HOMEBREW Digest #1930 Tue 09 January 1996

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		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

  DO levels/slow 1056 (Jim Busch)
  chest freezer taps, portable keg coolers (Jeff Myers)
  Wyeast 1056;1st Batch (Michael Genito)
  Apricot Ale (SGT James A. Torrie )
  Bending Cu Tubing (Charlie Scandrett)
  What's a good beer spot in San Francisco? ("Michael D. Fairbrother")
  HBD is great stuff! (Bucket99)
  New Wyeast Advanced Cultures ("William D. Knudson")
  Wyeast 1028 -> Porter (Judith Morgan or Jerzy Niesytto)
  Starter Gravity Calculations (John W. Braue, III)
  Wort Chillers and Wort Chilling (John W. Braue, III)
  Request: pH meter info. (Judith Morgan or Jerzy Niesytto)
  Gushers (John Meredith)
  Mini vs Corney Kegs (Richard Nantel)
  Oxygenation (A. J. deLange)
  Glycerol/Wyeast Cells/Diauxism (A. J. deLange)
  Cheap Hop Scales (C.D. Pritchard)
  Growing Yeast from slants (RORICK)
  Fruit Beer Thanks ("Mountain, Glenn")
  Using Lager Yeast Properly (Denis Barsalo)
  I agree with J. Schmidling! (Charlie Scandrett)
  Metabolism/pH Readings/Yeast Storage (A. J. deLange)
  Beer Haze ("John P. Linton")
  Fruit in Beer (KennyEddy)
  Lautering using 3 vessel system (Rick Seibt)rseibt at apk.net
  brewpubs in SF (NATEDA)
  Chest Freezer Modifications (kbwalker)
  re: Malt mill with concrete roller (C.D. Pritchard)
  Re: (U) Natural Gas Connection Option (Jim Griggers)
  Carbonation - Mixed size bottles (jcmas)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 14:42:54 -0500 (EST) From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov> Subject: DO levels/slow 1056 Our expert experimenter, A.J. reports: <If, in the <course of oxygenation, the headspace becomes filled with oxygen and is then <sealed off with a fermentation lock the amount of dissolved O2 will stay <close to its value at the time the O2 was shut off. In the experiment which <lead to the numbers above the DO level peaked at 14.2 mg/l (154% at 18.3C) <and was found to be at 14.1 mg/l (158% at 20.2C) 22 hours later. Of course, this is an experiment with water and no yeast. With yeast pitched in wort the DO levels should rapidly decrease as the yeast respires. A.J. knows this, I just wanted to point out that there are little practical cases where the DO levels would be high many hours after pitching. Jim writes about 1056: <While I cannot blame all my troubles with these batches on 1056 Wyeast, I <can provide what seems to work for me. ( By the way in the end I was happy <with all trubled batches). I recommend the following: 1) A one quart <starter from the foil pouch for 6 gallons 2) Buy as fresh a date code as <possible and do not store more than one month before starting (theoretically <this should not matter but I am superstitous) 3) Aerate, aerate, aerate!! < 4) Ferment at a minimum of 68 F, preferably in the low 70's. I agree with 1-3, but Ive used this yeast an awful lot and never had troubles with fermenting between 60-65F. In my opinion, a significant factor in healthy fermentation is the generation of the yeast pitched. I get my yeast from a local micro, and thus it is thick/dense slurry that has been around the block a few times in the fermentation game. Combine this with direct bubbling of O2 to reach A.J.'s numbers and this yeast is quite active between 60 and 65F. BTW, 65F is also the normal set temp that the local micro (Old Dominion) ferments this yeast at. Provided one brews often enough, repitching yeast slurry is the ideal way to get healthy ferments, and one of the keys to successfully brewing very high gravity beers that attenuate well. Just be sure to be careful with sanitation, as always. Ive also heard that 1056 has a very large O2 requirement, so getting as close to 8 mg/L is quite important when using this yeast. I doubt that folks who have sluggish ferments actually pitch the optimum cell count *and* achieve this DO level (not to mention the significance of amino acids, or lack thereof, in extract based beers). As for first wort hopping and the negative results with whirlpool hopping: This agrees completely with the comments that Bavarian brewers have told me with respect to late kettle hops. On many occaisons, Ive been admonished to avoid late hop additions (no later than 15 minutes before knockout) when brewing continental lagers. This includes Export, Helles, Maerzen and Pils. The news about early hop action is certainly a bit of a suprise. Carrick asks: <I am trying to find a cheap source for stainless steel valves and fittings. Sorry but *cheap* and *SS fittings* cannot be used in the same sentence!! Jim Busch busch at daacdev1.stx.com A Victory For Your Taste! Festbier, Lager and IPA Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 12:55:49 -0700 From: Jeff Myers <JMYERS at oss.oceaneering.com> Subject: chest freezer taps, portable keg coolers Martin Wilde asked (in HBD 1928) about mounting taps in a chest freezer, without drilling holes in the side walls - A year or so ago there was a posting in the HBD from someone who had a solution for the mounting taps on a chest freezer problem. They had made a wood "collar" that set on top of the chest edge, attached with silicon caulk and at the original hinge mounting points with brackets. They then mounted the lid, using the original hinges, to the top of the "collar". All of the taps (and a CO2 line penetration) were run through the "collar". I used a similar solution to make a cheap and