HOMEBREW Digest #1172 Thu 01 July 1993

Digest #1171 Digest #1173

		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

  Re: More Weizen Stuff (Timothy J. Dalton)
  High Gravity Brewing (Glenn Raudins)
  Half batches in Full size fermenter (Elaine)
  interested in hi-gravity brews (R  29-Jun-1993 0918 -0400)
  polypropelene (Ed Hitchcock)
  Homebrew adventures #8725784509 (Jim Sims)
  mailing list (114067)
  Re: Anheuser-Busch buys Sierra Nevada (how about Tsingtao?) ("Donald G. Scheidt")
  Foaming/Flat Kegged Beer (Cisco)
  Diluting beer ... (LYONS)
  High Gravity Brewing  (W.R.) Crick" <heybc at bnr.ca>
  High Gravity Brewing  (W.R.) Crick" <heybc at bnr.ca>
  Bits and pieces (Kinney Baughman)
  RE: More Weizen Stuff (Roy Styan)
  BFD article 1 of 2 (Lee=A.=Menegoni)
  oops  (Lee=A.=Menegoni)
  storing kegs and sanitizing fermeter lids (Bart Thielges)
  How not to make fruit beer... (korz)
  Specialty Products Intl. part 1 (korz)
  Hangover prevention and treatment (Domenick Venezia)
  Metallic first batch ("Michael Barre"                            )
  Light (Lovibond) Extract (LYONS)
  RE: Help rescue my first batch! (LYONS)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 08:50:53 -0400 From: Timothy J. Dalton <dalton at mtl.mit.edu> Subject: Re: More Weizen Stuff Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com> wrote: > I never see this either. The Weizen that Rick "beat out" (ouch!) only > yielded just under 30 pts/lb. I increased the pale malt and added a bit > of Munich and last nights yielded only 28. > Both batches were single decoction. > Erics book is certainly a great asset to brewers, and Eric notes that you > should adjust all grain bills based on the performance of your system. Now, > if I can just figure out the performance of my system with wheat malt, *$!%. My most recent Weissbier (actually a Dunkelwiessbier) had a grain bill of 6 malted lbs wheat, 4 lbs munich and 1 lb pils, and yielded 30 pts/lb/gal with a double decoction. (OG 15.5P - 1.062) No where near Warner's numbers, but still acceptable. > FYI: > Hefe Weizen #123, 6/23/93: > 59% De Wolf - Cosyns Wheat Malt > 38% De Wolf - Cosyns Pils Malt > 2.5% De Wolf - Cosyns Munich Malt > .5% De Wolf - Cosyns Cara Pils Malt > 13 IBU Hops, Whole Domestic Perle, 1/2 at start of boil, 1/4 at 60 minutes > 1/4 Hersbruker Hallertau Pellets, 15 minutes to end > ~21 oz Weihenstephan 66, Weizen Yeast > 1/2 Tbls Gypsum in Sparge, 1/2 Tbls in mash > OG 12P I added about 13 IBU also, Hallertau Hersbruker plugs and saaz pellets. The Weihenstephen #66 is a great yeast to use for a true weissbier! It really has the correct taste. > A question for wheat brewers: what kind of grain mill do you use, and how far > (fine) do you grind the Wheat? I am beginning to wonder if my extract loss > is due to not pulverising the wheat enough. Pound for pound I should be > getting a much higher extract from Wheat, and I dont. An equivelent Pale Ale > single infusion gives me at least 13P. Wheat should give a much higher yield. but it doesn't seem to in my case either. The xtractions using wheat are not very different from those with just 2 row pale. My previous batch had a poor wheat crush and the extraction suffered (low 20s). To avoid problems with the mills at homebrew stores, I just bought a MALTMILL (tm). Haven't gotten to use it yet. For my next weissbier (maybe a weizenbock for the fall) I'm gonna try and crush the wheat very well and hope that I don't have lauter problems (I haven't had any so far using a double decoction) Tim ==== Timothy J. Dalton tjdalton at mit.edu MIT, Dept. of Chemical Engineering, Materials Etching Technology Lab Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 8:07:31 CDT From: raudins at galt.b17d.ingr.com (Glenn Raudins) Subject: High Gravity Brewing Jim Busch brings up an interesting topic: High Gravity brewing. One concern that the big boys have is deareating(sp?) the water before adding it to the beer but this is because they are adding the water at the end of the process instead of adding it to the fermenter. Glenn Raudins raudins at galt.b17d.ingr.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 09:08:52 EDT From: Elaine <EBORIS at UGA.CC.UGA.EDU> Subject: Half batches in Full size fermenter I wanted to try making some cherry stout, but because I am unsure if I will really like the flavor (I have never tried any, it just sounds good) and because fresh cherries down here in Georgia are so expensive, I want to just make half a batch (3 GALS). My secondary fermenter is 6 gals and my question is, will having that large air space be a problem? Does anybody have an opinion about using fresh cherries versus canned ones? TIA E. Elaine Boris Student Information Systems Computer Services Specialist University of Georgia 706 542-0484 Athens Georgia Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 06:24:13 PDT From: R 29-Jun-1993 0918 -0400 <ferguson at zendia.enet.dec.com> Subject: interested in hi-gravity brews >Date: Thu, 24 Jun 93 11:16:55 EDT >From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com> >Subject: High Gravity Brewing > >In an attempt to start a subject that I dont recall reading here in the fairly >recent timeframe I am asking for opinions on high gravity brewing. What I >mean by this is similar to what the big boys do: Brew a high gravity wort and >dilute with