FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  supplies/wyeast 2112 (Glenn Anderson)
  Flames (Wally L. Blume)
  malt, subjective reading (Jack Schmidling)
  Database of contacts to homebrew clubs (Stephen Russell)
  Taste Midwest/Madison (chris campanelli)
  Sanity, fun, and hops (Ed Westemeier)
  Yeast Culture (Jack Schmidling)
  Wort Chiller - help requested (Stefan Karlsson)
  Recipe for Fullers ESB wanted (Andy Phillips)
  hbd post (cl7841s)
  Plum Wine (Thomas Kellogg)
  Thanks (James Dipalma)
  making labels stick ("Spencer W. Thomas")
  Fast fermentation (andre vignos)
  Canadian Beers (Philip A. Webster)
  Root beer (PEPKE)
  Re: Great Western Malting closes retail outlet in Corning, CA (Kevin L. McBride)
  stir mash? (Russ Gelinas)
  Siphon Woes (Chris Goedde)
  Re: Coffeemaker Mashtun (Hal Laurent  at  MEL)
  Help with Basement Brewery Layout (Roger McPherson) (Roger McPherson)
  Homebrew Digest #945 (August 11, 1992) (Laura Conrad)
  Yeast Questions (Ruth Mazo Karras)
  Coffee makers & Stars (Jeff Frane)


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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 	Tue, 11 Aug 1992 20:00:00 -0400
From: Glenn Anderson <glenn.anderson at canrem.com>
Subject: supplies/wyeast 2112



Could anyone give me the name and number of any Brewing Supply shops
in Chicago or the Chicago area that I can mail order supplies from.
Please e-mail to glenn.anderson at canrem.com

On another note, has anyone had any negative experiances with
Wyeast 2112? I recently made a batch of dark steam beer that stuck at
1.030 and then turned into brown infected liquid. The first 2 or3
days of fermentation looked good, big foamy krauesen then all stopped. I
was fermenting at around 50 Degrees F. Could this be too cool for the
2112?

I had no fermentation for 3 weeks, then nasty critters started at the
wort. The whole batch shot down the drain last night.

I've made alot of beer and this is my first infection. I've used
Wyeast products and have never had a problem, other than the seams of
the package breaking when I whacked it.

Thanks.....GA
- ---
 þ DeLuxeý 1.21 #11377 þ Brewer fails CRC - More bottles than caps
- --
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario/Detroit, MI
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044

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Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 00:29:11 -0400
From: cd651 at cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Wally L. Blume)
Subject: Flames



From: jeg at sangabriel.desktalk.com (John E. Greene)

>I think the "problem" is that people think that everyone brews for the
>same reason. They can't imagine anyone not having the same motivation for
>brewing.  Some people brew to accurately reproduce specific styles, some
>people brew to make a beer they enjoy drinking, some people brew because
>they like the brewing process.  Each of these people will have a different
>way that is right for them or works for them. Now, it seems, that one has
>risk public ridicule if they post their experiences even though it may not
>be 'technically' correct.  I, like many, feel it's not worth it.  I get
>enough of that crap at work and my brewing is intended to help me relax
>from that.
 
  Very well put, I only recently started getting the HBD, and when I
  first read it I was mystified at how some readers would take offense
  at someone doing something that was not technically motivated. 
  I learned brewing from two old men, namely my grandfathers, they both
  did things differently and they both produced very good beers. And
  each had it's own flavor. Most of my equipment is homemade, and the
  techniques I use are pretty old (and abstract at times) but I
  wouldn't dare post them here for fear of getting flamed by a "techy"
  saying my hydrometer reading was all wrong or I used the wrong temp.
  and therefore my beer could not possibly be worth drinking and I must
  be an idiot for doing something like that.

  If I wanted a scientifically produced beer, using standard equipment
  and a standard yeast using a precisely determined temperature with 
  a predetermined exact amount and type of sugar...I'd go buy a Bud.

- --
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
   /   / __  /  /     |         Wally Blume         |"God does not play dice
  /   / _ / /  / /_/  |      Internet address:      |  with the universe."
 /_/_/ /_/ /  / __/   | cd651 at cleveland.freenet.edu | -- Albert Einstein

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Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 11:59 CDT
From: arf at ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: malt, subjective reading

 
 To: Homebrew Digest
 Fm: Jack Schmidling
 
 >From: brians <brians_+a_neripo_+lbrians+r%NERI at mcimail.com>
 >Subject: Bulk Malt Prices
  
 >      I have seen people quote obscenely low prices for buying malt in bulk
        on the digest. 
 
 Not sure .55/lb is obscene but that is what I pay for it from
 Minnesota Malting in 25 bags plus UPS shipping.
 Contact is Bob Jensen (507) 263 3911.
 
 Someone just recently mentioned something about half that price but I let it 
 pass.  I insist on indirectly kilned malt and I doubt that the real cheap 
 stuff is.
 
 >From: Martin Wilde <martin at gamma.intel.com>
 >Subject: Mash efficiency comments
 
 >My sparges flow rate starts out slowly and then is increased as
 time goes by.
 