portable 5 gal keg cooler. I bought two cheap (plastic Igloo) 48 qt coolers. I took off both lids, and set one upside down on top of the other with a collar made of 2x 10's (on edge) in between, with a slot routed on the top and bottom edges of the collar to mate with the cooler edges. This is just big enough for 2 kegs, with the inside tall enough for my tallest kegs (with fittings). The CO2 in line went through the existing drain plug hole of the upside down top cooler, and I drilled 2 more holes in the front of that cooler for the beer out lines. I used bungee cords to hold the coolers together, and tied the CO2 bottle to them as well. This setup maintained ice around the 2 kegs for three Texas fall days (88-90F day, 70F nights), and worked quite well. I bought 2 extra drain plugs to put in the extra holes to be able use both coolers as coolers with their tops replaced. If I was going to do it over I would use a plywood and foam sandwich instead of the 2x10s, to keep it a little lighter. Jeff Myers Houston, Texas Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 15:39:51 -0500 From: genitom at nyslgti.gen.ny.us (Michael Genito) Subject: Wyeast 1056;1st Batch First, my added $.02 on Wyeast 1056: I brewed a batch of Pale Ale using Wyeast 1056. Did the whole bit - smack the pack ahead of time (it swelled); cooled the wort and added it and the yeast to the fermenter and air locked it. Went to bed. Woke up at ~65F - the spousal unit had lowered the thermostat for night time. After 24 hours, no activity! Seeing all the postings, it appears that room temp at 65F may be too low. Experience has taught me to wait just a bit longer, and if no activity occurs, repitch. We'll see... Then, in HBD1928: >From: "Douville, Lawrence F." <nop2689 at dsac.dla.mil> >Subject: 1st Batch of Brew >Hi all, > I got a homebrewing kit as a Christmas gift and am very anxious to >start brewing but want to make sure that I do everything right. So I >thought that I would post a message here for some advice. > Larry Douville Larry, Congratulations! Most important - don't worry! Keep everything clean and sanitized. Let your ingredients boil for at least 30 minutes. Pitch your yeast when the wort has cooled to 75F-80F. After bottling, let your bottles sit at room temperature for about a week before you relocate (if you do) to a cooler place such as a basement or refrigerator. Then let them age about 2 more weeks. Cream Ale is a great first kit. >From: louisp at gladstone.uoregon.edu (ummmmm.......Fred) >Subject: Wort coolers > > I am _almost_ ready to brew my first batch of beer. I can hardly >wait! I try to read a bit on a subject before jumping right in. I have >heard that wort coolers are important. Wort coolers (chillers) aren't the important thing - cooling the wort is important. Wort chillers make it convenient, especially if you are boiling more than a couple gallons of wort. If you're just using extract or specialty grains and extract, I've never had a bad batch adding the couple of gallons of boiled wort to 4 gals cold water in the fermenter, the resulting temperature being within the range that yeast can be pitched. I disagree with Charlie P representing that it is better to buy than make a wort chiller - it's very easy. To avoid kinking, you can either use a round form, such as a small pot to bend the tubing around, or use a tubing bender. You can buy a tubing bender from a plumbing supply, but many local hardware or plumbing stores will lend you theirs or even bend your tubing, especially if you tell them what you're doing with it. In fact - bribe them with a homebrew, it works all the time. > Also, I was wondering, doesn't the wort pick up any metallic taste? >And, is the tubing sterilized upon immersion into the boiling wort (makes >sense it should, but...) Thanks :] I've noticed no metallic taste in mine. Immerse the chiller ~10 minutes before the end of the boil, and it will be sanitized. Michael A. Genito, Director of Finance, Town of Ramapo 237 Route 59, Suffern, NY 10901 TEL: 914-357-5100 x214 FAX: 914-357-7209 Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 96 15:50:21 EST From: SGT James A. Torrie <jatorrie at cbdcom.apgea.army.mil> Subject: Apricot Ale While in DENVER a couple of months ago I had the BEST Apricot Ale I have ever had. Matter of fact it's the only one I have had. If someone knows a good recipe or two I would like to try them. Thanks in advance, Gasman Torrie "Have the bugler sound the charge!" Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 07:54:20 +1100 From: merino at cynergy.com.au (Charlie Scandrett) Subject: Bending Cu Tubing Louis P asked, LP>I have heard that wort coolers are important. I saw one at a local brew LP>supply house, and said to myself, "heck I could build one of those." I went LP>to a local home improvement store and bought a twenty foot length of copper LP>tubing, and a few fittings. To get to the point, how can one bend the LP>tubing without kinking it? Fill it with sand. Charlie (Brisbane, Australia) Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 17:00:28 -0500 From: "Michael D. Fairbrother" <mdf at apollo.hp.com> Subject: What's a good beer spot in San Francisco? I be in San Fancisco on this tuesday night, a bit of a hike from New Hampshire, but that's ok as long as there's a good beer spot in town. Michael Fairbrother Derry, New Hampshire Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 18:52:30 -0500 From: Bucket99 at aol.com Subject: HBD is great stuff! As a new home brewer, it's extremely nice to have HBD to help me along. I have found this digest to be invaluable in passing along information to help all home brewers. I found the 1st wort hopping information VERY interesting. The only thing I would change is: Some Home brewers that post here seem to take great pleasure in flaming others, and/or acting like snobs in general. If you believe in this hobby, (And it is a HOBBY unless you are employed as a brewer) then ALL homebrewers should try and further the participation of other people in it! Not flame or put down other brewers. You CAN discuss the merits of a position WITHOUT attacking the originator. Anyway, remember the 11th commandment. THOU SHALL NOT LET THY FERMENTER SIT EMPTY! Return to table of contents
