HOMEBREW Digest #1257 Thu 28 October 1993

Digest #1256 Digest #1258

		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

  Hops FAQ, Part 1/5 (npyle)
  Re: Liquid male extract (Nick Nikols)
  Watney's Red Barrel Clone (Bob W Surratt)
  Cider/Grain Storg/Sick Beer/NORM!/Sig.lines (COYOTE)
  re:Brewing with nuts  (R.) Cavasin" <cav at bnr.ca>
  Apparent attenuation ... function of yeast & malt. (lyons)
  Good Head/Spruce BOIL/junk (COYOTE)
  IPA request (Montgomery_John)
  Fermenting Process question ("Palmer.John")
  New England Brew Pubs (Todd Anderson)
  Re: layered beer (Brian Bliss)
  Update on "RCA" (W. Mark Witherspoon)
  Chapel Hill and Richmond Pubs/Brewpubs (sean v. taylor)
  Sheaf & Vine Brewing Supply (korz)
  Filtering/PitchTiming/GrainStorage/Critters/WyeastMunich/ChimayYeast/HeadKillingInfection (korz)
  Hemlock Beer (FILTER)
  Nut Beer (r.mcglew3)
  homebrew club gone stale! oxidation? (/R=HERLVX/R=AM/U=KLIGERMAN/FFN=KLIGERMAN/)
  Info on Yeast Labs Liq. Wanted (WEIX)
  clarifying in a keg (SWEENERB)
  Thoughts on a recipe for standard American beers... ("Victor Grigorieff")
  Faking orgasms and white knights (Diane Palme x2617)
  Beer hunting in Belgium: Part 6 (Aged beer tasting) ("Phillip Seitz")
  RE: Steam injection (Mike Fertsch)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 11:13:14 MDT From: npyle at n33.stortek.com Subject: Hops FAQ, Part 1/5 Here is part 1/5 of the Hops FAQ. I will send one part per day, but recent HBD activity may do any number of things to them (1 every other day, 2 in one day, ???). I'm looking for some Internet guru who can archive this thing for me in the near future (I have neither the time, inclination to learn, nor the facilities to do this). I will make one more revision if necessary, based on HBD feedback, but don't expect me to double the number of hours I've already put into this thing. Anyway, after the next revision, I'd like to email the whole thing to someone and have them archive it for me. Any takers? I hate to push off some of these hot discussions about mixing beer and Koolaid, but here goes: ****************************************************************************** HOPS FAQ, Revision 2, 10/25/93 Compiled/edited by Norm Pyle (npyle at n33.stortek.com) Reviewed/edited by Mark Garetz (mgaretz at hoptech.com) Reviewed/edited by Al Korzonas (korz at iepubj.att.com) I do not have the means to credit each passage individually, nor do I think it would make for good reading were I to do so. The following people (and probably many more, sorry if I miss crediting you!) have contributed to this FAQ (some of them don't even know they contributed!): Glenn Anderson (gande at slims.attmail.com) Scott Barrett (adiron!partech.com!scott at uunet.UU.NET) Nick Cuccia (Nick_Cuccia at talamasca.berkeley.ca.us) John DeCarlo (jdecarlo at mitre.org) Alan Edwards (rush at xanadu.llnl.gov) Bill Flowers (waflowers at qnx.com) Russ Gelinas (R_GELINAS at UNHH.UNH.EDU) Rick Larson (rick at adc.com) Don Leonard (don at tellabs.com) John Palmer (palmer#d#john at ssdgwy.mdc.com) Bob Regent (b_regent at holonet.net) Peter Soper (?) Patrick Weix (weix at swmed.edu) Carl West (eisen at kopf.HQ.Ileaf.COM) Ed Westemeier (westemeier at delphi.com) Dave Wiley (wiley at wiley.b11.ingr.com) Gene Zimmerman (EZIMMERM at UWYO.EDU) Also, Messieurs Miller, Papazian, and Rager should not be overlooked. They have all contributed to this FAQ, directly and indirectly. I thank you and the HBD thanks you. Here 'tis: - -- Q: What are hops? A: Hops are cultivated flowers (humulus lupulus) used for preservative and flavoring characteristics in beer. The bitterness of the hop is used to balance the sweetness of the malt, and the essential oils add a flavor/aroma which cannot be achieved by any other plant. The hop plant is a perennial spiraling vine which will grow in almost any climate given enough water and sunlight. It can climb either string or poles and can reach heights of over 25 feet. The flowers (or cones as they are called sometimes) are usually dried before use. - -- Q: What are the compounds which provide the bittering? What about the aroma compounds? A: Read on: Bittering Compounds One of the major contributions hops give to beer is a characteristic bitterness that provides a counterpoint to the rich sweetness provided by the malt. This bitter flavor is extracted from the hops during the boil. It is during this time that virtually insoluble Alpha Acids are isomerized (rearranged without changing their composition) into more soluble and stable iso-Alpha Acids, the main bittering substance in beer. Five different naturally occurring Alpha Acids have been isolated from hops which are: humulone - CH2CH(CH3)CH2 cohumulone - CH(CH3)2 adhumulone - CH(CH3)CH2CH3 prehumulone - CH2CH2CH(CH3)2 posthumulone - CH2CH3 Although isomerized Alpha Acids are the biggest contributers, hops contain Beta Acids which also add bitterness to beer. The Beta Acids are similar to Alpha Acids both in structure and abundance. In contrast to Alpha Acids, it is not isomerized Beta Acids that add bitterness, is the oxidation products of the Beta Acids that make their presence felt. Both the Alpha and Beta Acids are very susceptible to oxidation, especially at temperatures above freezing. Losses of Alpha Acids of up to 60% are not uncommon when hops are packaged and stored poorly. Once Alpha Acids have been oxidized they can no longer be isomerized into iso-Alpha Acid, thus decreasing the hop's bittering potential. For this