 Lots of people say something like this and I do not understand why this 
 happens unless they are all using grain bags.  Mine will run out as fast as 
 it can get through the spigot if I keep the level up.  I control the rate by 
 throttling it back.
 
 >For an experiment I sparged for 90 minutes and my efficiency was 90%!!.
 
 Just when I thought I was on board with the points/lb/gal, we now switch to 
 per cent efficiency.  90% of what?  According to many sources, you can not 
 extract more than about 75% of the starch/sugar from malt no matter what you 
 do.
 
 >When you are reading a book on brewing - don't put the author on a pedistal
 and assume that they are the ultimate god...  Just use whatever works
 for you.
 
 I can't think of any art/science where this has proven to be more true than 
 in homebrewing.  My books go back to the 60's and are repleate with 
 absurdities.  The newer stuff is typically more accurate but about half the 
 info is totally subjective and one books contradicts the next.
 
 That is what is so great about this medium.  There is instant feedback and 
 the garbage gets sorted out or at least identified as debatable.
 
 >From: G.A.Cooper at qmw.ac.uk
 >Subject: Headspace
 
 >>Jack says:
 
 >>It seems that there is a very simple solution IF the problem is the O2 in
 >>the headspace.  Why not just fill the botle up and leave NO headspace?
 
 >It depends whether you are concerned about thermal expansion/contraction.
 That is, beer and glass rates being different and glass being breakable.
 
 It is refreshing to find a good sound reason for doing something, isn't it?  
 However, I guess the reason THAT reason never occurred to me is that, 
 intuitively, I would guess the expansion and contraction in beer in going 
 from fermentation to refrigeration would be trivial compared to the normal 
 headspace.
 
 However, in answering my own question, I bet it has something to do with 
 accidental freezing of bottled beer.  The expansion of ice is NOT trivial.  
 So, is it possible that homebrewers, who would not think of letting their 
 beer freeze, could reduce the headspace to the point where O2 is simply a 
 non-issue?
 
 >From: jeg at sangabriel.desktalk.com (John E. Greene)
 >Subject: Re: The Good Ol' Days...
 
 >Actually it wasn't a bore at all and there wasn't much repeating of the same
 old tired lines from popular books.  This was a great forum for discussing
 the various techniques....
 
 The following has be extracted from email and seems appropriate here...
 
 I suspect that the distribution list has grown significantly since the good 
 old days also.  Aside from the stuff that makes you feel uncomfortable, I 
 would suggest that, in the final anlaysis, the overall quality has gone up.  
 In order to attract and keep a large readership and talented contributor 
 list, you must take the good with the bad.  I just find it unfortunate that 
 so many people are incapable of just ignoring the bad (mine included) and 
 taking it all for what it is worth.

js
ZZ~.

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Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 14:37:07 EDT
From: srussell at msc.cornell.edu (Stephen Russell)
Subject: Database of contacts to homebrew clubs

I maintain a list of e-mail contacts to several homebrew clubs.  The dual 
purpose of keeping such a list is to aid in membership recruitment as well 
as to promote interclub communication and activities.  An ftp site has 
already been established for the exchange of copies of club newsletters 
as a result of the creation of this list.

If anyone would like information on one or more of the clubs on this list,
just send me some e-mail.  The list of clubs with contacts has been 
appended to the body of this message.

If you are a member of a club and would be willing to be on the list
as a contact person for your club, just send me some e-mail.  Don't be
put off by the fact that someone may already be 'on' for your club --
some clubs have 4 or 5 people listed; the more the merrier.

There are some 80 clubs on the list, but I am always looking for more
additions, both in terms of additional clubs and additional 'listees' for
clubs already on the list -- please come aboard!

Similarly, if you have any questions about this list...just send me e-mail.

Cheers and beers, 

STEVE

srussell at msc.cornell.edu (internet)    srussell at crnlmsc2 (bitnet)