Date: 05 Jan 96 19:16:20 EST From: "William D. Knudson" <71764.203 at compuserve.com> Subject: New Wyeast Advanced Cultures Has anyone brewed with the new advanced culture series from Wyeast? Has anyone got information as to commercial equivalents on these yeasts? I have brewed with only one so far. It was the Abbey II. I made a 65 pt Dubbel. It came OK. Much less estery and phenolic than the original which I believe is 'Chimay'? This wasn't a great effort in that the beer was drier than I wanted, (but that's an unrelated problem and another story) In any case, NO BANANAS! Private E-Mail OK, I'll post a summary of responses. Bill Ich kann besser Deutsch wenn ich ewtas Bier getrunken habe. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 18:39:43 -0600 From: jm.jn at mail.utexas.edu (Judith Morgan or Jerzy Niesytto) Subject: Wyeast 1028 -> Porter >Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 10:31:32 -0500 (EST) >From: GKING <GKING at ARSERRC.Gov> >Subject: question re: Wyeast 1028 > >Dear HBD Collective, > >I recently brewed a light-bodied bitter, using Wyeast 1028 London >yeast for the first time. The resulting ale has a very yeasty flavor. >While I like the flavor, it is on the strong side. In fact, the yeast >flavor dominates the total flavor profile. Greg - maybe you kept it in secondary fementer to short ? 1028 London is described as having medium flocculation. It works pretty quickly though - I made "traditional" Porter ( partial mash and recipe from Dave Miller's book p228) - it started fermenting 12hrs after pitching (OG 60) (temp. ~75F) and I bottled it 9 days later (FG 11.5). I kept it for about 1 mo before drinking and there was not much of yeasty taste (and it is even better now - 2.5 mo later!). Later, JT Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 20:00:53 From: braue at ratsnest.win.net (John W. Braue, III) Subject: Starter Gravity Calculations Simonzip at aol.com writes: >As I understand it, when making yeast starters its a good idea for the stater >to be roughly the same gravity as that the beer will be. That being the case, >are there any formulas to accuratly determin the gravity of a starter without >dropping a hydrometer into it? I currently put 5-6 tablespoons of dry malt >extract into an Erlenmeyer flask with 400-500ml water, boil, cool, pitch, >shake. Well, the simplest method, of course, is just to make as a starter culture a small fraction of whatever you intend to brew. Probably doesn't work too well with all-grain, of course... As I recall, 1 lb. of pure glucose dissolved in 1 gal (U.S.) of water gives a solution with a gravity of 1.047. Assuming that all sugars will be the same within a couple of percentage points, then you can calculate: OG = 1 + (.047 * % of fermentables * weight (in lbs.) of malt / volume (in gals.) of water) A reasonable metric equivalent would be: OG = 1 + (.395 * % of fermentables * mass (in kg.) of malt / volume (in liters) of water) Purists will point out that density of solution is not a linear function of amount of solute, and that there are differences in densities of solutions of various sugars, but, what the heck, this is not Stochiometry 442. - -- John W. Braue, III braue at ratsnest.win.net I prefer both my beer and my coffee to be dark and bitter; that way, they fit in so well with the rest of my life. I've decided that I must be the Messiah; people expect me to work miracles, and when I don't, I get crucified. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 19:48:42 From: braue at ratsnest.win.net (John W. Braue, III) Subject: Wort Chillers and Wort Chilling louisp at gladstone.uoregon.edu (ummmmm.......Fred) writes: > I am _almost_ ready to brew my first batch of beer. I can hardly >wait! I try to read a bit on a subject before jumping right in. I have >heard that wort coolers are important. I saw one at a local brew supply >house, and said to myself, "heck I could build one of those." I went to a >local home improvement store and bought a twenty foot length of copper >tubing, and a few fittings. To get to the point, how can one bend the >tubing without kinking it? Simplicity itself...almost. Method #1 is to fill the copper tubing with beeswax or a substance of similar consistency, and let the material solidify. You can then twist the pipe to your heart's content. Method #2 is to use a bending fixture, an item similar to a half-die with a number of different radii. This can be expensive, so you may want to bribe your friendly local plumber to let you use his. (A tip o' the glass (not too far, I don't want to spill the beer) to my wife, ex-machinist, who suggested these two ideas. She also had a third which, she determined, was not