HOMEBREW Digest #3868 Mon 18 February 2002

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  Kleinian Descriptions ("Mike Brennan")
  visiting down under (Ray Kruse)
  : RE: cascase to clean kegs. ("Mike")
  Re: Bottle Question ("Audie Kennedy")
  Brewing water chemicals ("Mike Brennan")
  Re: high diacetyl down under ("Pete Calinski")
  New Keg Cleaning ("Brian M Dotlich")
  Cincy's Bockfest ("Dan Listermann")
  cooling 10 gallons (Al Klein)
  Color of iodophor solution (Al Klein)
  Chemical "Grades" (mohrstrom)
  Klein (Pat Babcock)
  Re: Stupid brewer tricks ("Gene")
  Rate of O2 intake (craftbrewer)
  Safale SO-4 Diacetyl Production and Grumpy Fred ("Phil Yates")
  RE: Subject: RIMS PIDs and SSRs (John Schnupp)
  Siphoning (Bob McDonald)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 00:13:07 -0600 From: "Mike Brennan" <brewdude at tampabay.rr.com> Subject: Kleinian Descriptions Simple concept. I believe his descriptions are rooted in some good doobies before tasting sessions. How else do you describe such detail, description, and imagination. Mr. Klein you are busted. Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 06:45:49 -0500 From: Ray Kruse <rkruse at johngalt.biz> Subject: visiting down under "the only non Australian HBD folk to visit Burradoo are Ray Kruse" I must confess that I'd thought of a "Return to Burradoo", but having avoiding the Postal Authorities the first time, I'm hesitant to retry my luck. I will say, however, that anyone who does visit the Baron will be shown a good time, with pleasant company, and a sampling of some very good beer. Since we've not heard anything about the billiard table lately, I'm guessing that it has a thick covering of dust, and even poor Marilyn has disappeared with the draining of the swamp created by the neighbor. Ray Kruse Survivor of Burradoo 2000 Glen Burnie, PRMd rkruse at johngalt.biz - -- "It must be obvious that liberty necessarily means freedom to choose foolishly as well as wisely; freedom to choose evil as well as good; freedom to suffer the rewards of good judgment, and freedom to suffer the penalties of bad judgment. If this is not true, the word ~FREEDOM~ has no meaning." Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 09:29:39 -0500 From: "Mike" <brewski at inet99.net> Subject: : RE: cascase to clean kegs. I'll bit that a lot of folks that have dishwashers have SS pots, pans, etc., that they put in the dishwasher all the time with Cascade as the cleanser. Many pots, pans, etc. have completely disappeared after the dishwasher and Cascade was through with them. All that Cascade, all that hot water and all that high pressure spraying washed them and the food down the drain. It's the concentration. One or a few beers and I'm ok. (Walt Lewis might disagree with that, anyway...) Two cases, like Refrigerator Perry has been reported to have drank at one time... I would melt down just like the SS kitchen utensils above. Mike Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 10:03:24 -0500 From: "Audie Kennedy" <audie_24293 at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Bottle Question Hello I constructed my own simple cases for odd sized bottles, using rope for dividers/handles. I made mine to hold 32 bottles. The ends are the width of four bottles, plus the width of the rope, and of course the sides are 8 bottles widths, plus the rope. The bottom is scrap plywood. I drilled holes along the sides and the ends about 3/4 of the height, between the bottles. The rope is woven between the bottles, and is left long in the middle of the ends for handles. They work well and look pretty good also. I have never tried one of those character pictures, but if you imagine a shallow box with rope handles at the end, and rope running between the bottles, you'll figure it out. The rope cushions the bottles pretty well. Audie Kennedy Wise, VA Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 10:06:12 -0600 From: "Mike Brennan" <brewdude at tampabay.rr.com> Subject: Brewing water chemicals When searching for sources of brewing chemicals, don't look past your local pharmacist. Five years back I was looking for a source of calcium cloride. I happened to mention my dilemna to a brewing friend. His wife, who is a pharmacist, overheard. Then next day she called me to ask how much I needed as she had a catalog with 100s of differnet pharmacy grade chemicals. I wound up getting 500 grams of pure "pharmacy grade" Calcium Chloride for about $12. I'm still using it and am about 2/3s through my supply probably 50 ten-gallon batches later. She said she could order me anything I needed as long as it was not a controlled substance or something you need a prescription for. I'll bet most pharmacists would accomodate you as long as you explained your need. Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 10:23:49 -0500 From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net> Subject: Re: high diacetyl down under Alan replied to Phil: "There are three possible solutions to your problem." <Snip> I have a fourth solution, pour it down the drain. But, because of the afore mentioned Coriolus effect and subsequent counter acting effect from the northern hemisphere yeast, it would remain suspended in the sink. (We all know liquids swirl in opposite directions above and below the equator.) Solution, ship it to me (at your expense of course) and I'll take care of it. Pete Calinski East Amherst NY Near Buffalo NY *********************************************************** *My goal: * Go through life and never drink the same beer twice. * (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.) *********************************************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 19:46:35 -0500 From: "Brian M Dotlich" <BMDotlich at cs.com> Subject: New Keg Cleaning Brewers, I just got a brand new Corny keg and the inside of the keg smells rubbery and oily. I am wondering what would be a suitable cleaning for a new Corny. I was thinking maybe a nice long soak in hot PBW would do the trick, but I didn't know if that would remove any oils from the manufacturing process. Thanks for your input Brian Dotlich Centerville OH Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 12:48:18 -0500 From: "Dan Listermann" <dan at listermann.com> Subject: Cincy's Bockfest "Ahrendt, Eric (E.J.)" <eahrendt at visteon.com> asks: <Does anyone know the fate of the Cincinnati Bockfest? The only reference I <can find is the Bloatarians upcoming Bock competition. Thanks. Bockfest starts this coming Friday with the Bockfest Parade starting in front of Arnold's at 8th and Main. The parade will form around 5:00 - 5:30 and step off at 6:00. No alcohol allowed - this is Cincinnati were fun is carefully regulated after all. The festivities will proceed all around the Main Street area that night and Saturday. It is the most fun you can have with your clothes on. Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at http://www.listermann.com Take a look at the anti-telemarketer forum. It is my new hobby! Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 17:02:03 -0500 From: Al Klein <rukbat at optonline.net> Subject: cooling 10 gallons Joel Halpine said: >If I could gather info on what those of you out >there are using, and your geography (or your cold water temp) I could >probably figure it out from there. I still do partial boils, so I don't need more than an immersion chiller, but my water temp (city water), late in the afternoon of a day that was ~70F, is 49F. (This is a heat wave - it's been much colder the past couple of months.) In the summer it (the water) runs much warmer, though. - --- [Apparent Rennerian 567.7, 95.9] Al - rukbat at optonline dot net Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 17:04:59 -0500 From: Al Klein <rukbat at optonline.net> Subject: Color of iodophor solution Kevin Elsken asked: >In the >past I have mixed up my sanitizing solution to get a 12.5 ppm iodine >level, and the color was a light amber, or so I thought. Anyway, after >seeing my solution was weak (some say I was born a few PPM short...), I >added more iodine till the test paper showed a nominal 12.5 ppm level. >Now the solution is more the color of apple cider. >What gives? Should it be that dark, or are the test papers unreliable? >Perhaps they are made by the same people who make the iodophor ;-)... I believe the ROT is 2 caps full in 5 gallons of water for a 12.5 ppm solution. - --- [Apparent Rennerian 567.7, 95.9] Al - rukbat at optonline dot net Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 20:54:59 -0500 From: mohrstrom at humphrey-products.com Subject: Chemical "Grades" AJ mentions suitable chemical grades for brewing. Can anyone point me toward a description of the various chemical grades? I know that "USP" is fine for consumption (at least for those things intended for consumption), but how do "reagent", "laboratory", "industrial", and "toxic waste" grades rank? Thanks! Mark in Kalamazoo Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 16:13:31 -0500 (EST) From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org> Subject: Klein Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... One question for those who have done more than toss a Klein book or calendar aside once the first hernia from laughter ensued: Has he ever found a beer that he didn't "enjoy"? One with a disgusting undertow, or, perhaps, one veined with putrifaction? Perhaps subtle excrement notes mid-bottle that are at once vegetal and rose scented? Maybe one with