HOMEBREW Digest #2800 Mon 17 August 1998

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Malt, etc. ("Mark Bridges")
  Yeast growth/good books/more micros ("Steve Alexander")
  PU clone notes/amen (Bill Anderson)
  Brew school grads ("George De Piro")
  Seeded hops ("George De Piro")
  Bitterness (AJ)
  Galena Hop growing (Robert Arguello)
  Brewschool bashing (Charles Hudak)
  Cultivation questions (Bill Anderson)
  Robert Arguellos nettiquette (Jonathan Edwards)
  Mead conditioning question (Ron Warner)
  Putting new wort over an old yeast cake (tmcglinn)
  Beer label roullette/My praises... (Some Guy)
  Soda cooler ("Jay Krause")

Let a good beer be the exclamation point at the end of your day as every sentence deserves proper punctuation... NOTE NEW HOMEBREW ADDRESS: hbd.org Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org (Articles are published in the order they are received.) If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org. **SUBSCRIBE AND UNSUBSCRIBE REQUESTS MUST BE SENT FROM THE E-MAIL **ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!! IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, the autoresponder and the SUBSCRIBE/UNSUBSCRIBE commands will fail! For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to brewery at hbd.org Homebrew Digest Information on the Web: http://hbd.org Requests for back issues will be ignored. Back issues are available via: Anonymous ftp from... ftp://hbd.org/pub/hbd/digests ftp://ftp.stanford.edu/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer AFS users can find it under... /afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer JANITORS on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 22:48:45 -0700 From: "Mark Bridges" <mbridges at coastnet.com> Subject: Malt, etc. Greetings All: An open question - does any of our susbscribers have access to Simpsons Malt? What I have is a nice floor malted (Maris Otter) Pale Ale malt. I'm very happy with it's performance in my homebrewery (and at local brewpubs). Are any of the collective familiar with this maltster and it's products ? On a local note, my recent edition of CAMRA Victoria's "What's Brewing" newsletter reports that HBD subscriber Dave Riedel won 1st place in the Dark Lager category, and 3rd in English/Scottish Ales in CAMRA Victoria's 1998 Homebrew Competition. Well done Dave! Cheers, Mark Bridges Victoria, BC Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 05:18:47 -0400 From: "Steve Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Yeast growth/good books/more micros A few 'gests ago George DePiro wrote ... > said that he had read that yeast growth is 8X (3 full divisions). Why > the discrepancy? > In the brewery, we do not give yeast enough oxygen for all the cells [...] True. I understand *why* the yeast may only grow 3X, the question is really *DO* they ? That is - is this current commercial practice and if so where ? M&BS, which is admittedly dated, suggest the 2 to 3 divisions is the normal range (4X to 8X) and that peg lagers at 4X. I believe I saw a mid-1980s JIB paper which suggested a greater than 4X growth for British ales as typical, but I don't have a copy at hand. I'd be interested in seeing what common US micro ale production and current British ale practices are. > to be at their 1% maximum sterol content. Because of this, they won't > divide 3X (they become reluctant to divide at 0.25% sterol and cannot > divide if their sterol will fall below 0.1%). If we were to inject > more oxygen into the young beer during fermentation, yeast growth > would resume. As stated above, this is not desirable (although there > are a few breweries that do this sort of thing by rousing the ferment; > the beers do take on a distinctive character). Also by introducing oxygenated krausen. > Excessive yeast growth is great during propagation, but not while > making beer. That is one major reason it is so important to pitch a > large, healthy starter. This will reduce the production of fusel > alcohols and harsh esters that contribute to "that homebrew tang." We have no disagreement here. BTW - the math models for fermentation have two terms for the fusel production rate. One describes the Ehrlich mechanism and explains some but not all of the fusel production and is proportional to the yeast mass. Integrated over time this term is approximately constant for a given yeast at a given temp fermenting a given amount of sugar. The other term describes the synthetic mechanism elucidated by Ayrapaa (put umlauts over the whole thing) is proportional to yeast growth rate. The second term is the one that George and I taste in underpitched beers. This synthetic term dominates in the production of n-propanol and n-butanol among others. Of the esters some have models that are only proportional to sugar uptake - and so are fairly constant (for a given yeast, temp, amount of fermentation) while others like ethyl caproate are modeled as proportional to yeast growth rate again. The one George dreads (ethyl acetate) is, by this model, relatively unaffected by yeast growth. The model