Last updated 8/15/92; only snail mail for PUB (NY) & Dukes of Ale (Albuquerque)
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Birmingham Brewmasters (AL)
Madison Sobriety Club (AL)
Tucson Homebrewers Association (AZ)
Bay Area Mashers (Oakland/Berkeley, CA)
Barley Bandits (Orange County, CA)
Hoppy Cappers (Modesto/Stanislaus County, CA)
The Draught Board (East Bay, CA)
Maltose Falcons Home Brewing Society (San Fernando Valley, CA)
Gold Country Brewers Association (Sacramento, CA)
San Andreas Malts (San Francisco, CA)
Brewing Students of Harvey Mudd College (Claremont, CA)
Quality Ale and Fermentation Fraternity (QUAFF) (San Diego)
Santa Clara Valley Brewers Association (CA)
The High Desert TRUBle Makers (Edwards AFB/Lancaster/Palmdale, CA)
Worts of Wisdom (South Bay, CA)
Deep Wort Brew Club (Colorado Springs, CO)
Hop, Barley and the Alers (Boulder, CO)
Mash Tongues (Fort Collins, CO)
The Unfermentables (Denver, CO)
Beer Brewers of Central Connecticut (Middletown-based)
Underground Brewers of Connecticut (Fairfield and New Haven counties)
Brewers United for Real Potables (Washington Metro Area)
North Florida Brewers League (Tallahassee, FL)
Brew-52s (Athens, GA)
Covert Hops Society (Atlanta, GA)
Heartland Homebrew Club (Grinnell, IA)
Ida-Quaffers (Boise, ID)
Abnormal Brewers (Association of Bloomington/Normal Brewers, IL)
Chicago Beer Society
Headhunters' Homebrew Club (Sugar Grove, IL near Fermi Ntl Accelerator Lab)
THC - Tippecanoe Homebrewers Circle (Lafayette, IN)
Trubadours (Springfield, MA and vicinity)
Valley Fermenters (Greenfield, MA)
Boston Wort Processors
Chesapeake Real Ale Brewers (MD)
Ann Arbor Brewer's Guild (MI)
Kalamazoo Area Zymurgy and Oenophile Orchestra (KAZOO) (Kalamazoo, MI)
Keweenaw Real Ale Enthusiasts United for Serious Experimentation in Naturally-
	Effervescent Refreshment Science (KRAEUSENERS)  (Houghton, MI)
Minnesota Brewers Association (Minneapolis/St. Paul metro area)
Minnesota TimberWorts (Rochester, MN)
St. Louis Brews
The Prairie Homebrewing Companions (Fargo, ND/Moorhead, MN)
Fish n'Brew's (Newfoundland and Labrador)
Brew Free or Die! (Merrimack, NH)
Who's Bitter's Who's Best Brewing Club (Seabrook, NH)
Bellhops (Bellcore -- Piscataway, NJ)
Mid-Atlantic Sudsers and Hoppers (MASH) (New Jersey)
Los Alamos Hill Hoppers (NM)
Dukes of Ale (Albuquerque)
Amateur Brewers of Central New York (Syracuse, NY)
Homebrewers' Emergency Club (Columbia Univ. CS Department, NYC)
Ithaca Brewers' Union (Ithaca, NY)
Mohawk Valley Friends of Beer (Utica, NY)
New York City Homebrewers Guild
Paumanok United Brewers (Long Island)
Homebrewers of Staten Island (NY)
Sultans of Swig (Buffalo, NY)
Wort Ever Ales You (Westchester County, NY)
Upstate New York Homebrewers Association (Rochester, NY)
The Prairie Homebrewing Companions (Fargo, ND/Moorhead, MN)
Bloatarian Brewing League (Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky)
Dayton Regional Amateur Fermentation Technologists (DRAFT) (Dayton, OH)
Society of Northeast Ohio Brewers (Cleveland Area)
Canadian Amateur Brewers Association (Dundas, ON)
Ontario:  Ottawa Camra
Heart of the Valley Homebrewers (Corvallis, OR)
Oregon Brew Crew (Portland, OR)
Homebrewers of Philadelphia and Suburbs (HOPS)
Happy Valley Homebrewers (State College, PA)
Palmetto State Brewers (Columbia, SC)
Berry Brewers (Saskatoon, SK)
SCA Brewers Guild (Bryan, TX)
Fort Worth Cowtown Cappers
Malthoppers (College Station, TX)
The Foam Rangers (Houston, TX)
Mashtronauts (Clear Lake, TX, south of Houston/Johnson Space Center)
North Texas Homebrewers Association (Dallas and northern Texas)
The Back Door Brewers (Charlottesville, VA)
James River Homebrewers (Richmond, VA)
Brews Brothers (Seattle, WA)
Madison Homebrewers and Tasters Guild (Madison, WI)
Society of Oshkosh Brewers (SOB's) (Oshkosh, WI)













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Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 13:08 CDT
From: akcs.chrisc at vpnet.chi.il.us (chris campanelli)
Subject: Taste Midwest/Madison

Whats the latest list of attending breweries for the Taste of the Midwest
in Madison?

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Date: 16 Aug 1992 12:55:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: homebrew at tso.uc.EDU (Ed Westemeier)
Subject: Sanity, fun, and hops

First, the sanity part.
 
Please, folks -- if somone's posting bothers you, don't reply
with your sarcastic comments, and don't send nasty personal
e-mail.  JUST IGNORE IT.  They're only seeking attention, and
the worst punishment for them is to be ignored.
 
Second, the fun part.
 
The Fourth Annual BEER & SWEAT was held Saturday at the
Oldenberg Brewery/Drawbridge Estate near Cincinnati.  This
is the largest homebrewers gathering in the Midwest, and 
maybe the second biggest in the US for all I know.  At least six
clubs from at least five states were present, and we had (by
my count) about 200 attendees and at least 25 kegs of GOOD
homebrew.  Needless to say, a great time was had by all.
Homebrewers and their families always seem to get along
well together, and I have found them to be some of the nicest
people I've ever known.  Try to make it next year if you can!
 
Third, the hop part.
 
Steve Casagrande writes:
> Reading about all the lucky homebrewers with their own hop
> vines has made me curious.  What kind of yield do you get 
> from a hop vine, in ounces, once you've dried the hops?
> E.g., is it 6 oz, or 6 lbs?
> If I dedicate about 10' of a small garden along the side of a
> house to hops, what could I expect for a total crop?
 
