FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  Beerfest in Arcata CA (John Millar)
  Size of the market (nr706)
  brewpub info wanted ("Mark Merchant")
  Help with a BIG KEG.... (Jack Skeels)
  Priming With Cane Sugar (WKODAMA)
  beginning to brew (Herstl)
  spices (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  More Water questions (Jay Weissler)
  CTSP vs Clorine & TSP and other ramblings ("Mark B. Alston")
  party pigs / where to put that carboy (LLAPV)
  Re: Sweet Homebrewed Beverages ("Mark B. Alston")
  Re: Wyeast Problems (John Shepardson)
  Wyeast questions (t_aylesworth)
  Easymasher and Irish Moss (wyatt)
  HELP!!!  OLD MEAD REFERENCE (RICK ZYDENBOS)
  Wasted space? (jim robinson)
  re:Sparkling cider, kegging (MBige.Roch817)
  RESIPIENT SERVER IS DOWN ("OAKQM3")
  Hot Liquor Tank (Terri Terfinko)
  American Micro Brews (Kevin Pratt)
  Hard vs. Soft H2O (FSAC-FCD) <dward at PICA.ARMY.MIL>
  RE: Wyeast Hangover (Jim Dipalma)
  Honey Priming (efrainm)
  Beginners Strange Brews (Doug Lukasik)
  Barleywine yeast (Jeff Frane)
  Thermostat for heat & cool (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  Mashing Breakfast Cereal ("Palmer.John")
  Chest Freezers (MRS1)
  scotch ale in decline (Mark Youman)
  corking sparkling cider (Henry E Kilpatrick)
  firestone kegs (Eugene Sonn)
  Barley in the Ancient Near East (Steven W. Schultz )


Send articles for __publication_only__ to homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
  (Articles are published in the order they are received.)
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Please don't send me requests for back issues - you will be silently ignored.
For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at novell.physics.umr.edu



----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Tue, 3 May 1994 10:02:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: jmillar at netcom.com (John Millar)
Subject: Beerfest in Arcata CA

I heard through the grapevine that there is a beer festival in Arcata,
CA on the weekend of May 15th.  Has anyone else heard of this festival
and does anyone know where to get more info?  Also, I'm always 
interested in visiting microbreweries and brewpubs.  I'd love to
hear from anyone who knows of some great brews!

 Reply to jmillar at netcom.com

Thanks,
John


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Date: Tue, 03 May 94 13:16:04 EDT
From: nr706 at aol.com
Subject: Size of the market

Julio C Rojas asked:
 ...help me quantify the size of the domestic (U.S.) homebrew market...
Haven't checked it myself, but you might see if MRI or SMRB has that info ...
my experience has been that their market size estimates aren't great, but it
could be a start. Also, have you tried calling Siebel (the brewing institute)
on West Peterson? Finally, if none of that yields much, you might try some
cheap research, an NFO panel or something.
If all else fails, try making assumptions and testing 'em ... it's amazing
how much you can figure out that way.

NR706 at aol.com <--- a marketing services supplier, also in Evanston

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Date: 3 May 1994 14:08:50 U
From: "Mark Merchant" <Mark_Merchant at gatormail.wi.mit.edu>
Subject: brewpub info wanted

HBDR's,
I am fairly new to the homebrew digest and have found it to be a very useful
source of information with regards to brewing and beer drinking in general.  I
am going to be doing some traveling soon and thought that I would try to get a
list of interesting brewpubs, breweries, and the like to visit when on
vacation.  I am going to be in the following areas:  Long Island, NY; Phoenix,
AZ (and possibly in Mexico and surronding regions); Seattle, WA (and possibly
in Canada or nearby areas).  I know of some places like Bandersnatches (???) in
Phoenix and I've heard that  brewpubs are fairly common in Seattle.  I was also
interested in visiting a malting company someone mentioned recently that is
near Seattle or possbily in Canada???  Any info that you can give me would be
greatly appreciated.  Thanks.
 -Mark Merchant

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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 13:46 EST
From: Jack Skeels <0004310587 at mcimail.com>
Subject: Help with a BIG KEG....

Greetings, and please advise,

A friend of mine has told me that he has two 1/2-bbl kegs (15.5 gal).  they
are both the type that has a protective(?) rim on both ends, the top has
handle cut-outs, and they appear to be SS.  The tap consists of a twist-lock
handle unit. The valve in the keg can be removed with only slight ingenuity.
It looks like you fill and dispense from the same general opening; fill with
the valve removed, and dispense with the valve in place and the tap
attached.  Is there a name for this type of keg?  

