---

   FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
        Shawn Steele, Digest Janitor
        Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!

Contents:
  Monterrey, Mexico (RANDY ERICKSON)
  tut beer (Rscholz at aol.com)
  Yeast starters ("Craig Rode")
  Poor Man's *REAL* Counterpressure Bottler (KennyEddy at aol.com)
  Re: How to clean up a boilover? (korz at pubs.ih.lucent.com)
  maltose syrup (Andy Walsh)
  Shawn -Check of the text reader per My discussion ("David R. Burley")
  RE: KEG CONVERSION, help needed ("CHUCK HUDSON, ER LAB 3-2865")
  Open  Fermentation (Carrick Legrismith)
  Sparge water temperature (rlabor at lsumc.edu (LaBorde, Ronald))
  Vanilla Beer??? (tthomas3 at ford.com (Tim Thomas))
  Adding Salt to Sweeten?!?!?!?!! (aesoph at ncemt1.ctc.com (Aesoph, Michael))
  flavored extracts (toml at fcmc.COM (Tom Lochtefeld (Risk Mgt)))
  Canned Skunk ("Kirk Harralson")
  Wisconsin Plate "ZYMURGY" (rlarsen at pyrotechnics.com (Rich Larsen))
  stuck fermentation ("Allan Rubinoff")
  Re; hops drying (Bob Waterfall)
  gelatinization/German brewing (Jim Busch)
  Rob's Brown Ale ("Barry Wertheimer")
  Lazy Homebrewer (Troy)
  Re: competetive inhibition by maltose, heat-shock ("Tracy Aquilla")
  re:Drying hops (Kurt Schilling)
  Re: Hops Drying (Brian Cornelius)
  Re: The Clever Tongue/Iodophor/Igloo Coolers/HSF? (Bill Rust)
  RE:  Keg Conversion Help ("Palmer.John")
  RE: stuck fermentation <robe at cadmus.com> ("Decker, Robin E.")
  HSA & astringency / apple cider recipie ("Keith Royster")
  MP/TN Valley Hombrewers Competition (Barry Wertheimer)

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OTHER HOMEBREW INFORMATION
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  including the "Cat's Meow" archives is at http://alpha.rollanet.org/.
  Information is also available at info at aob.org by e-mail.  For other "Cat's
  Meow" information send mail to lutzen at alpha.rollanet.org.

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  e-mail to ftpmail at gatekeepter.dec.com for more information.


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: RANDY ERICKSON <RANDYE at mid.org>
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 1996 17:26:34 -0700
Subject: Monterrey, Mexico

Greetings:

I just found out this a.m. that I will be traveling to Monterrey, Mexico next
week.  The visitors guide sheet I got shows beer as a leading industry
down there.  Any Don't Miss/Don't Bother recommendations?

Thanks All -- Randy in Modesto, California


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From: Rscholz at aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 1996 16:49:00 -0400
Subject: tut beer

Brewsters;

here's the latest from Reuters on the egyptian beer. ( apologies for
copyright infringment)

LONDON, July 2 (Reuter) - Drinkers with a taste for the ancient and exotic --
not to mention the extremely expensive -- got a chance on Tuesday to sample a
beer brewed to a recipe dating from the time of the Egyptian Pharaoh
Tutankhamun.
   Billed as the world's most costly beer, the first bottle of Tutankhamun
Ale went on sale at the luxury London department store Harrods priced at
5,000 pounds ($7,800).
   The remaining 999 bottles in the batch will be sold for 50 pounds each. A
store spokesman said 200 bottles had already been snapped up by curious
customers.
   The ale, developed by an Egyptologist, two scientists and Britain's
largest brewer Scottish & Newcastle, has been dubbed the "Liquid Gold of the
Pharaohs".
   It is based on analysis of sediment from jars found in a brewery inside
the Sun Temple of Nefertiti, queen of the Pharaoh Akhenaten, believed to be
Tutankhamun's father.
   The team could only gather and grow enough of the right raw materials to
brew 1,000 bottles of the beer, which will be sold to fund further
Egyptological research.
   Harrods' Egyptian owner, Mohammed Al Fayed, donned an ancient Pharaonic
headdress to pose for the cameras as he cracked open a bottle of the
sweet-tasting brew.
   Fayed said he was delighted to offer his customers a taste  linked with a
civilisation 5,000 years old.
   "While the ancient Britons were clothed in animal skins and daubing
themselves with woad, the Egyptians were inventing mathematics and perfecting
astronomy," said Fayed, who recently failed in an attempt to take up British
citizenship.
   The individually numbered bottles of beer are being sold in special wooden
boxes. The labels read "Tutankhamun Ale" with "The Beer of His Majesty"
written over the top in hieroglyphics