Hop varieties are vastly different in their yield per vine, so
there really isn't any standard answer.  My most prolific producer
is the Cascade, which gives me about 4 ounces (dried) per vine.
 
The main thing you want to be aware of is to keep different
varieties 6 to 8 feet apart from each other, or after a few years
you won't know which is which when they start coming up in
the Spring.  You should be able to plant three different varieties
in your plot with no problem, though.

Cheers & beers,
- -- Ed

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Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 10:51 CDT
From: arf at ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: Yeast Culture

 
 To: Homebrew Digest
 Fm: Jack Schmidling
 
 My mailbox is flooded with requests for the yeast culture article so it seems 
 appropriate to repost it occasionally.....
 
 
 
 
 
 
                  JACK SCHMIDLING ON YEAST CULTURE
 
 
                          Objective
 
 The objective of culturing yeast is to isolate a single cell from a beer or 
 culture that has the characteristics desired and encourage this cell to 
 reproduce enough offspring to start a new batch of beer.
 
 This is easier said than done but with reasonable care, luck and modest 
 investment, can be accomplished by the serious home brewer.
 
                           General Program
 
 The general program is to dilute the original culture and spread it over the 
 surface of a growth medium in a petri dish so that individual cells are far 
 enough apart to allow them to grow into visible colonies without touching 
 each other.
 
 A sample from one of these typical colonies is transferred to a test tube 
 containing a growth medium.  When this colony is actively growing, it is 
 considered a pure culture and can be refrigerated for later use or started by 
 covering with beer wort.  When this starter is actively fermenting, it is 
 poured into a larger amount of wort which, when active, is pitched into the 
 beer.
 
                           Basic Assumptions
 
 The procedure makes a number of assumptions which are correct, often enough 
 to allow it to work well enough, to satisfy most requirements.
 
 The first assumption is that one can select the desired strain by looking at 
 colonies on a petri dish.  This is more or less true because the overwhelming 
 majority will be the same, i.e. the dominant strain.  Bacteria, molds and 
 many wild yeasts are obvious and recognizable to the naked eye.
 
 The second assumption is that, while still very small, all round colonies are 
 the progeny of single cells.
 
 The third assumption is that all such colonies, at least in the center are 
 mono clonal or at least mono-cultures and otherwise sterile.
 
 To do the job right, one would have to study the original diluted culture 
 under high magnification and do a presort at that level.  This is revealing 
 and fun.  It also gives an indication of any bacterial contamination in the 
 culture but the rub is marking individual cells and finding them later when 
 they grow into colonies.  This is done using a calibrated X-Y stage on the 
 microscope and making careful notes.  Fortunately, however, I do not believe 
 that it is really necessary for the home brewer, although a must for the lab 
 selling selected strains.
 
                             Details
 
 There are many growth media available for the purpose and no doubt someone 
 can recommend a source or recipe for the ideal but for my experiments, I 
 mixed two packets (16 gr) of Knox gelatin with one cup of 1.020 wort.  After 
 heating and disolving, this is poured into petri dishes and test tubes and 
 sterilized in a pressure cooker for 15 min at 15 lb.
 
 The petri dishes are turned upside down after solidifying and cultured this 
 way to prevent water of condensation from falling on the medium.  The test 
 tubes are cooled on a slant to allow the water to settle on the bottom when 
 vertical.  They are also stuffed with cotton before going into the pc.  You 
 can also use tubes with plastic screwcaps and avoid the cotton.
 
 It should be noted that gelatine melts around 75 F so its use in summer is 
 precarious.   The better alternative to gelatine is agar agar.  This is 
 available at oriental food stores in stick form.  Half a stick (about 4 
 inches) in a cup of wort will get you through the hottest weather.
 
 
 
                      Isolating Cells
 
 The first step is to inoculate the petri dish with as diluted a mixture as 
 possible.  The books are full of procedures for doing this but I find the 
 simplest is just as good.  Take a copper wire or thin glass rod and heat 
 several inches in a flame to sterilize.  Dip this, when cool, into a working 
 beer or yeast culture.  If starting with dry yeast, desolve one granule of 
 yeast in a test tube with about one inch of sterile water.  Gently drag this 
 across the gelatin in the petri dish, trying not to break the surface.  Next, 
 draw the wire across this line at several points, to further dilute the 
 sample.  Turn the dish over onto the cover and "incubate" at room temp for 
 several days.  Do this on several dishes just for insurance and as controls.
 
 
                       Pure Culture
 
 The next step is to visually inspect the surface of the petri dish under low 
 magnification (hand lens or naked eye will do) to pick out a "typical" colony 
 that appears to have come from a single cell.  All colonies should be 
 rejected that are any shape other than perfectly round and differ in any way 
 from the majority.
 
 Flame your wire again and after cooling, remove a small sample from the 
 center of the selected colony and poke this into the surface of the medium in 
 a "slant" test tube.  You can do this to several slants, with the same 
 sample, to assure all slants are the same or flame the wire and take a new 
 sample from a different colony.  You can make as many slants as you will need 
 for several months and throw away the petri culture.
 
