---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Trouble with liquid yeast (davidson)
  Re: Cider techniques (Eric Pepke)
  Edme and Chimay (Martin A. Lodahl)
  nutty beer (Chris Burghart)
  EDME bashing (Doug Roberts)
  further (yawn) RE: Edme bashing (617)253-0885" <CASEY at ALCVAX.PFC.MIT.EDU>
  Re:  Homebrew Digest #511 (October 05, 1990) (helmke)
  Re: Wholesale HomeBrew Club - Anything like this in Canada? (Tony Plate)
  "distilling"; shipping (Chip Hitchcock)
  Re: The whines of Algis (a.e.mossberg)
  ciders and cysers (florianb)
  hard cider ,vinometers (Donald P Perley)
  high-alcohol yeasts (Kevin Karplus)
  Sterilizing (Kevin Karplus)
  Silver Solder (Mahan_Stephen)
  Germany - Part 5 (of 6) (Norm Hardy)


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[Please do not send me requests for back issues]
Archives are available from netlib at mthvax.cs.miami.edu


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 9:32:05 EDT
From: davidson at hpanlr.an.hp.com
Subject: Trouble with liquid yeast


Well all this talk about liquid yeast, especially Martin Lodahl's entry
in Digest #505, prompted me to make the switch.  I recently moved from
Colorado Springs to the Boston area and everything sat in storage for
four months - boy am I itchy to brew!  I figured a change in brewing was
called for and visited Beer and Wine Hobby (which by the way had an
impressive selection) and picked up some Wyeast Bavarian Lager #2206.
I had never brewed a lager before but for our new house I bought a stove
and a refrigerator for the basement (brewery) so I'm ready.  The date
code on the package was May 1990 so the woman at the store said it should
take 4 days to swell (she was counting through September).  I broke the
inner package Saturday evening, intending on making my starter on Wednesday
and brewing on Thursday (it would be a good excuse to take an afternoon
off).  On Sunday, it had swelled about an inch, and by Monday morning it
looked like it was going to burst.  Well I wasn't ready to brew yet (I
couldn't pick up the refrigerator until Tuesday) so I had to let this 
football sit on the kitchen counter until Tuesday evening when I had time
to make the starter.  Tuesday I made up the starter (process described
below), pitched the yeast, and waited, and waited, and waited...  My past
experiences with dry yeast had always been very quick - pitch at about 
midnight and wake to the sounds of blub, blub, blub.

When I woke on Wednesday I checked on the champagne bottle and there was
absolutely no activity.  I came home at lunch to check on it and there
were just a few white globs sitting on top - I figured infection.  Well
by that evening, there was about a half an inch of foam on top - I guess it
wasn't an infection.  The puzzling thing was that there was absolutely no
change in the levels of the airlock.  Now, a day and a half later, it is
in exactly the same state.  I don't get it.

The starter was made with a mix of Martin's recipe and Papazian's recipe:
Boil a little over a quart of water, add 3/4 cup DME (M&F Amber) and a small
handful of Hallertauer (3.9) hops.  Boiled for 30 minutes.  Poured through
sanitized strainer into another saucepan and boiled for another 10 minutes.
Cooled saucepan in ice bath to 70 degrees, poured through sanitized funnel
into sanitized champagne bottle, and poured yeast from sanitized package
(cut with sanitized scissors) into bottle.  Capped immediately with sanitized
airlock / stopper.  BTW, because of oil prices recently, the temperature in
the house has been 60 to 64 degrees.

The only thing I can imagine is that I used too much hops.  I should have
weighed it but I wasn't worrying at the time.  I certainly haven't convinced
myself that liquid is not the way to go but I would like to figure out what
went wrong and try to avoid it in the future.  I would prefer not throwing
away four dollars and some odd cents very often.  I'm not kissing this 
starter off either - maybe it can be saved, somehow.  Any suggestions?  How
long can I leave this sitting in the bottle?  Can I just make up a bigger
starter and throw this whole thing in?  I don't want it to get too big or this
will become my batch of beer...