boiled/cooled water into the fermenter. I'm very interested in any recipes that call for this method of brewing. I'm also interested in hearing any methods, procedures, gotchas, hints, etc. that people use for this method. Currently, I only have a 5gal brew pot which is not sufficient enough to do all-grain brewing. I want to do all-grain with a 5 gallon yield, and the aforementioned method might be doable for me. I'm interested, in particular, in wheat beer recipes. I've made myself a Zapap lauter-tun as explained in "the book" that works quite well. I've done a few partial mashes with decent success. JC FERGUSON DIGITAL LITTLETON MA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 10:59:58 -0300 From: Ed Hitchcock <ECH at ac.dal.ca> Subject: polypropelene Al Korz Writes: >I suspect that it is Polyethylene (PE), not Polypropylene (PP). I have yet to >see anything that's been made of PP that is food grade, so I suspect that it >is not food grade. Since we're on the subject of Polypropylene and food >grade certification, if you buy yeast in plastic vials, check what kind of >plastic it is. I've seen yeast sold in Polypropylene vials. > >Al. > ... >Jim Busch's post reminded me of one instance of food-grade PP -- those >pleated PP filters. Are you sure the spun ones are PP also? In any >event, I looked around a lot and called a lot and could not find a PP >food-grade vial. Why not HDPE, you ask? Well, I wanted to autoclave >it -- PP is autoclavable as is PC (Polycarbonate -- also not food-grade). > >I settled on glass vials with PP caps that have fiber/foil liners. > >Al. A lot of food storage material is made of polypropelene. Much of the Tupperware(tm) like stuff, and juice jugs and so on. It's heat resistant and microwaveable. A lot of lab equipment is also PP, and one doesn't want plastic leaching into one's slant tubes... ed ____________ Ed Hitchcock/Dept of Anatomy & Neurobiology/Dalhousie University/Halifax NS ech at ac.dal.ca +-------------------------------------------------------+ | I object to that comment! I know several pinheads | | and they are fully functional members of society! | +-------------------------------------------------------+ Eschew Labudmilloorsonhead Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 10:09:49 EDT From: sims at pdesds1.scra.org (Jim Sims) Subject: Homebrew adventures #8725784509 Well, last nite was either homebrewer's paradise or nightmare, haven't quite figured out which yet. I got home just after 7 after picking up the kids from Karate, slapped together some spagetti, and put some water on to boil for beer and filled the #2 washtub with water, bleach, and bottles. About 8, I added the malt extract and then the hops to the boil while I started siphoning off the latest batch of double-light from the primary fermenter. While the next batch ( 3-1/2 lbs M&F Light DME, ~ 2lbs honey, ~ 1 oz fresh Hollertau hops, EDME yeast) was boiling (cept for the honey)I bottled about 35 bottles of the aforementioned double-light, trying to leave about 2-3 gallons in the pan for making some fruit beer. Well, in order to have something to put that beer + fruit IN, I needed to bottle the fruit mead that's been fermenting for the last week : (3 weeks in primary, racked to secondary [ (2) one-gal apple juice bottles and a gallon winejug] with (a) 1 lb plums, (b) 1 12 oz package frozen raspberries, and (c) 1 pint fresh blackberries) This proved to be a challenge, cause the siphon was still sitting (primed) in the beer and I didn't think i wanted to try to start a siphon in those 1 gal jugs, between the "line loss" and all that fruit pulp, it didnt seem a good idea. So, I just poured the mead from the respective jugs through a strainer and funnel into the beer bottles. Yes, I know it oxegenated the mead a lot, but hey, sue me, OK? If it comes out *awful* I have something to blame besides my (otherwise) ineptitude... I sampled some of the fruit i strained off the mead - mmmmmmmmmm After getting the mead tucked safely into some bottles (and a bit drooled on the floor ;-), it was time to add the finishing hops and honey to the batch of beer on the stove and let it steep for a few minutes and dump it off to the primary and put it in the (pre-chilled with a coupla frozen gallon milk-jugs of water) water in the sink. Well, now there are dirty pots and pans everywhere and about 50 or so bottles of various fuit meads and beer, empty bottles, the #2 washtub with clorine water soaking those 3 gal jugs, an empty plastic fermenter, a bit of mead and beer, and who knows what else on the kitchen floor..... Back to the original batch of double-light beer that's been patiently waiting for its fruit. Cherries were on sale for $.99/lb raspberries for $1.19/pint and strawberries for $.59/lb; so that's what I got - ~2-1/2 lbs of cherries to be pitted, about 2 lbs of strawberries to (whatever you call removing the stem-thingie) and chop, and a pint of raspberrires to chop up. So now we've got bits of cherries and strawberries on the table & floor to go with all that other stuff and a big cutting board covered with fruit. After squishing the fruit into the three (separate) gal jugs, i added a gal of beer to the cherries and 1/2 gal to the strawberries and 1/2 gal to the raspberries (and added a rubber stopper and airlock). There was enough beer left to bottle 2 more beers of that