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FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
Re: Steinbier (The Brews Traveler)
Phils alive and already causing a stir... (Scott Morgan - Sun On-Line Telesales Representative)
Careful Dennis! ("Phil & Jill Yates")
Unnecessary Attack ("Phil & Jill Yates")
Gypsum lowers mash pH - Fact or Momily? (Tony Barnsley)
Is It Not So? ("Stephen Alexander")
Re: Floaters ("RJ")
Re: RE: Yeast Nutrient ("RJ")
The Mind Boggles!! ("Phil & Jill Yates")
Zymurgists, of course! ("Ray Daniels")
a name for a brewer ("Alan McKay")
Re: Fermentation times and Nutrient (Graham Stone)
Terminology - Fermentation and secondary fermentation (Graham Stone)
Agave Mead (ThE HoMeBrEw RaT)
Phil's Simple Calculations ("Jim Bermingham")
BIG Rims ("Jens Maudal")
Re: RIMS chamber & element (Rob Dewhirst)
Proud owner of a Hydrocollator...now what? ("Tim Martin")
Simple? (AJ)
compost & skunks ("Richard B. Dulany Jr.")
ProMash and mathematics (Frank Tutzauer)
Beer In Southern Illinois? ("Kirk, Jim")
A name for a brewer (stihlerunits)
Selenium ("Houseman, David L")
Re:Aquarium Pumps? (Bill Tobler)
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Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2001 23:00:53 -0600
From: The Brews Traveler <BrewsTraveler at adamsco-inc.com>
Subject: Re: Steinbier
I too have had the privilege of discussing the style with Chuck Skypeck
and have on occasion brewed my own. As Chuck himself has pointed out,
Steinbier is really a process and less of a style. The process tends to
lend itself to style-like characteristics.
I put together a web page discussing the beer, its origins, and how to
brew your own if anyone is interested:
http://www.adamsco-inc.com/BrewsTraveler/Main/howto/steinbier
- --
John Adams
The Brews Traveler
http://www.adamsco-inc.com/BrewsTraveler
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 17:13:06 +1000 (EST)
From: Scott Morgan - Sun On-Line Telesales Representative <Scott.Morgan at Sun.COM>
Subject: Phils alive and already causing a stir...
My God Pat..Phil's back! You know what that means...
>BTW Phil, I am a Promash user and find the program very useful. Be careful
>about generalizations just because you were too cheap to buy a very useful
>brewing tool.
and more...
My point is not that one cannot brew or do calculations w/o Promash, but
the gratuitous attacks on those who do use it are silly and childish.
I'd just email a loon from up North Phil...he reckons he could fix
that for you!!! But would it really work is the question!
Stonebeer- With much regret the sale of my folks house has ended a
long tradition of exploding river peebles hurredly transfered to wort
outside. My Bro and I usually do this around August(our winter) and its
always great fun.
Search the archives and you will be sweet...as will be your beer.
Just keep the IBU's down...
Scotty
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 17:14:52 +1000
From: "Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au>
Subject: Careful Dennis!
Dennis Collins writes :
>BTW Phil, I am a Promash user and find the program very >useful. Be
careful
>about generalizations just because you were too cheap to >buy a very useful
>brewing tool.
Now hold on a minute there Dennis! As Baron of Burradoo I am certainly not
too cheap to buy any thing. I came here, liked the province and promptly
bought it. A pissy little Promash programme isn't going to financially upset
me if I thought it was of any use.
I shouldn't have referred to Promash users in general. But my experience
with some chaps who get totally absorbed in computer programmes is that they
often don't understand the basics. If their computer breaks down they can't
add two and two.
You see this often in shops these days with kids trying to add up when the
cash register goes on the blink. They can't do it.
Another simple calc I like to use to approximate IBU's is:
Wt of Hops (in grms) multiplied by AAR multiplied by utilisation (you need
to know your own)
All of the above divided by total wort volume multiplied by ten.
equals approximate IBU's of your beer.
Seems obvious to me, what do you reckon Dennis?
Cheers
Phil
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 17:27:24 +1000
From: "Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au>
Subject: Unnecessary Attack
Len Safhay writes :
>And if people with no math sense can now easily find out,
>say, how much water to add, what's wrong with that? Only >really smart
>guys like Phil are allowed to brew?