Any help on how to do this better next time would be appreciated, or even
how to save this batch.

Waiting patiently for that beautiful sound of blub, blub, blub,

Marc

- --
Marc Davidson
hp-and!davidson

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Date:    Fri, 5 Oct 1990 10:01:43 EDT
From: PEPKE at scri1.scri.fsu.edu (Eric Pepke)
Subject: Re: Cider techniques

Terry Noe asks about techniques for making hard cider and asks if there are
other ways of leaving sweetness in cider than adding so much sugar that the
resulting alcohol kills the yeast.

My answer is, sure--use a less attenuative yeast.  I have had good success with
Red Star California Champagne yeast.  Not the Pasteur variety--it's too 
attenuative.  (The reason I use Champagne yeast has nothing to do with its
notable resilience to alcohol; it's because the flavor it produces is better.)

One has got to remember that the process of fermenting a beverage and leaving
sugar in it is, in some sense, precisely the opposite of brewing beer, so there
is a bit of unlearning to do.  Forget the liquid yeast cultures, the carefully
prepared starter solutions, the nutrients.  All this is to make the yeast as
vigorous and active as possible.  You don't want the yeast to be as vigorous 
and active as possible when making cider!  You want it to do a little bit of
the job and then stop.  So get an inferior quality dried yeast and dump a 
little straight out of the pouch into the cider.

Also, there's no need to bother with a carboy.  Get the juice in one-gallon
glass jugs.  The ID of the neck is the same size as that of a carboy.  Pour out
about a pint, dump in the yeast, fit a lock, put in a dark closet.  After three
days, rack (or even just pour) into another sterilized gallon jug.  

Eric Pepke                                     INTERNET: pepke at gw.scri.fsu.edu
Supercomputer Computations Research Institute  MFENET:   pepke at fsu
Florida State University                       SPAN:     scri::pepke
Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052                     BITNET:   pepke at fsu

Disclaimer: My employers seldom even LISTEN to my opinions.
Meta-disclaimer: Any society that needs disclaimers has too many lawyers.


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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 7:42:47 PDT
From: Martin A. Lodahl <pbmoss!malodah at PacBell.COM>
Subject: Edme and Chimay

After going so far as to recommend Edme yeast in previous postings
to the Digest, I'm now forced to add my voice to those in support of
Ken Weiss' report, in HBD 510:

"		... In my case, I got a *very* rapid 
" fermentation, after which I primed and bottled my ale. There was no 
" carbonation for some time, and then everything slowly became
" overcarbonated ...

Yep, the only two batches of "gushers" I've had behaved exactly this
way, with millions of tiny, beady bubbles, and they were my last two
batches using Edme.  Among the benefits of switching to Wyeast has
been a freedom from the Old Faithful Syndrome.

In the same issue, Mike Schrempp observed:
" I seem to remember reading on a bottle of Chimay that they filter
" out the fermenting yeast and add a second yeast for carbonation.
" If this is true, then culturing this yeast and using it for fermenting
" won't give a Chimay beer.

By sheer chance, my eyes happened to fall this morning on the
unremoved label of the 750ml Chimay bottle I'm using to culture
yeast.  That bottle's label said they added yeast at bottling, 
but didn't mention filtering, and didn't address the question of 
whether a single strain is used.  Miller, in CHoHB, gives a recipe 
for Trappist ale, and suggests culturing the yeast from a (fresh) 
Chimay bottle.  I haven't tried this (but intend to)(some day).

By the way, that yeast culture is Wyeast's "Vintner's Choice"
Champagne yeast, that I'm reculturing for use in a barleywine.  The
label was something of an oddball, being a Brewer's Choice label
with a "cut & paste" stickon over its top half.  My nose and
logic tell me the growth medium in the packet is a grape-based must
(I've written Logsdon's for confirmation), but it certainly seems
to find malt wort delicious.  I'll report on how the beer turns out.

And a special thanks to Brian Capouch for republishing the info for
the "Beer Hunter" tape.  To my astonishment, it appears I'll be
leaving for Belgium late next month, and this may help me prepare.

