FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  UPS Shipping for Contests (pblshr)
  Boiling the wort question??? (taylor)
  rootbeer recipes (mdeutsch)
  Growing Hops (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  EK Goldings (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  IBU calculations (GNT_TOX_)
  Silicone Tubing (William Nichols)
  ice beer ("Dana S. Cummings")
  PET Bottle Experiment (Alan_Marshall)
  2-row mash / rootbeer (RONALD DWELLE)
  Sierra Draft Question (Jim Busch)
  Heated mash? (Chuck Wettergreen)
  The Joy of Hop Growing (COYOTE)
  Bulkhead Fitting Plans (Dion Hollenbeck)
  Wine making (TAST2E69)
  re:microwaving caps (Jim Doyle)
  Wyeast Belgian (VIALEGGIO)
  Re: overrun caps, publist (Jeff Benjamin)
  Question (JACK FORD)
  Clear beer when kegging (Steve Zabarnick)
  Hop Rhizomes by mail (JEBURNS)
  Cedar Rapids, Iowa (Aaron Birenboim)
  Positive Pressure/Re: fluidless blowoff/Flawed airlock design (korz)
  Weird Beers of the World ("Stephen Schember")
  The Beer that made Idaho Famous (Part I) (STROUD)
  Re: Velvet Stout (Aaron Birenboim)
  Re: California brewing (Richard Stueven)
  Supermasherspargerboiler 2000 (I'm a STEELWORKER ... I kill what I eat)
  World-Wide Brew Club List (Brian Schlueter)


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For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at novell.physics.umr.edu



----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Wed, 09 Mar 94 08:40:36 EST
From: pblshr at aol.com
Subject: UPS Shipping for Contests

Unless you're declaring a value on your beer (It's priceless, right?), you're
just getting hassled by UPS regs. 

Hint: Find a buddy who has a UPS drop at their business, and reimburse them
for the shipping. UPS NEVER asks us what's in our packages. They're very
pleased to take our money, no questions asked. 

Tom Finan PBLSHR at aol.com
St. Louis Brews

"Confidence breeds style. If Norman Mailer were two inches taller, he could
write like Ernest Hemingway."

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 09:02:16 EST
From: taylor at e5sf.hweng.syr.ge.com (taylor)
Subject: Boiling the wort question???

Afew days ago in the digest someone was talking about boiling the wort so 
much as to carmalization.  What does this mean and does this happen when 
your wort is in a rapid boil for awhile.  I have a problem with my beers
I'm tring to figure out.  The beers taste good but I get alittle bit of
a sweet smell when opening the bottle
and a little bit of a sweet taste, not to bad just enough to taste it.
I don't get the bitter hop taste that I've tasted in other homebrew.  
Maybe I'm not putting enough hops in?  Maybe I'm not boiling the hops 
long enough?  I use honey all the time not corn sugar.
Can high temp. during boil carmalize the wort and add a sweet flavor?
Can honey change the taste alittle.  Don't get me wrong I'm sure my beers
are not infected with something.  Maybe it`s the extract or recipes I'm using?
Any ideas or info. anyone can give me would be appreicated. 
I boil my wort rapidly for at least an hour each time varing the hops.
Is this to much?  Thanks Todd

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 09:21:00 -0400 (EST)
From: mdeutsch <mdeutsch at indiana.edu>
Subject: rootbeer recipes


	If anyone does have a rootbeer recipe, could you please share it
with all of us.  I have a wife to make happy too......

				M. Deutschlander



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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 09:28:36 EST
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: Growing Hops

"Edward F. Loewenstein" writes:
 > Plants grown from seed may turn out to be either male or female, so if
 > someone tries to sell, or give, you hop seed, smile and politely refuse.

Another reason to "politely refuse": hop seed will NOT be genetically
identical to the parent plant, even if both parents were of the same
variety, so you will have no idea of the character of the hops you
would grow.

=S

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 09:41:16 EST
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: EK Goldings

Jim Busch writes:
 > The pale ale uses East Kent GOldings to effect, but not to
 > extreme as some of us do.

