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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Freezing Wort ("D Perry")
  Back to School (Stephen Dunn)
  A few things ("Brian M Dotlich")
  draft box woes (Aaron Robert Lyon)
  Hoegaarden White recipe ("Rob Compton")
  pH adjustment ("Houseman, David L")
  Teeshirts, HBD Community Red Cross Fund Status (Pat Babcock)
  Butter Flavoring May Pose Risk To Food Workers ("Pete Calinski")
  Nothing Important (Jim Clement)
  Gravity of Apple Cider (Tony Barnsley)
  water question (Himsbrew)
  Re: Gravity of Apple Cider (Richard Foote)
  Corn Sugar priming ("Chris Hatton")
  Add-On Spigots & Brass vs Stainless ("Hedglin, Nils A")
  "food-grade" rubber washers ("Bill Dubas")


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Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 22:32:00 -0700
From: "D Perry" <daperry75 at home.com>
Subject: Freezing Wort

I was wondering if you can freeze wort.  I am gonna prepare some quart jars
of unfermented wort so that I can use them for propagating yeast.

Thanks

Dave



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Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 19:32:39 +1000
From: Stephen Dunn <stephenjanette at optushome.com.au>
Subject: Back to School

G'Day from Sydney Australia,

I first attempted home brewing 10 years ago with dismal results. After
talking with a mate recently (an avid brewer) I developed a renewed interest
in the art. But this time I wanted to be fully prepared! Before doing
anything I did research, research, and more research.

As a born again brewer I found it difficult to decipher fact from fiction.
One book or person would advocate a certain sure fire method of ensuring a
perfect brew, and another would contradict the entire process. You can
imagine where this would leave me! As an inexperienced brewer, you hang on
every word on the subject. I've bought numerous books and searched the
internet for as much info as I can find.

Well, I've finally achieved a brew which I can honestly say tastes pretty
good. Thanks to references from people like John Palmer and a small handbook
called Understanding beer by Grant Sampson (another Aussie) I now understand
the process in better detail.

The point of my writing is - as a novice to the industry, I've struggled to
find intermediate advice on the brewing process. You either find "Making
your first brew" or it's straight into "full grain brewing". So I'm hoping
to see more information posted on general procedures. Many seasoned brewers
will probably find these sorts of requests painfully basic, but everyone has
to start at the beginning.

One area I find awkward is racking into a secondary container. I've made two
batches which ended up with off flavors. So I've gone back to single primary
fermentation and kegging after one week. I leave the burped keg at room temp
for conditioning for a further week, then gas it up in the fridge.

The reason I shy away from the secondary fermenter is I'm told that when the
primary fermentation is more or less finished, the beer is very susceptible
to oxidisation and infection. Putting it straight into a sanitized keg and
burping seems to be the safe way out. But I'm not transferring bright beer.

Does anyone have advise on this area.

By the way, I'm doing ales.

Thanks

Stephen



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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 08:28:10 -0400
From: "Brian M Dotlich" <BMDotlich at cs.com>
Subject: A few things

Fellow Brewers,

First off I would like to thank everyone who responded to my inquiry about
German Pretzels.  I didn't imagine that my question would generate such
interest.

First, A few weeks ago I was touring a small brewery in the area and was
discussing with the brewmaster water loss during the boil.  I've never
understood how it is that commercial breweries can keep their water losses
relatively low compared to homebrewers.  On my way home I was thinking that
maybe the tube that leads up to the ceiling and out of the roof of the
building may have something to do with this.  Perhaps, as the steam rises up
the tube, some of it cools on its way up and condenses on the sides of the
tube and falls back into the wort.

Next thought. I Was looking at a stainless steel conical fermenter at a
local homebrew supply shop this last weekend.  Later on that day I was
thinking about Budweiser and the Beachwood that they use because of the very
highly flocculating yeast used to brew Budweiser. I was thinking that
carboys have an advantage over conicals by allowing a larger surface area of
the beer to remain in contact with the yeast.  If this is so,  this would
play a major role in fermentation of beers with highly flocculent yeasts as
well as with lager yeasts which must reabsorb diacetyl and acetaldehyde
during lagering.

And finally.  I was wondering if beer from brewpub in a growler would last
longer, perhaps weeks instead of days, if I sanitized the growler before I
took it to the brewpub

Your thoughts on these points are appreciated

Brian M Dotlich
Dayton, OH



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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 08:33:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: Aaron Robert Lyon <lyona at umich.edu>
Subject: draft box woes

Brewers,

I have a draft box that I love, but when it arrived (I had to buy it as I
am not terrible handy) I noticed that the beer line they used was larger
than any beer line I had ever used before.  In fact, to attach the quick
connects at all I had to put in a small piece of smaller tubing on the end
of the quick connect and crimp down on the tubes a good amount.  This
wasn't to make them fit tightly, but just to make them fit at all.  Now,
when I use the draft box, I always get some foaming in the lines to the
coils.  How can I solve this?  Thanks.