Now Len, this is very unfair.
Past posters and readers of the HBD would well know I have been more than
fair and tolerant with some of the lowest of intellect brewers. Can I sell
you a wort kit Len?
Cheers
Phil
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 10:25:53 +0100
From: Tony Barnsley <tony.barnsley at blackpool.gov.uk>
Subject: Gypsum lowers mash pH - Fact or Momily?
Hi Oh Great Brewing Collective,
My fellow zymurgists on the UK homebrew list, have had a lively discussion
regarding a statement made by one member. His contention is that adding
gypsum to the mash RAISES the pH, (Increases alkalinity, lowering acidity),
through the mechanism of protonation, where the Amine end of the protein
chains mops up free H+ ions ( -NH2 + H+ -> -NH3+ ) (I may have this wrong
and its the other end, whatever one end accepts the free proton) this leaves
OH- floating around and subsequently the pH of the mash rises.
Now this flies in the very face of all the brewing literature I've read, and
indeed in the face of the practical experience many of us have when brewing.
My very soft water when used in a mash has a pH around 5.8-5.9, Adding a
teaspoon of Gypsum will drag the ph down to 5.3-5.4 ( I feel a 'spurment
coming on, anybody want to loan me a 3 grand pH meter and a trained lab rat
to operate it :> ). Said member has used gypsum in a mash and noticed no
change in pH.
As far as I understood the chemistry, the Calcium reacts with phosphate
released from phytin (as Phosphoric acid) to form calcium phosphate
(insoluble) and free protons which drop the pH (assuming the alkalinity of
the mash is low enough, mine is around 12ppm unless I add 0.29ml of lactic
acid in my 50L of brewing liquor. Yeah I agree, why bother? ). Ok so that
may be an oversimplification, but its the basics of what happens.
Now I know that water will participate in hydrogen bonding with the protein
chains, but I cannot believe that a significant shift in pH will happen
through protonation of the protein chains. I've checked my Biochem and Chem
text books and yes protonation does happen. I would guess that if the
proteins are spiky ones with lots of free amine arms stuck out from the main
chain then more protons would be mopped up (some proteins do exhibit a small
degree of buffering because of protonation), but most of the malt proteins
are enzymes and these tend to exhibit a more globular form.
So the question to the collective, is the oft repeated statement that
"Gypsum lowers mash pH" a fact or a momily?
Yes I am aware that in pure water the addition of gypsum will cause an
increase in pH because the sulphate ion is a weak base.
Well done if you made it this far :>
My thanks to all who responded on the copper thread. I actually discussed it
with Helen, TMB, who teaches Chemistry, of course Copper lies below hydrogen
in the reactivity series and so pure clean copper will not react with acids
except Nitric, but that's an odd one. Dirty copper is a different ball game
though, the protective oxide layer will dissolve releasing copper ions into
the wort. These will be absorbed by the yeasties. Pitch enough yeast and the
level of copper in each yeast cell won't reach toxic levels. The upshot of
this is that I had the brain wave that I could have a 200L copper kettle
made, contacted a fabricator and it will cost 170ukp.
Thanks all.
- --
Wassail!
The Scurrilous Aleman (ICQ 46254361)
Schwarzbad Lager Brauerei, Blackpool, Lancs, UK
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Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 05:41:19 -0400
From: "Stephen Alexander" <steve-alexander at ieee.org.nospam>
Subject: Is It Not So?
Phil Yates writes ....
>I have always enjoyed simple mathematics and found them useful.
Don't they require shoes in the cockpit ? Oh yeah open-toed heels. And just
what is the singular of "mathematics" anyway ?
>If one produces say, 20 litres of wort with a specific gravity of 1050, and
>you are interested in diluting it to 25 litres [..]
Hmm well Math is one of mine but in brewing it's more like numerology.
First the techno-weenie response. Total extract calculation that assumes
linear SG.vs.extract (or %mass) is doomed to failure. Even ideal solutes
don't act that way. Phil's calculation extract = vol*excess-SG = constant
is fundamentally flawed. I should also point out that this erroneous flawed
is a good enough approximation to be used in well respected journals.of
brewing. The other idea present in HBing is that we should use the Plato
scale like the pro-brewers. Doktor Plato made solutions of cane sugar (not
quite pure sucrose) and charted SG versus %mass of solute. Wort extract
isn't sucrose by a long shot but that is what all the pro's are pretending.
