FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Brewing Travels/ Update-Coyote Brews/ (COYOTE)
  Capping and carbonation (Richard Nantel)
  Priming bitters (Jim Grady)
  Filtration (w. diatomaceous earth) & Mashing FAQ ("Taylor Standlee")
  sending homebrew ("Jay Tarvin\"")
  Wort Chiller (Bob Eddy)
  not-home brew/ATF/dry yeast (Kirk Anderson)
  SNPA recipe collection (mclagan)
  UV Radiation for Bottles (dmorey)
  Old Crusty / Shelf Life / Errata (npyle)
  New Wyeast Profiles... (Mark Stewart)
  Mill Adjustment (Jack Schmidling)
  2 Qs from a newbie (nblackmo)
  HWBTA Style Guidelines, 2 of 3 (Rick Garvin (703-761-6630))
  Brewery tours in London? (Phil Bardsley                       )
  Thermometer/Pasty Lagers/Eye Allergy (KRWEISEL)
  kegging (Rich Ryan)
  re: Mead and Ale Yeast (Dick Dunn)


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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Jan 1994 14:08:28 -0600 (MDT)
From: COYOTE <SLK6P at cc.usu.edu>
Subject: Brewing Travels/ Update-Coyote Brews/

Post Holiday greeting to you brewers all.

Recently returned from adventures in the southern parts of Calif.

had a chance to pop in at a couple micros along the way.

Checked out the Crown Brewery in Pasadena.
They had the same 3 beers as two years ago:
    Mt Wilson Wheat.  nice, simple. Not real exciting.
    Amber.  Malty, hoppy, copper colored. Tasty.
    Stout.  Ok stout.  Not very heavy. Almost porter-like.

also went to HOPS on new years eve, at University Town Center in San Diego.

Excellent restaurant. They make some ok beers too.  They all seemed
kinda light- maybe over filtered. It is kindof a yuppy place. 
The food was excellent- and reasonable priced, considering what you 
might expect.  They had a very large variety. 
*    A pilsner. Very light lager. But where is the saaaaaz nose!?
*    ESB.  Was pretty good. But too light, not enough hops
    ( I guess I was kinda biased, I had a Fullers earlier that day)
*    Scottish Ale.  Needed more heavy malt character. Didn't seem strong
    enough for a scotch. Struck me as being more like the Grants scottish 
    ale, than say a McEwans.
*   Hefe Weizen.  Quite sour. Unfiltered, and looked it. Lemon and all.
    Seemed pretty true to style.  Wasn't my favorite though.
*   Rasberry lager.  Nicely done. Pungent rasberry. Had the copper color.
*   Russian Imperial Stout.  THIS was a stout stout. Very roasty flavor.
    A bit sweet for me, but well balanced to the dark flavors.

I also tried their Barleywine.  The waitress was almost apalogetic upon
bringing it, and offered to take it back if I didn't like it. (yeah, in the
back where she could drink it. Seemed like she'd already had a couple! :)
It was...fruity, malty, chewy, STRONG (10%).  Just what I'd expect. Yum it
said to me.  Came home to taste my very own Barneywine, and found a similar
reaction...to my pleasure.

I didn't get a chance to chat with the brewer. He was "celebrating" the new
year pretty hard I understand.  Pretty copper/stainless kettles, nice clean
decor. Quite the upscale kind of feel.  I had "blackened swordfish" and it
was very well presented, and delicious, but it had none of that painfully
spicey bite I connect with cajun cooking. Stuck a certain similarity with
the brews.  Geared for an unseasoned clientelle, and not wanting to offend
anyones tastebuds with over strong flavors.

Too bad.  I like being offended!

    Also went by Goat Hill (after a little detour to Light Bulbs Unlimited-
from which I soon will have a blue NEON COYOTE light.  :) Happy B-day...to me.
(from my mate!  She's getting a wave for her special day)

They had an ad on their menu for Rush Limbaugh brunch.  I began to wonder.
A very impressive list of brews from all over, a bit pricey, a bit loud and
"jock-ish" for my tastes. I never was a frat bro type.  Personal bias.

They did have an impressive collection of street signs. 


***
So...back on the home front.   Update of things happening in the 
Cosmic Coyote Brewery.

Pilsner- Urquel!!!   Just bottled after a months lagering.  And twice
dry-hopped with....what else...Saaaaaaaaaaaaz it all!  Yuuuuuum.
It is light, clean, fairly malty, and slightly sweet, but crisp.
And this baby just screams saaaaaaz.  But without being bitter.
Too bad it's a little late for the bay area brewoff. I think it would 
fair well.  (pat on back....smack lips once more)

    10 # Pilsner Malt. (german)
    1 # aromatic munich (belgian)
    1 # 40L Crystal
    .5 # Biscuit (belgian)

BOIL:
    1 oz N. Brewer
    1 oz Saaz
Mid:
    3/4 oz Saaz
Finish:
    3/4 oz saaz.
Dry hopped after primary ferment subsided. Then secondary also. .5 oz/ea.