deluking;

richard l scholz
still extact brewing but working up to all-grain soon.


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From: "Craig Rode" <craig.rode at sdrc.com>
Date: 2 Jul 1996 16:10:57 -0600
Subject: Yeast starters

Thanks for all the responses regarding my water.  (I posted too low a calcium,
I was going from memory.)  The consensus is that for tap water coming out at
pH 7.8, a dash of lactic acid in the sparge water should help.

Now on to another question.  Like the rest of you, I found a huge increase in
my beer's quality when I went to liquid yeast.  For a starter, I have been
using standard 22 oz bottles.  I boil the bottle, boil the extract, add hot
water to hot extract, cool, pitch the pouch, and wait 24 hours.  Works great.
However.....

It occured to me I am adding an extra step.  What if I:
1) Sanitized my carboy
2) Boiled the extract
3) Cooled the extract
4) Dumped that into my carboy
5) Pitched the yeast
6) Waited a day, then brewed, and siphoned my cooled wort on top of the
waiting hungry yeast?

Isn't the effect a small starter in a large bottle?  Why don't I do it this
way? Do you? Would the risk of infection be increased because I can't boil a
carboy?

And while we are (or I am) on the subject, how many of you use the sediment
from your last beer to create a starter for your next beer?   How many
generations would this work?  Would the yeast autolyze (er...eat itself) while
it was waiting in the bottle?  Would it work better if I primed with DME
instead of corn sugar? Does it matter?

Sounds like these are for you, Tracy......

Craig


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From: KennyEddy at aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 1996 16:48:55 -0400
Subject: Poor Man's *REAL* Counterpressure Bottler

Most of us are familiar with the "Poor Man's Counterpressure Bottler"
(PMCPB), featured within the last year or so in Zymurgy and Brewing
Techniques, among other places.  I believe I have a nice easy enhancement to
this already-effective design that makes it a true counterpressure bottler.

Recall some time ago we were playing with tire valves stuck in 1/2" holes
drilled in PET bottle caps (well, *I* was anyway), and using that to
"pressurize" keg-filled to-go bottles.  Turns out these same tire valves mate
perfectly with the inflating needles used to pump up footballs etc.  Just
screw the threaded part of the needle into the rubber underside of the valve.

The next trick is to bore a small hole alongside the main hole in a #2 (is
it?) drilled stopper -- the kind that fits in a bottle opening.  I used a
red-hot sewing needle but perhaps you can come up with a better way, or drill
out an *undrilled* stopper with an off-center 3/8" hole and perhaps a 1/16"
or smaller hole.  It needs to be small enough diameter that the valve needle
"seals" as it's inserted.  Make the hole such that it doesn't poke out until
it gets to the bottom -- no peeking through the sides!

Push the needle through the stopper from the top (outside the bottle) just so
that the hole at the end of the needle is completely visible outside the
other end (inside the bottle) of the cork.  Now assemble the rest of the
PMCPB as normal.  THe valve and the beer line will jockey for position but
there's enough room for everyone; it all seals inside the cork anyhow.

You'll need an air chuck on a hose attached to your keg.  I leave one
permanently attached (along with a clamp since they do leak).  Now, you can
purge and pressurize your bottle before filling.  Purge by leaving the
stopper loose while giving it gas, or do a few pressurize / burp cycles.  Now
fit the stopper in tightly and pressurize for real.  Open the beer valve;
you'll get a little beer since some pressure escapes when you remove the
chuck.  Now, to fill, use your fingernail to press the pin in the valve
slightly and slowly to gradually relieve the pressure.  The beer flows on its
own as the pressure is relieved.  When the bottle is full, close the beer
valve, and press the valve pin completely to relieve the rest of the
pressure.

