---

   FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
        Shawn Steele, Digest Janitor
        Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!

Contents:
  Sparkling Wine (John Artherton)
  HBD Problems ("JOHN C. THOMPSON")
  HBD HBD HBD HBD HBD Etc. (John Richardson)
  Re: Stupid beer quaffing tricks (guym at Exabyte.COM)
  recipe archives (Scott Abene)
  re: freezing yeast (BJFABB at ccmail.monsanto.com)
  Freezing Yeast (Geza T Szenes/IPL)
  Duplicate HBD's ("Jochen, Michael J.")
  ideal crush? ("Bryan L. Gros")
  SG won't go down (Gord Reid)
  Pump Question for RIMS Gurus (Lynn Ashley)
  Worlds Finest Microbrewery (bob.sutton at fluordaniel.com)
  Re: Freezing Yeast in a Non-Frost Free Freezer ("Prior, Mark")
  Copy of: Thursday May 23,1996 file ("David R. Burley")
  Majordomo results: #2044 ("David R. Burley")
  Great Taste tickets sold out (Robert Paolino)

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----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: John Artherton <metlhead at ix.netcom.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 00:31:32 -0700
Subject: Sparkling Wine

Regarding bottling with a sparkle, I am going to take your advise about 
the yeast and sugar... 1/2 cup per 5 gal, and will repitch with another 
packet of champagne yeast... tasted the boysenberry/blackberry wine 
yesterday when I racked it off, very dry, 1.000 S.G  from 1.093 O.G., 
very bitter.  Gonna bottle half of it as sparkling, the other half 
normal.  I'll have to send you a bottle UPS...  Bottled IPA yesterday.

>Aesoph, Michael wrote:
> 
> One thing that I am worried about is the "health" of my yeast for bottle 
priming..
> I am relatively sure that the alcohol content is extremely high and is
> probably killing the yeast off - making bottle priming impossible.
> 
>                                         Mike Aesoph

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From: "JOHN C. THOMPSON" <0005096260 at mcimail.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 96 06:05 EST
Subject: HBD Problems

- -- [ From: John C. Thompson * EMC.Ver #2.3 ] --

All:

I have seen the light, the folks at AOB are doing a fine job, as the count of
HBD 2044 I have received passes 42.  I have unsubscribed and no longer receive
the new digests on my business email, however, 2044 is like the pink bunny on 
TV
it just keeps coming and coming.


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From: John Richardson <shrink1 at mindspring.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 08:07:58 -0500
Subject: HBD HBD HBD HBD HBD Etc.

I, too, have gotten multiple copies of HBD.  Once, maybe, is understandable,
but day after day?  *My* thought is, If they can't get this right they must
have a helluva lot of hops in their Homebrew! You don't keep puttin' stuff
in 'til you run out!  I love HBD, but one copy is enough.  If you want to
send alot of something, send beer, we'll all give you our addresses.

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From: guym at Exabyte.COM
Date: Mon, 27 May 96 10:26:05 MDT
Subject: Re: Stupid beer quaffing tricks

     Chuck Epp writes:
     
> How about this for stupid beer-quaffing tricks? (And this is a question      

     > regarding pub etiquette.) Several days ago at my favorite local pub, I 
     > got a pint that wasn't filled to the rim.  It was significantly under.
     <Snip>
     > I politely asked to have the pint topped off, which the bartender 
     > amicably did, and for which I thanked him.  But my waitress then 
     > proceeded to lecture me on the cost of the brewpub's brewing
     > equipment and on the fact that they'd done market research and had
     > determined that $3 for a pint was perfectly acceptable, and that I
     > shouldn't be so cheap.
     <Snip>
     > How many of you have been so principled/daring/rude/selfish/whatever?  
     
Well Chuck, perhaps semantics are to blame here. While I cannot speak for      

     your local pub, I have found that typical "pint" glasses in US pubs are 
actually 14 oz. glasses, not 16 oz. as the name would suggest. In fact, I      

     have "won" several free rounds of beers for myself and those with me 
     because of this.  I would offhandedly mention that the "pints" they were 
     selling were actually not true pints to which the bartender would reply 
"sure they are, it says 'pint glasses' on the case the glasses came in". I     

then would offer to buy a mega swill brew to test my theory and pay for it     

if I was wrong. If the bartender was wrong, he would buy us a round. Each      

time, the bartender was genuinely surprised when the 12 oz. bottle of beer     

     would almost fill the glass.  My point?  $3.00 may be a fair price for a 
pint but, especially if we are talking 14 oz. "pints" it damn well better      

be a full one. Maybe your reply to the waitress should have been "your tip     

is in the amount of beer you wanted me to pay for but not drink". "Cheap"      

     indeed!
     
