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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Brakspear (TOLLEY Matthew)
  Kegging help for the feeble-minded ("Michael O'Donnell")
  Koelner Wiess (Alan McKay)
  Bedford British Ale yeast ("Bridges, Scott")
  Re: New Orleans Pubs ("Byron's Yahoo Account")
  Re: what is pretzel salt? (Jeff Renner)
  Drying fresh hops (Sebastien Riopel)
  Re: New Orleans Pubs ("Chad Gould")
  Hazelnut flavoring (beerbuddy)
  Re: Decoction Mash ("Gene Collins")
  Stainless Steel Conicals ("Rudolf Krondorfer")
  Cider judges . . . (Ray Daniels)
  Smoked porter/home-smoked malt ("Lori Brown")
  Mini-kegs (beerbuddy)
  Maudite Homebrew Recipie suggestions (Nicole Phillips)
  Brewtek yeast. (Wendy & Reuben Filsell)
  Cincinnati (Nathan Kanous)
  Albuquerque (Nathan Kanous)
  Where to get FermCap? (Dan Stedman)
  Hops questions ("Bruce Garner")
  Mashing Temps (ShoesBrew3)
  All Grain Raspberry Porter Recipe and the AHA Pub Discount Program ("Menzl's")
  re: Decoction Mash ("Henry St.Pierre")


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 14:59:46 +1000
From: TOLLEY Matthew <matthew.tolley at atsic.gov.au>
Subject: Brakspear

From: "Penn, Thomas (MED)" <Thomas.Penn at med.ge.com>

>My ultimate goal will be to replicate Brakespear Special Bitter

Not sure about the Special Bitter, but here's a recipe for the Bitter from
Wheeler and Protz's 'Brew Your Own British Real Ale'.

BRAKSPEAR BITTER

A superb, beautifully crafted, satisfying and refreshing bitter from
Brakspear's Henley brewery.  Full flavoured malt and hop flower in the
mouth, delicate dry finish with massive hop flower character.

OG 1035, 8.8o Plato, 25 litres

Pipkin pale malt		3200g
Crystal malt		  75g
Black malt			  40g
White sugar			 370g

Mash 66oC 90 minutes.

Start of 90 minute boil
Challenger		35g
Golding		18g
Fuggles		35g

Last 15 minutes of boil
Golding		15g
Irish moss		10g

Racking gravity 1006, 1.5o Plato
Alcohol 3.9% by volume, 3.1% by weight
38 IBU
Colour 24 EBC, 13 SRM

Incidentally, CAMRA have a campaign to keep Brakspear brewing at Henley -
see http://www.camracampaigns.org.uk/brakspear/Main.htm for details.

Cheers
 ...Matt...
Canberra, Australia





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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 22:49:32 -0700
From: "Michael O'Donnell" <mooseo at stanford.edu>
Subject: Kegging help for the feeble-minded

So I'm cleaning a batch of kegs tonight and pumping Starsan from one to the 
next as I finish cleaning them.  I've got a line with a beer-out fitting on 
each end and am connecting it from one keg to the next.  I notice that the 
new o-rings seem to make the connection a bit stiff, so I lean on it.  This 
gets my eyes closer to the keg, which allows me to see that I am cramming 
it down on the "Gas-IN" side.  Oops.

It took me three trips to the garage (for gloves, a really big screwdriver 
and more beer) plus a trip to the dictionary (for new curses to hurl at the 
beast) before I got them separated.  Is there a more elegant way to do 
this?  I succeeded by leaning on aforementioned screwdriver placed beneath 
the lip of the fitting, but I sort of gouged it up.

On another question:  The evening left me with several kegs that contained 
Starsan for about 10-15 minutes and which had been emptied by pushing it 
out with CO2.  If left around, can I consider these ready to use?  For how 
long should I trust them as sanitary?

cheers,
mike
Monterey, CA



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:20:48 -0400
From: Alan McKay <amckay at neap.net>
Subject: Koelner Wiess

Thomas Hamann wrote :

"Kueppers and there try there (sic) unfiltered Wiess Koelsch, 
 they are on the bank of the Rhine, same side as the train 
 station but get a bus there, too far to walk with wife and kid."