I just finished bottling four APAs for our club's July 13 competition, and
regret that I didn't bottle more as it was EASY.  Minimal mess, about 10
minutes out of my busy (yawn) day.  Much easier than those gigantic
commercial C3PO-looking monstrosities that cost $50 or more.

BTW I used room-temperature bottles and normal keg pressure (~10 psi) and had
absolutely NO foaming from a well-carbonated beer.

Ken Schwartz
El Paso, TX
KennyEddy at aol.com
http://users.aol.com

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From: korz at pubs.ih.lucent.com
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 96 16:35:06 CDT
Subject: Re: How to clean up a boilover?

Sue and Joe write:
>Does anyone have a good cleaning product that can get the
>carmelized wort off my cooking stove?

I spray some "Fantastik" or "Formula 409" on the stains, let them
sit for an hour and then scrape off the crud with a razor blade.
It may take several repetitions.  Be careful with that razor blade
and wait till the store is cool.

Al.

Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL
korzonas at lucent.com

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From: Andy Walsh <awalsh at crl.com.au>
Date: Wed, 03 Jul 1996 10:44:27 +1100
Subject: maltose syrup

Hi,
Greg King asked about maltose syrup, as recommended by Graham Wheeler.
Liz Blades recommended LME or barley syrup as a substitute.

I have Graham Wheeler's books (not at hand), but I seem to remember
that he recommended glucose as a substitute if maltose is unavailable?

This would make sense, since maltose is enzymatically broken
down by the yeast to glucose, and is 100% fermentable.
LME or barley syrup contains a multitude of sugars and dextrins,
some of which are unfermentable. Of course you can use these,
and make good beer, but I think that glucose would give results much
closer to the intention (but certainly not identical).

- --
Andrew Walsh			CHAD Research Laboratories
Phone (61 2) 212 6333		5/57 Foveaux Street
Fax   (61 2) 212 1336		Surry Hills. NSW. 2010
email awalsh at crl.com.au		Australia.


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From: "David R. Burley" <103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 02 Jul 96 21:13:36 EDT
Subject: Shawn -Check of the text reader per My discussion

Shawn,
This is to test what happens if the word "test" appears in the body and not the
subject line.

Dave Burley


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From: "CHUCK HUDSON, ER LAB 3-2865" <CHUDSON at mozart.unm.edu>
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 1996 19:41:44 -0600 (MDT)
Subject: RE: KEG CONVERSION, help needed

You might try using a manifold type of lauter tun. I have used one for years
and I find it one of the best projects I have done. Basically it is a length of
copper tubing sized to fit your existing hole and wraped once around the bottom
of the keg and then formed to fit as flat as possible. after the initial
fitting is done remove tjhe manifold and grab your trusty hacksaw and cut slots
HALFWAY thru the pipe. space the slots between 3/8 of an inch to 1/2 of an inch
all along the pipe. leave about 1-1 1/2 inches at the very end to fold over
itself to seal the end of the pipe.

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From: Carrick Legrismith <hiscope at c4systm.com>
Date: Tue, 02 Jul 1996 22:33:44 -0700
Subject: Open  Fermentation

The last two batches I have altered my fermentation procedure with
positive results. After letting the trub settle in the kettle I transfer
the wort into glass carboys where it sits for four more hours. I then
transfer the clarified wort into an open fermenter, which I made from a
modified keg, on top of my yeast. Before this, I settled in the kettle,
transferred to the carboys, pitched and then aerated. My new system is
much easier, is more enjoyable, allows me to easily to control trub and
sample the product as it progresses. Who came up with the closed
fermentation system anyway? I say kick the blow hose and try it--you
won't go back.

Carrick Legrismith

Hiscope Brewery
hiscope at c4systm.com



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From: rlabor at lsumc.edu (LaBorde, Ronald)
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 1996 23:02:22 -0500
Subject: Sparge water temperature

Hi,

I am not sure about the correct temperature to use for the sparge water. I
thought that the temperature of the grains while being sparged should be at
about 160-165 F. If I use 175 degree water in the sparge supply tank, then
the measured temperature of the water in the mash tun varies all over the 
place.

