FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Glass and temp (dbreiden)
  "Student's" Brewery (Sean J. Caron)
  Snail Trail Pale Ale (joshua.grosse)
  Thanks and another request ("ROBERT W. HOSTETLER")
  Re: Freezing hops
  Infected batch  (Gordon Baldwin)
  Homebrew Club Liability (Gary Braswell)
  Home Brew Browser (KIERAN O'CONNOR)
  Re:  Homebrew Digest #823 (February 13, 1992) (Steve Pierce)
  Liquid Yeast Age / Freezing Hops (Darren Evans-Young)
  UPS and shipping Alcohol (Bob_Konigsberg)
  dispensing pressure (donald oconnor)
  Using spent grains for making bread (312)266-3235 <krm at hermes.dlogics.com>
  Storing Wyeast (C.R. Saikley)
  Dry Hopping (Darren Evans-Young)
  Philadelphia Brew Pubs (Todd Breslow)
  Wyeast shelf life (chris campanelli)
  Hazel-Nuts in Beer -UPDATE- (Lee J. Slezak)


Send submissions to homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
Send requests to homebrew-request@ hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
[Please do not send me requests for back issues!]
Archives are available from netlib at mthvax.cs.miami.edu


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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 08:37:42 -0500
From: dbreiden at mentor.cc.purdue.edu
Subject: Glass and temp

Here's a question for all you who know more about the physics of
glass:

Is glass more likely to break from the thermal shock of hot -> cold
or from the shock of cold -> hot.

Seems I can boil boiling water in a room temp glass bottle with no problem.
But last year when I put my carboy in a snow bank (yeah, it was warm, but
not HOT HOT DAMN HOT), I returned to the earth what the earth had given
me -- and kissed a carboy good bye.

So my personal experience seems to indicate that glass can handle cold->hot
better than hot->cold.

Support?  Refutation?  Explanation?
Thanks,
- --Danny

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 09:16:11 EST
From: Sean J. Caron <CARONS at TBOSCH.dnet.ge.com>
Subject: "Student's" Brewery



sure it was guinness. i guess that means all you T-testers out there
(you know who you are) owe your jobs to the famout stout.

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Date: Thursday, 13 February 1992 10:33am ET
From: joshua.grosse at amail.amdahl.com
Subject: Snail Trail Pale Ale


I've been busy trying to make the perfect IPA.  Here's my latest
recipe.

9  lbs Pale Malt
3/4 lb Crystal Malt
1/2 lb Carapils Malt
1.5 oz (4.9%) Kent Goldings (60 Minutes)
1.5 oz (4.9%) Kent Goldings (15 Minutes)
1/4 oz        Kent Goldings (dry)
1 tsp Irish Moss (15 Minutes)
2 tsp Gypsum
2 oz Oak Chips
Wyeast 1059 American Ale

Mash Pale malt at 153 F for 30-60 minutes.  Test after 30 minutes.  Add
Crystal and Carapils and mash-out at 168 F for 10 minutes.  Sparge.
Bring to boil.  In a saucepan, boil the oak for no more than  10 minutes,
then strain the liquid into your boiling kettle. Boil the wort,
adding boiling hops after 30 minutes and the flavor hops and Irish Moss
after 75 minutes.  Chill and pitch a quart of 1059 starter.

Dry hop in the secondary fermenter.  The beer will clear in the bottle.

Primary: 7 days
Secondary: 5 days
Original Gravity: 1.056
Terminal Gravity: 1.022  (I like beers with body)

- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Josh Grosse                                jdg00 at amail.amdahl.com
Amdahl Corp.                               313-358-4440
Southfield, Michigan

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Date: 13 Feb 92 10:36:00 CST
From: "ROBERT W. HOSTETLER" <8220rwh at INDINPLS.NAVY.MIL>
Subject: Thanks and another request


Thanks for all of the advice and recipes that I've gotten so far. A buddy
from work and I are going to spend our federal holiday trying out our 
first batch.

The new request: With all of the talk of home cultures, can someone tell me
how to make a sourdough starter?

Bob Hostetler					8220rwh at indy.navy.mil

More hobbies than one man should be allowed.