Bohemian Lager- wyeast. Made 8 gallons of 1.032 ( a bit low)

Fermented at 52 deg F for 1 month.

***
My Blebbing Barneywine has pretty well settled. He's down to 15 sp gr.
and probably wont' drop much more.  He still hasn't cleared enough.
I need to rack him again. Then prep for bottling, and storage.

The second runnings from this mash made Barney's Backside. A malty, 
pretty light brown color. Just kegged last night.  Quite hoppy, but still
a lot of flavor.

I tried an experiment on this brew (for those of you involved in conversations
last year :) .  The third batch I sqeezed out of this was a semi sour
mash.  I still had sparge water in the mash tun, and didn't want to waste it,
so I added a bit more English malt, stirred and let it sit overnight. It had
a long slow continued conversion.  By the following afternoon it had some 
color, and flavor.  Rather tart flavor. Definitely some acid production.
I pulled it off, added some dry extract, molasses, and honey and boiled
with the leftover hops, and a bit more.  Well, it made beer. I was planning
on tossing some cranberries on the 2ndary. Still may do it, but tasted at
racking, it was doing 0k.  Still had some of the complex malty flavor of 
the Barneywine, and his backside.  Seemed like a succesful experiment.
Not that I'm going to do this all the time. But hey- I'll try anything twice!
***

Soon it will be time to cask the IPA.  I brewed it last monday, and it's been
happily/hoppily blebbing away since.  I'm hoping I can get it through 2ndary
and conditioned before the 22nd to celebrate and inebriate my birthday
celebration.  Good excuse to kill the entirety in one night!  :)

Celebration IPA:
    10# 2 row pale malt
     2# 2 row vienna malt
    1.5 # 40L crystal
    1.5 # 80L crystal
     1 #  Wheat
Infusion (NOT cold fusion!) mashed.

BOIL: 1 oz Chinook (13 alpha)
Mid:  .5 oz N. Brewer (7.6 a)
Finish: .5 oz N. Brewer
        .5 oz Cascade (homegrown)

Burton ale yeast, then bohemian lager.

OG: 1.048 for 7 gallons.  Fermented primary at 70, 2ndary to 55.

I plan to fine the 2ndary, then rack/prime in cask. Low pressure!

Should be fun!
***
Finally: I collected a number of nice brews- not commonly found in my
"great" state.  The more exotic included Buffalo Bill's Pumpkin beer.
(This one was spiced with pumpkin spices wasn't it? That couldn't just
be hops!)  and Samual Smiths Holiday Ale.  Yum.

A suggestion: If anyone is in the southern Calif. area definitely go find
a Trader Joes.  Nice selection. Incredible prices!  $3 for imported german
beers, australian, mexican...  Ok. So some of them aren't the top of the line
models, but truly some tasty brews at very reasonable prices.  Their wines
are nice too. Many under $3 a bottle, for decent wines!  They buy a whole
batch from a winery, and slap their label on it. ANd sell it cheap!

It's a coffee/cheese and crackers kind of store.  And I love it!

No connection, just a well stocked/happy customer.

    Anyway.  Glad to be back to my brew-home. Hoppy brew beer to you all.
***/
        John (The Coyote) Wyllie SLK6P at cc.usu.edu       \***

PS: If anyone has any info on upcoming competitions in the west
I'd be intersted in descriptions/rules etc...   Tanx.

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Date: 07 Jan 94 16:45:32 EST
From: Richard Nantel <72704.3003 at CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Capping and carbonation

Next time I bottle, I intend to follow Miller's suggestion in leaving the 
caps resting on the filled bottles for half an hour before crimping them 
on. The resulting CO2 will fill the top part of the bottle and should 
reduce oxidation. Since some CO2 will escape during this timelag, do I need 
to compensate for this by adding extra priming sugar? 

Richard Nantel
Montreal, Quebec
Canada

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Date: Fri, 7 Jan 94 17:59:49 EST
From: Jim Grady <grady at hpangrt.an.hp.com>
Subject: Priming bitters

I have made 3 pale ales/bitters this past fall and have succeeded in
getting that low carbonation level that is required to really enjoy the
hop flavor as well as get a nice head.  It actually was through an
accident with the first batch and it worked so well, I did it with the
others.  I got a 5 l. minikeg setup and the instructions say to use 1/2
the priming sugar you normally use.  Not wanting to commit the whole
batch to the new toy, I primed with 1/4 c. corn sugar in five gallons
and made up an additionaly solution to add after I filled the keg and
before I filled the bottles.  You guessed it.  I forgot to add it.  The
bottles seemed to take longer to condition than normal (3-4 weeks) but
then they seemed fine.  A rough pour gives a nice head and a very
lightly carbonated beer in the glass.  The final gravities were pretty
low so I don't think it's that I bottled too early (one was bottle 4
weeks after fermentation started!).  All three batches were all-grain
recipes from Terry Foster's book, "Pale Ale."  They were "Yer Avridge
Bitter," "Pride of Milford Bitter," and "Beyond the Pale Pale Ale;"
their final gravities were 1.009, 1.011 & 1.012 respectively.
- --
Jim Grady              |"Immediately after Orville Wright's historic 12 second
grady at hp-mpg.an.hp.com | flight, his luggage could not be located."
                       |                        S. Harris