This is one of my favorite ale hops.  Wonderful dry-hopping hop.

A recent IPA of mine had the equivalent of almost a half pound of EKG
in 5 gallons.  It was a sort of 1-dimensional experiment: nothing in
it but pale malt and EKG.  In a January tasting (about 2 weeks after
bottling) at the local club, at least one taster thought it was
infected.  But, it took 3rd in the HWBTA, so I can't complain too
loudly.  The next one won't be quite so bombastic.  (I made this after
a judge commented on my previous effort that it didn't have enough hop
flavor.  "You want hop flavor!  I'll give you hop flavor!")

=S

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Date:     Wed, 9 Mar 94 09:44 EST
From: <GNT_TOX_%ALLOY.BITNET at PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU>
Subject:  IBU calculations

Hello all,

I'm trying to do some IBU calculations.  The formulas in the HOPS.FAQ
file and the formulas give me completely different numbers.  What
should I use to help determine the ammount of hops I need?  I'm really
confused.  I'm starting to think a % utilization table along with HBU
ratings for beers would be easier than the IBU system.  HELP!

Andy Pastuszak
Philadelphia, PA
INTERNET: GNT_TOX_%ALLOY.BITNET at PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU
BITNET:   GNT_TOX_ at ALLOY.BITNET


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Date: Tue, 08 Mar 1994 20:28:37
From: bnichols at mlab.win.net (William Nichols)
Subject: Silicone Tubing

Hi All-
In HBD#1365 Rick Gordon asks about food grade high temperature
tubing--
Silicone tubing fits the bill:
Temp Range   -150 to 500 deg F
FDA Approved
Available in 10 ft lengths and many sizes from US Plastics
1-800-537-9724
it also comes fiber reinforced
if you need any other help just email direct

Bill Nichols
bnichols at mlab.win.net
 


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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 10:05:40 -0500 (EST)
From: "Dana S. Cummings" <dcumming at moose.uvm.edu>
Subject: ice beer

I hate to complain but isn't there somewhere else for the discussion of 
highly commercial, gimmicky mega-brews.  MHO :)

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 09:44 EDT
From: Alan_Marshall <AK200032 at Sol.YorkU.CA>
Subject: PET Bottle Experiment

In the HBD, Derel Sheehan writes:

> I have decided to run the experiment.  I am going to bottle my next two
> batches in plastic (PET) 20 oz. bottles.  <snip>  Second, I want to
> see if the question of oxygen transport through the plastic is an issue for
> homebrewing.  <snip again>

<reasoning behind the experiment omitted>

> ....At any rate, the plastic bottles
> may not be such a good idea for mead, wine or any beverage that sits in the
> bottle for more than 6 months.

Like barley wine, Christmas ales, winter warmers...
> 
> I will post the results of my experiment.  Cheers!

I suspect your experiment will be quite successful, particularly if 
you confine yourself to standard lagers and ales meant to be consumed 
fresh.  I base this on casual empiricism:  (1) the best homebrew I 
ever had -- an American IPA that I actually preferred to SNPA, or 
Anchor Liberty Ale -- was in a 1 litre PET bottle;  and (2) Wellington 
County Brewery, which is producing the some of finest ales in Ontario 
bottles in 1 Litre PET bottles.  However, none of these are meant to 
age.  In fact, Wellington puts a 1 month expiry date on the labels.