suitable for an item to be used with a food product such as beer). > Also, I was wondering, doesn't the wort pick up any metallic taste? >And, is the tubing sterilized upon immersion into the boiling wort (makes >sense it should, but...) Thanks :] The wort doesn't pick up a metallic taste, because the copper will be (if it's not already) instantly "passivated" by the formation of a micro-layer of copper oxide. Given normal usage, this coating will never be disturbed. Of course, if you have far more money than I, you could get custom stainless tubing (definitely do *not* attempt to bend this yourself). The coil will be sanitized by immersion in the boiling wort. The wort chill*er* is less important than wort chill*ing*. The really sleazy method of chilling the wort, which I use, is simply to immerse the whole pot into a sink of cold water, and let it sit a while. - -- John W. Braue, III braue at ratsnest.win.net I prefer both my beer and my coffee to be dark and bitter; that way, they fit in so well with the rest of my life. I've decided that I must be the Messiah; people expect me to work miracles, and when I don't, I get crucified. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 18:59:29 -0600 From: jm.jn at mail.utexas.edu (Judith Morgan or Jerzy Niesytto) Subject: Request: pH meter info. Howdy - trying to keep my brewing on the scientific side I decided to get a pH meter. I tried paper strips and they seem notoriously inaccurate - I knew only that I was not totally off (pH = 9 etc). Does anybody have a positive/negative experience with different models like eg. Checker or Phep3 ? Is temperature compensation worth paying extra ? Thanx, Jerzy Niesytto PS. I tried recently to carbon-filter all my brewing water and pH went from: >6.2 for tap water (strip being pink-purple) to: <4.6 for filtered water (strip did not change color) Any theory? Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 11:50:54 -40962758 (CST) From: John Meredith <johnm at byron.apana.org.au> Subject: Gushers Recently in one HBD (sorry - can't remember which), someone mentioned that gushers were a result of a bacterial infection. Having had one brew where nearly every bottle did indeed gush, I decided to pay particular attention to sanitization with a honey-wheat beer. Now the problem is that my new beer also gushes, but only when warm. When chilled the beer does not show any signs of gushing. Any thoughts? BTW, both brews taste fine. TIA. Here's my honey-wheat recipe (extract). The yeast I used was cultivated from a Fransiskaner Hefe-Weissbier. I'm unsure if this is a bottling yeast, but the resulting beer has a light body and good head retention. A nice drinkable summer beer (IMHO).In retrospect I'd be inclined to use 1 lb of a stronger honey (Australian blue gum ;-) and 1lb of dry malt extract to give better body. 1 can Munton&Fison's Premiere Weizen 2 lbs Light honey (strawberry clover) 1 lb Dextrose A suitable Weizen yeast (preferably liquid) 3/4 cup sugar or equivalent malt extract. Procedure: Boil honey, Weizen extract and dextrose for 15 minutes in 1.5 gal water. Tip into fermenter, and add water to make up 5 gal. Allow to cool and add yeast. Fermentation should be complete in around 3-4 days. Bottle with priming sugar. OG : 1.040 FG : 1.008 - -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "A cynic is a person searching for an John Meredith honest man, with a stolen lantern." Tel. ++61 369 1483 -- Edgar A. Shoaff Email: johnm at byron.apana.org.au Return to table of contents
Date: 06 Jan 96 20:26:03 EST From: Richard Nantel <72704.3003 at compuserve.com> Subject: Mini vs Corney Kegs Forgive me if this has been covered. I'm new here. I'm too busy to bottle and would like to begin kegging. I don't know whether to go with a cornelius or 5 litre mini-kegs. I brew mainly low carbonated English-type ales. Also, I only drink one to two beers per day so a batch tends to last me about two months. Any suggestions? Any pros and cons you'd like to pass on that may influence my decision? TIA Richard Nantel Private e-mail OK to 72704.3003 at compuserve.com Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 19:48:36 -0500 From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange) Subject: Oxygenation Pat Babcock sent e-mail asking what level of oxygenation could be expected from an aerating cane. I sacrificed an old racking cane to try this and had one heck of a time getting it to work i.e. the hole size had to be just right or I couldn't maintain the syphon. I did finally get one going and found that deoxygenated water run through it came out at 14% saturation. A more efficient injector or even a better made aeration cane would doubtless have resulted in a higher level. While at it I took the 14% water and poured it from counter height into a pot on the floor with the following results: No. Pours % Saturation 0 14% 1 49 2 71 3 82 4 91 5 96 This thus seems like a pretty good method of aeration but, of course, the wort is exposed not only to the oxygen in the air during this process but everything else as well. A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore! ajdel at interramp.com Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 1996 12:46:33 -0500 From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange) Subject: Glycerol/Wyeast Cells/Diauxism This was not picked up when posted yesterday so here goes again: Glycerol, CH2(OH)CH(OH)CH2(OH) is not a sugar but is so close to the trioses