HOMEBREW Digest #1258 Fri 29 October 1993

Digest #1257 Digest #1259

		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

  Hops FAQ, Part 2/5 (npyle)
  Re: yeasts (Jim Busch)
  You can't judge a beer by the bottle, but... (John Adams)
  grain storage ("Anton Verhulst")
  CF Chiller Effects on Hop Character ("Robert H. Reed")
  milling red hard spring wheat (Robert Schultz)
  Miscelaneous (Ulick Stafford)
  Steam injection (npyle)
  steam injection ("Anton Verhulst")
  Requesting Rum Distillation info (Domenick Venezia)
  Beer Drinks (Brad Roach)
  Chillers (Jack Schmidling)
  Show and Tell on my UK trip (Samuel Smith's) ("Bob Jones")
  Beer Shelf Life (Tom Schwendler)
  Hop Storage & Growth/Quaff & Stir (COYOTE)
  Growing Hops (Philip Proefrock)
  Pitching large yeast starters ("Bob Jones")
  Late Hops vs. Chiller, Homegrown Hops (Mark Garetz)
  Carboy Alert! ("Anthony Johnston")
  Favorite Beer Cocktail ("Stephen Schember")
  doppelbock (Michael Hohnbaum)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 8:30:01 MDT From: npyle at n33.stortek.com Subject: Hops FAQ, Part 2/5 Hops FAQ, Part 2/5: - -- Q: Should I use pellets, or plugs, or loose hops? A: Much has been written about what form of hops should be used. Loose hops are just that: loose cones which have been dried after picking. Plugs are loose hops which have been subsequently pressed into a bung, generally in 0.5 oz. sizes. Pellets are loose hops which have been ground to a fine powder and then pressed into rabbit-food-sized pellets. LOOSE HOPS Advantages: They are the most natural form of the ingredient. They float, which is good for siphoning out from under, and form a natural filter bed. When they are fresh, they beat all others in terms of aromatic hop oils. Disadvantages: They float, so some contact with a still wort (as in dry hopping) is lost, when compared to pellets. This problem can be overcome, though by using weighted hop bags, or it can be ignored. Since they are loose, exposure to air is the greatest and they lose quality quickly when compared to the other forms of hops. When stored in vaccuum-sealed or CO2 or nitrogen purged Oxygen barrier bags or jars, this problem can be avoided. They are bulkier than other forms. PLUGS Advantages: Are nearly the same as loose hops, in that, when hydrated, they become whole hop cones again. Like loose hops, they float. Unlike loose hops, they are better protected from air. Disadvantages: Few hop varieties come in this form. Currently, any domestic varieties are first shipped to England where they are made into plugs and then shipped back to the U.S. This may negate any freshness advantage they have over loose hops (for U.S. varieties) It is difficult, but not impossible to separate into increments smaller than 0.5 oz. PELLETS Advantages: Convenient to measure and have the best protection from air. They sink, so they get maximum contact in a still wort, as when used for dry hopping. This advantage may be mitigated though, if they are subsequently covered with dead yeast, so later additions are recommended. They reportedly contribute 10% more alpha acids to the wort because of maximized surface area, so are a more efficient use of this relatively expensive ingredient. They are generally available in more varieties and are generally a more consistent product. Disadvantages: They sink, so it is sometimes difficult to avoid them when siphoning. The extra processing may reduce/change hop aromatics. Given the pros and cons listed, the choice of which form of hop to use in a certain application is up the individual brewer. - -- Q: What are AAU, HBU, and IBU's? A: Alpha Acid Units (AAU) and Homebrew Bittering Units (HBU) are the same. For the sake of discussion we will use AAU's, which are calculated as follows: AAU = AA * W where AA = alpha acid % provided with the hops W = weight of the hops in ounces The units of AAU's would be "percent-ounces". They are usually considered "unit-less". It is generally assumed that, when using AAU or HBU, the batch size is the standard homebrewing unit of 5 gallons. If a beer is said to have 10 AAU's of bitterness in it, and it is a 5 gallon batch, there would probably be no confusion. If on the other hand, it is a 10 gallon batch, there is actually half the AAU's per gallon when compared to the 5 gallon batch and the beer would be quite different. Another drawback to using AAU's is that they don't consider the utilization obtained from long, intermediate, or short boil times. Fudge factors are sometimes added but at best they offer a rough approximation. To solve these problems, the International Bittering Unit (IBU) may be used. With it, the brewer can get a more accurate approximation of the bitterness given up by a given quantity of a given AA hop for a given boil time. It is batch size dependent so that a 5 gallon batch with 29 IBU's has the same bitterness as a 50 barrel batch with 29 IBU's. The equations are commonly quoted from Jackie Rager's article in the Zymurgy "Hops and Beer" Special Edition published in 1990. The tables and formulae follow: Boiling Time (minutes) % Utilization - ---------------------- ------------- less than 5 5.0 6 - 10 6.0 11 - 15 8.0 16 - 20 10.1 21 - 25 12.1 26 - 30 15.3 31 - 35 18.8 36 - 40 22.8 41 - 45 26.9 46 - 50 28.1 51 - 60 30.0 Utilization can be reduced to the following