Alan Marshall

- -- Alan Marshall -- AK200032 at SOL.YORKU.CA  (York University, Toronto, Canada)


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Date: Wed, 09 Mar 94 10:58:29 EST
From: dweller at GVSU.EDU (RONALD DWELLE)
Subject: 2-row mash / rootbeer

     A while back, someone posted an expert piece on mashing American 
     2-row, quoting somebody (maybe from California) about mashing at 
     two different temperature, one low ~130, one high ~160. Damned if 
     I can find the article. If someone can ID the HBD#, I'll retrieve 
     it. TIA
     
     "Duh" time. From some recent posts, I just realized that maybe 
     root beer (as in A&W) has not been de-alcoholed since the 
     beginning of creation. Was it historically a real beer? If 
     yes,does anyone know of some historical accounts of it, and where 
     can I find a more-or-less authentic receipe? Again, TIA.
     Ron Dwelle (dweller at gvsu.edu)

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 11:02:22 -0500 (EST)
From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com>
Subject: Sierra Draft Question

Since my post yesterday about Sierra Nevadas Draft ale only being
available at the brewery, I have been informed that a brewer
from SN stated that all kegged pale ale is this "draft ale".
This was not my impression, and now I am really wondering if
I have it all wrong (wouldnt be the first time!).

Anyone else know the scoop on SN draft ale???  I could of
sworn that the SN pale ale at the McMennimums was different.

Confused,

Jim Busch


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Date: Wed,  9 Mar 94 08:26:00 -0600
From: chuck.wettergreen at aquila.com (Chuck Wettergreen)
Subject: Heated mash?


HBDers,

In answer to my question about the process of mashing producing 
heat, Kirk Oseid (KLO at fluent.com) noted that he had read a 1940's 
article which spoke of the "heat of hydration" adding 1 to 2 degF 
(depending upon the moisture content of the grain) to the mash 
temperature. Spencer Thomas (Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu) added 
that my calculations perhaps had not included the effect of "slaking 
heat".

Since I have experienced this with every mash I have done in the 
insulated Gott mash/lauter tun, I'll start taking readings to see if 
there is a correlation to mash size, strike water temperature, etc.

Chuck
Chuck.Wettergreen at Aquila.com
 * RM 1.3 00946 * 

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Date: Wed, 09 Mar 1994 09:58:58 -0600 (MDT)
From: COYOTE <SLK6P at cc.usu.edu>
Subject: The Joy of Hop Growing

It's nice to hear the favorable stories of hop growers all over the place.
Mine are just approaching their second season (I couldn't help myself-
I had to dig down- tenderly- and see how they were doing. We had sunny 60's
yesterday, and I wanted to share it with them!)

One addition I'd make to the methods of hop planting described would be
to plant at least 2 rhizomes per hill.  The distancing, and spreading
concepts are just starting to be realized.
Reason for 2/hill:  Pests and other problems.  If one doesn't start, or is
just a weak rhizome you might not get a strong enough vine first year.
So far it seems all of mine have taken pretty well. There are numerous
sprouts just waiting to pop up.

Question:  Picking rhizomes. I know you shouldn't do it in the first year,
but... I couldn't find anything in Beach's book on harvesting rhizomes!
He talks all about his other attempts with shoots and stems, but not
about the true rhizome!  Argh.

When I dug down I did find some THICK horizontal roots. I was surprised
at how far out fromthe plant they are.  I'm afraid my cascade and mnt hood
may shake roots down there somewhere!  So,  just cut off a root fairly close
to the main stem and cut that into further divisions. Instant rhizomes!
Gave a couple to a grower-friend and saved one for me.

Question: What about damage to the main stem, or potential damage
at the wound sites on the rhizome?  Any treatment worth applying?
(like the tar stuff on tree branch- stumps)   I guess use a nice SHARP
clipper (not like the rusty dull one that sat out all winter - like I used!) 

How far down does one expect to find rhizomes?  How far down would I
need to bury a dividing wall to avoid mixing of varieties?
The other two are well contained- about 10 feet apart, but the cascade and
hood are a bit closer. They sit around a corner of the house, but they 
could reach around ( I discover!)


Anyway: For anyone thinking about getting in to it ... Go For It! Funfunfun.
It really doesn't take much effort. I don't think I'll ever be able to
rely solely on HG hops, but maybe for all my finishing!

***
Also on Home Malting, growing your own barley.  You'd have to have some
serious space!  Check the Zymurgy Grain Brewing Issue. There's an article
about making a malter.  I received an article via snail mail once with
a method for kilning different types of malt. Sounds like a fun project,
but if I can't grow enough hops for my own brewing efforts I know I won't 
be able to grow enough malt!  A couple acres, maybe we'd talk.