= Martin A. Lodahl    Pac*Bell Minicomputer Operations Support Staff =
= malodah at pbmoss.Pacbell.COM       Sacramento, CA       916.972.4821 =
= If it's good for ancient Druids, runnin' nekkid through the wuids, =
= Drinkin' strange fermented fluids, it's good enough for me!  8-)   =


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Date: Fri, 05 Oct 90 09:07:37 -0600
From: burghart at stout.atd.ucar.EDU (Chris Burghart)
Subject: nutty beer


  I have tasted beers with ``nutty'' flavor and seen many described that
way, but I have never seen a beer recipe that actually makes use of nuts.
Does anyone out there have such a recipe?  Is there any special reason
that I wouldn't want to use nuts for brewing?  Walnuts in particular seem
like they would make an interesting addition.

Chris Burghart
burghart at ncar.ucar.edu

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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 09:12:12 MDT
From: roberts%studguppy at LANL.GOV (Doug Roberts)
Subject: EDME bashing

[Several articles about suspected contamination of EDME yeast]

I have had mixed experience with EDME: several fair-to-good batches,
and one lost to a wild yeast contamination. I don't use EDME any
more. However, I was surprised to learn that the Santa Fe Brewery, a
small micro in Galesteo, New Mexico, uses the commercial varient of
EDME. The SF brewery makes EXCELLENT beer. The mash their own grains,
exercise stringent sanitation proceedures, and consistantly produce
excellent beers. They have been making a pale ale for several years,
now, and recently introduced two new recipies: a Porter and another
ale patterned after Liberty Ale (bitter, hefty Cascade's nose, _very_
good). 

The main observation here is that they basically use EDME yeast and
consistantly brew an excellent beer. It should be noted though, that
the bulk commercial varient is probably different than that sold for
home brewing: better quality control, perhaps.

My own experience with the EDME sold for home brewing has led me to not
ever used it again, though.

- --Doug
================================================================
Douglas Roberts                |
Los Alamos National Laboratory |I can resist anything
Box 1663, MS F-609             |  except temptation.
Los Alamos, New Mexico 87545   |  ...
(505)667-4569                  |Oscar Wilde
dzzr at lanl.gov                  |
================================================================

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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 11:22 EST
From: "JEFF CASEY / (617)253-0885" <CASEY at ALCVAX.PFC.MIT.EDU>
Subject: further (yawn) RE: Edme bashing

For those of you old timers, you may remember this message posted last
summer, but the generation time seems to be only a few months, so I will
post again.  For newcomers, this was the result of an attempt to do a
fair comparison of seven different dry yeasts.  The experiment was
admittedly formulated with some problems, and didn't include any
liquid cultures.  At the time, I was still a beginner (7th or 8th batch),
and did only extracts.  I am now on my 30th batch, and stick with full or
partial mashes as a rule.  I have tried various Wyeasts, as well as SNPA
cultered yeast.  While all have produced good beer, I have found that the
BIGGEST factors for improving "beginner's extract beer" are (in order):
   1) chill quickly with wort chiller
   2) use leaf hops, especially for the finish
   3) mash your own grain (at least a partial mash)
   4) rack off the trub before pitching the yeast

I almost exclusively use Edme yeast, occasionally switching to Whitbread
for variety.  I have had very few problems with any infection, overcarbonation,
or other reported problems -- more batches ruined due to my imaginative
recipe formulations.  I have found (attention, subjective opinion) that
liquid yeast cultures are simply not worth the trouble.

Here is my old posting of the experiment, verbatim:-------------------

subject:  amateur yeast experiment:

I started brewing only four months ago, and am still in the wild experimentation
stage.  I quickly became confused about different brands of yeast available,
and was able to get almost no reliable information, so I tried an experiment.
The results are posted below.  I just joined this bboard, so I have no idea if
this sort of thing is common.  I'd love to hear of other experience or comments
along the same line.  If this is an old subject, just flame to me directly
instead of clogging up the board. 

