HOMEBREW Digest #1156 Fri 04 June 1993

Digest #1155 Digest #1157

		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

  Oktoberfest recipe and dirty stove tops (Marc de Jonge)
  RE: iodine (James Dipalma)
  mircowave sanitation, superheated water (Ralph Palmer)
  SS/dry yeast (donald oconnor)
  Converting a freezer to a fridge (LPD1002)
  SS and phosphoric acid  (donald oconnor)
  California Crazy Train ("Rad Equipment")
  pH Testing (Jack Schmidling)
  looking for time saving tips ("Anton Verhulst")
  Hunter AirStat modification (BLAST)
  A beer joke ("Rafael Busto" )
  Re: What's the story with SA (TAN1)
  HELP FROM NJ!!! (korz)
  Lautering (Bryan L. Gros)
  RE: How can I protect my stove? (""Robert C. Santore"")
  Sparging, Octoberfest, pH Testing (Jack Schmidling)
  Re: iodine  (Drew Lynch)
  Beyond momilies ("William A Kitch")
  Noble Hops Wasteful? *NOT* ("Roger Deschner  ")
  OFest Recipe Formulation (Lee=A.=Menegoni)
  Iodine testing (Dennis J. Templeton)
  iodine ("Spencer W. Thomas")
  Oops... ("Anthony Johnston")
  taste of yeast starters (ng570)
  Garlic Beer Inquiry (Lou Casagrande)
  Micro in Alden, Iowa (Chad Sheley)
  Wort Chiller to Sparge Heater (CompuCom) <v-ccsl at microsoft.com>
  EDME Brewcraft Barrel/Bleach & SS/St. Pat's of TX correction (korz)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 11:46:29 +0200 From: dejonge at tekserv.geof.ruu.nl (Marc de Jonge) Subject: Oktoberfest recipe and dirty stove tops After reading Tony Babinec's post in HBD 1155, I decided to throw in another recipe for munich oktoberfest. This one is so simple it's hardly a recipe but the taste comes out great: Strong malty flavour, might do with a bit more hops, the taste is definitely 'in style' (so the style might do with a bit more hops :) [recipe for 20 litres] 5.5 kg Munich malt 40 g Hallertau hops (whole, 5.1% alpha) yes, that's it I make this with a 2-stage decoction mash, fairly high temperature (for German beer) Add strike water to get a temperature of 53C (pH of the mash around 5.4) while 60% is at this temp. do a quick infusion step of 67C with 40% of the mash (20 mins), boil (20 min) and back,(temperature should be around 67C) rest 45 mins, boil 1/3 of the mash for 10 minutes, back and rest 20 minutes (around 72C), sparge add 30 g of hops at the beginning of the boil, the remainder some 20 minutes before the end Pitch bottom fermenting yeast, primary at 14C, secondary at 9C, lager at 6C for a month. OG 1053-1057 FG 1012-1014 The malts I've used for this recipe are Belgian munich and Munich munich, they come out a bit different (the German version was somewhat darker), but very nice. On another issue: Hal Laurent asks about stains on the stove top: >Two questions: > > 1. Is there some method of removing these stains from the stove? > a warm cleaning soda (Na2CO3, not caustic soda!) solution may help, but I'm not sure what that does with your stove top > 2. Would it help if I lined the stove top with aluminum foil or > some other material when doing the boil? Being a sloppy cook, I find it useful to flood the stove with water before I start cooking anything messy, that reduces the cleaning of the stove to mopping up afterwards. - ------------------------------------------------------------ Marc de Jonge dejonge at geof.ruu.nl - ------------------------------------------------------------ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 08:45:36 EDT From: dipalma at banshee.sw.stratus.com (James Dipalma) Subject: RE: iodine Hi All, In HBD#1155, Spencer W. Thomas writes: >I'm sure this has been covered before, but here I go again.... >The last batch I made, I did the iodine test two ways: 1. I drained a >little out of the spigot at the bottom of my mash/lauter tun (Gott >cooler with copper-pipe manifold). This tested completely starch free >after 20 minutes (the first time I tested it). 2. I pushed the spoon >into the top of the mash and let some fluid run into it. This never >tested clear, even after 1.5 hours. >So which one should I believe? I'd say believe the first sample. What I think happened is that the sample drawn from the spigot was free of grain husks and pieces of grain by virtue of being drawn through your sparge manifold, while the second sample taken from the top of the mash contained grain material. IMHO, the iodine test *is* a reliable means of determining starch conversion, but it is absolutely critical that the sample be free of any grain husks (which contain cellulose) and grain chunks (insoluble starch, which will never convert). What is being tested here is the degree of conversion of *soluble* starch to sugars, so it's important to test a sample that is liquid only, free of any particulate matter. Cheers, Jim Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 09:31:43 EDT From: Ralph Palmer <rpalmer at Think.COM> Subject: mircowave sanitation, superheated water - ---------- X-Sun-Data-Type: text X-Sun-Data-Description: text X-Sun-Data-Name: text X-Sun-Content-Lines: 0 - ---------- X-Sun-Data-Type: default