smooth function, as opposed to the table, which produces many discontinuous lines. Either can be used with sufficient accuracy for the homebrewing operation. %UTILIZATION = 18.10907 + 13.86204 * hyptan[(MINUTES - 31.32275) / 18.26774] (Of course, you can drop some of those significant figures.) If the gravity of the boil exceeds 1.050: ADJUSTMENT = (BOIL_GRAVITY - 1.050) / 0.2 otherwise, ADJUSTMENT = 0 IBU_PER_OZ = %UTILIZATION * %ALPHA * 7462 / (VOLUME * (1 + ADJUSTMENT)); UTILIZATION is the percent alpha acids expressed as a decimal fraction ALPHA is the percent alpha acids expressed as a decimal fraction VOLUME is the final number of gallons in the batch (usually 5). To calculate IBU's if you know the number of ounces of hops to be used: IBU = OUNCES * IBU_PER_OZ To predict the number of ounces needed to hit a target IBU: OUNCES = IBU / IBU_PER_OZ Jackie Rager's numbers have been used successfully by hundreds of homebrewers and provide a consistent base with which to work. It is apparent that his constant 7462, derived from metric to US conversion, is actually closer to 7490. The ADJUSTMENT factor could be questioned as well, as it is intuitively obvious that a gravity of 1.049 does not affect utilization exactly the same as a gravity of 1.000 (water). It is assumed that the utilization table is corrected for this assumption and/or the difference is small enough that it has little effect on the final bitterness of the beer. Note also that Mr. Rager's numbers are often used for pellet hops thrown loose in the boil. It is common to add 10% more hops if used in a hop bag, and 10% more than that if loose hops or plugs are used. It has been reported that since iso-alpha acids possess a slight electrical charge, they can be lost in many ways. Among these are absorption into the yeast cell walls (and subsequent removal of the yeast), attachment to coagulating proteins (and subsequent removal of this trub), attachment to filters, etc. It is unclear if Mr. Rager's utilization numbers have assumed these losses. A revised utilization table has been presented by Mark Garetz and can be used if desired. It is shown below for reference. Boiling Time (minutes) % Utilization (adjusted for average yeast) - ---------------------- ------------- less than 5 0.0 6 - 10 0.0 11 - 15 1.0 16 - 20 4.0 21 - 25 6.0 26 - 30 11.0 31 - 35 13.0 36 - 40 19.0 41 - 45 23.0 46 - 50 24.0 51 - 60 25.0 The same IBU formulae from above can be used with this table. It represents one of the many arguable topics of hops in homebrewing. - -- Q: How do I store my hops? A: At as low a temperature as possible, likely to be in your freezer. Also, attempt to remove as much air as possible from the package and use airtight, preferably oxygen-barrier packages. - -- End part 2/5 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 10:40:04 -0500 (EDT) From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com> Subject: Re: yeasts > Date: Thu, 21 Oct 93 13:29:18 MDT > From: npyle at n33.stortek.com > Subject: Late Kettle Hop Additions > I've been thinking recently about hop additions (all this Hops FAQ stuff has forced me to think about some of this stuff). I just realized that there is an inherent advantage to immersion chillers (my old method) over counter-flow chillers (my current method). Yes, the immersion chiller leaves the cold break in the kettle but it does something else that I have not seen discussed in this forum. With the counter-flow chiller the wort and hops remain near 100C the entire time the wort is being chilled. From experience I know the kettle is still extremely hot 20 minutes after turning off the flame. I would bet that finishing hops act more like flavoring hops and that flavoring hops act more like bittering hops with a counter-flow. Can anyone verify these assumptions? Do you know of any commercial brewers who use immersion chillers (they clearly have _some_ advantages)? Probably not since immersion chillers are less efficient and I know of few commercial brewers (even micros) who care a lot about hop aroma. This is certainly true, the time/temp can be long and high. Some pro and not pro brewers add finish hops to the whirlpool in an effort to get more aromatics in the beer. I whirlpool in the kettle, so when I add late hops, it does sit at 200+F for the 15 min whirlpool, and subsequent 35 min chill. You will still end up with aromatics, but if you want more, like I do in many beers, there is no substitute for dry hopping. > ------------------------------ > Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1993 12:34:58 -0700 (PDT) > From: Domenick Venezia <venezia at zgi.com> > Subject: Yeast nutrients/pitching > > > My goal in starting this enquiry was to somehow get my pitching rate into an > acceptable range while NOT being forced to pitch a half gallon or more of > some other wort into a carefully designed recipe. Remember a half gallon is > 10% of a 5 gallon batch and such a volume will affect your results. I would > like to do an adequate pitch in about a pint of starter. Also, I wanted > to avoid having to save and pitch yeast slurry from previous batches (Hey, > I want it all). > > Generally, I pitch a pint starter (very seriously underpitching) and if I > can get 10 times the pitching rate by using a little YNB (provided the yeast > characteristics remain