reason, the "storageability" of each hop variety is often provided, along with the Alpha and Beta Acid levels, by the hop broker. This parameter is usually given as a percentage of the Alpha Acids present after 6 months at 20C. Some good storage hops (usually high Alpha Acid) lose only 15-20% of their Alpha Acids: Cluster, and Galena are among the best. Most high quality aroma hops lose anywhere from 35-65% of their bitter acids unless anaerobic conditions and cold storage (<0c) are provided. This is why it is imperative for brewers to buy the freshest hops available and store them in the freezer, properly packaged. Essential Oils Hops bring a lot more to beer than bitterness. The volatile oil, usually 0.5 - 3.0% (vol/wt) of hop cone, is an important part of many types of beer. Brewers seeking to maximize hop flavor and aroma generally make late kettle additions (0-15 min. before cooling) with high quality "aroma" hops. Dry hopping, i.e. the addition of hops to the secondary fermenter or serving tank, is another way to add hop character to a beer although the aroma components retained by this method differ from those obtained in late kettle additions. The maximum oil utilization is about 10 - 15% which decreases with increased boiling time. The essential oils are what give hops their unique aroma; each variety has it's own distinct profile. The smell of hops freshly crushed in your hand is quite often different than that in a finished beer. This is due to the fact that the major components in hop oil, beta-pinene, myrcene, beta-caryophylene, farnesene and alpha-humulene, are not usually found in beer. However, fermentation and the oxidation products of these compounds, especially humulene epoxides and diepoxides are considered contributors to "hoppy" flavors and aroma. The exception here is with dry-hopping, where some of the hop oil components do survive into the beer intact. Researchers have not been able to duplicate the complexities of hoppy character by adding pure chemicals in any proportion or combination. Consensus is that there is a synergistic blend of several compounds, some of which may have not yet been discovered. Hop researchers, using capillary gas chromatography, have detected and identified more than 250 essential oil components in hops. Twenty two of these have been pinpointed as being good indicators of hoppiness potential. They are subdivided into 3 groups, humulene and caryophyllene oxidative products, floral/estery compounds, and citrus/piney compounds, as listed below: Oxidation Products: caryolan-1-ol caryophyllene oxide humulene diepoxide a humulene diepoxide b humulene diepoxide c humulene epoxide I humulene epoxide II humulene epoxide III humulenol II humulol Floral/Estery Compounds: geraniol geranyl acetate geranyl isobutyrate linalool Citrus/Piney Compounds: delta-cadinene gamma-cadinene citral limonene limonene-10-ol alpha-muurolene nerol beta-selenene - -- End of part 1/5 Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 11:55:20 MDT From: Nick_Nikols at Novell.COM (Nick Nikols) Subject: Re: Liquid male extract >>This formula uses 1.042 for a pound of >>DME (dry malt extract) in a gallon of water, about 1.034 for >>LME (liquid male extract), and about 1.029 for speciality grains. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >Yuck! I wouldn't put that stuff in my beer! >Geoff I guess this must be from a recipe for Smegmabrau. Nick Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 12:17:02 PST From: Bob W Surratt <Bob_W_Surratt at ccm.hf.intel.com> Subject: Watney's Red Barrel Clone Text item: Text_1 Does anyone have a recipe that they feel comes close to matching Watney's Red Barrel?? Please E-Mail any to me. Thanks! Bob Surratt Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1993 13:13:00 -0600 (MDT) From: COYOTE <SLK6P at cc.usu.edu> Subject: Cider/Grain Storg/Sick Beer/NORM!/Sig.lines ***************** meade at readmore.com asked about: Cider Sorbate/Sulphate * Potassium Sorbate is a "stabilizer" It will not STOP an active ferment but will inhibit initiation of growth. Both yeast and bacteria. You Don't want cider with sorbate. Find an orchard and get the fresh pressed- unfiltered stuff. Much worth it! * Sulfating cider- hell why not! You DON'T want to BOIL it! I've done it. Personally I prefere CYSER to CIDER> Add honey. Makes MORE alcohol, and adds a sweeter complexity. Straight cider tends to become rather dry. Cinnamon is a nice addition too. ****************** garti at mrg.xyplex.com (Mark Garti) Subject: grain storage >what are people using to store their grain in? how long, under good conditions, will the grain be fresh? besides rats, are there any problems associated with buying and keeping 50 lbs of grain? * I like metals cans with tight fitting lids. You can line them with a plastic bag to close down tighter as grain is used. IAMS pet food commonly has gifts of cans which will hold about 30# of grain. You may find old square metal flour cans. They fit better on shelves, and hold- 20#. Smaller cans are useful for dark and specialty grains. Check your local surplus store. Watch out for anything- wet, dirty, smelly, or which stored chemicals! Plastic buckets would work fine too. Grain will store well under room temp and cooler UNGROUND for long periods of time. After grinding grain loses some of its potential. The big enemy- besides rates, in my case... MICE!