Switching from SG to Plato is a pretty dim idea except that is commonly
used.
The approximations:
<total extract = constant = vol * excess-SG>
and
<4 * Plato = excess SG>
are both pretty good despite the flaws, and generally will keep you honest
to within 1% over a reasonable brewing range of values.
>Seems obvious to me. But ask a Promash user if he understands this and all
>you get is a blank face.
I do know what you mean. A friend and most excellent brewer recently had no
idea how he measured efficiency (there are at least 3 common and very
different ways to measure it) except that it was 85% on ProMash.
In my wayward undergrad career studying Physics I learned that although you
can pass tests by treating the stuff you don't understand as mathematical
abstractions, that this leaves you with absolutely no base to build on when
you need to reason about and apply these in another context. It really
doesn't matter if you're discussing IBUs or entropy, malt extract or mass
defect.. If you have no seat-of-the-pants feel for it you can't really
think through what is happening. The simple calculations you cite are a
good example of rules that should help us understand and have a quantifiable
"feel" for the dilution's effect.
>From all reports Promash is a great software package and I have no quibble
with using it as a convenience, but not a crutch.
>Steve Alexander, comments please.
More than you wanted to know yet ' Phil ? The answer is that the SG of the
20L->25L dilution of SG=1.050 wort would give SG=~1.03964 (not 1.040) !
BTW Phil, thanks to a kind gift of rhizomes from the ever-humble
Hopfenmeister Mark Kellums I have 6 (maybe 7) Ultra hops plants growing like
weeds at my new place and many more Eroicas Is there a club for heirloom
hops growers ? It will probably be late 2002 before I get a crop, but I
still hope to get you the Ultra I once promised.
-S
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 06:31:30 -0400
From: "RJ" <wortsup at metrocast.net>
Subject: Re: Floaters
"David Craft" <David-Craft at craftinsurance.com> wrote:
"My last two batches this summer has had insufficient hot-break, which
leaves
"floaters" lurking in the wort. I use an immersion chiller and as the tap
water warms I cannot get the quick enough chill to settle out the proteins.
I am working on a solution for my next batch, running some ice water through
the chiller the last 10 minutes."
If you can't get your hands on a counter-flow chiller, you might try adding
another separate immersion chiller that sits in a bucket of ice-water,
before going to the immersion chiller in the kettle... That should really
make a significant difference, in cooling down the wort.
"My question how long should I wait before transferring to a secondary? I
am making a Vienna Lager, which I usually let ferment about 2 weeks before
transferring. An ale I would only wait about 5 days. Do these floaters (
they look like turds, sorry) have a detrimental effect on the beer?"
As for the floaters, sounds like: you may not be adding enough Irish Moss or
adding it at the wrong time; or your using a high proportion of adjuncts; or
your boil is not sufficiently churning...
When making ales, and not caring a great deal about clarity, I generally
would not bother with the next step... But when I'm looking for clarity in
the finished product I often rack to a starter tank & pitch, when the yeast
shows signs of fermentation, approx 4-8 hours later, I rack again to the
"primary" and go from there, leaving as much trub behind as possible.
Not knowing what temperatures and specific yeast that your using, I'd say
the 5 days & 2 week scenarios are appropriate.
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 06:34:29 -0400
From: "RJ" <wortsup at metrocast.net>
Subject: Re: RE: Yeast Nutrient
"Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com> wrote:
"I recently began using crushed zinc tablets in my boils. Now I haven't
done
any side-by-side testing, but these brews have had the most explosive
fermentations I've experienced. Even a lager where I pitched lots of yeast
but intentionally did not aerate (to reduce ester production) really took
off. As an all-grain brewer I don't believe additional yeast nutrients are
necessary, but the zinc may have had a positive affect."
Dave,
Have you drank any of the beer made this way? I'm interested in knowing if
any metalic taste came thru???
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 21:08:37 +1000
From: "Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au>
Subject: The Mind Boggles!!
