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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Aluminum Bottles of Moose Drool ("Richard Murney")
  Hey! Wha' happen? (MATTHEW HAHN)
  Re: aerating after fermentation (Jeff Renner)
  Alt Bier/21 yr brew (Jim Busch)
  RE: ...cheaper kegging options (Calvin Perilloux)
  European Pale Ale COC Winners ("Gary Glass")
  Re: CAP question (Jeff Renner)
  Head killers? - specifically glassware (Rich Rodda)
  Dr. Clayton Cone Fortnight of Yeast ("Rob Moline")


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Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2003 05:39:38 +0000
From: "Richard Murney" <rmurney at hotmail.com>
Subject: Aluminum Bottles of Moose Drool

On July 30 Travis Dahl KE4VYZ <dahlt at umich.edu>
wrote "(www.bigskybrew.com/index.php/fuseaction/home.alumaBottle).
Anybody see these yet?  Comments?  More importantly, are the twist
off or could someone actually reseal them, for something different?"

My wife, bless her soul, picked up some of these for a backpack trip we did.
They are light and unbreakable. Great idea from Big Sky Brewing! I was
hoping to refill with homebrew too. They are not twist tops. However they
do not have the tulip shape bulge in the neck for my capper to grip. Maybe
other cappers don't require that, I don't know.
They are a  major advance in brewing science, nonetheless.



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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 05:40:04 -0400
From: MATTHEW HAHN <mchahn at earthlink.net>
Subject: Hey! Wha' happen?

I put my kegs (which are lightly carbonated) on a 60-40 N2-CO2 mix. 
They went flat within 3 hours. Anybody know why?



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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 07:38:34 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: aerating after fermentation

Al Korzonas brewinfo at xnet.com (BrewInfo) writes from Homer Glen, IL 
(good to have you back more actively, Al):

>I will drop slowly for months.

That can happen when you have young kids, but perhaps you should cut 
back on the mead?

>Chuck went one step further and said he adds calcium carbonate to 
>*lower* the pH whenever the fermentation slowed to a trickle.

Brain cramp alert - it's obvious you meant *raise* the pH (or lower 
the acidity).

Jeff
- -- 
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


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Date: Mon, Aug 4 2003 9:51:30 GMT-0400
From: Jim Busch <jim at victorybeer.com>
Subject: Alt Bier/21 yr brew

Wow, its great to read posts from Al K. again!
Now, not that I want to be argumentative with Al,
but I used to agree with him about all munich malts
for Altbier, then I brewed up a series of 12 pilots
with vastly different malt profiles : 100% Munich,
touch of Carfa, down to 80% pils, some Munich, some
caramel, some carafa.  Somewhat to my surprise, the
beers that employed over 50% pils malt as a base
seemed closest to me in flavor profile with the
holy grail, Zum Uerige.  In fact read the label,
roast malz, pale malz, caramel malz, hopfen.

Hummmm, about time to fire up another alt as the
brewery has been cooking Kolesch yeast recently. Just
need to move that 22P Belgian strong ale out of the
uni to make room!

Regarding brewing for storage for about 18-21 yrs.
Ive been cellar aging strong Victory beers since
opened in 96 and have found that the best aging beer
we make is Storm King Imperial Stout.  It holds up
better than our barleywine, and better than the Belgians.
So here is what I would brew for an Impy:

Pils malt to OG of 22-24P.
5% Roasted Barley
Touch of Munich (say 3% if you wish)
PNW hops, Centennial, Columbus, Cascade to about 50BUs.
PNW hops, Cascade for flavor at 30&15 mins.
Be sure to rest at least 30 mins at 144F to maximize
beta amylase action for max fermentibility.
2 LITRES of thick slurry ale yeast per 5 gals.
Yes 2 Litres of SLURRY.
Oxygen feed when pitching.

Since you have to bottle condition this, be sure
to add fresh yeast with sugar at packaging time. Dont
rely on the old ferment yeast. Store cool at 55F and dark.

Prost!

Jim Busch







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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 07:07:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Calvin Perilloux <calvinperilloux at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: ...cheaper kegging options

>> ...don't get a 2-gauge regulator.  I, personally,
>> think they are a waste of money.  The second gauge goes 
>> on the high-pressure side of the regulator and tells you 
>> the pressure in the tank.  For gasses like nitrogen or oxygen, 
>> where the tank is all gas, it might be useful, but for CO2, 
>> which is a liquid in our tanks, it really only begins to
>> drop when all the liquid CO2 has become gas and that's 
>> just a few pints from empty.

I hate to disagree with one of the Hall of Foam candidates (Al K),
but 2-gauge regulators ARE useful, or perhaps let's say that these
are useful if you have a large CO2 tank.  Case in point:

The tank-pressure gauge on my 20-lb tank usually runs around
50-something atm.  It stays in that range (depending on ambient
temp) so long as there is liquid inside.  A week ago, I noticed 
it was down to 38 atm.  Yikes!  Time for refill.  But time 
I have, because even at a "mere" 38 atm, that's a lot of gas 
volume.  Many pints served later, and a purge-keg session, 
and a force-carbonation session, and I can see it dropping
and know I better refill this week or next.  So yes, the 
gauge *IS* useful! 

How much volume that 20-lb tank holds, I don't know exactly, 
but even at the current 20+ atm, that's a lot of gas when 
all I'm doing is using gas at about 1 atm (OK, more than
double that for force-carbo).  Keep in mind, though, that 
if you're running a 5-lb tank, you'll have a lot less warning 
time before it runs out. 

