HOMEBREW Digest #2963 Thu 25 February 1999

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Ball Valves != Sanitary, Thermowell/Probes, more yeast results from 10% sucrose (Joe Rolfe)
  Two questions... (Jeffry D Luck)
  Fix extraction (Matthew Arnold)
  Re: EASYEAST (bob mccowan)
  Mashing, Sparging, Extraction Efficiency (Drewmeister)
  Hops promote body (ALAN KEITH MEEKER)
  MCAB Recipes (John Varady)
  Propane tank manifold or "t" (Alan Dowdy)
  Racking too soon/keg sanitation (Rob.Green1)
  Yeast Inhibition by CO2? ("Stanley E. Prevost")
  an idea ("Gradh O'Dunadaig")
  Ball valves (Doug Moyer)
  Re: Why RIMS with modified malts? (Jim Snow)
  Alcohol Measurement (AJ)
  valves (Rod Prather)
  Heart of Dixie Brew-Off: Entries due 3/6 ("John W. Rhymes")
  homebrew cooking - lager yeast bread (Scott Murman)
  valves (Rod Prather)
  rowan (Jon Macleod)
  Wood as an Structural Material (Mark_Ohrstrom/Humphrey_Products)
  re : Milling Grains ("Alan McKay")
  My first cider (Mike Isaacs)
  sake stuff (Jim Liddil)
  Phil's Phalse Bottom (Dan Listermann)
  Milling Grain (Dan Listermann)
  RE: Yeast from bottles (LaBorde, Ronald)
  Wort pH (BioCoat)
  Water analysis and Swedish Ale ("Foster Jason")
  Bottled O2 Adapters (Bob.Sutton)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 11:37:35 -0500 From: Joe Rolfe <rolfe at sky.sky.com> Subject: Ball Valves != Sanitary, Thermowell/Probes, more yeast results from 10% sucrose fridge at kalamazoo.net mentioned <snip> >I believe ball valves to be the best overall choice for most >home brewing uses. Ball valves are inexpensive, throttle >liquid flow reasonably well, are easy to clean and sanitize, >and unlike a globe valve, easy to clear obstructions >(like hops) from. <snip> I will agree on all but the sanitation part, no way, no how is a ball valve easy to sanitize. I brewer I know of takes extreme measures to sanitize the ones on his fermenters. To the extent of heating the entire valve up with boiling water in effort to pasturize the hidden recesses, for many, many minutes. Do not use heavy duty flame on them as the seal can be ruined. Alc squirted and flamed in to the opening is a good bet. Dissassembly (if possible might be better - never tried it tho). I dont know how you would even try to sanitize the plastic ball valves I have seen on some of the homebrew gear in magazines. But then I hate plastic like the plague also....I'd rather get the plague. In larger commercial operations - I have only seen ball valves on fermentation gear in A. Pugsley breweries and this friend of mine (above). I do take back the cheaper than butterfly type, I have a 1.5inch ball all 316SS on my brewkettle, used $275(ouch)...1.5inch butterfly can be had for $150 or so. Themowells/Probes If you do purchase the themowell - check the sizes carefully as was mentioned and there is the metalized paste that goes in the well tip to allow contact of the themometer probe to the well. Check a plumbing supply house for this stuff. Triclamp fittings make it easier to move around but raise the cost quite a bit. Good, Cheap, Fast - pick two again.... ****BIG QDA**** All of the yeast(7 so far) I have pull from 10% sucrose storage have come back to life, some more slowly than others, some with some blips during reanimation, but after a few cycles at lab level fermentation all appear to be functional to the levels I remember them and brewnotes remind me. I have since pulled two others and they are starting to make the return from the dead. Time to brew Budwieser and check for defects, this will happen this Saturday. Just another QDA related to 10% sucrose storage...Most of these had been stored for 6-8 years, in cool cellar temps under 10% sucrose (per Rajotte), in about 2.5 ml or a 10ml tube tightly capped. Reanimation by taking loop fulls did not pan out, the entire tube had to be dumped into 5ml. Another reason to make several tubes in the beginning. The 5ml samples were examined under scope, morphology noted, plated and reisolated and built up from there in 2.5ml to 10ml, to 50ml to 250ml to liter at normal room temps with "occasional" daily agitation. The beer was decanted and tasted (one by me) flavor noted. At the liter stage, sterile wort reintroduced and sample repeated. Before use micrcope exam will be done again. I did not have time to do full fermentation performance test/viable cell counts but the all seem to start and finish around the same time frames, and final gravity (from taste only) appears to be close to each other. The gravity will be check more when resonable volumes of beer are available. Good time for clinitest - sorry I did not say that:. - good enuff for me. One thing I have yet to be able to complete is the giant colony. All kinds of GD trouble, I had been doing this with fairly good success on just plain ole agar/wort. Cant seem to get the plates to pour well, eventual mold spores form (after about three to four weeks) and the colonies just never get bigger than 1/4inch diameter. The mold scares me more than the size, right now.... Good Luck and Great Brewing Joe Rolfe Return to table of contents
