HOMEBREW Digest #5141 Mon 05 February 2007

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  CO2 Tank filling in the Ann Arbor Michigan Area ("Joe Van Loon")
  Re: dextrins/mouthfeel/body ("-s.alexander")
  Re: Malt Color Assignments (Geoff Cooper)
  CO2 Pressure for Mild ("A.J deLange")
  re: beer line question (Nathaniel Lansing)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 00:23:07 -0500 From: "Joe Van Loon" <joevanloon at comcast.net> Subject: CO2 Tank filling in the Ann Arbor Michigan Area Fellow Detroit Metro brewers, please help. I've got two tanks, a relatively bright and shiny (brushed, actually) 5 pounder and a well-used 20 pound bottle. Just recently got back into the brewing scene and am looking for a place near work to get bottles filled during the lunch break or after work - usually 5:30ish. While carbonating a brew from a recent session, I got caught up in my other day-to-day committments and failed to realize that the "out" poppet stuck and leaked the remainder of my CO2 from the 20 Lb. tank. Oops. Hate to learn those lessons twice. I live in Union Lake and work in East Ann Arbor (Plymouth road and Dixboro), so anyplace near there or between Ann Arbor and Canton would be optimal. I don't mind dropping off and picking up, but would like to hold on to the nicer small bottle since I paid the premium to buy it new a few years ago. Thanks in advance for any info. Regards, Joe Van Loon Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 06:10:54 -0500 (EST) From: "-s.alexander" <-s at adelphia.net> Subject: Re: dextrins/mouthfeel/body Aaron Martin Linder sez; > I have been told that if one dissolves dextrins in water and tastes the > solution it has little flavor, perhaps a very subtle effect in a beer at > best. However, is it really true that dextrins have no effect on > mouthfeel/body? Are body and mouthfeel the same thing in terms of > drinking a beer? Are they really measures of viscosity? It would be > interesting to have a method for analysis of mouthfeel, such as viscosity, > and test two beers mashed at different temps to see if they are different. Very good questions Aaron, and I have no direct answers. Dextrin has very little flavor - it is neither sweet enough to notice, nor does it 'taste' starchy. Completely unnoticeable to beer flavor I think. I have a disagreement with any attempt to directly equate viscosity and mouthfeel. Astringency is a clear example of a mouthfeel which is not related to viscosity. Viscosity is an aspect of mouthfeel but ... I have an open question to add to the heap - how do humans sense viscosity ? I doubt there is any very direct measure and perhaps it is a secondary variable - like surface tension that we actually sense. Obviously if you have maple syrup or a thick gravy there is enough viscosity to mechanically sense; but adding a fraction of 1% dextrins - I wonder what it is that we sense (if anything). There ale also some very strange changes in viscosity wrt %alc and it is entirely possible that dextrins in a beer *may* have a disproportionate impact on visocity, as compared to dexrtins in water. I agree that something is vey strange here and in need of a better explanation. -S in stockholm Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 12:40:15 +0000 From: Geoff Cooper <G.A.Cooper at greenwich.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Malt Color Assignments </lurk='off'> Hi folks, May I introduce myself. I usually respond to the name Geoff and for those who have been reading this digest for some time, yes I am the same Geoff Cooper who last sent a message back in 1994. I left the digest for some time - combined pressure of work and declining signal to noise ratio - but started reading again a few years back. I have found many interesting articles: thanks steve (-S), Fred, Frederick .. the list is long. But then up came one message where it looks like I can help. On 5 Feb 2007, at 04:00, Fred L Johnson wrote: > I'm still looking for the EBC method of mashing used to assign malt > color. Does anyone know if it, too, is 50 g grain/450 g total mash > weight? The copy of the Institute of Brewing's 'Recommended Methods of Analysis' that I have to hand is dated 1991 - so assign the appropriate level of doubt, methods will have been refined. The short answer is yes and no. The long answer is: Under "2.5 Colour" is says "Filtered wort is prepared from the test malt using IOB method 2.4 (Malt, Hot Water Extract)" Summary of 2.4: Grind the grist and adjust weight to 50 +/- 0.05g Add 360 +/- ml distilled water ... initial mash temperature of 65 +/- 0.2 oC Hold mash at 65 +/- 0.2 oC for exactly 1 hr. After 1 hour cool the mash to 20 +/- 0.5 oC and exactly 25 minutes from [after] the end of mashing, adjust the weight of the mash to 450g *Alternatively* transfer the cooled mash through a funnel ... make up the contents to 515 ml Filter Now returning to 2.5 Colour Colour values are always expressed as if the mash is made up to 515 ml. For 450 g mashes correct the colour to 515 ml using the formula: Colour (515 ml) = colour (450 g) x 0.8661/SG where SG is the specific gravity of wort from 450 g mash The use of a 'tintometer' is described using illuminant B of CIE As an aside: For Beer colour Colour (EBC units) = A x f x 25 where A = absorbance at 430 nm in 10mm cell f = dilution factor Hope that helps Geoff </lurk='on'> Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 13:18:57 +0000 From: "A.J deLange" <ajdel at cox.net> Subject: CO2 Pressure for Mild At 38F at sea level the volumes of gas dissolved in beer is Vols = 1.45 + 0.12*PSIG. Thus at the proposed pressure of 6 psig equilibrium would be at a little less than 2.17 volumes. This is above the amount of gas which would be dissolved in a cask conditioned ale stored at cellar temperature which has finished "working" and which has had the spile removed for serving. Equilibrium with 1 atmosphere of CO2 at 45F is about 1.3 volumes but ale served at that level of condition is traditionally served throuh a hand pump, perhaps through a sparkler, and it is that which puts the fine, creamy head on a pint. Poured through a conventional faucet you would have a pretty flat, unappetizing pint (muy opinion). So 6 psi at 38F is probably a good starting point but expect to have to experiment to get exactly the pour you want. Note that there are a couple of "ale faucets" on the market some of which have restrictor plates built in and some of which perturb the flowing beer in some other way in order to force the gas out of solution. You may or may not find these satisfactory. In my personal experience (never really liked the pours from the special faucets with the exception of a Guiness faucet) the best way to draw ale is through an engine. When using one of those approximately 1 atmosphere (0 psig) CO2 is about the right level. Personally I like a bit more condition and so keep the beer at 35F (way too cold but that's what my cooler is set for - I lager in there) in kegs with a couple (4-6) pounds of pressure on it. When I serve the beer I bleed the CO2 in the keg to atmospheric before opening the valve to the engine. As the beer is a little over conditioned there is a some breakout in the line but after the first pint or so this problem goes away. If you wanted to keep 1 atomosphere on a keg there is a device called a "rebreather" which is like the second stage of a SCUBA regulator. It passes gas on demand (like Le Petomaine) i.e. when the pressure in the keg drops because a pint is drawn it lets in enough CO2 at atmospheric pressure to replace it. As I noted above this is a little too lifeless for me but many people use them. A.J. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 10:06:07 -0500 From: Nathaniel Lansing <delbrew at compuserve.com> Subject: re: beer line question At 38 degrees 1.7ish volumes CO2 is 3 lbs gauge; about 1 foot of 1/16 ID. It with be easier to change the temperature rather than the physical set up. At 6 lb/2feet line bring the temperature to ~45F. That should pour happily, and a more suitable temperature for a "British type" dispense anyway. The problem lies mostly in the gauges when you at low pressures, the error becomes a larger part of the reading. So what reads 3 lb could maybe really be 4.5 or vice versa. I consider gauges a start point , then tweak to the proper pouring. Return to table of contents
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