Please help, losing beer!

 -Aaron




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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 14:12:47 +0100
From: "Rob Compton" <compton at btinternet.com>
Subject: Hoegaarden White recipe


For a 5US Gallon brew...

OG 1048 - 11.9 Plato
Pale Malt 4.65lb
Unmalted Wheat 4.2lb - this should be a "soft / biscuit wheat" not a "hard /
bread wheat"
Flaked Oats 7.5oz

Start of boil
Goldings 0.7oz
Saaz 0.5oz

Last 15minutes of boil
Saaz 0.45oz
Ground coirander seed 0.08oz
Dried Curacao peel 0.1oz

Single infusion mash - 68C or 154F for 90mins
Boil - 90mins
Racking Gravity 1011 - 2.7 Plato
Alcohol 5% abv, 4%abw
Bitterness 18EBU
Colour 8EBC

Ale Yeast

To ensure max geletinisation of the raw wheat, crack it first, and boil it
in a minimum amount of water for a few minutes. It should geletinise at
normal mash temps, but just to make sure...

For best coriander flavour, get whole seed and crush it just before use.
Ready milled seed lacks the full flavour and aroma of freshly crushed. Used
a pestle and mortar, or coffee grinder for best results.

The curacao peel should be milled before use too, this releases the flavours
into the brew.

Ferment as an ale at around 20C, then mature for one month in a cask at
12-15C. Bottle with just a dash of sugar per bottle. Hoegaarden (Interbrew!)
add a few grains of bottom working yeast when bottling.

There, that didn't hurt did it!

Rob.





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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 09:33:26 -0400 
From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com>
Subject: pH adjustment

Ray Daniels replies to Mike Szwaya on the question of acidifying wort and
sparge water.  I agree with Ray but would add to this that in brewing to
specific styles, it is necessary to closely match the water from the region
of that style.  Styles were created because certain grains, hops and
processes worked with the local water to produce palatable beers.  Other
combinations didn't.  The soft water of Plzn allowed for high hop bitterness
without harshness.  Roasted grains, which acidify the wort naturally worked
with the alkaline water of Dublin.  IMHO one of the keys to brewing good
beers that meet the expectations of styles is to modify your brewing water
to match that of the region for that style.  That's not to say that you
can't make something that you like with whatever water you have but, like
the brewers of old, you might need to experiment to see what grains and
processes work best with your water.  Whatever the approach, use the same
water to mash-in and to sparge and you shouldn't have any problems.  Do take
care to measure the pH of the runoff from your mash tun to the kettle to see
that it doesn't exceed 6.0, or alternatively that the gravity doesn't fall
below a 1.010-1.012, temperature corrected.

Dave Houseman   



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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 09:21:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org>
Subject: Teeshirts, HBD Community Red Cross Fund Status

Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...

First, there appears to be no interest in designing a tee shirt for the
HBD as the 10/15 deadline for submissions approaches. If you are
interested in designing a tee, but haven't there are any particular
reasons why you haven't, please let me know. Again, if you are interested
in designing a tee shirt for the HBD, please send a .gif or .jpg of your
design to teeshirt at hbd.org. All submissions will be voted upon by the HBD
readership (and, I suppose, random site visitors...) and the winner will
be produced for the 2002 Official HBD Tee. The original announcement is
reprinted below for your viewing pleasure.

Finally, the HBD Community Red Cross Fund stands at $425. I have not been
to the PO Box, so if you've donated by that means, I will not have
received it as yet. Once again, if you wish to donate to the Red Cross and
would like to have your donation go twice as far, please donate through
the Match Fund. If received in time for me to postmark the entire fund by
10/15 (I will probably mail the check 10/13 to ensure it receives the
prescribed postmark) these funds will receive a match. If received after,
I will try to identify other oppportunities to have the funds matched
(there are still several public matches in my area), but will forward them
to the Red Cross regardless.


- -- 
 -
God bless America!

Pat Babcock in SE Michigan         pbabcock at hbd.org
Home Brew Digest Janitor           janitor@hbd.org
HBD Web Site                       http://hbd.org
The Home Brew Page                 http://hbd.org/pbabcock

"The monster's back, isn't it?" - Kim Babcock after I emerged
                                  from my yeast lab Saturday

============ Reprinted from HBD #3710 ==============

Date: Wed, 15 Aug 2001 10:30:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org>
Subject: HBD Tee-Shirt Contest!

Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...

No, no - this is NOT an opportunity to douse tee-shirt clad
beauties with water.

As you (may or may not) know, the HBD has been getting our
merchandising act s-l-o-w-l-y together. So far, we've managed to
get button production under way in support of the many
conventions, competitions and conferences we HBDers go to, and
at which we pass each other like so many ships in the night,
having no way to recognize each other...

