HOMEBREW Digest #3636 Fri 18 May 2001

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  counterflow woes ("Houseman, David L")
  Wyeast Woes.... (Todd Bissell)
  Re: Counterflow Woes ("Warren White")
  Re: Bicarbonate precipitation ("Denis Barsalo")
  Sparging devices and going all-grain (Pat Casey)
  Yeast nutrient. ("Colin Marshall")
  A Big Response ("Max McDonohue")
  Budvar = Czechvar (bobbrews) Johnson" <Robert at bobbrews.com>
  sprinkling sparging (JohanNico)" <JohanNico.Aikema at akzonobel.com>
  A Poke (craftbrewer)
  Bier Jaarboek (Ant Hayes)
  Brown Malt question (Paul Mahoney) (leavitdg)
  Re: Hop pellets and the Bazooka screen (james r layton)
  RE: Sparge times in a RIMS/HERMS system (Wayne Page)
  Re: Robust Porter (Jeff Renner)
  RE: fermentor geometry ("Steven Parfitt")
  Re: lots of mouth-feel (Jeff Renner)
  Culturing yeast from Karmeliet Tripel bottle (Tom Riddle)
  recipe ("David Craft")
  Re: Robust Porter ("RJ")
  Water (AJ)
  more fermentor geometry ("Steven M. Claussen")
  HBD CAP Experiment... (Pat Babcock)
  the HBD warm-fuzzies (Marc Sedam)
  Sanke Snap Rings ("Scott McLagan")
  CAP experiment (BrwyFoam)
  cranberries ("elvira toews")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 09:57:33 -0400 From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com> Subject: counterflow woes Steven asks about clogging problems: >I've got the fearless chiller and quite like it, works great with my >apartment-brewery but this clogging is quite frustrating. I made a screen >filter utilizing a faucet filter with some 3/8 hose jammed in side with >this wrapped inside a stainless "lint" filter, basically a nice wire >mesh. This worked for all of 6 seconds till it was covered in hop bitz & >goo. I found that adding screens just causes them to clog with hop fines when I use pellets. Two solutions I've tried worked fine. The first was DO NOTHING. Well, it's not quite nothing. What I did was place an unfiltered pickup for wort at the outer edge of my kettle and whirlpooled. Most everything in the wort settled over a 15min wait and piled up in the middle. This worked great with very few fines coming through my counter flow chiller. That is until I used some whole hops and wasn't patent enough to wait the 15min -- I wanted to cool quickly to minimize DMS. At that point a couple whole hops clogged the value on the outlet of my kettle. Luckily I won a SS false bottom in a HB competition and began to use it. This works great with whole hops or fines. A few fines get though to the chiller but only at the very beginning of the knockout. And usually I catch the very first runnings in my hydrometer anyway so they don't make it to the fermenter. I haven't had a problem since, knock on wood. Dave Houseman Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 00:01:29 GMT From: Todd Bissell <bis9170 at home.com> Subject: Wyeast Woes.... Hi all: I just received a beer ingredient kit that I ordered from a reputable online dealer, and found a nasty surprise. The Wyeast package (#1968 Special London, to be precise) was already fully inflated...! And considering that my friendly neighborhood UPS guy has been trying to catch me at home for the last few days, this wyeast pack has probably been fully swelled up for at least 2-3 days in Southern California heat. The question is: what do I do with this thing...? Are the yeast still alive and ready to make me some porter? What would be the pros and cons of pitching this yeast as is...? Would I be better off going to the local homebrew shop to pick up an unincubated package? I prefer White Labs products: what would be a good wyeast #1968 equivelevent? Cheers! Todd S. Bissell Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 10:39:16 +1000 From: "Warren White" <warrenlw63 at hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Counterflow Woes Steven! Hop crud blockages are a problem that we've all encountered at least once in our brewing lives and I wholeheartedly agree with you they're a right royal PITA. I empathize with you on your dilemma of having to dump a whole batch due to hop blockages, it happened to me once courtesy of a hop plug deciding to mate with a copper scrubby. A method I've found that works and works *well* over the years with pellets or whole hops is to get yourself a nice-sized S/S kitchen strainer, wait until your bittering hops have done their thing then whilst still boiling **carefully/gently** whirlpool the whole thing (lest you get HSA) and then dip your strainer into the hot wort and gently lift it out. It will be full of hop crud, lift this out of the boiler and then bang it into something until the strainer is fairly clean. Repeat this process about five or six times, you'll notice less and less hops going into the strainer each