		Brew On.   John -The Coyote_ Wyllie   SLK6P at cc.usu.edu

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 09:16:28 PST
From: hollen at megatek.com (Dion Hollenbeck)
Subject: Bulkhead Fitting Plans

I have had so many requests for this that I thought it worth posting
for all.

		Bulkhead fitting description

A bulkhead fitting is a way of getting an attachment for plumbing on
two sides of a plate (bulkhead).  The simplest bulkhead fitting is
made with a close nipple, two rubber washers, two metal washers and
two pipe thread nuts.  Place the nipple through a hole in the plate.
Slip over a rubber washer, slip over a metal washer and then run on
the nut.  From the other side, do the same.  Tighten the two nuts
against each other to form a seal.  If the bulkhead is curved like in
a round cooler, you may need very soft rubber gaskets, but if it is
flat, the rubber can be harder.  O-rings sometimes work.  If you
cannot get pipe nuts, you can make them by buying reducer fittings.
For a 1/2" pipe nut, buy a 3/4" to 1/2" reducer.  Hold the 3/4"
threaded portion in a vise and use a hacksaw to cut off the hex nut
portion.  These are available for sale from McMaster-Carr in brass or
bronze, but I have only seen them in retail stores in pot metal which
one would *not* want to use in brewing.  The metals to be used may be
brass, bronze or stainless.  The washers should be 1/2" washers with
the hole bored out to 3/4" plus a hair to fit 1/2" pipe.


Bill of Materials

1	1/2" x close nipple
2	rubber washer or O-ring (3/4" ID)
2	metal washer (1/2" ID bored out to 3/4" ID plus a hair)
2	1/2" pipe nuts or 3/4"x1/2" reducing bushings



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Date: Wed, 09 Mar 1994 12:07:22 -0600 (CST)
From: TAST2E69 at CL.UH.EDU
Subject: Wine making

I am interested in wine making and was wondering if there are any good 
sources of info on wine?  Please send to in%"tast2e69 at cl.uh.edu"
Andrew Prather

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 10:09:31 -0700
From: Jim Doyle <jgdoyle at uci.edu>
Subject: re:microwaving caps

Did I really see a posting recommending the boiling of caps in a MICROWAVE?

All of my experience tells me that putting metal in the microwave oven
causes the oven to catch on fire.  I would suggest folks do research on
their own oven prior to sterilizing metal items in this fashion.
        	--
Jim Doyle
P.S. Purchasing Office
Ph. (714) 856-6047


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Date: Wed, 09 Mar 1994 13:13:38 -0500 (EST)
From: VIALEGGIO at ccmail.sunysb.edu
Subject: Wyeast Belgian


               State University of New York at Stony Brook
                       Stony Brook, NY 11794-5475

                                            Victor Ialeggio
                                            Music
                                            516 632-7239
                                            09-Mar-1994 01:10pm EDT
FROM:  VIALEGGIO
TO:    Remote Addressee                     ( _homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com )

Subject: Wyeast Belgian

I've cultured assorted Belgian yeasts from the
bottle(s)--just curious though, which, if any, does
Wyeast's Belgian resemble?
vialeggio at ccmail.sunysb.edu

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 11:44:18 MST
From: Jeff Benjamin <benji at hpfcbug.fc.hp.com>
Subject: Re: overrun caps, publist

> I'd prefer to have my homebrew labelled with
> "Lime Rickey" or "Artificially Flavored Diet Raspberry Soda".

I agree!  I'd rather have plain caps than "Real Beer" caps, but overruns
are even better (not to mention cheaper).  I can't believe that the
seemingly inexhaustable supply of "Boulder Sport" caps has finally run
out.  My homebrew shop has not had any overruns for many months --
perhaps the shift to PET bottles and cans, and the recent increase in
the number of homebrewers, means they just aren't making as many bottle
caps these days.