First:  I already realize that I used a pretty bad recipe for the test.  It
had far too much bittering hops for balance.  The idea was to look for 
differences in yeasts, however, so I tried to look through it. I was also
experimenting on yeasts suitable for my conditions (Boston in summertime),
where the temperatures are ungodly hot, and mold runs rampant.  I also realize
the problem with my lack of gravity measurements and exact temperatures, sorry.
Don't chew me out for these, but I would be interested to hear if one of the
"bad" yeasts might be perfectly good under other circumstances. 

7 gallon recipe:
2x 3.3# can M&F light unhopped
.75# M&F light unhopped spray
.75# crystal (steeped while coming to boil)
1 tsp gypsum
2oz clusters boiling
.5 oz cascades finishing
Divided evenly into seven 1 gal bottles, different yeast in each bottle.
Fermented at about 75-85 F.

Results were:
1st:       Edme ale - best overall.   rounded, slightly sweet.  some diacetyl.
                 nice balance.  fermented rather slowly (3-4 days).
2nd/3rd:   Whitbread ale - lighter, crisp.  poorer head.  some esters.
                 very fast fermentation.
2nd/3rd:   CWE ale - slight yeasty bite.  very dry (attenuative).  good head.
                 no esters.  extremely fast fermentation (frighteningly).

... these three were all quite good, and I have been using them successfully
since then.  they all rated fairly close together.  the remaining four were
all quite a bit worse (a very big gap in quality), and I haven't touched them
since.  none seemed to have spoiled, they just had unforgiveable ester 
content and/or carbonation qualities.  (this could be due to temperature).

4th:       M&F ale - heavy yeast bite.  flat head.  very little ester taste.
5th:       Kitzengen lager - (fermented warm) this had the best head and
                 carbonation quality.  very dry (attenuative).  extremely
                 bad ester content.
6th:       Doric ale - yeast bite.  very estery.  bad head.  overall horrible.
7th:       Red Star ale - same as Doric, but a little worse.

these were the results of two different double blind tests, with only minor 
variations between the two events.  I might try this sort of thing again
with a better recipe after it cools down, and include some liquid cultures
that I've tried since (with luck); unless somebody else out there has 
done it for me and can post the results.  I have heard that the next issue of
Zymurgy will cover yeasts - perhaps all this will be superceeded soon.

   ------------------------------  I hope this is useful. Sorry for the echo
problems, old timers.     Jeff Casey     casey at alcvax.pfc.mit.edu


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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 13:00:32 EDT
From: helmke at buster.cps.msu.edu
Subject: Re:  Homebrew Digest #511 (October 05, 1990)

    2 things:
      Why the rare (and nasty) mention of Red Star yeast?  Works pretty good
for me... And in 2 years of brewing, not one bad batch or really weird fermentaion...  I might try one of the others, if I see it in my local (Lansing) brew
supply store though.
   
    Re: UPS & 100 lb. bags of sugar:  UPS won't handle anything over 70 pounds!
If you buy in bulk like this, expect either picking up yourself or having
a regular trucking company do it.  (this means having a semi back up to your
house 8^) ).
    -Scott

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Date: 	Fri, 5 Oct 1990 11:43:54 +0500
From: Tony Plate <tap at ai.toronto.edu>
Subject: Re: Wholesale HomeBrew Club - Anything like this in Canada?


a.e.mossberg writes about a place where one can buy
brewing supplies at wholesale prices (and quantities).

Does anyone know if anything like this is available in
Toronto, or by mail order in Canada?

Tony Plate

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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 12:14:29 EDT
From: cjh at vallance.eng.ileaf.com (Chip Hitchcock)
Subject: "distilling"; shipping

Gary Heston:
> I think the prohibition is against the process of distillation, not a limit
> on naturally fermented content. If anyone develops a strain of yeast that'll
> keep going, let me know.....