And also note that if you draw quite a lot of gas all at once,
you can get a "false alarm" as the evaporative-cooling effect 
in the CO2 liquid will cause the guage to drop temporarily 
until the tank and liquid warm again to room temperature. 

Calvin Perilloux
Middletown, Maryland, USA




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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 12:27:04 -0600
From: "Gary Glass" <gary at aob.org>
Subject: European Pale Ale COC Winners

With a total of 39 entries (15 Bohemian Pilsners, 8 Northern German
Pilsners, 6 Dortmunder Exports, and 10 Muenchner Helles), the winners of
Saturday's European Pale Ale Club Only Competition were:

1st Place:
Mick and Vi Walker
Munich Helles III, Category 2D
Prairie Homebrewing Companions
Fargo, ND

2nd Place:
Daniel Aussem
Leona's, Category 2C
Beer Barons of Milwaukee
Glendale, WI

3rd Place:
John Aitchison and John Rasmussen
Imperial Pilsner, Category 2A
Maltose Falcons
Northridge, CA

Congratulations!

Thanks to all of the clubs that participated and especially to Tom Gardner
and Foam on the Range for hosting the competition.

Cheers!

Gary Glass, Project Coordinator
Association of Brewers
888-U-CAN-BREW
(303) 447-0816 x 121
gary at aob.org
www.beertown.org

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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 16:57:57 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: CAP question

"Steve Arnold" <vmi92 at cox-internet.com> writes from Fort Smith, Arkansas:

>I recently made a CAP in accordance with Jeff Renner's article in
>Brewing Techniques.  Can I just tell you, Jeff that it turned out
>WONDERFULLY!

Glad to hear it.  I actually make my CAPs with a slightly modified 
recipe these days - no Munich and more hops, but that recipe makes a 
great beer too.

>The beer had a slight grainy sweetness which I found to provide a
>delightful balance to the 25 IBUs.  The problem has come only in the
>last week.  After about 4 weeks in the bottle, that treasured "grainy
>sweetness" has disappeared.

I can think of two possibilities.  One is that it continued to 
ferment in the bottle and this dried it out.  This should have been 
evident from a higher level of carbonation.  Did carbonation seem to 
increase?  Keeping it at lagering temperature after it achieved 
proper carbonation might have slowed this, but lager yeasts will work 
at this temperature.

The second possibility is oxidation.  This can rob a beer of its 
"wonderfulness" before any overt oxidation becomes evident.  Often it 
is the maltiness that is the first to suffer.

There is nothing that can be done but you can watch out for oxidation 
in your future brews.  A pale lager like this is brewing naked, and 
minor flaws will show up.

Good luck on future batches.

Jeff
- -- 
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 17:52:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rich Rodda <rrodda at yahoo.com>
Subject: Head killers? - specifically glassware

I am trying to locate the culprit killing the
head/carbonation in my drinks.  
Any beer, soda, carbonated mixer  is de-carbonated
when poured into any of my household glassware.
I don't have a dishwasher.  My tap water is hard(?). 
When left in a dish overnight, the water evaporates
and leaves a pink residue.
I use anti-bacterial dish soap.  The latest bottle is
cheap-o Shop Rite Ultra So-Soft.  
Active ingredient: Parachlorometaxylenol.
Any suggestions on how I can avoid losing my head? :-)
Tips on proper glassware cleaning appreciated. 
Thanks!
 
RRodda in North Jersey (NJ)
rrodda at yahoo.com



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Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 22:49:04 -0500
From: "Rob Moline" <jethrogump at mchsi.com>
Subject: Dr. Clayton Cone Fortnight of Yeast

			Dr. Clayton Cone Fortnight of Yeast
		   8.11.03 - 8.22.03 Yeast Questions Answered

     I am pleased to announce that Dr. Clayton Cone, consultant to
Lallemand, the American
Yeast Company, and formerly of Fleischmann's Yeast Company....... and one of
my own personal "Yeast Gods" has graciously agreed to host a 2 week period
of answering yeast related questions from the members of the HBD, commencing
August 11th, 2003 through August 22nd, 2003.
     Dr. Cone, certainly among the most generous of the brewing world's
experts has allowed that he may call on others in the field....."as no one
can know it all!"
     Questions may be submitted to the HBD, 8.11.03 up to the
posts/questions that appear in the HBD 8.22.03. Dr. Cone will answer any and
all questions at his discretion...which means if you have submitted a
redundant question that is answered by any other response, you may not be
directly answered.
     Standards to be followed.....
     1. Questions MUST be sent to the HBD, submitted to post@hbd.org  , and
submitted with "Dr. Cone, 2003" in the subject line, with or without further
subject heading.
     2. Questions shall be accepted for response via HBD 8.11.03, through
8.22.03. Dr. Cone has graciously allowed that follow-up may be required post
the cut-off point, and they will
deal with that on an as needed basis.
     3. Reprinting of the Questions and Answers may be published by
Lallemand and Dr. Cone at their discretion, in any media. Attribution of
name is granted by the questioner, without further publication of any e-mail
addresses.

     Ladies and Gentlemen, Brewers and Brewsters....we are ever so fortunate
to have Dr. Cone add his decades of expertise to what we  at  the HBD exist
for..."Brewers Helping Brewers!"
	Dr. Cone...Bless You Sir! And Thanks, mate!

Cheers!
Jethro Gump

Rob Moline
Lallemand
515-282-2739 brewery
515-450-0243 cell

"The More I Know About Beer, The More I Realize I Need To Know More About
Beer!"
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