Steve Alexander makes comment :
>More than you wanted to know yet ' Phil ? The answer is that >the SG of
the
>20L->25L dilution of SG=1.050 wort would give >SG=~1.03964 (not 1.040) !
Steve
This is exactly what I would have expected from you. I knew my simple math
(In my day we only knew it as "mathematics") would be far too puerile for
your scientifically buzzing mind.
I look forward to receiving your hops.
And as promised, my very popular Czech style lager will be dispatched to
you, hopefully much sooner now that I have a bit more time on my hands.
Hope the house building is going okay.
Cheers
Phil
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 06:36:06 -0500
From: "Ray Daniels" <raydan at ameritech.net>
Subject: Zymurgists, of course!
Kevin McDonough asks what brewers are called. Various options spring to
mind:
Yeast ranchers . . .
Fermentation engineers . . .
Suds supervisors . . .
Wort watchers . . .
Malt masters . . .
And you could check out the names of about 80 percent of the homebrew clubs
for some ideas that are actually clever.
The real (serious, now) answer is, of course: zymurgists!
Ray Daniels
Editor-in-Chief
Zymurgy & The New Brewer
Phone: 773-665-1300
E-mail: ray at aob.org
Call Customer Service at 888-822-6273 to subscribe or order individual
magazines.
Don't Miss:
Great American Beer Festival - Denver, CO - Sept 27-29
For more info see: www.beertown.org
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 07:45:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at ottawa.com>
Subject: a name for a brewer
The obvious term which comes to mind is "Zymurgist"
http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=zymurgy
cheers,
-Alan
- --
"Brewers make wort. Yeast makes beer."
- Dave Miller
http://www.bodensatz.com/
What's a Bodensatz? http://www.bodensatz.com/bodensatz.html
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 12:56:07 +0100
From: Graham Stone <gstone at dthomas.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Fermentation times and Nutrient
Well, looks like I finally got a rise out you American brewers! :) The
Nutrient that UK brewers use contains almost entirely inorganics salts.
Alan Meeker (Baltimore, MD) replied concerning the protein content of the
wort and I would not argue that worts probably have sufficient protein.
Judging by the amount of effort we go to to get rid of the stuff I would
have to totally agree. However, if you are collecting and repitching the
same yeast day after day, as we are, eventually the yeast does start to run
out of essential salts and vitamins - these are what make up the bulk of the
yeast nutrient that we use (Yeast-Vit from Murphy and Sons:
http://www.murphyandson.co.uk).
Graham Stone
www.portchesterbrewery.co.uk
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 13:35:31 +0100
From: Graham Stone <gstone at dthomas.co.uk>
Subject: Terminology - Fermentation and secondary fermentation
After a few recent posting about Nutrients, Joseph Gerteis highlighted an
issue about nomenclature. Here's how we call it in the UK (details on web
site below):
Commercially, fermentation takes place in a single container where the
gravity is dropped from some starting point to about 2 degrees above final
expected gravity. At this point, fermentation is stopped by cooling.
Generally speaking, this is done by racking the green wort into another
attemperated vessel (with cooling built into on onto the vessel) or, as in
our case, into a fermentation freezer fitted with an external thermostat
(Hoptech, CA). The wort is cooled over a period of 2-3 days (no faster that
1 degree every 3 hours) in order to slow fermentation and hence encourage it
to sediment out of the wort. This process is called Conditioning and NOT
secondary fermentation. The goal is: to get exactly the target gravity
when the beer is drawn from the cask on serving and to get the correct level
of carbonation in the cask. Too high a yeast count and too much
fermentation will continue in the cask (beer too high gravity and too thin)
- not enough and the beer will lack condition and be too sweet). After
conditioning, the wort is racked into casks along with finings. Whilst in
the sealed casks a small amount of fermentation takes place in order to get
1-1.5 volumes of CO2 into the beer. This is secondary fermentation and is a
defining characteristics of "real ale".
>From a homebrew perspective, sometimes the jargon changes. Authors like
Graham Wheeler and Dave Line sometimes recommend "dropping" the fermenting
beer after a day or two from the start. This is done for 2 reasons: To get
the wort aerated in order to help yeast growth (not fermentation) and
secondly to get the wort off any old/dying yeast that may have come from a
starter. In practise, on small scales, this technique is worth trying.