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Date: Fri, 7 Jan 1994 16:35:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Taylor Standlee" <standlee at humanitas.ucsb.edu>
Subject: Filtration (w. diatomaceous earth) & Mashing FAQ


1)
Recently I visited a brewpub in San Luis Obispo (Calif.) where they filter
their ales through diatomaceous earth.  I asked the kid behind the bar
about this and got the "ya would'n understand, its technical" typical of
people busy behind counters, which then changed to "Actaully,
I don't really understand it I'll have to ask the brewmeister"
after I convinced him I would indeed "undertand".  Unfortunatly, the
brewmeister was not in and I had to get back on the road, so I still don't
understand it.  Does anyone have any information on this type of filter
system; or any other that they use and are satisfied with.  We really want
to start filtering our beers for keging without loosing character.

2)
Is there a Mashing FAQ or other resource discussing variations in mashing
proceedures and their subsequent effects?

Can anyone speak on the relationship of mashing schedule as related
to attenuation of the wort and finished ale or steam beer?

We usually do a single step mash at 154 degrees for English, German and
American ales (2-row/Munich/Vienna ect.); and a 3 step 124 for 30 min.,
145 10 min., 154 45 min. mash for steam beers (using a combination of
2-row and 6-row, ect.) with good consistent results but are anxious to
improve our beers and our understanding of the process.
How should we mash to better regulate the body and sweetness of the beer?

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Date: Fri, 7 Jan 1994 16:59 PST
From: "Jay Tarvin\"" <TARVINJ at axe.humboldt.edu>
Subject: sending homebrew

In his message regarding the clip art to be posted
(no thanks, I have too much fun coming up with
my own art) George Tempel suggests that use of 
the clip art should be reciprocated with bottles
of homebrew... this is a question I thought I knew
the answer to (NO WAY) but is it actually legal 
to send homebrew through the mail?
Is it safe? it seems as though air shipped bottles
could explode.
If it can be done what are the guidelines and
recommendations?

Thanks,
Jay Tarvin

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Date: Fri, 7 Jan 1994 18:28:38 -0800
From: reddy at qualcomm.com (Bob Eddy)
Subject: Wort Chiller

I have been considering various approaches to wort chilling and have come
up with an idea I haven't yet seen discussed on the net.  My idea is to
construct an immersion chiller in reverse.  The conventional immersion
chiller, of course, runs chilled water through a copper coil which has been
immersed in the hot wort until the desired temperature is reached.  My idea
is to reverse the process by immersing the copper coil in an ice bath and
running the hot wort through the coil.  I feel this would yield excellent
heat transfer.

Construction would consist of a bucket (or other container) with entry and
exit ports at the top and bottom of the bucket.  The copper coil would be
placed inside the bucket and connected to the entry/exit ports.  (See
diagram below - a little imagination will help here!)

                       I                   I  
                       I- - - - - - - - - -I
                       I     ice bath      I<---bucket
        Hot wort       I                   I
        from boiler -->I>----------------\ I
                       I /---------------/ I
                       I \----copper-----\ I
                       I /-----coil------/ I    X      Cold wort to
                       I \---------------->I>---I----> primary fermenter
                       I                   I  valve
                       I___________________I

To use the device, the bucket is filled with a mixture of ice and water
(mostly ice).  The output from the boiler is connected to the upper (entry)
port.  Gravity pulls the wort through the coil and out the lower (exit)
port and off to the primary fermenter.  The flow rate through the coil is
controlled by adjusting the valve on the exit port.  This, in turn,
controls the exit temperature of the wort.  Additional ice is added to the
bucket as required.

The advantages I see with this approach are that it is inherently simple. 
It doesn't require the use of copious amounts of running water (an
important consideration for us living in "water poor" areas of the
country).  You also don't have to figure out what to do with the water
run-off, because there really isn't any.  The process also allows for the
use of a hop-back prior to the entry port if you're interested in that
procedure.  My guess is that the wort temperature will be quickly reduced
with this device.

The disadvantages are that sanitation of the coil may be difficult (but no
more so than with a counter-flow chiller) and I'm sure there are many
suggestions for dealing with this problem.  Also, I'm not sure how much ice
would be required to process a batch of wort.

Although I haven't built this device yet I am guessing someone must have
already considered such a device before and may have good reasons for *not*
using it.  It seems simple enough to me and appears, conceptually, to be
effective.  But it may also have some hidden traps I haven't thought of. 
Has anyone tried this or does anyone have any opinions about it?



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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 94 13:43:26 -0500
From: Kirk_Anderson at wheatonma.edu (Kirk Anderson)
Subject: not-home brew/ATF/dry yeast

I'm just re-joining the HBD conversation after a long hiatus, so you'll
excuse me if this topic has been recently discussed.

