HOMEBREW Digest #3829 Thu 03 January 2002

[Prev HBD] [Index] [Next HBD] [Back]

		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org


          Northern  Brewer, Ltd. Home Brew Supplies
        http://www.northernbrewer.com  1-800-681-2739

    Support those who support you! Visit our sponsor's site!
********** Also visit http://hbd.org/hbdsponsors.html *********

  How to convert keg to brew pot? ("Tray Bourgoyne")
  Post ferment dilution (Brett Hetherington)
  Old Potrero ("Fred Waltman")
  re: Target Gravity (John Schnupp)
  RE: Wort recirculation thru CFC (Dean Fikar)
  all wheat beers? (Steven S)
  Re: Target Gravity (measuring boil-off rate) ("Fred L. Johnson")
  Propylene Glycol Alginate (ksc58)
  Light vs. Dark Extract Fermentables ("Andrew Moore")
  Making Root Beer ("Stephen Rockey")
  RE: Target Gravity ("Steven Parfitt")
  Re: Brix to SG conversion (Demonick)
  Boston Homebrew Competition / MCAB5 Qualifying Event ("John B. Doherty")
  2ndary fermentation and rackings ("Ralph Davis")
  New Years Brewing Questions ("Hedglin, Nils A")
  beer article (Ed Jones)
  thermocouples (David Passaretti)
  Re: Yeast Reproduction Limit? ("Steve Alexander")
  re: Target Gravity ("gmc")
  Re: barley cereal mash questions (Jeff Renner)
  Re: Something new (Bierschnapps) (Jeff Renner)
  Solera Ale; was Re: New Zymurgy (Jeff Renner)

* * Show your HBD pride! Wear an HBD Badge! * http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/shopping * * Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy! * Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org FROM THE E-MAIL ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!** IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, you cannot subscribe to the digest as we cannot reach you. We will not correct your address for the automation - that's your job. The HBD is a copyrighted document. The compilation is copyright HBD.ORG. Individual postings are copyright by their authors. ASK before reproducing and you'll rarely have trouble. Digest content cannot be reproduced by any means for sale or profit. More information is available by sending the word "info" to req at hbd.org. JANITOR on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2002 22:16:08 -0600 From: "Tray Bourgoyne" <tray at netdoor.com> Subject: How to convert keg to brew pot? Thanks for all the help on my questions of late! I just returned from New Orleans. Mike Karnowski of Brew Ha Ha Homebrewing supplies helped me purchase my first beer ingredients kit ( Nut brown ale) and a few other things I needed to complete my kit. One of the final things I want is a larger brew kettle. I have a old 15 gallon keg that I want to use. I'm looking for instructions on how to convert this keg to a brew kettle. I have searched the web with no luck. I need the specific instructions and anything I should add to make it a better brew pot. Thanks, Tray Bourgoyne Raymond, MS Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 01 Jan 2002 21:22:33 -0700 From: Brett Hetherington <Bretth at idcomm.com> Subject: Post ferment dilution Howdy Wortheads, I figured some of you might find this interesting... Like the rest of you, I'm cursed with lite beer swillin relatives who think beer with taste is a bad thing. In an attempt at familial harmony, I decided to try an experiment with batch #13, which was a wheat ale, OG 1046, fg 1006. I put 2 gallons of wheat ale in my 2.5 gallon firestone keg along with 60 fluid oz. of boiled water and 4 fluid oz. of Everclear. My intent was to lighten the taste while leaving the alcohol content the same. I force carbonated 24 hours at 30 lbs. I'm not disappointed with the results! It's a lighter bodied version of my delicious wheat. The malty taste is still incredible, which is typical for my recipe. Not bragging, ok yes I am. Anybody desiring a brew for the lite beer swillin masses should give this a try with their favorite recipe. Brett Hetherington, Aurora, Colo. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2002 23:48:49 -0800 From: "Fred Waltman" <fwaltman at mediaone.net> Subject: Old Potrero David Craft asks about Old Potrero: Its not called Whiskey (or even Whisky) because it isn't aged long enough. Distilled grain spirits have to be aged for 3 or 4 years (I forget which) and O.P. is not aged very long (2 years sticks in my head, but I'm not 100% sure of that). Nothing to do with the grain bill or location it was distilled. Hope this helps. Fred Waltman Los Angeles, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2002 23:55:15 -0800 (PST) From: John Schnupp <johnschnupp at yahoo.com> Subject: re: Target Gravity From: "gmc" <gmc at setel.com> >I do a 10 gallon batch and this has posed a problem for me. It would be nice >to know exactly how much volume is being boiled away so I can stop or go a >little longer with boil if needed. > >Has anyone thought about collecting the steam during the boil and condensing >it back into some measurable volume/weight? I have never tried to collect/measure the condensate from the boil. I assume it could be done. One thing to keep in mind is that the boiloff rate is depends on how "strong" the boil is. If