I have to agree that you really have to try some Koelner
Wiess (a technicality - it's not "Koelsch" since Koelsch must
be filtered), but to get to Kueppers you will definitely
not have to take a bus anywhere.  Walk out the front door
of the train station and immediately in front of you is
the side door to Kueppers Alt Koeln.

http://www.bodensatz.com/staticpages/index.php?page=20020701140507438

The only other place in town that still serves a Wiess
(pr: "VEECE" like "FLEECE", note it's "ie" not "ei")
is Hellers, which is definitely a jaunt from the train
station :

http://www.bodensatz.com/staticpages/index.php?page=20020822191206443

cheers,
 -Alan


- -- 
http://www.bodensatz.com/
The Beer Site (tm)


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 08:19:19 -0400
From: "Bridges, Scott" <ScottBridges at sc.slr.com>
Subject: Bedford British Ale yeast


I picked up a new strain of White Labs yeast yesterday at our local hb
store.  It's called Bedford British ale yeast.  It is one of the "platinum
series" that are only in release for a short period.  This is the one for
Sept/Oct.  The web site says to "click here" for complete info, but there
isn't any link to click on....  Does anyone know what the pedigree is for
this yeast?  Any tips on particular beers to make with this?  The chart on
the wall at the hb store said that it is good for all British style ales,
naturally....

Yes, for those that know me, this is an indication that I might actually be
brewing something soon.  Not in time for the Palmetto State Brewers
competition unfortunately.  

BTW I attended a soggy but fun Brewgrass festival in Asheville, NC over the
weekend.  Great bluegrass music and a bunch of fine beers.  Beer drinkers
must be hardy souls because it was surprising to see how many people braved
the remnants of tropical storm Hanna to stand around in the rain drinking.

TIA,
Scott




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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 06:44:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Byron's Yahoo Account" <btowles at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: New Orleans Pubs

In HBD #4044, John Edwards mused, 

>I'm heading to New Orleans next week on a business trip and wanted to know if

>anyone that has been there can suggest pubs/bars with good local beer.

The most common local products are Abita, Dixie and Day's. There's also Zea's
rotisserie and the Crescent City Brewhouse which brew on premises. The CCBH is
in the French Quarter on Decatur, which is walking distance from any downtown
hotel.

You should be able to find an Abita or Dixie product without too much effort.
The Amber and Turbodog are the most common Abita products, and the Blackened
Voodoo and Crimson Voodoo are the common Dixie products. If you can find
Day's, it will be the golden, but I think there's limited distribution in and
around the city for Day's on tap. You should be able to find the Abita
products more frequently than the Dixie, which is odd considering Dixie is
made in New Orleans, and Abita is made north of N.O., in Abita Springs. 

I also have a general beer bar suggestion. If you're on the east side of the
french quarter, go to DBA. It's a beer snobs closest proximity to utopia here
in the city. It's strictly an anti bud / miller / coors establishment. There
is also the Bulldog on Magazine street, Uptown, as well as Cooter Brown's at
Riverbend, Uptown. CB's has a lot of variation, but a lot of it is
bud/miller/coors derivatives, and the interesting beers don't turn over
quickly. If I had my pick, I'd go to DBA first, then the bulldog. You can
check out further information on them at www.pubcrawler.com under New Orleans.

Hope this helps.


Byron Towles

Member of the Crescent City Homebrewers
http://hbd.org/crescent


=====
- ---------------------------------------------
The two most common elements in the
universe are hydrogen and stupidity.
- ---------------------------------------------



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:08:41 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: what is pretzel salt?

Alan McKay <amckay at neap.net> admits to sleeping through part of the class:

>OK, I missed that part somewhere.
>What is "pretzel salt"?

It is a coarse, pelletized salt for topping pretzels, salt bagels and 
a few other things.  There is a picture of it at kingarthur.com, but 
look at any pretzel, at least here in the US.  Surely Ontario can't 
be much different.

The topic came up because of my posted pretzel recipe here about a 
year ago, which I tightened up into an article in Zymurgy a few 
months ago.

Jeff
- -- 
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:38:01 -0400
From: Sebastien Riopel <s.riopel at eci-co.com>
Subject: Drying fresh hops

This is a question directed to those who grow their own hops.
A friend grows hops in her yard for another brewing friend who
will be unable to harvest her hops this year.  I have been graciously
given the rights to this year's crop!  I intend on havesting the hops
this upcoming weekend.  However I have just a basic idea how to
dry them. I was intending to make myself a picture frame with an
aluminium screen to hold the hops and put it in the oven at minimum
setting, I guess around 150-170F.  For some reason 140F comes
back from memory but I'm not certain.  I figure I need to let them
dry like this until they are crisp and dry but I don't want to "bake"
them.  All I have is the oven to dry them in and I don't want to spend
any money to get them ready for use.
I would appreciate any suggestions or guidelines to get these hops
nice and ready to brew sometime soon.  I believe they are noble hops,
either Saaz or Hallertauer.  When I use them I will probably use
them only for aroma since I have no idea what %AA they may be.