First let me tell you that I haven't done a mash-out, but just mash at 155
degrees for this IPA and then start the sparge after one to one and a half
hours.  I measure the water above the grains and it will be about 160
degrees and slowly rise to 175 degrees about the time the sparge is about
done.  If I measure down into the grains, I measure 155 starting and slowly
rising to 165 or so about the time the sparge water has all run out.

So I have never seen any mention of a difference in sparge water
temperatures depending on wether a mash-out is done or not. Could I use much
hotter water at the start of sparge to quickly get the grains up to 165 and
then as the sparge progresses let the temperature drop?

Also I have never been clear on exactly when to use a mash-out and why to
use a mash-out. Should I always  use a mash-out?

Using an Igloo 10 gal round cooler for the mash tun and it works great -
after a 1 or 1.5 hour mash and a couple of stirs the temperature drops only
2 degrees Farenheight.

Any help or clarification here would be greatly appreciated!

Ron


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From: tthomas3 at ford.com (Tim Thomas)
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 07:22:15 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Vanilla Beer???

I am somewhat new to homebrewing and have a basic question.
Has anyone tried to make a vanilla beer, using either vanilla
extract or some form of the vanilla bean?  If so, how did
it turn out?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

Timothy J. Thomas

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From: aesoph at ncemt1.ctc.com (Aesoph, Michael)
Date: 03 Jul 96 08:49:33 EDT
Subject: Adding Salt to Sweeten?!?!?!?!!

Dear Collective:

	I am in the process of making some rhubarb wine (mmmmmm!!!)...  Anyway,
it's a little bit bitter right now, and I'd like to sweeten it up a
little.  A friend of mine suggested adding salt to sweeten it....  Makes
sense as salt can be used to sweeten green apples..  Any comments on what
that will do to the yeast???  I am concerned because I want to make the
wine sparkly - that means bottling it like beer with priming sugar.





==================================================

        Michael D. Aesoph                Associate Engineer

==================================================


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From: toml at fcmc.COM (Tom Lochtefeld (Risk Mgt))
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 96 08:45:51 EDT
Subject: flavored extracts

Has anybody had any experience with adding flavored extracts, liquers
etc. during the bottling stage?  I was thinking it might be interesting
to add some strawberry margherita syrup or something to a couple of six
packs as I bottle my latest batch of pilsner but I am worried that the
extra sugar might cause over-carbonation.  Any comments or suggestions
would be welcome.

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From: "Kirk Harralson" <kwh at smtpgwy.roadnet.ups.com>
Date: Wed, 03 Jul 96 09:10:21 EST
Subject: Canned Skunk

Over the years, I've been educated by the HBD about light-struck beers in clear
or green bottles giving that familiar skunk smell.  Heineken (sp?) is a
particularly popular example of this.  On a return flight last week, I asked
what beers they had, and Heineken was the only choice other than Budmilloors, 
so
I took it.  I don't know if it is an airline rule or not, but all beer was
served in cans, not bottles.  The funny thing is, when I poured the beer, the
skunk smell was present!  It was not as pronounced as the bottled version I'm
used to, but it was definitely there.  I think it's a pretty safe assumption
that light does not get through aluminum cans, so I have to wonder when the 
beer
is exposed to light.  This also made me wonder about the bottled version.  When
I buy a case of Heineken, it's sealed in a cardboard case. Again, I assume that

not much light is going to get through there.  If these are packaged at the
brewery, when are the bottles exposed to light?  Again, I'm not questioning the
light-struck phenomenom -- that has been explained ad infinitum in past 
digests,
and I accept it at face value -- I just wonder when and how it occurs.

Kirk Harralson
Bel Air, Maryland


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From: rlarsen at pyrotechnics.com (Rich Larsen)
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 07:50:30 -0500
Subject: Wisconsin Plate "ZYMURGY"

Does anyone know the person that owns the Wisconsin Licence plate "ZYMURGY"?