stable) I figure it's worth it. > > If one is not reusing slurry but using a starter what's involved in getting > an adequate lager pitch of 10-15x10**6 cells/ml in a 5 gallon batch? Well, if dilution of the bitter wort is an issue, then decant the still beer off of the starter/yeast slurry. If you dont have enough slurry, add more fresh wort, let ferment out, and decant. Mike Sharp is a big pro- ponnent of pitching after high krausen, so the ferment and decant method makes sense. With cell densities, you are kinda forced into successive steps up to get the cell count up, or reuse yeast from a previous ferment. > > What kind of lag time did he get? I'll bet it was on the order of 10-12 > > hours, not bad, but greater than optimum. > > With Wyeast Chico Ale strain he got just what Dan expected, 10-12 hrs. > However, with Wyeast London Ale strain he got a 3 hour lag. > > Speaking of lag time, how exactly are we determining the end of lag time? > For my own purposes I have defined the EOLT as 2 bubbles/minute from my > airlock, but this may be misleading in either direction. Jim? Dan? fg > 3 hours is really great! I measure the transition by visable krausen on the top of the wort. With my brew schedule, I never see the transition, since I usually cast out into the fermenter at 10PM, pump oxygen for about 2 hours, and go to bed. By 7AM, the ferment is usually crawling out and over the floor! Got to get a bigger fermenter :-) > > In fact, I think its a pretty darn good one if you are brewing outside > and pipe your wort into the basement. Mount that on the basement wall > and you don't have to worry about hauling it around, setting it set up > or it being in the way. I'd encourage you to make it at tell us how it > works... This is how I do it. I have a 12 foot prechiller counterflow from the kettle to the pipeline interface. This feeds 50 feet of counterflow pipeline, second stage, underground, into basement, cross basement, to fermentation area, where it goes through 15 feet of ice bath, ball valve into fermenter. I over-engineered it for several reasons: speed, high tap water temp in summer, and hopes of lagering some day. At the end of the transfer, I hook up 175+F water from my hot liquor tank and rinse the pipeline, often diluting the cast out wort. > Subject: Steam injection > > I recently watched a fellow homebrewer use what I consider an extremely > clever gadget. He had an ordinary household pressure cooker that he > modified to run a steam line out through a ball valve. By simply injecting > live, low pressure steam into the bottom of his picnic cooler mash tun while > stirring the mash, he was able to raise the temperature to the desired point > very quickly. He also used the steam to heat his sparge water in the same > way. It all seemed so simple and logical that I wondered why I hadn't seen > it mentioned before. > > Has anyone experimented with this type of setup? What were the pros and > cons? > Sounds dangerous to me. How do you know when it is empty? Best, Jim Busch Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 08:37:28 -0600 From: John Adams <j_adams at hpfcjca.sde.hp.com> Subject: You can't judge a beer by the bottle, but... Good point. If you look in any copy of Zymergy you will find a few companies that produce custom labels but I've never seen anyone who makes caps, bottles, or wooden crates. Personally I make my own labels using a graphics editor, a ray-tracer, a good collection of gif/jpeg "clip art" of beer labels, and a color printer. I would also like to find an outfit that produces custom beer coasters. John Adams Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 10:46:34 EDT From: "Anton Verhulst" <verhulst at zk3.dec.com> Subject: grain storage garti at mrg.xyplex.com (Mark Garti) asks: >what are people using to store their grain in? >how long, under good conditions, will the grain be >fresh? besides rats, are there any problems associated >with buying and keeping 50 lbs of grain? >mrgarti at xyplex.com I store all my specialty grains in a 48 quart picnic cooler (I already have a good lauter tun :-). I find this really effective for storing small (1 to 5 pound bags of crystal, roasted, and other malts. As for base malts, I still don't have a good method for storage. I usually by 55 pound bags of Munton & Fison malts and their bags are plastic lined. As long as you close the top well, insects aren't a problem. Rats are another matter. With 3 cats in the house, rodents are not my concern :-) but they could get into that bag with no problem at all. A good solution might be a heavy duty 30 gallon trash container with a tight fitting lid. - --Tony Verhulst Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 10:54:14 -0400 (EDT) From: "Robert H. Reed" <rhreed at icdc.delcoelect.com> Subject: CF Chiller Effects on Hop Character Norm Pyle writes: > With the counter-flow chiller the wort and hops remain near 100C the entire > time the wort is being chilled. From experience I know the kettle is still > extremely hot 20 minutes after turning off the flame. I would bet that > finishing hops act more like flavoring hops and that flavoring hops act more > like bittering hops with a counter-flow. Can anyone verify these assumptions? <snip> > I may alter my procedure a little bit to compensate for this. I haven't yet > decided how. Suggestions? I