Our next sally into the battle of marketing is tee shirts! One
problem: what goes on it?! That brings us to the HBD Tee-Shirt
Contest! Here's an opportunity to stew your creative juices, let
them congeal in technicolor, and spew 'em onto the chest (or
back) of HBD members everywhere!

We're looking to have designs for the HBD Tee-Shirt created by
those who know the HBD best: you. So create your artwork, render
it to gif or jpeg format, and send it to teeshirt at hbd.org. We'll
publish the pic onto the HBD website, and provide voting buttons
so that site visitors can vote for the 2002 HBD Tee-Shirt
design. The design netting the highest votes by contest deadline
goes to production, with attribution to the winner! The winner
will also receive a free shirt bearing their design, plus a HBD
button containing their name and Chief Clothier as the second
line. Their photo and design will also appear on the HBD
website.

Legal mumbo-jumbo:

All designs, whether winning or not, become the sole property of
HBD.ORG to use or disposition as they see fit. Contest is open
to anyone wishing to submit a design. HBD.ORG reserves the right
to not publicly display any design deemed obscene, in poor
taste, or counter to the HBD.ORG philosophy without notification
to the submitter. Designs must not contain copyrighted or
trademarked images, unless copyright or trademarked by HBD.ORG.
Winning design may be rendered or modified suitably for silk
screening and/or for display on the HBD.ORG website.

Contest begins with publication of this notice. Contest is
expected to complete 10/15/01. See http://hbd.org for details as
they are developed.

All proceeds generated through HBD merchandise are used to
recoup the cost of said merchandise and the cost of maintaining
the HBD.ORG presence on the internet.

Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 09:57:31 -0400
From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net>
Subject: Butter Flavoring May Pose Risk To Food Workers

Just a note to keep everyone up to date.  The Wall Street Journal reports in
the October 3,2001 edition that:

After examining 117 workers at the Jasper (Mo.) plant of Gilster-Mary Lee
Corp, the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health issued a
preliminary report saying that eight workers there have developed
bronchiolitis obliterans, a rare disease in which lung tissue is permanently
destroyed.  Six of those eight are awaiting lung transplants.

The plant, which makes popcorn, also had twice the national rate of
bronchitis and asthma and more than three times the rate of obstructed
breathing.  The institute believes it is safe to eat the popcorn.  It is the
production workers that are at risk because of their intense exposure.

The agency is warning about DIACETYL, a chemical compound that smells and
tastes like butter.

On the plant floor, workers mix soybean oil, salt, artificial butter
flavoring, and coloring agents warmed to 108 F.  When you open the lid to
the mixer, it would take your breath away a worker reports.


I don't want to make fun of the effect on these workers but, I would assume
none of us brews anything with enough diacetyl to be at risk.  Of course,
long time beer judges....Nah.


Pete Calinski
East Amherst NY
Near Buffalo NY


***********************************************************
*My goal:
*      Go through life and never drink the same beer twice.
*     (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.)
***********************************************************





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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 11:06:23 -0400 
From: Jim Clement <jclement at silverbacktech.com>
Subject: Nothing Important

Last Sunday, I brewed my first spiced pumpkin beer.  As I do not have a
scale, I thought I would take a picture of the amount of pumpkin I used, so
I would have some type of reference as to the amount I used in this beer.  I
figured while I was at it, I would snap a couple more and throw them on the
web for anyone that might be interested.  

As I enjoy checking out other brewers' equipment/procedures etc., and it's
always comforting to me to see others using plastic buckets, blankets
strapped around mash tuns and other "non-professional" equipment, I though I
would post these pix.  Hopefully, they will encourage others to do the same.
When the vast majority of what one reads gets in the books and on the web
gets into the nitty-gritty of efficiency percentages, RIMS, sacc. rests,
mineral content etc.; this is proof that one can still relax and not worry.

I would also like to thank everyone that replied to my problem with the
Polder thermometer probe several months ago.  The shrink tape works great,
just don't put it in the gas grill stuck in a leg of lamb for a few hours:
it will melt.  I now have one I use for brewing, and one for cooking.  We
all knew it would come to that. :)

The recipe I used for this beer was a combination of an all grain English
Pale Ale I have been making recently, and a spiced pumpkin ale extract
recipe from one Jamey Moss (http://hbd.org/brewery/cm3/recs/08_34.html).  He
was right about it smelling good while it cooked.  

If anyone is intersted in the details, I can email them; but I will wait for
this one to finish before I think about putting them on the web.  