time. Re-whirlpool the wort every second or third scoop of the strainer to encourage all the crap into the middle of the boiler again just to be thorough. It's not a pretty method by any means but I find it very effective. It won't remove every bit of hop residue but it certainly greatly reduces the amount of spooge left in your boiler. Any flavour/aroma additions can be added in hop bags or stocking legs where utilisation isn't as important. Even if you just throw them in at this stage at least you don't have your boiling charge to contend with. Hope this helps - Warren White - Melbourne, Australia Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 21:56:17 -0400 From: "Denis Barsalo" <denisb at cam.org> Subject: Re: Bicarbonate precipitation I would like to know how much room for error there is until I can *actually* taste the difference? I often see all this discussion of adding chemicals to water to adjust mineral content or to adjust PH. How far off do I really need to be until I can taste the difference? I brewed with RO water for years (5+) and recently switched to filtered tap water (2-+), I haven't noticed any difference! I thought my yeast would react differently; I thought my mash efficiency would change; I thought my pilsners would taste differently.... no difference!! I now use Montreal tap water with a .5 micron pre-filter and a charcoal second filter. I used to add Gypsum to my mash and sparge water when I used RO water and stopped when I finally connected an unwanted bitterness from it. I used to sometimes add a bit of Epson and Table salts if I wanted to make a classic British ale, but have tired of that practice also. I have often thought of purchasing a proper PH meter but never could justify the expense. Bottom line, I make good beer, often great beer! Am I just lucky to have decent tap water to start with? Denis Barsalo Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 11:56:09 +1000 From: Pat Casey <patcasey at iprimus.com.au> Subject: Sparging devices and going all-grain Jim Cuny and others have asked about going all grain and some of the equipment necessary. I don't think it can be emphasised enough - technique and understanding are far more important than equipment. By understanding I mean you need enough of a story about what is going on so that you know why you are doing something, are able to work out possible reasons for why something has gone wrong, and know how you can improve your technique. Of course improving your technique and increasing your understanding go together. For me, part of the fascination of brewing is that I can produce an acceptable beer with quite crude equipment. And, part of the challenge has been to develop a good and consistent technique while simultaneously improving my improvised equipment. But what I have found is that improvements to my improvised equipment have only been successful when my technique has improved beyond the limits of existing equipment because it is only then that I can see where I need to improve equipment and how it can be done. Despite all of this I still use my original sparging device. It is a small (1.5 litres) plastic food bucket with a wire handle and small holes drilled in the bottom of the bucket. The bucket is strung from a wooden pole that rests between the tops of the kitchen cupboards - they are on opposite walls. The bucket sits about 6 inches above the grain bed, I ladle the sparge water into it from a stock pot on the stove and give it a gentle circular swing. Sure it does not give the finest of sprays, but it is easy to match the flow rates and the whole set up was easy and cheap to make. The rotating sparge arms are great little devices, but you need an elevated supply of hot water to drive them which for me, and probably most other kitchen brewers, would mean an extra vessel with an element and thermostat. When I started all grain brewing the only equipment I bought was a Phils Phalse bottom and a plastic snap tap to make a combination mash and lauter tun at a cost of less than US$20. The bucket was a used one given to me by the home brew shop. I insulated it with polystyrene - hot knife, several fruit boxes and gaff tape. For heating water and boiling the wort I used an existing 10 litre stainless stock pot along with a larger one borrowed from my mother. Cooling the wort was of course in the laundry sink. I later bought a 20 litre stainless stock pot - US$30 on special from K Mart. I now have a proper boiler but still use the original lauter tun. The big stock pot is now my mash tun and water heater. So if you are considering switching to all grain do not be put off by the possible costs. If you don't have a large enough stock pot start prowling the aisles of suitable shops and swoop when they have a sale. As a big stock pot