shouldn't be taken too seriously, it simply determines that most important rate limiting substance of a mechanism and that creates a model term with a dependency on growth, fermentation, amino acid uptake, etc. The fit to experimental data is pretty good tho'. == In a couple off-line discussions the question of "what is a good/great brewing science book" has come up. Imagine that you were interested in learning brewing science and that you could realistically only afford to buy one (maybe multivolume) set of brewing science books. It should ideally be current, complete and accurate. Alan Meeker quickly convinced me that I have been overlooking a lot of seriously misleading and downright incorrect background information in Fix's PoBS - I've eliminated it from consideration. This book needs a substantial re-edit to make is recommendable - tho' the idea of a $30 book with the intended level of coverage is very attractive. DeClerk is of course great, and of course very dated. Malting and Brewing Science, 2nd ed, is quite a bit fresher, precisely written without the excess baggage of translation, but still - from 1978 this is getting a bit dated too. After scanning briefly Pollack 'Brewing Science' vol 3(?) I get the impression that this is a state of the art compilation circa 1979-1986, but lacks the cohesiveness to be a textbook. Pollack has the added disadvantage of being out of print and costing about $600US. I haven't seen Kunze and don't know if it is encyclopedic enough to be the choice for the single book to own. Even if it is complete - the bits I've seen quoted here cause me to doubt the trueness of the translation. Anyone care to comment ? Anyone have a better choice ? Anyone aware of any Wehenstephan research work in translation ? == 'Some guy' who claims that my choice to not pick micros 6ers randomly from the fridge bin at the local stores is self-defeating. Fooey. I don't feel that I need to play the fool for everyone who bought a bottling line. The industry needs internal competition - they can't just keep throwing products over the wall and expecting growth. They need coherent style labeling and they need some sort of quality labeling which would ensure some very minimal standard of quality and adherence to style. I'm in favor of experimentation but why not take advantage of word-of-mouth/pubcrawler/reviews etc before experimenting ? That random pick just encourages no style no label and random quality - which is ultimately very bad for the very good micros that we all hope will thrive. Steve Alexander Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 11:49:07 +0100 From: anderson at ini.cz (Bill Anderson) Subject: PU clone notes/amen Andrew asks for tips on his Pilsner Urquell recipe. One thing I've noticed in many American clones, and even several European lagers, is a lack of the acidic undertones that make a PU, Lobkowicz, or Velke Popovice so great. I asked the brewmaster at the Lobkowicz brewery where this comes from, the yeast or a lactic acid rest, and was told it's primarily from yeast (a Budweiser strain) but a sour mash is certainly a viable option if the beer isn't pungent enough to keep it in style. His water has a ph of 7.9, the wort= 5.05-5.15, and ferments out to 4.2-4.4. I'm curious to hear what the more expert tasters have to say about the sour undertones. For example, Sam Adams's Bohemian lager falls flat on its face (IMHO), yet I recall (vaguely) that its decoction-brewed and uses only the finest Saaz hops. - ----- Amen to Scott and Steve's lamentations of Micro's and Brewpubs! On a recent visit to the States, a friend proudly served up a night of Ipswich Stout, a beer remarkably similar to a batch that I had once dumped down the toilet as undrinkable-oxidized and unbalanced, with a really grassy aftertaste. Bland is bad! Bad is worse! -Bill Anderson Prague, Czech Republic anderson at ini.cz Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 98 09:16:00 PDT From: "George De Piro" <gdepiro at fcc.net> Subject: Brew school grads Hi all, Charles wrote, regarding the fact that some brewpubs serve a bland line-up: "Blame it on brewpub owners who have no business being in the brewing industry and *brewschool* graduates who know how to make "beer" but know nothing about beer styles or history and who couldn't tell you the difference between a Helles and a Pilsener." What the heck is with these recent insults to those of us that have bothered to advance our knowledge in a formal setting? I'd say Charles has it exactly backwards. Some of my Siebel classmates may have entered school with an ignorance about beer styles, but they didn't leave in the same state! That was the whole point of it! We had a lecture on beer styles, and the tasting sessions exposed students to the wide world of beer. Sure, it wasn't enough to get you a good grade on the BJCP exam, but it served its purpose: exposing aspiring brewers to the diversity of their craft. Perhaps Mort could tell us about the tastings and style lectures at H-W? I know that Kunze's text (used at some German brewing schools) has a full chapter