X-Sun-Data-Description: default X-Sun-Data-Name: Articles X-Sun-Content-Lines: 37 Does the radiation from a standard home microware offer any sanitation or sterilization benefits? I remember reading about a new autoclave design that also used microwave in the process and began to wonder about home microwave ovens. I just cultured my first batch of wyeast into 4 starters, and was very paraniod about sanitation. Afer soaking the bottles in a bleach solution I decided to boil them. I do not have a pot big enough, so I filled each bottle 1/3 full and stuck them into the microwave to boil the water inside the bottle. As I sat there waiting for the boil, I wondered if the microwaves themselves would kill any of the nasties. Boiling the water inside the bottles worked well, but I also got to relearn the hazards of superheating water. The bubbles in boiling water need a site to nucleate or the water does not boil at 212F. Typically scratches in pans or glass provide a nice nucleation point. However if there are no scratches, ie a nice smooth bottle or flask, the water will heat above 212F. That is why boiling chips, little pieces of porus ceramic, are put in flasks in chem class. One of my 4 bottles did not boil when the others did. I first thought it was because it was positioned in the corner. When I opened the microware and touched the bottle, the hot water spurted out the top! Thank goodness I was wearing an oven mit. I will continue to use the mircowave to boil water in the bottle, but plan to put in a scratched glass marble in to act as a boiling chip. Ralph Palmer - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Palmer |The opinions above are mine alone and do not Thinking Machines Corporation |necessarily represent the views of my employer 245 First Street |---------------------------------------------- Cambridge, MA 02142 | "Even paranoid people have real enemies" email: rpalmer at think.com | - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1993 08:37:12 -0500 From: donald oconnor <oconnor at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu> Subject: SS/dry yeast Al writes, "I re-checked my 1991-1992 Cole-Parmer Chemical Reactivity charts and there was no mention of Chlorox (bleach)." Better check again Al. Page 1185, item 23 from the top, 1991-92 Cole Parmer catalog is none other than "Clorox (bleach)." It's in the 93-94 catalog as well, page 1465. Al goes on, "Furthermore, I'd like to point out that don's wife is the owner of St. Pat's of Texas (brewing supply) and they do not stock Iodophor rather they stock a chlorine sanitizer." Wrong again. St. Pat's has never at any time stocked a chlorine sanitizer . St. Pat's has stocked both the 4 oz and liter size of iodophor for about a year. We've been using iodophor for as long but I see no reason to run down bleach which, as John Isenhaur points out, is inexpensive, readily available and just fine if used properly. It should be noted that my standard dose (1 tsp/gallon) was 1/6 th that suggested by george fix (1 oz/gallon), i.e., nearly a full order of magnitude below the safe level. If I understand George correctly, he believes repeated use with a bleach solution known to be safe, will eventually cause harm. Poor logic. If we drink a beer a day for 40 years, we won't die from alcohol poisoning. I recommend Arne's ? wonderful post of a couple days ago about the reactivity of chlorite with aluminum. Its a wonderful example of how useless superficial knowledge such as numbers from tables can sometimes be. More from Al, "Finally, don has, in a newsletter, questioned the quality of the DeWolf- Cosyns Belgian Malts (another item not stocked by St. Pat's of Texas)" Not true on both counts. St. Pat's newsletters have had only good things to say about belgian malts. Not only does St. Pat's sell Belgian malt, St. Pat's was one of the first shops to do so. In fact, St. Pat's was the first shop to advertise the availability of Belgian malts in Zymurgy (summer '92 Great Fermentations also has an ad in the same issue). My wife Lynne learned of these malts from Pierre Celis during a personal tour of his brewery while it was still under construction. Lynne can testify to Pierre's wonderful nature. He spent an hour or so toting our youngest boy Patrick, 1 at the time, around the brewery. Al adds, "St. Pat's of Texas turns out to be the sole distributor of Briess malt in the area." St. Pat's, like Pierre Celis, appreciates the quality of both Briess and DeWolf Cosyns malt. Al goes on, "I've yet to find the reasoning for don's tirade on yeast a few weeks ago, but I'm sure that his ulterior motives will surface eventually." The only two people who have resorted to sophomoric remarks regarding my posts about yeast are Al and George. I believe Al sells dry yeast for a profit and George of course is employed by the distributor of Whitbread. On the other hand St. Pat's gives dry yeast away free because Lynne cannot in good conscience sell it for a profit. I would be more than delighted if George and Al's dream of