I was in Toronto at a friend's house last week.  He and 11 other
afficionados brew several batches at a time, once a month or so.
They go to a brewery/store where they buy the supplies, cook the
wort, ferment, and (later) bottle.  No mess in the kitchen!
His brews were in plastic bottles and had been force-carbonated,
but I assume one has the option.  He said there's basically a fixed
fee for almost any 10-gallon batch: ingredients and use of the
equipment.

I was just wondering if this kind of thing is being done in the USA.
Let me guess: it's illegal, right?

(Re: the Yakima Brewing vs ATF story. Sheesh! a lot of people don't
know that sort of thing happens here.  Paramilitary bullies! If the ATF 
goon squad were that spiteful after media coverage of the Grant's 
Brew caper, imagine how they feel after the Waco debacle.  Now all of 
America knows.)

Concerning dry yeasts, I'd appreciate any suggestions via private 
e-mail about which ones to avoid and which to seek out.  Thanks


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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 1994 11:04:47 -0800 (PST)
From: mclagan at sfu.ca
Subject: SNPA recipe collection

Dear Brewers:

Sufferin' Mailers! I am quickly gaining an appreciation for the 
number of people that read this digest. Over the last few days 
I've had over 200 requests for the SNPA recipes. I've managed 
to meet the demand with a great deal of help from QuicKeys (a 
fabulous macro utility for the Mac).

A few of you have addresses that make my mailer choke. Please
check if you appear below. The message I get from the mailer
appears above each group.

"Missing name for redirect."
ESF01%ALBNYDH2.bitnet at UACSC2.ALBANY.EDU
John_Shepardson.esh at QMAIL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
hecker%elfx.dnet at esu36.ateng.az.honeywell.com
Wayne_A_Sawdon at MENDOCINO.MACH.CS.CMU.EDU

"Event not found."
adiron!partech.com!scott at uunet.UU.NET

"Don't understand specifying a subject and no-one to send to!"
Gregory=Kushmerek%AcctgMed%FIN at HumRes-Server.Net.Tufts.EDU

"User or Host Unkown."
Dave.Dorcak at Forsythe.Stanford.ED
dknight at nyx10.cs.du.edu

I am admittedly an email novice, so any help with these addresses
would be appreciated. If mail won't work perhaps I could put the
collection in some FTP space.

Cheers,
Scott McLagan (mclagan at fraser.sfu.ca)
Co-ordinator for Computers, School District 43 (Coquitlam)


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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 1994 14:43:32 -0600
From: dmorey at iastate.edu
Subject: UV Radiation for Bottles

Greetings everyone,

	All of the talk lately about using the oven to *sanitize*
bottles gave me an idea.  I was curious if anyone has tried to use
ultra-voliet light source.  This would be very similair to those
safety glasses cabinets that use uv light to sterilize the eye wear.
Such a device could be easily constructed from lumber and
non-phosphorus coated fluorescent bulbs.
	So, my question is does this seem to be a reasonable approach?
Would it take too much time or are the *critters* we are concerned
with survive the bombardment of uv radiation?  I'm sure this will not
cause thermal stresses in the bottles.  Just some food for thought.

Dan

==========================================================================
 Dan A. Morey		|   Wine is proof that God loves us and wants to
 dmorey at iasate.edu	|   see us happy.  - B. Franklin
 Agricultural Process 	|
 Engineer		|   The same is true for BEER!  - Me
==========================================================================


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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 94 14:52:07 MST
From: npyle at n33.stortek.com
Subject: Old Crusty / Shelf Life / Errata

Mark Fryling writes:

>One more question.  I have been looking wherever possible for Rogue's Old
>Crustacean Barleywine but I cant seem to find it.  Is this stuff available in
>bottles anywhere?  The things I have read say that its great stuff.

Mark, I can't help you find it because I've never seen it for sale.  I *can*
attest to the fact that it was far and away the best barleywine I tasted at the
GABF last fall.  I remember tasting it, getting a big grin on my face, then
grabbing my friends and dragging them over to the booth.  All agreed that this
was nectar.

**

I think I've read at least 3 different testimonials on each side of this issue:
Does filtered or unfiltered beer have longer shelf life?  I suspect it is not
black and white.  Dr. Fix, can you comment on this?

**

Carl Howes correctly corrected my completely erroneous guess on the Fix HSA
article:

>Norm Pyle wrote (in #1318) that George Fix's article on HSA was
>"(Fall?) 1993".  I think that was Winter 1992 (unless he wrote another
>one...really should get that subscription in...)

I wasn't even close.  I think it wasn't until fall that I read it...  The
lesson here is two-fold:  1) I shouldn't quote dates (or much of anything else)
from memory, and 2) You shouldn't listen if I do.  Sorry for the inconvenience.

Cheers,
Norm

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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 1994 16:45:06 -0800 (PST)
From: Mark Stewart <mstewart at scs.unr.edu>
Subject: New Wyeast Profiles...