>From Joseph's posting, it would appear that racking beer from one container
to another during fermentation is also common practise in the states.
However, I am not clear why you guys do it. It may be that you don't chill
your beer to stop fermentation but instead just let it grind naturally to a
halt. If so, racking the wort off the bulk of the yeast is a good thing.
But is it secondary fermentation - I don't think so.
Graham Stone
www.portchesterbrewery.co.uk
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 05:41:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: ThE HoMeBrEw RaT <skotrat at yahoo.com>
Subject: Agave Mead
hmmm 5 pounds of honey, 3 pounds of agave nectar, some yeast and
budda bing budda bang... Agave Mead...
Anyone try it??? Thoughts???
Is it good??
-Scott
=====
"Dogs love me cause I'm crazy sniffable
I bet you never knew I got the ill peripheral"
-bboys
http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat - Skotrats Beer Page
http://www.brewrats.org - BrewRats HomeBrew Club
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 08:16:31 -0500 (Central Daylight Time)
From: "Jim Bermingham" <bermingham at antennaproducts.com>
Subject: Phil's Simple Calculations
Phil,
How dare you advocate that we Americans use our brains when doing
calculations. Next you will be wanting store clerks to do the ancient art
of actually counting out change instead of letting the cash register do it
for them. Phil, we are Americans! We forgot how to add, subtract, multiply
and divide soon after the hand held calculator became affordable. With the
recent high school graduates I've seen applying for jobs at my workplace it
s debatable that these subjects are still taught in school.
Absolutely nothing wrong with tools to make our daily lives easier but it is
a shame when we start blasting people who suggest exercising our brain cells
Phil you're still better off than your mate from the north. Two weeks were
spent on him for suggesting that software code might be broken for some of
the brewing software on the market. We have "Software Police" in the states
No one and I mean no one has any bootlegged software on their computers
nor have any of us ever downloaded MP3 files from Napster and put them on a
CD. I don't know anyone that has ever recorded a rental movie either.
God I love it when Phil is back on line
Jim Bermingham
Millsap, TX
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 15:39:28 +0200
From: "Jens Maudal" <jens.maudal at c2i.net>
Subject: BIG Rims
Has anybody experiance with big RIMS set up's, let's say
something like a 1 or 2 barrel system.
I suppose in theory there shouldn't be any limits for how
big a RIMS system could be.
I am planning on building a RIMS for a small brewpub, something
in the region of 2 barrels and wonder if anybody have any
experiance with this size of system.
Jens
Jens P. Maudal jens.maudal at c2i.net
Greetings from "BottomsUp Brewery"
Drammen - Norway
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Visit my humble RIMS and homebrew page:
http://home.c2i.net/bottomsup/index.htm
Norbrygg bryggeside: http://www.norbrygg.com
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 09:03:44 -0500
From: Rob Dewhirst <robd at biocomplexity.nhm.ukans.edu>
Subject: Re: RIMS chamber & element
>From: Karen & Troy Hager <thager at smcoe.k12.ca.us>
>
>MB's $59 chamber is cheaper than DIY...???
>
>Home Depot - 1.5" copper pipe, 4' length $11
>Local Plumbing Supply - fittings $9
You are very lucky to have a home depot local. Many of us don't. I am
sure that my closest one doesn't have 1.5" copper pipe and fittings
either. If I recall the other person on this subject also said they did
not have a local supplier for parts.
Bear in mind there are regional variations in cost as well. My local
plumbing supply charged $19 for a 3' piece of 1.5"-2" pipe.
>So if my math is right, DIY setup = $33 + change vs. MB setup = $83 +
>shipping, which has to be a bit for a 5+lb package. I think I will settle
>for the DIY setup with a savings of $50!!! Of course copper doesn't sparkle
>like that SS does! ;>)
Well, there are a few costs not figured in here that close the gap. First,
you must have tools to assemble the DIY version -- torch capable of
sweating 1.5" copper, solder, flux, sandpaper, etc.. Next, every piece of
the MB chamber is threaded. I doubt $9 bought 4+ threaded 1.5" copper
fittings (but it may have!). Next, you're time, but we've been done that
road before. It's somewhere above $0.
