HOMEBREW Digest #64 Wed 01 February 1989

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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

Contents:
  Liquid Yeast, Hops and Filtering (rogerl)
  Adding Dextrin or Lactose (lbr)
  Re: Filtering my Brew (lbr)
  Re: Liquid Yeast (lbr)
  Re: filtering beer (a.e.mossberg)
  AHA National Competition Rumors (Mike Fertsch)
  Duplicate Digests (rdg)
  hops, and the devil made me do it (Jeff Miller)
  Yeast, Competition (rdg)
  filtering beer (arthure)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 09:32:10 EST From: rogerl at Think.COM Subject: Liquid Yeast, Hops and Filtering From: Bryan Hilterbrand <bryanh%dadla.la.tek.com at RELAY.CS.NET> Subject: Liquid Yeast ... Did I do the right thing? Should I have let the yeast sit overnight, or would it have made a mess all over my counter? Any other do's and don'ts about using liquid yeast? You missed the line in the book about "Don't Worry". You did everything just fine. I don't think that envelope can "explode". Them buggers are really tough when it comes to containing starting microbeasties. What that package does is start the yeast multiplying, so that when you pitch there is sufficent activity to get the whole fermentation process going. This "starting" process is typically not needed for dry yeasts. Other liquid yeasts may not come with starter such as the one you used. In these cases you will need to make up a starter from malt and water. The package usually describes how to create the starter. The big thing here is sterilization. Everything has to be *REALLY* clean. Since liquid yeasts are typically purer strains, they can be affected by contamination easier. This is also why the package you used said to sanitize the outside of the envelope. You picked a great place to start, with liquid yeast et al. Just remember, Don't Worry, Relax,..... From: Pete Soper <soper at maxzilla.encore.com> Subject: bittering hops Is it true that flavor and aroma come only from hops added in the last few minutes of a boil and steeping andr dry hopping? Yes, this is one place where the finish of a brew comes from. Different hops add different flavors and aroma when added to steep or dry hopping. Some can be astringent and some can be quite sweet and flowery. Is it true that one hop type added for a LONG boil is going to add just the same thing as another hop - namely isomerized alpha acid? Yes, but the thing here is how much of a type of hop is being used to generate the amount of bitterness desired. To get the same level of bitterness with a hop that has an alpha level of 6, for instance, would reqire twice as much as a hop with an alpha level of 12. Why don't I just buy the most bitter hop I can find for this and be done with it? Maybe you don't want that much bittering in a given batch. Maybe you don't want the end product to be so astringent or sweet. Hopping can get to be a real art. And much of that art depends on personal tastes and style of brew you are creating. If you are trying to reproduce a particular style, typically you'll use a hop that is common to the area where the style of beer is from. So I guess what I'm saying is it isn't just the bittering quality of the hops that's used. I'm still learning about the nuances and subtleties. From: John F Stoffel <john%wpi.wpi.edu at RELAY.CS.NET> Subject: Filtering my Brew After drinking our first experimentaion in Home Brew (which came out Damm good in our estimentation), my frineds and I have come to the conclusion that filtering the beer just before we bottle it would do wonders. You might want to investigate finings. Geletin and polyclar are two that have been discussed quite abit in this forum. Another alternative is chilling the batch for 12 to 24 hrs. prior to bottleing. All of these things will help. Filtering requires quite a bit of hardware, ala two pressure tanks, appropriate sized filters, CO2 et cetera. My brewing budget is very modest and I find this additional equipment for filtering to get quite costly quite fast. I'd suggest trying the low tech solutions, finings, first before spending the big bucks. Cheers! Roger Locniskar Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 11:08:02 EST From: lbr at gatech.edu Subject: Adding Dextrin or Lactose >> I would like to add a bit of Dextrin (non-fermentable sugar) to my >> priming mix.... [Asks how much.] > From: hplabs!harvard!ima!wang7!klm I have used lactose (another unfermentable sugar) with success. As I recall, 1/4 cup was plenty. I would certainly use no more than 1/2 cup of dextrin powder- that will give the beer lots of body. Lactose (milk sugar) can give a saccahin taste if not used in moderation. It should be fine in small amounts in dark