is useful for purposes other than brewing it is not such a big cost. In the meantime read as much as you can. Once you have started all grain brewing, and started to develop your technique then you will see where you can best spend your money. Pat Blue Mountains, NSW Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 12:09:42 +1000 From: "Colin Marshall" <byoah at argay.com.au> Subject: Yeast nutrient. I always culture my yeast (liquid or dry) in a wort consisting of 100 gms of dried malt extract per litre of cooled, boiled, oxygenated water. I have been contemplating adding a nutrient such as Lalvin Fermaid K or diammonium phosphate, particularly with lager yeast. Can anybody tell me whether this would be wise or foolish, and why? Thank you, Colin Marshall. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 14:19:08 +1000 From: "Max McDonohue" <max at hinet.net.au> Subject: A Big Response Thanks to so many of you for emails telling me all about Mr Pivo and Dr Alexander, or was that the other way around? If they are not in fact in love with the same woman, perhaps they should be so at least they have an excuse for all this argument. Dr Alexander also sent me a personal explanation which was quite hilarious. He really is a funny fellow. Anyway, having got brave enough to actually work this computer, let me tell you brewing out here in the outback is not easy. I use an old bath (it was a trough) down in the paddock where i mix up all the goo and add the powder yeast. It sure ferments well in summer when the temperatures get up around 40 celcius. But I have trouble keeping the dust out of it. Still and all, it makes quite a few good bottles though most of them burst in a very dangerous fashion (nearly killed one of the pigs)! For this reason I also leave the bottles out in the paddock and sneak down to get them when it is cooler at night. The wife seems to think it is quite a good drop and i haven't even told her that it is me making it yet. Most of what I know i read in an old magazine and i am hoping to learn more in the future. Thanking you again. Max McDonohue Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:22:22 -0700 From: "Robert (bobbrews) Johnson" <Robert at bobbrews.com> Subject: Budvar = Czechvar Well you are shopping the wrong place... Buy the 500ml bottles. They are amber and the beer is great. The 6 pks are green glass.. I.E. Heinies.. I have had many of these over there and here over the years. In fact if you are in So Calif. The 22nd at BJ's in Brea at 7:pm the Brewers of Buvar are in town for a tasting.. I will be there!! Robert Bobbrews) Johnson http://www.bobbrews.com Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 14:28:56 GMT From: Todd Bissell <bis9170 at home.com> Subject: RE: Czechvar That's about what I've heard too, about A-Busch and Budvar burying the hatchet. Since A-B is only 1000 times larger than Budvar, it seems like a no-brainer to come to this agreement: Bud increases it's market share in Central Europe, and Budvar finnally adds it's beer to the U.S Market -- a drop in the bucket, when you compare volumes. IRT the beer itself, I personally wasn't really wow'ed when I picked up a 6-pack for $9.00. I've never had a bad czech lager, but then again, Czechvar wasn't anything I could get really excited about, either (IMHO). Around here, Staropramen and Pilsner Urquell are both less expensive, and fresher tasting, both on-tap and in bottles. Cheers! Todd Bissell Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 08:52:28 +0200 From: "Aikema, J.N. (JohanNico)" <JohanNico.Aikema at akzonobel.com> Subject: sprinkling sparging Hi, For sprinkling you need a (rotating) sprinkling arm to distribute the water evenly. I think the risk of letting in oxygen into the grainbed is greater than with sparging with a layer of water above the top level of the grain. But with the last mentioned method there exists the risk of sparging with a diluted sugar solution (less yield). Can anyone suggest me where I can get/buy rice hulls? Greetings from Holland, Hans Aikema, http://www.hopbier.myweb.nl Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 19:01:16 +1000 From: craftbrewer at telstra.easymail.com.au Subject: A Poke G'day All / Now what can one say. Bloody yanks. Yes I enlist the buggers to shoot a few southerners while they are on exericse over here, even point them to a nice area where they can intercept plenty of them, and what happens. All they can shoot is one emu. Yes thats right, took a whole company to bring down one rather large mobile feather duster. Then they have the gall to say, opps, we didn't see it. Dear ol Sadam must be wonder "How did i lose". / Now dear Bob did write (and yes it was a nice piece of work indeed) When I log on and read the HBD, I picture guys (mostly, >maybe a few Sheilas) from all walks of life, in a big house party, drinking beer and sharing stories and information. <<<<<< / Now fuuny thing, I sort of pictured me surrounded by all the sheilas, all in admiration of the brewing god from down under, with my brewing kit bag there for them all to take hold and have a sample. With the guys just staring and muttering - Bastard - under a foaming glass of beverage that would never measure up to one of my beers. / which sort of drifts to what Glen said Don't forget to add the few of us gathered on the lawn around a passed-out Graham, poking him with a stick to see if we can make him roll over.