double-light, and then loads of clean-up..... I finally got done about 1:30 AM. Cant wait to try the results! jim Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 9:00:26 -0600 (MDT) From: 114067 at INCDP1.LANL.GOV Subject: mailing list would like to get on email list. address is 114067 at incdp3.lanl.gov. thanks Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 8:14:25 PDT From: "Donald G. Scheidt" <dgs1300 at aw101.iasl.ca.boeing.com> Subject: Re: Anheuser-Busch buys Sierra Nevada (how about Tsingtao?) In HOMEBREW Digest #1170, it is said: >Date: Fri, 25 Jun 93 11:44:46 EDT >From: chuck at synchro.com (Chuck Cox) >Subject: Re: Anheuser-Busch buys Sierra Nevada > >Rick Garvin sez... >> >> I called SNBC today at 916-893-3520 and spoke with Peggy. She was surprised >> that the rumor had gotten to Washington, DC but she had heard it. She said >> that this was absolutely false. Now, our friends at the SEC do not like >> companies to deny these things if it is true. So, I beleive her. > >Hey! It's rumor time. > >According to sources at the breweries, A-B did ask both Sierra Nevada >and Anchor (and possibly others) what their selling price was, both >declined. > >According to sources in both the brewing and financial worlds, A-B is >seriously considering buying Jim Koch's Boston Beer Litigation Company. Heh, heh. That would be a master stroke for J.K.: selling a brewery with virtually no brewing facilities (a virtual brewery?) to the mighty A-B. Considering that Miller has already shown us that it is perfectly capable of producing flavourful beer (it's just been holding back until the market was right, didn't you know that!? :-), I find it amusing to think that Budweiser, the master marketer of insipid pale lager, would consider buying Boston (tm) Beer (tm), something that is essentially a beer-marketing company. Okay, enough with these rumours; I have something real. A-B has announced that it will purchase 5% of China's Tsingtao brewery, or 45 million shares, part of a semi-privatisation of Tsingtao. Source: Seattle Times business section, 28 June 1993, page 2. Seriously! Political repression may continue, but economic development and growth in the PRC continue to gallop along, and now the biggest American megabrewer is dipping its toes into the waters. Let's hope that this involvement with Tsingtao keeps them busy enough that they keep their hands off Budvar (aka the Budweiser with flavour). Look for even wider availability of Tsingtao in supermarkets across the land. (Didn't A-B already have some kind of interest in Denmark's Carlsberg, or was that import and marketing only?) - -- __ | | __ /\ \ | Don Scheidt | /\ \ / \ \ | Boeing IASL, 777 Cab Development | / \ \ / /\ \ \ | dgs1300 at aw101.iasl.ca.boeing.com | / /\ \ \ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 08:25:18 -0700 (MST) From: Cisco <FRANCISCO at lan.ccit.arizona.edu> Subject: Foaming/Flat Kegged Beer The second half of this post showed up in Teusday's digest so I'm guessing that the first half got lost, so I'm reposting the first half. > From: djackson at wv.MENTORG.COM (Darin Jackson) > Subject: Foaming/Flat Kegged Beer > > I recently purchased a kegging system and made my own beer chiller. > The chiller is 6' of 1/4" od copper tubing with 3/16" fittings on > either end to connect in from the line out of the keg and to the line > out to the cobra tap. I bent it into a shape that fits into my small > cooler I dedicated to the task and was proud as hell of my $6 portable > chiller. Well, I'm having foaming/flat beer problems. > I have 4' of 3/16 id > hose and 6' of approximately the same id copper total, but the "smooth" > part at the end by the tap is only 2'. I presume that there will be > turbulence caused by the fittings from the copper to the hose. Is 2' > enough to let the beer settle back down? I'm getting all head and almost > no carbonation in the beer. I have tried dispensing with the gas > disconnected, with 12 lbs of gas, with 10 lbs of gas and with 7 lbs of > gas. And, of course, I drank all of the flat beer. > Darin Your problem is your dispensing pressure does not match the inside diameter and length of your dispensing line. I posted an article about how to calculate this a few weeks ago, email me if you want it sent to you. To make it simple, an inside diameter of 3/16 has a pressure drop of 1 pound for every 4 inches. You have 6 ft. of copper tubing and 4 ft. of plastic tubing(all with 3/16 id according to you). This translate out to 10 feet of 3/16 id tubing or 120 in./4 in. = 30 lbs pressure that is required to push the beer through the lines without the carbonation leaving the liquid. The cobra tap does not essentially have a pressure drop across it that must be taken into account if you open it FULLY when pouring. If you open it slowly then you are definitely causing the tap to influence a greater pressure drop through your dispensing line and foaming will occur. So get used to opening it quickly and fully. John Francisco Francisco at lan.ccit.arizona.edu > Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 10:32 EDT From: LYONS at adc2.adc.ray.com Subject: Diluting beer ... >Subject: High Gravity Brewing > >In an attempt to start a subject that I dont recall reading here in the fairly >recent timeframe I am asking for opinions on high gravity brewing. What I >mean by this is