I saw him driving down I-294 in Illinois on 6/29.  I tried to get his
attention to give him a homebrew, but....

=> Rich <rlarsen at pyrotechnics.com>
________________________________________________________________________
     Rich Larsen, Midlothian, IL.  "Spice is the Variety of Life"
         Want to learn how to Brew Beer at Home?  Check out
            Homebrew University BBS at (847) 970-9778
________________________________________________________________________


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From: "Allan Rubinoff" <allan_rubinoff at mathworks.com>
Date: 3 Jul 1996 09:49:00 -0400
Subject: stuck fermentation

In HBD #2091, Rob Emenecker writes about a "stuck" fermentation:

> Aerated for 15 minutes with an aquarium pump then pitched 2 packets of M&F
> rehydrated yeast. Yeast was pitched at 7:00 PM on Sunday and the brew's O.G.
> was 1.049 (70% extraction efficiency).
>
> Monday morning the brew was happily bubbling away. Monday afternoon there
was
> no activity whatsoever. Cripes! What could have gone wrong? Is My Beer
> Ruined? In a fit of despair I paddling/splashing the hell out of the brew
> for about 20 minutes (assuming that it was not properly aerated).

Sorry to say this, but your beer *was* probably fine, and you may have
ruined it by trying to fix it.  Your beer probably started fermenting
overnight on Sunday and was largely done by Monday afternoon.  This can
happen, especially with dry yeast.  Aerating at this point was a mistake;
your beer is probably going to be severely oxidized.  A better strategy
would have been to take a hydrometer reading to find out if the beer had
in fact fermented out.

Allan Rubinoff
rubinoff at mathworks.com




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From: Bob Waterfall <waterr at albany.net>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 10:13:00 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re; hops drying

Dan Ritter asked:

>planning to air dry them [hops] slowly in my well ventilated and warmish 
garage
>(75-80 F in the late summer early fall and fairly dry climate).  I have
>built several large framed screens that will hang from the ceiling.

It should be no problem.  I've been drying my hops for the last three years
in the garage or cellar for the last three years.  I use 1 or 2 screens from
the back door since it's getting to be time to switch to the storm windows
anyway (well, maybe it's a little early). I spread the hops out so they are
only one or two deep on the screen.  I give them a stir every day like you
plan.  They dry out in a few days to a week here in upstate NY (not a dry
climate).  I then package them in zipper *freezer* bags squeezing out as
much air as possible and store them in the freezer of the beer fridge.  Air
does get into the bags and starts to degrade them eventually (6 months or
so) even in the freezer.  I usually end up giving away half of them since
most of the crop is Nugget that only take an ounce or so to really bitter up
a batch.

Bob Waterfall <waterr at albany.net>,
Troy, NY, USA


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From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 10:29:58 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: gelatinization/German brewing

There has been some discussion as to the Gelatinization temps of
barley.  This is from Molls book Beers and Coolers:

paraphrased:
Barley starch consists of large granules of starch (15-40 um), having
a gelatinization temp between 57-59C, and small granules (1-6 um),
having a gelatinization temp of 59-65C.  Small granules comprise
90% of the total number of starch and 10% of the weight.

So the bulk of barley starch will gelatinize close to the optimum
temps for beta amylase.

As for German brewing and natural carbonation, Im suprised nobody
has mentioned the primary method of carbonation: spunding the tank.
This is simply closing off the tank vent within 1P or so of terminal
gravity.  This is one of the main benefits of using a unitank, or
pressure vessal of any kind.

Jim Busch

"This isnt rocket science, but I do that too"

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From: "Barry Wertheimer" <wertheim at libra.law.utk.edu>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 10:32:12 EST
Subject: Rob's Brown Ale

Rob Emenecker asks the age old question.... "Is My Beer Ruined"!

> I brewed an English Brown Ale this past Sunday <snip> then pitched 2
>packets of M&F rehydrated yeast. Yeast was pitched at 7:00 PM on
>Sunday <more snipped>
>
> Monday morning the brew was happily bubbling away. Monday afternoon
> there was no activity whatsoever. Cripes! What could have gone
> wrong?