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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 11:01:59 -0500
From: bickham at msc2.msc.cornell.edu (Scott Bickham)

Subject: Re: Freezing hops

	This topic is discussed in an article by Pfenninger et. al. in the book
 "Brewing Science", ed. by Pollack, Academic Press (1979).
	They compare the composition of Brewers Gold hops that were kept
for 10 days in either the absence of air at 32F or a paper bag at 68F.  The
composition of the hops stored in the absence of air did not significantly
change, however the alpha acid content of the bagged hops dropped from
7.9% to 6.6%, while the beta acid content went from 8.1% to 7.3%.  The
total oil (% dry basis) dropped from 1.98 all the way down to 0.78.
	I'm by no means an expert in this area, but based on this, I would
definitely recommend storing hops in an airtight container in your freezer.
	BTW, "in the absence of air" means in the absence of oxygen, not 
necessarily in a vacuum.

Scott Bickham  (a physicist trying to become a biochemist)




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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 8:08:59 PST
From: Gordon Baldwin <hpubvwa.nsr.hp.com!sherpa2!gbaldwin>
Subject: Infected batch 

Well after 66 batches over 5 years it looks like I've lost my first
batch. After aging my last batch of lager for 2 weeks the beer has
little white dots floating on the surface in the bottles, and there is a
ring around the inside of the neck. I havn't tasted it yet, but I am
assuming that it is ready to be used to water the plants. 

I am trying to determine the souce of this. I am not overly anal about 
sanitation, but every thing I use to brew with gets a rinse of clorine. 
The bottles were soaked overnight in a TSP solution, then run through the 
rinse and dry cycle in the dishwasher. The one abnormality was during the
fermentation. This is an all grain brew 8 lb klages, 1/2 lb crystal, 1/2
lb dextrin, 1 oz cascade flavoring, 1 oz saaz finishing, 2 packs Red
Star lager yeast. I do primary in a bucket then transfer to a glass
carboy for secondary. When I transfer to the secondary my all grain
brews usually only have a little cloudyness, this time it looked like
industrial sluge. Could I have gotten a bad batch of yeast? I have had
very good luck in the past with Red Star Lager. ( I agree that Red Star
Ale is no good). The fermentation usually takes less than a week, but
this batch took close to 3 weeks.

Gordon Baldwin
ELDEC Corp
sherpa2!gbaldwin at sunup.west.sun.com
 ...!hpubvwa!sherpa2!gbaldwin


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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 9:03:36 CST
From: ingr!b11!rocker!gary at uunet.UU.NET (Gary Braswell)
Subject: Homebrew Club Liability


	John Polstra writes:

"A better bet would be to establish a club culture (no, not yeast) in
which Mr. I. C. M. would absolutely *not* be permitted to drive himself
home."

	I like this idea.  I mean, maybe I'm sounding a little old-fashioned,
	but at fraternity parties or office parties I used to go to, if someone
	partook of considerably more than his/her body could handle,
	the host either INSISTED that he/she spend the night at the place of 
	residence of where the party was at, or that a reasonably sober
	person took them home.  Generally, I elected just crash out on the
	floor.

	That may be unreasonable for the really large home-brewing clubs,
	but for smaller ones, this could be an understood 'bylaw'.

- --------------------
Gary Braswell
gary at rocker.b11.ingr.com

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1992 11:37 EDT
From: KIERAN O'CONNOR <OCONNOR%SNYCORVA.bitnet at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Subject: Home Brew Browser

HBD'ers,

I sent out the Home Brew Browser to anyone who requested it.  If you
are intersted in getting one, please e-mailme with the subject line "I
want my HBD!"

Whats the HBD Browser?  Its a Macitosh HyperCard stack that lets you
import the HBD and read them on your mac.  It separates the message
headers in the HBD and the messages so you click on the message
header, and bingo, the message pops{up.

OK.  Will someone please tell me how to put this in the archive?  I
can't ftp.  Perhaps someone who I sent a copy to?

Kieran

oconnor at snycorva.bitnet

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 11:29:27 EST
From: steve at rtfm.mlb.fl.us (Steve Pierce)
Subject: Re:  Homebrew Digest #823 (February 13, 1992)



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Date:         Thu, 13 Feb 92 11:28:36 CST
From: Darren Evans-Young <DARREN at UA1VM.UA.EDU>
Subject:      Liquid Yeast Age / Freezing Hops


Liquid Yeast Culturing:

On Wed, 12 Feb 92 11:20 CST, Robert Spangle said:
>I would like to start my own yeast culturing, but I do not know where
>to start.  I know there are many different strains, but what do you
>like out there?  How do I get some?  Mail order?  Local brew shops?
>Can anyone think of a good book or reference manual about culturing?
>
      Call 1-800-742-2110 and ask him to send you a catalog.