noticed a similar change in late hop character when I changed to using a CF chiller: I found that to obtain the same hop flavor and aroma, I had to add *more* hops *later* in the process as compared to my previous process that used an immersion chiller. One technique that I have found useful is to add hops *during* the runoff. After my boil is complete, I stir the wort vigorously and wait 15 min for the trub and hops to settle. During the runoff - about 25 min for 5.5 gal - I typically add whole hops in one or two additions. This has improved the intensity of my late hop character. I use a slotted pick-up tube in the boiler to avoid clogging the chiller. I feel the CF chiller has pros and cons: I get a much better cold break with my CF unit using well water. My wort exit temp is ~55-60F. Another benefit is that, given that my chiller and settling tank are disinfected, there is very little risk of infection because the wort in my boiler is still above 160F at the end of runoff. On the downside, one must deal with the cold break in the fermentor and the late hop character is decreased in the 30-40 min. the wort remains in the boiler. Rob Reed Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 09:13:40 -0600 (CST) From: Robert Schultz <Robert.Schultz at usask.ca> Subject: milling red hard spring wheat I attempted Phil Seitz's Beligian White Ale on the weekend. I now know what Phil meant by grinding 5 lbs of wheat on a Corona. How do the roller mills perform on the hard unmalted grains (wheat, rye, rice)? Barley and oats are fairly soft. Rob. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~ Robert.Schultz at usask.ca, University Studies Group, University of Saskatchewan~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~ "I'm going off half-cocked? I'm going off half-cocked? ... ~ ~ Well, Mother was right - You can't argue with a shotgun." - Gary Larson ~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 10:53:41 EST From: Ulick Stafford <ulick at michaelangelo.helios.nd.edu> Subject: Miscelaneous With HBD bunged up worse than my sink was last week, should people be lecturing about humor or criticizing the humorless in the digest rather than by email? Re brewing. Peter Just asks about lagering in bottle vs carboy (or keg). The advantage of the latter is clarity - and very little sediment, but a disadvantage is fresh yeast should be added. The advantage of the former is timesaving and less trouble with equipment. However, I think the advantages of bulk conditioning outweigh the trouble involved (1255). Robert Urweiler asks about labels. There was an article in the last Zymurgy, which was nearly more useful than the entire last BT (IMHO). Was anyone else disappointed with it after their first 2 excellent issues? Scott Weisler resonds to greg with criticism of a PVC pipe design wort chiller. The problems mentioned are easily overcome with baffles, and the design can be as or more effective than the garden hose method because the flow is more turbulent. I am considering such a device. However the outer part will be metal - not PVC - possibly and old paint can or something thicker with bulhead fittings and pieces of scrap metal for baffles. Sterilize by bunging the whole thing in the oven for half an hour. Pity one can't buy a nice small shell and tube heat exchanger cheaply. Ulick Stafford - no sig to conserve bandwidth Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 9:55:19 MDT From: npyle at n33.stortek.com Subject: Steam injection Ed Westemeier mentions steam injection for heating sparge water and for step mashes. It sounds fine for sparge water heating (although I can think of more efficient means of heat transfer). My first thought in using it for stepping up mash temperature is Hot Side Aeration. This may or may not be a problem, though, on second thought. Does steam contain lots of free oxygen? It is not like hot water which can contain dissolved oxygen, but it is pushing along lots of (hot) air with it. I suspect it is not a good idea to use steam directly but it gives me an idea for putting a radiator in my cooler/mash tun. This way you could add heat to the cooler for step mashes without the complications of electricity (for some reason a direct propane flame doesn't seem like a good idea). I have lots of 3/8" copper tubing in the garage, hmmm... norm Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 12:05:45 EDT From: "Anton Verhulst" <verhulst at zk3.dec.com> Subject: steam injection Ed Westemeier writes: >I recently watched a fellow homebrewer use what I consider an extremely >clever gadget. He had an ordinary household pressure cooker that he >modified to run a steam line out through a ball valve. By simply injecting >live, low pressure steam into the bottom of his picnic cooler mash tun while >stirring the mash, he was able to raise the temperature to the desired point >very quickly....... This, sir, is just too wonderful for words. Thank you. BTW, what kind of tubing was being used? - --Tony Verhulst Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 09:16:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Domenick Venezia <venezia at zgi.com> Subject: Requesting Rum Distillation info I realize this is a forum for BREWING but the recent mini-thread on distillation indicated to me there may be some expertise in HBD-land that I could tap. I have been presented with a possible commercial endeavor and am looking for *REAL* information (with references) on the subject of distillation of spirits, particularly rum. Please use private Email. Thanks. Domenick Venezia ZymoGenetics, Inc. venezia at zgi.