Possibly nothing.  Your beer may be done fermenting.  With 2
packs of dry yeast and a warm summertime fermenting temperature
(you did not tell us fermentation temperature), the yeast may have
gone right to work.  Have you checked the specific gravity or
tasted it?  Also, what did it look like when it stopped bubbling?
Had there been a good head of kraesen that had already fallen
back?  What does the surface of the beer/wort look like?

Another possibility is that the beer is still fermenting, but the CO2 is
escaping other than through the airlock.  Again, looking at the
stuff, hydrometer readings, and/or tasting should help you tell
whether fermentation is going on or not.

Of course, if the beer was done, that extra aeration on Monday
afternoon probably wasn't a good idea.

Barry

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From: Troy <treynard at fast.net>
Date: Wed, 03 Jul 1996 10:46:56 -0400
Subject: Lazy Homebrewer

I have been the laziest homebrewer in America. I brewed a stout in mid-February
and
have not yet bottled. Is there any hope at all, or should I just dump and start
over?
Thanks in advance for your replies.

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From: "Tracy Aquilla" <aquilla at salus.med.uvm.edu>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 96 10:56:10 CDT
Subject: Re: competetive inhibition by maltose, heat-shock

In Digest #2090:
Steve Alexander <stevea at clv.mcd.mot.com> wrote:
>I have documentation that maltose competitively inhibits
>beta-amylase.

I'll bite. Specifically, at what maltose concentration is the rate
significantly inhibited? I'm also interested in your source.


"Sharon A. Ritter" <102446.3717 at CompuServe.COM> wrote:
>>From: Edward J. Steinkamp
>>Does anyone know the maximum temperature differential  yeast can
>>take?
>
>Dave Miller answered a similar question in the March/April edition of
>Brewing Techniques (Q&A With the Troubleshooter). His source (Dr. Joseph
>Power of the Siebel Institute)  indicates that the maximum rapid
>temperature drop that a yeast can handle is about 18F (10C). Yeast
>thermal shock going from colder to warmer is not a problem (from the
>same article).

Heat-shock induces an entire cascade of reactions resulting in the
activation of numerous genes. All kinds of weird things can happen when
yeast is heat-shocked. (For literature citations, search "heat-shock 
proteins".)
Tracy


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From: Kurt Schilling <kurt at pop.iquest.net>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 96 10:12 EST
Subject: re:Drying hops

Greetings and salutations!

In HBD 2089 or 2090 some one metioned drying hops.  I have been raising hops
for about 6 years now. I have used two methods to dry the cones. Method one
involved spreading the cones on a cookie sheet and putting the cheet in the
attic of the house (temp in July/August was >130 dF). I'd leave the sheets
up there for about 5-7 days. End results were pretty good, >90% dehydration.
FOr the past couple of years, having moved to a new location, I've been
spreading the hops on screened racks and putting them in the loft of my
sheet-metal roofed barn. The temperature is a bit lower (100-120 dF), but
the improved air circulation thru the screens seems to have improved the
dehydration process. Time to driness is about 7-9 days with usually >90%
dehydration. FWI, the screened racks are 18" wide by 30" long, 2.5 inches
deep and screened with aluminum screening. They do double duty in drying
home grown mushrooms from the basement.

Have a great holiday!
Kurt Schilling


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From: Brian Cornelius <bcorneli at wsu.edu>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 08:15:34 -0700
Subject: Re: Hops Drying

Dave Burley writes:
>Papazian ( I think) in one or more of his books suggest using your clothes
dryer. Tie the hops up in a pillow case and dry away. Keep the temperature
between 130F and 150F( Malting and Brewing Science p. 309).

The pillow case and clothes dryer trick is for drying of home made malt.
"Would my hops be ruined using this method?"  You bet!  Much too rough on
them.  The temperature also seems higher that necessary.  Unless I'm drying
the hops in the attic, I bet I don't ever get over 100F although it takes
2-4 days before they're ready for the freezer. The MBS reference of 130-150F
may be for commercial operations where they can't wait that long.