a riptide of rotting fish, having a windshear of garbage nuanced nicely upon the continental drift of doggy-dew subflavors dancing like spiked shoe-clad rhinoceri upon the uvula? :^) Steve makes some good points, but it must be more purposeful than whimsical or fanciful. It is just as bad if your description is rendered meaningless by immersion in drivel or, more to the point, if your intended audience cannot connect with your descriptions - just as our current language, to your perspective, is not term-rich, somewhat bland and or contining unattainable terms. I'd argue, though, that since our language derives from such things as Jackson's books, Echardt's book, etc, that *most* of us can find an example of, for instance, black currant as decribed in the palate of a particular beer by buying said beer (where available) and looking for the odd flavor we didn't recognize before. And most of us around today uderstand the british "catty" to be "polecatty" or, better for those unexposed to teh rich language of the southwest, "skunky". Not arguing with you, Steve - you haven't said anything to trigger any strong disagreement, re: descriptive language, but do you really need to glom upon one of these Gems before defending Klein's stuff for its own. My sardonic description in the first paragraph likely has him (Klein) slapping his forehead with a "Why didn't I think of that?!" :^) - -- - God bless America! Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock at hbd.org Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org HBD Web Site http://hbd.org The Home Brew Page http://hbd.org/pbabcock [18, 92.1] Rennerian "The monster's back, isn't it?" - Kim Babcock after I emerged from my yeast lab Saturday Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 00:21:37 -0600 From: "Gene" <gcollins at geotec.net> Subject: Re: Stupid brewer tricks LeavesKevin Elsken proclaims his hatred of siphoning and touched on a great idea involving a hand vacuum pump. I have been in the truck service business for nearly 20 years and have managed to accumulate all sorts of every tool imaginable. Heck, even Snap-On Tools sends me Christmas cards. One of these items is a hand vacuum pump and it just so happens that I implemented for the beer siphoning task and it works great. Another thing that I found and possess is a little gadget I bought last year called a "Simple Siphon". This little device make easy for anyone to siphon anything. It is made from copper and has a metal coil spring and a glass marble contained within. All that is required to get a full stream going is a shake. It really does work! Take a look at www.simplesiphon.com. The only thing missing is a device to filter out trub/yeast. Perhaps some of the great minds of the HBD could invent one and sell it to the rest of us. Maybe, that will be me. Gene Collins Broken Arrow, OK Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:37:02 +1100 From: craftbrewer at telstra.easymail.com.au Subject: Rate of O2 intake G'Day All / This post is not in response to the not sooooo great Phil Yates, master of a new style of beer called Dairy's Delight. Seems he must be hanging arround the back end of those cows tooo long. I'm sure he knows the difference between them and Jill, but then again, dont they say the cows in Burradoo all have a funny smile, with all the SWMBOs wondering why they haven't. / But it took an e-mail from NQLD to set him right and now he is ok. / But my question is more relevant. My question relates to O2 absorption. / Put simple (like Phil) / If I had a carboy of wort, from the boiler with utterly no addition of O2. And then cool it, say to 10C. What is the rate of O2 absorption thru natural exchange. Now lets generalise and put a lot of varables to bed. (yes I know it depends on surface area, currents in the wort and all that guff). And I know also that most absorption will occur at the beginning and it slows as it gets closer to equilibrium. / So lets say, ON AVERAGE, For a wort with no O2, at a temperature of 10C, how long would it take to get to 80% equilibrium with the air O2, and also 100%. / Why do I ask. Well I wonder on two accounts. The first is if one open ferments, and a person does not airate the wort straight away, I wonder how long they should wait til they pitch the yeast. The second is I wonder what rate of co2 evolution has to occur to override the O2 absorption gradient. / Shout Graham Sanders / oh - Some fool seems he cant spell. And I can tell you coming from me thats a statement. Where I come from, I spell flavour and colour the way god (which ever one you believe in) meant it to be spelt. I guess we could take you lot more seriously if you used metric like everyone else, and drove the same side of the road as us Nth Qlders. Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 12:55:25 +1100 From: "Phil Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au> Subject: Safale SO-4 Diacetyl Production and Grumpy Fred Alan Meeker ran a very simplistic (!!!) description of Coriolus effect and how it could be effecting diacetyl production down here in Oz. I can't agree with Alan on this matter as the entire Coriolus effect is negated (as pointed out by Jeff Renner in private email) by simply turning your fermenter upside down, a procedure all Oz brewers do instinctively when using Northern Hemisphere yeasts. Alan's second post on the matter drives much closer to the mark (in my opinion). I did not internally measure wort temp during the furious two day feeding frenzy so it may well have crept somewhat above the 22C ambient. This would be due to the furious activity. I have no doubt this rapid yeast growth had much to do with the diacetyl production, and I have little doubt the diacetyl will be gone before the beer is ready to drink. What fascinated me was the obvious viability of the dry yeast and it's rapid consumption of fermentables. Dealing with these yeasts is a different ball game altogether from what I am used to with liquid yeast cultures. The possibilities for experimentation are enormous. Further more, there are some beer styles that go well with a bit of diacetyl in them so if I can find a way to keep it hanging around, a whole new scope of flavour options becomes available. But how to keep it hanging around? This will be interesting. On the matter of hangin' around, I am somewhat disappointed by comments from Fred Kingston suggesting the Aussies have kicked me out. Fred and I were once good friends sharing interests in brewing and aviation. Kicked me out of what, Fred? Fred has been grumpy ever since he lost control of his Piper on landing and wound up in a farmer's chook shed. And even grumpier when he had to pay for the chooks. And the shed!! Somehow, he blames me for the whole messy incident! Cheers Phil Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 23:17:23 -0800 (PST) From: John Schnupp <johnschnupp at yahoo.com> Subject: RE: Subject: RIMS PIDs and SSRs Larry Maxwell asks: >(SSR) output from Omega Eng'g, but failed to read the >spec sheet closely enough, which noted that the SSR >handles only 1A max. I am guessing what I need is >another (external) SSR that handles 20A or so to Then Ron La Borde gives a good suggestion. >Too little current (or too high a resistance load) and the >PID may fail to cycle on/off. YES, when you build and your system, make sure that you have a load connected to the SSR output. If you do not and try and measure the output it will no change state and you will think you have a bad SSR. Ron continues with: >This may sound complicated, but it is really not so, >only 2 resistors and a diode bridge. >You connect a full wave diode bridge across the 200 >ohm resistor and the output of >the bridge will be 20 volts rectified AC. Actually >more than 20 volts because the AC >being RMS 120 volts will actually peak at 1.414 times >20 or 28.2 volts peak. This is a good idea. Well worth considering. My .02 is this. Have you taken your controller apart? It may be possible to remove the low current SSR and install one rated at a higher current. If the controller does not have enough room to do this, you may be able to disconnect the "internal" SSR and add some wire to the control lines so that you have the dequired 3-32VDC to wire to an external high current SSR. Don't forget to heat sink the SSR. ===== John Schnupp, N3CNL ??? Hombrewery [560.2, 68.6] Rennerian Georgia, VT 95 XLH 1200, Horse with no Name Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 13:25:02 -0800 (PST) From: Bob McDonald <rcmcdonald at yahoo.com> Subject: Siphoning Kevin Elsken asks about suggestions for the siphon challenged. After being a member of the siphon challenged for five or six years of brewing, I ordered the self-starting siphon from Hoptech (NAYYY) and haven't looked back. It's easy to sanitize and works every time. Basically, it consists of a large tube with a check valve on one end, and a smaller tube that fist inside, with a ring-shaped seal on the end that allows the combination to act as a pump. When racking, you pull back on the inner tube as the larger tube fills with beer, and push down as beer is forced up the inner tube and into your racking tubing, quickly starting the siphon. Experiences may vary, but as far as I'm concerned, this falls in the category of simple brewing equipment that takes away a fair amount of frustration. Anyone else have similar gadgets that make their brewing easier? Bob McDonald Washington D.C. Return to table of contents
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