- is MOISTURE. You want to be sure to keep it dry. Mold will do bad things to grain. ************************ >First, what kind of critters can invade a bad batch? What is the worst illness that you have heard of from drinking 'bad beer'? * Besides the normal nausea from drinking too much GOOD BEER!... there are multitudes of wild yeast and bacteria which can invade and creat off FLAVORS. But as for getting sick...the only story I heard of was when toot ended up with a sour stomach after drinking the sediment from many bottles of spiced beer (clove, cinammon...etc) and got sick from the excess spice bits reeking havoc in his tumtum. Relax...Don't fret...Be cautious...but not 'noid! :) Then have a brew. *********************** To Norm Pyle- working on the HOPS faq: * Have you contacted Steiner's at all? I wrote for a catalog and price list and was sent a nice ~200pg HARDCOVER booklet on hops- varieties- growth- dristribution...etc. Kinda nice! and FREE! ok...it's actually 80 pages, with a spanish and german translation! I believe they generally cater to BREWERIES not just brewers (like us) I don't have the address handy- but e-mail me if you want it. I've tried emailing you- but I get bounced. I hate getting bounced! *********************** About the sig. line re: Orgasms and baseball. I guess some folks are a little sensitive. Personally I get a chuckle everytime I see it. I don't think sig.lines should be censored- just kept BRIEF! Maybe a disclaimer at the beginning- noting parental discresion and what not! Here's to Screamimg and Squirming! ******************************************************************** John (The Coyote) Wyllie SLK6P at cc.usu.edu *********************** Aaaaaaack! BtC ************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1993 15:21:00 +0000 From: "Rick (R.) Cavasin" <cav at bnr.ca> Subject: re:Brewing with nuts Dave Lame gives an interesting description of the use of hazel nuts in a mead: One caution Dave. You have assumed that people who lived over a thousand years ago did not do something because you think it would be impractical, and then conclude that the only shred of evidence you have (of what they did) is wrong based on your one experiment, when you admit that it yielded mixed results. Perhaps they did collect immature hazel nuts and press the juice from them (and had some use for the leftover nuts). Perhaps the juice of the immature hazel nut produces a superior mead. Perhaps the juice from immature hazel nuts is water soluble. Maybe your source on the use of hazel nuts in 8th century Irish mead making is wrong and they never used nuts at all. Admittedly, it would not be practical for most people to try using immature hazel nuts, but you shouldn't conclude that the oil produced by pouring boiling must on mature hazel nuts is the 'real' hazel milk. If your luck is anything like mine, somewhere down the road a source for immature hazel nuts will mysteriously appear. ;) Good for you for going out and actually trying the experiment! Cheers, Rick C. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 14:44:49 EDT From: lyons%adc3 at swlvx2.msd.ray.com Subject: Apparent attenuation ... function of yeast & malt. Glenn Anderson in HBD 1254 askes about apparent attenuation numbers for various yeasts. I have had widely different apparent attenuations from my all grain batches, most likely due to variations in the mash temperatures from batch-to-batch. My records show apparent attenuations ranging from 52% to 78% using the same yeast (Whitbread dry ale yeast). I have had very consistent apparent attenuations over several batches with the same DME & same yeast. However, I get completely different apparent attenuations between different brands of DME (AA of Laaglander <> AA of M&F) with the same yeast. In my latest batches I have been using Wyeast 1338 (European) liquid yeast and have gotten apparent attenuations of 75% with M&F based recipes, and 56% with Laaglander based recipes. I guess my point is that although the yeast is important in determining the apparent attenuation, the percentage of fermentable sugars in the malt also plays a significant roll in determining the final gravity. Question: When companys give apparent attenuation numbers for there yeasts, is there a standard malt (or recipe) that they are using? Chris Lyons Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1993 14:01:21 -0600 (MDT) From: COYOTE <SLK6P at cc.usu.edu> Subject: Good Head/Spruce BOIL/junk ****************************** Tom said: >The problems that a lot of people have with carbonation and head retention (including myself) may be related to infections that don't completely foul the beer, but just add off flavors. ...snip... But why does an infection kill head? And what can I do with this 5 gallon batch of infected brew? * Good Beer Head (as compared to...