Date: 23 Feb 1999 09:38:35 -0700 From: Jeffry D Luck <Jeffry.D.Luck at aexp.com> Subject: Two questions... Greetings guru's. I'm new at brewing and so far I'm only doing extract and partial mash batches. In my first try at tweaking a standard recipe, I upped the LME from 6 to 9 lbs (for a 5 gallon batch). I now know what 'fusal taste' is all about. Will this flavor go away over time? It's been in the bottles now for a month. And more importantly, what other adjustments do I need to make in the future if I'm increasing the LME? Also, I am headed out of town soon and I'm wondering how to best transport homebrew on an airplane. Can you check it with your luggage, or is there a risk of freezing it in the cargo hold? Or, can you get it past the carry-on gate without too many stupid questions from the pseudo-cops? Is there a worry about changing altitude & air pressure? Thanks in advance for your help. Jeff Luck Salt Lake City, UT - USA (...where it's NOT currently legal to homebrew. 'Sort of adds to the experience.) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 17:14:06 GMT From: marnold at ez-net.com (Matthew Arnold) Subject: Fix extraction Steve Alexander commented about George Fix's 104F (40C) rest in the last HBD. I myself decided to test it with a recent batch I made. I mashed in with at 1 qt/lb, rested for 30 minutes, then added enough boiling water to get up to my saccrification temperature at 158F (70C). Everything went well enough, but I only noticed a nominal increase in efficiency, well within the noise. I think the problem was that I had to add so much boiling water to get the mash up to 158F that my mash ended up well over 2 qt/lb. My guess is that any efficiency increase was counteracted by the fact that the enzymes were so diluted. Does that sound like a decent assumption? Steve? George? George? Al? Fix uses enough boiling water to get up to 140F (60C) then uses direct heat to get up to 158F. This would give a better mash thickness of about 1.6 qt/lb. I mash in a Gott cooler so direct fire is out for me (I don't like the molten plastic taste in my beer. Call me a perfectionist :) ) FWIW, I used mostly Weyermann Dark Munich with some Melanoidin to make an AlK altbier. I don't know how much longer I can let it "lager" before I lose all control and tap the keg. The Fix HBD blurbs may be found at http://realbeer.com/spencer/FAQ/Fix-mash.html Steve adds regarding mashouts, but it certainly applies to the above discussion: >Pay the maltster the 50 cents and go home early. When I first started all-grain brewing Scott Kaczorowski (sp? You still out there, Scott? Long time, no type!) gave me the sage advice: "Grain is cheap, your time is expensive." If I were a megabrewer, every point of extract would be precious. As a homebrewer, working on a much smaller scale, getting every last point isn't that critical. That's my .02 (.0308 Cdn, probably overpriced), Matt - ----- Webmaster, Green Bay Rackers Homebrewers' Club http://www.rackers.org info at rackers.org Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 12:34:24 -0500 From: bob.mccowan at bmd.cpii.com (bob mccowan) Subject: Re: EASYEAST >Anyone in the area of Hampton, NH using EASYEAST? Joe: According to Don at Stout Billy's in Portsmouth, EASYEAST is produced by a microbiologist from UNH. It started out as a custom product for Stout Billy's, and I guess it has branched out from there. Last time I looked, they had quit a variety of yeast available. I have brewed with it and had no problems. However, even though Don assured me that there is enough yeast to pitch 5 gallons of wort, I think the lag time is too long; I prefer to step the yeast up once before pitching. Bob McCowan Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 13:28:31 -0500 From: Drewmeister <drewmstr at erols.com> Subject: Mashing, Sparging, Extraction Efficiency Once again, I'm joining in late on a discussion on HBD and askiong a fairly remedial question. As of the last 2 years, I have been brewing 25%/75% All-Grain/Extract. This year, my New Year's resolution was to brew more and better beer, as well as to brew at least 50% all-grain. I use a Gott cooler to mash, transfer to a 2 bucket lauter tun, and use a gravity feed Phil's "sparge arm" to sparge. My questions are as follows: 1. Conversion test: never seems to work the way the say. The iodine does not turn color right away, but eventually, little black streaks appear. 2. Recirculation ("vorloff" (sp?)): When taking the first runnings from the lauter tun and recircing, what is the best and easiest way to add the wort back on the top of the grain bed without splashing/channeling the grains. I tried to pour these runnings back into the sparge water tank, but the particles of grains kept making my sparge arm get clogged, so I will not do this again. 3. How is extraction efficiency measured. I remember reading about this, but can't remember where. What are the rules of thumb for gravity/gal/lb of grain??? I used 12 lbs of Crisp British Pale malt, 1 lb crystal and 1 lb Carapils and wound up with only 4 1/2 - 4 3/4 gals after boiling. The S.G was 1.070. 