devoted to beer styles. In Germany (and perhaps elsewhere), you cannot call yourself a "brewmaster" without a degree. In fact, you can't even get a job! (yes, even in Belgium). Perhaps if more US pub-scale "brewmasters" would bother to learn a thing or two about what they do, there would be a more diverse selection of better beer out there. Have fun! George De Piro (Nyack, NY) Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 98 09:24:30 PDT From: "George De Piro" <gdepiro at fcc.net> Subject: Seeded hops Hi all, This year and last my hop cones contained seeds. No, I didn't plant any males. As my dog and I walk around town I have been looking for any other hop vines, wild or cultivated, to find the source of the males. I finally found them, about two doors down from my house! These wild hops have a slightly different leaf shape then mine (more exagerated "cuts"), and there are plenty of male inflorences (sp?). My question to you all is how common is this? I'm sure the things have been there for years, but I never noticed until I started growing my own and noticed that they were seeded. How many of you have seeded cones? (Is that too personal?) Have fun! George De Piro (Nyack, NY) Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 11:31:42 -0400 From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com> Subject: Bitterness A few further comments on measurement of beer bitterness. The ASBC lists 4 protocols under bitterness. In Beer - 23A the absorbance of the bittering principles extracted into isooctane (expensive gasoline) is measured at 275 nm in a 1 cm cell and the result multiplied by 50 (23D is essentially the same but an automated flow analyzer is used). Thus a 50 BU beer would have an absorbance of 1 and a 150 BU beer an absorbance of 3. The latter value is getting into the iffy region of many spectrophotometers but the iffiness is with respect to linearity - the noise floor is usually still a unit or two off. Note that some of the really spiffy units will read down to absorbtions of 7! As G DeP suggests, changing path or dilution (caution - Beer's law is more honored in the breach than the observance) can be used to get within the best range of the instrument. It is incumbent upon the analyst to know the limitations of the instrument and I am confidant that Louis knows his. What is more important to understand is that methods 23A and 23D do not explicitly purport to measure the iso-alpha content of the beer. They measure "bitterness" reported in "bitterness units" (BU). Methods 23B (archived) and 23C do measure iso-alpha acid quantity (23C by solid phase extraction and HPLC) and report this in mg/L. While BU and iso-alpha content in mg/L are "practically identical" in beers brewed with fresh hops it is also the case that beers made with old hops or improperly stored hops or certain extracts will yield iso-alpha acid readings which can be "significantly" below the BU value. For this reason method's 23A or D (and the EBC's similar method) are generally preferred in that they represent "... a uniform method that best expresses the true bitter flavor value of the beer." (ASBC Methods of Analysis. Introduction to "Beer Bitterness"). For the homebrewer, 23A is vastly prefferable, not so much because of the shortcomings of 23C with older hops but because the probablity that he might get his hands on the required equipment for 23A is finite. An added advantage is that calibration with a standard is not required (the instrument must, of course, be calibrated with respect to wavelength and absorbtion but this should be part of standard operating practice whatever determination is being done). Method C, conversely, does require calibration with a standard (standard extracts are available from ASBC but they are expensive). It isn't, of course, totally beer and skittles with 23A. It's been reported that sorbates, benzoates, coloring agents and some adjuncts absorb at 275 nm. These are not things that homebrewers, or even most craft brewers, would allow in their beer but they do impose an extra burden on the analyst examining beers brewed with any of these substances. If they are used their absorbance can be determined and subtracted from production measurements. It obviously can't hurt to do a calibration using 23A with the ASBC (or any other) standard but it's probably simpler and certainly less expensive to do occcasional sanity checks on commercial beers whose bitterness is (or is thought to be) well known. Another scheme would be collaboration among investigators e.g. I measure PU, Louis measures PU, other guys with access to a lab measure PU and we all report our results here. Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 09:03:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Arguello <robertac at jps.net> Subject: Galena Hop growing I have been fairly successful with my Cascade vines. This is their third year in my yard and despite very poor growing conditions, (not much light and very poor drainage), I harvest enough from two rhizomes to make the effort worth while. I am wondering if I might have similar luck with Galena. I live in northern, central California. Anyone out there with experience with Galena? Also, I received 11 responses to my query about the appropriateness of my tag line. Of the 11, 6 respondents indicated that mentioning products for sale within the sig runs counter to the charter of the HBD. 5 HBD'ers indicated that my tag line advertisement were restrained, not blatant and non-abusive and had no problem with it. Without exception all responses that I have received were polite and sincere and I thank you all. One reader included a segment of the HBD "Moderation Statement", and that statement clearly shows that advertisements other than those that are a direct response to a query, are considered inappropriate and strongly discouraged. As a result, I have removed references to my products from my signature, (except the URL for my web site). Thanks to all of you who have helped clear this up for me, and to Al Korzonas for pointing it out in the first place. - -------------------------"Dances With Worts"--------------------- Robert Arguello robertac at jps.net http:/www.jps.net/robertac/keg.htm - ----------------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 09:24:37 -0700 From: Charles Hudak <cwhudak at home.com> Subject: Brewschool bashing George takes exception to my "brewdegreebashing" >What the heck is with these recent insults to those of us that have bothered to >advance our knowledge in a formal setting? I'd say Charles has it exactly backwards. > >Some of my Siebel classmates may have entered school with an ignorance about >beer styles, but they didn't leave in the same state! That was the whole point >of it! We had a lecture on beer styles, and the tasting sessions exposed students to >the wide world of beer. Sure, it wasn't enough to get you a good grade on the BJCP >exam, but it served its purpose: exposing aspiring brewers to the diversity of >their craft. > It's funny, I just knew that you would respond to this George. Honestly, I think that Siebel does a really good job with their curriculum. Some of the newer schools, though, even those affiliated with Davis, seem to stress pumping out new graduates rather than training them in the *art* of brewing. I'm sorry if you happen to disagree but my experience with some of these folks is that they get well versed in the *science* of brewing but not in the *craft* of brewing. I've browsed the curriculums at some of these schools and nowhere is beer history or beer styles ever mentioned. Few even have recipe formulation sections, other than the pure technical calculations of how to hit a certain S.G. > In Germany (and perhaps elsewhere), you cannot call yourself a >"brewmaster" without a degree. In fact, you can't even get a job! (yes, even in >Belgium). Yeah but it's not that way here. I spent several hours talking with a guy once who'd been homebrewing extract beers for a year or so. He was really interested in going to a brew school and asked me what I thought. I said that in order for him to get anything out of the school, he needed to have a good background in chemistry, algebra and basic biochemistry. He said he hadn't gone to college and he'd done poorly in these classes in high school. I suggested he enroll in some classes in J.C. since he would have a hard time keeping up if he didn't grasp these concepts. He himmed and hawed and asked if it was really necessary. I told him that *I* wouldn't waste $10,000 on a brew degree if I wasn't prepared to learn the material. He thought about it for a moment and then said, "Well, do you think that brewmasters would want to buy my recipes?" I almost fell over laughing. I had to explain to him that since I *did* have a background in brewing science and had a better understanding of how all the parts came together and was well versed in style history, that I would generally be able create a better recipe than he could so why would I buy his? His lack of commitment was obvious The bottom line is not all aspiring brewers take the industry and the profession as seriously as you George and that's the problem. > >Perhaps if more US pub-scale "brewmasters" would bother to learn a thing or two >about what they do, there would be a more diverse selection of better beer out there. > I would wholeheartedly agree but I don't think that a "brewdegree" automatically makes you a great brewer. A lot of the quality comes from your commitment to the craft and a broad understanding of the craft of brewing not just the science. This is what a lot of brewers lack. If anyone else was insulted by my post, I apologize. Fact is, if you are reading the HBD, you probably don't fit the profile that I was describing; you've demonstrated your commitment to the craft. C-- Charles Hudak cwhudak at home.com Living large on the left coast....... Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 19:15:51 +0100 From: anderson at ini.cz (Bill Anderson) Subject: Cultivation questions Dear collective: Since I'll be moving back to the US in October, I've decided to take advantage of the goodwill offers of many brewmasters in the area and plan to go on a yeast safari. Armed with a jumble of home-made slants and knowledge gleaned from HBD and the Brewery's excellent technical library, I will plod from door to door begging scraps of sediment like a tinker calling for pots. I've recently found an article Ed Basgall posted in HBD #2151, regarding freezing yeast in a 15% DME solution. I thought this might be a good idea for me, as I'm kind of clumsy and inexperienced in handling slants. I can't decide which would be a better method, slants or frozen wort. The deciding factors will be transportability and long-term storage, as I don't see myself having a complete brewery setup for a couple of months. What do you think is a better option? I'll also be on the lookout for weisen strains. In the HBD archives I've found reference to Wyeast #3068 as an estery weisen yeast. However, I've often read that weisen is usually brewed with one strain, filtered, and bottled with yet another. If this is so, how should I go about capturing and reproducing a truly genuine weisen? Do they breed in captivity? Is it possible to order from the Weihenstephan yeast bank, and does anyone have a contact number? Thanks in advance. -Bill Anderson Prague, Czech Republic anderson at ini.cz Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 15:10:30 -0400 From: Jonathan Edwards <jdedward at us.ibm.com> Subject: Robert Arguellos nettiquette robert wrote: "I have been recently spanked for the content of my "sig". I was informed that I was using poor "nettiquette". HBD'ers who feel offended by my sig are asked to e-mail me and inform me of their feelings on the matter. I thought that my "nettiquette" was just fine, but I will bow to the general consensus." ah, robert, don't worry about it. i read the post you are reffering to and got a laugh from it. some people really need to lighten up. i haven't seen this person complaining about any other "commercial" sigs. of course, he is probably doing it via email. wouldn't doubt that. i mean, people here are really uptight about making sure they are the ones who are right in a debate. whole, years old threads are posted to webpages. people argue about technical aspects of thermonuclear recirculation dynamics of mash density when combined with acidity of hydrogen induced ions charged with neutrons extracted from partially crushed organically grown hybdrids of malt. whew! get my drift? guess i might not be the scientifically oriented brewer, but i make a damn good beer with my primitive 10 gallon gott coolers and keg boiler. i don't need to preach about nettiquette, police mailing lists, or get into pissing contests about whose fermenter is bigger. i like this mailing list but some people really need to get over it, relax, and have a homebrew. keep your sig file robert! to hell with the net police! :-) jonathan Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 16:27:53 -0400 From: Ron Warner <rwarner at annap.infi.net> Subject: Mead conditioning question Folks- I have a light ginger mead (only 9 lbs honey for 5 gal batch) which has been sitting in secondary since 2/14/98. I want to bottle now for New Year's consumption. I want a sparkling beverage. Wyeast Dry Mead yeast was used. Do I have adequate remaining viable yeast to carbonate the bottles using 3/4 cup priming sugar? Should I pitch a conditioning yeast? If so, what yeast would you suggest? TIA! Ron in Severn (MD) Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1998 00:05:50 +0000 From: tmcglinn at nz1.ibm.com Subject: Putting new wort over an old yeast cake Following on from the suggestion about a week ago to try putting a new wort over an earlier yeast cake I did just that. The brewing session was not well planned as I was suddenly confronted with a spare day due to late cancellation of other things. I transferred the previous 6 day old wort to secondary, draining off the remnants of beer, and added the new wort to the container with the yeast cake in it. Without thinking I stirred the yeast cake into the new wort, and immediately wondered if this was a mistake. Had I just mixed a lot of dead yeast into my new wort? Was that a bad thing? Only 2 hours later the wort is fermenting at high speed, while my previous experience of rehydrating a few grams of yeast, usually meant enthusiastic fermentation took 12 or more hours. I still have several bottles of the same brew recipe I have just made, from 2 previous brews over the last few months, so a comparative tasting will be done. I'd appreciate advice on stirring the yeast cake however. - Isn't it funny that no matter how much you read and study, when you actually do it you find things you hadn't thought about. Tony McGlinn Phone: (358) 9-459-4621 Mobile:(358) 40-538-1175 Internet; tmcglinn at nz1.ibm.com Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 20:47:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Some Guy <pbabcock at oeonline.com> Subject: Beer label roullette/My praises... Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... Steve once again steps upon the hot coals of human experimentation.... So, let me get this straight, Steve: You'll happily let me and others go into the store with hard-earned cash to sample some unknown beer, but we have to tell you what we thought of it to protect you from having to sample a potentially bad beer? And you'll not do the same for us? Fooey! And Ppppppbbbbbbbllllllllttttttt!!! Ha! I'll get you! A moratorium on brew-reviews on the Digest. You send 'em, I'll delete 'em! A-hahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaa. (Huh? What? I *CAN'T* do that? Says who? Oh. The Steering Committee. Oh. Ok. I'll just say mean things behind his back, then.) I hardly think that the brief burst of sales due to a first-offering's appearance on a shelf will sustain a brewery very long, nor will it encourage "no style no label and random quality". Yes: more people will get "screwed" by a bad or mislabelled beer, but if the beer is despicable to all, it won't survive and we won't be perpetuating the foisting of blech under the guise of a craft beer. If *you* think it sucks and is mislabelled, yet it DOES survive, it suggests that you are either wrong about the beer or PALATES DIFFER. If you expect others to be your guinea pig, you may need to play with their chromosomes to ensure your palate and theirs are at least similar. Better yet: have the decency to lend your palate once in a while by going out on the limb and trying a new brewery. Then tell *us* what you thought of them. Like Al says: you can always bring them back. (BTW: I stopped providing reviews a while back. Got tired of being hacked to hell by those whose opinion on the beer differed - particularly when, by the zeal of their defense of some beers, it was apparent I got bad samples. Perhaps, though, it simply relates back to the comment above regarding the differences in palates. What I find to be excrement, you might find to be nectar. Rough waters to tread, thanks: I'll take the bridge.) Not trying to dance all over your grave or anything with this. I just think that what's good for the goose is good for the gander (is that sexist?). If you want others to provide data to preserve your palate and wallet, you have to be willing to do the same. All for one, and one for all and all that rot... And to the fella commenting on being proudly served a beer he found inferior: I hope you're never a guest in my house. I'd hate to proudly serve a night of beer to you, then read about how pedestrian my tastes are on the internet. - ---------- Thanks to all who have commented regarding my involvement on the 'Gest. I appreciate your comments (and I do think Eric intended his post as a joke). Yeah, it takes time. Being "internetless" on occassion now causes some anxiety where it didn't in the past, while other times I wish I could just walk away from it. For the most part, y'all make it easy. For the rest, it really is a labor of love. Since I don't get the time to experiment or add to my web pages due to being on the road so much, the 'Gest let's me "give something back" by helping to get the information to those that seek it. And I like to think my involvement somehow helps to preserve this "institution" which the Home Brew Digest has become. But I'm not alone. I have a slave. A quiet person who seems happy to let me be the "face" of the Digest while he works on the brains and the guts of the it. Never once heard him complain when I've tossed up some cockamamee idea for the Digest (OK: maybe once.), and has good-naturedly and skillfully set this Unix wannabe on the straight and narrow more often than I care to comment on. He has occassionally given balance to my very aggressive type "A" personallity with notes like: "Do you *really* want to post that?" He has never once refused to take on the moderation responsibility when asked - even though he can never pass the mantle of maintaining the code over to me (though I'm working on that. Really! I am.) And I'm learning enough about this person that, though we've never met, I number him amongst my closest friends. You would, too. I'd once again like to publicly and LOUDLY thank Karl Lutzen for partnering with me on the Digest as well as for his constant stewardship of the home-brewing community. I invite y'all to do the same. He gives a lot to get so little in return.... See ya! Pat Babcock sampling any old beer in SE Michigan Personal E-Mail pbabcock at oeonline.com Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org HBD Web Site http://hbd.org The Home Brew Page http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/brew.html "Just a cyber-shadow of his former brewing self..." Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 20:17:16 -0500 From: "Jay Krause" <krause at galis.com> Subject: Soda cooler Hi all, Long time lurker, first time poster. Thanks for all the great info! I have a line on a soda display cooler, the type you find at a drug store. Is this good to use for fermenting, lagering etc.? TIA Jay Krause Check out my Beer Lable of the Week at: http://www.members.tripod.com/~beerlable Return to table of contents
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