 You now "incubate" the slants until 25% or more of the surface is covered 
 with the pure colony and then refrigerate them till needed.
 
                                Starting
 
 When needed for use, cover the slant with sterile wort and pitch when ready, 
 i.e fermenting.  For best results, this starter should be used to pitch about 
 a pint of wort, a day or so before brew day.
 
 This process can be used on anything from a packet of Red Star to a bottle of 
 your favorite beer and will produce a pure culture.  There is no guarantee 
 however, that the strain will remain the same for ever because of natural 
 mutation.   As it is my experience that the most common and objectionable 
 contaminents of dry yeast are bacteria and mold, this process will guarantee 
 at least, to eliminate these most serious problems.
 
 I was intrigued by the recent posting on the quality of beer made from Red 
 Star that was re-cultured.  I was also "impressed" by the number of contest 
 winners who use Wyeast and now rise to the challenge of winning the "World's 
 Greatest Brewer" trophy using re-cultured Red Star instead of just joining 
 the Wyeast bandwaggon.
 
 js
 
 
 

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 12:09:11 MET DST
From: Stefan Karlsson <stefank at math.chalmers.se>
Subject: Wort Chiller - help requested

I'm about to make myself a wort chiller.
I think it will be an immersion type. 

I first bought some 3/16" copper tubing, but realised that it
was to narrow, so I found some 30-40' of 3/8" in my father's
basement. I think it should be better. 

Now, what's the best construction?
If you have a single spiral I guess you'd let the water flow from
the bottom to the top, because of the wort getting colder at the
bottom (right?). What if you use double spirals. Should you start
at the bottom of the inner spiral and then from the top go down
and let the inner spiral start from the bottom? OK, you who'd been
building those before, please give me some advise. 

Stefan Karlsson 
Dep of Math
Univ of Goteborg
Sweden
 -
stefank at math.chalmers.se

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 13:43 GMT
From: Andy Phillips <PHILLIPSA at LARS.AFRC.AC.UK>
Subject: Recipe for Fullers ESB wanted

Does anyone out there in Netland have a good, preferably grain-based
recipe for Fuller's ESB? I've made the version in Dave Line's book
"Brewing beers like those you buy", which, although very good, tastes
and looks nothing like the real thing. It's also extract based, and
I would prefer to try an all-grain recipe - I'm not an all-grain snob,
but my brewing did improve when I switched to grain.

Thanks
Andy


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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 08:35:50 -2300
From: cl7841s at ACAD.DRAKE.EDU
Subject: hbd post

		  Announcing 
		the 9th Annual 
		  Dixie Cup 
	    Homebrew Competition

America's second largest homebrew competition  
will be held October 16 and 17, 1992 in Houston, TX.

The Dixie Cup is sponsored by the Houston Foam Rangers
Homebrew Club and DeFalco's Home Wine and Beer Supplies   
of Houston.  It is an AHA and HWBTA sanctioned competition.

Entries will be accepted in basically the same style
categories as those used for the AHA national competition.
The final list of styles will be in the entry info.
The entry fee will be $6.  Brewers are allowed to enter up to two
beers for each style.
 
Information on how to enter the Dixie Cup will be snail-mailed the first
week of September.

Beer entries will be due October 9.

To receive info on the Dixie Cup, drop me a note and I`ll
see that it is sent to you. 

My address is :  slamb at milp.jsc.nasa.gov 

If you wish to go to the source, mail a request for info
 to:

	Dixie Cup 1992
	c/o DeFalco's
	5611 Morningside
	Houston, TX 77005
	Tel. (713) 523-8154 

Of course, all of the information in this post will be superceeded
by the official entry stuff.


P.S.  I had my brother post this, I haven't been able to get
anything to go to the HBD by myself.  Can anyone offer any assisstance?
I get the HBD everyday, no problems.
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
- --- 
      .    _  .     _____________ 
      |\_|/__/|    /             \ 
     / / \/ \  \  / Happy! Happy! \      
    /__|O||O|__ \ \   Joy! Joy!   / 
   |/_ \_/\_/ _\ | \  ___________/      
   | | (____) | ||  |/                       
   \/\___/\__/  // _/
   (_/         ||   
    |  Real    ||\   Sean Lamb (slamb at milp.jsc.nasa.gov)
     \  Beer   //_/   Loral Space Info Systems
      \______//      Houston, Texas, USofA, Earth, Sol 
     __|| __||      
    (____(____)      
          
Colin Lamb - MacMeister 8-)>  -  Drake University  -  Des Moines


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Date:         Mon, 17 Aug 92 09:38:47 EST
From: Thomas Kellogg <RADITLK%UVMADMIN.BITNET at mitvma.mit.edu>
Subject:      Plum Wine

Hi, a friend of mine loves the Japanese Plum wine.  Being a homebrewer I
thought I would try to make some Plum wine.  Has anyone out there in homebrew-
land tried to make this or has a recipe for plum wine?  Thanks in advance.