4. Along the lines of the efficiency, should I have added some cold water to get to 5 gals??? I followed the strike water/sparge water/make-up water guidelines in NCJHB and came up a little short. Now if I was at my target 1.060 with 4 1/2 - 4 3/4 gals, I would not worry, but adding a little cold water may have gotten me to my target S.G. of 1.062 (according to the recipe). If measuring S.G. when cool, do you just chill the wort, take S.G. then add water if S.G. is high??? Drewmeister drewmstr at erols.com http://www.erols.com/drewmstr/flyfish.html "Fishing is the part of life that's filled with more or less regular successes, and failures that don't really matter because there'll always be a next time." - J. Gierach Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 14:08:04 -0500 (EST) From: ALAN KEITH MEEKER <ameeker at welchlink.welch.jhu.edu> Subject: Hops promote body Last night my wife came home from the store and presented me with a bottle of hair conditioner. The brand is Willow Lake "Hops, Apricot, and Almond Conditioner." The label says it contains natural hop extract for "increased body." Too bad it doesn't have any hop aroma to it. Maybe I'll add some to the secondary the next time I do a protein rest with today's highly modified malts.. -Alan - ------------------------------------------------------------------ "Graduate school is the snooze button on the alarm clock of life." -Jim Squire -Alan Meeker Johns Hopkins Hospital Dept. of Urology (410) 614-4974 __________________________________________________________________ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 15:08:17 -0500 (EST) From: John Varady <rust1d at usa.net> Subject: MCAB Recipes Howdy folks. I know a few of the MCAB winners are on this list and I was hoping to start a thread of MCAB winning recipes. Following is my porter recipe which took 2nd in Robust Porter. It's an interesting recipe in that it has a vienna malt base, uses a low % of dark malts (6% total) and is fermented with Bavarian Lager yeast. I should have waited for my comment sheets to come back so I could post some tasting notes as well, but I'll post a follow up when they get to me. One thing I can say is that using Bavarian lager yeast gave this beer a much better aroma then I had ever achieved using ale yeast. Without the ale yeast esters, the toasty, bready, malty, coffee, toffee aromas predominate, giving the beer a righteous nose (we'll see what the judges smelled in my follow up post). This recipe has been well relieved in contests and I am happy to say the beer that placed in the MCAB was a different batch from the beer that qualified me. As an aside, I was fortunate enough to taste the first place Tripel brewed by Al Folsom at our home brew club meeting last Thursday. It was exquisite and my glass was way too small. Great beer Al, let's see the recipe! (I'm particularly interested in see Georges Weizen). Without further ado: HBRCP 2.2 Recipe: Name: Pine Box O.G.: 1.053 Style: Robust Porter I.B.U.: 43.5 Volume: 13.0 Gallons A.B.V.: 5.1 Grains/Fermentables Lbs % Hops AAU Grams Min - ---------------------- ----- --- --------- ---- ------ ---- Vienna, German 13.50 54 Galena 10.5 60.00 120 Pale, American 2 Row 5.00 20 Cascade 5.0 56.00 15 Aromatic, Belgian 2.00 8 Spalt 4.7 50.00 0 Biscuit, Belgian 1.00 4 Melanoidin, German 1.00 4 Chocolate, English 1.00 4 Special "B", Belgian 1.00 4 Black Roast, English 0.50 2 Yeast: Bavarian Lager Mash 25 lbs of grain in 10 gallons of water to rest at 151F for 20 mins. Boost slowly to 158F over 30 mins and rest for 40 mins. Drain to collect 7.5 gallons first runnings. Batch sparge with 7 gallons water to collect 14.5 gallons total. Boil down to 13 gallons. Pitch yeast at 58F. Ferment at 50-54F for 2 weeks. Lager in SS at 32F for 4 weeks. - -- John Varady The HomeBrew Recipe Calculating Program Boneyard Brewing Custom Neon Beer Signs For Home Brewers Glenside, PA Get More Information At: rust1d at usa.net http://www.netaxs.com/~vectorsys/varady Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 14:20:43 -0800 From: Alan Dowdy <Alan at Auroracorp.com> Subject: Propane tank manifold or "t" I haven't any experience using propane tanks and burners so forgive me if I am complicating a simple project but.... I am in the final stages of building a 3 tier brew system loosely based on a number of similar systems that I have found on the web. I have two propane tanks and three burners, as all the other systems I've seen seem to have, and this is where I have run into a small hitch. Where does one purchase, or how does one build, a manifold or "t" for connecting both the burners for the liquor tank and mash/lauter tun to one propane tank? I made the mistake of going to a BBQ specialty store where I was told by the young sales assistant that "it can't be done" even though I have seen it done, just not close enough to see how. Is it just a simple fitting that I can pick up as Home Depot. I hesitate to thinks so because the connection between the regulator and tank doesn't look that simple. I am sure that more than a few of you have already crossed this bridge and I would appreciate any guidance you might offer. Thanks again. Alan Dowdy Torrance, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 17:53:20 -0500 From: Rob.Green1 at firstunion.com Subject: Racking too soon/keg sanitation Coupla questions about the above topics. 