*slap*) requires the presense of proteins to form stable bubbles. Proteins surround CO2 bubbles and establish a network structure stabilizing the bubble. Can you believe that researchers are funded to study this kind of thing! Maybe I should apply for a grant...Splitting the Beer Atom! Bacteria and yeasts may choose to chew on the necessary proteins for food, or building materials and deplete the beer. Some of these same protein eaters may also produce products which result in what we consider "off flavors" or aromas. But to them...it's just what they do. Don't blame them- JUST ELIMINATE THEM! Call the TERMINATOR! ****************************** Chris Cook praises boiling essence for SPRUCE BEER >John mentioned using 6 oz of essence. I don't know the brand, but that sounds like a whole lot of essence. *I was thinking about that one. I think it was a 2 oz bottle. Good for up to 6 gallons??? Maybe I should have boiled it, and made a darker beer. Hmmm. Still don't think i want to try it again. Maybe I'll experiment with smoke instead! (RauchBier!) BTW: Not to slam a style..Not me! Give it a try if it tickles your pickle. I'm DEFINITELY not Rheinheitsgebot myself! Anyone else ever tried Cajun Spice in a brew? Interesting. ***************************** Jeremy Bergsman says: >(can you say salivary amylase?), the fungal one is probably the cheapest. * You're not gonna start telling us to chew our grains in our mouths and then spit into our boiling kettles are you! Starts sounding like some wierd indian corn concoction! Hmmmmmm. So what if we add some fungus to our mashes- MushroomBrew? ***************************** Oh Nuts...Yeah. Oil. Kills head. Maybe you should spit in it. That's coooool. Huh huh, heh, heh. ***************************** Oh...and BTW Norm mentioned his Barley wine was down to an OG of... Wait a minute here. OG= Original Gravity. How can it be down to... FG= Final Gravity, SG= Specific Gravity. Let's be nittypicky! :) ******************************************************************** ~~~~~~~~~~~~ John (The Coyote) Wyllie SLK6P at cc.usu.edu ~~~~~~~~~~~~ ********************** Aaaaaaaack. BtC ************************* Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 15:04:00 CST From: Montgomery_John at lanmail.ncsc.navy.mil Subject: IPA request I posted this question before, but got no response, so I thought I'd give it one more try before abandoning the idea altogether. I'm am currently on a quest for the Holy Grail of India Pale Ales and am trying to replicate Hale's IPA. If anyone has any recipe suggestions for recreating this brew, could you please pass them along? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. john m. montgomery_john at lanmail.ncsc.navy.mil Return to table of contents
Date: 25 Oct 1993 14:04:08 U From: "Palmer.John" <palmer#d#john at ssdgwy.mdc.com> Subject: Fermenting Process question Hello Group, I have made a spiced Christmas Ale (de la Phleming), and I used Wyeast European Ale. I wanted a malty roundness to support the spices. I would like your perceptions as to the quality of my fermentation. I may have rushed things a bit. I squoze the packet early Saturday, by evening it was plump and I added it to a high gravity starter (I haven't measured it, but from the remainder's color, I'd guess 1.06) Next morning It was foaming with a half inch of foam in the pint jar. I made my beer and pitched that afternoon. I had good activity afterwork the following day (monday). It had a sluggish fermentation overall judging from the meager three quarters inch krausen. Most visible churning had ceased by Thursday and the krausen is now settling back in. Other particulars: aeration: Liberal splashing of the bathtub cooled wort into the 7gal carboy. And some shaking. a little. OG: about 1.06 (measured warm and adjusted) FG: as of sunday 1.03 Temp: Air Stat'd at 69F Time Elapsed: 7 days as of 5pm Monday Oct.25 I am using the Brewcap system but am having a difficult time getting my sediment out of that teeny 1/4 inch hose. (hop pellet fine particles) I need to do that tonight. I am thinking of going ahead and racking it... I can wait a while though, probably. Does my fermentation seem too feeble to you? This is my first use of Liquid Yeast, the dry Red Star always had a furious krausen... The three point drop in gravity looks good, but is that the whole story? I appreciate any and all comments. -John Palmer ** I think sex is more fun than basketball, too.** ** Fishing can be a tossup, though. ** ***(Depends on which is biting better)*** Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 17:07:15 EDT From: Todd Anderson <TAND1698 at URIACC.URI.EDU> Subject: New England Brew Pubs Long time reader, first time writer. I would greatly appreciate any info. on brewpubs in the Southern New England area. I've been to a couple in Boston, so I'm more interested in Rhode Island, Connecticut and Cape Cod areas. My E-Mail address is TAND1698 at URIACC.URI.EDU. Thanks a Bunch! Todd Anderson University of Rhode Island Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 16:23:36 -0500 From: bliss at pixel.convex.com (Brian Bliss) Subject: Re: layered beer Fritz Keinert <keinert at iastate.edu> writes: >While we are on the subject of beer drinks: does anybody know how to >get two differently colored beers (like Guinness and Bass Ale) in two >layers in the same glass? We tried it once during a party, with no >success. You must use draft guinness, either from a tap or from the can. Pour a layer of anything else on bottom, then pour the guinness slowly & carefully over a spoon held against the wall of the glass. Does it work if you try to put guinness on the bottom? I'd go out and buy some, but they don't sell the cans in TX. bb Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 17:52:16 EDT From: mwithers at hannibal.ATL.GE.COM (W. Mark Witherspoon) Subject: Update on "RCA" Ok, folks my Rusty Cream Ale came out. The verdict... It ain't cream ale. It looks and tastes like a Killians Red clone. To refresh everyone's memory here is the recipe.. 