pure dry yeast were to come true; then Lynne could start selling the dry yeast for a profit. I found it ironic that in the end George was blaming Lallemand, Al's favorite dry yeast producer, for the problems with Whitbread, the product that George represents. For the record, all Whitbread, the good, the bad and the ugly has been produced under contract by Distillers in England. That particular portion of the Whitbread history seems to have been invented for the purpose of not only deflecting responsibility for the really atrocious batch of a couple of years ago, but also to pass blame on to the competitor, Lallemand. Best regards, Don Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 07:38:07 -0600 From: LPD1002%NYSHESCV.bitnet at UACSC2.ALBANY.EDU Subject: Converting a freezer to a fridge Thanks to all who responded to my query. I have found the Hunter Airstat as recommended at Builders Square For $28. It only has a low end of 40 Degrees. That was somewhat bothersome since one of the reasons I wanted a fridge was to try lagering. The other suggestion, a Johnson Controls Portable Thermostat is sold at my locat Homebrew store for $64.95. This price was somewhat bothersome, but I think it's the one for me. It has a wider range (down to 20 degrees) and the owner of the homebrew store says he recommends it over the Hunter because he knows of some people who used Hunters and had their compressors burn out. It seems the Hunter is a little TOO precise and kicks the compressor on when there is any fluctuation in temperature. The freezer I lucked into seems pretty old, so I guess my decision is made. STEVE SEPTER Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1993 08:52:07 -0500 From: donald oconnor <oconnor at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu> Subject: SS and phosphoric acid George Fix uses a sanitizer containing phosphoric acid for his 304 stainless kegs. Phosphoric acid reacts quite severely with 304 stainless. should we then conclude that the use of this sanitizer will damage his kegs with repeated use? of course not. For the same reason that dilute bleach will not either. the key here is to use the product whether its phosphoric acid or bleach properly. Return to table of contents
Date: 3 Jun 1993 07:08:23 U From: "Rad Equipment" <rad_equipment at rad-mac1.ucsf.edu> Subject: California Crazy Train Subject: California Crazy Train Time:7:04 AM Date:6/3/93 Due to a gross lack of response (0 reservations) the Crazy Train between LA & Portland has been cancelled. Frequent reasons offered included the extended travel time required and the attraction of lower RT airfares available. Maybe we'll try again next year to Denver. RW... Russ Wigglesworth (INTERNET: Rad_Equipment at radmac1.ucsf.edu - CI$: 72300,61) UCSF Dept. of Radiology, San Francisco, CA (415) 476-3668 / 474-8126 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 09:06 CDT From: arf at genesis.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling) Subject: pH Testing >From: jdg at cyberspace.org (Josh Grosse) >In today's issue, Mr. S. questioned his purchase of a pH meter, and said he felt he purchased equipment he found to be useless. >I have one, and I find it extremely useful for three purposes: You will note that *I* found it to be useless, i.e. with MY process, using MY water. I only suggested that before speNding the money, one should try one to see if it is needed in his/her case. If no adjustments are necessary and the water supply is constant, then one need not make the measurements on a continuing basis. >1) Adjusting the pH of the mash. (pH 5.0-5.5) I presume you mean that you adjust the water to something so that after adding the malt, the pH is 5.0 to 5.5. I wonder what that something is. My water is 8.1 and drops into that range. I would be interested in knowing what your numbers are without adjusting. >2) Adjusting the pH of sparge water. (ph 5.6-5.8) Again, my sparge water is 8.1 and after sparging 10 gallons, it only raises the total pH of the wort a tenth of a point. >3) Ensuring I don't oversparge. (ph > 5.5) It is just as useful to use a hydrometer. If you stop sparging when the gravity falls below 1.008, you will not likely have any problems. It will take tons of a water a few points higher to have any effect on the total wort. But again, I am only suggesting that one try it before buying. He may find that it only tells him what he already suspected from the quality of the beer produced. ------------------------------ >From: korz at iepubj.att.com >Subject: Wyeast British and London/Rusty hop leaves >JACK writes: It may seem folksy to use first names but it's a bit confusing. I (one of several Jacks) am not responsible for the above. js ZZ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 93 10:28:42 EDT From: "Anton Verhulst" <verhulst at zk3.dec.com> Subject: looking for time saving tips In HBD #1155 Hal Laurent appreciated the quality of his brews after switching to all grain but complains about the amount of time it takes. When I read his post I thought he was talking about me! :-) I've got 3 all grain batches under my belt now and they were great (IMHO). Even my wife drinks my beers now - she was indifferent to my extract brews. My best time for brewing an all grain batch is about 5 hours and I'd like to cut that down as much as possible. Some one in a recent Zymurgy issue said that an all grain batch took him 3 hours, including clean up. My biggest problem right now is that I don't have water ready at the right temperature at the right time and I know that this will be cured by experience. I would like to hear about time saving tips from other brewers. regards, - --Tony Verhulst Return to table of contents