> There is no mention of WHERE to send additions and corrections to the list
> mentioned in the Publist itself.  No wonder there's so much out-of-date
> stuff in there!

I think there's lots of folks out there, including myself, who would
be happy to send in updated information for the publist if there were
someone maintaining it (not that I'm volunteering :-).  Please post
to the digest if there's a place we can send our info.

- --
Jeff Benjamin                               benji at hpfcla.fc.hp.com
Hewlett Packard Co.                         Fort Collins, Colorado	
"Midnight shakes the memory as a madman shakes a dead geranium."
					    - T.S. Eliot

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Date:    Wed, 09 Mar 94 13:45:19 EST
From: IO91892 at MAINE.maine.edu (JACK FORD)
Subject: Question

I just got your address from a friend of mine and I was wondering
what information you can give me.  I just bought a book on homebrewing
and I am interested in giving it a try soon.
thanks

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 13:10:19 -0500
From: steve at snake.appl.wpafb.af.mil (Steve Zabarnick)
Subject: Clear beer when kegging

I've had trouble obtaining clear beer for the batches that I have kegged
(in 5 gal Cornelius kegs). I recently decided to try using gelatin finings
in the keg for an ale, and obtained much clearer beer. My latest batch is a
lager (Wyeast 2124) that has been lagering at 38 degrees in a carboy for 6
weeks. I just kegged this lager and noticed that it is quite cloudy. Is
gelatin fining recommended for a kegged lager? Polyclar? Is my clearing
problem due to the long distance through wich the yeast need to settle in a
keg? All of my bottled beers have been crystal clear, so I don't think it
is due to my mashing and brewing procedure. BTW, I always force carbonate
in the keg.


Steve Zabarnick
steve at snake.appl.wpafb.af.mil


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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 14:48:25 EST
From: JEBURNS at ucs.indiana.edu
Subject: Hop Rhizomes by mail

Could someone post an address for a good source of hop rhizomes?  
Also I recently moved from eastern Washington to southern Indiana,
does anyone on the net know when a good time for plantin hops would
be? (that should read "planting")

thanks,   Dave in Bloomington
jeburns at ucs.indiana.edu

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 13:21:53 MST
From: abirenbo at redwood.hac.com (Aaron Birenboim)
Subject: Cedar Rapids, Iowa


   Anybody out there familiar with the Cedar Rapids area?
I'm considering moving there, and I'd like to talk candidly with somebody
familiar with this area of the country.

       aaron


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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 15:11 CST
From: korz at iepubj.att.com
Subject: Positive Pressure/Re: fluidless blowoff/Flawed airlock design

Sorry about this being a bit dated, but I had some problems posting it.


Mark writes:
>One of the more interesting tidbits: he said that the 
>cap was useful for scavenging the O2 in the headpsace, 
>*and also for keeping the beer free from O2* because he
>said the cap liner is not an O2 barrier and oxygen would
>migrate from the outside and into the headspace.  I asked
>if the positive pressure wouldn't keep the air out, and
>he said he didn't think so, that intuitively it would seem
>that way but gas was mostly space and there was lots of
>room for the molecules to sneak around each other.

I know for a fact that PureSeal (formerly SmartCaps) bottlecaps
are not only oxygen-scavenging, but also create an O2-barrier
to keep O2 out of the bottle, just as Mark reported.  Indeed,
positive pressure of one gas will not keep another gas out of
the bottle/bag/fermenter.  It's not how gasses work.  Also,
despite the fact that CO2 is heavier than air, if you purge
a container with CO2, but then leave it sitting open for a
while (or seal it with an O2-permiable seal), the CO2 in
the container and the O2 in the air will begin to mix.  The
rate of transfer depends on the type and thickness of the
material through which the gasses must pass.  This phenomenon
is called diffusion and I'm certain all of you have heard
of it.  It is the process by which gasses (or liquids, for
that matter) move across a permiable boundary from an area
of higher concentration to an area of lower concentration.
This is why the CO2 will not keep out the O2 and vice versa.
It's the reason that HDPE fermenters are not good for long-term
storage of beer, especially finished beer, and why polyethylene
bags are virtually useless for hop storage.