   Does anyone know just what the wording of the prohibition is? People in cold
climates used to produce "winter wine" of 20-25%(?) alcohol by putting the
wine out on cold nights and throwing away the (mostly water) ice each morning;
I don't know that this would be worthwhile with beer (unless you wanted to try
a strange way of making something as strong as ]barley wine[), but it could
be interesting with mead, fruit mead, or even high-proof hard cider.
   As an ex-chemist, I certainly wouldn't call this "distillation" (or maybe
I would---separating oxygen, then nitrogen, from air by progressive chilling
is sometimes called distillation...).

Algis Korzonas:
> P.S. I wonder what UPS charges for a 100lb. bag of sugar?

1) Probably more than it's worth; 2) I didn't think they take anything that
heavy. Motor freight (without home delivery) could be anything from $20 to $50
(they charge per hundredweight within weight ranges, with a separate set of
rates for each of several hundred classes of things you might ship by truck).

100lbs is an awkward size; maybe you should scale up even more? I visited
Carlsberg headquarters a few weeks ago and saw multiple pallets of bags of
"Dansukker" ?100kg? per bag, ~12 bags/pallet, in the brewhouse. (Carlsberg is
also doing an all-barley medium-dark lager, slightly lower in alcohol, very
much like the first beer they brewed---don't expect to find it in US,
thought.)

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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 18:22:13 GMT
From: aem at mthvax.cs.miami.edu (a.e.mossberg)
Subject: Re: The whines of Algis

Algis write:

>Thanks for reminding me Andrew, that I should post a short
>note regarding my adventures with Craig of Wine and Brew By You.

>It appears that Craig didn't like my posting (although every
>word was true) and although I sent the entire order back to

Buzz! Even before talking to Craig and Sandy I spotted a number of
errors in your posting. Errors? No, that's too weak. Lies.

Note that after your first posting, *I* called you to try to resolve
any possible problem you might have had. You did not return my phone
call. I also sent you email. Your advertised email address is illegal.

>[...]
>unintentional oversight.  From now on, I plan to buy only
>from reputable dealers like Lil' Olde Winemaking Shoppe in
>Sugar Grove, IL and Winemakers in Elmhurst, IL.

Buy wherever you like.  Wine and Brew By You doesn't need your 
business, nor do they want it. Your comments are litigable and 
you should shut up. Quickly.


[my comments and mine alone]

aem

- -- 
aem at mthvax.cs.miami.edu .......................................................
I like for you to be still: it is as though you were absent, distant and 
full of sorrow as though you had died.  One word then, one smile, is 
enough.  And I am happy, happy that it's not true.	- Pablo Neruda

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Date: 05 Oct 90 12:00:22 PDT (Fri)
From: florianb at tekred.cna.tek.com
Subject: ciders and cysers

Terry Noe pushes the subject of cider just a little bit further:

>   When I tried hardening some cider last year, I simply pitched a big
>   glob of yeast (Wyeast Irish Ale) from my primary into a gallon jug of
>   fresh cider.  In a week or so, I had some halfway-hard cider that was
>   pretty drinkable.  The problem was getting the fermentation to stop.
>   Before long, however, the cider fermented out so completely as to be
>   (almost) undrinkable.  The residual flavor left when the sugars had gone
>   was very bitter.

I don't know how you prepared your apple juice, or if you used bottled
apple cider.  If you are using fresh apples, you might want to avoid the
skins.  Tannins will give a harsh flavor to the cider.  Normally, I just
buy a gallon jug of some straightforward apple juice, without preservatives.
It's nice to use the filtered kind to get clear cider.  I haven't the 
faintest idea what bottled "cider" in the grocery stores is.  It has a
different flavor than pure apple juice.  In any case, I use a combination
of one gallon pure apple juice plus one half pound of corn sugar, if I'm
feeling ornery.  I boil it 10 minutes, then add 1 tsp citric acid, 1/4 tsp
ascorbic acid, and 1 tsp yeast nutrient.  I then cool it to room temp and
add RED STAR CHAMPAGNE YEAST, sprinkled over the top.  It takes about two
months or more to ferment out.  One should use champagne yeast if one adds
sugar, since the higher alcohol content could kill beer yeast.  The final
gravity of pure apple juice cider will be close to 0.995.  Thus, if the
bottling takes place at 1.005 - 1.000, the product will be sparkling.  
Although I do this, I cannot recommend it due to the dangers involved.
You'd better know your apple juice well to do this type of early bottling
to get carbonation.  The alternative of course is to let it ferment out,
then add 1/2 tsp corn sugar per bottle to get carbonation.  All this
assumes that the yeast are still active at the time of bottling.