Date: 03 Jun 1993 10:06:10 -0600 (CST) From: BLAST at sn01.sncc.lsu.edu Subject: Hunter AirStat modification I remember reading about a mod to the Hunter AirStat to make it work for a lower (< 40F) temperature range. Could someone with the specifics please repost or e-mail it to me? I'm getting ready to do a lager and with outside temps above 90F already, the little yeasties are going to need lots of TLC (Thermal Lagering Control). Thanks, Bruce Ray Return to table of contents
Date: 3 Jun 93 11:01:04 From: "Rafael Busto" <SUPERVISOR at bnk1.bnkst.edu> Subject: A beer joke - Why american (commercial) beer is like making love in a canoe? - Because is f__ing close to water Rafael Busto Computer Center Bank Street College of Education, New York City RBusto at bnk1.bnkst.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 08:01:13 PDT From: TAN1%SysEng%DCPP at cts27.cs.pge.com Subject: Re: What's the story with SA In HBD 1155 Big Ed asks >What's the story with Sam Adams. It seems it's always getting trashed here. >A lot of people in my area (Southern MA) are buying Sam Adams. (Course there's >not a whole lot of selection in my area.) Is Sam Adams Ale and Lager really >that bad, or is it that people just don't like Koch(?). I'm new, so forgive me >for not being up on the controversy. >**** The controvery is not the beer produced by SA, it is generally regarded as excellent (with the exception of the "Lambic"). The problem is Ed Koch and his less than above board advertising techniques and litigations. SA has made claims that were not true (winner of the GABF 4 years running), filed lawsuits against micro-brewerys for the use of the name "Boston" in their beer, and generally handled himself in a manner that makes you glad he is not your neighbor. I've been watching the digest for almost a year now and have found it amusing as to the various controversies that unfold. It's like watching the black sheep of the family, wondering what he's going to do next to screw up. I personally do not participate in the boycott of SA products. I like his beers, and use them as examples good American beers. I do go on, then, to explain about Koch. I may not like Koch, but its hard to deny that the lager is excellent. Tom Nelson Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 10:31 CDT From: korz at iepubj.att.com Subject: HELP FROM NJ!!! HELP!!! URGENT!!! If you live or work in New Jersey and would be willing to do me favor (picking up some boxes from a warehouse and UPSing them to me) please send me email directly. Yes, this is beer-related and I'm sure we could figure out some kind of beer-related compensation for this favor. Thanks. Sorry about the bandwidth. Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 08:55:57 PDT From: bgros at sensitivity.berkeley.edu (Bryan L. Gros) Subject: Lautering I realize that the variety of methods of sparging are as numerous as people brewing, but I am looking for some general guidelines. What are the main parameters in sparging? That is, what are the important things that you want to work towards however you are sparging? How important is, for example, the thickness of the grain bed? the temperature of the water? the level of water above the grain bed? the amount of recirculation? water hardness/ softness? pH? what have I missed? which are irrelevant? which depend on the style of beer the brewer is aiming for? what do people that sparge for two or three hours doing all that time, recirculating or waiting for the grain to "soak" or what? With that information, what is important for equipment? geometry of the lauter tun? Several points of view would be great. I think this aspect (along with a poor grain crush from the store) is my main problem with poor efficiency now (and maybe others too). Thanks - Bryan I guess I'm asking for a lot of information, so pointers to a good reference would be fine, if one exists. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 93 12:01:52 -0400 From: ""Robert C. Santore"" <rsantore at mailbox.syr.edu> Subject: RE: How can I protect my stove? In HBD 1155 Hal Laurent asks about how to avoid brown stains on his stove. Hal, I have the exact same set up you descrived: A 33 qt enameled steel brewpot over two burners of a white enamaled gas stove. I get the same brown stains you do. One obvious source of the brown gunk is wort boil- overs or small drips and spills. I've also found that ANY residue on the stove at the start of the brew session will turn into that impossible stain even if it dosn't look dirty to begin with. While starting out with a very clean stove, and cleaning all spill as they happen will help, I have never had a brew session that didn't leave some stain. The solution is to use oven cleaner after you're all done. Let is soak awhile and you should find that the stain wipes right off. Bob Santore rsantore at mailbox.syr.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 11:08 CDT From: arf at genesis.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling) Subject: Sparging, Octoberfest, pH Testing >From: Jamie Ide 02-Jun-1993 1046 <ide at studio.enet.dec.com> > That is, immerse the chiller in a pot of hot (boiling?) water and run tap water through it to heat sparge water. By playing with the flow rate and the water temp., I ought to be able to get it up to temp. easily. > Has anyone tried this? Any opinions? Ah, yes. Great minds do travel the same paths. You just missed my latest new product announcement. The EASYSPARGER (tm) or easysparger (if you make it yourself) does exactly that with a lot less fuss. It is a small (6 qt) kettle with two barb fittings on it. One goes to a hose and faucet adapter and the other, an inch lower, goes to a piece of stiff tubing that dribbles water into the lauter tun. The kettle sits on the stove and will provide all the sparge water you will ever need with no pre-planning or calculating. On second thought, there is one significant disadvantage of your approach and that is there is no chlorine evaporation in the wort chiller, whereas in the open kettle, most of it is evaporated before getting to the outflow. > I could easily hook up a "showerhead" to the hose output and get a nicely distributed flow over the mash. For the record, a shower head is one of those things that commercial brewers use that have no application in small batches but are so cute that some suppliers just can't resist selling them. If (as it should be) the water level is maintained above the grain level in the lauter tun, it make no difference where or how the water enters as long as it is not a tunneling downpour. >From: tony at spss.com (Tony Babinec 312 329-3570) >Most German Oktoberfest beers have a starting gravity of 1.052 - 1.055, which puts them more in line with the AHA "Vienna" style. > Ferment at 50 degrees F or so. Rack the beer to secondary, and lager for 4 to 8 weeks. I got the idea from the Fix's book that the most fundamental difference between the two styles derived from the fact that the Octoberfest was, by definition, aged for many months, i.e. March to October. If you look at the gravity ranges for the two styles, they just about overlap to the extent that the bottom end of one is the top end of the other. I would think that aging a "Marzen/Octoberfest" for two months would be cheating on the old family recepie. ........... To clarify a point on an earlier posting, my tap water is around 8.1 and upon doughing in, the pH of the mash drops to around 5.5. The point being that if one buffers their water to this range before doughing in, they may be just kidding themselves. js Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 93 08:57:20 -0700 From: Drew Lynch <drew at chronologic.com> Subject: Re: iodine > I'm sure this has been covered before, but here I go again.... Well, sort of.... > The last batch I made, I did the iodine test two ways: 1. I drained a > little out of the spigot at the bottom of my mash/lauter tun (Gott > cooler with copper-pipe manifold). This tested completely starch free > after 20 minutes (the first time I tested it). 2. I pushed the spoon > into the top of the mash and let some fluid run into it. This never > tested clear, even after 1.5 hours. I have been using an identical setup, and have have identical results. My top test did eventually test complete, after 3-4 hours. For a while, I even did overnite mashes to get complete conversion. I ended up with a lot of underbodied, overalcoholic brews. What I have done since then is raised my normal mash temp to the upper end of the range, and stir occasionally. I now get complete conversion top and bottom in less than an hour. The stirring does speed loss of temperature though. - --- My SS keg went to the fabricators today! I am having false bottom supports and a nipple welded into it. I already have the pump, and plan on doing a pseudo-RIMS using my existing King Kooker, the keg and the pump, and graduating to 10 gallon batches as well :-)! Thanks to Rick Larson for all the info! Home of Drew's Brew, Beer Worth It's Malt! Drew Lynch Chronologic Simulation, Los Altos, Ca (415)964-3312 x18 drew at chronologic.