Dan Ritter writes:
>I have a healthy crop of hops taking over my back yard and I was planning
to air dry them slowly in my well ventilated and warmish garage (75-80 F in
the late summer early fall and fairly dry climate).  I have built several
large framed screens that will hang from the ceiling. Every day I will
conscientously go out and "stir" the cones to encourage even drying.  Will
this work or am I asking for failure?

It'll work just fine.  Exactly what I've done for the past 3 years.

>In the dryer?!#....my wife and kids would freak!

And probably exile you to Cottonwood Butte.  I tried it with malt 2 years
ago and still hear about it.  :))

Brian
bcorneliu at wsu.edu
Steptoe, WA


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From: Bill Rust <wrust at csc.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 96 11:47 EDT
Subject: Re: The Clever Tongue/Iodophor/Igloo Coolers/HSF?

Top of the Mornin':

Rob Lauriston was discussing taste and quoted Al K:
>"You cannot taste esters.  Bottom line.  Your tongue only senses sweet, salty,
>sour and bitter...

There was a series of programs on the Discovery channel about the senses,
and on the show about taste, they talked about this very thing.  A doctor
that was on the show mentioned that there were only 4 different flavors that
the tongue could discern by itself.  They interviewed a couple of people who
had medically lost their sense of smell.  They both had considerable trouble
discerning some fairly obvious flavors.

[Regarding iodophor...]
I have a question about use of iodophor.  I am currently storing a 12.5ppm
solution in my kegs until I have time to fill them.  On kegging day I
transfer the solution to a newly cleaned keg, and rinse the emptied keg
about 3-4 times (my habit with bleach solution) before filling and priming.
I have always heard to allow the kegs to 'drip dry', but because of my
schedule, I find it easier to rinse.  Any danger in that?  Does iodophor
leave a residue that cannot easily be rinsed off, but evaporates with no
problem?  I'm not really *that* concerned about it since my beer tastes
fine, and I haven't grown a third arm or anything after about six batches
like this.

Also, can somebody confirm a rumor that it only takes about 5 minutes to
sanitze glass, plastic, stainless steel in a 12.5 ppm solution of iodophor
as opposed to a 2 hour soak in a bleach solution?

[Regarding Igloo 5 gallon sport coolers...]
8 single step infusion mashes so far, no warping!  I was concerned about
warping when I first got it and have been watching it very closely.
However, I am getting ready to try my hand at decoction mashing this winter,
so we'll see how it holds up.

[HSF?]
I'm brewing 6 kegs for an upcoming wedding (mine) and batch #1 may be dead
from a bad circuit breaker (overloaded my weenie AC unit!!!!)  Anybody wanna
try a lager (WYeast 2308) primaried  at  90+ deg. F.?  Would you call that Hot
Side Fermentation (HSF)?  Oh well, thank goodness my fiancee's a chemist
with her own basement (did I do good or what?).  I guess I'll just have to
start brewing ales at her place instead.

Skol.

  -----------------------------------------------------------
  Bill Rust, Master Brewer | Sure drinking kills brain cells,
  Jack Pine Savage Brewery | but ONLY THE WEAK ONES!
  Shiloh, IL        (NACE) |            --Old Irish saying...
  -----------------------------------------------------------


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From: "Palmer.John" <palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com>
Date: 3 Jul 1996 08:41:20 U
Subject: RE:  Keg Conversion Help

Braam asked about converting some kegs to brewing vessels including how to
mount a false bottom.

Depending on the size and shape of the hole that is already in the side of the
kegs, I would abandon making a false bottom and use a copper tubing manifold
instead. Manifolds work very well for me. To maintain the gravity draw from the
tun you will need to have the outlet from the spigot below the level of the
manifold and that may necessitate a U bend arrangement as the tube goes thru
the bulkhead fitting (or however you do it).

     |keg wall
     |
     |
     |
   x--\
   | | |_____  manifold
   | |________  bottom

The greyish powder is either dust or oxide. In either case, wash the keg out
with a good detergent like dish soap. Something that will rinse clean.