    TOM
     RSO
      UVM                MIN
       (RADITLK at UVMADMIN)

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 09:47:54 EDT
From: dipalma at banshee.sw.stratus.com (James Dipalma)
Subject: Thanks



Hi All,

	I just wanted to express my thanks to all who responded to
my post last week regarding yeast culturing.  The number of responses
and amount of material received was almost overwhelming.
	To those who wrote to me asking to pass the information along,
I'm working on compiling the information into a comprehensive,
organized form.  It'll go out today.
	Once again, HBD has proven to be a valuable resource.

                              Jim



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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 09:56:41 EDT
From: "Spencer W. Thomas" <Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu>
Subject: making labels stick

My favorite label sticking method uses milk (I didn't make this up, I
got it from a friend).  I laser-print my labels on plain paper.  After
cutting the sheets into labels, just dip the back of a label into a
saucer of milk, then press it onto the bottle. A quick sponge
application gets rid of the excess milk.  They stick great, but come
off easily when wet (a feature, not a bug).

=Spencer W. Thomas 		HSITN, U of Michigan, Ann Arbor, MI 48109
spencer.thomas at med.umich.edu	313-747-2778

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 10:13:19 EDT
From: andre vignos <andre at Think.COM>
Subject: Fast fermentation



This weekend (saturday) I started a batch of nut brown ale and I am a
little curious about the way it is fermenting. After adding the yeast to
this room tempature batch, I gave the beer a quick swirl. Within an hour I
started seeing some action.  This is pretty fast by my standards but it
didn't bother me.  After 24 hrs the blow-off was complete (serious
blowoff), again this seemed pretty quick but I had read that this type of
ale his a shorter fermentation period then most (5-6 days). I took off the
blowoff tube and put on the bubbler (can't remember the name for the silly
thing). This morning I timed the delta between bubbles and it is allready
over a minute.  A rule of thumb I heard was that when it takes more then
two minutes between bubbles then it is ready to bottle. It seems to me that
this will occur within the next day. Should I be concerned? Do I need more
yeast?  I did use 7 lbs of extract in addition to a pound of partially
mashed grains. I will take a specific gravity reading soon (tomorrow). If
it is in the right range (1012-1020) should I just go ahead and bottle it?
Will the beer not come down to the right gravity if there is not enough
yeast to convert all the sugars?.



                              Do I worry too much?     -Andre


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Date: 	Mon, 17 Aug 1992 08:34:12 -0400
From: pawebs at ohpspd.com (Philip A. Webster)
Subject: Canadian Beers

Someone recently asked a question about Canadian beers, especially those 
available in the U.S.  I haven't seen a response yet, so here is one from me.

As far as I know, the beers exported to the Excited States are the same as those
available here in the Great White North.  That is, they are the light, pilsener
style beers produced by the big brewers, which achieve massive sales by means
of extensive advertising aimed at young, blue collar (usually white) males.  Of
course, with the current trade dispute on this very topic, exports are likely
to be at a very low level until the lunacy subsides.

With regard to strength, you should be aware that the reputation of Canadian
beers as being stronger that U.S. beers is a fallacy.  This arises because we
measure alcohol content by volume whereas south of the 49th it is by weight.
Since alcohol has a specific gravity of less than one, a beer of, say, 5% by
volume would be about 4% by weight.  Hence the confusion and the unwarranted
reputation.

My first paragraph notwithstanding, we do have some good beers up here, from
a burgeoning number of microbreweries and brewpubs.  If anyone is planning
a trip to Toronto or Southern Ontario (perhaps for the World Series :-} ),
drop me an E-mail and I will put you onto some good places.

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Date:    Mon, 17 Aug 1992 10:39:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: PEPKE at VAXMOM.SCRI.FSU.EDU
Subject: Root beer

Doug Behm writes:

> If anybody tries to make root beer from real roots , I would like
> to know how it turns out.

I have made root beer from real stuff, approximating from a 100-year old
recipe.  The recipe included sassafras bark, wild cherry bark, yellow dock,
wintergreen bark, molasses, and a few things I can't remember.  The only
ingredient that I had any trouble finding was the wintergreen bark, and oil
of wintergreen from the druggist added after cooling proved a satisfactory
substitute.

The result was tasty, highly complex, and not a lot like what we are accustomed
to thinking root beer should taste like.  To make something like modern root
beer, it would probably work best to use wintergreen and little else.

And yes, kids, this is illegal, because sassafras contains a carcinogen.

Eric Pepke                                     INTERNET: pepke at gw.scri.fsu.edu
Supercomputer Computations Research Institute  MFENET:   pepke at fsu
Florida State University                       SPAN:     scri::pepke
Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052                     BITNET:   pepke at fsu

Disclaimer: My employers seldom even LISTEN to my opinions.
Meta-disclaimer: Any society that needs disclaimers has too many lawyers.

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 11:00:13 EDT
From: klm at mscg.com (Kevin L. McBride)
Subject: Re: Great Western Malting closes retail outlet in Corning, CA

Tom Bower <bower at hprnlme1.rose.hp.com> writes:

> Just a note to let all you HBDers know:  Great Western Malting has closed
> its one and only retail outlet in Corning, California....