you are like me, I assume that you typically boil so that wort is boiling at about the same rate from batch to batch. I think think you should be able to find the answer to your question with some careful note taking. Record the volume of the wort you collect before you begin to boil. Boil at your normal rate. After you have filled your fermenters, you will need to determine how much wort was trapped in the various components of your system (left in kettle, trapped in hops, left in chiller, etc ...) You will then need to calcualte. Evap rate = (1-fermenter volume+losses/preboil volume)/boil time If you use ProMash, use the water needed function. Plug in all the volumes and then adjust the evaporation rate till you get the collected volume to be correct. After a couple batches, you should have a pretty decent average for your system. This seems a lot easier to me than trying to go to all the work to build something to collect the condensate. After all, you will only use that special equipment a few times too. ===== John Schnupp, N3CNL ??? Hombrewery [560.2, 68.6] Rennerian Georgia, VT 95 XLH 1200, Horse with no Name Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 04:34:26 -0800 From: Dean Fikar <dfikar at swbell.net> Subject: RE: Wort recirculation thru CFC Steve A. writes: "Another suggestion is to recirc iodophor solution thru the pump, CFC and tubing for 20' prior to recirc'ing hot wort. Hot wort is not a sufficient sanitizer. This step was critical to getting a clean (no infection in unpitched wort after 72hr) wort test from my system." Interesting comments. I thought that hot wort would be an effective sanitizer if given enough time. Fix, in "Analysis of Brewing Techniques", suggests that a 10 minute contact time is sufficient (100K reduction in cell counts) for even thermophilic bacteria at near boiling temperatures. This is a bit longer than I recirc but he also writes that if you keep your equipment scrupulously clean you should be okay with a 1K microbial reduction. Perhaps I need to do another wort stability test soon even though I don't think I've had any significant infection problems lately. Comments? Dean Fikar Fort Worth, TX Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 07:24:27 -0500 (EST) From: Steven S <steven at 403forbidden.net> Subject: all wheat beers? I am wanting to try a all wheat beer, 100% grain bill is wheat (white winter wheat). Has anyone tried this that cares to comment? Steven St.Laurent ::: stevensl at 403forbidden.net ::: 403forbidden.net [580.2, 181.4] Rennerian "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem." -- President Ronald Reagan, 1985 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 07:59:05 -0500 From: "Fred L. Johnson" <FLJohnson at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Re: Target Gravity (measuring boil-off rate) "gmc" asks how to determine his boil off rate: First of all, it would be polite for posters to provide their name with their posts. (I beg gmc's forgiveness if gmc is actually his name.) Second, one can determine one's typical boil-off rate by measuring 1)the volume in the kettle before and after several boils and 2) measuring the exact length of each boil. Simply calculate the boil-off rate (volume change per minute) for each boil and average the various values. The more times you measure the boil-off rate, the more representative your average value will be. If your heat supply is set about the same every time you boil, you should get a fairly small standard deviation for these boil-off rates. To determine the volume change in your kettle during the boil, you must calibrate some type of volume measuring device. Cumulatively add 1 gallon of water at a time to your kettle, measuring the height of the cumulative volumn on a yardstick (preferably metal) with each addition, and plot the cumulative volume in the kettle vs. height on your yardstick. This plot applies to COLD volumes, not boiling wort. The plot will not be a straight line if you use a barrel shaped keg for a boiling kettle, but it will be a straight line if you use some type of cylindrical container for a kettle. Use the above plot to look up the volume loss of your worts during the boil by simply measuring the volume (height) before the boil (i.e., before the wort gets very hot) and after each boil (after it cools). You will have to use use an immersion chiller to do this, and remove the chiller before making your measurement of the cooled wort. If your height vs. volumne plot for your kettle is a straight line, you can calculate a linear fit to the points and use the formula for calculating the volume change instead of reading it off of your plot. (One can ignore the small volume added to the kettle by hops.) Just be sure to measure the volume of your wort in the kettle before it gets very hot. - -- Fred L. Johnson Apex, North Carolina USA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 08:41:46 -0500 (EST) From: ksc58 <kcada at cas.org> Subject: Propylene Glycol Alginate Happy New Year! I've been given a kilogram of propylene glycol alginate. I've read that this is used in the brewing industry for head retention/stabilization