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 10:47:56 CST From: "William A Kitch" <kitchwa at bongo.cc.utexas.edu> Subject: Beyond momilies If a momily is an opinion presented as fact, what should we call the following? Al Korz in HBD #1154 re St. Pat's of Texas. [snip] >Furthermore, I'd like to point out that don's wife is the owner of St. Pat's >of Texas (brewing supply) and they do not stock Iodophor rather they stock >a chlorine sanitizer. Wrong. I just last week purchase iodophor from St. Pat's of Texas. [snip] >Finally, don has, in a newsletter, questioned the quality of the DeWolf-Cosyns >Belgian Malts (another item not stocked by St. Pat's of Texas) while on >the other hand, St. Pat's of Texas turns out to be the sole distributor >of Breiss malt in the area. Wrong again. I regularly buy Briess malts from another seller in the Austin area. [snip] >Please note that this is not a flame. I'm simply posting data that I've >collected and am not personally attacking anyone. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^ Perhaps you meant to say ". . . lies that I've made up . . ." I have no particular stake in St. Pat's, it just one of the three local homebrew suppliers I use. I am however amazed at the amount of mis-information spread by some contributors to HBD. Momilies are bad enough, let's at least cut out the completely false statements, Al. WAK Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1993 12:11:34 CDT From: "Roger Deschner " <U52983 at UICVM.UIC.EDU> Subject: Noble Hops Wasteful? *NOT* In the last HBD, Tom Nelson said: >The use of Tettenanger, a finishing hop, in >the full boil is also unusual and wasteful in that the excellent >aromatics will be boiled off. I beg to differ! The use of "noble", low-yeild hops in the full boil improves your beer. The only "waste" is money, but hops are a relatively small part of our financial investment in homebrewing, so I only use the best. As has been discussed here at some length before, hops contribute much more than sheer bitterness, even when used early in the boil. The "other flavors" - not all of which are driven off by an hour of boiling - are a vital part of the incredible complex of flavors in a truly great beer. I say, calculate your bittering units, and then throw bales and bales of Tettenanger, Saaz, or whatever, in, if that's what it takes. The extra buck or two will be well spent. Leave those high-alpha hops for the commercial guys who watch the bottom line. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 12:08:08 EDT From: Lee=A.=Menegoni at nectech.com Subject: OFest Recipe Formulation Regarding the use of German vs Belgian Pilsner malt for Fest recipes. In George Fix's review of Belgian grains he mentions that the Belgian Pilsner pilsner malt is much lower in SMM, the DMS precursor that is a good indicator of the level of malty/sulphury flavor in the brew, than the German malts. I find this component an important part of the flavor and aroma profile of a fest beer like Spaten Ur Marzen and would consider using German malts as the base malts in addition to the highly praised Belgian specialty malts. I would also do a decoction mash. My read of George's review suggests that for Chec style Pilsners, Fest and other lagers with a rich malty profile quality German pils malts are a better choice than Belgian. Are there other factors which out weigh the low SMM that make the Belgian a better choice? Did I miss something? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 14:16:28 -0400 From: djt2 at po.CWRU.Edu (Dennis J. Templeton) Subject: Iodine testing >From yesterday's digest: From: "Spencer W. Thomas" <Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu> Subject: iodine I'm sure this has been covered before, but here I go again.... The last batch I made, I did the iodine test two ways: 1. I drained a little out of the spigot at the bottom of my mash/lauter tun (Gott cooler with copper-pipe manifold). This tested completely starch free after 20 minutes (the first time I tested it). 2. I pushed the spoon into the top of the mash and let some fluid run into it. This never tested clear, even after 1.5 hours. So which one should I believe? I got a great (for me) extraction rate of 31 pts/lb/gal, with wonderfully clear sweet wort, so it would seem that conversion was indeed complete (maybe at 20 minutes). <end> This point is poorly made in the books, I think, but I remeber one text covering it. Iodine will react with powdered husk as well as with starch. In my experience the starch reaction is the purple color that is usually described, and the reaction with husk particles produces a greenish brown color. In a thick solution, with excess iodine around, the two results can be confusing. If you look closely at the husk reaction, you will probably notice that the color is not in the solution, but in tiny particles, with clear fluid in betwen. I have developed the habit to test only runoff that has been pre-circulated a little, as Spencer reports above, and I also dilute it a little, maybe 2:1 with water before adding the iodine. Good luck, dennis Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 14:37:02 CDT From: "Anthony Johnston" <anthony at chemsun.chem.umn.edu> Subject: Oops... Thanks to all who let me know that the