******
Rick writes:
>[Pasteur] filled some flasks with broth and formed an "S" type of lock with 
>glass tubing. He then boiled the broth to sterilize it. TO THIS VERY DAY
>those flasks are bug free with NO WATER WHATSOEVER in the lock. The 
>beasties simply can't crawl all the way through the S.

While this may be true for keeping nasties out of the fermenter, I
want to warn anyone who might be thinking about not filling their
airlocks at all to consider the first topic of this post.  The airlock
not only is for keeping nasties out, but also to keep oxygen out.
If you don't fill the airlock, diffusion cause the concentration of
O2 in the headspace to approach that of air, especially as the fermentation
begins to subside.  Now, you can get brew good beer like this, as can be
seen with Anchor, Samuel Smiths, Liefmans, Pilsner Urquell and any number
of other breweries that use open fermenters, but then again, consider
that they transfer the beer as soon as fermentation is complete.  Exposure
to O2 after fermentation is going to create a lot of aldehydes.  If you
aren't convinced that this is bad, try some of that air-pumped Industrial
keg beer the next morning.  Does it taste good?

*****
Steve writes:
>Peter Maxwell correctly pointed out that my airlock design
>using one Gerber jar would not work.
	<snip>
>The first (incorrect) solution would only work while the
>air flow was going into the fermenter, and when CO2 started
>flowing out, would squirt sterilant all over the place (what a mess!).
>The second solution COULD work if the lengths of the tubes were
>all calculated correctly.
	<snip>

>    | |   __     || 
>    |*|  /  |    || 
>    |_| /_/||    || 
>    \o\/o/ ||    ||
>     \o_/  ||    ||
>    S-lock ||    || <-- tube to fermenter
>         __||____||___
>        [__||____||___]
>         | ||    ||  |
>         |           |
>         |       .   |       
>         |        .  |
>         |       .   |
>         |-----------|
>         | Blowoff   |
>         |___________|

I completely misunderstood the purpose of Steve's design.  I thought
that he was using his device to "sanitize" are for aerating the wort.
Now, from today's post, I see that this was meant to be a "sanitizer"
for incoming air during the wort-cooling/lag period.  The diagram
above implies a small diameter blowoff hose, which I urge all homebrewers
to steer clear of.  I've had two mishaps with clogged blowoff hoses
(1/4" ID and 1/2" ID) and now only use a 1" ID (1.25" OD) blowoff
hose that goes right in the neck of the carboy -- no stopper.  Also,
the large diameter hose has the added benefit of relieving the
homebrewer from worries of water/sterilant/etc. getting sucked up
the blowoff hose.  There would have to be a huge change in temperature
and a very large headspace for the headspace air to contract enough
to pull enough liquid up the blowoff tube to make a difference.  Sure
the liquid will rise up a foot or so, but that's about it.  When the
fermentation begins, the water will come out back into the blowoff
jug.

Al.

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Date: 9 Mar 1994 17:22:38 -0500
From: "Stephen Schember" <Stephen_Schember at terc.edu>
Subject: Weird Beers of the World 

                      Subject:                             
Time:  10:55 AM
  OFFICE MEMO         Weird Beers of the World             
Date:  3/9/94
I had a conversation yesterday with a friend who spoke about a
fermented millet seed beer he had in Mongolia. He said you just
added water to the fermented seeds and stick your long straw and
the pot. I too was puzzled and amazed and passed on the hbd
story of Mongolian Fermented Yak milk in a pouch. All this and
the great post someone put up about unusual African beers makes
me think that there should be an unusual/international beer(or
fermented beverage) FAQ if there isn't one allready. Any
interest, stories, motivated researchers of the fermented
arcane, out there ? 
On a seperate topic I've read about different flavor crystal and
other specialties can contribute depending on when they are
introduced  into the brewing process.  How can mash out
additions of crystal etc. be effectively duplicated in extract
brewing ?
 -thanks
steve



