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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Brain Cells ("Pete Calinski")
  Re: White Labs 565 Saison yeast ("Sebastian Padilla")
  RE: Irish Moss ("David Houseman")
  RE:  Last runnings for starter wort? ("David Houseman")
  RE: Last runnings for starter wort? (Steven Parfitt)
  Racking FAQ? (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Re: Saison yeast (Greg Peters)


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Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 22:16:51 -0400
From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net>
Subject: Brain Cells

Anybody think that the body is producing more brain cells because it knows
it will be hard to remember the events during the drinking?  ;-)

Pete Calinski
East Amherst NY
Near Buffalo NY

http://hbd.org/pcalinsk


***********************************************************
*My goal:
*      Go through life and never drink the same beer twice.
*     (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.)
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Date: Tue, 03 May 2005 06:19:43 +0000
From: "Sebastian Padilla" <sebastianpadilla at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: White Labs 565 Saison yeast

First off I highly recommend that you read Phil Markowski's (I hope I 
spelled that right) book Farmhouse Ales.  It goes a bit into using this 
ideosynchratic yeast that is supposed to be one of the Dupont strains.

I love using this yeast, when used correctly (most people don't, or in the 
case of commercial breweries can't because of economic reasons) this yeast 
will produce a dry, spicy tasty Saison that despite its super low finishing 
gravities has a fair amount of body to it.

I have been using this yeast for a couple of years, and I have never had 
this yeast finish above a 1.005, and the only reason that particular beer 
finished out that high was because it started at 1.096.  Typically I get 
final gravities of between 1.001 and 1.003.  Yes this yeast is a voracious 
eater of all types of sugars, including more complex ones that you would not 
expect ale yeast to be able to digest.  As others have suggested this yeast 
can be sluggish, especially if fermented below 75*F, but just give this 
yeast time and you will by duly rewarded with a tasty, traditional Dupont 
style Saison.

I typically try to ferment above 75*F, and have gone as high as 90*F for 
primary fermentation.  Supposedly Dupont ferments well into the 90s during 
primary fermentation.  Also this yeast does require a long primary 
fermentation, and even at the elevated temperatures I have not had any 
trouble with the yeast breaking down and contributing off flavors.  I 
usually primary for a minimum of one month with this yeast, and if it does 
not get into the 80s I typically wait a few more weeks.

I should not that I do use a cold conditioning period of about two weeks or 
more with all of my beers, so this might help smooth out any rough edges, 
but I have not noticed any particularly noticeable off flavors from this 
yeast when coming out of the primary.

I highly recommend this yeast, it produces wonderfully characterful saison 
beers.  This yeast is quite a bit different than your average yeast, and 
many people have not used it to its full potential, because of its unique 
requirements.

I should not that I would be wary of bottling a beer that finishes above 
1.010 with this yeast if those bottles are going to be stored warm, this 
yeast is quite voracious and will eventually want to ferment the beer out 
very dry.  Just ask Tomme Arthur at Pizza Port, both the SPF 18 & 45 turned 
into quite the gushers after a few months in the bottle.

Cheers,
Sebastian
Tucson, AZ




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Date: Tue, 03 May 2005 08:03:20 -0400
From: "David Houseman" <david.houseman at verizon.net>
Subject: RE: Irish Moss

Rowan,

Yes, IM will help you when you whirlpool hot wort prior to extracting the
wort.  The whirlpool will settle particulate matter into a cone in the
center of the kettle.  IM will aid in causing proteins to be clumped
together so that it can participate in this action.  I assume (but don't
know) that at least some of these proteins and other dissolved matter may
eventually settle out with gravity but you don't want to have to wait that
long, so IM would I assume speed up the process.  Another aspect that I
personally find in brewing is developing a "process" for brewing.  If you
follow a process each time you brew, then you won't forget things and you
will develop into a better brewer as you improve your processes.  So I
always add IM...as well as many other things that I do as part of a brewing
routine.

Dave



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Date: Tue, 03 May 2005 08:10:28 -0400
From: "David Houseman" <david.houseman at verizon.net>
Subject: RE:  Last runnings for starter wort?

Brian,

I save the last runnings almost all the time.  Depending on the gravity (I
stop between 1.012 and 1.015) I'll boil this down to achieve about 1.040.
This I put in Mason jars and boil in a hot water bath.  Canning the wort
allows me to have wort for starters at a moments notice.  I've never had a
problem with this wort, either starting or with flavors.  A quick and cheap
starter.

Dave Houseman



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Date: Tue, 3 May 2005 05:57:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steven Parfitt <thegimp98 at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Last runnings for starter wort?

From: Brian Miller Ponders:

> I'm a fly sparger and am wondering if there's any 
> reason not to use the last runnings (perhaps boiled
> down) for starter wort?

 ....SNIP....

> Will there be anything lacking in this wort that 
> can't be corrected by a bit of yeast nutrient?
> Regards,
> Brian Miller
> Tracy, CA


I regularly save the last runnings and boil down to
1.030 and then pressure can it. It shows good break
and trub, so I don't worry about adding any nutrients.

I've been doing this for years, and the canned starter
is really handy. Just spray sanitixer around the lid
before you open it as a precaution.

I've had good luck with the starter feeding my yeast
on a stir plate. I usually decant off the trub,
although some always comes over into the starter
flask.

 

Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery  http://thegimp.8k.com
Johnson City, TN [422.7, 169.2] Rennerian 

"There is no such thing as gravity, the earth sucks." Wings Whiplash - 1968



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Date: Tue, 3 May 2005 12:00:38 -0500
From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu>
Subject: Racking FAQ?

It's rather weird to ask newbie questions at this point and I guess I 
usually do it by ear. "You see, I have this friend and he has a 
question..."
When's the best time to rack to secondary?

There might be a really good answer in one of the Fortnights of Yeast 
or in one of the FAQs available on brewing sites. And there's certainly 
a diversity of opinion. Some forego the secondary altogether. Others 
may rack earlier or later depending on what they want to achieve. But 
what do you tell beginning homebrewers about when to go from primary to 
secondary? What *are* the effects of racking late or early? Stuck 
fermentation, autolysis, unrefined tastes...?
There are several rules of thumb. I guess one that some of us might be 
using is that the SG should be "relatively close" to expected FG, 
guestimated by yeast attenuation and mash temp and thickness. Other 
brewers use bubble count and we know how unreliable that is but it's 
easy to tell people. Receded kraeusen is another one but some people 
seem to say that it's better to rack when there's still some kraeusen 
and it depends on flocculation to a large extent.
So, what's the word on the street?

Ale-X, going back to Montreal *today*!
Relax, Don't Panic, Have a Pan-Galactic Gargleblaster!



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Date: Tue, 3 May 2005 12:14:31 -0700
From: gregbrews at webtv.net (Greg Peters)
Subject: Re: Saison yeast

  I have used the WL565 on about 5 batches   of Saisons (my favorite)
and they all ended up at 1.014.  Living in sourhern Cal. means that I
had to settle     for higher fermentation temps during the    summer.
WL565 seem to like it hot.

Cheers ,
Greg in El Cajon, Ca.      



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