dihydroxyacetone CH2(OH)C(O)HCH2(OH) and glyceraldehyde CHOCH(OH)CH2(OH) that we might overlook it if someone calls it a sugar. Yeast make it by reducing and dephosphorylating dihydroxyacetone phosphate which is an intermediate in the glycolytic pathway. In # 1927 Rob Reed commented on the necessity for the use of a starter for Wyeast packages. As I had often wondered about this I took an old Wyeast 2007 package, samcked it and immediately (i.e. before any multiplication could take place) counted cells. I estimate that the package contained 4.6E9 cells. This is approximately 100E6/ml (the package contains 50 ml of starter). As this post was not picked up yesterday (Saturday) I had time to smack a fresh pack of the same strain and let it swell (to about an inch and a half) over night. It yielded an estimated 2.1E9 cells i.e. about half (but within an order of magnitude). Interesting that no multiplication appears to take place. I suppose that this must be because the environment in the package is anaerobic. On the other hand we could have a statistical variation situation here. Accepting that 10E6 (1E6 per degree Plato) is a nominal adequate pitching rate the observed number of cells is sufficient to pitch 5 - 10 times the package fluid volume of 50 ml or 250 - 500 ml. As a five gallon wort is about 19 litres it is clear that use of the package alone results in gross underpitching. On the same general subject, Ken Schwarz asked in #1928 about the distilled water technique with Wyeast products. I am speculating wildly but strongly suspect that this may be exactly what they do. If you cut open a Wyeast pack you will find the yeast suspended in a clear fluid (and a small envelope of nutrient which you break to start things off). Is that fluid distilled water? It should work. Everyone knows that Wyeast packages are useable long, long after their expiration dates are past but that they take longer to swell. This is consistent with the progressive loss of viabilkity of the cells over time. Acouple of ways to preserve Wyeast strains using the distilled water technique come to mind. 1. Don't break the pack. Use sterile transfer techniques to remove some of the liquid to a small sterile tube and store this. 2. Don't break the pack. Dilute the cells to the point where single cell colonies can be grown on a plate. Transfer the colonies to tubes of distilled water. 3. Smack the pack. Brew with it. Harvest the yeast. Wash and store some of the cells under distilled water. 4. Single cell culture the yeast sediment from the brew etc... The mysteries of the diauxic nature of yeast metabolism are now somewhat less obscure thanks to Tracy Aquilla who e-mailed with a message containing the magic word "acetate". In the generic bacterium/plant cell ethanol can be used as a carbon source for respiration anaboolism. It is oxidized to acetate in the cytosol and this combines with CoA to form acetlyl CoA which enters the glyoxylate cycle. Succinate thrown off from this cycle then enters the Krebs cycle (in the mitochondrion) and the rest of the pathway is as in respiration of carbohydrate (which brewer's yeast don't respire). This was all right there on p 587 of H,B,S & Y after all but it took Tracy's note to make it click. He is doing a paper on all this and I'm sure we are all looking forward to it. The remaining question is "Where does the glyoxylate cycle take place?" Plants and bacteria have organelles called "glyoxysomes" but no diagram of a yeast cell I have ever seen shows these. A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore! ajdel at interramp.com Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 96 16:01 EST From: cdp at chattanooga.net (C.D. Pritchard) Subject: Cheap Hop Scales $2.50- item# 10902 "Pocket Postal Scale" from American Science and Surplus at 800-934-0722. They have lots of other stuff for adapting to home brewing. (No connection, ect, just a very happy customer.) The scale is about 3"x4" and is packed in a flat "leather" case. It's made in Taiwan, gold electroplated and goes from 0 to 4 oz. in 1/4 oz. increments. Use a baggie hung from the alligator clip that's affixed to one end of the scale to hold your hops for weighting. For those familiar with the drug culture of the 60's- these gizmos were very popular for weighting another herb. C.D. Pritchard cdp at chattanooga.net Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 07 Jan 96 18:20:57 +0600 From: RORICK at imssys.com Subject: Growing Yeast from slants OK folks, I have saved and used yeast slurry before, but never grown anything from slant. Is there any consensus on a method to build up enough yeast to pitch? Anyone know a source of information? Thanks, jim _______________________________________________________ James T. Rorick rorick at imssys.com http://www.cs.umbc.edu/~jtroric Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 96 08:56:00 est From: "Mountain, Glenn" <mountg at post.crc.cra.com.au> Subject: Fruit Beer Thanks Thanks to all who replied to my post about problems associated with producing a clear fruit beer. The consensus seemed to be that steeping the fruit prior to the boil was my major problem and the pectin from the juice was set by the boil. The suggestions were to add the fruit/juice after the boil or to the secondary. The use of a pectinase enzyme was also suggested (thanks Spencer, Dave, Tim) of which I had not known about.. Armed now with all the information recieved I will shortly attempt my third