2 lbs of pale malt 1 lbs of flaked corn 1 lbs of crystal malt (about 50 l) 4 lbs of Alexanders Pale Malt 1 oz of Tettanger Hops (3.8%) (boil at 45 min) 1 oz of Liberty Hops (3.2%) (half and half boil/finish) Whitbread ale yeast OG = 1.052 FG = 1.012 It appears that the Whitbread yeast that I used was really atteuntuave. The % alcohol/vol is around 6.5. The preliminary tastes puts it nice, smooth, a bit thin (its' been ageing about 2 weeks). It should have some character in about 1-2 months. Thanks for the reply's about it. Mark Witherspoon ************************************************************************ |\ /| W. Mark Witherspoon | The opions expressed are of my | |\ /| mwithers at hannibal.ATL.GE.COM | own not of my employer... | | ATL (609)866-6672 | This sig will self destruct...* Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 19:22:51 EDT From: sean v. taylor <sean at chemres.tn.cornell.edu> Subject: Chapel Hill and Richmond Pubs/Brewpubs Greetings: I am going to be in the Chapel Hill, NC area for a few days in November and I was wondering if anyone out there in the HBD zone had any advice on good pubs/brewpubs anywhere in the area. On my way down, I am stopping in Richmond for an evening and I was wondering the same thing (pubs/brewpubs?) Any responses would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Sean Taylor Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 11:57 CDT From: korz at iepubj.att.com Subject: Sheaf & Vine Brewing Supply Please excuse the use of bandwidth, but due to the proliferation of my catalog via electronic means, I have no way of knowing who of you out there were planning to place a Sheaf & Vine order by mail. It is with deep regret that I must report Sheaf & Vine Brewing Supply will be suspending mailorder operations until further notice. As many of you know, I have been running Sheaf & Vine Brewing Supply (retail store AND mailorder) singlehandedly, evenings and weekends after putting in 40+ hours per week at AT&T Bell Laboratories. The reasons for suspending the mailorder side are: 1. health -- often I would be up till 3am packaging hops & grains and this has really taken a toll on me, 2. no time to spend with my wife -- we just celebrated our 1 year anniversary (even on our anniversary day, I met with a potential customer) and, most importantly, 3. decrease in quality -- the heavy load of mailorder requests has increased turnaround time to unacceptable levels... if I cannot provide the best possible service to my customers, I would rather suspend operations rather than compromise quality. If and when I make Sheaf & Vine a full-time business or if retail operations require the hiring of an employee, I will resume mailorder operations. Please accept my appologies. Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 13:41 CDT From: korz at iepubj.att.com Subject: Filtering/PitchTiming/GrainStorage/Critters/WyeastMunich/ChimayYeast/HeadKillingInfection Jim writes: Okay - I give up. How *do* I filter out those bits of gunk, fruit, etc from the primary (or secondary) fermenter when ready to bottle, without oxidizing? To say nothing of trying to filter out the hops, etc *before* going _into_ the primary.... Once the wort is cool you can splash all you want -- this is the time to filter out bits of hops and stuff you added during the boil. I use hop bags and thus get very little stuff to filter out. After primary fermentation, one way to filter the beer is to put a mesh over the end of the siphon hose. You can increase your filter surface area by first putting a sanitized copper scrubbie (like a Choreboy) over the end of the siphon tube and then covering that with something like a hop bag (thanks to Al Andrews and/or Kinney Baughman for this tip). ********************** Domenick writes: >It has been my experience that Wyeast is ready to pitch after about 24 >hrs, sometimes less. By the time the package is really puffed the >yeast has gone way past high kraesen (sic?), and flocculated. It's had a >good meal and dozed off. Pitching this means not only are you under >pitching, but you are under pitching sleeping yeast that will need some >time to wake up. By using a starter you can pitch more cells and perhaps >better time your pitch to occur just before high kraesen. So I think that >a 48 hr lag time (Sat-Mon) is not unexpected. Actually, the ideal time to pitch is shortly AFTER high kraeusen. This is important enough to repost (something from Mike Sharp): >What I refered to here as the 'stationary phase' is really >the very beginning of the dormant phase. In other words, >let you starter ferment out _then_ pitch it. Don't let >it sit too long or you'll have other problems. > >As far as the argument that vigorously multiplying yeast will >start your wort faster, the yeast have a limited supply of glycogen >and it gets depleated through culture growth (multiplication). >If you then pitch this starter with an already depleated glycogen >level into your wort then you'll have more of a lag since the >cells won't be able to multiply as quickly (due to the low glycogen levels) >[think of glycogen as the fuel that drives the cell] By letting >the cells reach stationary phase they have stopped multiplying, >begun storing up glycogen again, and just generally getting ready >to go dormant. > >At least thats the Reader's Digest version of what I go out of: >> Impact of Yeast Handling Procedures on Beer Flavor During Fermentation >> Pickerell et. all. >> American Society of Brewing Chemists (ASBC) Journal, Vol 49:2, 1991, pp.87-92 **************************** Mark writes: >what are people using to store their grain in? I store it in white, 5-gallon, HDPE pails with gasketted lids (they are a bear to remove, even with the lid-lifter