HOMEBREW Digest #3773 Mon 29 October 2001

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  Water analysis question (Scott)
  Re: Airlock Discussion ("Gregor Zellmann")
  Older Frozen Hop Pellets ("Thomas D. Hamann")
  Dog biscuit recipe? ("Lou King")
  Teeshirt contest update... (Pat Babcock)
  Pubs/places to visit in London? (Bill Wible)
  old hops (Jeff & Ellen)
  mash mixer motor (David Passaretti)
  airlocks ("Dr. Pivo")
  Vegemite from yeast slurry? (Walter J Doherty)
  Re: J-B Weld (gsferg)
  Re: Format of Rennerian Coordinates (gsferg)
  re: LPG (John Schnupp)
  RE: Beer Distance/Hash House Harriers (Bob Sheck)
  pumpin porters and ramblings (carlos benitez)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2001 23:35:41 -0700 From: Scott <sejose at pacbell.net> Subject: Water analysis question I am to the point where I wish to know the makeup of my brew water. Since I am on a municipal water supply, I can find out the water profile, but my question is how does running the water through a filter change this analysis, if in any way? The filter I am using is sold at Home Depot, General Electric brand, single stage under counter type with the 'Taste and Odor' filter installed, which removes primarily chlorine. Any guidance here is appreciated! Thanks Scott Auburn, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 12:54:06 +0200 From: "Gregor Zellmann" <gregor at blinx.de> Subject: Re: Airlock Discussion Hi fellow brewers, there is a discussion about airlocks happening in HBD. I can't resist to add my 2 cents. When I started this hobby 2,5 years ago, I read a lot of books, read and posted in r.c.b. and got the impression that airlocks are a must to prevent exposure to oxygen and infections. After visiting a few traditional breweries in South Germany (Bierfranken) and seeing that they had open fermentation vessels AND trying their beer, which was phantastic, I became convinced, that airlocks are not needed to make good beer. A little exposure to oxygen doesn't seem to do harm to the finished product and might be even good. (I remember the very controversial discussions here in HBD about dropping). So, when I brew a normal gravity beer, which ferments out in a week I don't bother with airlocks anymore and never had problems so far. I just cover the hole for the airlock in my fermenters with a bit of alu foil. BUT: I always use airlocks for long secondaries (2-3 months) and for high gravity beers. The primary reason for this is not so much exposure to air but exposure to Lactobacillus and other nasties. Just a few weeks ago, when I returned from a week of holidays I had an airlock of a high gravity beer (OG 1.085) stinking like vinegar. Probably the fermentation was quite vigorous, while I was absent and pressed a little Kraeusen into the airlock, which then got infected. I already thought my beer turned to vinegar too, but it was not infected at all. I don't know what would have happened without the airlock. Maybe the hops in the beer (70 IBU) would have killed the nasties anyway, but I'm actually quite happy with my ways. Gregor Zellmann Berlin, Germany P.S.: Sorry, I am too lazy to do the math for Rennerian coordinates. If somebody has an easy way to do it for me, he is very welcome to mail it to me. :) Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 22:17:36 +0930 From: "Thomas D. Hamann" <tdhamann at senet.com.au> Subject: Older Frozen Hop Pellets At 01:43 27/10/01, you wrote: >William Plotner <beerbill at juno.com> >Subject: Older Frozen Hop Pellets > >Hello Yall, >I have 4 pounds of hop pellets, unopened, in oxygen barrier bags. They >have been in the freezer since I bought them. That was about 2 years ago. >They are: Cascade, Tetttnanger, Willamette, and Hallertauer. > >Are these any good? Would you use them? NO, don't use them whatever you do, you will need to send them to me, am an authorised hop disposal depot!!! :-) goodonya, Thomas South Australia Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 09:05:12 -0400 From: "Lou King" <lking at pobox.com> Subject: Dog biscuit recipe? I'm making my first all grain batch today. I have a vague recollection that there have been recipes published to make dog biscuits with the spent grain. However, I looked back through the HBD archives and wasn't able to find anything along these lines, so I don't know where I might have heard this. While any response will be too late for today's batch, I'm still interested in recycling and giving my dogs a cheap treat. Any ideas? Lou King (Lou's Brews) Ijamsville, MD [395.1,120.6] Rennerian Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 11:03:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org> Subject: Teeshirt contest update... Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... If you haven't been to http://hbd.org lately, you may not have noticed that the teeshirt contest is going on and patiently awaiting your vote! Drop by, pick "teeshirt contest", review the concepts and designs, then cast your vote! So far, with just over 200 votes in, it's a dead heat between Designs F and G, with Design E a not-too-distant third. Stop on by and cast your vote! And my extra special thanks to those who came through with their creative thoughts - As with all things HBD, "We ain't nothin' without alla yous!" (If you sent one in too late to make the voting ballot - crossed a few wires on the timing thoughts, and published the deadline for a class project in error <blush>. Sorry - save it for next year! We'll definitely be doing this again next year, to be sure!) - -- - God bless America! Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock at hbd.org Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org HBD Web Site http://hbd.org The Home Brew Page http://hbd.org/pbabcock [18, 92.1] Rennerian "The monster's back, isn't it?" - Kim Babcock after I emerged from my yeast lab Saturday Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 11:08:59 -0500 From: Bill Wible <bill at brewbyyou.net> Subject: Pubs/places to visit in London? A friend writes: > My wife and I are flying to London November 3rd. Do you have > a list of pubs or a list of the best places to visit? Lucky guy! I got to go to London once, when my ship stopped in Portsmouth when I was in the Navy. I was 24 at the time, and all I knew about was American beer. This "English" stuff was warm and flat. I sat in a pub somewhere in London, couldn't tell you its name or location, but they had handpumps lined up on the bar as far as I could see, and I sat there drinking French Lager - Kronenborg or something - out of can no less. I was definitely playing the part of the Ugly American, and boy, do I regret that to this day. Now that I have all this beer education, I can only wonder about all the beers on those handpumps and what I missed out on. Someday I will have to return there and atone for my sins. This guy is not a homebrewer, just looking for some good beer. Anybody have any suggestions/recommendations so that my friend doesn't repeat my earlier mistakes? Thanks Bill Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 19:18:35 -0400 From: Jeff & Ellen <JeffNGladish at ij.net> Subject: old hops William Plotner wrote, "I have 4 pounds of hop pellets, unopened, in oxygen barrier bags. They have been in the freezer since I bought them. That was about 2 years ago. They are: Cascade, Tetttnanger, Willamette, and Hallertauer. Are these any good?" Yes, they most likely are still good. Air and heat are the worst enemies and you have pretty much eliminated them. I just today brewed with some very old hops that had been kept at near freezing temps for over 9 months. They looked and smelled fresh, and the cooled wort tastes just as bitter as I anticipated. Jeff Gladish, Tampa, Florida (I used the cool site to find my Rennarian coordinates, but have since lost the piece of scrap paper I wrote it on and am now too lazy after brewing all day to look it up again) Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 09:23:23 -0800 (PST) From: David Passaretti <dpassaretti at yahoo.com> Subject: mash mixer motor I am contemplateing contructing a mash mixer from a motor I currently own. The motor runs at 1750rpm, 115 v, 6a, and has 1/3 hp. Does anyone know if I can use a dimmer (like the ones for fans) to reduce the speed of the motor without damaging it. Does anyone have any thoughts on the ideal speed. I had thought between 30 and 60 rpm would bve appropriate. To reduce the speed enough with a series of belts seems like it would be too complicated. Thanks David Passaretti Cincinnati, OH Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 19:26:55 +0100 From: "Dr. Pivo" <dp at pivo.w.se> Subject: airlocks Phil Yates has been bold and irresponsible enough to propose: > I have only