<<<<< / Now Glen, I would love a good poke (and I am not explaining that Aus slang term to any of you lot) and having those ladies arround will do nicely, but I couldn't picture myself rolling over and seeing Steve A there, gleem in his eyes at the thought of a deep scientific discovery. True i might set him straight (is that the right term) and show him actually what goes on in the real world, but he might not be able to look at a test tube again. / Shout Graham Sanders / / oh it was asked From: "Max McDonohue" <max at hinet.net.au> Subject: Who Is Doctor Pivo? / I have been reading here in this digest for some time and decided to ask a few questions. Who is this Doctor Pivo and why does he seem to have such a dislike for Mr Alexander? Are they both in love with the same woman?<<<< / Sort of - Their lady of their life is Mrs Wort (But Dr P calls her Mrs Palm late at night). Now Mr A dreams one day of actually meeting her, sort of like a teenager dreaming of his first experience, knows what to do, just need the person. Dr P on the other hand, has had so many he forgotten what true love is. / So its up to the two gurus of brewing at the party, sitting in a qiuet corner, after all have had their fill. Ponder all the bodies in front of us. Its true, we two are the only ones with no hangups. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 13:05:47 +0200 From: Ant Hayes <Ant.Hayes at FifthQuadrant.co.za> Subject: Bier Jaarboek I am trying to track down a copy of Peter Crombecq's Bier Jaarboek - does anyone know where I can buy one? Ant Hayes Gauteng Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 06:35:40 -0400 (EDT) From: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu Subject: Brown Malt question (Paul Mahoney) paul; I think that it depends upon the qualities of the brown malt in question, but I experimented (a year or so ago) with brown malt from Fawcett's only to find that 1-2 lb per 5 gallon batch is about the max. The reason for this (and I have this directly from the maltster- Mr Fawcett himself, as well as from our own local expert Mr Renner) that the brown malt does not have enough diastatic power . I will look for the email that he sent me if you'd like ... Too much brown malt, in my "experiments" led to a very heavy coffee-like flavor...and I have had to toss a few batches due to this... Happy Brewing! ..Darrell Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 06:56:24 -0500 From: james r layton <blutick at juno.com> Subject: Re: Hop pellets and the Bazooka screen Neil K wrote: >I'm about to have a hole drilled in my big, beautiful, brand-new 9 gallon pot >and would like to try a Bazooka screen, but I tend to use hop pellets. Is >the screen mesh fine enough/coarse enough to filter all my hop pellet sludge >without clogging? I firmly believe that any kettle configuration that tries to pull wort through a layer of hop pellet sludge is doomed to failure. It isn't the screen that clogs, it is the sludge that blocks wort flow. The trick to keeping the hop pellet bits in the kettle and out of the fermenter is to let them settle, then draw clear wort off from a pickup point that isn't buried in the sludge. Doing the whirlpool trick will get most of the sludge to pile up in the middle of the kettle. One thing about whirlpools, any pickup tubes or other projecting devices will disturb the whirling action. Hop bits will pile up in the eddies behind the projections. A "clean" kettle works best. Jim Layton Howe, TX Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 08:15:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Wayne Page <wdpage at pinn.net> Subject: RE: Sparge times in a RIMS/HERMS system Mike, I have tried all three methods on my RIMS: fly, batch and no-sparge. If you want higher efficiencies go for the slow fly or batch-sparge, you will wash sugars out of the grain that won't come out in the higher density first runnings that you have been recirculating. If efficiency isn't as important, but length of brew-day is, go for the no-sparge. I have been using it exclusively for the last year and am very happy with the result. You will end up with a VERY full mash tun, but I haven't run out of space yet in my converted keg and the beer seems to have a better malt character than I got with the other two methods. One of these days my schedule and that of the HRB&TS will mesh, and I'll bring a few samples down to a meeting for you to try! Wayne D, Page Brewing Deep in the Great Dismal Swamp Chesapeake, VA >I have a question for you all (especially those using RIMS/HERMS >systems. Since I spend an hour or so recircing the wort and if >I do a mashout is there a reason to extend the sparge out to 45- >60 minutes? Seems to me that all the sugars would be in >suspension and I should be able to do a fast sparge without >any problems arising. >Any ideas? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 09:06:17 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at mediaone.net> Subject: Re: Robust Porter Paul Mahoney <pmmaho at yahoo.com> of Roanoke, Virginia writes >I am planning on using brown malt as my base malt. >Here is my suggested recipe: >Brown Malt 7 # >Pale Ale 2# ><snip> >But my primary question is: should I use this much >Brown malt? Can I use it as a base malt, or should I >reverse the Pale Ale malt and Brown malt proportions? I made a similar suggestion to Darrell Leavitt a few years ago when Thomas Fawcett & Sons' malts became available here in the US (I was mostly interested in their malted oats). Darrell tried it and got something resembling coffee, and no conversion. In checking with Fawcett, either he or I found that modern brown malt does not contain much in the way of enzymes. I think that reversing the proportions may be too extreme, but I wouldn't exceed maybe 40%. Some other brewers have reported a harshness when using more than 25%, but it apparently mellows with age. Jeff - -- ***Please note new address*** (old one will still work) Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at mediaone.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 09:15:17 -0400 From: "Steven Parfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com> Subject: RE: fermentor geometry Steven M. Claussen wrote >In HBD #3634, Stephen Alexander said regarding fermentor geometry: >>An BB&MB type CC has the same surface area to >>volume ratio as a cornelius keg with 3.75 gallons of wort so we should >>expect similar O2 diffusion into the wort. (1) Why do we care about 02 diffusion into wort? once fermentation takes off the CO2 blanket prevents O2 diffusion any way. That is unless you are talking about really open top fermenters, and then once Kruessen (sp) heads up, it will prevent much O2 diffusion. (2) Watching my latest batch of APA, I can't help but wonder if small feremnters are so turbulent, how can any temp gradients can build up for long. The patterns of swirls and eddy currents were phenominal! (3) Mr. Fix (i believe) proposes an experiment using Corny Kegs as fermenters to assess the effects of Fermenter geometry. I would submit that such a test should be carried out not with just corny kegs, but with split batches. The batches should be large enough to allow splitting between corny kegs and another fermenter with a lower H/W ratio, such as a 6 gallon carboy. The reason of proposing the split batches is to get better control. Each person performing the experiment would be replicating the experiment with as many variables eliminated as possible. If you were to simply use N additional brewers fermenting in corny kegs, you would have n sets of uncontrolled variables. Not a good way to run the experiment. Variables I can see right off the bat are (1) Yeast, (2) How was starter made, (3) mash schedule, (4) grain bill variations, (5) water quality/hardness/???, (6) pitching conditions, temp, SpGr, (7) Fermentation temperature/environment, (8) racking procedures, (9) lagering conditions, ..... If this esperiemnt proceeds, you really need to get a good handle on variables by detailing the procedure and having precise documentation of the individual batches. Steven Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 09:26:08 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at mediaone.net> Subject: Re: lots of mouth-feel Speaking of Darrell <leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu>, he writes: >I brewed a Rye ale recently (4/22/01) and have found that >it has a heap more body/ mouthfeel than I had planned. <snip> >I am wondering if it was the higher than usual >(for me) initial rest (150F).