similar to what the big boys do: Brew a high gravity wort and >dilute with boiled/cooled water into the fermenter. Now before you get all >upset that this is not the way to make "real" beer, let me point out that I >talked to a few brewmasters in the UK who did just this. In particular, the >brewer from the Larkins Brewery (located in Kent, took a medal in last years >GBBF), told me he brews his ordinary bitter to an OG of 1.055 and dilutes it >down to 1.035 in the fermenter. I realize one needs to take into account the >additional caramelization in the kettle with the increased sugar content, but >has anyone done much of this. I am especially interested in the idea of >brewing pale ales of OG 1.065-1.070 and adding water to result in a 1.055 >in the fermenter. The entire fermentation would be at the lower gravity. An >obvious issue is the pH of the water pushing the wort toward the alkaline >side, would the wort be able to buffer a 10-20% water charge? Would typical >Sierra Nevada ale yeast be able to work at a slightly more basic pH than a >normal wort? IT would seem to me that since kettle size is normally the >limiting factor in batch size, this would be a great way to increase volume >of finished product. I am fortunate in that I oversized/over engineered my >lauter tun to accomadate high gravity brewing, so working with the extra >grains is no problem. > >Comments/experiances? I'm not sure if many would recommend diluting a beer. However on a partial mash I was shooting for an OG of 58 and ended up with 90. I decided to bottle it and label it as an under hopped Imperial Stout. I did consider diluting it down to 58 but wondered when it would be best to dilute it. What would be the advantage of diluting the beer prior to active fermentation rather than during the secondary phase? Chris LYONS at ADC2.ADC.RAY.COM Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 11:49:00 +0000 From: "Bill (W.R.) Crick" <heybc at bnr.ca> Subject: High Gravity Brewing Jim Busch asked about high gravity brewing: We've tried it with good success. We originally did a batch with no sparge, and 4/3 the grain bill ala George Fix's maltiness article in HBD year or so back. This created Pilsener Noel Premium (PNP), which is a offshoot of Normal Pilsener Noel (NPN). PNP definitely had all the maltiness George predicted. Almost too much. The PNP is more like a Mai Bock, than a pilsener? So we decided to run the same grain bill, that is 4/3 normal, do a sparge, and boil down to a normal batch size. We watered it down 50%, that is total of 150% of normal batch size. Tastes great. I can't detect any bad artifacts of the higher gravity brewing, or the "watering down" .No one else has commented on anything unusual either. Bill Crick Brewius, Ergo Sum! Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 11:52:00 +0000 From: "Bill (W.R.) Crick" <heybc at bnr.ca> Subject: High Gravity Brewing Sorry about the double post. I missed a critical point. THIS BEER WAS WATERD DOWN AT BOTTLING TIME! Jim Busch asked about high gravity brewing: We've tried it with good success. We originally did a batch with no sparge, and 4/3 the grain bill ala George Fix's maltiness article in HBD year or so back. This created Pilsener Noel Premium (PNP), which is a offshoot of Normal Pilsener Noel (NPN). PNP definitely had all the maltiness George predicted. Almost too much. The PNP is more like a Mai Bock, than a pilsener? So we decided to run the same grain bill, that is 4/3 normal, do a sparge, and boil down to a normal batch size, for fermentation. We watered it down 50%, that is total of 150% of normal batch size, when we bottled it. Tastes great. I can't detect any bad artifacts of the higher gravity brewing, or the "watering down". No one else has commented on anything unusual either. Bill Crick Brewius, Ergo Sum! Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 12:10:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Kinney Baughman <BAUGHMANKR at conrad.appstate.edu> Subject: Bits and pieces Hi ya'll! Keith mentions: >Charlie Papazian in TCJOH refers to the dumping of the wort through a strainer >into the fermenter to remove the hops and any other particulates as sparging. And I disagree with the esteemed CP on this. While I'm not one who thinks you need to rack off the cold break before fermentation begins, I do believe you need to get as clear a runoff as possible off the hot break when going to the fermenter. >This might be the source of the confusion. He also recommends scooping out >the specialty grains just prior to the wort coming to a boil. Hmm... The conventional wisdom here is to remove the grains at 170 degrees to avoid leaching tannins into the wort. Waiting until just before the boil is too long. Jack says: > Hmm... Wasn't planning on going to Portland. Hate to make the trip just to > keep him honest. Any volunteers to take a brand new MM for the GREAT > CRUSH-OFF? I'll try not to fall into the camp of the humor-impaired here but the casual reader and, I'm sure Mr. Listerman, would take offense at the insinuation that Dan is a dishonest person. This makes two such swipes at Dan in as many weeks. And since he isn't here to defend himself, don't you think we can refrain from comments like this? Nir writes: >>I'm just back from the UK. The British seem not to mind using plastic in their >>homebrewing. They have a