> and they now have a 2000-lb. minimum order

I've noticed an alarming trend recently in that several companies, now
including Great Western, have decided that they will no longer sell
direct to homebrewers at all, have jacked their formerly wholesale
prices up to retail, and/or are imposing outrageous minimum orders.

What a great way for these people to alienate a growing segment of
their market.  I realize that Great Western probably makes most of
their money by selling grain 10,000 lbs. or more at a time to micros.
They do seem, however, to have been doing a rather brisk business in
the homebrewing market as well.

Foxx Beverage, who got into the homebrew kegging supply business by
popular demand and has done us a tremendous service, is now getting
out of it.

I can see two possible reasons for this trend:

1) The companies in question have decided that it is just too much
   work to service hundreds or thousands of small orders and they
   want to stick to wholesale, an all-around much easier job.

2) The Home Wine and Beer Trade Association (HWBTA) is putting
   pressure on suppliers to not compete with retail homebrew
   supply shops.

If the reason is #1, I can grudgingly accept it, but will try to talk
the vendors in question out of this policy.  If the reason is #2, I
think some not so nice letters to the HWBTA would be in order about
their policies.

I support my local homebrew supply shop, and I think that everyone
else should too.  I do, however, feel that we should also have the
option of going directly to the supplier when we want to order in bulk
or if we want to special order stuff that our retailer doesn't
normally carry.  Special orders from retailers tend to be outrageously
priced.

Fight for your right to shop around for the best price!  Don't let the
retail associations bully us!  Vote with your wallet!

Also, Jon Binkley <binkley at beagle.Colorado.EDU> writes:

> Wyeast's European Ale yeast is a good Alt yeast.  All imported
> Alts I've seen are pasteurized, as are the few Koelschs that
> make it over.  I know of no sources of authentic Koelsch yeast,
> but I'm of the opinion that Wyeast's German Ale yeast, #1007,
> would make a pretty good rendition of a Koelsch.

I brewed a "Koelsch" recently and used Wyeast 1007.  It worked out
very nicely.  Authentic?  Probably not.  Did anyone notice?  No.

- -- 
Kevin

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Date:    Mon, 17 Aug 1992 10:55:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: R_GELINAS at UNHH.UNH.EDU (Russ Gelinas)
Subject: stir mash?

    In a single step infusion mash, is it better to stir the mash occasionally
or should it be left alone?  What's the consensus (HA!) ?

    Is there an easy way to make hop oil concentrate from whole hops?

Russ

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 11:02:19 EDT
From: Chris Goedde <goedde at shape.mps.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: Siphon Woes

The good news is that I brewed my third batch over the weekend.  The
bad news is that siphoning it into the secondary was a major hassle.
The cause of this hassle is CO2 coming out of solution inside the
siphon tube, collecting at a bend in the tube and stopping the siphon;
as a result, I had to restart the siphon several times.  Needless to
say, this has me worried^H^H^H^H^H^Hndering.

This particular batch had been in the primary for ~30 hours (although
I also had this problem when racking my second batch, which had been
in the primary > 2 days).  The kraeusen had fallen and the air lock
was glubbing about once per minute (it had been streaming pretty
continuously about eight hours earlier).  I don't have this problem
when racking at bottling time, so my preliminary diagnosis is that I'm
not waiting long enough before racking to the secondary, but I'm
wondering if there's something I can do to prevent this, or if there's
something I can do while siphoning when I see the bubbles forming and
starting to collect.

Thanks,

chris
goedde at shape.mps.ohio-state.edu

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 11:44:57 EDT
From: Hal Laurent  at  MEL <laurent at tamdno.ENET.dec.com>
Subject: Re: Coffeemaker Mashtun

In #949 Chuck Cox writes:

> What is a good cleaner to remove coffee
> taste/aroma from stainless? 

Well, you might try Efferdent denture cleaning tablets.  They work
wonderfully for removing coffee stains from glass.  Perhaps they'd
work on stainless steel as well.


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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 09:54:08 MDT
From: rogerm at cirrus.com (Roger McPherson)
Subject: Help with Basement Brewery Layout (Roger McPherson)

I am in the process of planning a brewery in my basement and would
welcome any and all suggestions on how to best arrange things.  I plan
to do both extract and all-grain brewing.  To date, I have only done
extract brewing.  I will have a frig, stove and sink available.  Also,
any references on small scale brewery layouts would be greatly
appreciated.

Thanks,

Roger McPherson
rogerm at cirrus.com

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 12:35:46 EDT
From: lconrad at wilko.Prime.COM (Laura Conrad)
Subject: Homebrew Digest #945 (August 11, 1992)

Jack Oswalt writes:

	So my questions: Can sassafras root be obtained in the United States?
	Is it even legal in the USA?  Can root beer be made from
	sassafras bark? 

Where I live, sasasfras root can be obtained quite easily -- you go to
the woods and pull up some sassafras seedlings.

You can recognize sassafras because it's the only common kind of tree
that has three different shaped leaves -- some are like a mitten with
a left thumb, some are like a mitten with a right thumb, and some are
like a mitten for an alien with two thumbs.