I told him that the *only* way that I could brew a batch that large was to
convert one of the kegs to a brew pot ;-)  He said okay!  I read in a
previous post that a circular saw with the appropos blade will work to cut
the top off; tho my now-best-pal-in-the-world wants to use his cutting
torch.  

Question #1:  Should we cut, rather than melt, to reduce embrittlement?

Question #2:  Is this the right "kind" of keg to convert?  My guess is yes,
as the bottom protective ring looks like it would tend to hold the flame in
rather nicely.

As far as actually brewing the batch, I'll be doing a partial mash, and will
top off the batch with some water (as I can't boil more than about 14 gals I
think).  Is there somebody who can give me a few pointers as to how to do
this whole thing?  Like, is there some easy way to ferment the batch as a
whole?  Can I use the keg somehow?

I'm really excited at this opportunity, but really scared of hosing a $50+
batch of beer.  Any and all replies will be appreciated.  If I get a nice
set of information, I will put a BIG KEG INFO file on the archives.

TIA and happy brewing,

JACK SKEELS
JSKEELS at MCIMAIL.COM

        "Say NO to the balkanization of HBD!"




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Date: Tue, 03 May 1994 09:48:32 -0400
From: WKODAMA at aba.com
Subject:  Priming With Cane Sugar

A couple of weeks ago Jeff Frane posted about priming with cane
and brown sugars as alternatives to the usual corn sugar.

Last night I cracked open a bottle of East Kent Goldings ale I
primed with cane sugar.  Great carbonation; thick, frothy head;
and head retention all the way to the bottom of the glass.  And,
if I may say so myself, great taste (no, there wasn't any dreaded
sugary cidery lurking in there either).

If one can speak after only one batch, I would recommend cane
sugar as a primer.

Wesman
wkodama at aba.com


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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 16:06:00 EST
From: Herstl <herstl.psych at office.mmc.org>
Subject: beginning to brew

can you please help me get started with some info about the home
brewing process. i promised some friends that I would bring my
own to their next October Fest.  Many thanks.


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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 16:16:39 EDT
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: spices

I guess because it's not a brewing magazine, Randy couldn't include
his usual advice on actually USING spices in making beer.  The method
that I remember for easily spicing beer, and adjusting the quantity
goes like this:

Steep some of the spice in a pint of vodka for a week.  Then pour a
measured amount of your ready-to-be-bottled beer into a glass and
start adding the spice tincture a drop or two at a time, until you've
got the desired spicing level.  Then scale up the amount to 5 gallons
and add that amount to your whole batch.

=S

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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 15:25:04 -0500
From: jay_weissler at il.us.swissbank.com (Jay Weissler)
Subject: More Water questions

Bradd Wheeler.  asks
>Does anyone out there know where I can find similar breakdowns of  
waters...

Hopes this helps. Measures should be ppm

 Ion	Pilsen	Munich	Dublin	Dortmund	Burton
Ca	7	70-80	115-120	260	260-352
SO4	5-6	5-10	54	283	630-820
Mg	2-8	18	4	23	24-60
Na	32	10	12	69	54
Cl	5	1-2	19	106	16-36
(H)CO3					
Nitrates					
THM					
pH					

 Ion	Milwaukee	Halifax	Dartmouth	London	Winnetka
Ca	35	13	4.3	52	34.8
SO4	18	10	2.8	77	113
Mg	11	0.6	0.01	16	10.7
Na	?	4	3.8	99	5.2
Cl	5	6.7	8.6		11
(H)CO3		28	3	156	113
Nitrates		0.05	0.05		0.27
THM		0.05	?		 

pH		?	6.2		7.9

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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 14:47:42 MDT
From: "Mark B. Alston" <c-amb at math.utah.edu>
Subject: CTSP vs Clorine & TSP and other ramblings

First my question:

	I am quite confused about the differences between using CTSP
(clorinated Tri Sodium Phosphate) and straight Clorine bleach with
TSP.  I have read in many sources that bleach will corrode stainless
steel but that CTSP is much safer.  Why?  Is it simply a matter of
lower concentrations of clorine in CTSP than most homebrewers use
straight?  Moreover, I have heard that the chemical manufactures use
stainless steel vats to make their products in.  So, what exactly is
the deal with clorine.  Can I really use CTSP safely on my stainless
kegs.