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Date: 09 Mar 1994 17:19:56 -0500 (EST)
From: STROUD%GAIA at leia.polaroid.com
Subject: The Beer that made Idaho Famous (Part I)

The following article was taken from the April 1987 issue of the Foam Ranger's
Brewsletter Urquell

***************
The Beer That Made Idaho Famous or How I Mash Potatoes
                                                         by Cary Jensen

Often I am accused of being just a little mad when I introduce a beer like
Meister Potato Brau.  Comments like "what possessed you to ruin good beer by
making it with potatoes" are reliable when I talk to the uninitiated.  However,
these detractors are typically silenced with one (sometimes two) quaffs of this
'nectar of Idaho.'

I know, I know, comedian Chevy Chase once extolled the virtues of beer made
from this unglamorous tuber by proclaiming "I drink Spud and I pour it on my
suit."  Remember though, the drink 'for people who can't taste the difference'
only lived in the imaginations of drug addled comedy writers for that
particularly novel late-night TV program.

Charlie Papazian writes in "The Complete Joy of Home Brewing" that
'Fermentables produced from potato starch do not contribute significantly to
the character or flavor of beer, other than providing fermentables to be
converted to alcohol.'  He further writes that '[the] use [of potatoes as an
adjunct] is discouraged by beer drinkers justifiably or unjustifiably against
"potato beer".'

Well, it's just this kind of negative thinking which gets me started.  All I
need is for one person to say 'Yuck!  What a disgusting idea!" and there I go,
getting out the ol' brewing pot and grating up some potatoes.

As you may have guessed, if you are still with me, is that potato beer is not
for novices or the weak of heart.  It does required that you prepare a mash.
On the lighter side, though, the starch in potatoes is easily gelatinized, so
working with this unusual adjunct is less hassle than you might imagine.

When I prepare a 5 gallon batch of potato beer, I usually only use between 2
and 3 pounds of potatoes.  These I prepare by slicing thinly like potato chips,
or grating, using either a food processor or a cheese grater.  I have not
peeled the potatoes in practice only because I am terminally lazy.  You may
want to try peeling your potatoes and see if there is any noticeable difference
in taste.

The grains I prepare by submitting them to a protein rest at about 122 F for 45
minutes.  During this time I boil the shredded potatoes in a second pot.  This
boiling serves to gelatinize the starches in the potatoes, maaking them easily
converted to sugars by the active enzymes in the barley grains.  As I noted
above, potato starch is easily gelatinized; it is not necessary to boil the
potatoes prior to adding them to the mash.  However, by adding the boiling
potato soup (this is what your kitchen will smell like at first) to the mash,
you can conviently raise the temperature of your mash up to 155 F, an ideal
temperature for converting the starches to sugars.

Maintain the temperature of the mash using whatever methods you currently use
until all of the starches have been converted to sugars.  Lately this has taken
me between 30 and 45 minutes.  Use an iodine test to determine when this
conversion is complete.  Sparge as you would do with any other all grain beer,
discarding the spent potatoes, no matter how strong an urge for cooked,
shredded potato you develop during the mashing procedure.


- -- End of Part I --

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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 94 15:26:10 MST
From: abirenbo at redwood.hac.com (Aaron Birenboim)
Subject: Re: Velvet Stout


RF61384%LTUVAX.bitnet at CUNYVM.CUNY.ED (sorry, no name given) asked about
Velvet stout:

   Had it.  Unimpressed.  It tastes like Miller, but EXTREMELY
astringent.  (sharp with that harsh "puckering" at the back of the jaw)
No roast malt flavor or aroma.  just that nasty astringency.
Note:  AHA guidelines consider excessive astringency a flaw in stout
(not that i have a lot of respect for AHA guidelines, but this time i agree)

  I think its likely to be a lager, adjuncted.  I give it mostly
full marks on appearance (lacks head), mostly low marks on aroma
(no good ones, no bad ones), low marks on flavor, mid-to low
drinkability.  perhaps a high 20's.  (only one flaw... astringency,
but way off style)

        aaron


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Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 17:09:37 -0800
From: Richard Stueven <gak at wrs.com>
Subject: Re: California brewing

Jim Busch relates his tale of Travelling West:

>Drive down to east bay, and hook up with Rich Steuven, aka
>gak.  Rest up for a hard weekend (when your with gak, you 
>better be rested!). 