for beer and I'm curious to know how much of this is used per gallon and during which brewing step it's added. I assume a kilo will probably stabilize a few barrels! I would guess that this is added somewhere between pitching and kegging/bottling. Does anyone have any info about this stuff? I'd like to use it on some of the light lagers I make as well as homemade rootbeer. Please don't send the Reinheitsgebot Police after me! Ken Cada kcada at cas.org Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 08:51:51 -0500 From: "Andrew Moore" <abmjunk at hotmail.com> Subject: Light vs. Dark Extract Fermentables The past couple of days have featured some great posts regarding yeast and the fermentation process. There's a wealth of knowledge here. On to the question(s): I have noticed, in the course of a few batches that, according to extremely unscientific data, a batch made with light extract will finish at a lower specific gravity than one made with dark extract. Both batches started around the same OG (+/- 1.060), but the dark finished around 1.020 while the light finished around 1.010. I know that many of the specialty grains contain few fermentables, while contributing to the OG. Is is correct to think that dark extract has fewer fermentables than light? If so, is there a known factor that could be used in recipe design to relate dark to light extract quantities? For example, quantity "x" of LME plus quantity "y" of roasted grains (black patent, chocolate, etc.) equals quantity "z" of DME in OG? Or, perhaps the factor could be expressed in percentage of fermentables for given weight of LME and DME? Finally, based on response to the above, where does amber extract fall in the continuum? Thanks. Andrew Moore Richmond, Virginia Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 08:16:54 -0600 From: "Stephen Rockey" <christ at egyptian.net> Subject: Making Root Beer Hello, I want to make some Root Beer for my kids. I have a container of concentrate, and the 2 liter bottles. The only question I have is, How much year do I use for a 4 gallon batch, or how much per 2 liter bottle? The direction I have indicate how much to use for a 12 oz bottle, and I could extrapolate, but I would like to know exactly. I searched the net and found many recipes for Root Beer, but none addressed this question. Thanks, Steve Rockey Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 09:26:35 -0500 From: "Steven Parfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com> Subject: RE: Target Gravity GMC querries: >I will toss this one out there to see if anyone else had similar >thoughts >on measuring boil-off, or even tried something of the sort to >accurately >measure the loss of volume during the boil. >If my calculations are correct, +/- a half gallon can move the old >hydrometer a couple of points either way. Although this may sound >trivial >to some, a couple points here and a couple points there seems >to add up to >something other than what I intended. >I have read about folks using measuring sticks, or whatever you call >it, >to measure fluid levels during the boil. With the idea that the >density of >water changes during the boil makes this whole idea just a >little >subjective to me. ....SNIP... >Has anyone thought about collecting the steam during the boil and > >condensing it back into some measurable volume/weight? The collection idea seems a bit complicated to me since you have to cool the steam and recover it, and be very carefull not to let any escape(which would essentialy require a closed system). Not to mention the possibility of trapping some of the volitiles we are trying to get rid of (due to restriction in a closed system). I just finished making a "measureing stick" by cutting a 3' section of copper water line (1/2") and pressing four straight couplings on it. The couplings were pressed (Hammered) into position to indicate 3, 6, 9, and 12 gallons. I measured cold water in 3 gallon batches and heated them on the stove, then added them to the boiler (after adding enough water to account for what will remain in the boiler when it is drained) to get the proper positions of the couplings. I can interpolater between them for measuring other ammounts. It seems easier to me to measure what is left in the boiler, rather than measuring what was removed. Besides, I never accuratly measure my sparge water. I sparge till it hits 1.010 and boil till I have the required 11 gallons left(or whatever I target). Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery http://thegimp.8k.com Johnson City, TN 5:47:38.9 S, 1:17:37.5 E Rennerian "Fools you are... who say you like to learn from your mistakes.... I prefer to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid the cost of my own." Otto von Bismarck Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 07:45:56 -0800 From: Demonick <demonick at zgi.com> Subject: Re: Brix to SG conversion Here is yet another conversion formula: /* ** Formula was derived from the 69th edition (1988-1989) of the CRC Handbook ** of Chemistry and Physics, "Concentrative Properties of Aqueous Solutions: ** Conversion Tables", Table 88 Sucrose ** ** MathCAD was used to curvefit the data for Degrees Brix at 20 C (% sucrose ** by weight) and specific gravity at 15 C ** ** SG = 1.000898 + 0.003859118*B + 0.00001370735*B^2 + 0.00000003742517*B^3 ** ** where: ** ** B = measured refractivity in Brix ** SG = calculated specific gravity at 15 C ** */ Domenick Venezia Venezia & Company, LLC Maker of PrimeTab (206) 782-1152 phone (206) 782-6766 fax Seattle, WA demonick at zgi dot com http://www.primetab.