     --
     Guy McConnell /// Huntersville, NC


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From: Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 10:14:10 -0500
Subject: recipe archives

Hi all, 

Just a note to say that I have added a very empty recipe data-base (hint
hint) to my webpage.

I set it up much like the brewery has theirs (but it's empty) and added a
nifty input screen so that you can add your recipes right on line to a given
style. 

The URL is: http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat/recipes/

This service is free of course (with all the selling and bashing going on in
here lately, I just thought I would throw that in).

Happy Summer brewing, 

- -Scott


################################################################ 
#                     ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT	  	               #
#                Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com>                 #	
# http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat (the Homebrew "Beer Slut" page) #
#                           OR                                 #
#  http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat/Brew-Rat-Chat/ (Brew-Rat-Chat) #
#              "Get off your dead ass and brew"                #
#     "If beer is liquid bread, maybe bread is solid beer"     #
################################################################


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From: BJFABB at ccmail.monsanto.com
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 10:47:04 -0500
Subject: re: freezing yeast

Mark <PRIORM at IMS.IMSINT.COM> wrote:

>Has anyone had any luck maintaining frozen yeast cultures in non-frost-free
>freezer?  If so, what technique did you use?  How long were you able to
>maintain the cultures?

I assume that you mean a 'frost free' freezer, the type that undergoes 
periodic
warming cycles to remain frost free. I store my yeast in a small box lined top
and bottom with 'blue ice'-type packs. These serve to insulate the yeast 
during
the thaw cycles. I also assume that you are adding glycerol (same as glycerin)
to a final volume between 15 and 25 percent (vol/vol) before freezing your
cultures; very low viability without the glycerol! I've stored yeast up to 
about
two years with good success in a frost-free freezer. A 'non frost free' 
freezer
is more optimum to store the frozen yeast stocks; the colder the better. Here,
you need not use the insulated box technique as there should be no warming
cycles. Your best bet is if you have access to a -70 deg.C freezer, but if you
don't work in a lab...

Cheers,

Brad Fabbri


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From: Geza T Szenes/IPL <Geza_T_Szenes/IPL.IPL at notes.ipl.ca>
Date: 27 May 96  9:47:11 
Subject: Freezing Yeast

Thank you all who have responded to my post about unsuccessfully freezing 
yeast  both privately, and via the digest.  The summary of the replies was;

a) The ratio of glycerol to yeast slurry that I used may have been too low. (I 

used approximately 1 part Glycerol to 10 parts slurry) 
b) The temperature variations in the freezer compartment due to the defrost 
cycle of the frost free fridge may have had a killing effect on the yeast.

Although I have no empirical data I do not believe that the temperature 
fluctuates enough in the freezer compartment to affect the yeast. It basically 

has a fan to suck out the moisture, but I have never observed the temperature 
changing in there.

I will try to experiment with increasing the glycerol ratio to higher levels, 
starting at 2 to 10 ( I already know that 1 to 10 is not sufficient), until I 
find a ratio that works. 

However: One of the reasons I got into HomeBrewing is to get away from all the 

additives that may be found in commercial products. Therefore what I'd like to 

know is how much glycerol in 5 US Gallons (19 Liters) of beer is acceptable 
before:

1. Affects Taste?
2. Has a harmful (toxic) effect on people?

TIA



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From: "Jochen, Michael J." <jochen at UDel.Edu>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 12:39:53 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Duplicate HBD's

I, too, have been receiving multiple copies of the famous HBD #2044. To 
date, I have received about 40. I have tried unsubscribing and 
resubscribing... no luck. I just received ten more this morning. I've 
sent a note off to Shawn reflecting the nature of the problem. I have 
confidence that this minor glitch will be worked out soon... And that's 
just what it is, a MINOR glitch. It takes me about 3 seconds to press the 
delete key ten times and get rid of the extras...

cheerz,
- -mike

Michael J. Jochen            jochen at udel.edu           o o o    Don't Worry,  
Computer and Informational Sciences                   o |~~~|\    Have a      
University of Delaware  Newark, DE  USA              oo |~~~|/   Homebrew!    
Amateur Call: N3WQW          MARS Call: AAR3CGT         |___|     Prosit!

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From: "Bryan L. Gros" <grosbl at ctrvax.Vanderbilt.Edu>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 11:42:51 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: ideal crush?

I hate to bring up the subject of mills again, but I wonder what
the ideal crush should be:  is there one standard?

It seems to me that we're balancing two things.  One is separating
the husk and crushing the starch enough so that the enzymes
can get to it.  The other is leaving big enough pieces to form a
filter bed during the sparge.

For the former, you'd want everything crushed to powder and
for the latter, you'd want husks left whole.  Is this right?