fruit wheat beer. Glenn Mountain Melbourne, Australia mountg at post.crc.cra.com.au Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 1996 22:25:01 -0500 From: denisb at CAM.ORG (Denis Barsalo) Subject: Using Lager Yeast Properly Hello you all, I've been making ales and lagers for a while and I would like some guidance on how to properly use lager yeast. This has been my procedure for the last few lagers that I've brewed: I made a starter using 5tbs of DME in 2 cups of boiling water and added a few pellets of Northern Brewer hops. I left it at room temperature for a few days (68F to72F) until there was a krausen. I then pitched it to my cooled wort and left it at the same room temperature until there was a krausen in the primary. Once the beer seemed well off and fermenting, I moved it to the cold room where the temperature is closer to 40F to 45F. It stayed there until fermentation completed. I then racked it to another carboy, and returned it to the cold room for another couple of weeks. I then bottled the beer, left the cases at room temperature 7 to 10 days, then back to the cold room for more conditioning. (Minimum 7 to 10 days again) Even though the beers taste great with a nice hazelnut and grain flavor, and the color is nice and clear, I think I can improve my methods. I want to know if I can pitch at a colder temperature? What about the starter? Is the sudden temperature drop (from 68F to 45F) bad for my beer and yeast? Would the best procedure be to pitch a slightly lower temperature like 55F and slowly drop the temperature as the beer starts to ferment? I presently don't have the technology to do that, is that what all those fancy fridge and freezer thermostat controllers are for? What would be the best low-tech method to achieve a proper lager? TIA Not Worrying, Relaxing and Enjoying a Homebrew! Denis Barsalo Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 20:39:44 +1100 From: merino at cynergy.com.au (Charlie Scandrett) Subject: I agree with J. Schmidling! Jack posted that his best aroma came from this technique, JS>The water was brought to a boil, hops added, heat JS>turned off and allowed to steep for 10 min. This was added to the JS>beer after the first week of fermentation. JS>Guess what? It tastes and smells like European Pils. JS>I have now concluded that the taste and smell I didn't like was the JS>taste and smell of raw hops. It must be boiled to remove the grassy JS>flavor and aroma but not long enough to lose the desired aroma. JS>Furthermore, most or all of that aroma and taste are lost in long JS>boil, cool down and primary fermentation. I have a similar experience. I always steep the aroma hops for 20 minutes in 60-75C hot wort, then add 3-5 minutes before the end of the boil. I believe 1st wort method is similar but with an hour plus boil.(My reasoning was, extraction time without destruction of volatiles, then sanitisation for 3-5 minutes) I may be right for the wrong reasons! If we can just find what heat (not boiling) does to hop aroma compounds, then we can understand how the same method can produce aroma compounds that survive a long boil. Perhaps my/Jack's methods might be a bit more econimical because I think a 90 minute boil is going to have a fairly high attrition rate on anything called "volatile", I think that complex aromatics have a tendency to be delicate. MR. Fix? Any enlightenment? Charlie (Brisbane, Australia) Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 09:43:41 -0500 From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange) Subject: Metabolism/pH Readings/Yeast Storage All WRT #1929: Thanks to Craig Amundsen for his comments on diauxism (I think I invented a word). A couple of comments on his post: While alcohol may be somewhat bacteriostatic, the reason that organisms deprived of oxygen ferment is to produce NAD which is required in the early steps of glycolysis. Thus energy (in the form of ATP) production from fuel can continue absent O2. In the case of yeast, NADH is oxidized to NAD thus reducing acetaldehyde and producing ethanol. Brewing yeast only exhibit Crabtree effect (reversion to fermentation in the presence of O2) when glucose levels are high (as far as I know). In the presence of other fermentable sugars growth takes place when O2 is available. Fermentation is much less efficient than respiration (which brewers yeast don't do in the usual sense anyway) but the pathway is simpler i.e. it is a reversion to an ancient pathway. Finally, the reaction in which pyruvate is decarboxylated to acetaldehyde is, for all practical purposes, irreversible. Thus when humans consume ethanol it is oxidized (producing an excess of NADH which leads to all sorts of problems) in the cytolsol of hepatic cells to acetaldehyde which is oxidized in the mitochondria to acetate and disposed of from there. Much of the misery of hangover is due to the toxic effects of acetaldehyde and disulfiram (Antabuse (TM)), which wives used to be able to buy from catalog adds which encouraged them to sneak it into their boozy husbands coffee, enhanced this effect by blocking the metabolism of acetaldehyde. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Dave Houseman asked about erratic pH meter readings. pH meters are simply finicky gadgets at times. There are several things which can cause erratic readings. Very low ion content in the water is one of them but you have plenty of ions present. Are the buffer readings stable? The usual source of error is fouling of the junction so you need to make sure that is clear. Aspiration of fill solution through the junction with a bulb and sandpapering of the junction represent drastic measures to clear it if simple washing won't. In brewing, protein often clogs the junction (and coats the sensing bulb as well). Enzyme based electrode cleaners are available to remove this. Eventually the sensing bulb glass becomes deactivated and the electrode must be replaced. It can, however, often be rejuvenated. Try immersing on 0.1N HCl (hardware store HCl seems to be 8.7N and can be diluted 100:1 to get 0.087N) for a few seconds. Then rinse and go into 0.1N NaOH (this is now being sold in homebrew shops as part of a wine acid titration kit). Rinse and go back to HCl. Back and forth a few times. If the electrode is filled, try replacing the filling solution. See the instruction manual (or sheet) that came with the electrode and follow their rejuvenation directions if they conflict with what I have written. Unfortunately, a couple of years is about all you can expect from even the best electrodes. It may simply be time to get a new one. Other possibilities for erratic readings are broken wires or loose connections. If this is the case you should not be able to get a stable reading from a buffer. Prior to reading a water sample be sure that all buffer has been rinsed off the electrode with distilled water (or extra water from the sample) and be sure to move the probe around in the sample so that electrolyte doesnt surround and shield the bulb. It may take 30 seconds for a reading to stabilize. Dave's water analysis is very typical of acidic well water run through a neutralizer (i.e. over crushed limestone) and then through a cation exchanger. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Pat Babcock asked 4 questions about the distilled water technique. I think 3 of them have been pretty well covered by Tracy's post in this number and elsewhere but I will comment on the room temperature issue. I was told of this technique by S.C. Jong of the ATCC who consults to several S.E. Asian breweries. He was quite specific about room temperature storage because of problems with contamination of the tubes in refrigerators (which are really microbiological jungles). Furthermore, the published work I cited in an earlier post was done at romm temperature. Thus it appears that room temperature will work but I have to believe that reduced temperature would result in enhanced viability. It seems to me that the tubes could be protected from bugs by sealing in zip lock bags, dipping in beeswax or somesuch. Nonetheless I am experimenting at room temperature as a "worst case". A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore! ajdel at interramp.com Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 96 10:33 EST From: "John P. Linton" <0003726529 at mcimail.com> Subject: Beer Haze What is/are the causes of hazy beer. I just tried a few bottles of an all malt wheat extract and although the flavor and carbination are fine, the beer is very cloudy. The haze is present in both the warm and cold bottles. Any and all commects are welcome. Thanks in advance. jl Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 10:36:42 -0500 From: KennyEddy at aol.com Subject: Fruit in Beer While I have not (yet) made a fruit beer, I recently tasted a phenomenal cherry porter which I would like to try my own hand at. The fruit part was accomplished by first blanching (dipping briefly in boiling water) the destemmed fresh cherries so as to kill any wild yeast and other bugs. The cherries were then placed in a ziploc bag and frozen. The porter was made and fermented about half way (with respect to gravity); the cherries were then thawed and crushed in the bag, then dumped into the fermenter, skins and all. The brewer had sampled the brew every month for the first four months and was disappointed; when I tried it it was six months old and the brewer was amazed at the maturation that occurred in those two months. Time is important! The 5-gal recipe was a pretty generic porter (1 lb crystal, 1/2 lb chocolate, pale fermentables to taste [about 1.050 OG if I remember right], very lightly hopped) with 6 lbs fresh cherries prepared as described. The balance between the porter and the cherry flavors was *perfect*. Ken Schwartz El Paso, TX KennyEddy at aol.com Nancy Reagan at a "Just Say No" rally: "I didn't intend for this to take on a political tone. I'm just here for the drugs." Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 11:15:15 -0500 From: (Rick Seibt)rseibt at apk.net Subject: Lautering using 3 vessel system I am in the planning stage of my three vessel all grain brewery, and have found HBD to be invaluable in assembling the hardware. I plan to use the level 3 keg system with a pump(s) to move the liquids. My questions are concerning the brewing process changes I need to make. I will be mashing and lautering in the same vessel(#2) with #1 holding hot liquor and #3 being the kettle. The usual configuration. My questions are: 1) Do I need to change the mash water/grist ratio to account for the liquid that will be under the false bottom (perf'd SS)?(I probably will recirculate) 2) When sparging, how will I pump the wort from the M/L tun to the BK? If I turn on the pump, won't it "pull" the wort out, thereby decreasing efficiency? 