two uses for plastic airlocks (unlike all those bras I burnt). > They fill a hole on the lid of my fermenting bucket (a hole I once drilled > believing I needed an airlock) and keep bugs out of my wort. > .... which is a conclusion I likewise reached some years ago. There were some raw individuals (probably spawned south of the equator) who suggested that even when doing a secondary, they were superfluous, and could be replaced with a bit of plastic food wrap and a rubber band. Now, I think that that is absolutely horrid. Imagine if you could make exactly the same quality beer, without having specialty gadgets created expressly for brewing purposes... why, we would soon stand at risk of making brewing a fairly simply understood procedure, and lose all of the panache, and stylish look, that continues to inhibit these prospective "would - be", "Johnny-come-lately" brewers from ever entering the scene. Realizing that the idea was entirely preposterous, I reasoned that, as such, there could just be merit in it. I fiddled around with it, and even did some shoddy spurments which can be read at.... http://www.bodensatz.com/homebrew/columns/jirvine/watertrap.html I can easily report that I've never used the little bubblers since then, and am happier to have them gathering dust somewhere than having to shove them through a sanitising procedure. I have ended up with a very high grade industrial filter in the hole of my primary (OK, so it's a bit of toilet paper stuffed into it) because I prefer an "open" primary. If I secondary (and predictable clearing times and yeast loads is one reason why one might want to do that some times.... but it does entail one extra risk for oxygen exposure late in the game, and a whole rack of crud that needs cleaning) then I use that "plastic and rubber band" method. As long as the fermentation is not extremely violent (say... an oxygen deprived primary, that kicks off when racked) it seems to be a self regulating system...... a crappy enough seal that it lets by excess pressure when CO2 pressure gets too high, but good enough to keep it tight at low differentials..... it kind of always looks "the same".... a bit swollen. Now, how can that be? ... that perhaps we do a bunch of unnecessary extra work, and even propagate this excess nonsense to others? I believe it has to do with "Maya" and the illusionary nature of our life. Verily, it can be found in the Vedic writings: "Life is but a dream." For those not fortunate enough to be versed in Oriental philosophy and religion, and would like to view this quote within the Hindu classic without having to research it yourselves, you will find it in the passage just after "Row, row, row your boat..." Dr. Pivo Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 16:14:07 -0700 (MST) From: Walter J Doherty <wjd at U.Arizona.EDU> Subject: Vegemite from yeast slurry? Hello collective, Does anyone out there know of any recipes for home-made Vegemite or Marmite using the left over yeast slurry after fermentation is done? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Wally Doherty Tucson, AZ Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 18:50:26 -0500 From: gsferg at clary.gwi.net Subject: Re: J-B Weld >How does J-B Weld go bonding stainless to stainless, and stainless to >copper? Is it food safe? I am planning to use it in a mash tun and a >counter-flow chiller. I've lost track of the things I've stuck together with J-B Weld. Certainly aluminum and stainless, stainless and stainless, titanium and aluminum, dunno about stainless and copper but I wouldn't be surprised. Give it a try on some sample stock. As for being food-safe, I dunno :( George- - -- George S. Fergusson <gsferg at clary.gwi.net> Oracle DBA, Programmer, Humorist Whitefield, Maine US [729.7, 79.6] Renerian - -------------- I am a man, I can change, if I have to, I guess. Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 19:21:51 -0500 From: gsferg at clary.gwi.net Subject: Re: Format of Rennerian Coordinates Tom Williams had this to say about that: >[direction, distance]. In short, the directional component of the vector >ALWAYS comes first. George Fergusson of Whitefield, Maine, a Professional >Land Surveyor, expressed similar reservations based on his surveying >experience. That's EX-Professional Land Surveyor, and yes, I did express similar reservations. I was also under the impression that polar coordinates were [direction, distance] but someone else contradicted that assertion. Oil Well. The rationale used to justify the [distance, direction] format- if I understood it correctly- was to "not risk confusing anyone with reality", a sentiment that is hard to argue with. Basically, I caved in when it appeared that the idea of converting distances to "beers" seemed to be catching on i.e., "don't push your luck". Speaking of which, I did find the time today to meander down the road a country mile carrying a 6 pack of homebrew in my back pack. I consumed 3 16-ounce bottles of Brown Ale in 1 mile. Then, I turned around and walked back home and drank 1 additional beer. It was a lovely afternoon! So, this first experiment looks like 2 beers per mile, for me anyways, on average. How long I could keep that up I don't know. I'll have to try it again soon. My corrected Rennerian coordinates in [beering, bearing] format would be [1459.2, 79.6]. George- - -- George S. Fergusson <gsferg at clary.gwi.net> Oracle DBA, Programmer, Humorist Whitefield, Maine US [729.7, 79.6] Renerian - -------------- I am a man, I can change, if I have to, I guess. Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 18:27:01 -0800 (PST) From: John Schnupp <johnschnupp at yahoo.com> Subject: re: LPG I wanted to make a comment about the recent LPG thread. Tom Clark said a few days ago, >Also, when releasing propane from a tank into the air, if you can see it, >you are discharging liquid. The gas is invisible. What about when I run out of propane and vent the remaining few psi? I can "see" the gas. I know it is not liguid because of the pressure (and weight) in the tank indicates that there is no liquid. I would argue this point. Every "clear" substance had a different refractive index. I argue that what you are seeing is not liquid, but in reality the light being refracted as it passed thru the gas. This is similar to the effect caused by looking thru hot air and seeing this simmering in the distance. This is also what makes stars twinkle. In my job I use helium for vacuum leak detection. The key to successful leak detection is to use a minimal amount of helium. One of the "tricks" is to adjust the helium flow so that you can "see" it flowing out of the tip of the wand when looking at a light source. Finally, a question: How much gas it there in an empty propane tank? Answer, the tank still is full of propane gas. The gas is at atmospheric pressure. The gas is not truly removed until the tank has been evacuated and purged (and then the tank will be filled with the purge gas). My point is this, just because a tank is "empty" (no gas pressure) does not necessarily mean it is safe. ===== John Schnupp, N3CNL ??? Hombrewery [560.2, 68.6] Rennerian Georgia, VT 95 XLH 1200, Horse with no Name Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 22:18:05 -0500 From: Bob Sheck <bsheck at skantech.net> Subject: RE: Beer Distance/Hash House Harriers Roy- As a long-time member of that "Drinking Club with a Running Problem" it would be very difficult to ascertain beer-to-distance algorithms. I am trying to gather some half-minded thoughts together to pose to HASH-L on this very matter. Bob (K9-6T9 [THFKA Hairball]) Sheck // DEA - Down East Alers - Greenville, NC bsheck at skantech.net // [583.2, 140.6] Apparent Rennerian >Surely someone on the list is a member of a Hash House > Harrier group and could give us their guidance on the beer- >to-distance conundrum. Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 19:24:46 -0800 (PST) From: carlos benitez <greenmonsterbrewing at yahoo.com> Subject: pumpin porters and ramblings Hello everybody, With all this talk of pumpkin porters I've been thinking - has anybody ever used the seeds? Or even tried malting them for use? What about a "beer" made of just malted pumpkin seeds and the meat of the pumpkin - would this still be called beer or would it be Pumpkin Malted Beverage ? German Purity laws aside, at what point do these delicious nectars that we make stop being "beer" and become something else? Wow, all these questions ave made me thirsty, - I'm going to the basement for a beer (Best Bitter) anybody else want one? ===== BIBIDI ! Brew It Bottle It Drink It Carlos Benitez - Green Monster Brewing Bainbridge, PA, U.S.A. Return to table of contents
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