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 08:15:11 -0800 (PST) From: "John B. Doherty" <dohertybrewing at yahoo.com> Subject: Boston Homebrew Competition / MCAB5 Qualifying Event Dear Fellow Beer Enthusiasts, The Boston Wort Processors are pleased to formally announce the Eighth Annual BOSTON HOMEBREW COMPETITION (BHC8) to be held on February 9th, 2002! This competition is run by the Boston Wort Processors Homebrew Club and is a BJCP Registered Event. The competition will be held at the Watch City Brewing Company in Waltham, MA, just west of Boston. This competition will again be the Northeast Regional Qualifying Event for the 5th year of the Masters Championship of Amateur Brewing (MCAB) Competition! (http://hbd.org/mcab/) The BHC8 page on our club website (http://www.wort.org/bhc.html) lists the qualifying styles for MCAB5. This competition will also be the 2nd of five in the 2002 New England Homebrewer of the Year (http://mail.symuli.com/NEHBOTY) circuit. All BJCP Styles will be judged, including Cider and Mead. The Entry Deadline has been set as Friday February 1, 2002 and the entry fee is $5.00 per entry. We will also need judge and steward support, so please come and help us out if you can! On February 9th, the entries will be judged in morning and afternoon sessions with a complimentary lunch served to judges and stewards. A public Best Of Show judging and Awards Presentation will follow the afternoon session. Watch City Brewing Company's Head Brewer, Aaron Mateychuk, will also select a Brewmaster's Choice Award from among the BOS finalists. The lucky entrant who wins the Brewmaster's Choice will get to assist Aaron in brewing a brewpub sized batch of their beer at Watch City!!! All of the information one needs to enter the competition or to judge or steward in the competition can be found at: http://www.wort.org/bhc.html including entry forms, bottle labels, judge registration forms, drop-off and ship-to info, etc. We encourage everyone who is interested in this competition to obtain information through the website as it will be continually updated there. Feel free to send me email at dohertybrewing at yahoo.com with questions you might have. Spread the word and we look forward to judging your entries!! Cheers and Happy Brewing! John B. Doherty Head Organizer for the 2002 Boston Homebrew Competition (BHC8) dohertybrewing at yahoo.com 978-670-6987 (w) 508-923-6376 (h) Surf to http://www.wort.org/bhc.html for all competition details!! Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 12:20:00 -0500 From: "Ralph Davis" <rdavis77 at erols.com> Subject: 2ndary fermentation and rackings Happy New Year all! I have a question for the experienced beerlings among you: What are the best methods and how long should one do 2ndary fermentations? (I know some people don't do any) According to the book, "Beer Captured" by the Szamatulskis, (successor to "Clonebrews"), one can leave a beer in the 2ndary carboy with an airlock for months... Actually for a couple of recipes I made recently they recommend an 8 week 2ndary. When, after a week or so, I see nearly an inch of trub on the bottom of the 2ndary carboy, I've racked it to another fully sanitized carboy for clarity and taste's sake. Is this a wise procedure? I just don't like the idea of the beer sitting on top of the trub for weeks. Anyway, I'd like to hear some of the old boys' advice.... Oh, by the way, "Beer Captured" has some great recipes.... fully 1/3 of which are for Belgian creations.... Ralph W. Davis Leesburg, Virginia [395.2, 121.8] Apparent Rennerian "Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -Benjamin Franklin Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 09:48:26 -0800 From: "Hedglin, Nils A" <nils.a.hedglin at intel.com> Subject: New Years Brewing Questions Hi all, Ran into some problems & questions with a batch I did yesterday. 1) I did a starter of White Labs English Ale Yeast 002. It seemed not to ferment much, I never saw the airlock moving at a quick rate. But when I pitched it, there was about 1" in the bottom of the gallon jug, so it must have done something. Just to be sure, I checked the gravity & it looked like it only dropped about 6-8 points, so less than 1% alcohol. Is this normal? I noticed there was what looked like a very thin white strata in the middle of the yeast sediment. Any idea of what this is? Everything seems to be fermenting fine now, I achieved wort fermentation after about 6-7 hours. Also, I keep reading about people doing various sizes of starters (1 pint, 1 quart). Does that measurement indicate the amount of wort that the yeast is put into, or the about of yeast collected? I assume the former, since 1 quart of yeast seems like a lot. 2) What part of the brewing process causes DMS? I kept the lid on the kettle while steeping the specialty grains for 30 mins & afterwards while the wort was heating up to a boil. I took it off once it reached about 200 degrees. 