Anyone out there in "HBDland" know of where I can get profiles on the new 
WYeast strains (i.e., Scotch, Pils, etc.)?  If they're posted somewheres 
then please e-mail me as to where.....my most recent download of the yeast 
FAQ from sierra.stanford.edu didn't make mention of them.
TIA,
     **********************************************************************
     **     Mark Stewart        "Hurry 'long quickly and don't take      **
     **     Dept. of Psych.                no shortcuts..."              **
     **     mstewart at unssun     -Virginia Reed, Donner Party survivor    **
     **********************************************************************


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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 94 22:27 CST
From: arf at mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: Mill Adjustment

 
 >From: Eric Wade <ericwade at CLASS.ORG>
 
 >I rec'd an adjustable Glatt malt mill for xmas:).  Does
 anyone have any suggestions on where to begin with gapping it.  I know
 that the proof is in the milling, but I've never milled my own grain
 before and would like some help with getting started.  I've got feeler
 guages for gapping plugs, etc.....
 
 
 The following came up on r.c.b and the response seems to be relevant to your 
 question.....
 
 >From: hollen at megatek.com (Dion Hollenbeck) {a satisfied Glatt user}
 
 >       (Jack, can you explain why adjusting just one end
         of the MaltMill rollers works, please?  This is not a slam,
         but true wish for information).
 
 The short answer is that, in a properly designed roller mill, adjustment is 
 not necessary, so how one does it is like arguing about angels dancing on pin 
 heads.
 
 The grist produced by a fixed spaced MALTMILL will easily wet, fully convert 
 and provide the proper amount of husk material required by any known 
 mash/lauter system on any known malted grain.  It is the ultimate in 
 simplicity to use and of the over 1000 sold, I have only been asked to 
 up-grade one unit to adjustable capability.  The reality speaks for itself.
 
 So why do I sell adjustable mills as an option?
 
 Because people think they need them and in spite of my un-sales pitch, they 
 continue to pay for them.
 
 Why do people think they need adjustability?
 
 First of all, experience with Coronas, sets them up and the tradition and 
 needs of commercial brewers which have been transplanted to home brewing, 
 convinces them that "textbook quality" grist is imperative.  I admit, I fell 
 for this line also and used the term in my early literature.
 
 Commercial breweries use costly, multistage roller mills to crush the malt 
 and sort out the variously sized particles to assure a grist of known and 
 controllable particle distribution.  Elaborate testing is done on the grist 
 by passing it through successively finer calibrated sieves, under controlled 
 conditions and the weight of the grist not passing through each screen is 
 recorded.  The distribution of the various sized particles from a typical 
 multi-roller commercial mill is shown in the following bar chart.
 
                      .....................
 
 35%                 
                     X
 30%                 X
                     X
 25%                 X      X
                     X      X
 20%          X      X      X
              X      X      X
 15%          X      X      X
       X      X      X      X
 10%   X      X      X      X
       X      X      X      X
  5%   X      X      X      X       X              
       X      X      X      X       X              X
  0%   X      X      X      X       X       X      X
 
       10     14     18     30      60     100     100
 
       ^________Retained on Sieve___________^     Passed
 
 
 The numbers along the bottom are the mesh sizes of the sieves and represent 
 the number of openings per inch.
 
 The vertical numbers are percentages by weight of the total sample taken, 
 either retained on the sieve or passed through it.
 
                     .....................
 
 Sieve analysis is very useful to commercial brewers as a method of monitoring 
 the incoming malt and the milling operation.  It is also important in 
 tracking down problems that occur further along in the process.  It is not to 
 be presumed that any particular distribution is the best or even acceptable 
 for any and all brewing systems or environments.  What is most important is 
 having a standard of reference to compare future results with.
 
 It is important for homebrewers to understand that what works best for large 
 scale commercial operations has little relevancy to small scale, home 
 brewing.  There are two driving forces in a commercial operation.  One is 
 repeatability and knowing exactly what the grist looks like at all times, is 
 the only way to achieve this.  The second is efficiency of operation and 
 maximizing the amount of beer made from every pound of malt.  The way to do 
 this is to adjust the grist to exactly suit the individual brewing process.
 
 The extract efficiency when using a roller mill, will not vary enough in 
 small batches to provide measurable differences over very broad ranges of 
 grist particle size distribution.  If all the grain is thoroughly crushed, 
 there will be little advantage if any, to adjust for a commercial style 
 distribution and of course, the equipment and time must be available to make 
 the measurements and adjustments.
 
 Having said all that, if one wishes to achieve the "text book" sieve analysis 
 with a two roller mill, the only way is to "cheat" and that brings us to why 
 adjusting only one end "works".
 
 By adjusting the spacing at one end to near roller contact and the "nonimal" 
 spacing on the other end, by simple serendipity, the grist from a MALTMILL 
 (tm) comes out looking like it went through a six roll mill.  The variation 
 in spacing across the rollers seems to accurately simulate the statistical 
 distrbution of a six roll mill adjusted to "text book" grist.
 
 As the rollers are 10 inches long, I would not assume the the same would be 
 true with the Glatt and it's 4 inch rollers.  Furthermore, I would be 
 surprised if it would even function with that much skew over only 4 inches 
 without causing undue bearing distortion and/or binding.. and with plastic 
 bearings, I wouldn't even try it unless you have some spares and the 
 equipment to replace them.  BTW, I have a bag full of them in the archives.  
 I gave them up long ago as pennywise and pound foolish.
 
