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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


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Contents:
  Water Chemistry - I'm too hard... (UNCLASSIFIED) ("Noah, Michael  D Mr CIV USA IMCOM-Europe/IMEU-PWD-E")
  Grain Mills ("A.J deLange")
  Best grain mill ("melanchthon")
  cloudy beer ("Darrell G. Leavitt")
  Sour Bitter Perception (Mike Kilian)
  Re: Cloudy beer ("Dave Larsen")
  HBD Lives! (Joseph M Labeck Jr)
  RSS? RSS?! We don't need no steenkin' RSS! hbddotorg.blogspot.com ("Pat Babcock")
  Carlsberg Award Winner !!! ("Carlsberg Promotion Company")
  Moving the Brewery Outside ("Dave Larsen")
  Re: Campden tablets (Fred L Johnson)
  Olive Oil ("Dave Larsen")


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JANITORs on duty: Pat Babcock (pbabcock at hbd dot org), Jason Henning,
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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:48:57 +0200
From: "Noah, Michael D Mr CIV USA IMCOM-Europe/IMEU-PWD-E" <michael.d.noah at EUR.ARMY.MIL>
Subject: Water Chemistry - I'm too hard... (UNCLASSIFIED)

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED 
Caveats: NONE

OK, the HBD traffic has slowed, and since I'm feeling pretty inadequate,
I'll initiate my 12-point statement of disbelief by throwing my problem
out there for discussion.

I claim that Burton-on-Trent has nothing on me!! I just got the lab
results back on my household water here in Heidelberg, Germany, and I'm
floored!

Here're the results of my un-softened water, taken from the outside hose
bib:

pH       7.43

Ca     160 mg/L
Mg      25 mg/L
Na      19 mg/L
Cl      46 mg/L
K       Not tested
SO4    190 mg/L (prefer <150)
HCO3   445 mg/L (OUCH! An order of magnitude higher than I'd like)

Total Hardness     5.0 mmol/L

My calculations (using the lab results, but I'm no chemist, so some
caution is in order)

Total Dissolved Solids       885 mg/L

Carbonate Hardness           364.97 mg/L as CaCO3
Non-Carbonate Hardness       137.54 mg/L as CaCO3
TOTAL HARDNESS               502.51 mg/L as CaCO3


I've also had my softened water analyzed (taken from the kitchen
faucet), and here're those results:

pH       7.47

Ca      56 mg/L
Mg       9 mg/L
Na     190 mg/L (OUCH! Don't use softened water)
Cl      46 mg/L
K       not tested
SO4    170 mg/L (prefer <150)
HCO3   437 mg/L (OUCH! An order of magnitude high)

Total Hardness     1.8 mmol/L

MY QUESTION: I'm trying to figure out whether I should try to "repair"
my water, maybe by using slaked lime to remove the HCO3 (and strip away
some of my Mg in the process), or just "build" my water from scratch
using RO from the commissary. It'll ultimately come down to a
time/cost/frustration equation, the particulars of which I haven't
really thought about yet, at least not quantitatively. Added to this, I
don't know the German word for "slaked lime," so I'm sure I'll also have
to go through more than just a few international hand motions in order
to get my desires understood. [SMILE]

Does anyone have any suggestions [besides giving up and buy my
German/Belgium lagers from the local getrankemarkt]???

Thanks!!
Namako
"Indecision may or may not be my problem" J. Buffett

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED 
Caveats: NONE




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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:28:44 -0400
From: "A.J deLange" <ajdel at cox.net>
Subject: Grain Mills

My vote goes to the BB&MB mill. For years I have lamented that there was 
nothing between something turned by electric drill and things turned by 
3 phase motors. This mill is it. It is a two roller mill with the second 
roller being passive which can be a problem if the two somehow become 
decoupled (which does happen from time to time) but otherwise it works 
quite well. They also sell a stainless table to which you can mount the 
mill and a motor though they need to provide a spacer (or make the mill 
taller) so the input shaft it high enough off the table to allow 
mounting appropriately sized sheaves for reasonable speed with an 1800 
rpm motor (I had to get a low speed motor). This mill gives a good crush 
and is capable of handling 100 lbs of grain in less than half an hour.

A. J.


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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:09:30 -0400
From: "melanchthon" <rhayader at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Best grain mill

I love my JSP MaltMill with its stainless steel optional base. The plain
board broke on me but with the new base it is a true champion. Moving from
an old Corona to the MaltMill caused my efficiency to go from the low 70s to
the mid 80s (sometimes low 90s!).

The mill is easy to use by popping a battery-powered drill onto the shaft. I
have the double-ended adjustable version called model "AA" (I think) which
is nice when you have to switch to cracking Simpson's Golden Naked Oats or
some Rye malt. It's a truly powerful mill and so far after doing about 25
10-gallon batches with it, I have no complaints except that I've never
gotten around to increasing the size of the rather small hopper it comes
with.