Cheers!

Sebastien
(Montreal, Quebec)





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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:46:29 -0400
From: "Chad Gould" <cgould11 at tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Re: New Orleans Pubs

> Hello!
> Long time lurker, first time poster.
> I'm heading to New Orleans next week on a business trip and wanted to know
if
> anyone that has been there can suggest pubs/bars with good local beer.

In the quarter, there isn't much. There is a place called Crescent City
Brewing Company, but it has rather expensive food (and beers), and IMHO
isn't worth the bother. The main place I liked in the Quarter itself is a
British pub called O'Flaherty's. They have some nice British taps, nothing
special but it beats a sharp stick in the eye.

In a few places, however, you will find the local beer, Abita, on draft. The
amber is a nice style Vienna lager; Turbo Dog is a more robust porter, and
they have an excellent raspberry wheat beer called Purple Haze. They also
offer a brewery tour which is worth the effort.

If you are willing to drive across Lake Ponchatrain, the Abita Brewpub is
very nice. Serves up some pretty good food and beer in a quiet town.

Closer to the airport is a place called Zea's Rotissere and Brewery. It's on
the corner of Veteran's and Clearview. Terrific beer on draft (brewpub
style) and some excellent food. Highly recommended.

I don't know if Acadian Brewery is still open - any locals know?

Two other places, Cooter Browns (good taps, on the river bend) and Murphy's
Brew House (across the lake in Gretna), have a large bottle selection. Worth
the stop if you are around those areas.




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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 14:47:33 +0000
From: beerbuddy at attbi.com
Subject: Hazelnut flavoring

Hi folks - thanks for the advice and suggestions for 
this newbie last time. I've now read the New Complete 
Joy of Homebrewing through to the beginning of 
the "advanced" section (all grain). I gained enough 
confidence to use an extract recipe from that book and 
modify it somewhat to try something new. 

Last night I started with the first nutbrown recipe in 
the book, and added a little honey for an extra little 
kick, and hopefully a tiny bit of residual sweetness 
(the O.G. came out at 1.062). 

The other thing that I would like to add is hazelnut 
flavoring, and thought I would add extract at the 
priming stage. The only thing I found at my local store 
is "Noirot Hazelnut," which appears to be made for 
flavoring hard liquor. Will this work for adding flavor 
to beer? Or should I find some actual extract or other 
flavoring over the internet? 

Thanks for any advice comments or suggestions, on or off 
list. 

Timothy
beerbuddy at attbi.com


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:00:14 -0500
From: "Gene Collins" <gene at bctruckelectric.com>
Subject: Re: Decoction Mash

Bob Pelletier asks about the benefits of decoction mashing.....

>From what I can tell, decoction mash serves a few special purposes. It
seems to impart that particular "German" taste to the beers I have made.
It is a distinctive grain type of flavor to me; I suppose it is derived
from boiling the grain husks. Secondly, you seem to get better mash
efficiency because the grain passes through the alpha and beta amylase
activating temperature zones many times, thus resulting in better
overall starch conversion. As far as complexity is concerned, YES! You
have to constantly attend to it for several hours and hitting the target
temperature is challenging to say the least. I made a triple decocted
doppelbock last week for Oktobeerfest and I am still tired from the
constant stirring. Reserve decocting for special brews only. I know I
do.

Gene Collins
Broken Arrow, Oklahoma

Serious winemaker?  Please visit my new website www.eurojuices.com.





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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:58:16 +0200
From: "Rudolf Krondorfer" <rudolf.krondorfer at sensonor.no>
Subject: Stainless Steel Conicals

Hi everybody.

I was wondering if anybody on this list have had any problems with
metallic taste on the beer after switching to stainless steel
fermenters?

I have a set of conicals that are made of 304 stainless steel. Ever
since I started using these, my beer has had a horrible metallic tast to
them (they are undrinkable). John Palmer (the metal guy) has given me a
few tips already, but I would love to hear if anybody else has
encountered this problem. Also, how/if you solved it.

Cheers
Rudolf Krondorfer
Norway


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:07:45 -0500
From: Ray Daniels <raydan at ameritech.net>
Subject: Cider judges . . . 

OK, so this isn't beer, but many of you have demonstrated your interest in 
other beverages, so I'll ask anyway.