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 09:41:56 PDT From: b_roach at qlc.com (Brad Roach) Subject: Beer Drinks I don't know if this qualifies as a beer drink, but when I make margaritas I always add alittle beer before blending. The advantages are: 1) the beer tends to hide the Tequila taste, and 2) makes the margaritas more foamy. __ /_/ / / \ /_ __ __/ /___/_/ (_(_<_(_/ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 12:20 CDT From: arf at mcs.com (Jack Schmidling) Subject: Chillers >From: npyle at n33.stortek.com >Subject: Late Kettle Hop Additions >I've been thinking recently about hop additions (all this Hops FAQ stuff has forced me to think about some of this stuff)... The immersion chiller cools the wort and hops fairly quickly from 100C to around 50C (maybe 10 minutes). The late kettle additions are boiled for a short time (1-10 minutes) and then within 10 more minutes they are at a relatively low temperature (50C). It is unfortunate that those who do not read rec.crafts.brewing missed the recent great debate on immersion vs counter-flow chillers. Kinney Bauman did an admirable job of defending counter-flow in light of its obvious shortcomings and naturally lost to the Lighthouse of Wisdom and Truth. I won't re-hash the whole argument here but in summary, not a single, UNARGUABLE advantage could be brought in defense of counter-flow for home brewers and most of the good reasons are only valid in large scale brewing. The only advantage to homebrewers was the OPINION that chilling faster made for clearer beer but no one had come up with any documentation to prove the point. Before I get into the virtues of immersion chilling, it is necessary to point out that I would no more use a poorly designed immersion chiller than a poorly designed anythingelse and most people do not have proper immersion chillers. Mine is installed in the lid of the kettle with quick disconnects to water and drain lines. Once the lid and chiller are in place, they can stay there for hours or days without risk of contamination or loss of aroma laden vapor. Now, ponder the possibilities this allows. You have an infinite number of post boil hopping schedules that you can play with. For example, shut off the heat, put on the lid and throw in some hops. This hops is at near boil temp which kills that herbal taste but the vapor and aroma can not escape. When you chill it down, the vapor and aroma are re-absorbed by the wort. Let's say you think that some shops should be added at 163.794 degs F and allowed to natually cool with the wort. No problem either. Maybe you want to add some every 10 degs as it cools or how bout chilling it down right away and adding it at pitching temp but letting it sit in the kettle for 24 hours to absorb the flavor. There are no end of possibilities to toy with. >Do you know of any commercial brewers who use immersion chillers (they clearly have _some_ advantages)? They have only one disadvantage.... they are ponderous and totally impractical in a large operation. They require a removable lid to get it out or an impossible cleaning headache if installed permentantly in the kettle. Counterflow chillers of a modest size can chill any amount of wort given enough time. It is another good example of what can go wrong when people simply scale down what they see in a commercial operation and assume it must be better for homebrewers. The counter-flow "snobs" are simply wrong on this one. BTW, you mentioned that the kettle stays hot awhile with the counterflow anyway but that is not the argument. There is no magic as to how long the wort stays hot. The issue CAN be, how hot? If it falls below pasturization temp and is open to the air, there is a risk of contamination. If it stays near boiling, it is no worse than extending the boil that amount of time. And keep in mind that PU simply air cools the wort till it reaches lower temps. The counter-flow afficinados claim that it is the instantaneous chilling of each quantum of wort as it passes through the chiller that does the magic. While this is certainly something one can not do with immersion chilling, no one, (at least in that discussion) was able to prove that it really makes any difference. Judging from the reputation of PU, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with how long it takes to get from boiling to 150F, so it needs to be proven that fast chilling from there to pitching temp is critical. To me, the most obvious disadvantage of the counter-flow chiller is that most of what would have stayed behind in the kettle ends up in the fermenter unless one does an additional settling step. So, I hereby challange the counter-flowers to start your engines.... js Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 10:38:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "Bob Jones" <bjones at novax.llnl.gov> Subject: Show and Tell on my UK trip (Samuel Smith's) Thought I would add a few more interesting observations about my recent UK trip. I dropped in at Samuel Smith's brewery in the afternoon an