	I know that alternatives exist such as Idophor but I have just
purchased a 0.5 Micron filter system and am trying to figure out the
best way to sanitize it.  (Please no anti-filter comments, I have
never used one myself and don't need to hear the advice of others who
have also not used one.  I belive that one should try everything
before writing it off.)  I can't use boiling water (my favorite
method, it's soo cheap :) and am worried about using Iodine because of
the staining which will occur.  The method suggested to me from Cliff
at Braukunst is to force a solution of CTSP through it and into the
dispensing keg to clean and sanitize the whole works.  But, I am
nervous about using a clorinated product in my kegs.  Any info from
those using a filtering system will be appreciated.

Now some general blabering:
****
We have heard plenty of good reasons about why we shouldn't split the
hbd but I would like to add my voice to this.  DON'T SPLIT THE HBD!!!
****
I have recently started fermenting in stainless steel kegs.  I *love*
it.  You don't have to worry about keeping it out of the light.
Racking it from the fermenter to the dispensing keg is simple and does
not require siphoning.  And I can get my hand down into the keg to
scrub it out.  Much easier than using a bottling brush on a glass
carboy.

One suggestion I would make to those thinking about such a setup is to
not cutoff the end of the out tube from the fermenter.  Simply get
youself a brass endcap and a short piece of tubing and make a capped
tube about 1.5" long.  Then file some V shaped groves on the bottom of
the out tube and place the brass tube over the out tube in the bottom
of your keg as seen in this sidways ascii drawing:
               ___________
________________________ |
________________________<|
               __________|

The V groves allow the beer to flow when the cap gets sucked onto the
tube and the 1.5" tube keeps you from sucking up the yeast which has
settled on the bottom of the fermenter.

In this way you can still use the keg as a serving vessel by simply
removing the brass tube.  Using a cutoff tube relegates that keg to
always being a fermenter.  

For more info read the Gadgets special issue of Zymurgy or email me
with your questions.
*****

Finally, how many of us are going to Denver for the conference?  I
registered on the last day of the reduced prices (April 29).  I am
looking forward to it and am wondering if there will be many hbd'ers
there.  
*****

Enough for now,
Another Mark brewing behind the Zion curtain.

Mark Alston
(c-amb at math.utah.edu)

P.S. my damn spell checker is screwed up.  So pardon all my
     mistspelings



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Date: Tuesday,  3 May 94 15:50:29 CST
From: LLAPV at utxdp.dp.utexas.edu
Subject: party pigs / where to put that carboy

Howdy!

In HBD 1414, Todd says he got a Party Pig for his birthday.  Since I fessed
up a couple of weeks back that I like mine, I'll pipe up some suggestions.
First, put it together first (without the pouch) in a practise run.  The
clamp can be tricky if you're not sure what you're doing.  When you do put
your beer into it, & you pump up the pump, a little beer may fizz out of the
sides of the red button.  Don't worry; I've had no problem with this.  Just
realize that you probably have enough pressure in there by then.  Finally,
let it carbonate at whatever temp you carbonate your bottles at.  If you
chill it right after sealing it, the yeast will go dormant & won't do their
magic.  At risk of starting another sterilization arguement, I use iodophor
to sanitize my pig.  Oh, one more thing!  Go light on the priming sugar!  My
Pale Ale I put into there was mighty foamy!  There isn't enough pressure in
there to carbonate your beer, but there is enough to make a difference.

In the same HBD, Don want's to know where people put their carboys.  Since I
live in Austin, Texas, where basements are an anamoly (yeah, I've been in a
basement, once), I put the fermenting carboy in my bedroom closet.  It's
best in the winter, when the closet itself is about 67 degrees.  In the summer,
it gets up 85 in there (w/ the a.c. on), so that's when we resort to the
brewing fridge.  I stuff a towel or something under the door to block out the
sunlight.  If the temp starts moving up too much, I'll open the door at night
to let in the cooler air.

Pax limex,

Alan of Austin

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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 14:51:29 MDT
From: "Mark B. Alston" <c-amb at math.utah.edu>
Subject: Re: Sweet Homebrewed Beverages

Try steeping some crystal malt (1 lb or so) in about 1 gal of 160 deg
F water for 30-60 min before boiling.  Strain the liquid into your
boiling kettle and brew on.  The Crystal malt has quite a bit of
unfermentable sugar in it and will carry through to the final product.

Mark Alston
(c-amb at math.utah.edu)



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Date-Warning: Date header was inserted by SERV02.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
From: John_Shepardson.esh at QMAIL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (John Shepardson)
Subject: Re: Wyeast Problems

Hello Brewtheren,

I normally post to rec.crafts.brewing, but would like to make my
hbd debut now.