mashing aparatus made of a 20 lit polyproylene bucket To which Al responds: >I suspect that it is Polyethylene (PE), not Polypropylene (PP). I have yet to >see anything that's been made of PP that is food grade, so I suspect that it >is not food grade. Al corrected himself later but I've been brewing for years with a product that is constructed of HD Polypropolene and I'm still alive. :-) Jim asks about high gravity brewing... I've been doing some high-gravity brewing at Tumbleweed for the first time in my life. Our biggest problem with it is adjusting for hop utilization. We had much better hop character to our beers when we did full gravity boils. The hop back helps but, again, I got better results from the full gravity brews. Suggestions, anyone? And then Carl says: >To add my $.02 to the advertising debate; it strikes me as highly inappropriate >to advertise on this list. It is a waste of bandwidth for those of us who are >looking for an informative forum on tips and techniques. It also does an >injustice to those who voluntarily restrain themselves on the list and actually >PAY for their advertising. If a product is good, we will hear about it from >satisfied customers. 'Nuff said. To which I say, "Amen, Brother". Discussion of products in this forum is expected and should be encouraged. But why not let the customers debate the various pros and cons of a product? I personally think the only time a manufacturer needs to say anything about his product publicly is AFTER a thread has run its course. At that point, one post addressing all the pressing issues would be appropriate. This endless harping, hyping, and mentioning of one's own products to keep threads running ad nauseum is in poor taste, to say the least. But we've had this discussion before, haven't we? Cheers! ___ ----------------------------------------------------------- ___ | | Kinney Baughman | | | | baughmankr at conrad.appstate.edu | | \ / \ / | "Beer is my business and I'm late for work" | --------------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 09:36:44 PDT From: rstya at mda.ca (Roy Styan) Subject: RE: More Weizen Stuff The best I've done brewing weizen was to get a 34 pts/lb/gal yield. This was for a weizen bock, and was brewed with a triple decoction, including a 30 min. dough in and 20 min. acid rest. It was a loooooong day - about 11 hours. I now stick with a single decoction and my normal 30-31 pts/lb/gal, using the extra time to sample my wares. My grain mill is a corona, powered by a 23 rpm motor. I think the low rpms give a better crush than one normally finds on these mills. It is left on the same setting for barley and wheat - breaking a kernel into five or six pieces. Although flour is eveident, it does not caused problems with the sparge as long as I go through at least one decoction. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 11:41:38 EDT From: Lee=A.=Menegoni at nectech.com Subject: BFD article 1 of 2 Dan: Please ACK getting this. Competition Update: There will be a HWBTA sanctioned competition at the Topsfield fair this September, entry deadline is September 8th. The cost is $5 per entry or $ 4 per entry if over five are entered. Prizes in the form of gift certificates and brewing opportunities at local micros will be awarded. Prizes will also be awareded to the first and second place club, a club must have at least five entries. This is a great opportunity to enter a competition, since entries can be dropped off in Topsfield there is no shiiping cost. Lee Menegoni will be bringing entries to Topsfield for BFD members. If you have a brew your proud of bring it to the July or August meeting the judges in the club can help pick the appropriate category to enter it in. Remeber to save three for the competition. Please contact Lee if interested he has entry forms and more details. Phone H: 603-881-5227 W: 508-635-6282 HWBTA is the Home Wine and Beer Trade Association. Club Only competitions: We need to set up a tasting date, entrants can submit more than one beer but only one per category. August 9 entry deadline August 9 Weiss is Nice ** categories: Berliner Weisse, Weizen/Weissbier, Dunkelweizen, Weizenbock Its not too late, the BFD Yeast Bank has a few good cultures appropriate for the Fest style. October 4 entry deadline October 4 Best of Fest ** categories: Vienna- Amber to deep copper/light brown. Toasted malt aroma and flavor. Low malt sweetness. Light to medium body. Hop bitterness "noble-type" low to medium. Low hop flavor and aroma, "noble-type" OK. No fruitness, esters. Low diacetyl OK. Marzenn/Oktoberfest- Amber to deep copper/orange. Malty sweetness, toasted malt aroma and flavor dominant. Medium body. Low to medium bitterness. Low hop flavor and aroma, "noble-type" OK. No fruitness, esters December 6 entry deadline December 6 Poignant Porter ** categories: Robust Porter- Black. No roast barley character. Sharp bitterness of black malt, without high burnt/charcoal-like flavor. Medium to full bodied. Malty sweet. Hop bitterness medium to high. Hop flavor and aroma: none to medium. Fruitness/esters OK. Low diacetyl OK. Brown Porter- Medium to dark brown. No roast barley or strong burnt malt character. Light to medium body. Low to medium malt sweetness. Medium hop bitterness. Hop flavor and aroma: none to medium. Fruitiness/esters OK. Low diacetyl OK. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 11:53:33 EDT From: Lee=A.=Menegoni at nectech.com Subject: oops Ooops. The competition info article was not intende to be sent to HBD. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 10:39:32 PDT From: nexgen!bart at olivea.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Bart Thielges) Subject: storing kegs and sanitizing fermeter lids Here's a few of questions for the experts : 1) I haven't been able to find a good way to immerse my fermeter lid (a 5 gallon white plastic bucket with snap on lid) in the sanitizing solution. I can distort the bucket and jam the lid in part way, but this could scratch the sides of the bucket and besides does not totally immerse the lid. Also, I don't have any other vessel larger than the bucket. I've been splashing the sanitizing solution all over the lid in the hopes that the contact time is long enough. Is it ? Do I need to buy a larger soaking vessel ? 2) I've been kegging my beer (too lazy to clean bottles :-). So far, the one batch that I completed was consumed all at once during a party. However, I imagine that it would be nice to keep a keg around for longer periods of time. I use CO2 to pressurize so oxydation isn't a problem but I don't have enough `fridge space to keep the keg upright and cooled down for extended periods. Will repeated cycling between 45F and 80F spoil the flavor ? I'm not really concerned about any visual effects, only taste. 3) I bought a used and dirty Cornelius keg. I scrubbed the interior out as well as I could. Now, I'm worried whether there might be built up crud in the feeder tube or the hose fittings. Would you recommend disassembly and cleaning ? I've circulated sanitizing solution through all of these parts. advTHANKSance, Bart Thielges Expert Brewing Novice and Unambiguous Contradictor Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 28 Jun 93 15:42 CDT From: korz at iepubj.att.com Subject: How not to make fruit beer... I have the forture of having married into fruit trees. What I mean is, that my new in-laws have two cherry trees in their yard and they haven't been bothering to pick them, so I can have them for the trouble of picking. Last year, I watched half of the cherries get eaten by birds and plotted a way to keep all the cherries to myself this year. This last weekend, I decided to build a cage around the trees to keep the birds out. The cherries on one tree were almost ready but on the second tree they were still quite green. I decided to build a cage around one tree and then move it over the other one next weekend when the cherries on the first tree will be ready to pick. The materials for this project (1-by-2s, nails, staples and netting) cost me about $40. Early Sunday morning, I set out to build the cage. The cage was to be 16 feet long and 16 feet wide and 10 feet tall. Note that this is much too tall to lift over the trees, so that to move it, one side would have to be disassembled and then reattached after moving. Basically, the design was a box frame made of 1-by-2s with "Bird-X" netting stapled to five of the six sides. 11 hours and a hundred mosquito-bites later, I can only say this must have been my stupidest project ever! After 10.5 hours of baking in the sun and getting chewed upon by mosquitos, I determined that I was building a large death-trap for birds (while putting up the netting, several birds flew into the netting and it was a matter of time before one of them got caught in the net and died) and that the benefits were not worth the costs. Costs: Consider that the frame was simply nailed together and therefore damage to the wood from disassembly subsequent reassembly means that the lumber would only be good for maybe three years. Therefore, the cage would cost about $8 per year in lumber, nails and staples. It took 10.5 hours to assemble this cage, would take probably 4 hours to move it and then another 10.5 hours to disassmble for winter storage. A total of 25 hours. Even at, say $5.00 per hour, my labor costs were $125. (Sure, I like to build things, but heck, I could also spend that time brewing!) Total cost per year: $133. Benefits: I estimate that there are about 60# of cherries on these two trees each year. The birds get about half, so that the cage gains me about 30# of cherries. That means that I would be getting 60# of cherries for $2.22/lb, but I would have to pick them too! Not to mention, I've still got 15# left in my freezer from last year that I didn't have time with which to brew. I spent the last 1/2 hour tearing down the netting down from the frame and next weekend I'll be taking down the frame. Chalk one up for experience. By the way, it looks like a good year for Michigan Cherries. They are already in the fruit markets and are priced quite a bit lower than last year: already-picked are running $1/lb, whereas u-pick last year were $1/lb. Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 12:43 CDT From: korz at iepubj.att.com Subject: Specialty Products Intl. part 1 A number of weeks ago, someone posted the name of a supplier of inexpensive malt extract called: Specialty Products Intl. If you are like me, you called and recently got their booklet called "Home Beermakers Guide." This booklet was written "BY LEIGH P. BEADLE, AUTHOR OF THE BEST SELLER _Brew_It_Yourself_" a book that was "reviewed" (quite unfavorably) here on the HBD a few months ago. First off, I'd like to post a disclaimer: I am a homebrewing supply retailer and mailorder business owner which does not carry the products marketed by Specialty Products International, HOWEVER, these products are available to me for wholesale purchase, so it is by choice that I do not choose to stock them -- in other words, I am not really in competition with SPI. They would have my wholesale business if I felt they had a good product. If you have received this booklet and are a relatively experienced brewer, then you probably got a few laughs out of it. If you are less-experienced, then you may have been confused by this book, which is the sole reason for my posting this review. Pg1: "Hundreds of commercial breweries flourished in America around the turn of the century, and beer-lovers could choose from a variety of lagers and pilsners. There are now only 50 left and within a few short years there may be only five remaining." Indeed, there were hundreds of breweries around 1900, but "lagers and pilsners" [sic] were not the only styles they brewed. Back then, ales were quite popular also and many styles of ale were available to the beer-lover. By the way, pilsners ARE lagers, just one specific style of lager. Fear not, the numbers of breweries in the US are growing, not shrinking. "It takes only about thirty minutes to mix the ingredients, and a week later, another thirty minutes to bottle and cap, with nothing to do in between." I'll address the boil time issue later, but unless you're not sanitizing and you're using 1/2 gallon bottles, bottling will take you over two hours. Pg2: "The single stage fermenter, developed since my previous books on home beer-making, is a great improvement in equipment. It is made of FDA food-grade polyethelene..." Will the wonders of high-technology ever cease! Will you look at that! As a by-product of research done for the Space Shuttle project, single- stage fermenters are now available to us lowly homebrewers. By the way Leigh, that's "polyethylene." Pg3: "Since the fermenter is filled with CO2 gas the beer is protected against spoilage because spoilage organisms are air-bourne and cannot live in a CO2 environment." Yes, unless you count Lactobacillus and Pediococcus and wild yeasts of perhaps 30 species from Hafnia to Bayanus, not to mention Cryptococcus which is water-bourne... ...seriously, molds and two species of acetobacter are the most common spoilage organisms that cannot live in a CO2 environment. Pg5: "Always let your equipment drain upside down to dry. After brewing your beer, rinse out your fermenter immediately after emptying it so that the beer does not have time to dry. The same applies to your siphon hose. This way, you will not have to sterilize your utensils each time you use them. It is a good idea to run a solution of Clorox and water through your siphon hose and also your fermenter after several batches, again using the above solution of one tablespoon of bleach to one gallon of cold water." Well, I doubt even the beginners on the HBD can see what's wrong with this picture. Yes it's a good idea to rinse immediately and I feel that the concentration of bleach is right, but we all know very well that sanitation is the most important part of brewing good beer and everything that will come in contact with your beer should be sanitized (and rinsed in the case of bleach) immediately before use. "If you rinse your bottles out with hot water immediately after emptying them, scrub them with the bottle brush and leave them to dry upside down and, finally, store them upside down in their carton, it will not be necessary to resterilize or re-clean them prior to the next brewing." I would venture to guess that the author of this booklet has a gusher at least once in every ten bottles with these procedures. Again, it`s great idea to rinse right away, but sanitation is required before use. By the way, that "sterilization" would require the equipment or bottles to be irradiated or autoclaved. What the author surely meant was "sanitized." To be continued... Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 11:30:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Domenick Venezia <venezia at zgi.com> Subject: Hangover prevention and treatment Slightly suffering as I am at this moment from too much Barolo and Port (it wasn't a beer night), I thought I would share what I have learned from some decades of chronic overindulgence in various and varied fermentations. Metabolism of ethyl alcohol (CH3-CH2OH) and the higher so-called fusel alcohols (CH3-(CH2)n-CH2OH) uses prodigous quantities of WATER and B-vitamins. If one arrives at an Emergency room dangerously intoxicated the first thing one receives is a mega-dose of B-vitamins in the butt or thigh. Since alcohol metabolism depletes one's store of B-vitamins it is very important for us steady imbibers to maintain high body stores of B-vitamins. This can be done through proper nutrition or through balanced, high quality, relatively high dose supplements. It is important that we watch our health because it may seriously affect our ability to drink! Maintaining good body stores of B-vitamins will reduce hangover severity by itself, but personally I pop a couple extra before bed on those nights when I've had a few. For those of you who are serious physical