As far as the dryness, when I lived in Germany, I had quite a lot of
Moost--a hard, dry cider brewed by the Swabians this time of year.  Since
they started with sour apples in the beginning, this stuff was killer.
You had to drink it while eating sausages.  In the lab where I worked,
there was a technician from the Black Forest who made his own.  He would
bring a big jug of apple juice to the lab, and put it under his desk
with a cork in it.  In a month, it got pretty good.  That's when I started
pinching it after lunch every day.  He'd catch me and say, "Florian,
you are drinking this, ah, Moost, what do you call it, cidair, too quickly"
I would reply, "No, I'm just sipping it."  He would laugh and say, "No,
I meant to say to you, ah, it is too soon.  Wait until one more month."
He was right. It got better.  This is to illustrate that there are as
many different forms and tastes of cider as there are cider brewers.

Last winter, I made some cider and put cinammon sticks in the fermenter.
In one month, it got really good.  I had a bunch of my sisters down from
Seattle for Thanksgiving, and we drank this stuff hot in front of the
wood stove in the evening.  Memories like that are cast in gold.

Now that I'm on the subject, why does one skim the foam from mead while
heating it on the stove, prior to fermentation?

Florian the long-winded



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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 15:49:10 EDT
From: perley at easygoer.crd.ge.com (Donald P Perley)
Subject: hard cider ,vinometers


various people write:

>   What some folks have suggested over the last few days in this digest
>is to add lots of sugars to the cider.  When the alcohol content gets
>high enough, the yeast die, and your fermentation stops.  Well, that's
>certainly one approach.  Does anyone have any other ideas?

A couple of ideas:

If you aren't against chemical action, you can add Sorbistat (A brand name
for sorbic acid, I think), which will stop those yeasties in their tracks.
It is made for making sweet wines.

Another way is to bottle the cider at the desired sweetness, and then
pasteurize at 170 degrees in a water bath.

  (regarding cider recipe with 6 pounds of honey and brown sugar added)
>Practically, no matter how much fermentables are in a wort, the alcohol
>content will not exceed 15% - yeasts simply get drunk, try to drive, and
>you got dead yeast.  15% alcohol is certainly in the legal range.  The
>recipe described above will probably remain very sweet, because the yeast
>will die before the cider dries out.  If that's the goal, it sounds pretty
>good!

I already wrote to Jay, but this seems to have taken off, so...

Fresh cider is typically 1.045-1.050.  If after you add the brown sugar
and honey the SG would be in the 1.090 range.  That would be distinctly
on the low side for wine.  I don't have conversion factors handy, but
probably around 9-10% alchohol if you ferment out to < 1.000

>On a side note, several months ago someone mentioned testing their brew with
>an "alcohol vinometer" or something of the sort, to determine alcohol
>content. All my attempts at email bounced, so (since I'm already sending
>this in) does anyone out there know what one of those is, how much they
>cost, and where one could be acquired?

A vinometer (at least the one I have) measures the alchohol content 
based on a combination of surface tension and density.  It is 
basically a capilary tube and you take the reading at the top of the
column of liquid.  To be accurate, the liquid should be fermented dry.
Beer won't ferment dry, so it isn't too useful there.

 -don perley


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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 13:00:58 PDT
From: Kevin Karplus <karplus at ararat.ucsc.edu>
Subject: high-alcohol yeasts

The greatest alcohol content from yeasts that I know of are from Sake yeasts,
which I believe can survive up to about 18%.  Champagne yeasts are also far
more alcohol tolerant than beer yeasts.  If you are really intent on ultra-dry
strong beverages, try using sake yeast.

(Note: I had some sake yeast once, but never got around to using it, so
this is all second-hand info.)