If so, then I would want to adjust my Maltmill (TM) so that 
it crushes as fine as possible without messing up the sparge.
Everyone homebrewing has a different system with a 
different setup.  My setup (copper rings with slots on the
underside inside of converted sankey kegs) seems pretty
forgiving to the crush, so I crush my malt significantly
finer than the phil mill at the supply shop.  I have no
problems with my sparging, even with 60% wheat.

Is there one ideal crush or would the ideal crush vary with
one's equipment?  What am I missing?

               - Bryan
                 grosbl at ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
                 Nashville, TN


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From: Gord Reid <gdr at ra.isisnet.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 14:14:32 -0700
Subject: SG won't go down

Hi all,

Our very first batch doe homebrew doesn't seem to be cooperating. We started 
with a kit a
followed the instructions to the letter. Now after 18 days the SG is at 1.010 
and it has been for
about 4 days. Any suggestions for this newbie?

We thought of bottling it anyway with only a touch of sugar in the bottles but 
we are afraid they
my explode.

Thanks

gord


- ------------------------------

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From: Lynn Ashley <73744.3234 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 27 May 96 14:26:53 EDT
Subject: Pump Question for RIMS Gurus

To: INTERNET:homebrew at aob.org
 
With a RIMS as my goal, I been watching for inexpensive suitable 
pumps.  One which caught my attention is in the Surplus Center (SC) 
catalog, item 2-1045, $13, mfg by Gorman Rupp Model EK324498.  
 
It unfortunately comes in at the low end of the specs which 
Rodney Morris published in his article on RIMS.  Also its heat 
handling ability is not listed in the SC catalog description.
 
I ran the pump with boiling water for 1 hr and did not observe 
any problems (but my vinyl? hoses turned milky opaque).  As 
near as I can tell the pump meets all the specs described in 
the SC catalog.
 
Can any of you RIMS gurus comment on the suitability of this pump 
for 5 gal batches.
 
Areas which appear to come up short of Morris' recommendations are:
1.75 GPM  at  3 ft head, 3.5 GPM max --- Morris recommends 4-8 GPM  at  1 ft head;
5.5 ft max head --- Morris recommends 6-20 ft shut off head.
 
If anyone has a Gorman Rupp catalog perhaps it lists the max liquid 
temperature for continuous operation.  My test suggest it may be 
suitable for the mash temp range.  The SC catalog describes the pump 
as being chemical resistant and having a thermoplastic resin body 
and impeller.
 
This pump is not self priming.  With proper pump placement, is this 
a problem?
 
Other qualities of the pump appear to conform to Morris' recommendations: 
magnetic drive, 1/2" hosebard ports, triac motor controllable and 
~1/30 HP ?? (35% eff? & 230V  at  0.3A).  Morris recommends 1/50 to 1/20 HP.
 
Unless I hear something that causes me to reconsider, I will proceed 
on the assumption that this pump is suitable.  Maybe I can use RIMS
on my next batch!
________
 
I was surprised at how fast water moves in the 3 GPM range.  My 
recirculation/sparging experience makes me wonder how RIMS can get 
wort through the grain bed that fast.
________
 
Thanks Lynn.
________________________________________________________________________
    /
   /  /\      Lynn Ashley  (lajiao ren)      Arlington, Virginia, USA
  /__/__\     73744.3234 at compuserve.com      38.904N 77.120W 105mAMSL
____/____\______________________________________________________________

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From: bob.sutton at fluordaniel.com
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:51:10 -0400
Subject: Worlds Finest Microbrewery

Last week I had the opportunity to visit a shining example of a local 
microbrewery
located in Greenville, SC. During my visit I met the Brewmeister and was given 
a tour of
his fine facility. We started with the grain milling process. Given the recent 

embodiment of purported knowledge on milling which I have been ever so 
fortunate to
glean from the digest lately, I learned that the best extraction comes when 
the grain is
milled to a consistency similar to instant coffee. I was told that the 
extraction
efficiency was improved. By the way, the unit they used (I forget the name) 
had parallel
rollers. So much for that nonsense about skewed rollers. Maybe parallel 
rollers are more
difficult to manufacture (when I can't get a picture to hang straight, I tell 
everybody
that the artist intended it to lean to one side).

Next we visited the lauter tun. A simple non-agitated vessel to perform simple 
infusion
mashing. Temperature control is achieved by regulating the temperature of hot 
water
supplied from an adjacent tank. No 40-50-60 here (whatever that means).

The Brewmeister was particularly proud of the yeast strain ("It comes from 
over in
Europe"). Since I'm all in tune with the Krebs, Carnot, and Harley cycles, I 
asked about
how they cultured and scaled-up the strain. Seems like they inoculate the 
chilled wort
by pouring in a bag of dry yeast. Now, I wondering how much time I've been 
wasting with
liquid yeasts and two liter seed preps.