3) Unfortunately, I ran out of propane just before the wort reached boiling. I had to run out & get my tank refilled. By the time I came back, it had been about 25 minutes & it had cooled back down to about 180. Will this cause a problem or affect the batch, & if so, how? I had already taken the grains out, so they didn't have additional steeping time. 4) Being flustered by running out of propane, when the wort started to boil, I added the hops, forgetting to add the extracts. After boiling for about 8 minutes, I realized what I had done, shut off the heat & added the liquid extract. It took about 20 minutes to reach boiling again. Will this cause a problem or affect the batch, & if so, how? I noticed that the wort had a very green grassy taste, so I'm assuming this effectively added a 20 min steep of the bittering hops that extract more flavor. I still made sure to have a total of 60 minutes of boiling time. 5) This batch is a Newcastle clone & called for 1/2 lb of Dark Brown Sugar. Once I turned the heat back on, a thick brown foam/scum appeared on the top of the wort. It stuck around for quite some time & actualy turned into a whitish foam with a crusty brown top. Was this because of the Brown Sugar, the hops reacting to adding the extract/sugar out of order, or something else? 6) I noticed when I put my immersion chiller into the wort, that the boil stopped for about 3 minutes. Should I be concerned about that & add extend the boil that amount of time, or just not worry about it? Thanks, Nils Hedglin Sacramento, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 13:56:48 -0500 (EST) From: Ed Jones <ejones at ironacres.com> Subject: beer article Here's a good article from Today's Chemist. http://pubs.acs.org/subscribe/journals/tcaw/10/i12/html/12filmore.html - -- Ed Jones - Columbus, Ohio U.S.A - [163.8, 159.4] [B, D] Rennerian "When I was sufficiently recovered to be permitted to take nourishment, I felt the most extraordinary desire for a glass of Guinness...I am confident that it contributed more than anything else to my recovery." - written by a wounded officer after Battle of Waterloo, 1815 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 11:03:22 -0800 (PST) From: David Passaretti <dpassaretti at yahoo.com> Subject: thermocouples I am currently using a HERMS based on 15.5 gal Sanke kges. I have a three way ball valve that directs the reciirculating wort to either a 50ft coil within the HLT or directly bak to the mash tun. I generally leave the pump running (and the wort recircualting) throughout the entire mash. If the temp of the mash gets a little low, a flip the ball balve until the temp is stabilized. I was hoping to automate this some sort of controller, thermocouple, and solenoid valves. There seem to be many types of TCs (K,J,T). Does anyone know what the best kind to sue is? Also, could I use a regular temp controller like the ones in Beer, Beer, and more Beer, or do I need a PID controller? Will PID controllers open/close a Solenoid? Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. David Passaretti Cincinnati, OH Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 16:09:17 -0500 From: "Steve Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Re: Yeast Reproduction Limit? Bill asks ... >I have > read, somewhere, that you can aerate again, especially with big beers, > 12-14 hours after fermentation starts. [...] >My question is, would this be a good practice to do > regular, just on big beers, or maybe not at all? Glen Pannicke's post included a very relevant nugget that deserves expansion. Making good beer and making healthy yeast fermentations are two different things. Aerating at any time in the fermentation is good for the yeast, but aerating wort/beer is always bad (or at least not good) for beer flavor. Good beer making methods must walk the rather broad line between good yeast growth, attenuation and preventing off flavors from yeast nutritional deficits versus excess of oxidation products or FAN, etc that will negatively impact flavor or stability of the beer. Aerating wort when it is cool, pitched and before alcohols and esters have formed minimizes the potential flavor damage to the beer, so you should always aerate wort at pitching time. You may need to aerate wort again later into the fermentation, but there are some judgement calls involved. First there are big variations in the amount of O2 a particular yeast needs for proper growth. Some yeast improve performance (long term - over many repitchings) up to saturation levels of air around 8ppm and perhaps beyond, while others plateau at only 4ppm of dissolved O2. Knowing your yeast pays dividends, but it's a difficult thing to judge. If you try more O2 and it doesn't help, maybe that's normal for that yeast. Don't continue adding more and more O2 just for grins. Try it - see if it helps - and let the yeast tell you what it likes (keep notes). Next, what