Just what are you trying to say, Jim?  Did I work you too hard?  Are
you getting too old for this stuff?  Don't like staying up until 5:00am
with screaming roommates and weird (*truly*weird*) music?  Bring your
wheelchair next time, Gramps...we take our fun Real Serious!

>Next installment: north to Ft. Bragg.

But seriously, folks...Jim and I had a blast pub-crawling up and down
the coast.  (I counted 11 pubs in three days...maybe more...)  I'm
looking forward to reading his version of the ordeal...with luck, some
of it might even sound familiar!

have fun
gak

Richard Stueven, Castro Valley CA
gak & gerry's garage, brewery and hockey haven

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Date: Thu, 10 Mar 94 15:18:00 EST
From: I'm a STEELWORKER ... I kill what I eat <aidan at rschp2.anu.edu.au>
Subject: Supermasherspargerboiler 2000
Full-Name: I'm a STEELWORKER ... I kill what I eat

Hiya

I have been reading this group for 6 or so months now (through 
rec.crafts.brewing, but now I am a full subscriber), I have eight 
batches under my belt (had to get a bigger belt!  :-)), most of 
them extract, dabbling with specialty grains and I even did a 
small partial mash on my first wheat beer (also used Wyeast Wheat 
yeast, so I am hopeful for a good result - I couldn't believe it, 
I actually smelt the famous banana smell emanating from 
air-lock!).  

ANYWAY ...  sheesh some people go on ...  I never envisaged going
all-grain (just too damn expensive for the equipment - I am a
very poor post-graduate student), but I have found a place that
will sell me a tea urn for $20 (apparently they are about 20 or
30 litres = 5 or 7 gallons).  In case you don't realise this is a
stainless steel vessel, with a large thermostatically controlled
electric element in it, and a tap mechanism, that is normally
used to dispense tea.  I figure it is actually a very cleverly
disguised masher/sparger/boiler.  This could be the answer to all
my prayers!  I want to know if I have to worry about the element
scorching the wort/grains? If so, how do I get around this? Use
some sort of false bottom? I figure I can sparge by fitting some
sort of manifold to the bottom of the urn and pipe it through the
exsiting tap. Any feedback would be good.

Thanks

Aidan

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Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 15:12:48 +0000 (JST)
From: Brian Schlueter <schluetb at emh.kadena.af.mil>
Subject: World-Wide Brew Club List


Thank you everyone for you response to the WWBC list.

I strongly wish to keep people in touch with all local brewing
activities, Towns, Cities, States, provinces and Countries!

You the homebrewer can make this happen,

 My e-mail box located in Okinawa is soon closing due to are move to
the United States, Omaha, Nebraska area.

schluetb at emh.kadena.af.mil


Please snail mail all new clubs, closings, additional info or
question to:

SBS
2668 Marywood Dr.
Dubuque, Iowa 52001 USA


A comment of the information exchange, every entry is open to anyone 
requesting it. Building the brewing community is the goal!

If you have already brewed your first batch and can teach others, I 
encourage you and commend you on your efforts!

Brewing will grow and we have tools today to make it happen faster
and world wide. Let's all help others to grow.

Anyone that did not receive a copy of the WWBC list please e-mail me 
for a prompt response! Close out date is 20 Mar 94.

DONT FORGET YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS!

Brew-ON!  Cheers to Hombrew,
just made some pale ale for the 24 hour plane trip home. Kom Pia!

Brian

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1369, 03/10/94