Interestingly, sassafras and ginseng are closely related.  In the
nineteenth century, you used to be able to obtain ginseng root the
same way you can still get sassafras root.

However, the Chinese or Koreans decided that "Real New England Ginseng
Root" was the best stuff, and it got overharvested and is now rare.
So the herb companies marketing ginseng to Americans advertise "Real
Korean Ginseng Root".


			Laura

(617) 275-1800 x4512--------------MS 4-1, 201 Burlington Rd., Bedford, MA 01730

There is a law that no organization can ignore, or not for long.  
That is that the real rulers of any organization are those that 
do the work, no matter what they are called.

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Date: 17 Aug 92 12:51:30 EST
From: Ruth Mazo Karras <RKARRAS at PENNSAS.UPENN.EDU>
Subject: Yeast Questions

This weekend I made what I think might be a sort of Alt-like ale--at least
that is what I hope it will be. I used Wyeast 1007 German Ale with 6 lbs. of
6-row, 1 lb. of Munich and 1 lb. of crystal (60 L.). That was pretty much what
my local supplier had that was precrushed. In attempting to make up a recipe
that I thought would be good, I scanned Cat's Meow II and looked in a number
of other books. Wyeast 1007 does not seem very popular. So, what do YOU use
1007 for? (The current HBD has a couple messages sugesting the Wyeast European
Ale yeast for Alts.)

I would like to use the 1007 again by pitching from the secondary to a new
batch, and with some advance work I think I can get a real recipe to try for a
known beer style. Please lend a hand/recipe, if you can.


BTW, I used Chinook and Tetnanger to aim for an IBU of 28. Maybe this will be
good. The yeast (dated 8/5) really took off after pitching.

Chris Karras (RKarras at PennSAS.UPenn.edu)

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Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 10:03:46 PDT
From: gummitch at techbook.com (Jeff Frane)
Subject: Coffee makers & Stars

Chuck Cox (world's fastest homebrewer) sez:
> 
> I just bought a cafeteria coffeemaker for $1.
> 
> It appears to be a near-perfect mashtun.  It has a pair of side-by-side
> 5 gal tubs, all stainless.  It has a swivelling sparge head, temperature
> control, dual sparge/fill timers, some kind of recirculating pump, and
> what appears to be an overflow or level sensor. 
> 
> As far as I can tell, I just need to add false bottoms and a more
> accurate thermometer to turn this into a semi-automatic recirculating
> mash/lauter tun.
> 
> Has anyone out there already done this? Any advice? After a thorough
> disassembly & cleaning, the first batch will be a nice big stout (with
> an involuntary hint of coffee).  What is a good cleaner to remove coffee
> taste/aroma from stainless? I don't have to remove lots of gunk, the
> system is already very clean, and I know it works, I had coffee out of
> it last week. 
> 
I've seen two of these over the years: Dave Logsdon brews in one that he
bought from a government surplus site -- it had never been out of the
box.  He did some fancy plumbing with it and had the two tubs replaced
with a single unit.  The way it's set up you can circulate either steam
(or very hot water) or cold water through the jacketing, so it can be
used for mashing, boiling and fermentation.  Pretty spiffy.  But there
are plans for something that sounds very much like yours in an old issue
of Fred Eckhardt's Amateur Brewer.  These aren't Fred's plans -- the
originator's name escapes me -- but as I remember there were very
concise.  Sorry, I don't have my issues here with me and may not even
have that issue, but you could try contacting Fred directly; he has back
issues of most, if not all, the old ABs.


Brian Cole asks:
> 
> An unrelated question. While travelling in Germany this summer I tried a
> Weizenbock for the first time. It was made by a brewery called Maisel or
> something like that -- may have spelling wrong. It was quite good. The
> label had a Star-of-David on it with Bayreuth (I think) written under it. 
> I didn't have a chance to check with the locals but I thought Bayreuth might
> be Beruit in German. Can anyone tell me about this brewery or about 
> Bayreuth ? I am interested in knowing whether this beer really came from
> Beruit, is brewed under contract in Germany for an outfit in Beruit,
> or is simply a German beer.
> 
Maisel is in, I  believe, the city of Bayreuth.  They make an
extraordinary beer called Dampfbier, which I haven't been able to find
here in Oregon for two many years.  Dampfbier was apparently their
attempt to do something "different"-- it's the equivalent of a steam
beer, but darker.  Incredible.  The star you describe can be spotted on
a lot of old beer logos -- including the old Weinhard brewery here in
Portland.  I remember reading about it specifically in connection with
Maisel and have been going crazy trying to find where I read it -- the
star was, I believe, a craft or guild symbol and used by all German
brewers at one time.  There is no connection -- other than appearance --
with the Jewish Star of David.

If anyone can point me to a reference on this, I'd really appreciate it,
by the way.


> darker brown when exposed to air (oxidation), which happens fairly quickly.
- --Jeff Frane

> I managed to get almost a full gallon with little oxidation, so I decided to


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End of HOMEBREW Digest #950, 08/18/92