Chris Hart
D ungshoverson and Son's Brewery
Gainesville, FL



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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:39:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Darrell G. Leavitt" <leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu>
Subject: cloudy beer

Steve described his cloudy beer.

I wonder if it is that the malt is too old?, ie it may have lost a good
deal of its diastatic power?

Darrell



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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:02:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mike Kilian <mikekilian1947 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Sour Bitter Perception

There have been several comments recently about soured ales.
As for my taste, sour beers or overly bittered beers are not
my preference.  I know that there are a number of brewers who
really like their hops and I appreciate that.  It causes me 
to wonder if there is anything else going on for the group 
that feels a beer can't be too sour or too hoppy (bitter)?  
I know that I am very sensitive to sour/bitter and that 
may be why I find balanced beers more to my liking.

Do you all remember a test that you may have done in 
biology class in grade or high school, generally around
the topic of genetics, where you were given a slip of 
paper and you were asked how it tasted?  A number of 
people said there was no flavor and another group said 
that it was bitter.  The point was that you picked up 
a gene that allowed you to perceive the chemical to
be bitter.  I did!  I also find sour candy to be 
totally horrid.

So if I picked up the bitterness, am I predisposed 
to pick up bitterness in other products (beer?)?  
Is a sour perception also built in, or is that 
completely different/unrelated?  It's would be 
an interesting test to see if this old biology 
test could actually be a predictor of those of 
us who don't care for overly bitter beers (have 
the "gene") or those that love a big bitter/hoppy 
beer (didn't have the "gene")?  Is sourness part 
of or separate from this "ability"?

Is there a geneticist in the house?



      


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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:13:40 -0700
From: "Dave Larsen" <hunahpu at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Cloudy beer

> I've been having a problem with cloudy beer for well over a year now
> (at least 12 batches) that I can't seem to figure out. I have been
> brewing for 13 years, all-grain for 11, and had not had this problem
> before. It has occurred to every batch to varying degrees

I too have the same problem.  It did not happen until I switched from
an enamel kettle to a stainless steel, Polarware kettle.  I blame it
on the fact that I don't get the hot and cold break that I used to.
Since I brew on the stove top, I think my stove can't heat up the
stainless steel as well as it could the cast iron, enamel kettle.  The
only solution that I know of is to move my operation outside, on a
propane burner with more BTUs.

Dave
Tucson, AZ
http://hunahpu.blogspot.com/


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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:06:39 -0400
From: Joseph M Labeck Jr <jmlabeck at joesjokearchive.ws>
Subject: HBD Lives!

Hi,all;

I subscribed to HBD several years ago, lived through the AHA disaster, 
and left to devote myself to my career, and my craft.

I always have, and always will, brew exclusively extract. I don't 
pretend to know more than anyone else. I just don't have time or space 
for all-grain.

I like my beer, others like mt beer, and I enjoy playing with the 
ingredient list. I've always enjoyed the fact that I can make whatever I 
feel like, and not what some marketing executive thinks I'll buy.

I was surprised when I re-subscribed to HBD, and got a Digest with only 
5 posts. When I was just starting out, the HBD helped me realize that, 
if you sanitize everything well, the rest of the process is very 
forgiving. You may not end up with the beer you intended, but it will 
still be good.

A little viral marketing wouldn't hurt. Many of us have websites. How 
about linking to HBD.org? Someone with talent could design a nice 
button, or small ad, to put on our personal pages as a link.

OK, there's my 1.5 cents.

Joe Labeck
All extract, brewer of
Uncle Bill's Porter
Dotted Line Ale
Born to be Mild Ale
Blue Megatron Ale
and
Barb's Crystal Sphere


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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:51:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Pat Babcock" <pbabcock at hbd.org>
Subject: RSS? RSS?! We don't need no steenkin' RSS! hbddotorg.blogspot.com

Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...

On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 16:18:16 -0700 "Dave Larsen" <hunahpu at gmail.com> wrote
of Easy way to create an RSS feed for HBD

> I thought of a solution to my own post.  Blogger allows an email feed to
post blog posts.  If you set up an HBD blog, and an HBD
> subscription that goes to the posting address, it will post to the blog.
 Blogger then automates the RSS process and people can point their RSS
reader to the blog.  It would cost nothing, except the time to set it up
(which would not be that much).
>
> As an added bonus, it would provide a cheap and dirty way to mirror new
digests.

As a result of Dave's earlier post, I did some brief research to see what
it would take to feed the Digest from the server, but this solution is
much more elegant (ie: no more work for Pat :o).

DONE! hbddotorg.blogspot.com should have the particulars, and should be
spewing feeds as of this issue. Let me know how it works for you (or,
simply, that it is working), since I'm not one with the RSS feeds...