tool!) at about 60-65 degrees. You can get between 25 and 30 pounds of grain in a 5-gallon bucket. What else is nice, is that the pails stack much better than 110lb sacks! *************************** Doug writes: >First, what kind of critters can invade a bad batch? Lots, but none that are dangerous. lactobacillus and pediococcus are the most common, but you can also have acetobacter, molds and sherry flor. >What is the worst illness that you have heard of from drinking 'bad beer'? The worst thing that can happen is you'll like it and develop 'bad taste.' But seriously, a hangover is about the worst thing you can get. >Second, what is a good McEwan's taste alike? I have had this beer and like it's >style. I assume you mean McEwan's Scotch Ale. There are very few beers that I know of that are similar to McEwan's Scotch Ale and are imported into the US. Note that if you like MSA, you may also like a beer which is perhaps the lager counterpart to MSA, namely Doppelbock. Salvator Doppelbock is a bit less sweet but in a similar vein. Celebrator by Ayinger is another good one you might try. *************************** Phil writes: >Has anybody had experience with this yeast (Wyeast Munich Lager #2308)? I don't know what they mean about the instability, but I can report a very intense "home perm solution" nose for the first 4 months of lagering. I fermented at 50F and then later at 45F. After 4 months, the off aroma disappeared and the beer did well in a few competitions. **************************** Jamie writes: How does the Wyeast Belgian compare to cultured Chimay yeast? Which am I better off using? Judging from the flavor of two beers that I recently tasted, one brewed with Wyeast Belgian and the other brewed with cultured Chimay dregs, I would say that the yeasts are identical. There are trade-offs with each: going the Wyeast route is more expensive but the Chimay dreg route is a bit riskier, since you don't know how much the bottle was abused on its way to you from Belgium. ***************************** Tom writes: >But why does an infection kill head? Because part of what gives good head retention are dextrins and other more-complex carbohydrates which yeast can't eat, but some bacteria can. The bacteria cut up the large carbohydrates (and perhaps even proteins - -- but this is just a guess, although small proteins are very important to head retention) into pieces that are edible by yeast (which is why infected beers often turn into gushers -- overcarbonation from the yeast eating stuff you wanted unfermented). Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1993 22:03:14 -0400 (EDT) From: FILTER at xavier.xu.edu Subject: Hemlock Beer There seems to be some confusion among some people as to the difference between Eastern Hemlock (an evergreen found in the far north down to Tennessee along the mountains,) and the Hemlock(& water Hemlock) 'weedy-type' plant. The two are not at all related, and I'm not at all sure how they gained the same name. The evergreen tree is one of our most beautiful coniferous trees. It has small perfectly shaped cones. According to 'Euell Gibbon's Wild Foods Guide,' you may take a handful of the needles brew a delicious tea. It's good, I've tried it over the camp fire. 'Peterson's Wild Food Guide' agrees and goes on to state that a highly nutritious flour can be made from the inner bark. 'Peterson's North American Tree & Shrub Guide' states that both Native Americans & early frontiersmen brewed tea from the Eastern Hemlock. Unfortunately, the future of this tree is uncertain because of some ugly, little insects we've imported into this continent. The weedy-type plants, Hemlock & Water Hemlock, are easily distinguished from the evergreen. They've got leaves, as opposed to needles. They may only grow a yard or two tall. And most of all, they look like Wild Carrot & Queen Anne's Lace. In fact, I think they're related to the latter. Both Hemlock & Water Hemlock are highly poisenous, requiring only a handful of the leaves to do in the average person. Rest assured, if you can tell the difference between an evergreen and a weed, you can use the Hemlock in your brewing(like the spruce.) I've never made beer from either. Good Luck, Jeep (Filter at XU.XAVIER.EDU) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 00:32:00 BST From: r.mcglew3 at genie.geis.com Subject: Nut Beer I judged specialty beers last year at the HOPS-BOPS HB contest held at the Sam Adams Brewpub. We gave a nut beer 1st place, it really was a good beer. When we first tasted it we were not all that impressed, but after some re-calibration of our palates, we gave it a second try and voila. I can't remember the recipe, I believe it was either walnut or pecan, and I seem to remember that is was a brown ale. If anyone is connected with HOPS, maybe you can look back in your records. For anyone that enters a specialty beer in a contest, be aware that the judges in that category are subjected to a lot of widely varying beers and have a hard time picking the right one, the judges' taste preferences really are the major factor. So, if it doesn't do well, let your own taste buds determine if you should do it again. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1993 23:45:06 -0400 (EDT) From: /R=HERLVX/R=AM/U=KLIGERMAN/FFN=KLIGERMAN/ at mr.rtpnc.epa.gov Subject: homebrew club gone stale! oxidation? As a member, former vice president and president, and treasurer of our local homebrew club over the past half dozen years or so, I have been disappointed in the direction the club has gone presently. It has turned into more of a socializing and drinking club. Not to be too negative, I would like to address this problem in our club newsletter. I'm thus asking for input from people on the HBD to share with me if they have had similar experiences in their clubs, and possible ways to remedy this situation. In particular, I would hope some could share with me some of the activities that they partake of at their club meetings besides drinking homebrew. Specifically, where are meeting held, do they rotate from house to house or restaurant to restaurant? Are experiments done on a club basis? Etc. Since this may be of general interest to other clubs, a reply by digest would seem appropriate. However, responses can be e-mailed to : kligerman%am%herlvx at mr.rtpnc.epa.gov Thanks, Andy Kligerman Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1993 23:54:46 -0500 (CDT) From: WEIX at swmed.edu Subject: Info on Yeast Labs Liq. Wanted Hi, I've been lurking (and drinking and brewing and then lurking some more) since composing the Yeast FAQ. I could find no data on the attenuation of many of the strains listed in the FAQ. If any one has data/impressions, I would be glad to amend the FAQ. On a totally unrelated note: What are peoples impressions of the EKU Hefe-Weissen (Weizen, Weixen?). I thought it was great, just my conception of what a Bavarian Wei*en should taste like, but then it was my first chance to try the style. (Goes great with pork roast, red cabbage, and hot German potato salad--just like Grossmutti used to make!). I think my confusion over the spelling would be resolved if I knew what Wei*en stood for. Weiss == white or Weiz == wheat. Anyone? Anyone? Thanks, Patrick <weix at swmed.edu> Hopfz und Maltz, Gott erhalts! Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 00:55:50 -0600 (CST) From: SWEENERB at msuvx2.memst.edu Subject: clarifying in a keg I am considering skipping the use of a secondary and siphoning straight into a Cornelius keg as an experiment. In the past I have used both Polychar and gelatin as clarifiers, but recently gelatin has been the method of choice. I like gelatin because it seems to drop out of solution in only a couple of days and I don't like to wait for beer too long. My current batch is a wheat beer which has been in the primary for about a week with no activity for the last day or so. Have any of you kegger types tried to add clarifiers directly into the keg and what kind of results/problems can I expect, particularly with respect to the use of gelatin? Thanks in advance folks. As always, Bob Sweeney Memphis State University sweenerb at memst.msuvx1.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 13:43:27 PDT From: "Victor Grigorieff" <VGRIGORI at us.oracle.com> Subject: Thoughts on a recipe for standard American beers... Howdy, I was wondering what kind of a recipe one should use to make a beer like Bud or Henry's Reserve Ale. I am guessing that the standard American mass-produced beer is using a bunch of corn sugar instead of malt. I usually make beers with 7-10 pounds of malt (per 5-gallon batch), sometimes substituting honey. Does anyone have ideas on substituting corn sugar? Am I on the right track, or are these beers made with extremely light malt instead. Any thoughts? Thanks, - Vic ________________________________________________________________________ Victor Grigorieff vgrigori at oracle.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1993 07:50:43 -0500 (CDT) From: dspalme at mke.ab.com (Diane Palme x2617) Subject: Faking orgasms and white knights Hello all. I would just like to say "thank you" for those of you out there in HBD-land who have a sense of humor and enjoy a bit of levity in your morning e-mail. It is refreshing to know that a woman is allowed to have a sense of humor, and even more so, <gasp!> to express it. For all of you who sent me personal mail, as well as those of you who posted, thanks. I'll try to come up with an even better .sig. For the person who was offended, well, um, pffffftt! ;-P :) :-I :-D Returning you to your regularly-scheduled HBD ... D. - -- Diane Palme, EIT Department Engineer, Central Inspection Allen-Bradley Company (414) 382-2617 dspalme at mke.ab.com "In the beginning, it was the Plan." You think A-B would be smart enough to accept my opinions as their own? I mean really! <sheesh> Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 08:36:30 -0400 From: "Phillip Seitz" <p00644 at psilink.com> Subject: Beer hunting in Belgium: Part 6 (Aged beer tasting) Beer Hunting in Belgium: Part 6 of 7 Aged beer tasting (by Phil Seitz) On the last day of our trip we were able to arrange a tasting of aged beers. While we did request certain types of beer to sample, the final selection was made by our host. We cannot vouch for the actual age of the beers (the bottles were not labeled with dates), but can certify that they were certainly old, and looked it--covered with dust, well sedimented, corks all moldy, etc. As it turned out, the effects of ageing were a bit unpredictable anyway, so what follows here should probably be taken as a range of possibilities rather than a strict prediction of the effects of time on unusual beers. Beer #1: 15 year-old gueuze from the Wets brewery (St. Genesius- Rhode); 75 cl corked bottle This beer was completely flat, a medium caramel brown in color with a tart, rich, cherry-like aroma. It was surprisingly sweet, and at first taste we were convinced we'd been