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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  RE:  Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels ("David Houseman")
  RE: Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels ("Keith Christian")
  bubbles, tiny bubbles ("Dave Burley")
  Re: Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels (stencil)


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Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2012 08:24:35 -0400
From: "David Houseman" <david.houseman at verizon.net>
Subject: RE:  Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels

Keith asks:

"Looking through past messages, I saw a reference to Ray Daniels  recipe
called the Perfect Pilsner. Does anyone have the recipe?  If you brewed it,
what are your thoughts?"

Like any recipe from someone I would look at this as a starting point and 
not expect that my result will be exactly what someone else brewed.  If 
Ray's pilsner is perfect, my version of this will not be an exact clone.  It 
could be "better" or "worse" but it won't be the same.  Why?  Even the most 
detailed recipe will not contain all the variables that affect the resulting 
beer.  The grain bill and hopping and mash schedules are great starting 
point, but water chemistry, mash tun and kettle composition and shape, the 
fermenter shape, rate of oxygenation, the amount, viability and cell count 
of the yeast and other factors were involved in the production of the 
original beer.   Your system will be different.  Not necessarily worse or 
better, but different.   So the beer will be different.   If you drink a 
beer you really, really like, you can make a beer that is close but it will 
be different.    So go for it, but just manage your own expectations and 
after you make this beer, modify the recipe to suite your own tastes and 
your system's performance.

David Houseman



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Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2012 07:35:46 -0700
From: "Keith Christian" <keithchristian at roadrunner.com>
Subject: RE: Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels

Yes David, excellent points.  I really should have clarified...  Over the
years many recipes had been shared in this forum.  Many I have tried and
enjoyed.  A great resource for sure. In my recipe collection and notes,
there were several references to Ray's Perfect Pilsner being a really good
beer.  I was interested in grain bill, hops, yeast, etc. as a starting
point.  

I am interested in brewing a beer with huge hop flavor and aroma.  I had a
pilsner around 2001 at a BJ's Brewery and I would like to make something
similar to it.  We had a Maltose Falcon's meeting at the brewery and the
brewers brought out their special reserves... It was so good that I never
forgot it. Sometimes I am reminded of that beer when I open a Sierra Nevada
Torpedo.  It is the balance of the alcohol, body, and hopping that I am
chasing.  I know the Torpedo is an IPA and not a pilsner,  But It brings
back my memory to that beer.

The beer probably had an SG of about 1060 to 1070 and a huge amount of Czech
Saaz.  It was almost like drinking Saaz.  It looked  , smelled, and tasted
great. For me, it was the Perfect Pilsner.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Keith

- -----Original Message-----
From: David Houseman [mailto:david.houseman at verizon.net] 
Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2012 5:25 AM
To: post at hbd.org; Keith Christian
Subject: RE: Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels

Keith asks:

"Looking through past messages, I saw a reference to Ray Daniels  recipe
called the Perfect Pilsner. Does anyone have the recipe?  If you brewed it,
what are your thoughts?"

Like any recipe from someone I would look at this as a starting point and
not expect that my result will be exactly what someone else brewed.  If
Ray's pilsner is perfect, my version of this will not be an exact clone.  It
could be "better" or "worse" but it won't be the same.  Why?  Even the most
detailed recipe will not contain all the variables that affect the resulting
beer.  The grain bill and hopping and mash schedules are great starting
point, but water chemistry, mash tun and kettle composition and shape, the
fermenter shape, rate of oxygenation, the amount, viability and cell count
of the yeast and other factors were involved in the production of the 
original beer.   Your system will be different.  Not necessarily worse or 
better, but different.   So the beer will be different.   If you drink a 
beer you really, really like, you can make a beer that is close but it will 
be different.    So go for it, but just manage your own expectations and 
after you make this beer, modify the recipe to suite your own tastes and
your system's performance.

David Houseman



Return to table of contents


Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2012 14:03:50 -0400
From: "Dave Burley" <Dave Burley at charter.net>
Subject: bubbles, tiny bubbles

David Huber.  I think the CO2 is already dissolved since the sugar is
dissolved, the enzymes in the yeast body are fully hydrated, so the CO2 never
leaves the solution. 