1) Is it possible to rack to the secondary too soon. I had an Alt in primary for 6 days at 65-70 F and racked before the yeast had all settled out. Was this a mistake? if so can I fix it now? or should I just try to enjoy the possible high gravity finish and possible diacetyl (sp?) flavors that may result from my fermentus interruptus? (too many road runner cartoons as a child). 2) What is the general consensus on sanitizing corny kegs? I am new to kegging (1st batch). I had four corny's donated to my cause by my local Coke guy and did the following prep steps. Rinsed with cold water followed by a hot water rinse followed by a strong bleach solution which was allowed to remain in the keg for 30-45 mins (pressed poppets after the keg was full to make sure sanitizer was in contact with all surfaces) . I then drained the bleach solution and did not rinse yet. The kegs are waiting patiently for the batch mentioned in item #1 at which time I will re-sanitize and rinse one out. I read on an earlier post that bleach solution can harm metal if left to sit too long, should this rule apply to ss kegs also? There's a little pool of the bleach solution at the bottom of the kegs, should I get that out ASAP? Rob Green Live to Brew.....Brew to Live (forgive me Mr. Harley) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 18:13:38 -0600 From: "Stanley E. Prevost" <sprevost at phase4.com> Subject: Yeast Inhibition by CO2? There was a presentation at the National Craft Brewers Conference "Practical Yeast Management in the Brewpub", by David Sohigian, American Brewers Guild. Some supplemental material on yeast used in that presentation can be found at http://realbeer.com/abg/pdf/ibssupplement.pdf There is a section in that material dealing with Inhibitory Effects of CO2 on yeast health and performance. In a nutshell, it says that saturation levels of CO2 cause many changes in the metabolism of the yeast during fermentation, including a decrease in or prevention of cell division. Many other negative effects are described. Assuming these effects are real, there are implications for brewing practice. I will illustrate with a current situation I have. I have two 5-gallon meads in primary fermentation, one using Wyeast dry mead yeast 3632 and one using Wyeast sweet mead yeast 3184. They have been going for about three weeks and both still have about a three second bubble. The 3184 mead is very "fizzy". Any agitation of the carboy results in considerable evolution of CO2. The 3632 mead is mostly flat, showing little of the fizzy character of the other one. There are many differences between the two meads, but one that might have some bearing is that the 3632 mead had about 1/4 tsp of Foam Control used to help suppress foaming during aeration (recommended usage is 1 tsp). Is it possible that this affects the CO2 retention? Although the bubble rate of the sweet mead indicates a healthy fermentation, I wonder if there is any negative effect from the high CO2 level. If this effect of CO2 is real, then one should attempt to maintain maximum yeast health and vigor during fermentation by adopting a practice of degassing during fermentation by some means such as agitation or by using an additive to reduce CO2 retention. Do any of you Wise Ones know anything about this effect? Stan Prevost Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 16:50:02 PST From: "Gradh O'Dunadaig" <odunadaig at hotmail.com> Subject: an idea Hey, Dan Listermann and other engineer-types... so, i live at sea-level and when i am skimming the fecch from my boiling wort, it gets mildly uncomfortable with my paw in my brewpot. your task, should you decide to accept it, is to come up with a gizmo so i don't burn my precious fingers. email me for the street address to send the royalty checks. or, if there is an already existing gizmo, could i please be informed of the location where i might make the purchase? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 20:36:20 -0500 From: Doug Moyer <shyzaboy at geocities.com> Subject: Ball valves In HBD#2960 Rod Prather mentions the non-linearity of ball valves. Since most people I know control ball valves by hand, their non-linear nature is not relevant. But the fact that when you open them up they are truly open is important. It keeps husks and other bits from catching like they _could_ whilst going around the bends in a gate valve. Open the ball valve as far or as little as you need. Does it matter what the angular position is in relation to the flow? Brew on! Doug Moyer Salem, VA Star City Brewers Guild: http://hbd.org/starcity Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 21:48:35 -0600 From: Jim Snow <homebrewer at home.com> Subject: Re: Why RIMS with modified malts? To answer Bruce's question below: If I believe in single temperature mashing, is there any reason to consider a RIMS? I am