you are asking for in terms of yeast growth ? If you have "normal" gravity (<13.5P) wort you can almost always succeed by aerating once and pitching at recommended levels. If you underpitch then you are asking for more yeast growth. "[...] OG was 1080, 5 gallons. I made a qt starter [...]" is classic HB underpitching. If this was a step-up starter and not reactivation of a big slurry then it's underpitched by about 3X. A10% starter size (2qt for 5gal) is suggested for 12P ale wort, and proportionately more as the gravity increases. Also high gravity wort requires more yeast growth per unit wort (per liter or gallon) in order for the yeast to reproduce up to the attenuation limit. High gravity wort does have more sugar, more FAN and more nutrients per gallon, but it can only hold similar levels of O2 from aeration as normal wort. Additional late aeration makes sense in underpitched and/or high gravity worts. High gravity wort introduces three additional stresses on yeast; high osmotic pressure, high CO2 content and high ethanol levels. All of these stresses are reduced when yeast have better, less permeable cell membranes. This means adequate levels of UFAs and sterols which require oxygen. Personally, if I was making a barleywine or a 20P wee-heavy I'd include a late aeration in the schedule. Another useful method is an open primary fermentation which introduces small amounts of O2 over an extended period of time. When aerating late I don't think a cut-off time in hours is a very reliable guide, tho' you *may* be able to aerate up to 24 hours after pitching. A better rule of thumb is to stop active aeration about the time first CO2 bubbles start for normal gravity wort at recommended pitching rates. You can aerate later than this as the pitching rate increases - for example in 20P wort well pitched wort you should be able to aerate later. The reasoning and guesswork surrounding this recommendation have to do with the an understanding of when yeast are capable of making sterols and UFAs from available oxygen. After some initial period yeast are less apt produce lipids even if oxygen is available. This is only a rule of thumb - mind you. Listen to your yeast. Don't sweat a few hours either way. If you smell ethanol and esters (if the bubbles smell more like beer than wort) you're best off avoiding active aeration.- period. == Dom Venezia asks ... >(what ever happened to Paul Erhlich and the Council of Rome?) He's busy co-authoring more alarmist tripe with some other ChickenLittles.! There's more job security in (re-)predicting the end of the world than I would have imagined. -S Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 20:54:08 -0600 From: "gmc" <gmc at setel.com> Subject: re: Target Gravity Fred L. Johnson Wrote: First of all, it would be polite for posters to provide their name with their posts. (I beg gmc's forgiveness if gmc is actually his name.) ********* Ah shucks Fred, don't worry about it, I forgive you. I would like to thank those of you that made such generous and informative responses to my post. Seems that it may be a good idea to let the steam evaporate after all. I have two or three good ideas now to explore and thanks so much for steering me back on to the road. Relax, don't worry, get a measuring stick.... Cheers!!! gmc Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 13:39:11 -0500 From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at mediaone.net> Subject: Re: barley cereal mash questions Catching up. Rob Dewhirst <rob at hairydogbrewery.com> writes: >I am planning to use some unmalted barley in a dry stout this weekend. I am >doing a cereal mash as a substitute for flaked barley, but everyone seems to >have a different method. I've read Renner's articles in the hbd archives, >but he speaks of corn and rice, not barley. Actually, the reason for a cereal mash with unmalted rice and corn (maize) is that the gelatinization temperatures of their starches is above the temperature of ordinary mashes. Barley starch gelatinizes below mash temperatures. So a cereal mash is not actually necessary, although it won't hurt, and will probably make the conversion a little more time-efficient. >First, I assume I mill the barley before the cereal mash? Yes, whether you use a cereal mash or just put it into the mash raw. >Second, how long do I boil? I've seen ranges mentioned from 10 mins to 6 >hours. Same as for rice/corn? Since gelatinization is the reason for boiling, it's fort of a moot question. I'd say 20 minutes should be ample. >Third, what does this do to the water required for the regular mash? Do I >go ahead and add my usual 1.33 quarts/lb for the cereal mash even though it >has water added already? My inclination is to add NO water to the regular >mash to account for the added cereal mash. How does the water retained in >these spent grains compare to others? Do they retain a lot more or less >water? Take into account the water in your cereal mash. I generally use about the same amount in the cereal mash as in a regular mash, so it all comes out even in the end. >Finally, Renner mentions adding a percentage of malted barley to the cereal >mash of corn or rice. Is this a good idea for a barley cereal mash as well? Yes, it keeps the mash thin and easier to handle and incorporate into the main mash. Hope this helps. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at mediaone.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 14:59:28 -0500 From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at mediaone.net> Subject: Re: Something new (Bierschnapps) Another Jeff <duckinchicago at yahoo.com> writes: > >>>Anchor Steam has gotten on the distilled spirits >kick in a good way and sells a very interesting gin >called "Junipero" and a very-expensive Whiskey called >(I believe) "Old Portero". Haven't tried either, but >have heard many good things about them. Although I >have to say, for the price of the Portrero ($88), you >could buy an amazing single malt scotch or small batch >bourbon (or two very nice ones!) > Anyone tried these? (I know this is a beer forum, >but I figure Fritz is still 99% a beer guy.) Fritz's Anchor Distillery is producing some amazing spirits. Here are some thoughts on them: Old Potrero Whiskeys. I have two that I received two years ago as Christmas presents. I'm not sure what is available now. My sister and brother-in-law have an upscale restaurant in Big Sur, California, and were able to get these. They have have limited availability, and one cannot be sold outside of California. It seems that Fritz figured that he'd been drinking straight rye whiskey all of his adult life and he decided to tackle making something like the original rye whiskey of colonial times, using a pot still rather than a modern continuous column still. Rye is the original American whiskey (older than bourbon, which is essentially aged corn whiskey). It is what Scottish and Irish Yankees made in new England and other northern colonies, and is what the Whiskey Rebellion was fought over.. After prohibition it never recovered its popularity, and bourbon became much more popular among straight whiskeys, along with blended (with grain neutral spirits) American and Canadian whiskeys. Straight rye has recently enjoyed a comeback, thanks in part to the writings of Jim Murray (the whiskey writer, not the baseball writer). Original rye whiskey, along with other whiskeys and spirits of 200 years ago, were probably not aged very much if at all, and not in charred oak barrels (that came in the mid 19th Century in Kentucky and is now the requirement for rye and bourbon). They very likely bore more resemblance to schnapps and/or vodka. Old Potrero Single Malt Spirit is aged less than two years (23 months, but the front label says one year) in uncharred new oak barrels, so it can't be called whiskey or sold outside of California. Old Potrero Single Malt Straight Whiskey is a similar raw spirit (I think) that has been aged in charred oak barrels for three years to comply with US government requirements for calling it whiskey. Both are made from 100% malted rye (other ryes are made with 50-60% unmalted rye, with maybe 10-15% malted barley and the balance corn) and are bottled at cask strength (~125 proof). They are intensely flavored! They almost have to be diluted to drink, although my wife thinks that is heresy. The single malt (my bottle from the batch distilled 6/3/97, bottled 5/25/99) is paler than most American whiskeys - the color comes only from the raw oak, and is fruity and spicy (fruitcake spices) on the nose. The palate is similar, very intense, and the finish is intense, long and full of complex warm spices. The whiskey (distilled 12/27/95, bottled 1/14/99) is is somewhat darker, but nowhere as dark as most older bourbons. The nose is similar but with more subdued fruit and with some oaky vanilla, making it slightly more conventional. It is slightly smoother on the palate, and less intensely flavored (but only in comparison). The finish is long and complex. It is somewhat more refined, but powerful. I like both of these, but only in very small doses. They are that powerful. I am down to about 1/3 of a bottle of each, and they seem to have held up fine. Considering their alcoholic strength and the intensity of flavor, as well as their collective uniqueness, I think they are worth $88 (easy for me to say). I think they wholesaled for $67 two years ago to the restaurant trade, so that isn't too big a markup. I found the whiskey in Massachusetts this summer at $125. That's pretty steep. For an interesting early look at Old Potrero, see Jim Murray's Malt Advocate article at http://www.whiskeypages.com/All_American/story_3/ . A little bit about other more conventional straight rye whiskies (Canadian blended whisky is often called rye, especially in Canada, but it contains very little these days, and in NYC, American blended whiskey is also called rye but probably has none whatever). I am perhaps most fond of Jim Beam Straight Rye. It has a bright yellow label, making it stand out from the JB bourbons. It is inexpensive (less than $13 here in Michigan with the uncompetitive controlled prices). It is less oaky than other ryes (or bourbons, for that), allowing the fruitiness and spiciness of the oak to show through. JB's other rye is Old