Hope this helps,
John J. Palmer - Metallurgist for MDA-ISS M&P
johnj at primenet.com  Huntington Beach, California
Palmer House Brewery and Smithy - www.primenet.com/~johnj/


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From: "Decker, Robin E." <robind at rmtgvl.rmtinc.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 96 13:43:00 -0500
Subject: RE: stuck fermentation <robe at cadmus.com>

Rob,

This may be a bit elementary, but we get this same question at the shop all
the time.  If you will look at your airlock, you may be able to "relax"...
 If you use a bubbler airlock, and there is water (or whatever you use) in
both sides, it means there is CO2 pressure inside your fermenter, and YBINR
(Your Beer is NOT Ruined).  If you use the 2-piece airlock, the small inside
part should be sort of floating.  If your airlock looks fine, just be
patient and wait the full 5-7 days for complete fermentation.   Just because
you can't see bubbles, it  doesn't mean your fermentation has stopped.  BTW,
I wouldn't even consider dumping any batch without first taking a gravity
reading, the results of which would help me decide what rescue attempts to
try next.  You would not believe some of the great "saves" we have made in
the past year!! (at nominal additional cost).

Goldings
"I have to get off this planet"


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From: "Keith Royster" <keith.royster at ponyexpress.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 13:59:47 -0500
Subject: HSA & astringency / apple cider recipie

Hello all!

I recently received some feedback from Rodney Morris on my RIMS web
page (see the URL below) and he said something that confused me.  In
my page I mention that astringency can come from the later stages of
sparging when the wort has thinned and the pH has dropped.  This drop
in pH causes tannins to be extracted from the grain husks which is
what causes the astringency. Rodney mentioned that Hot-Side Aeration
(HSA) can also cause an astringent flavor, which is more of a concern
for RIMS users if they are not carefull to not splash the returning
wort.

I responded to Rodney that it was my understanding that HSA causes
the same cardboardy / sherry / stale flavors in beer that
post-fermentation aeration causes, and that I have never heard of
the flavor being described as astringent.  He then responded with
the following.....

> Dr. George Fix published an article on hot side aeration in the
> winter 1992 issue of Zymugry magazine. In that article, he stated
> "in packaged beer the (HSA) oxidized melanoidins can play the role
> of oxidezers by reacting with alcohols and producing staling
> aldehydes. The latter have an astringent character that sometimes
> takes on a metallic tone. ...it can occur even if there is little,
> or no air in the bottlesheadspace."

> Dr Fix also mentioned in his article:  ...oxidized phenols, on the
> other hand bring their own flavoring to beer.  The German word
> "herbstoffe" (which loosely translates to "grain astringent") is
> often used to describe their effect.  Many regard these flavors as
> unpleasant as the staling aldehydes that arise from the oxidation
> of alcohols.

So do any of you have any comments on this?  Are people confusing
stale / carboard flavor with astringency? I obviously respect both
Rodney's and Dr. Fix's opinions, but at the same time do not
remember ever hearing the collective mentioning HSA and astringency
in the same sentence.  Was I sleeping in class again?

- ----------------------------------------------

On another note, I friend of mine has asked me to look into brewing
an apple cider for him, specifically like the Woodchuck bottled cider
you can buy in the store.  I know this is only marginally beer
related, but if any of you have any info, recipies, or pointers, I'd
sure appreciate it!

Keith Royster - Keith.Royster at ponyexpress.com
Mooresville, North Carolina
 at your.service - http://dezines.com/ at your.service
My RIMS page - http://dezines.com/ at your.service/RIMS
Carolina HomeBrewers - http://dezines.com/ at your.service/cbm

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From: Barry Wertheimer <wertheim at libra.law.utk.edu>
Date: Wed, 03 Jul 96 14:16:16 -0700
Subject: MP/TN Valley Hombrewers Competition

This is the second (and final) announcement that Metro Pulse and the
Tennessee Valley Homebrewers Club are sponsoring their second annual
sanctioned homebrew competition on July 13 in Knoxville, Tn.  Entry fee
is a very reasonable $3 and requires 2 bottles of your delicious
homebrew.  Bottles of any size, shape, color, or description are
welcome.  Entries must be received by July 10.

For more information, contact Jeff Colfer at jcolfer at aol.com

- --Barry



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