Finally, when I evaluated the costs, I didn't consider the element to be
part of the chamber. I didn't buy mine from MB because they didn't sell
it. I also don't think Chris B was referring to the element either.
So it looks like you can make an a copper chamber if you have a good local
supplier and already have the tools, but comparing what you made to the MB
chamber deserves closer scrutiny.
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 10:52:47 -0400
From: "Tim Martin" <TimMartin at southwest.cc.nc.us>
Subject: Proud owner of a Hydrocollator...now what?
Hey Neighbors,
Long time no post but I still read every day. I didn't know what a
Hydrocollator was last week but now I own one. It is a ten gallon
square stainless steel container with a lid. It has a 120v-1000watt
heating element in the bottom. It also has a drain and spigot. it used
by physical therapist type people to heat hot packs. It has a variable
thermostat that maintains water temps at 160 to 166df. When I first
saw this puppy I knew it had to be in my brewery.
Question???How do I override the thermostat. Or is it possible to
replace the thermostat with another that will allow me to achieve a
higher temp. I need to reach 175df to use for my mash and sparge. I
called the company and told them I wanted to use one of their old
hydrocollator to make beer and they said, "huh, you will melt the wire
and start a fire if you make it get any hotter". I knew they wouldn't
understand. Any ideas will be appreciated. I'll probably start
tinkering with it tonight.
Thanks,
Tim Martin
Cullowhee, NC
Buzzardsroost Brewery
"with that strong predatory taste"
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 15:37:03 +0000
From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com>
Subject: Simple?
The burning question of the day seems to be whether calculation of
concentration change caused by dilution or concentration based on
specific gravity "points" is a simple matter. It is indeed if an
approximate answer is acceptable and, given the accuracy with which home
brewers typically measure specific gravity, an approximate answer is
fine. The accurate calculation is a little more detailed. One determines
the concentration of sugar by entering specific gravity into tables
promulgated by ASBC or EBC. These are based on the Plato tables and
list, for each specific gravity value, the number of grams of sugar in
100 grams of a wort with the particular SG. Dividing 100 grams by the
density of the wort (not specific gravity) at a particular temperature
gives the number of milliliters of wort which weighs 100 grams and from
this the grams per milliliter and pounds per gallon for the wort can be
calculated. Multiplying by the volume of the wort (corrected to the
particular temperature) gives the total weight of sugar. Dividing by
the new volume gives the new concetration and then one goes through the
process backwards (pounds/gal -> grams/ml -> grams/100grams -> SG) to
obtain the new specific gravity.
ProMash does it this way and it does it this way because while the
primary market for it is the homebrewer professional brewers use it as
well and they demand calculation in accordance with the ASBC's
recommended methods. In fact the Plato table is replaced by a third
order polymial also published by the ASBC which is clearly a fit to the
table data. The mathematically most tricky part of the dilution
calculation is in going back to SG from Plato which requires that the
proper root of the third order polynomial be found. This is done in
closed form to lots of decimal places but the user is given the option
of how many decimal places he wishes to see in this and all other
calculations. Most users will neither notice or care that the answers
ProMash gives are slightly different from those obtained by assuming
that "points" are a measure of concentration. At the same time those
precision freaks (you know who you are) who measure SG to 5 and 6 places
can be assured that the trouble they take will not be rendered futile by
less than "perfect" math in the program. The cost for this is that the
user of ProMash is presented a bewildering set of options as to how he
wants the program to work. This is ameliorated somewhat by a couple of
presets for tyro, advanced homebrewer, pro etc.
The underlying reason why all this is necessary is that the amount the
volume of a sugar solution changes when a fixed weight of sugar is added
varies (though slightly) depending on the total amount which is already
dissolved.
A.J.
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Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 10:26:10 -0600
From: "Richard B. Dulany Jr." <RDulany at co.el-paso.tx.us>
Subject: compost & skunks
Steve Johnson gave some excellent advice about composting and creating a
food supply for pest animals. Here's my experience in hopes that someone
will learn from it:
It's winemaking season here in the Southwest and I thought it would be a
great idea to till 250 lbs. of freshly pressed grape skins into an area of
poor soil in my backyard. My winery-owner friend spreads his skins along the
rows of vines. Unwittingly, I created a magnificent buffet for the local
skunk population. They dug up the skins and much of my flower bed too. I
trapped one of the little stinkers every night this week.