ask about a tour. They said they were all booked up. I mentioned I was a brewer from the states and the receptionist made a phone call and I was in. The tour was at 7pm that evening. My wife and I showed up in the adjoining pub with about 12 other people. Our tour began in the tack room. That's where they keep all the hardware for their horses. We heard all the details about their award winning horses before we went outside to see and feed and pet one of them. These are Shires, we're talking big horses here. I could just see over the horses back. I'm 5'8". Sam Smith's does no advertising and depends on their horses, which they show around everywhere, and public good will for their advertising. It seems to work. Afterward we entered the brew house and I got to see those famous Yorkshire slate squares I have heard so much about. I finally understand these damn things. One of them was empty and several of them were in full blown fermentation. They look like this... | A | | | |------/ \-------| divider | | | B | |---------------------| The unfermented wort is filled in chamber B just below the divider. As the fermentation proceeds, the foam and yeast are pushed up into chamber A. Because there is the cone shaped thing is the center, the yeast is skimmed from the beer. After a day of fermentation, they pump all the liquid from B back to A. This is just to rouse the fermentation. After this they just let the skimming action take place. Sort of neat, huh. I have no idea how they clean the B chamber. They told me they never repitch their yeast. They always grow up a fresh batch. I got to see their impressive steam generator and their gorgeous copper kettles. Then we entered the lager brewery. Yep you heard me right. They brew lagers under special contract for Ayinger. The lager brewhouse had a kettle and mash tun that was gigantic. We saw the other standard brew stuff, and made our way to the pump room. It is tucked away under the brewery. You have to almost crawl to get there. It was easier when leaving :->. We drank their cask ales and saw a movie. After a few beers I found myself behind the bar pulling my own beers with those great beer engines. Lots of fun! I tasted NO diacetyl in any of their beers. I mentioned the skunkyness we get in their beers in the states due to their use of clear bottles for some beers. They seemed amazed. Sam Smith's is located in the town of Tadcaster about 30 mins outside of York. There are about 4 breweries in Tadcaster, Bass, Magnet, Sam Smith's and John Smith's. All the breweries located there because of the water quality (the water is very hard). There is alot of rivalry between Sam Smith's and John Smith's. John was a brother and split off another brewery. Sort of a family outcast. The John Smith's brewery was sucked up by Courage in 1970. All of Sam Smith's beers I tasted in England were very good. I had a pint of their Museum ale in London. It had a distinct woody character to it. It was drawn from a wooden cask. The taste was sort of a young, green woody character. Maybe some of you brewers that have experimented with wood chips in your IPA's would know what I mean. This was not an IPA, however. Cheers, Bob Jones Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 10:54:52 EDT From: softdesk!suez!trs at uunet.UU.NET (Tom Schwendler) Subject: Beer Shelf Life Hello brewers, I just read that sediment beers (beers with yeast sediment) have a shelf life of only 3 months. I know I have kept bottles longer than that, but does anyone know what the shelf life of homebrewed beer is? Let's say assuming you are keeping the beer in a cool dark place, how long should it store without turning sour, or acidic? Other than filtration or pasturization, are there ways the homebrewer can increase the shelf life of bottled beer? Thanks for your help, trs at softdesk.com Tom Schwendler Structural Product Manager Softdesk, Inc. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 12:44:25 -0600 (MDT) From: COYOTE <SLK6P at cc.usu.edu> Subject: Hop Storage & Growth/Quaff & Stir *************************** Hop Forms- Stability.... > Also, regarding the type, pellets tend to retain more of everything (AA and aromatics) than plugs, which retain more of everything than whole. It's all a matter of exposed surface area. * Just a comment here: One of the disadvatages (not to open a can of worms! Old debate I know!) to pellets involves the process of pelletization. This process involves physical abuse, and some temp. stress to the hops. This results in some loss of aromatic qualities from the hop as compared to fresh cones. Plugs are a good in between since the hops are not first chopped, but just pressed into pellets. So to say that " pellets tend to retain more of everything" is a bit misleading. In terms of storage...YES, in terms of qualities lost from the time of harvest thru processing, to the store, NO. It is true that handling of flake hops (cones) does have the potential to reduce quality mroe than handling of pellets. I commonly find a collection of yellow crystals at the bottom of my flake hop bags. So.....my solution. Grow my own! See note below.... *************************** From: Philip Proefrock <PSPROEFR at MIAMIU.ACS.MUOHIO.EDU> Subject: Growing Hops >I am interested in growing my own hops for use in my homebrew. (I don't plan to use this