      The Yeast Culture Kit Company
      6005 Mustang Place
      Riverdale, MD 20737

Freezing hops:

I keep all my hops in the freezer. I have not noticed any problems.

Age of Liquid Yeast:

I popped a package of Bavarian Lager 2 weeks ago dated 07/30 (1991).
Puffed up just fine.  It'll take a little longer to puff (2 days), but should
do ok. I keep my yeast in the fridge.

Darren

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 09:58 PST
From: Bob_Konigsberg at 3mail.3com.com
Subject: UPS and shipping Alcohol

Well, first off, my apologies for not checking both sides of the story.  
I've now rechecked with several (3) UPS people who tell me that I was 
badly misinformed by my first contact, and who tell a consistent story.

Here are the rules for UPS shipping counters.

Alcoholic beverages may only be sent to and from the following four 
states: California, Colorado, Oregon, and New Mexico.  UPS is not 
supposed to accept alcohol to or from any other states.

Exception: Alcoholic beverages may be shipped to a laboratory for 
analysis, as long as no one will consume them.

Alcoholic beverages may NOT be shipped by air, they must go by ground 
transport.

UPS Agents such as Mail Boxes Etc. can pretty much do as they please in 
refusing anything, but are supposed to adhere to the UPS guidelines.
In other words, they can refuse (in CA, CO, OR or NM where it's ok by 
UPS), and there's not a lot UPS can do about it.  If a UPS counter 
person refuses, AND the package is both TO AND FROM one of the four 
states, you can complain to management and get results.

The other states represent a patchwork of laws, and UPS doesn't want to 
spend the time and money figuring out what's legal where, and so just 
refuses to deal with the matter.


BobK



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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 12:05:59 -0600
From: oconnor at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (donald oconnor)
Subject: dispensing pressure

Bob Jones inquired about dispensing pressure for soda kegs of beer.
The uncertainties he refers to are centered around a general 
misunderstanding of dispensing pressure and carbonation level or
soda keg pressure.  The dispensing pressure is not the same as the
keg pressure because of the resistant to flow in the dispensing
tubing.  You generally want the keg pressure to be about 10 psi
in order to have properly carbonated beer.  A dispensing pressure
anywhere near this will cause excessive foaming.  The solution
is to use a long dispensing tube.  1/4" vinyl tubing will drop
the pressure about 1 psi per foot.  So if you use 6' of tubing and
set the tank pressure to 10 psi, the dispensing pressure will be
about 4 psi which will cause much less foaming.  The length of
tubing that each individual wants will depend upon a number of 
parameters such as the individuals desired carbonation level,
temperature of the beer, and amount of foam desired.  

There is no difference in the taste of naturally carbonated beer
and beer force carbonated with a gas tank.  CO2 has no memory of
whence it came.  If you use dry malt to prime however, there will
be a slight change in the beer due to the unfermentable sugars
(about 1/3 of the weight).

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1992 14:25:45 CST
From: Kevin Mayes (312)266-3235 <krm at hermes.dlogics.com>
Subject: Using spent grains for making bread

Stephen Mahan asks if anyone has had any experience using crystal malt in
making bread.  While I have never done this, I have had some bread that was
made by the Berghoff brewery here in Chicago.  They make fresh bread using
their spent grains and it turns out really good.  At $4 a small loaf though,
it's pretty expensive.  Especially when you realize that the grains would
otherwise be worthless to them at that point.

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 13:02:43 PST
From: grumpy!cr at uunet.UU.NET (C.R. Saikley)
Subject: Storing Wyeast

From: YATROU at INRS-TELECOM.UQUEBEC.CA (Paul Yatrou)

>My question is how long should I expect the yeast to last (two
>of them are dated Dec. 19 and the other three are Jan. 21)?
>Is three months pushing it? 