I had a very strange Wyeast problem recently that I just have to
get off my chest.

I popped a Wyeast Belgian White (3944) into a starter a few
weeks ago and streaked some out onto a petri dish for future
brews.  After 24 hours I had no activity in the starter.  Since
it was brew day I decided to go ahead and use it.  This is because 
I am fortunate enough to be an all grain brewer, and the yeast
had the privilege of a good 6 to 8 hours of extra growth before
pitching.

I smelled the yeast just before pitching and it was unusually
sulphery.  Not terrible, but not too good.

After 24 hours - No action in the fermenter.
I looked at the petri dish - no growth.
After 48 hours - same thing.  This was very unusual.
On the third day the fermenter was still on strike but the petri
dish was a bit cloudy. I was not relaxed.
So I brought the dish into work and had a microbiologist friend
look at it.  Under the microscope we saw absolutely no yeast.
It appeared to be a pure culture of a rod shaped creature with a 
6 to 1 length to width ratio that wiggled around as it floated in
solution.  He said it was way to big to be bacteria and that it
reminded him of an aspergillus culture he was looking at recently.

I was really flabbergasted.  After 50 brews with Wyeast cultures,
and minimal contamination problems, this was a real shocker.
Luckily I had a 5 gallon batch of ale to rack and poured a gob of
slurry into my Belgian ale.

Other facts: The pack was dated Feb 26 (or 24) 94.  I bought it the
day it arrived at the brewshop and kept it refrigerated for two
months.  The loop was flamed and the dish was clean before use.
The starter solution was not in question as the dish was
inoculated directly from the Wyeast pack.  There was not one single
solitary yeast cell on that dish.

With my luck, this will probably turn out to be the best Belgian
Ale I ever made, but will never be able to repeat it!


John Shepardson           |   "Brewed according to nature's receipt"
                          |   ( Hoegaarden 6-pack literature )

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Date: Tue, 3 May 94 19:15:31 EST
From: t_aylesworth at lfs.loral.com
Subject: Wyeast questions


I plan to start using liquid yeasts in some upcoming brews and have a
couple of questions.  First, I plan on getting the most out of the yeasts
by using a technique mentioned in the Yeast FAQ.  It suggests, essentially,
brewing a small batch and bottling it into six bottles.  Then, when ready
to do a real batch, place the yeast from one of the bottles into a starter
and, when it is ready, pitch the starter.  Any comments on this technique?

Second, and more importantly, which yeast(s)?  I only brew ales, and I
want to use yeast that will work fairly well over a wide temperature
range.  I looked through a small Wyeast flyer from my local homebrew store,
and two caught my eye.  The Wyeast Irish (1084?) looked like a good one
for somewhat malty beers - sweet stouts and scottish ales.  And the Wyeast
American (1056?) looked like a good one for general purpose ales.  Does
anyone have any comments on these yeasts?  Are they somewhat forgiving
about temperature fluctuations?  Anyone want to take a stab at trying to
describe taste characteristics?

Thanks in advance!


- -------------------------------------------------------------------
Thomas Aylesworth                     |  t_aylesworth at lfs.loral.com
Space Processor Software Engineering  |  
Loral Federal Systems, Manassas, VA   |  (703) 367-6171



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Date: Tue, 03 May 94 18:53:32 pst
From: wyatt at Latitude.COM
Subject: Easymasher and Irish Moss

        I recently purchased an Easymasher and decided to try it out.  I 
     must admit that when I recieved it I was a little aprehensive because 
     it looked a little hokey, the filter part was a stainless steel screen 
     as I expected but it was just wrapped into a tube and folded over at 
     the end.  The seam on the side just kinda hung out there and it was a 
     lot smaller than I expected.  I decided to put it on my 8 gal enamel  
     pot instead of my 25 gal Stainless pot.  I brewed two 7 gal batches 
     and mashed them both using the Easymasher.  It did pretty well and the 
     only problem I had was that I kept hitting the screen part and 
     eventualy bent it even though I tried to avoid doing so.  Even so, the 
     Easymasher still worked with no problems other than my being slightly 
     annoyed about bending the screen.  I used Irish Moss in the first 
     batch and didn't in the second.  I didn't really notice any difference 
     and the Easymasher didn't clog but it didn't filter out the trub any 
     better either.  Irish Moss does make a difference though and the trub 
     definatly coagulated and settled to the bottom of the fermenter in the 
     irish moss batch as well as clearing the wort significantly.  I have 
     used irish moss off and on in the past and the wort clears better with 
     it.  One question that I have is that if most of the proteins are 
     taken out, will the beer suffer during the aging process of lagers?  I 
     understand that the tannins and proteins react during the aging 
     process giving a cleaner brew and in the process keeping the yeast 
     alive(I read something about this in Noonans book "Brewing Lager 
     Beer). If the proteins and lipids are reduced and a decoction mash is 
     employed, will the tannins remain tainting the beer?  In a fresh beer, 
     I can see a definite plus with irish moss but I am not so sure about 
     the cold aged ones.
     