exclusively, but it would be nice to have hops I had grown in the beer that I brew. I expect I would only use the homegrown hops for one part of the process, say boiling, and will continue to buy other varieties for flavor/aroma.) Does anyone else do this? Can you provide some pointers, suggestions as to where I can find seedlings or seeds, etc.? What varieties will grow best in the midwest?o I hope to get starters going indoors this fall, so that I can get them growing this coming spring. * Hop Growing Experience (1 year- first season, but what a thrill!) "exclusively"- You'd need a BIG vine yard to keep up- 1 harvest to last all year. That's asking a lot. BUt maybe after a few years. "boiling"- Personally I feel I get the best advantage out of the fresh- ness of my homegrown hops by utilizing them at finishing. BOUQUET!!!! Plus I am able to spread out there use more that way. Planting Time: Early spring. March-May depending on location. Form of starts: Rhizomes- segments of roots with sprouts. No Seeds! (I actually found a seed in one of my cones. I don't know what fertilized it, but it was a rather odd find! Haven't tried growing it. ) Female plants are propogated. Males not found- except on research plots. Plan on some TALL vines. Very fast growing! Beautiful sight to watch. You can actually OBSERVE growth. 3 inches per day at the peak! The way to plant is dig a plot- fertilize/mulch, and lay the rhizome in a hole. Protect from frost until things warm up. No point in starting them inside. Just count on several years till "great growth and production" is observed. Well worth it! I planted 4 varieties: Cascade- Good grower. Excellent production. Hardy. BIG cones! Chinook- not too impressive. A friend had the reverse of these 2 Mnt Hood- 2nd best growth. Yummy cones. Also quite hardy Perle- Not too impressive. A bit better than Chinook. I like the hop though. NOTE: This was the first year. Subsequent years will improve dramatically I did have quite a bit of pest problems, but the cascade was able to tough it out! I'm looking forward to next year! Can't wait till the start up again! I got starts from FreshHops in Philomath OR. 503-929-2736. No connection. Just a happy customer. There are other sources. Write to them or call and they will inform you when the starts are ready for shipment. It's about 2-4 $ rhizome. I used 2/hill. There is a book on Growing Hops- dont have the author at hand. It's an ok book. More of a personal account than a hard-fast guide. Some good info. He did do some research for it. That shows. There is a hop primer floating around somewhere on the net. I could try to find/post it if desired. ************************** Stuart from Edinburgh says he: > uses a plastic brewheat thingy and I think its crap, I want to brew bigger batches and I want to use gas to heat, cos I like flames! * I'm sure there's a few folks around willing and able to scorch a few flames. But that would never happen on HBD...right! :/ A note for AL...That's one reason why I didn't include the commercial mash/lauter tuns in my rundown. Not that they don't exist but just that with a little creativity one can be fashioned cheaply at home. I don't have exp w/ the commercial ones...but they are out there. Have heard good things about Phil's false butt. ************************* Tom queries: wanted to know if....needed to put down my homebrew to scape the hops off..side of kettle. It sure could save me a couple of minutes drinking time. * Hold a spoon/paddle in one hand, homebrew in the other and scrape away. I don't know for sure- but I would suggest that to get FULL extraction of hop oils you want to hop material in contact with hot liquor for the full boil. I use a mesh- hop bag, so I don't have that problem. I do plunge the bag to the bottom several times during the boil. But I can do that one handed. Use a beer mug with a handle if you don't feel comfortable with your dexterity. With a little practice you can master the techniques of continuous drinking during ANY activity. If you spill a little into your wort...don't worry. ************************************************************************* ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ John (The Coyote) Wyllie SLK6P at cc.usu.edu ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ *************************** bonk bonk bonk ****************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 12:05:14 -0700 (PDT) From: "Bob Jones" <bjones at novax.llnl.gov> Subject: Pitching large yeast starters Domenick Venezia's concern about pitching large starters into fermentations was a concern of mine as well. What I have started doing is wait until the yeast has dropped and then decant (I have actually been removing the liquid above the yeast with a small siphon hose) and then add additional food. Then I do the same again or just pitch straight into the wort. Work G. Fix and a few others have done, has shown that there are actually ADVANTAGES to pitching yeast AFTER high kruesen. The viability issue does enter into the equation if one waits too long before pitching. I can't seem to locate any info on yeast viability with time. Bob Jones Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 12:31:47 PDT From: Mark Garetz <mgaretz at hoptech.com> Subject: Late Hops vs. Chiller, Homegrown Hops Norm Pyle asked