 As a final point, I have been told by a respected source that RIMS is one 
 reason to need an adjustable mill.  However, his experience was limited to an 
 adjustable MM which worked with his RIMS and someone else's fixed mill that 
 did not.  I would be interested to know what experience RIMS folks have had 
 with fixed MM's of current design.
 
 Well, anyway the first answer WAS short.
 
 js
 ......................
 
 I can't speak for the Glatt, but the fixed MM is set at a spacing of .045" 
 and this could be the other short answer to your question.   I use an 
 adjustable for my personal brewing but go months without touching the 
 adjustment and then only when checking out design changes.  I use many 
 different malts in my beer and see no need to ever adjust it.
 
 jjs
 

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Date: Sun, 9 Jan 1994 03:59:32 -0800
From: nblackmo at cln.etc.bc.ca
Subject: 2 Qs from a newbie

First of all, I'm totaly new to this...I've never brewed anything before in
my life, so would appreciate any help you can offer  (problems and remedies
that a newbie may experience, etc.).  

Question 1; Are there any *reliable* mailorder companies that would sell
what I need?  If so please send me information about them.

Question 2; Is this available in a non-digest format?  If so how would I
set myself to it?

reply to nblackmo at cln.etc.bc.ca


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Date: Sat, 8 Jan 1994 21:39:45 -0500 (EST)
From: rgarvin at btg.com (Rick Garvin (703-761-6630))
Subject: HWBTA Style Guidelines, 2 of 3

Home Wine and Beer Trade Association (HWBTA)
1994 National Homebrew Competition

Style Guidelines Part 2 of 3

Part 1) Ales
Part 2) Lagers
Part 3) Mixed, Meads, Sponsors

Lagers

11. BOCK (award sponsored by THE BEVERAGE PEOPLE, SANTA ROSA, CA)     

a. TRADITIONAL GERMAN BOCK - Copper to dark brown. Full body. 
Malty sweet character predominates in aroma and flavor with some 
toasted chocolate. Low bitterness. Low hop flavor "noble-type" OK. 
No hop aroma. No fruitiness or esters. Low to medium diacetyl OK. 
Medium to full body. Hop bitterness low. OG 1.066-1.074 IBU 20-30  
SRM.20-30.

b. HELLES (LIGHT) BOCK - Pale to amber. Other characters same as 
Dark Bock without chocolate character and medium to full body. OG 
1.066-1.068 IBU 20-35 SRM 4.5-6.

c. DOPPLEBOCK - Light to very dark - amber to dark brown. Very 
full body. Malty sweetness evident in aroma and flavor can be 
intense. High alcoholic flavor. Slight fruitness and esters OK, 
but not very desirable. Low bitterness. Low hop flavor, "noble-
type" OK. No hop aroma. Low diacetyl OK.  OG 1074-1.080 IBU 17-27  
SRM 12-30.

12. BAVARIAN DARK (award sponsored by CONSOLIDATED 
BEVERAGES/COOPERS, MEDINA, WA)

a. MUNICH DUNKEL - Copper to dark brown. Medium body. Nutty, 
toasted, chocolatelike malty sweetness in aroma and flavor. Medium 
bitterness. Hop flavor and aroma, "noble-type" OK No fruitiness or 
esters. Low diacetyl OK. OG 1.052-1.056 IBU 16-25 SRM 17-23.

b. SCHWARZBIER - Dark brown to black. Medium body. Roasted malt 
evident. Low sweetness in aroma and flavor. Low to medium 
bitterness. Low bitterness from roast malt. Hop flavor and aroma, 
"noble-type" OK. No fruitiness, or esters. Low diacetyl OK. OG 
1.044-1.052 IBU 22-30 SRM 25-30.

13. DORTMUND/EXPORT (award sponsored by LIL BROWN JUG, TACOMA, WA)

a. Pale to golden. Medium body. Medium malty sweetness. Medium 
bitterness. Hop flavor "noble-type" and aroma OK. No fruiiness, 
esters or diacetyl. Alcoholic warmth evident. OG 1.048-1.056 IBU 
23-29 SRM 4-6.

14. MUNICH HELLES (award sponsored by JONMER, INC., FOSTER CITY, 
CA)

a. Pale to golden. Medium body. Medium malty sweetness. Low 
bitterness. Hop flavor and aroma "noble-type" OK. No fruitiness or 
esters. Low diacetyl OK. OG 1.044-1.052 IBU 18-25 SRM 3-5.

15. CLASSIC PILSENER (award sponsored by THE RENO HOMEBREWER, 
RENO, NV)

a. GERMAN - Pale to golden. Light to medium body. High hop 
bitterness. Medium hop flavor and aroma "noble-type." Low 
maltiness in aroma and flavor. No fruitiness, esters. Very low 
diacetyl OK. OG 1.044-1.050 IBU 30-40 SRM 2.5-4.

b. BOHEMIAN - Pale to golden. Light to medium body. Medium to high 
bitterness. Low to medium hop flavor and    aroma "noble-type." 
Low to medium maltiness in aroma and flavor. No fruitiness, 
esters. Low diacetyl OK. OG 1.044-1.056 IBU 35-45 SRM 3-5.