exercisers (again, general good health increases one's ability to imbibe) know that dehydration leads to headache and nausea. In my opinion it is dehydration that causes these symptoms called "hangover". The solution is in fact a solution. Drink as much water as you can before you go to bed, and drink water through out the night. And I mean QUARTS! Now some of you may think that this would necessitate many nighttime excursions, and you are right. But it gives you the chance to drink more water, and given the choice would you rather be a little tired the next day (take a nap) or hungover? Finally, Paul Sovcik recently mentioned a greasy breakfast will ameliorate a hangover. I also have found this to be true, though I take issue with the term "greasy". Let's just say "fat containing", such as an egg over medium with a thin slice of sharp cheddar on whole wheat toast. In summary: serious drinking demands serious training and attention to general health and nutrition; take your B-vitamins; drink lots of water; have breakfast. Domenick Venezia ZymoGenetics, Inc. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 12:37 CDT From: "Michael Barre" <MBARRE at NOMVS.LSUMC.EDU> Subject: Metallic first batch Thanks Andy, Brian, and Al for your help. The water I used (tap water pulled from the Mississippi River) is definitely hard - 12 to 14 mg/l according to the spring water salesman. Brian, I did not boil the water, but tried to remove the chlorine before adding the wort by filling the sanitized fermentation bucket with the 3.5 gallons of water two days before the brewing. I removed the lid from this bucket only two or three times during that time, to allow the evaporated chlorine to escape but keep the nasties out. I know two days in a bucket WITHOUT a lid is enough time to dechlorinate my water, from experience with fish tanks; but WITH a lid, I don't know. Neither did I siphon off the precipitate. The s.g. had fallen from 1.048 to 1.010 (corrected to 60F) within 13 days, at which time I bottled it. I had a lot of precipitate (from hop pellets) in the fermentor. Do you think siphoning into a secondary fermentor would improve the flavor? Should I use a hop bag for the pellets? Which reminds me, someone posted a question recently about shoving the flotsam back down into the wort. After a week of fermentation I uncovered the wort to scoop some out with my sterilized (boiled for 15 minutes) Pyrex measuring cup to test the s.g. At that time I pushed most of the scum from the sides of the bucket back into the liquid with my sterilized steel spoon. I don't know if that contributed to my problem, but I won't do it again. When the Ozone man gets here next Monday, I will purchase a glass carboy with zero hardness (according to the salesman) spring water from him. I will use that water and use that carboy as a primary fermentor. I will purchase better (ale) yeast and extract. If I use pelletized hops, I will put them in a bag. I will jug-aerate the water. And, I will use the water-pan-towel-drape fermentator cooler. I may or may not use liquid yeast, and may or may not siphon off into a secondary fermentor after the fermentation settles down. Thanks again for the help. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 12:43 EDT From: LYONS at adc2.adc.ray.com Subject: Light (Lovibond) Extract >>Subject: Light (Lovibond) Extract >> >> I wish to make a beer with the lightest possible color as is >> possible with extract. >> What suggetions can you give me for both liquid extract >> (preferrably unhopped) and DME? >> >> TIA >> Andy A > >Andy, from my experience and comments from my local supplier, American Eagle >seems to be the lightest extract (both dry and syrup) on the market. Their >amber DME seems to be the color of M&F et.al.'s light. > I seem to recall some HBDers complaining that the American Eagle dry extract product had significant amounts of corn sugar mixed in with the malt. This would certainly make a light beer, but it may be better to stay with a quality extract, such as M&F or Laaglander, which claims to be all malt. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 12:46 EDT From: LYONS at adc2.adc.ray.com Subject: RE: Help rescue my first batch! >From: J. Michael Diehl <mdiehl at triton.unm.edu> >Subject: Help rescue my first batch! > >Last sunday, I started my first batch, an extract. I'm using a Laaglander >Dutch Dark Beer kit. But I think I'm in for some problems. > >My initial Gravity was only 25; I was told to expect 45, on the scale that is. >I also expected a bit more vigorous bubbling. I had times when it didn't >buble at all, other times it did pretty well. Anyway, 2 days after pitching, >My girlfriend and I tasted a bit of the wort. It tasted like watered-down >sour grapejuice. I figured that maybe I didn't stir it well enough so after >2 more days, I stired it up real good and took a gravity reading, a 20. It >still tasted the same, but I bet you could catch a buzz of it! ;^) Now I >suspect that all of the yeast is dead. What do I do now? Thanx in advance. An OG of 25 and FG of 20 would result in a beer with less than 1%A. I suspect that your first batch is okay and that you forgot to correct the OG for temperature. For example, an SG reading of 25 measured at 185F would translate to a SG of ~55.5 at 60F. Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1172, 07/01/93