town in IA is Adel, not Alden. Tony Johnston Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 13:17:29 PDT From: ng570 at andechs.pnl.gov Subject: taste of yeast starters I have a question concerning how a yeast starter should taste, i.e., whether contamination has occurred or not. The situation is this: after propagating a Wyeast 1084 (Irish) package into several bottles of about 5 oz each (unhopped, O.G. 1.020, fermented completely out), I took one out last night to pitch into a 1 quart starter so that I could brew this weekend. Well for once I decided to taste it to see if there were any problems. Well it was very clean tasting and the 'beer' was very clear (i.e. not cloudy), however it seemed very acidic. Is this typical for this case or do I have a possible contamination of lactic or acetic acid bacteria? I hate to toss out all of these potential starters if I'm just being paranoid, but I don't want to ruin a perfectly good batch of beer either. Thanks for the help, Kirk Peterson - -- Theory, Modeling, and Simulation Molecular Science Research Center Pacific Northwest Laboratory office - (509) 375-6350 FAX - (509) 375-6631 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 16:50:22 EDT From: casagran at gdstech.grumman.com (Lou Casagrande) Subject: Garlic Beer Inquiry Fellow Brewers, A friend of mine is contemplating making a Garlic brew. Actually, he wants to take about 1 six-pack out of another brew and add garlic to it. Does anyone have any advice on the best stage at which to add the garlic? AdvTHANKSance. Lou Casagrande casagran at gdstech.grumman.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1993 15:28:40 -0600 (CDT) From: max!chad at uunet.UU.NET (Chad Sheley) Subject: Micro in Alden, Iowa HBD; There has been a small amount of discussion on a micro-brewery in Alden, Iowa, and subsequently in Adel, Iowa. Well, I did a very small amount of research and called the City Hall in Alden and was informed there was no brewery in Alden. (Dispersed amongst much laughter). Just for reference, the town of Alden is located about 30 miles north of Ames, Iowa off of highway 35 on highway 20. (Not that it matters now.) Now for something that I DO know for sure. I live exactly 3 blocks from the Dallas County Brewing Company in Adel. The other information supplied by other HBDers is correct. The beer is marketed under the name "Old Depot" in reference to the restaurant which is housed in the former Adel railroad depot. The 4 beers that are available _are_ Lager, Porter, Ale, and a Light. The other beers mentioned are only available on tap in the Old Depot Pub which is part of the restaurant. These beers are touted as "Beer of the Month" and are available on a monthly basis, or until the batch runs out. As far as the restaurant goes, the menu is very diverse. I have only been there for the lunch which is pretty normal, but the appetizers and dinner entres are different. I don't know how most micro-breweries work, but in this case the brewery and the restaurant seem to be seperate entities. Which is probably good. I have heard some not-so-great things about the restaurant (ie: service) and since the newness has worn off (The whole thing is only in it's 2nd year.) the parking lot has been sorta empty. At least if the restaurant assumes room temperature, I can still get that beer that I have come to love. :-) ******************************************************************************** * * __ * * Chad A. Sheley * / /___ * * * \ ___\ * * chad at uis.com * |\ \ \ __ * * * | \ \ \ \ \ * * UNIX INTEGRATION SERVICES * \ \ \_\ \ \ * * 11033 Aurora Ave. * \ \_____\ \ * * Urbandale, IA 50322 * \______ / * * (515) 254-3074 * /_/ * ******************************************************************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 05:24:57 PDT From: Scott Lord (CompuCom) <v-ccsl at microsoft.com> Subject: Wort Chiller to Sparge Heater I have a RIM system that works the same way. I have a 15g covered keg as a boiler and pump hot water to a 50gal. double wall insulated storage tank ( it is a old A&W root beer vat) then use two copper coils in parallel (25ft long ) that are summered in the vat and recirculate the mash through it as a temp. boost .I figured out how to keep my mash from sticking when running my RIM system I use a third 11gal converted keg as a "GRANT" what I do is set the flow rate out of my insulated mash tun to the GRANT so the grain does not compact then pump the mash out of the GRANT through the copper coils back to the top of the mash tun. I did two brews this last weekend both of then where wheat ales. 31gal. 11lb wheat malt 29 lb 2row 5 lb carapils 5 lb crystal 40l 4 tsp. Irish moss last 20 min. 4 oz. Saaz (alpha=4.5) boil 1 oz. Tettnang (alpha=4.0) 30 min. 3 oz. Tettnang (alpha=4.0) end of boil 31 gal 28 lb British 2 row 19 lb wheat malt 4 lb carapils 4 oz. centenals boil 1.5 oz. Haller-tau 30 min. 2.5 oz. Haller-tau end of boil mash 76c5min /4min 72c15min/ / 67c15min_/ 7min. / / / 17min / 50c30min.