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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 16:50:34 +0100 
From: Tony Barnsley <tony.barnsley at blackpool.gov.uk>
Subject: Gravity of Apple Cider

Hi all,

Not actually made any cider for a while, as I found a really good supplier
of locally, (well 120 miles away? :> ) produced cider. They add no sugar to
the pressings and reckon on getting 8% ABV from the neat juice. What that
equates to as OG I have no idea, I suppose I could always ask. They use a
blend of 3-4 types of apple to get the right acidity, they did use a single
variety of cider apple one year, but ended up with a way too acid batch that
was used for blending. All the cider is aged in oak for one year as well

I think there might be cider pages at

http://www.hamstead-brewing-centre.co.uk but they were talking about setting
up a separate site for the WobblyGob cider. Incidentally Hamstead are the
only licensed cider producers in the Midlands, and their cider was at the
GBBF this year. At current rates of sale they will be selling out of the
current batch in April, and the next batch won't be ready until May! This
stuff is popular.

- --
Wassail!
The Scurrilous Aleman (ICQ 46254361)
Schwarzbad Lager Brauerei, Blackpool, Lancs, UK

UK HOMEBREW - A Forum on Home Brewing in the UK
              Managed by home brewers for home brewers

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Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 13:37:18 EDT
From: Himsbrew at aol.com
Subject: water question

greetings all,
I have a question about water.
Let me start by saying that to me chemistry
is just a bad memory from high school!
I have a private well at home(Green Bay Wi)
so I haven't had the $ to get it tested.
my water goes thru a home water softner,
then is filtered thru a sink filter
(culligan type )with two filter cartriges.
Now my question, is this ok to brew with?
I am about to start all-grain brewing,
and I don't want to screw it up!!


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Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 13:50:54 -0400
From: Richard Foote <rfoote at mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Gravity of Apple Cider

Cider Makers,

>Does anyone know off-hand the typical gravity of unfermented apple cider.
>I (of course) can take the gravity myself when I buy a gallon from the
>store, but I was planning to use a gallon of it in a brew and I'm trying to
>plan ahead.

Another data point:

As measured last night = 1.045.  NOTE: This was GA fresh cider from a local
orchard, not that clear apple juice stuff as found in stores.  Last year, I
recall it running in the mid 40's too (same orchard).  I would think it
could also vary by time of year.  Apple harvest here runs from August to
Nov. with different varieties, having different characteristics, e.g., tart
vs. sweet, maturing at various times during the period. 

Hope this helps.

Rick Foote
Whistle Pig Brewing
Murrayville, GA




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Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 13:58:55 -0400
From: "Chris Hatton" <chrishatton23 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Corn Sugar priming

I use 3/4 cup corn sugar to bottle carbonate my 5 gallon batches, and I have 
often noticed a "spritzy" or champagne-like carbonation  in my brews. I 
tried lowering the amount to 1/2 cup sugar, which produced a an 
undercarbonated beer. I have tried carbonating with DME, but I experienced a 
large amount of sediment in my bottles, so I switched back.

Is this a problem anyone else has had?? Does it relate to the temperature at 
which I store my bottles? I amm trying 2/3 cup corn sugar next, or maybe DME 
again. Any comments or suggestions?



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Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 11:23:52 -0700 
From: "Hedglin, Nils A" <nils.a.hedglin at intel.com>
Subject: Add-On Spigots & Brass vs Stainless

Hi,
  I'm still looking around for a brew pot & had some more questions.  I read
an article in Brew Your Own about Fermentaps Weldless Ball Valve that can be
added to a brew pot just by drilling a hole.  Has any one used something
like this?  How well has it worked?
  Also, I've found brass, chrome-plated brass & stainless steel valves.  I
know that the machining of the brass leaves lead on the surface, but I've
heard that once the valve comes in contact with liquid, the lead oxidizes &
isn't an issue any more.  So, is a regular brass valve OK?  I've also heard
there's a way to treat the brass to remove the lead.  What is that process?
Does the chrome-plating prevent the lead from contacting the wort?
Thanks,
Nils Hedglin
Sacramento, CA


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Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 22:29:37 +0000
From: "Bill Dubas" <bill_dubas at hotmail.com>
Subject: "food-grade" rubber washers

Greetings;

I am in the process of adding a recirculation option to my mash tun, using a 
1-gallon SS pot as a grant with a SS bulkhead fitting in it for a drain.  As 
I do not have access to a welder, I'm going the "weldless" approach.  I 
tried using food-grade Buna rubber O-rings to create a good seal between the 
bulkhead fitting and the pot, but they deformed too easy and leaked when I 
tightened down the bulkhead nuts.

I'm thinking that I need to switch to a flat washer to get a good seal.  
However, I'm having trouble locating rubber flat washers in the size I need 
that are specified as food-grade.  Usually it's not even specified whether 
they are or not.  How important is it for these rubber washers to be 
food-grade?  I imagine that a non-food-grade washer would introduce unwanted 
flavors and odors, or maybe worse.  Are there any other options that I may 
be overlooking?

Thanks in advance for any help,
Bill



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