As the pressure builds the rate of change drops since the sugar is being
depleted.

Keep on Brewin',

Dave Burley

Return to table of contents


Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2012 23:26:44 -0400
From: stencil <etcs.ret at verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Perfect Pilsner by Ray Daniels

On Sat, 14 Apr 2012 00:16:43 -0400, 

in Homebrew Digest #5938 (April 13, 2012)

Keith Christian wrote:

>

>Looking through past messages, I saw a reference to Ray Daniels  recipe

>called the Perfect Pilsner. Does anyone have the recipe?  If you brewed it,

>what are your thoughts?

>

Haven't brewed it (not a Pilsner fan) but here's the recipe,

peached from 

<http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.brewing/browse_thread/thread/5bc0
1752d2f6c5a8/ead7a5e92a89c0c9%3Fq%3D%2522Alexander%2BSun%2522%23ead7a5e92a89c
0c9&ei=iGwTS6eaOpW8Qpmqic0O&sa=t&ct=res&cd=55&source=groups&usg=AFQjCNGq8lISi
o-ijCoGsnLjDl6boOP5yw?pli=1

  The All About Beer site itself doesn't seem to show any

response to a search for <perfect pilsner>.

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------

From: JS <jayceeessfouratfrontiernetdotnet>

Date: Jan 4 2007, 5:27 pm

Subject: Bohemian Pils Mash Temp

To: rec.crafts.brewing

RAY'S FAVORITE RECIPES

>From Brewing Editor Ray Daniels

Perfect Pilsner

I remember this recipe as the first of my beers to earn the

praise of

an established professional brewer. Looking at it now, I see

why! This

is a classic Bohemian pilsner recipe with darn near

everything done

right. It employs specialty malts with subtlety but goes

straight for

the heart with the Saaz hops. If you are mashing and have the

ability

to ferment at lager temperatures, you should definitely give

this one

a try.

Extract brewers may also enjoy this recipe by substituting 6

lbs of

Alexander's Sun Country Malt Extract for 8.5 pounds of the

two-row

malt.

O.G. 1.050

F.G. 1.015

Ingredients

10 lbs Two-row Malt (American or European)

0.75 lb Crystal malt - Light (10-40 deg L) German

0.25 lb Cara-Pils malt

0.375 lb Wheat malt

0.25 lb Munich malt

1.0 oz Saaz* (5.0% aa) - boiled 60 minutes

1.5 oz Saaz - boiled 30 minutes

0.5 oz Saaz - boiled 10 minutes

0.5 oz Saaz - boiled 5 minutes

1.5 oz Saaz - Dry hopped in Secondary Fermenter

* Given the amount of hops added to this recipe, you may want

to

select pellet rather than whole hops to reduce wort loss.

Also, if the

Saaz hops available to you are below 4% alpha acid, you

should select

another European-type hop with an alpha acid content near 5%

for the

first two hop additions. Try Hallertau, Hersbruck, Spalt,

Liberty,

Crystal, or Mt. Hood.

1 tsp Calcium chloride was used in mash water. Sparge water

was

acidified with food grade lactic acid.

Wyeast Munich Lager Yeast (2308) -- 2 packages in 2 quarts of

starter.

Irish Moss was used in the last 10 minutes of the boil.

Procedure

The mash for this beer included a protein rest at 130 deg F

(a bit

high) for 30 minutes and a saccharification rest at 154 deg F

for one

hour. If you can do a protein rest at 122 deg F or so, it's

not a bad

idea, but if you can't, don't let that stop you. Just do an

infusion

mash at 154 deg F and go from there. My mash water volume was

15

quarts (3.75 gallons) and the sparge water volume was 5

gallons.

Total boil time was 100 minutes, with the hop additions

beginning

after the first 40 minutes of the boil.

Fermentation was conducted at 45 to 48 degrees for five days

and then

raised to 55 to 58 degrees for another 10 days.

The dry hops were added during the lagering phase which was

four weeks

at 35 to 40 deg F.

============ end transcript ===========

gds,  stencil

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