     
                                                        Thanks
     
                                                        Wyatt

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Date: Wed, 04 May 1994 15:51:09 +1200 (NZST)
From: RICK ZYDENBOS <ZYDENBOSR at INVERMAY.CRI.NZ>
Subject: HELP!!!  OLD MEAD REFERENCE


I am searching for an article that either Charlie Papazian or Michael
Jackson wrote on a commercial meadery here in New Zealand.  If I recall
it was in an old version of Zymurgy but not 100% sure.  If someone
could help me with this I would be incredibly grateful!!  It mentions a lot
of the pitfalls he overcame in his first 20 years of brewing mead and
I don't want to repeat them.

Many thanks in advance!!

Rick Zydenbos
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Date: Tue, 03 May 94 10:27:43 PST
From: jim_robinson at ccmailsmtp.ast.com (jim robinson)
Subject: Wasted space?


I'm donning my Flame Retardant (TM) suit and here comes my 2 
cents.  Clang.  Regarding the individuals that feel they have 
their own idea on the content and format of the HBD, "Grow Up".  
The HBD can and should accommodate the needs of Homebrewers... 
Beginners and Advanced.  There are a number of ways that people 
expand their knowledge base about brewing.  The newbie brewers 
tend to ask the same basic questions, OVER and OVER, the more 
advanced brewers are usually very accommodating, helpful, and 
understanding.  The more advanced brewers tend to learn by 
engaging in *LIVELY* discussions.  After a major flame session , 
I'm sure that the "participants" spend a bit of time researching 
their position (ie..obtaining napalm) before responding.  I 
personally find these "discussions" to be informative and 
entertaining.  So.. Beginners keep on asking stuck fermentation 
questions and Advanced homebrewers keep on "discussing" the pH of 
Boston Whaler bilge water. 

To the person with cheese floating in his beer, try it on a Ritz 
cracker, "Everthing goes on a Ritz"   

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Date: 	Wed, 4 May 1994 04:44:43 PDT
From: MBige.Roch817 at xerox.com
Subject: re:Sparkling cider, kegging

Corby:
Chances are, you will soon have a big mess on your hands.  Unless you used
champagne corks and wire hoods to keep them on,  your corks will soon pop out
of the bottle and spill your precious drink.  I believe one of the reasons for
standing the bottles on end is in case of explosion.  If you use champagne
corks, the fit is so tight that you won't have to worry as much about keeping
the bottle on it's side (especially since you probably will not be aging this
stuff for 10 years).  I've followed the same recipes from "The Art of Wine" to
make champagne with success.  My bottles however, were capped with bottle caps.
Good Luck.
 -Bigs (Rochester,NY)

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Date: 4 May 1994 04:54:14 U
From: "OAKQM3" <OAKQM3 at oakqm3.sps.mot.com>
Subject: RESIPIENT SERVER IS DOWN

Mail*Link(r) SMTP               Homebrew Digest #1415 (May 04, 19
!!!! Original Message >= 24K; See following enclosure. Preview follows !!!!