beers. It is traditionally used in "milk stout." Don't use this stuff to balance your Pilsner. I had some frustrating results in last year's competition, but I think - Len Reed Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 11:07:34 EST From: lbr at gatech.edu Subject: Re: Filtering my Brew From: Pete Soper <soper at maxzilla.encore.com> > Is it true that flavor and aroma come only from hops added in the last > few minutes of a boil and steeping andr dry hopping? Is it true that > one hop type added for a LONG boil is going to add just the same > thing as another hop - namely isomerized alpha acid? Yes, there are > all those evil hop oils that we want to blow away or rack away from, > but having blown or racked they've been left behind and so are not > part of what I'm asking about, right? > > What I'm getting at is whether it makes any sense to use one hop over > another for the START of a LONG minute boil. Why don't I just buy > the most bitter hop I can find for this and be done with it? > > Just to be absolutely clear, I'm asking about hops that are going > to be boiled for 90 minutes or more. I don't believe this is true. Yes, the isomerized alpha acid is the *main* result of a long boil, but the boil hops affect flavor as well. They don't seem to affect aroma. Your conclusions are valid for bitter, dark beers. But I used nothing but Saaz in my Pilsner. Experiments with Eroica (a high alpha acid variety) were unsatisfactory. - Len Reed Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 11:08:55 EST From: lbr at gatech.edu Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast > I have a question about [liquid] yeast... At the > top of the instructions, they said that the packet would require one to > five days before the culture would be ready to pitch, and they went on > to say that it would take one day plus one day per month since the date > shown on the package (it showed Jan. 3, 1989). Later in the instruc- > tions, they said to wait until the package had expanded to at least one > inch thick.... > What happened is this: at about 1:00pm I broke the nutrient packet, and > I started boiling the wort, etc. at about the same time figuring that I > would let the stuff in the carboy cool down overnight before I pitched > the yeast (the package said at least one day to culture the yeast...). > About 11:00pm that night, I went into the kitchen, and the yeast package > was ballooned to about two inches thick. I was afraid if I let it sit > there overnight that it would blow up, so I pitched the yeast right > then. The carboy was cool to my touch (cool enough to pitch the yeast), > so I figured the worst that could happen is that it would take a little > longer for the fermentation to start. > Did I do the right thing? Should I have let the yeast sit overnight, or > would it have made a mess all over my counter? Any other do's and > don'ts about using liquid yeast? Yes, you're fine. I have found that Wyeast cultures, especially the ale cultures, typically swell up sooner than the package indicates they will. I put these things into a starter jug several days before the brewing session to get a vigorous fermentation going. (I use sterile canned wort for starters; see Dave Miller's zymurgy article last year.) I suggest using a sterilized thermometer before pitching. 110 def F will kill yeast. I force cool my wort; this is absolutely required when brewing from grain. When using extract it's not nearly as important but you do risk infection while the wort is sitting. - Len Reed Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 11:36:29 EDT From: a.e.mossberg <aem at mthvax.miami.edu> Subject: Re: filtering beer In Hombrew #63, John F Stoffel asks about filtering beer: | One, will filtering reduce the amount of fermetation that |takes place in the bottle? Does filtering have a signifigant impact |on the beer itself? Or is having all the yeast settled on the bottom |part of the joys of homebrew? How many of you out there filter YOUR |beer? Commercial beer is filtered. Commercial beer is pumped with CO2. If you filter, most, if not all, of the yeast will be removed, depending on how fine a filter you use. If you remove the dead yeast, you will remove the live yeast, and not get any carbonation. The only way you can, as a home- brewer, filter your beer and then have carbonated beer is to filter it into a keg, which you pressurize. aem -- a.e.mossberg aem at mthvax.miami.edu MIAVAX::AEM (Span) aem at umiami.BITNET (soon) Now, for the first time, Nicaragua has a government that cares for its people. - Jose Figueres, ex-president Costa Rica Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 09:24 EST From: Mike Fertsch <hplabs!uiucdcs!meccad.RAY.COM!FERTSCH> Subject: AHA National Competition Rumors This year's AHA Conference and Competition will be held in Fort Mitchell, KY during the week of June 7-10. I've been told that the logistics for the competition will be different from previous years. Here's what I heard: The AHA will request one (maybe two) bottles of each entry to be sent to Boulder, CO for first round judging. The purpose of first-round judging is to narrow the field to those which are good enough for second and final judging. Local Boulder-area judges will do the first-round judging. The brewers of the first-round survivors will be asked to send two more bottles directly to Fort Mitchell for best-of-class and best-of-show judging. These categories will be judged by certified judges during the national conference. The awards ceremony will take place at the end of the conference. Please note that the AHA has not announced dates or confirmed these rumors (you still out there, Jim Homer???). Looking at my calendar, I come up with a few dates. If final round judging will be in Kentucky on June 7, the final round beers should be there no later than June 1. The AHA better inform the first round survivors no later than May 18. First round judging will probably begin April 24. First round entries should be in Boulder by April 17, so plan on sending them no later than April 10. You better get brewing folks! Again, I stress that these are just rumors!!!! Formal announcement should be coming soon from AHA. The AHA may decide on a totally different format from what I described! The logistics of shipping competition beers are not too bad. UPS does a good job of sending beer; just package it well. I send my entries second-day air. UPS is generally NOT allowed to ship alcoholic beverages; they ARE allowed to send beer for research, or formal evaluation. It is legal to send beers to a competition. As a practical matter, is is better to stretch the truth and describe the package as "non-perishable food". I've had no problems with my non-perishable food. mike fertsch Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 01 Feb 89 10:33:38 MST From: rdg at hpfcmi Subject: Duplicate Digests Full-Name: Rob Gardner I am aware of the problem some people have been having concering duplicates. If you have been receiving duplicates of the homebrew digest, please answer the following questions to help me figure out the problem: 1. Do you *always* get duplicates, or just sometimes? 2. Are the duplicates complete digests, or is one of them truncated? (The last line should say something like "End of Homebrew Digest".) 3. What machine appears to be doing the duplicating? Most headers I have seen so far point to hp-sde (sde.hp.com). If you can't tell, send me headers. Please do not reply to "homebrew" - send all your info to homebrew-request. Also, once you have told me you are having the problem, please do not send mail saying that you're still having the problem, since the volume of complaints is getting rather high. Do let me know if there is some change, ie, you stop getting duplicates, or you start getting 7 of them, etc. Once again, I apologize for the inconvenience of getting two copies of the digest, but it's better than none, right? Please bear with the problem for now, just delete the extra copy, and hopefully we'll have it fixed soon. Rob Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 10:39:50 CDT From: Jeff Miller <jmiller at unix.eta.com> Subject: hops, and the devil made me do it I have two submissions today. First to answer some of Pete's questions about boiling hops with my own impressions. It is true that the esters responsible for aroma get reduced the longer you boil your hops but there are other flavors in the hops besides these. I have experienced different results based on different types of boiling hops (useing everything from saaz to chinook) and fell that if you really have an idea in mind for your beer you can fine tune the taste based on the type of hops you choose for the boil as well as the finish. I have also heard lots of talk about hopping multiple times at different times of the boil to create some really complex tastes. I have also heard rumors of how some commercial brewers are getting away from doing much with boiling hops because of costs in both labor and materials. If this is the case it will make our homebrew all that more attractive. Now, the devil made me do it! I brewed a light pilsner using a four pound can of Williams about 2 weeks ago. I had a bad day and it continued right on through the brew. I burned myself twice and blew up a glass fermenter because I was being to lazy to clean the wort chiller. I did save almost 4 gallons and bottled it last night. I kegged 3.87 