3) Are there others that I will encounter once I get going? Is there anyone using these systems that has addressed these problems, or should I just relax? Private email is ok, I'd be happy to summarize. Thank you Rick Seibt rseibt at apk.net Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 11:20:35 -0500 From: NATEDA at aol.com Subject: brewpubs in SF I'm heading to San Francisco and Napa for a visit in a few weeks. Would appreciate the names of brewpubs in the immediate area. Got to spend the time constructively while my better half is in her meetings. And if any of you hop heads are also into Country/Western dancing are their any good dance places in the immediate SF area? Thanks Nate Apkon nateda at aol.com Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 11:00:32 -0600 From: kbwalker at mmm.com Subject: Chest Freezer Modifications Y'all, Martin Wilde wanted to know about how to install taps in a chest freezer. Just as Martin suggested << Don't Drill Holes In The Side! >> The tubing that carries the refrigerant is aluminum and part of the chest wall. There is no way to repair it. There is a way to install taps that I heard about recently, (from a guy who has an unrepairable chest freezer with a hole in the side). This involves minor carpentry nothing more complicated. 1. Remove the hinges from the side of the chest. 2. Build an extension for the side of chest freezer. You can use 2x4's oriented with the 4" side vertically. This will be a simple frame made from 4 pieces of wood. They sit on the top edge of the chest wall where the top seals. You may want to attach the wood to the chest wall with Liquid nails or some other glue/sealant. 3. Attach the hinges to the wood extension and run the taps through the wood extension. These are suggestions and a place to start (I heard about this second hand). You could use fancy wood or carve hunting scenes or ... use your imagination (which, among this bunch is considerable). Hope my first post helps someone, Kevin Walker Brewing Walker's ESB* in Sugar Land, Texas *Extra Special Bubba My opinions are my own and not those of my employer. Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 6 Jan 96 16:15 EST From: cdp at chattanooga.net (C.D. Pritchard) Subject: re: Malt mill with concrete roller dludwig at atc.ameritel.net posted in #1928: >On another subject, not to long ago, someone was experimenting with a >concrete grain mill. How's it working? I've put over 20 lbs thru it so far, including a couple of lbs of rather hard crystal malt and 2 mashes with the milled malt- either stuck and the efficiencies were pretty good but under what the recipe I used in Miller's book. One was a RIMS with flow of 3/4 to 1 GPM. The mill works so well I've abandoned the idea of making a 2 roller version. I am going to connect a 1/2" drill to it and (picking up on the motorized malt mill thread) explore the fatigue properties of the mill's 5/8" shaft and the 7" concrete wheel 8-> C.D. Pritchard cdp at chattanooga.net Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 15:48:22 -0500 (EST) From: Jim Griggers <brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> Subject: Re: (U) Natural Gas Connection Option In HBD 1928 "Al Czajkowski" <usfmc8fh at ibmmail.com> writes about a natural gas quick-connect manufactured by M. B. Sturgis Inc.: > (no affiliation...blah blah, don't even have one, just have the flier! > If any one has one, do you like it?) I bought two of these hose kits. One is connected to a portable gas grill that I converted from propane to natural gas. The second hose connects to my home-built keg boiler. I only have one outlet, so I can't grill and brew at the same time, but I see no problem with this. I bought the hose kits at Home Depot in the grill section. Look for the Char-Broil Natural Gas Hose Kit (made by M.B. Sturgis). I think it was around $36. The 12' hose comes with a 3/8" flare fitting on one end and a quick-connect on the other. The kit also includes the female quick-connect fitting which attaches to a 3/8" NPT pipe. It works about like plugging in an electrical appliance. The hose is made of flexible metal (stainless steel I think) covered with a vinyl sheath. The fittings are brass. The kit also has plastic caps and plugs to seal the quick-connects when not in use. The keg boiler I made uses a cast iron ring burner made for low pressure gas. With the orifice that I selected, it puts out about 30K BTUH. (calculated by timing the gas flow at the meter) I like the idea of not having to worry about running out of gas during a brew session, or having to take a propane tank to be refilled. (I do have a few spare propane tanks) I installed the gas outlet myself, but I have all the pipe cutting and threading equipment. I also have taken a gas code class at a local technical college, so I knew how to calculate pipe size and orifice requirements. __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |\/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/| |Jim Griggers brew at devine.columbiasc.ncr.com Columbia, SC| |______________________________________________________________| Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 96 11:19:43 CST From: jcmas at searle.monsanto.com Subject: Carbonation - Mixed size bottles I've bottled a batch with 12 oz. 17 oz. and 22 oz. bottles. Will they all carbonate at roughly the same amount of time?? If I test the 12 oz. bottles for carbonation, can I assume that the larger bottles will be similarly carbonated?? Thanks! John Mas E-Mail address :: JCMAS at SEARLE.MONSANTO.COM Return to table of contents