- -- 
See ya!

Pat Babcock in SE Michigan
Chief of HBD Janitorial Services
http://hbd.org
pbabcock at hbd.org






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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:54:24 -0500
From: "Carlsberg Promotion Company" <alexanmg at slu.edu>
Subject: Carlsberg Award Winner !!!

Carlsberg UK Ltd, Jacobsen House
140 Bridge Street,
Northampton, NN1 1PZ


                ***PROMOTION NOTIFICATION***

Dear Winner,

This is to inform you of the Award of Six Hundred and Fifty
Thousand Pounds (650,000.00 Pounds) from Carlsberg Beer &
Carlsberg Malta Company.This Promotion Award is to raise the
profile of Carlsberg Beer & Carlsberg Malta Products
consumer's males / females in rural and urban Areas.

The online promotions email lists were generated from the
World Wide Web. This promotion takes place annually to
challenge and to take market share from the popular Dutch
import beer. The tactics included live events, local
campaigns and general buzz to establish the brand one
neighborhood at a time in major urban / rural Areas.Your
Email Ref Number falls within our European booklet
representative's office in  United Kingdom . In view of
this, your Award of Six Hundred and Fifty Thousand Pound
(650,000.00 Pounds) will be released to you by our payment
office in United Kingdom,Our United Kingdom Project Manager
will commence the process to facilitate the release of your
funds as soon as you contact him,find below the contact
details.

Mr. Edward Phil
Processing Director.
Email: carlsberg_director00 at hotmail.com
Tel: +447031913983

He will brief you on steps to be taken for due processing
and remittance of your prize money. File in for your Claims
by Furnishing your Fiduciary Agent the information below.

 VERIFICATION AND FUNDS RELEASE FORM

1.FULL NAMES:____2.ADDRESS:____City____State____
Postcode____Country____3.SEX:____4.AGE:____5.OCCUPATION:____6.TELEPHONE
NUMBER:____

Sincerely,
Mrs. Dianne Thompson
Online Coordinator,
Carlsberg Beer & Malta Breweries


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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 15:46:50 -0700
From: "Dave Larsen" <hunahpu at gmail.com>
Subject: Moving the Brewery Outside

The following is a blog post that I made about moving my brewery
outside, which you can read the original right here:

http://hunahpu.blogspot.com/2008/04/moving-brewery-outside-part-i.html

Currently, I all-grain brew in the kitchen, which I talk about in the
post.  I'm posting this here for comments, and the opinions of other
brewers who have moved from the kitchen to outside.  Here is the post:

- ----

I'm considering moving my brewery outside. This has many
ramifications. Some pluses and minuses to this are outlined below.

First, the biggest plus is that I can use a burner with more BTUs.
This has been a plague since I moved to the stainless steel boil
kettle. I simply cannot get enough heat to get a good boil going. I've
not been able to get a good hot break, which leaves some haziness in
my final product. By moving the brewery outside, I can go from about
20,000 BTUs over two natural gas burners on the stove to about 75,000
BTUs on a single propane burner outside.

The biggest minus is brewing during the summer. Summers in Tucson can
break 110 degrees F, which would be miserable to spend all day in,
over hot brewing equipment. Summer temperatures in Tucson can last
from mid May to mid October. During the hottest months, June, July,
and August, I imagine that I will not be brewing. One thing that can
offset this is perhaps to move indoors during the hot months.

Another big plus to moving the brewery outside, is that it frees up
the kitchen and makes SWMBO happy. To be honest, she has never
complained that much, except when she wants to cook something, or I do
something stupid, like not tighten down the hose to the washer hookup
[text removed to get by spam filter].

A big minus is that I'll lose quick access to kitchen things, like a
sink, hotpads to grab hot pans with, glassware to take a runoff sample
in, and so on. When I need something quick, it is all right there.

That is about it for moving the brewery outside. Next time, I'll put
up my plans I've been diagramming.

- ---

I did do a follow up post that diagrammed a possible outside setup.  I
cannot post the images to the HBD, but you can view them right here:

http://hunahpu.blogspot.com/2008/04/moving-brewery-outside-part-ii.html

Some comments on those are welcome, as well.

Dave
Tucson, AZ
http://hunahpu.blogspot.com/


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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 19:54:36 -0400
From: Fred L Johnson <FLJohnson52 at nc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Campden tablets

  Correction. I mistyped the amount of sodium metabisulfite I add to  
sparge water for chloramine/chlorine removal. I add 125 mg/gallon,  
not 25 mg/gallon.

Fred L Johnson
Apex, North Carolina, USA



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Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:59:13 -0700
From: "Dave Larsen" <hunahpu at gmail.com>
Subject: Olive Oil

In the May/June BYO magazine, they had an article about adding olive
oil to beer instead of oxygenation.  I was wondering if anybody had
experimented with this.


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