about immersion vs. counterflow chilling and late hop additions: Just my 2 cents: There's no reason to go back to immersion chilling for late hop additions, unless you want to. If you like counterflow chilling, you can compensate for the effects of long "hot wort time" by either covering the wort so the volatiles aren't lost or simply adding a bit more hops. But in my opinion the difference is likely to be a small one regardless. I would think that a much more significant effect would come from those that cool their wort by immersing the pot in a sink or bathtub of ice water, which takes significantly longer than either immersion coils or counter-flow chilling. For the record, I use an immersion chiller and also cover the pot as the wort cools. A tip is that since the coils don't allow the actual lid to fit over the pot while cooling, I use about three strips of Strech-tite (like Saran wrap) to cover the pot so that I get a good seal. Now I don't cover to keep in hop volatiles (but I suppose it does), but to keep airborne nasties out of the wort during cooling. I do not cover during the boil. Philip Proefrock writes: >I am interested in growing my own hops for use in my homebrew. (I don't >plan to use this exclusively, but it would be nice to have hops I had >grown in the beer that I brew. I expect I would only use the homegrown >hops for one part of the process, say boiling, and will continue to >buy other varieties for flavor/aroma.) I would suggest you do just the opposite. Use the homegrown hops for aroma additions and use hops you know the alpha acid ratings on for bittering. You can at least get a sense of the aroma potential of your homegrown hops by using your nose, but there's really no practical way to know how much alpha acid is in there (without a lab analysis). Mark Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 14:37:55 CDT From: "Anthony Johnston" <anthony at chemsun.chem.umn.edu> Subject: Carboy Alert! Just a note of potential concern to you all: Recently (about 5 mins ago) I was cleaning a carboy recruited from our stockroom that had previously held some (assumedly) harmless chemical solutions (KI in DI water and such). Anyway, after filling with approx 8 liters of water or so and dumping in about 250 g of potassium hydroxide pellets, I picked up the carboy to swirl and mix the contents. The second time I lifted the carboy, the entire bottom separated almost perfectly, dumping the contents. I am thankful that: 1) This occurred over my lab sink. 2) That the carboy contained only cheap chemicals rather than wort or (gasp!) finished beer. 3) That I didn't splash caustic KOH solution all over myself. In the future, I will (and will recommend to others) to: 1) carefully inspect all new carboys before initial use (and used ones too.) 2) regularly inspect my old ones 3) exercise due caution when picking up or transferring my carboys. 4) avoid any sudden thermal shock to the glass carboys. 5) Avoid long-term contact with caustic soda soluitions. I am sure that most of these precautions are obvious and well-known and the others may seem like overkill, but after seeing the results of a broken carboy... anthony johnston not crying over spilt wort (yet!!) Return to table of contents
Date: 26 Oct 1993 16:22:36 -0500 From: "Stephen Schember" <stephen_schember at terc.edu> Subject: Favorite Beer Cocktail Subject: Time: 4:00 PM OFFICE MEMO Favorite Beer Cocktail Date: 10/26/93 I know this horse is probably quite dead but here's another wallop. The favorite (only) beer cocktail in my house is something called "Skip and Go Naked" which consists of: 3 Cans Coors extra gold (or similar grade/style beer) 1 8 oz Can frozen Lemonade 8 oz Jim Beam (+,- to taste and desire to expose oneself to those you are drinking with) Ice to bring pitcher up to 2 quarts. Don't know its origin but it sure is good and goes well with embarassing board games. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 13:29 PDT From: hbaum at uts.amdahl.com (Michael Hohnbaum) Subject: doppelbock Around the end of August I asked for advice on priming a doppelbock, due to the concern that the yeast used to ferment would be wiped out by the high alchol level. I received numerous responses, all of which said "pitch some more yeast when you bottle". Fortunately I had set aside a bottle of my original starter to use in a planned beer this winter, so I had yeast available. I made up a one pint starter, added this yeast and let it ferment. Then I made a primer from 3/4 cups dme added this and the yeast to the bottling bucket with 5 gallons of doppelbock and bottled. I am happy to report that a week later the beer was perfectly carbonated resulting in a very tasty brew to help me through the upcoming winter. Thanks to all who provided me advice on this. For anyone interested, the recipe: Baumerator 10 pounds Briesse 2 row malt 3 pounds munich malt 1/2 pound toasted malt 1/2 pound chocolate malt 1/4 pound roasted barley 1/4 pound black patent malt 1/2 crystal malt 80L 4 ounces Tettenger boiling hops 1/2 ounce Tettenger finishing hops Yeast Labs Bavarian Lager Yeast OG 1084, FG 1020 Protein rest 125, Mash 154, Mashout 168 Michael Hohnbaum hbaum at uts.amdahl.com These opinions do not reflect amdahl's, but are completely mine. Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1258, 10/29/93