Anyone out there experienced in judging cider?  If so, please drop me a 
line.  I'm looking for a few judges for the Planet Buzz! Mead and Cider 
Festival in November.

Thanks to all for the bandwidth.


Ray Daniels
Organizer,
Planet Buzz! The Mead, Cider and Perry Festival
Coming to Chicago November 8-9, 2002
See www.meadfest.com
and also, Real Ale Festival - 7th year Feb 26-March1, 2003
ray at meadfest.com
773-665-1300 



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 08:31:10 -0700
From: "Lori Brown" <loribrown at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Smoked porter/home-smoked malt

After reading the Smoked Beers book by Ray Daniels and Geoff Larson, and the
Alaskan Smoked Porter article in Zymurgy vol 23 no 2, I am working on an
all-grain recipe for a smoked porter.  Several of us intend to smoke some
pale malt to use in our group brew.  The book has some good guidelines, but
I wanted to see what other people's experiences might be with brewing smoked
beers and home-smoking malt rather than using Weyermann's commercial smoked
malt.

A few questions in particular since this is our first attempt at
home-smoking malt: Do you usually smoke the malt ahead of time, or can you
smoke the malt and go right into brewing with it the same day, once it is
dry?  We will be using a home smoker (Lil Chief) - same kind you would use
to smoke fish.  The book talks about apple wood as giving a nice, mild
flavor.  Have other people had good luck with this wood?  What have you used
to actually contain the malt in the smoker? (since the smoker has open wire
smoking trays that will not keep the malt from falling through.)  Length of
time in the smoker?  Lastly, any good recipe or book/magazine article
suggestions?  We are aiming for a lightly-smoked porter - not too intense
for our first batch of smoked beer - then we can modify for the next batch
to suit our tastes.  I look forward to hearing your replies.

Lori Brown
Seattle, WA  [?,?] Rennerian
(Basically 2000 miles west of Renner)



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:49:04 +0000
From: beerbuddy at attbi.com
Subject: Mini-kegs

Had another though today (I know, scary, but ya just 
can't avoid them all the time!). I saw some 5L mini-kegs 
at the homebrew store the other day. They look like 
little tiny kegs and just have a little CO2 cartridge 
for dispensing and storage, but you still prime for 
carbonation. I like the small size cause they'll fit in 
my fridge (I'm in an apartment), but think they might be 
easier and take up less space than bottles. 

Has anyone used these before? Comments, complaints or 
thoughts on cleaning and sanitizing?

Thanks as always. 
Timothy


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:16:15 -0700
From: Nicole Phillips <toddandnicole at attbi.com>
Subject: Maudite Homebrew Recipie suggestions

Hello All
I am looking for suggestions on a clone recipe for Unibroue's La Maudite.
I'm stuck on a few things and would like unencumbered thoughts on a recipe.
All ideas are welcome.



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 01:42:59 +0800
From: Wendy & Reuben Filsell <filsell at myplace.net.au>
Subject: Brewtek yeast.

Hi all down there in America,

I am hoping you can help me with some yeast info, I love my weizen and have
tried the Wyeast 3068 and Whitelabs wlp300 but not the 380 (yet) and now
want to try something different like Brewtek CL920.
Can anyone give me a bit of a comparison  against the  aforementioned.
The thing is we don't have a distributor up here in Australia so it gets
kinda expensive to bring in one slant.
Are there any other Brewtek strains that are particularly good compared to
the other brands as I would like to make the freight and my Aussie pesos go
as far as possible!!
Cheers,
Reuben.
Western Australia. 


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 13:45:18 -0500
From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu>
Subject: Cincinnati

Good Afternoon,
I'll be in Cincinnati from the 26th through the 28th (inclusive).  Any beer 
hounds out there want to have a beer?  I won't have a car....I can let you 
know where I'm staying privately....'cause I don't know yet.
nathan in madison, wi



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 13:45:45 -0500
From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu>
Subject: Albuquerque

Looking for info on beer haunts in  Albuquerque.  Late October.
nathan in madison, wi



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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 3:19:29
From: Dan Stedman <dan at stedmanbrewing.com>
Subject: Where to get FermCap?

<P>Yo Gump - any ideas where we can get FermCap in amounts less than 55 lbs?
The only place I can find it is Brewers Wholesale, and they will only sell
me 55 lbs of it (for $316). I would prefer to not buy a 100 lifetime supply
of it, so any ideas would be appreciated.</P>
<P>On a related note, I have used the foam control that HopTech sells and it
seems to work. Is this the same stuff? I've never tried it in the boil. I'd
LOVE to have something to knock down my frequent boilovers! Unfortunately,
they want $6 for 2 oz's of it, which seems a little pricey.</P>
<P>Dan in Minnetonka</P>



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:50:21 -0500
From: "Bruce Garner" <bpgarner at mailbag.com>
Subject: Hops questions

I have been harvesting some of my hops.

