the bakers reading
give me a sense of how much yeast slurry to "pitch" in my bread? (Recipes I
have mostly use about 7 cups of flour.)
Thanks!
Marla Korchmar
Brooklyn, NY
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Date: Thu, 28 Sep 95 10:35:28 EDT
From: Pierre Jelenc <pcj1 at columbia.edu>
Subject: drinking and candling
In Homebrew Digest #1843 CGEDEN at NERVM.NERDC.UFL.EDU writes:
[ ... ]
> Lets face it, 18-yr-olds are adults and deserve the right to drink if they
> care to. Some of them will make unwise choices, but so do all of us from
> time to time.
I can't think of an 18-year old that I would consider an adult. I
certainly wasn't one. Anyway, as long as they only kill themselves, fine.
I do not consider suicide a crime.
But when it comes to others, I would support lowering the drinking age as
long as DWI is treated like attempted murder, and vehicular homicide while
intoxicated is equated with murder one.
> It makes no more sense to deny them this freedom based on
> highway statistics than it would to deny drivers licenses to people over
> 70 years old.
1/ It's not a "freedom", it is a license to use public resources. As long
as you drink, or drive, or both on your own private property, I see no
objections.
2/ Many countries, and some states here, do make older drivers retake
driving tests periodically, typically every 2 years.
Then Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> asks:
> So, does anyone know - how much candling is safe? How much will light-strike
> my beer? A few seconds, a few days, what?
Your flashlight is safe. In order for the skunking reaction to occur, the
light has to have a wavelength in the green to near UV range. An ordinary
incandescent bulb emits almost exclusively in the yellow to red range.
Pierre
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Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 11:10:21 -0400
From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Signatures, please?
Time for the semi-annual request: If you put a short signature line at
the end of your posts (see below), then we can all feel more like a
community of brewers. It also helps to know where you live when
responding to a request about supplies, availability of beer, laws, etc.
=Spencer Thomas in Ann Arbor, MI (spencer at umich.edu)
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 11:14:49 EDT
From: rich.byrnes at e-mail.com
Subject: (U)Organic Beers
THIS IS A CORPORATE DOCUMENT - As if any of you cared
FROM: Rich Byrnes
Subject: (U)Organic Beers
Short note- A while back someone was asking for advice and help on
making an organic beer, for whatever reason (I forgot!) A comment a
friend made last night led to a brain-fart, a new AHA style for 100%
organic beers, and the classification would be......E.P.A., Enviromental
Pale Ales of course! :-> (Boo Hiss)
Regards,_Rich Byrnes Jr
B&AO Pre-Production Color Unit \\\|///
phone #(313)323-2613, fax #390-4520 (.) (.)
Rich.Byrnes at E-mail.com_____________________o000__(_)__000o
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Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 10:13:05 -0500
From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com>
Subject: Crusader Update (that Nazi stuff)
I posted to all my lists about this a few days ago, most of you have probably
learned a bit about this by now. Here's what happened: A hacker, on Saturday
night, broke into numerous computers and forwarded a racial hate tract to
tens or hundreds of thousands of e-mail addresses pulled apparently at random
from every newsgroup on the Usenet.
Currently, "authorities and security specialists at a local, national, and
international level" are looking into the issue.
lan at panix.com (to the best of my knowledge not one of the above "authorities")
writes :
> I will be tracking the search for this person on
> http://www.panix.com/~lan/crusader -- if you have any relevant
> information for the web page, please email it to me.
Please do not clog any innappropriate mailing lists or newsgroups with this
discussion. I apologize for this use of bandwidth, this is the last I will
post of it. If you have any questions that aren't answered in this post,
please send them to me via _personal_ e-mail, or check with the newsgroup
news.admin.net-abuse.misc.
Thanks,
-Russell Mast
Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 95 11:31:09 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu>
Subject: Low alcohol cream ale recipe
I just posted this recipe to r.c.b. in response to a request and thought
it might be of interest to HBD readers.
> I'm looking for a Cream Ale recipe. Something that would come out
like
> a Sleeman's or Hart Cream Ale. Full grain or mash-extract.