in the process of upgrading my three-tiered system to RIMS. I am also generally a single infusion mash person. Two benefits I see in switching to RIMS is (1) providing a constant temperature _throughout_ the bed during the mash and (2) easily raising the temp for mash out. I have noticed with my digital thermomether that the temp of my mash bed can vary greatly during my 153F infusion mashes. I hope to improve my extraction efficiency, wort clarity and process repeatability through RIMS. -Jim Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 04:05:27 +0000 From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com> Subject: Alcohol Measurement I sent the following to Simon Wesley in response to his request for info about alcohol measurement. Then I thought that there might be a reader or two (besides Simon) who might be interested in how alcohol in beer is measured. The following is the ASBC Beer-3 method: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Briefly, Boehinger Manheim, now part of Roche, sells a kit for alcohol determination. It costs about $80 and, as the enzymes must be kept cold, must be Fedexed overnight adding about $20 to your bill. Then there is some handling fee so it's a little over $100 when the smoke clears. I think the kit does 30 tests but half of these are blanks i.e. you can really only do 15 tests with a kit unless you run a bunch at one time against 1 blank. A sample at about 0.5% abv is diluted about 100:1 (working from memory here) and 3 mL placed in a cuvet and three mL of DI water in another (the blank). Each of the 2 cuvets has 0.3 mL buffer and an NAD plus AlDH (aldehyde dehydrogenase) tablet added to it. The cuvets must have a closure or be sealed with parafilm to prevent evaporation. The absorbance is measured at 340 nm. Now 0.05 mL of ADH (alcohol dehydrogenase) slurry is added to each and, after a reaction period, the absorbances are measured again. The EtOH content is proportional to the difference of the differences in the absorbance meaurements. The test is extremely sensitive, hence the 100:1 dilution. There is no reason it could not be used for normal alcoholic strength beer as well (in fact there is a simplified procedure for beer, wine, etc.) except for the expense. I saw your post in today's HBD and I can do this testing if you want but I'd have to charge quite a bit and I can't immagine why someone who is obviously enjoying his experiments with LA beer so much would want someone else to do the analysis! [Simon has access to a spectrophotometer] - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The following is a little amplification on the method. The chemistry mimics what goes on in your liver. First, ethanol is oxidized to acetaldehyde by the electron transfer coenzyme NAD+ in the presence of the enzyme alcohol dehydrogenase. In this process, NAD+ is reduced to NADH ADH CH3CH2OH + NAD+ ----> CH3CHO + NADH + H+ Next, acetaldehyde is oxidized to acetic acid by NAD+ in the presence of aldehyde dehydrogenase: AlDH CH3CHO + NAD+ H2O ----> CH3COOH + NADH + H+ The presence of the hydrogen ion on the right shows that the reaction is pH dependent and in the test it is forced to the right by the use of a strong alkaline (potassium hydroxide) buffer. Thus each mole of alcohol oxidized results in 2 moles of NADH. NADH absorbs light at 340 nm (near UV ) and thus the amount of NADH in the cuvet can be estimated from the spectral absorbtion at that wavelength using Beer's law. This is directly proportional to the amount of ethanol in the sample. ASBC method Beer-1 for full strength beers adds 50 mL of DI water to 100 mL of beer and distills the mixture until nearly 100 mL of distillate has been collected. The distillate is presumed to contain all the alcohol from the beer. It is made up to 100 mL with DI water, mixed, and its specific gravity measured with an electronic densitometer of pycnometer. Tables give the % alcohol by weight and volume of the distillate and hence the beer. The residue in the flask is made up to 100 mL and its specific gravity measured. Comparison to the OG of the beer gives the true attenuation. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 06:41:21 -0500 From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net> Subject: valves I'll go with you on the glove valve being a better control mechanish but ball valves are terribly non linear when it comes to controlling flow and have poor resolution due to the 1/4 turn characteristic. What you are saying is that ball valve, though non-linear with a tendency to control flow only near the closed position are desirable because they are easy to clean? So what If I want something that has some resolution and range. My needs for control are a bit more precise than I can get from a globe valve. Globe valves don't seem to be a good answer for brewery applications, too many hiding places. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 22:38:20 +0000 From: "John W. Rhymes" <jwrhymes at mindspring.com> Subject: Heart of Dixie Brew-Off: Entries due 3/6 It's time! Entries are due on March 6, 1999, for the 1999 Heart of Dixie Brew-Off. Judging will be based on the 1998 BJCP guidelines, and we are accepting all styles except Cider. Our special category is Potato Beers, made with at least 20% potato (in any variety or form). Entries in this category should be designated as category 'P'. See http://www.bham.net/brew/brew-off-1999.html for details and entry forms. Entries are $6 and require three bottles. Recipes are required only for the Potato Beer category. We are putting together another excellent judging panel (more judges are certainly welcome!). Last year, we had 37 judges evaluate 155 entries, with 3 judges for each flight. We've got good prizes and we will return your scoresheets promptly. Please include your email address on your registration form to expedite communication. John W. Rhymes -- Birmingham, Alabama jwrhymes at mindspring.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 23:27:02 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Murman <smurman at best.com> Subject: homebrew cooking - lager yeast bread I know there are others out there who have tried this, so please, don't be shy. I've gotten back into sourdough baking, which prompted this experiment. I took the yeast slurry from the primary of a lager, poured it into a quart mason jar, and stuck it into the fridge (aka beer holder) to settle. No sanitation efforts were undertaken, or desired. For some reason, I felt a lager yeast would work better than an ale strain for bread. <shrug> Anyway... I took 1 tablespoon of yeast slurry, and combined it with 1 cup of bread flour and 1/4 cup of water. I kneaded this in my bread machine, and then let it sit for about 4 hours. After 1 hour there was definite action. At 4 hours I added 1/2 cup of wheat flour (I only wanted to make a small loaf to experiment), and again used the bread machine to give the dough a long knead. After the knead, I formed the dough into a round loaf, and let it rise overnight. I intentionally did not add any salt or sugar. In the morning, the dough had at least doubled in size. I slashed the tops of the loaf, glazed it with egg white and water, and baked it for 40 min. at 350F. My oven is small, and I suspect that it bakes to a higher temperature, so you might want to try 400F as a start. It resulted in a decent bread. It isn't the greatest bread in the world, but it certainly is as good as many bread yeast recipes I've seen. By playing with the rise times and H2O amounts you could probably make an interesting loaf. -SM- Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 07:11:36 -0500 From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net> Subject: valves I'll go with you on the glove valve being a better control mechanish but ball valves are terribly non linear when it comes to controlling flow and havX-Mozilla-Status: 0009to the 1/4 turn characteristic. What you are saying is that ball valve, though non-linear with a tendency to control flow only near the closed position are desirable because they are easy to clean? So what If I want something that has some resolution and range. My needs for control are a bit more precise than I can get from a globe valve. Globe valves don't seem to be a good answer for brewery applications, too many hiding places. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 07:28:16 -0500 From: marli at bbs2.rmrc.net (Jon Macleod) Subject: rowan Has anyone on the list ever used rowan berries (from the European Mountain Ash) in brewing; either beer or mead. I've seen it mentioned in quite a few historical texts, but never a recipe. Haven't been able to try any either. The berries themselves are certainly awful (VERY tart), but I've really been curious to try something. Mike Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 22:19:48 -0500 From: Mark_Ohrstrom/Humphrey_Products at humphreypc.com Subject: Wood as an Structural Material Mitchell "Smooth" Surface (sorry, couldn't resist #;-]) asks: > My other question is about stands. I've looked at some of the systems > on the web and noticed that most of them are using metal frames. I > don't weld and don't know anyone who does. I'd like to use a wooden > stand, with perhaps a sheet metal top, but have the obvious concern > about putting a 170,000 BTU gas burner on a piece of wood. Has anyone > done this? I invite anyone with questions about the safety of wood in the vicinity of the open flame/heat of a gas burner to use a handy, yet accurate instrument to predict the relative safety of their application -- the human hand. It's surprising how close that you can hold your hand to the kettle and burner while they are running full tilt. In still air, use either corrugated cardboard or plywood as a shield/reflector/receiver of the radiant heat from the burner. Now, place your hand between the surface and the roaring burner to gauge the heat exposure. Note that wood surfaces would best be smooth and painted a light color -- this to prevent sparks or soot (or spilled wort) to settle on the surface, and to reflect radiant heat. Along with the conducted heat (assuming that you're using the typical burner/stand configuration) you should be