gallons in a pony (and no I didn't wax it so I'll probably get Alzheimers) and then I had to deal with 5 more bottles of beer. The thing is that I primed the keg at a known rate but I had no idea as to an appropriate primeing rate for a 5 bottles? I decided to prime with 1/4 tsp dextrose (nope, didn't boil it either, just added it) per bottle. I'm not really concerned over all the "short steps" I took on this brew and of course hope that it turns out. Anybody out there ever prime on a per bottle basis like this? Anybody got any ideas if my bottles will be flat or explode? Well, well, I guess I'll just have to relax and wait a number of weeks to get the answers. Jeff (jmiller at eta.com) Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 01 Feb 89 14:16:00 MST From: rdg at hpfcmi Subject: Yeast, Competition Full-Name: Rob Gardner > From: Bryan Hilterbrand <bryanh%dadla.la.tek.com at RELAY.CS.NET> > About 11:00pm that night, I went into the kitchen, and the yeast package > was ballooned to about two inches thick. I was afraid if I let it sit > there overnight that it would blow up, so I pitched the yeast right > then. The carboy was cool to my touch (cool enough to pitch the yeast), > so I figured the worst that could happen is that it would take a little > longer for the fermentation to start. > Did I do the right thing? Should I have let the yeast sit overnight, or > would it have made a mess all over my counter? Any other do's and > don'ts about using liquid yeast? You did the right thing. Some hints: 1. Start the yeast much further in advance. Yes, it will probably start in a few hours, but if it happens to take 2 days, then your cool wort is in grave danger. If the package has expanded before you are ready to brew, you can refridgerate it, or see #2... 2. Culture the liquid yeast to a higher volume before pitching it. I have found that the amount of yeast in those little packets is minimal, so I pitch it into a gallon jug with some sterile starter solution, and let that grow for a few days. When I have pitched the foil pouches directly, there was an alarming delay before signs of fermentation were visible. Pitching a large starter has reduced that "lag phase" quite a bit. > From: Jeff Miller <jmiller at unix.eta.com> > Rob, you were talking about the AHA competition and I was wondering how > one goes about getting entered in it. Do you have to actually go there? > I know that the US Mail and UPS people don't like shipping alcohol so I > assume you can't really mail it there. Anyway, I would sure like to have > my beer judged on a national scale rather then just the local county fair > so I would appreciate any information anyone might have about getting > entered. The Spring (or thereabouts) issue of Zymurgy usually has complete instructions, rules, categories, etc. for entering the national competition. Yes, you can ship your homebrew entries to them! They tell you how to do this- basically you have to wrap them a certain way, etc. What, you say you don't get Zymurgy, and you're not an AHA member? Well...immediately send $21 to: American Homebrewers Association PO Box 287 Boulder, CO 80306 Or call 303-447-0816 and charge it. > From: John F Stoffel <john%wpi.wpi.edu at RELAY.CS.NET> > Also, what is the address of this National brew competition? Well, you usually have to get your beer to the AHA headquarters in Boulder, but this year I'm not sure what's going to happen. The Great American Beer Festival etc will be in Kentucky this year for some arcane reason (:-) so the competition might be also, though I hope not. (I wouldn't want to have to mail in *my* competition entries! ;-) > And what are the requirements to enter? In a nutshell: For each brew you want to enter, you send in $6 (more for non-members) along with 3 bottles of your brew. The bottles must be standard 12oz bottles, with no labels or other identification marks on them. You also send in the recipe used, the name of the brew, and what category it is being entered in. After the competition, you'll receive your score sheets within several weeks. Rob Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 89 13:23:57 -0800 From: sco!arthure at ucscc.UCSC.EDU Subject: filtering beer Yeast are tiny little buggers. Filtering yeast out of your beer is kind of like trying to sweep ants ... To remove yeast from your beer, you'd need to use a really fine ceramic filter ... And that would probably all of your yeast, preventing bottle conditioning. Other people in this newgroups have mentioned some solutions to the problem of excess precipitated yeast, like finings, chilling the beer before racking, patience ... -arthur Return to table of contents
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