__/ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 93 16:42 CDT From: korz at iepubj.att.com Subject: EDME Brewcraft Barrel/Bleach & SS/St. Pat's of TX correction Joseph writes: >I recently purchased an EDME Brewcraft Barrel. The first batch I put in >was not great. The main problem was it was terribly flat. The barrel is >6 gallons with the CO2 injectors and a release valve that is supposed to >keep pressure up to 10 psi. I think the problem may be that these barrels, most of which are made by or for English companies, are made for storing and dispensing English-style ales, which are considerably less carbonated than American-, Belgian- or German-style beers. You may be able to modify it to keep the beer at a higher pressure, but I think that it would just be better to just store English-style ales in it. ******************************* George writes: > 2. At room temperature (and a normal pH), 304 is resistant to chlorine > as long as the FAC is below 250 mg/l. > >Since our standard 1 oz. bleach per gallon gives a FAC of 100 mg/l, one >could conclude that chlorine bleach can be used to sanitize ss kegs. >Careful brewers will reject this conclusion. The factor of 2.5 is cutting >it too close. Then John writes: >cornelius's, and the bungs and figure 8 gaskets on 1/2 barrels. I had >bartending experience prior to the use of these kegs where I learned about >chlorine test strips to determine the sanitizing power of the solution. I use >in the ballpark of 50 ppm as determined by these strips and I havent had any I put two and two together and thought about what my test strips read. Just as another data point, when I use Bleach solution (bottles, thermometers, glass carboys, etc.) I use one tablespoon per gallon of hot water (and yes, I use only cool water for Iodophor solutions). Testing with chlorine test strips, as I do periodically, results in a reading of 200ppm at the start, dropping from there (how quickly it drops is proportional to how much organic material is stuck to the item being sanitized -- bottle that still contained the yeast from a previous batch will turn your 200ppm solution to something way below 50ppm). Later, George writes: >The version of iodophor I use is called Accord II, and >is made by Diversity. This is the version that has the iodine bound up in >phosphoric acid; the other versions have it bound up in detergents. I use an "Iodophor" that is sold under the name BTF or B.E.S.T. (same stuff, judging from the chemical composision on the labels). It does not contain phosphoric acid, but also does not contain detergents. I know there are versions that do have detergents, and these types are to be avoided for our purposes, but BTF and B.E.S.T. are not of this type and *are* suitable for homebrewing use. ******************************* I must appologise to Lynne O'Conner about posting outdated and incorrect data about St. Pat's of Texas. Without checking, I incorrectly posted that they do not carry Iodophor or the DeWolf-Cosyns malts. I've since been told by two sources that they do, indeed carry these items. My mistake. Sorry. The whole issue of posting information for possible commercial gains is a tricky subject. Even if we don't identify ourselves as retailers or having commercial interests in a particular item, could we be posting information that tends to bias the buying habits of the HBD readership? I think so. I have done my best to be fair whenever I post on a topic. Sure there's a much bigger profit from a package of Wyeast than a package of Lallemand or Coopers... it's easy to bash dry yeast because many people have had bad experiences with it. Most brewers will believe it. I, personally, have had some good experiences with Lallemand and Coopers and have posted favorably about them. I've had private email which has indicated that recent shipments of Red Star (can you believe it!?!) have produced prize-winning beer. I will re-assert myself to continue to try to be unbiased in my posts and urge everyone to do the same. The HBD is one of the best sources of brewing information in the world. On the Brewing Techniques magazine subscription, you will notice there's a question something like: "where do you get most of your brewing information? Personally, I have to say the Homebrew Digest. Even the questions are often as enlightening as the answers, because they make you think and because they make you put yourself in another brewer's apron re-think something you may have done 250 times and come up with an even better way to do it. I started to brew because I could not buy English Bitter here in the states. I continued to brew because I love the art and science of brewing. I opened a homebrew supply store because I have hopes of someday making a living related to brewing. I'm passionate about beer and brewing and have spent hundreds of hours helping brewers not because I hoped to gain their business, but because of my love for the art, the science and the result -- bottom line. Al. Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1156, 06/04/93