nowhere close to the scorch/ignition point of wood. Unlike say, a woodstove installation (perhaps ignored for years), the brew - and the surrounding area - tends to receive close attention during the time that the fire is on. Note: do not use wood directly ABOVE the heat source! (Try placing your hand OVER the flame to confirm why this is so!) Mark in Kalamazoo Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:48:52 -0500 From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at nortelnetworks.com> Subject: re : Milling Grains Jack Schmidling wrote : > Just to keep the record straight, I posted no such thing. It was > the sales manager for that Canadian company who always seems to be > trying to pick a fight. He got nowhere on r.c.b so he lifted that > from my web page and came trolling here in the HBD and now seems > to have gotten a bite. First of all, I have no affiliation whatsoever with Valley Mill. I live in Ottawa where it's made, and I met the guy once when I went to pick up my mill at his house. Just so you know, Jack, I'm considering a law suit to get you to cease and decist this sort of slander against my name. It's outright lies, and I won't put up with it any longer. As for where I lifted the quoted material, I got it from your post to r.c.b, Jack, not from your web page. If you like I can very easily dig up the exact date and time you posted the message, and can give yo all the appropriate article numbers and so on. -Alan - -- Alan McKay Nortel Networks Norstar WinNT 613-765-6843 (ESN 395) amckay at nortelnetworks.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 06:20:23 -0800 From: Mike Isaacs <misaacs at bigfoot.com> Subject: My first cider I usually brew on back-to-back weekends, taking advantage of the previous week's yeast. Last week, instead of brewing, I decided to throw in some apple juice. I racked yesterday and both batches were very acidic. Batch#1 was 5 gallons 100% Gravenstein juice, pasteurized. Batch#2 was 5 gallons Tree Top, pasteurized. Both were added, as is, to the fermenters with 1056 American Ale. Visible signs of fermentation appeared in 3 hours at 65F. Racked to secondary 7 days later. Batch#1 Some apple taste, very, very acidic, little apple aroma. - nice yellow color, cloudy. Batch#2 Less apple aroma and taste than #1, less acidic, too. - clear and pale yellow. I plan to keg one batch for a party in three weeks and bottle the other. Will the taste mellow or does it need some work. I have had thoughts of blending both, after tasting again. I have also thought about lactose, a product I have not used before; or maybe some fruit flavorings. What about adding a can of apple juice concentrate to the kegged batch and force carbonating? Any comments or suggestions? Thanks, Mike Son of a Son of a Aler, misaacs at bigfoot.com Dancing when we go, "Apocalypso IPA" Jolly Mon Brewery, San Ramon, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 07:57:36 +0000 From: Jim Liddil <jliddil at azcc.arizona.edu> Subject: sake stuff Rod Prather Asks <SNIP> >Did the paper give any insight as to why sake ferments to 20%. I have been >told of a phenomena called accomodation where the alcohol tolerance >increases if sugars are added slowly as fermentation progresses. Sake >emmulates this because the koji, or aspergillus fungus, that produces the >sugars continues working after the yeast is added to the rice liquor so >conversion and fermetation takes place simultaneously. I have wondered if >the principle could be applied to high alcohol beers. Again I suggest For starters (grin) read CRC Critical Reviews in mIcrobiology "Ethanol tolerance in Yeasts" Vol 13, Issue 3. This review article covers all this stuff and more. and if you get all the cited references you end up with quite a collection of cool articles.:-) The bottom line is that there really is not much difference in brewing (beer, wine, sake distilling) yeasts and their ability to ferment to a given alcohol level. I am only refering to s. cerevesiae. And the bottom line is is the final prodcut drinkable? All of this stuff about FAN, oxygen etc. is mentla masturbation if the final result is undrinkable swill. Keep in mind that for the majority of the worlds brewers the beer the brew has to SELL! If it does not then they go out of business. We as homebrewers can do all the funny stuff we want only being limited by our budgets. And if all I want is high alcohol beer I'll make some barleywine and fortify it with the 200 proof ethanol. Now there's an idea. Jim Liddil Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 10:14:11 -0500 From: Dan Listermann <72723.1707 at compuserve.com> Subject: Phil's Phalse Bottom Rick Georgette writes: <By itself Phils false promise bottom is difficult to use. Grain easily slips past it and it floats in water making it difficult to mash in. I have used a simple solution to make this work in a round cooler. Simply slit a piece of tubing and slide it around the circumference of the screen. This not only holds it in place, but it prevents grain from flowing aroung the screen causing a stuck sparge.