---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


***************************************************************
       THIS YEAR'S HOME BREW DIGEST BROUGHT TO YOU BY: 

          Northern  Brewer, Ltd. Home Brew Supplies
Visit http://www.northernbrewer.com  to show your appreciation!
               Or call them at 1-800-681-2739

    Support those who support you! Visit our sponsor's site!
********** Also visit http://hbd.org/hbdsponsors.html *********


Contents:
  loss of hop aroma, staling/oxidation ("Steve Dale-Johnson")
  RIMS Controller Schematic ("evan kraus")
  Remembering George Fix (Jeff Renner)
  Fred's anti-oxidation plan ("Peed, John")


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
*           The HBD Logo Store is now open!             *
*            http://www.hbd.org/store.html              *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
*  Suppport this service: http://hbd.org/donate.shtml   *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
*   Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy!   *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org

If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!!

To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word
  "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org FROM THE E-MAIL
  ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!**
IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, you cannot subscribe to
  the digest as we cannot reach you. We will not correct your address
  for the automation - that's your job.

HAVING TROUBLE posting, subscribing or unsusubscribing? See the HBD FAQ at
http://hbd.org.

LOOKING TO BUY OR SELL USED EQUIPMENT? Please do not post about it here. Go
instead to http://homebrewfleamarket.com and post a free ad there.

The HBD is a copyrighted document. The compilation is copyright 
  HBD.ORG. Individual postings are copyright by their authors. ASK 
  before reproducing and you'll rarely have trouble. Digest content 
  cannot be reproduced by any means for sale or profit.

More information is available by sending the word "info" to 
req@hbd.org or read the HBD FAQ at http://hbd.org.

JANITORs on duty: Pat Babcock (pbabcock at hbd dot org), Jason Henning,
                  and Spencer Thomas



----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2006 20:45:01 -0800
From: "Steve Dale-Johnson" <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com>
Subject: loss of hop aroma, staling/oxidation

The post today from Jeff Renner to Fred Johnson's question, and response 
from Fred have brought something to the surface that has been troubling me 
of late, hadn't found a way to put my finger on it until now.

I haven't brewed in awhile, something about work, 2 and 4 year old kids and 
all that.  Still love beer, so I have been drinking (on tap, Sankey kegs) a 
nice, subtle honey pilsner by a local BC brewery (Tree brewing Honeycomb 
pilsner), really nice european style lager with a fine lacy white head like 
stella, a nice crisp bittering just in balance and a *fantastic* fresh hop 
aroma ...when the keg is first tapped.  I just killed one after a period of 
about 2 weeks (I had help) and by the end the beer was decidedly less 
dynamic, almost off (not sour, just not as clean and crisp) and had lost all 
hop aroma as well as the initial slight sulfur nose of a european style 
pilsner.  Thought I might not have cleaned my keg rig thoroughly enough in 
my usual obsessive compulsive anal retentive cleaning regimen.  I realize 
now in retrospect that it was oxidative staling.  If I ever had similar 
changes with my homebrewed beers, I thought it may have been HSA or an 
infection or whatever, but with 2 kegs in a row of stable (unpasteurzed, 
mind you), well made commercial brew????

I can only figure that this is coming from my beer gas, "pure" Co2.   Filled 
at the fire extinguisher place and not by BevGas, if that makes a 
difference.   How can you make sure that the Co2 that you buy isn't impure 
and adding oxygen to the keg???  It's the only thing I can think of that 
could have staled the beer this fast, certainly not my hoses the way it's 
been used up .... driving me nuts

Anyone care to enlighten??

Steve Dale-Johnson
Not Brewing, but still drinking at 1918 miles, 298 degrees Rennerian
Delta (Vancouver), BC, Canada.




Return to table of contents


Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2006 05:54:19 -0500
From: "evan kraus" <ekraus50 at hotmail.com>
Subject: RIMS Controller Schematic

Anyone got a copy of the original Rodney Morris RIMS Temperature control 
board schematic?
If you do can you send it to me?
ekraus50 at hotmail.com



Return to table of contents


Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2006 08:34:34 -0500
From: Jeff Renner <jsrenner at umich.edu>
Subject: Remembering George Fix

Brewers

Today, March 10, is the fourth anniversary of the death of one of the  
great pioneers of homebrewing, George Fix.

I hope you will all raise a glass of your finest to his memory.

See  http://byo.com/departments/904.html and http:// 
www.math.clemson.edu/history/fix.html

Here's to you, George!  We miss you.  As Louis Bonham wrote above, we  
don't worry that "in heaven there is no beer."  We know you have gone  
before us and are tipping one for us, waiting until we follow to join  
you.

Jeff
- ---
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, jsrenner at umich.edu
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


Return to table of contents


Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2006 11:10:22 -0800
From: "Peed, John" <jpeed at elotouch.com>
Subject: Fred's anti-oxidation plan


Fred's anti-oxidation plan sounds good, but I have a few things to add.
First, I would think it would be better to have a mash/lautering system
that doesn't require transferring the mash from the mash vessel to a
lauter vessel.  Second, while many people think that RIMS recirculating
systems increase oxidation, I would argue that they decrease oxidation.
If you prime the pump properly, you will ensure that the lines and pump
are filled with liquid and no air.  Now, assuming that your inlet
manifold sits atop the grain bed and under the surface of the wort in
the mash tun, you can recirculate wort with no oxidation at all.  And
assuming that your mash and lauter tun are combined (as in a picnic
cooler), you can dough-in with minimal mixing, recirculate to clarity
with no disturbance or splashing, then quietly run off the liquid to the
boil kettle.  Add the typical RIMS heater and some temperature control
and you can mash out using the RIMS system without disturbing the mash
bed (if you wanted, you could control heat with a simple on-off switch,
although it would require a lot of diligence).  Contrast a closed-loop
RIMS system with a manual system using separate mash and lauter tuns and
you see that with the latter you have to scoop the mash out of one
vessel and put it into another, as well as having to manually draw off
wort and pour it back into the lauter tun to achieve a fraction of the
clarity with a lot more chance for oxidation; to me, the RIMS system
looks a lot better from a standpoint of oxidation.  As for RIMS designs,
I don't think you can beat Dennis Collins':
http://sdcollins.home.mindspring.com/System.html

I'm not at all convinced that hot side aeration is the problem, but it's
pretty much impossible to prove or disprove it.

As for the cold side, I try to purge all kegs, carboys and yeast starter
vessels with CO2 before filling.  A carboy cap, racking cane and hose
barb allow CO2 pressure-transfer of wort and yeast from carboys to kegs.
Obviously, the pressure must be kept low (I stay in the 1 to 2 psi range
for the most part, never exceeding 5 psi).  If you follow this strategy,
your wort and beer will never contact air from the time you rack it out
of the boil kettle.  I do this more for sanitation than for
anti-oxidation.

For bottling, I think it really helps to purge the bottles with CO2.  A
simple hose and racking cane can connect directly to a CO2 regulator set
to a psi or two.  Put it in the bottle, open the valve, flow for 5
seconds or so while withdrawing the racking cane.  Blichmann's BeerGun
makes purging and filling really easy, although I haven't used one
enough to know if it makes for better bottled beer.

Don't have a CO2 setup?  Watch e-bay.

John Peed
Oak Ridge, TN

"Theory and practice are the same in theory, but not in practice."



Return to table of contents

---