I had a surprising experience recently along these lines. I moved at
the end of January, and in the process of cleaning out the fridge I
found an old package of Wyeast hiding back there. I don't recall which
strain it was, but it was dated June 1990. As I was about to throw it 
out, an idea struck me.....

So I popped the package, not really expecting anything to happen to my
1 1/2 year old yeast. Much to my surprise, in 2 days the package was all
puffed up and ready to go. Because of the move, brewing wasn't an option,
so I had to be content tasting the wort from the package. It was yeasty,
but clean.

I'd never recommend storing Wyeast for this long intentionally, but my
experience is a testimony to the fine work done by those folks. Now, if
they'd just fix those damned packages.......

CR

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Date:         Thu, 13 Feb 92 14:48:17 CST
From: Darren Evans-Young <DARREN at UA1VM.UA.EDU>
Subject:      Dry Hopping

I've dry hopped a pilsner, per Miller's Continental Pilsner book, with
1.25 oz of Saaz pellets. All of the hops have now floated to the top
and kinda formed a cap.  Should I stir the hops into the beer?
Will the hops eventually sink?  I feel like the hops should be better
mixed in with the beer. It's in the secondary right now.

Darren

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Date:         Thu, 13 Feb 92 18:53:13 EST
From: Todd Breslow <V5149U%TEMPLEVM at VM.TEMPLE.EDU>
Subject:      Philadelphia Brew Pubs


I'm new to HBD but wanted to first say how jealous I am that you have
all those brew pubs on the west coast because here in Philadelphia
we have a grand total of two, if you drive out to Lancaster in the
Amish country there is another one, but it's a microbrewery and not
a brew pub in the true sense. If there is anyone out there from
Philadelphia or the area please drop me a line -- it would be nice
to know.
Dock Street Brew Pub
22nd and Cherry Streets (not exact address, if it matters send me mail)
They have typically six beers on tap on any given night, and the quality
is generally very very high. The place is huge and very very expensive
($3.50 for a small 10oz beer or higher for a cask conditioned ale) and
it is a very corporate environment (ie, people in suites with expense accounts
etc..)
Sam Adams Brew Pub
15th and Samson Streets (again, not exact. This is off the top of my head)
smaller, more intimate, cheaper. 45 bbl capacity (3 tanks of 15 bbl).
The beer is good, but not exceptional.
Thanks,
Tod Breslow

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 17:43 CST
From: akcs.chrisc at vpnet.chi.il.us (chris campanelli)
Subject: Wyeast shelf life

To Paul Yatrou:

I punched a Wyeast packet that was 9 months old (thats right, N-I-N-E
months old).  The yeast came out just fine.  I obviously had disregard
the old "one extra day for every month past the stamped date".  The yeast
in question was a Bavarian Lager.  I punched it on a Wednesday night and
by Friday morning it was ready to be fed.  I gave it a quart of sterile
wort to build up (ala Dave Miller) the count and by Saturday afternoon me
and my merry little friends were ready to go to work.  Beer turned out
just fine.      
              -  Chris

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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 92 19:27:20 -0800
From: Lee J. Slezak <slezakl at atlantis.CS.ORST.EDU>
Subject: Hazel-Nuts in Beer -UPDATE-

The following is referring to an earlier post about the use of Hazel-Nuts
in beer and bottling.  As stated previously I have a batch of dark brown
ale fermenting away in my carboy that had about 1/4 cup roasted hazel nuts
addded to the boiling wort for about 25 minutes.....

Thanks to all who responded to my previous post.  Basically most everyone
seemed pretty excited about the idea, but everyone was quite concerned about
head retention, as am I.  In search of a deep rich head I treked to my local
homebrew store looking for help.  What I found was a small package of what is
called "Heading Mix" (a mix of dextrose and gum arabic).  Has anyone ever used
this stuff before?  Is it something I should consider using, I dont even 
know if I was supposed to use it in the boil or what.  The only thing on
the package besides the name and ingredients said to: "stir contents of
package (1 ounce) into one pint of cold water.  Mix thoroughly, for best
results use a wisk or electric mixer."  When though?  Before bottling?
I need some more help here - should I use this stuff or just take a $.75 loss
I am not too concerned about the cost - just the quality if my beer...

Thanks again and Happy Brewing!

Lee J. Slezak


P.S.	What is gum arabic?

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #824, 02/14/92