Overholt, an old Pennsylvania label they took over (I have an unopened bottle from the 1930s, distilled before prohibition). It is fuller bodied with more oaky richness, but this covers some of the distinctiveness of the rye. Wild Turkey's rye is another fine rye, even oakier, and at 101 proof, a bigger whiskey. There are also some other older ryes showing up from old stocks of now defunct distilleries. One very nice one is Van Winkle's Family Reserve, available in 12 and 13 year old versions. I've forgotten which distillery this was produced at. If you like bourbon, I commend the exploration of straight rye whiskey. // Now on to the gin - Junipero. I'm not sure the motivation for its production, but I suspect it was cash flow. Gin needs no aging, so it can produce immediate revenue. This gin is single handledly responsible for making a martini drinker of me. I had tried martinis made from other premium gins and wasn't that impressed. I'd take a well made Manhattan any time (with straight rye (but not Old Potrero), thank you, not bourbon or, heaven forbid, blended whiskey). But my sister and brother-in-law also included a bottle of this (and I had only asked for a sample of the two ryes in "airplane" miniature bottles!). I still prefer a Manhattan (2:1, don't forget the bitters) in the winter, but there are times when a martini is just right. At 98.6 proof, it is stronger than any other gin I know. It is full flavored and full bodied for a gin, almost oily, smooooth, aromatic, very complex, and holds up well to the necessary dilution of chilling (stirred or shaken, your choice), as well as to a little vermouth (I am traditional in this - I like about 4:1, not the more trendy "glance in the direction of the vermouth bottle"). This is more easily available, at least in California. I saw it last week at Old Doc's Liquors in Fresno for $26.95 - and it's easily worth this price. And if it's available in Fresno, it should be more easily available in bigger, more sophisticated markets. BTW, since discovering Junipero, I have also become a fan of the new (<2 years) Tanqueray 10 gin at a similar price (not to be confused with regular Tanqueray). It is also extremely to my liking - a little drier, and also miles ahead of any other I've tasted. // If you've read this far, you may be interested in the irregularly published Distilled Beverage Digest (to subscribe, send the word "subscribe", without the quotes, to dbd-request@hbd.org). It was an outgrowth of discussions of distilling and distilled beverages on HBD that led to DBD's establishment, thanks to janitor Pat Babcock. I will also post this to DBD, so there may be some followup there. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at mediaone.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:54:45 -0500 From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at mediaone.net> Subject: Solera Ale; was Re: New Zymurgy Just catching up from ten days in soggy California, so I'll post a bunch, which I'll send out as soon as Comcast/Mediaone/ATT-Broadband or whoever they are now gets me back on line. My service went down this am and they project a 24 hour repair. :-( // Anyway, "David Craft" <David-Craft at craftinsurance.com> wrote some kind words from Greensboro, NC: >Congratulations to Ray Daniels and his staff for the latest Zymurgy, January >2002. From beginning to end it is the best I have ever read. I can imagine >how hard it is to keep the topic fresh. I know there is alot to write about, >but beer only goes so far! Ray is a great editor - he has made all the difference in the direction and quality of Zymurgy. Since the magazine is the primary benefit of membership, I can't overestimate the importance of quality in attracting and keeping members. >I am impressed with the Solera article by Jeff Renner. This might be a good >project for a brew club, as different people could add different beers at >different times. I don't have a cellar or a dedicated space that I keep at >55 degrees. We'll talk about it here in Greensboro, NC! I have some >Barleywine that I was not particularly impressed with I could add. Great idea! >Question for Jeff or anyone else, does oxidation play a big part in the >process? I assume if you have Acerbacter working, you have some oxidation >somewhere along the way. What keeps this from turning to Vinegar? I don't think oxidation is a big part, but on the other hand, some oxidation doesn't seem to hurt, and may even help in added complexity. Vinegar is not a problem as long as there is no continuing exposure to oxygen. Acetabacter requires O2 to metabolize ethanol into acetic acid (which is different from general oxidation). A limited O2 exposure in not going to produce much acetic acid, and a little probably also adds to complexity. >Again, a great article and magazine. If you are not a member of the AHA, you >should be! I can only second this. And thanks for the kind words. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at mediaone.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
[Prev HBD] [Index] [Next HBD] [Back]
HTML-ized on 01/03/02, by HBD2HTML v1.2 by KFL
webmaster at hbd.org, KFL, 10/9/96