Kevin

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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 13:08:58 PDT
From: Kevin Karplus <karplus at ararat.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Sterilizing

I wonder why everyone is into chemical sterilizers (bleach, etc.) these days.
I've always sterilized everything with boiling water (including my carboys), and
never had any trouble with infections.  With Boiling water, there is no problem
with contamination of the brew with the sterilizing agent.

Of course, I brew mead, not beer, and I've heard that mead is much less likely
to get infected than other beverages (honey being slightly antiseptic).

Anyone else out there who is avoiding chemical sterilizers without trouble?

Kevin Karplus

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Date: Fri, 5 Oct 90 15:05:00 CST
From: Mahan_Stephen at lanmail.ncsc.navy.mil
Subject: Silver Solder


     I know this is in response to an old article, but I think it needs 
to be said.  Someone here was talking about building a wort chiller and 
using silver solder to make the connections.  I looked up the 
composition of silver solder and found that it was about 97% LEAD and 3% 
silver (your mileage may vary).  

     This makes it highly unsuitable for use in anything involving food 
or drink.  Lead free plumbing solder should be available at any local 
plumbing supply house.  This type of solder has been used for about the 
last ten years for home plumbing when sweating copper pipes and 
fittings.  It would be the appropriate type to use when constructing a 
wort chiller.


steve

mahan_stephen at lanmail.ncsc.navy.mil
#include <disclaimer.h>

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Date: Sun, 7 Oct 90 15:38:21 PDT
From: polstra!norm at uunet.UU.NET (Norm Hardy)
Subject: Germany - Part 5 (of 6)

Duesseldorf is a densely populated industrial city of over 1 million.  There
is also a large number of foreigners working/living.  The city is located in
central Germany on the Rhine River (don't swim in it).  Duessel means brook
or creek, and dorf stands for a custom by which young people cartwheeled
around trying to get handouts from the folk.  Or maybe I got that backwards.

Anyway, Alt beer is the beer of choice in Duesseldorf.  An Alt beer is a top
fermented (ale) beer amber or darker in color, very malty and highly hopped.
Most come across with a grapefruit type of bitterness.  The Alts are lagered
for smoothness (3 to 4 weeks) before serving.  There are over 30 different
Alt beer breweries in the region.

The Duesseldorfians love their Alt (old) beer; so much so that they even
mention it while singing at their soccer games (even my poor German compre-
hension could understand that one!).

The most prestigious Alt beers are:  Zum Eurige (from the old town), a
combination brewery, butcher shop, and restaurant.  They also serve the beer
at a portal in the side of the building to throngs of people outside whoj
eventually overtake the street and stop all traffic from coming through.  The
people just leave their glasses and brewery workers come and take the 
glasses away for cleaning.  Next is Schumacher Alt, a more pale Alt with a
smooth bitterness.  One of my favorites was Fuchschen Alt, also in the
old town.

Homebrew hints:  use Wyeast 1007 (German Ale) yeast, some chocolate malt,
Hallertauer or Herzbrucher hops.  Ferment at 60-65f, rack and condition
at 35-40f for up to a month.  Oh, obviously, use malted barley for the
bulk of the malt (i.e. 8 lbs Klages, .25 lbs Chocolate malt would be a
good starting point).

In Seattle the Maritime Pacific Brewing Co. makes an excellent Alt beer
called Flagship Red Ale, although it is a little pale in color and uses
some wheat malt.  Incidently, that beer was the consumer's favorite at
the recent Taste the Difference beer festival in Seattle edging out
competition like Red Hook, Grants, Pyramid, Hales, Rogue, etc.

Finally, an Alt beer is a satisfying thirst quenching beer.  Some say that
a real "blindfold" (i.e. no visual clues) test would find the alt beers as
flavorful as the pilseners, thanks to the aging.  Perhaps, but I liked
them as they were, served in .2 or .3 liter "shot" type glasses.  Easy
drinking, always bitter, great stuff.

Next...and last...a overview of the trip....

Norm 
Hardy


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End of HOMEBREW Digest #512, 10/08/90
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