I'm not familiar with those brands, but I grew up in Cincinnati, home of
Schoenling Little Kings, argueably the Ur-typ cream ale, although it
really is of fairly recent origin (post WWII, if I am not mistaken). A
good cream ale should have the fermentation flavors of an ale due to the
use of ale yeasts at ale fermentation temperatures, and smoothness from
lagering; some residual sweetness from a relatively high FG, and maybe a
little DMS from 6-row malt. Here is a recipe that I made last winter
that did well in competitions. The judges did not realize it was low
alcohol (~2% ABV). I made it for my son and his fraternity brothers,
who like "lite" beers (that is, his brothers do; he likes good beer). I
called it "Isaac Newton Cream Ale," because it's "so light it defies
gravity." It turned out quite nicely - better than I anticipated.
My intent was to make a low alcohol beer with decent body and taste. To
acomplish this, I designed for low OG (1.032) and high FG (1.016) via
crystal and carapils malts and corn and a 50-60-70 mash schedule, with
30 minutes at 50C, only 15 minutes at 60C, and 45 minutes at 70C. It
started out a bit phenolic from over sparging, but this diminished with
lagering. I'd stop sparging earlier next time and dilute for full
volume, probably after fermentation, so as to get more complex flavors
from higher gravity fermentation. For some reason that I can't remember
(probably because it was for fraternity guys with no taste buds), I used
some old, dry Whitbread yeast (I always use liquid yeast). It would
have been better with a nice fruity liquid yeast that didn't accent hops
too much. Maybe YeastLab Canadian. As I recall, I hopped to a target
of upper teens IBUs, which was about where it ended up.
Grist bill for 7-3/4 gallons (1/4 bbl):
6.25 lb. US 6-row malt
0.5 lb. Carapils
0.25 lb 50L crystal (Baird)
1.25 lb. flaked maize
Nine gallons well water boiled & decanted to reduce hardness and
alkalinity, then added 3/4 tsp CaCl2.
Mashed 50-60-70 as above, hops:
1 oz. Liberty plugs at 5.5% aa., 90 minutes
1/2 oz. Styrian goldings plug at 5.2%, 15 minutes
1/2 oz ditto, 15 minute settling steep
Fermented ~2 weeks mid 60sF, lagered six weeks at 33F.
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan c/o nerenner at umich.edu
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Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 11:51:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Even heating
Ken writes about even heating:
<Jim Bush and Dion Hollen argue about which systems are better for even
<temp distibution in the mash tun.
Correction, we were not arguing, really!
<I measured virutally every quadrant if
<the mash tun and found, after stirring, no more than a 2 degree delta. That
<is to say, if one section was 68C the other sections would be no less than
<67C and no section would be more than 68C.
I see about the same deltas, maybe closer to 3F but I dont measure the very
bottom. This is workable. It equilizes very fast.
<So, how even is even? Also does "even" include the heating process
and if so, how even is even?
I think the goal is to not overshoot too much. The enzymes dont instantly
deactivate but you dont want to push it either. A 1-2C overshoot and then
equilizing at the rest temp is fine by me.
<My wife and I both believe that the uneveness (especically when heating)of
<our system and proceedures actually help create beers full of different
<characters.
You might be altering the enzyme action in small regions of the mash but
the overall effects would seem to me to be minimal. Then again if you find
the beer tastes better I wouldnt change a thing!
Good brewing,
Jim Busch
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Date: Thu, 28 Sep 1995 09:09:09 -0700
From: David Pike <davep at cirrus.com>
Subject: RE: PID temp control
> Harry Bush asks the unavoidable question,
>What is PID (other than something really bad that happens only to
>women), and is it something I should get?
And Charlie answers:
Here goes?...
etc,etc...
But Charlie did not answer the implied question(s), ie:
where did you get it, who made it, how much did it cost?
OR, if you made it: what is the design, and how much did the parts cost,
and if you made more, how much would you charge?
Dave Pike
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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1844, 09/29/95