16. AMERICAN LAGER (award sponsored by THE MARKET BASKET, 
BROOKFIELD, WI)

a. AMERICAN STANDARD - Very pale. Light body. Very low bitterness. 
Low malt aroma and flavor. Low hop aroma  and flavor OK. 
Effervescent. No fruitiness, esters or diacetyl. OG 1.040-1.046  
IBU 5-17 SRM 2-4.

b. AMERICAN PREMIUM - Very pale to golden. Light body. Low to 
medium bitterness. Low malt aroma and flavor OK. Low hop flavor or 
aroma OK. Effervescent. No fruitiness, esters or diacetyl. OG 
1.046-1.050 IBU 13-23 SRM 2-8.

c. AMERICAN DARK - Deep copper to dark brown. Light to medium 
body. Low bitterness. Low malt aroma or flavor  OK. Low hop flavor 
or aroma OK. Effervescent. No fruitiness, esters. Very low 
diacetyl OK. OG 1.040-1.050 IBU 14-20 SRM 10-20.

17. VIENNA/OKTOBERFEST/MARZEN (award sponsored by FERMENTATION 
FRENZY, LOS ALTOS, CA)

a. VIENNA - Amber to deep copper/light brown. Toasted malt aroma 
and flavor. Low malt sweetness. Light to medium body. Hop 
bitterness "noble-type" low to medium. Low hop flavor and aroma, 
"noble-type" OK. No fruitiness, esters. Low diacetyl OK. OG 1.048-
1.055 IBU 22-28 SRM 8-12.

b. OKTOBERFEST/MARZEN - Amber to deep copper/orange. Malty 
sweetness, toasted malt aroma and flavor dominant. Medium body. 
Low to medium bitterness Low hop flavor and aroma, "noble-type" 
OK. No fruitiness, esters, or diacetyl. OG 1.052-1.064 IBU 22-28  
SRM 7-14.

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Date:    Sun, 09 Jan 94 09:19 EST
From: Phil Bardsley <UPHILB at UNCMVS.OIT.UNC.EDU>
Subject: Brewery tours in London?

I'll be in London a day or two in transit for work, and I'd like to
tour a couple breweries.  Any places you've been and recommend
visiting or avoiding?  Also, where can I write for the CAMRA
publication I've heard about that lists pubs serving cask-conditioned
ales?  Private responses to phil_bardsley at unc.edu   Thanks.  Phil

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Date: Sun, 09 Jan 1994 17:14:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: KRWEISEL at delphi.com
Subject: Thermometer/Pasty Lagers/Eye Allergy

Hello all, time for me to stop lurking on the HBD and post some
stuff to this wonderful forum. Many thanks to -ALL- for the great
tidbits of info I have recived from here. 1 nifty gadget 
description and 2 questions to follow:

Nifty gadget:  I recD!|ently purchased a "Maverick Redi-Check" digital
thermometer from a mall type kitchen gadgets store. It is designed
to be a digital meat thermometer and cost me about $22. Ya poke it
in the bird, press a button and it tells you the meat temp. It reads
to xxx.x deg F (accurate as best my other equipment can tell) if
given time, but the neat thing is that the PB on it gives a quick
temp reading (about 5-10 sec) that the booklet says is accurate to
within 2 F. The little critter must "know" it's thermal time
constant and take a series of temp/time readings and do a curve fit
(1st order lag?) to approximate the final temp, if it gets a match
with the next several readings it does a lock at the calc temp, if 
you let it sit, it does home in on the final temp, but as with other
thermometers this does take 20-30 sec. No more leaning over a hot 
mash kettle waiting on the thermometer for me!

Question: My ales have typicaly turned out great, but my lagers
have always had what I call a "pasty" (aka Cardboard/Papery) taste
to them. The more I read I'm learining that this may be caused by
oxidation problems. I do all grain mashes in a SS kettle on the
stove, lauter tun in 2 pickle buckets, one with lots of holes set
in the other, drain through a SS valve and flex tube to the same SS
kettle for boil. Post boil I settle in the SS kettle and siphon out
through a copper tubing wort chiller to a glass carboy, serve in 
cornelius kegs. Ales ferment upstairs at about 65F for 14/21 days,
Lagers in the main basement at about 52, secondary in a fruit cellar
at 35 (pretty nice basement for a lager loving brewer, don't ya 
think! too bad it only works in the winter!!!) Differences from ales
to lagers are that I do a secondary/lager to another carboy at much
colder temps, with a siphon xfer in between. I always fill the kegs
with CO2 before a xfer, and have started filling the secondary
carboy with it too, but have not yet noticed a difference (only a
couple of batches so far...) - Could HSA be introduced by "pouring"
the mash into the pickle bucket lauter tun, and the Ales don't live
long enough to notice? I thought that disolved O2 was driven off
during the boil, but can the buggers "mate" with something in the
grain, and come free during the lagering to cause problems? Should
I use this excuse to convert the SS keg in my basement into a 
mash-kettle/lauter-tun? Ya but then I'll need a cajun cooker and
want a 15 gal kettle to do 10 gal batches...