<snip> >6lb Weissheimer Pilsner malt >1.5 lb Rye Malt >2 lb Vienna Malt >2 lb Flaked Barley <snip> >Chilled and put onto a good size yeast cake of Irish Ale >yeast (Whitelabs) <--$# at $ THAT'S IT! right? The yeast leaves >too much residuals? ...I guess I may have it figured out.. >not sure... I am not sure you have figured it out. You got good attenuation, 1.056->1.013. That's not a lot of residuals, proportionally at least. Of course, it is a fairly big beer, which means it will have a fair amount of body. I think it's more likely the rye malt and flaked barley. They both contribute body, likely through beta glucans and protein. They are high in both. If it's too much body, you could do a beta glucan rest. I think that is around 115F, but you ought to check the archives. Jeff - -- ***Please note new address*** (old one will still work) Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at mediaone.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 06:59:58 -0400 From: Tom Riddle <ftr at oracom.com> Subject: Culturing yeast from Karmeliet Tripel bottle Does anyone know if the yeast in the Karmeliet Tripel bottle is the same used for main fermentation ? What are people's experience in general with culturing from bottles ? Thanks, Tom Portsmouth, NH - -- Tom Riddle Oracom, Inc. http://www.oracom.com Tel. +1 978.557.5710x305 Fax +1 978.557.5716 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 10:53:07 -0400 From: "David Craft" <David-Craft at craftinsurance.com> Subject: recipe Hello, Does anyone have an all grain recipe for New Belgium's Fat Tire Ale? I = live in the east and have tried this beer while traveling out west. It = is one of my favorites. David B. Craft Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 11:04:45 -0400 From: "RJ" <wortsbrewing at cyberportal.net> Subject: Re: Robust Porter Paul Mahoney writes: >But my primary question is: should I use this much > Brown malt? Can I use it as a base malt, or should I > reverse the Pale Ale malt and Brown malt proportions? The biggest problem that I foresee with using such a high percentage of Brown Malt is that you'll most likely end up with motor oil when your through... The brown malt sold by Hugh-Baird contains very few fermentables, if any. If you want to still use this percentage, I would suggest that you use homemade Brown Malt instead. It'll still be heavy in the finish, but not as bad as the HB & it'll bring with it a toastiness that you won't get with the HB, either. A pound of Weyermann's Raunch malt or 1/4 pound of HB (low) Peat malt will bring out the smoky qualities that you want. Ciao, RJ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 11:53:56 -0400 From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com> Subject: Water WRT: Chloride 8 ppm Floride 0.3 ppm CaCo3 209 ppm Iron 0.2 ppm Sodium 9 ppm Sulphate 9 ppm Need some clarification on the 209 ppm number. Both hardness and alkalinity are reported (usually) in terms of "ppm as CaCO3" and I assume, therefore, that the 209 is, thus, one or the other of those. I really need to know the alkalinity and sepatate calcium and magnesium hardnesses (or concentration of these two as the ion) though I can guestimate if given just the total or just the calcium. - -- A.J. deLange CT Project Manager Zeta Associates 10302 Eaton Place Fairfax, VA 22030 (703) 359 8696 855 0905 ajdel at mindspring.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 08:56:56 -0700 From: "Steven M. Claussen" <sclaussen at mail.kindercare.com> Subject: more fermentor geometry In HBD #3635, I questioned Stephen Alexander's statement discounting the difference in height to width ratio of a corny keg and a CC fermentor. Nathan Kanous said in response to my post: >Everyone is posting that it is the H:W ratio that makes a >difference. You state that nobody could ferment 3.75 gallons in a corny >keg and that suggesting so is "cooking data". Bad form, my friend. Actually, I never suggested that you COULDN'T put 3.75 gallons in 5 gallon corny, only that you wouldn't. I may have misread S. Alexander's post, but I understood him as saying that the surface area to volume ratio of the corny and CC are really about the same, and that, as a result, the hypothesis was incorrect that the difference between fermentation characteristics of the two vessels was based on the increased surface area (and, therefore, oxygen uptake) in the CC. As I re-read it now, I believe my original understanding was correct: > [excerpt from S. Alexander's post] The hypothesis about geometry impacting >surface area so oxygen uptake demonstrates an argument that does not support the >H:Wgeometry argument. An BB&MB type CC has the same surface area to >volume ratio as a cornelius keg with 3.75 gallons of wort so we should expect >similar O2 diffusion into the wort. A test tube fermenter mayhave a 5:1 H:W ratio >yet a much higher surface:volume ratio thaneither of the above fermenters. O2 >inclusion is not determined by H:Wratios. As to what appears to be the point of your post, I agree that one could conduct an experiment of the impact of H:W ratio by simply putting less wort in any given fermentor. This, effectively, would change the "geometry" of the vessel. -Steve Claussen in PDX - Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 11:20:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org> Subject: HBD CAP Experiment... Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... George proposes an experiment! Woo-hoo! Reminiscent in the days of the great HBD Pale Alexperiment, I propose a similar experiment be conducted. Here's what we need: o A non-combatant to chair the experiment o A committee to set the terms of the experiment o A webmaster to serve up the experiment online o A volunteer to donate the grain bill - ideally, all brewers will use the same brand and type of grains from the same lot o A volunteer to donate the hops bill - ideally, all brewers would receive the same type of hop from the same bale or package o A volunteer to donate the yeast - ideally, all brewers will use the same yeast from the smae generation from the same lab o A sponsor for the shipping of the above o Volunteers capable of lager brewing having one or more of the various fermenter geometries required The target recipe will be Jeff Renner's CAP as layed out in Sep/Oct '95 Brewing Techniques (http://www.brewingtechniques.com/library/backissues/issue3.5/renner.html) Any takers? - -- - See ya! Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock at hbd.org Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org HBD Web Site http://hbd.org The Home Brew Page http://hbd.org/pbabcock "The monster's back, isn't it?" - Kim Babcock after I emerged from my yeast lab Saturday Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 14:14:13 -0400 From: Marc Sedam <marc_sedam at unc.edu> Subject: the HBD warm-fuzzies Good discussion about visualizing the HBD as a barroom. But someone forgot the inevitable drunken scrum about yeast vitality or fermenter geometry bound to erupt at 2am... I realized this morning that my day rarely feels complete without a full dose of the HBD. It's a good thing. An even better thing is that I'm going down to the Sunshine Challenge 2001 in FL this weekend as a guest of the Central Florida Homebrewers. The best thing is that I'll be joined by HBD stalwarts Jeff Renner and Dave Burley (and Dave's repaired ticker). Clearly these are two people whom I would never had met were it not for the HBD. I've had several sets of correspondence with both Dave and Jeff over the past few years and virtually know them. Now I'll have the opportunity to spend a few days surrounded by homebrew to get to know them in person. Few things are as enjoyable as a homebrew. Having some in the company of good people is one of them. All hail the HBD. Cheers! Marc - -- Marc Sedam Chapel Hill, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 15:32:43 -0700 From: "Scott McLagan" <smclagan at sd48.bc.ca> Subject: Sanke Snap Rings Hi All. Anyone know of a source for replacement snap rings for Sanke kegs? I'd like to replace the spiral ones (pain in the butt) with normal 'snap ring pliers' type. Much thanks, Scott. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 20:14:51 EDT From: BrwyFoam at aol.com Subject: CAP experiment Hi! Our janitor writes: >George proposes an experiment! Woo-hoo! >Reminiscent in the days of the great HBD Pale Alexperiment, I propose a >similar experiment be conducted. Those were the "pre-one upmanship" days! I have gotten a lot of e-mail about my post. I guess virtual brewing is not as popular as I thought. In any case I am in. I think it is important than we all use the same recipe to minimize confounding factors. I will therefore go out and get some 6-row malt ( for the first time in decades!).However I issue an urgent request. Please no Cluster hops. Remember we and our friends have to drink the beers that are not sent for evaluation! All this and not once did I use the T-word. Cheers, George Fix Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 21:10:45 -0500 From: "elvira toews" <etoews1 at home.com> Subject: cranberries My experience with cranberries would lead me to disagree with Marc. Yes, cranberries are acidic, but I put pounds and pounds of them in a 6 USG batch and the yeast doesn't seem to mind. The resulting wort is no more acidic than wine must. There might be some variable level of antibiotic activity, as found in blueberries, which would explain different brewers having different results. The other difference would be that I use whole (crushed) berries instead of juice. That allows the yeast to get going before the carbonic maceration liberates any odd substances. Sorbate (the blueberry ingredient) will not usually knock down an active fermentation, but will prevent one from starting. Sean Richens srichens at sprint.ca Return to table of contents
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