given a kriek. Our host explained to us that in some cases gueuze can get sweeter with age (!), and that, no, there were no cherries in this beer. The initial flavor was quite full, tart, slightly caramel- and cherry-like, a bit like Rodenbach Grand Cru or Alexander but with more of the lambic funkiness, less acidity, and no oakiness. The consensus at the table was that the beer had reached a state of maturity, or peak flavor and character. As with older wines, exposure to oxygen produced some interesting effects. We drank our glasses over a 20-30 minute period, and different tastes and flavors would come forward and then retreat again. Most notable was a banana-like flavor that only lasted a few minutes. The Wets brewery no longer exists. A line of gueuze products is still available under that name, but our host said these are made by the Brasserie Girardin. Later comparison showed that modern Wets and Girardin bottles are identical. Beer #2: 10-year-old Liefman's Goudenband; 37.5 cl corked bottle Here the effects of exposure to oxygen were very dramatic. Following the initial pour the beer was well carbonated, quite similar to the current Goudenband in body, but slightly darker and with brown tints in the head. Then there was the flavor and aroma. As beer snobs we had a hard time coming to agreement--did it taste more like a washcloth that's been laying around wet for three days, or just a really bad pair of smelly socks? However, within ten minutes all the washcloth smell and flavor had vented off, leaving the beer with a rather convincing flavor of cabernet sauvignon. Slightly fruity, slightly tannic, very wine-like. Fortunately it stayed that way, at least until we were finished with our glasses. A remarkable performance. Beer #3: 20-year-old gueuze from the Wets brewery; 75 cl corked bottle Our host introduced this beer by saying it was the same style and type as the one we'd previously had, though obviously the year of production (and therefore some of the microflora used in the brewing) were different. In fact, the two beers could hardly have been more different. This beer was also flat, with the color of dark milk chocolate. The aroma and flavor were very pronounced, and featured bitter chocolate, coffee, and strong caramel. A lot like drinking strong coffee flavored with cocoa powder and butterscotch, rather bitter but not overpoweringly so. In fact, a lot like Mexican mole sauce. Our surprise was evident, and we asked how two ostensibly similar beers could turn out so differently. The reply was that, well, after ten years the development gets unpredictable. I can't say I'd drink a beer like this very often, but it was not objectionable and certainly an interesting experience. Beer #4: 25-year-old Orval; 33 cl capped bottle Unfortunately no aged Trappist beers like Westvleteren Abt or Chimay Bleu were available, but a stock of Orval had been retained. At the time this bottle was produced Orval as 5.6% ABV; now it's 5.2%. Despite the crown cap it had retained plenty of carbonation. In fact, it tasted a lot like Orval, particularly with regard to the "hair tonic" yeast flavors. If anything, it had just softened a little, possibly due to the decline in hop flavors. Any reasonably experienced beer drinker could have pegged this as Orval blindfolded. Was it really bottled in 1968? I had to wonder. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 09:56:12 EDT From: mferts at taec.com (Mike Fertsch) Subject: RE: Steam injection Ed Westemeier proposed a method of Steam injection: >I recently watched a fellow homebrewer use what I consider an extremely >clever gadget. He had an ordinary household pressure cooker that he >modified to run a steam line out through a ball valve. Be VERY careful modifying pressure cookers. High pressure steam can be dangerous! The last thing you need is a hose rupturing, burning yourself. >By simply injecting live, low pressure steam into the bottom of his >picnic cooler mash tun while stirring the mash, he was able to raise >the temperature to the desired point very quickly. >Has anyone experimented with this type of setup? I once had the privledge of brewing a batch of beer at the Vermont Pub and Brewery. The recipe called for a step mash. The VP&B mashtun is equipped with hot water valves feeding the top, and steam valves feeding the bottom. A combination of hot water and steam heated the grain for the high temperature step. They force steam into the bottom of the kettle - this helps heat the grain to the desired temperature. One problem was mixing the grain. As would be expected, the bottom of the grain bed gets very hot, and needs to be stirred up. We stirred like mad (not easy with 1000 pounds of grain!), and also injected CO2 into the kettle from the bottom. The CO2 gave the grain a little more mechanical motion and assisted mixing the mash. (Raising the temperature was NOT fun - imagine standing on a ladder with a big oar, stirring the mash. As the same time, steam and CO2 are comming off the grain. If the stirring doesn't fatigue you, the steam doesn't burn you, or the CO2 asphixiate you, you are destined to fall off the ladder and break a leg!). Everything worked out well - the beer was fantastic! (no one got hurt, but don't call OSHA!) ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mike Fertsch Work: 617-224-7298 mferts at taec.com Toshiba, Wakefield MA Home: 617-932-0567 mikef at hopfen.rsi.com Home, Woburn MA Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1257, 10/28/93