Question: I've had problems with my eyes and contact lenses for
the last several months, lots of redness, tears, sleep chunks in
the morning ... My Dr. recently asked "Any new Chemicals in your
life?...You have developed an allergy to something..." Well, while
grinding grains (corona mill) for a recent batch my eyes felt a
familar discomfort, and severals days later developed the same 
symptoms as the "allergy" Does this mean I can't brew anymore? 
Ha, not on your life!  The saftey goggles and box with a vacuum
cleaner hose attached are a big help, but I still seem to be 
sensative to the dust. How do all you experts out there crush/grind
your grain without raising a lot of dust? Does anyone else out
there have eye problems, heard of any from friends, heard of any
solutions? What did I do to my Karma to deserve such a curse...
Allergic to Malt dust, please Help!!!!

Karl Weisel	KRWeisel at delphi.com - home, delayed & prefered
Cleveland, Oh	Weisel at rcsteam5.mhs.compuserve.com - work, 
		 where they monitor our email and
		 don't care about my opinion!!


|aq

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Date: Sun, 9 Jan 94 17:10:33 -0500
From: Rich Ryan <ryancr at install4.swin.oasis.gtegsc.com>
Subject: kegging

I recently took the plunge and purchased 3 pin lock
kegs and the O rings from Defalco's. They arrived in
good shape other than label scum and smelling like
soda pop. BTW, they told me that they are no longer 
shipping the cornelius kegs and suggested Great 
Fermentations in Santa Rosa, CA. Sorry they didn't
have the phone number. Since I am new to all of this 
I am not quite sure what other specific parts 
are needed to complete the setup. A while back I thought 
someone was in the process of compiling a FAQ but I haven't 
seen anything in the archives. Can anyone provide
a list of equipment and possible sources for the 
remainder of the stuff I need to start? Keep in mind
that I would like costs to be low. Some questions I
have. What size CO2 tank is recommended? Do I need
a regulator? I don't have a pressure release valve
on the keg so how do I adjust the pressure? 
I'm not looking for an elaborate setup, just plan on 
placing the setup in a spare frig. TIA, for any and
all help.

Rich Ryan
GTE
Chantilly, VA	ryancr at swin.oasis.gtegsc.com

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Date: 9 Jan 94 21:36:10 MST (Sun)
From: rcd at raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn)
Subject: re: Mead and Ale Yeast

WCH at gnv.ifas.ufl.edu writes:

> About 3 weeks ago, I started making my 2nd batch of mead.  After letting
> the mead coool down, I pitched the first package of yeast. One day goes by,
> two days go by, three days go by.  Oh no. I start to get worried so I pitch 
> another package.  Same thing.  Another package.  Again same thing.

More details, please!

One thing comes to mind right away:  You say "pitch...package of yeast" as
if you're putting the yeast directly from the packet into the fermenter.
That could be the problem; you should be rehydrating the yeast first at
least, and probably making a starter as well.  If you've got a typical
mead must (starting gravity of 1080 or more), it's a particularly inhos-
pitable medium for re-starting dry yeast.

> Now, I'm really worried.  The stuff has been in the carboy for 2 weeks just 
> sitting there.  I figure what the hell so I dumped in some ale yeast (the
> other packages had been a wine/mead yeast). Now, the stuff has been going
> ball's out for about a week.  Here come the questions?

Ale yeasts tend to take off faster than wine yeasts.  But I think we've got
as many questions as you do, to try to locate the problem...
  * What yeast did you use first (the wine/mead yeast)?
  * What did you use second (the ale yeast)?
  * Any chance your supplier deals mostly in beer products, such that the
    wine yeast could have been very stale?
  * What was the original gravity of the must?
  * What was the fermentation temperature?

> 1)  Isn't the ale yeast alcohol sensitive?  Meaning, won't it ferment to a 
> certain level then die?

Sure, but all yeasts are alcohol sensitive.  As a rule it's safe to say
that ale yeasts are less tolerant of alcohol than wine yeasts, but ale
yeasts still vary considerably in their alcohol tolerance.

> 2)  Has anyone else fermented mead with ale yeast?  How did it turn out?

I've done it, and I've been slowly drawn to the conclusion that the "wrong"
yeast is the major source of off-flavors in young meads.  The odd flavors
age out after a while.

> 3)  I'm getting ready to rack the mead in smaller 1-gallon bottles.  Should 
> I try to put some wine yeast in a racking or just let it go?

Depends on the starting gravity (relative to what the yeast can handle)
and how far it's fermented by the time you rack it.
 ---
Dick Dunn    rcd at eklektix.com   -or-   raven!rcd    Boulder, Colorado USA
   ...Simpler is better.

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1320, 01/10/94