Some are green papery and firm.
Some are green with pedal tips browning
Some, growing inside the mass of vines, are round, paler green and less
dense.
Some growing outside are shaggy and have leaflets in the tops of the cones
Some have started to dry on the vine and tan at the end of the cone.
Some have dried even more and are a dark bronze green.

All have plenty of yellow lupulin glands.

My question is if any of these should not be harvested? Some of the bronze
colored hops have a different smell. Have any of you had experience with
this?

Also, has anyone frozen and later used fresh hops without drying them?

I have some Cascade and Hallertauer. The Cascade are very square when viewed
from the end of the cone. Are the Hallertauer also square, but less so? The
vines got mixed on my property. Can anyone describe the smell of fresh
Hallertauer?

I have made a 70 IBU fresh hop beer with my first Cascade harvest. I used
five times the weight. We will see...

Bruce Garner
Madison, WI



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 22:17:52 EDT
From: ShoesBrew3 at aol.com
Subject: Mashing Temps

After reading a bunch of info on multi-step mashes I am alittle curious.  
Will these make better beers then doing single infusion mashes?  I believe I 
can swing this with my system but would it be worth it?  The great George 
Fix, had recommended a schedule  of 104F - 140F - 158F.  Does anyone use 
this?

Thanks

Erik


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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 22:31:59 -0400
From: "Menzl's" <menzl at concentric.net>
Subject: All Grain Raspberry Porter Recipe and the AHA Pub Discount Program

First, I want to thank everyone who replied to help me with my All Grain
CAP.  It is now lagering and it is going real well.  I continued to be
astounded by the wealth of information I get from this group and the
willingness of everyone to help in any way they can.  It is appreciated by
me and I assume all the rest of us newbies.

My wife has had the good fortune to experience here first beers while
traveling in Europe during college.  She has assumed ever since that beer
refers to Guinness and other flavorful beers which makes my job easier when
trying to expand horizons.  (I started on Zing and Meister Brau so it has
been a longer journey for me.)  My beers have still not reached the
complexity plateau of those beers she started with but now it is time for me
to try something a little different.  My wife and I recently had the honor
of attending the Michigan Brewers Guild Summer Festival and we had New
Holland's (or Holland's?) Raspberry Porter.  The taste was such that I have
received the commandment to clone it.  I have done a lot of looking for
recipes and I have been having a hard time finding an all grain Raspberry
Porter recipe.  If anyone has a tried and true all grain Raspberry Porter
recipe, I would be most appreciative if you can help me out.

Third, and on an old topic, I finally got a chance to visit Hereford & Hops
(http://www.herefordandhops.com/) here in Bay City, Michigan again and I had
my AHA card.  The head brewer, Brett Moody, indicated he was a member of AOB
but had not heard of the AHA Pub Discount program.  Brett was interested in
how to participate "of course because you guys are my market".  This is
completely in character because he has spent time with the local brew club
at the "Brew School" and he is more than willing to answer any types of
questions.  Just goes to show you that the Pub Discount program will work,
they are more than willing to participate, and we just need to make the pubs
aware of it and help pass it on.  As a side note, his latest dopple bock at
9.5% abv was beautiful and had me seeing "Vapor Trails" (thank you Toronto
Trio!)

Thanks once again!

William Menzl
Midland, Michigan [99.8, 344.8] Apparent Rennerian



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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 23:12:45 -0400
From: "Henry St.Pierre" <hankstar at mhonline.net>
Subject: re: Decoction Mash

> From: Bob Pelletier <rp at ihrsa.org>
> Subject: Decoction Mash
> 
> What benefits does a decoction mash  have over an infusion?

Very little if any.

> Would it be beneficial to all styles?

Absolutely not.

> How much more complicated is it to do?
It's a lot more work for very little benefit. The way you have phrased 
your questions  leads me to believe that you have not been all grain 
brewing for very long ( I had the same questions after I started all 
grain brewing). Buy or borrow Noonan's book 'Brewing Lager Beers'. He 
goes into everything you may or may not want to know about decoction 
brewing.

> Thanks,
You're welcome.

> Bob  
Regards and keep brewing,
Hank





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