During the tour I noticed that the "Joy of Homebrewing" book lay amongst the 
clutter. I
was told that it is the "bible" of microbrewing, and that several of the 
varieties now
on tap, came from this fascinating source. A few other items came to light 
during my
visit. Lagers are too difficult to manage, and ales taste as good, if not 
better.

I asked about a hopback brew (I was curious as I had one running at the house 
during
this time). The Brewmeister told me that he wouldn't risk contaminating the 
fermentor
with hops ("you're just asking for trouble"). OK guys, fess up... how many 
hopbacks do
you dump down the drain due to contamination.

Finally I asked the Brewmeister where he had gotten his training. He told me 
that he was
hired as the bartender before management promoted him to Brewmeister. Make 
mine Coors
Light please.


Bob
Fruit Fly Brewhaus
Yesterday's Technology Today

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From: "Prior, Mark" <PRIORM at ims.imsint.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 96 15:56:00 EST
Subject: Re: Freezing Yeast in a Non-Frost Free Freezer

Yesterday, I asked:

> Has anyone had any luck maintaining frozen yeast
> cultures in non-frost-free freezer?  If so, what technique
> did you use?  How long were you able to maintain the
> cultures?

Woops, I meant a frost-free freezer.  Sorry, my mistake....  I'm aware that 
the temperature swings in a frost-free freezer can be lethal to yeast.  Has 
anyone been successful in maintaining cultures in a frost-free freezer? 
 What steps, if any, did you take to protect the yeast cultures from the 
warming cycles?  How long were you able to maintain the cultures?

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From: "David R. Burley" <103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 27 May 96 19:16:13 EDT
Subject: Copy of: Thursday May 23,1996 file

- ---------- Forwarded Message ----------

From:	David R. Burley, 103164,3202
TO:	Shawn Steele, Internet:homebrew-digest-request@ aob.org
DATE:	5/27/96 6:50 PM

RE:	Copy of: Thursday May 23,1996 file

Shawn,

Once or twice a day I get about a half dozen copies of the #2044 Thursday May 
23
file downloaded to my "compuserve/ download" file as Noname.dat or noname.00N
where N = 2-7.  Interestingly, not every file was #2044 even though it said it
was in the copy sent to the CIS mail/in-box file.  Since most of them were
#2044, I stopped checking and deleted without downloading.  I've been in the
hospital for some weeks and it took me some time to get through all of this.
Please straighten this out.

Good Luck on this new adventure!

Dave Burley


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From: "David R. Burley" <103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 27 May 96 19:19:12 EDT
Subject: Majordomo results: #2044

- ---------- Forwarded Message ----------

From:	INTERNET:majordomo at aob.org, INTERNET:majordomo at aob.org
TO:	David R. Burley, 103164,3202
DATE:	5/27/96 7:14 PM

RE:	Majordomo results: #2044

Sender: bacchus at aob.org
Received: from aob.org (bacchus.aob.org [205.168.231.42]) by 
dub-img-5.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515)
	id TAA27274; Mon, 27 May 1996 19:08:09 -0400
To: 103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM
From: majordomo at aob.org
Subject: Majordomo results: #2044
Reply-To: majordomo at aob.org
Date: Mon, 27 May 96 23:08:08 GMT
Sender: bacchus at aob.org
Message-ID:  <9605272308.aa12288 at bacchus.aob.org>

- --

>>>> Shawn,
**** Command 'shawn,' not recognized.
>>>> 
>>>> When I signed on to send you my previous memo about #2044, there was 
another
**** Command 'when' not recognized.
>>>> copy of #2044 in my "new Mail" sent to me! I had just cleared the "new 
mail"
**** Command 'copy' not recognized.
>>>> box of six copies minutes before sending you the previous memo.
**** Command 'box' not recognized.
>>>> 
>>>> HELP!!!!
**** Command 'help!!!!' not recognized.
>>>> 
>>>> Dave Burley 
**** Command 'dave' not recognized.
>>>> 
**** No valid commands found.
**** Commands must be in message BODY, not in HEADER.

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From: Robert Paolino <rpaolino at execpc.com>
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 22:23:54 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Great Taste tickets sold out

Mail order tickets for the Tenth Annual Great Taste of the Midwest are
sold out as of Memorial Day weekend.  Mark your calendars for 1 May 1997 
if you want to be sure to get tickets for next year's event.

As for you lucky ticket-holders, we'll see you in Madison on August 10!

Now go have a beer,


Bob Paolino                                     
Madison                                    rpaolino at earth.execpc.com
Have a beer today... for your palate and for good health


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