The lesson I learned from this is not to just add raw "food" to the soil in
hopes that it will decompose on its own. An active compost pile is a
necessity. Rolls of metal "hardware cloth" are cheap and readily available
for building a varmint-proof enclosure for your compost material.
Ricardo
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Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 13:11:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Frank Tutzauer <comfrank at acsu.buffalo.edu>
Subject: ProMash and mathematics
Len Safhay quotes Phil:
>Phil Yates, regarding an arithmetical calculation, writes: "Seems
>obvious to me. But ask a Promash user if he understands this and all you
>get is a blank face"
and then says:
>Damned if I understand the seeming hostility of the pencil and paper
>crowd to Promash.
Not to speak for Phil, but I don't really think it's an attack on ProMash
or ProMash users, just frustration with the general lack of mathematical
skills evident today. I tried to explain to a brewing buddy (who, like
most, tops up with water, shakes like hell, and then takes a gravity) why I
instead take a gravity of the concentrated wort first, then keep track of
how much water I add to get 5 gallons, and do a quick computation to get
the overall gravity. I tried to explain the computation as simply as I
could (and I'm a teacher by profession), but I got that same blank look.
And this calculation is *sooo* easy that no way would I run out to the
living room computer and fire up ProMash just to figure it out. But, OTOH,
if I were already in the program for some other reason, I would have no
problem letting ProMash do the arithmetic for me.
And, FWIW, I think of the problem as a weighted average. If I've got 4 of
5 gallons at 1.050, that's 80% of the total. So .8(50) + .2(00) = 40, or
1.040.
--frank (a mathematician AND a ProMash user)
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Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 12:22:11 -0500
From: "Kirk, Jim" <jkirk at dnr.state.in.us>
Subject: Beer In Southern Illinois?
I'll be spending a few days in southern IL for a business trip. In and
around the Carbondale area. Can anyone tell me of any good brewpubs or other
watering holes featuring good beers? Will travel for beer!
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Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 09:37:02 -0800 (AKDT)
From: stihlerunits at mosquitonet.com
Subject: A name for a brewer
Kevin McDonough wrote
>
>I had an acquaintance the other day ask if there a name for someone who
>brews beer? Of course, I responded with the term, brewer. He was
>wondering, though, if there was a more esoteric term, similar to the way a
>stamp collector can be referred to as a philatelist. Anyone have any ideas?
>
How about Zymurgist as an alternate name?
- Scott Stihler
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Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 15:54:15 -0500
From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com>
Subject: Selenium
There has been a lot written in the press recently about the role of
selenium in the diet and incidence of prostate cancer. After reading these
I decided that perhaps some additional selenium would not be a bad idea.
One on-going double-blind study of selenium and vitamin E indicated that
daily intake of 100mcg of selenium was being used. My daily multi-vitamin
has only 25mcg. So I got some additional selenium supplements to take. Low
and behold a primary ingredient is brewers yeast. A Google search turned
out the following:
SELENIUM
GOOD FOOD SOURCES OF SELENIUM
Selenium content is very dependent upon the content of the soil on which
foods and animals are raised.
Brewer's yeast, organ and muscle meats, fish and shellfish, grains, cereals,
Brazil nuts, broccoli, cabbage, cucumbers, radishes, garlic, onions, torula
yeast, molasses, dairy products, sesame seeds, tuna, kelp, and wheat germ.
So apparently the male homebrew drinker has yet another reason to be
thankful.
David Houseman
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Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 18:04:34 -0500
From: Bill Tobler <WCTobler at brazoria.net>
Subject: Re:Aquarium Pumps?
Mark, I'm pretty sure you would have a temperature problem here. I would
not think aquarium pumps are rated to 180 deg F. Anyway, you can buy a
good pump for around $90 US, which is close to what a good aquarium pump
would cost. Check out http://www.movingbrews.com/, they have some really
cool pumps.
To Better Brewing
Bill Tobler
Lake Jackson, TX
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