> As I have explained here before, if you use the strike method where you put all the water in the mash tun before adding the grist this sort of problem can happen. For a number of reasons it is better to add the grist and water effectivly at the same time by adding a pan of water followed by a pan of stirring between additions. I don't have problems with stuck mashes when I do this. Lately I have found an even better way to strike. I connect the output of my hot liquor tank to the output of the mash tun and underlet the strike water while I stir in the grist No more switching pans and I get a very controled mix without balling or exposure of enzymes to excessive temperatures. Rick's gasket is very effective and harmless, but I haven't found it to be necessary. Dan Listermann dan at listermann.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 10:43:26 -0500 From: Dan Listermann <72723.1707 at compuserve.com> Subject: Milling Grain Jack Schmidling writes: <BTW, Sieble uses a motorized and timed shaker so I would not be surprised if someone got different results hand shaking the sieves.> The second public testing of the Maltmill's grist distrubution was performed at the Oldenburg Brewery. It was performed with their mechanical shaker. The results bore no resemblance to the distribution that is in Jack's promotional material. To my knowlege Jack has never released the actual numbers he got from the tests at the Seible Institute. If I am incorrect in this, I would appreciate a copy. Oldenburg let me borrow their shaker long enough to develope a method of producing the same distribution manually. My offer stands. I will lend my seives to anyone willing to give it a go and report their results. Dan Listermann dan at listermann.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 09:42:10 -0600 From: rlabor at lsumc.edu (LaBorde, Ronald) Subject: RE: Yeast from bottles >>>> From: Petr Otahal <potahal at postoffice.utas.edu.au> Why doesn't everyone just restart their yeast from their own home brew bottles by building up from the sediment in the bottle? Isn't this a lot less complicated than having to use agar and stuff? Surely you could do this at least a few times without getting many mutations and the like. <<<< I did this once, and it worked well, just as you might imagine. I guess it is not done more often because of some sort of paranoia/AR fears about unseen bacteria. Ron Ronald La Borde - Metairie, Louisiana - rlabor at lsumc.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:30:40 EST From: BioCoat at aol.com Subject: Wort pH Can anyone tell me the significance of proper wort pH. What should the correct pH be before and after the boil? Thanks Rick Georgette Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 11:49:00 PST From: "Foster Jason" <jasfoster at hotmail.com> Subject: Water analysis and Swedish Ale Greetings Fellow Brewers, I am a moderate, intermediate all-grain brewer of 5 years. In a quest to improve my beers, I am on a search. I find my dark beers (stout, porter, brown ale, dunkel) turn out excellent and I am very pleased with their taste. However, I am usually disappointed with my lighter-coloured beers. There is usually a sour off-taste, sometimes more, sometimes less. In particular, my efforts to brew kolsch and pale ales have left me underwhelmed. So, I am searching for a cause. There are a number of possibilities my set-up is crude by many standards), but my latest theory is my water composition. I use our municipal tap water and add 1 to 2 tsp of gypsum. I wonder if this is adequate. Our water analysis looks like this: chlorine=2.5 mg/L chloride=2.8 mg/L flouride=.8mg/L calcium=80 mg/L total hardness (as CaC03)=150 mg/L sulphate=60mg/L sodium=4 mg/L pH=8.2 Other elements such as mercury, lead, iron and manganese are at negligible levels. Is there something else I should be doing? My second question: I notice on my packs of Wyeast liquid yeast that they have a yeast strain for "Swedish Ale". I am a self-described Swedeophile and would love to brew one. Does anyone have a recipe and/or a description of Swedish Ale? Thank you to all. Jason Foster Edmonton, Alberta, Canada ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 14:45:34 -0500 From: Bob.Sutton at fluordaniel.com Subject: Bottled O2 Adapters I thought I'd set up an aeration rig using bottled oxygen, instead of the old aquarium pump. Off to Home Depot and I found O2 can (BenzOMatic) for about $7. Fine so far... huh ? Well not quite. The O2 cylinder needs to be fitted with a valve that actuates an internal release valve inside the O2 cylinder - much like a Schraeder valve on a bicycle. AND it takes a left-handed thread (good-bye Home Depot). I really don't want to by a whole cutting rig just to get to the O2 shut-off valve. Has anyone adapted a BenzOMatic O2 cylinder. I'd appreciate some hints. If one doesn't have ready access to medical O2, or is welding-impaired, what solutions remain. Am I left with the aquarium pump. >From the foothills of Sawth Cariliner, Bob Fruit Fly Brewhaus Yesterdays' Technology Today Return to table of contents
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