HOMEBREW Digest #1415                        Wed 04 May 1994


        FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
                Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  Metals usage in Brewing ("Palmer.John")
  A/B vs SA (LLAPV)
  Anti-homebrew ads, courtesy of A-B ("J. Andrew Patrick")
  Chest Freezer Taps (Glenn Raudins)
  More info on HydraPure Valves ("Palmer.John")
  Testing beer for toxic nasties (tims)
  Can't tell if fermentation is through (Daniel Neil Roberts)
  Re: #SAVING WATER WITH A WORT CHILLER (repiii)
  separate beer digests -- Just say NO! (Jack Skeels)
  Recipe request for Courage (Kevin Mceachern)
  Ascii Art (npyle)
  Heineken recipe request (Roger Grow)
  Hunter Airstat (Bill Rust)
  All grain question/Beer-related activities in Boston (GONTAREK)
  Extract Kit HBU's ("Little, David")
  Wyeast Hangover (Rich Larsen)
  homebrew volumes, mothers, dry yeast... (Jeff Frane)
  Sparkling cider, kegging (Corby Bacco)
  Spices/light protection/newbies go gonzo (Jeff Benjamin)
  Chemistry/Spices (Reid Graham)
  Pete's Wicked Ale/Just a new guy (Jeffrey S Walls)
  Thermostat for heat & cool (Bob Jones)
  Conserve Water while cooling. (rnarvaez)
  Appropriate yeast for Barleywine? (TATTERSH)
  Conserve Water while cooling. (rnarvaez)
  spruce beer recipes? (FIGURAP)


Send articles for __publication_only__ to homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
  (Articles are published in the order they are received.)
Send UNSUBSCRIBE and all other requests, ie, address change, etc.,
  to homebrew-request@ hpfcmi.fc.hp.com, BUT PLEASE NOTE that if
  you subscribed via the BITNET listserver (BEER-L at UA1VM.UA.EDU),
  then you MUST unsubscribe the same way!
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
FAQs, archives and other files are available via anonymous ftp from
  sierra.stanford.edu. (Those without ftp access may retrieve files via
  mail from listserv at sierra.stanford.edu.  Send HELP as the body of a
  message to that address to receive listserver instructions.)
Please don't send me requests for back issues - you will be silently ignored.
For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at novell.physics.umr.edu


- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: 2 May 1994 13:36:41 U
From: "Palmer.John" <palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com>
Subject: Metals usage in Brewing

Hello Group,
In response to yesterdays post by Terry for welding/Joining info and other
current issues concerning our brewing metals, I offer the following
compilation on zymurgical metallurgy.

*Steel*
The stainless steel most used for Food related applications is an austenitic
stainless, 304.  304 is non-magnetic, weldable, and used extensively for
kegs.

The stainless used for Good pots (like Vollrath) is usually also 304.  Other
stainless kitchen stuff, like utensils and some pots, will be ferritic
stainless,
which does not have Nickel in it (or not much) and is less acid-neutral.

What makes a steel Stainless?
The alloying addition of Chromium (and Nickel) create a significant
percentage of those atoms at the surface, where they form tenacious oxides
which seal the surface and prevent further oxidation. Anodizing Aluminum
alloys is the same idea, creating a solid aluminum oxide barrier to further
corrosion. Anodized (black) aluminum cookware, (Magnalite, Calphalon) is
acid neutral / acidic food resistant, like stainless steel, because of this
heavy
oxide layer.  Plain (bright) aluminum cookware does not have the degree of
surface oxides necessary to prevent reaction with acids.

*Brass*
Brass is an alloy of Copper and Zinc with some lead thrown in for
machinability. The lead percentage varies, but for the common brass alloys
found in hardware stores, it is 7% or less.  Lead is entirely soluble in
Copper.  Therefore it does not have a high propensity for leaching out of
brass.  Jack Scmidling posted yesterday about the lab results on beer made
with his Easy Masher (tm) system which is indeed a worst case scenario for
wort exposure to brass, because his practice is to let the hot wort remain in
contact with th
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Date: Wed, 4 May 94 9:14:15 EDT
From: terfintt at ttown.apci.com (Terri Terfinko)
Subject: Hot Liquor Tank

I have built a hot liquor tank from a keg using
an electric water heater element mounted in the
side about 2 inches from the bottom.  The tank
also has a thermometer mounted half way down
the side.  In general the tank works great, 
except for the temperature differences between
the top and bottom of the tank, usually 10-20
degrees.  I was surprised to find how stratified
the temperature layers were.  I am constantly
stirring or recirculating the water.  One thought
was to install a circulator pump.  I have found
that this is a bit pricey.  A bronze bodied pump
for 250 degree ratings costs over $100.  Any
advice on how to easily get the water temp evened
out would be appreciated.  Has anyone found a
reasonably priced pump?
    
     Terry Terfinko - terfintt. at ttown.apci.com

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Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 06:33:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: krpratt at netcom.com (Kevin Pratt)
Subject: American Micro Brews

I am a BJCP judge (certified).  I am certainly no expert, just an avid and 
often brewer and beer drinker.

I have begun noticing that among pub and homebrewers that the biggest 
beers are often perceived as their best beer.  Many brewers attach a 
phenominal amount of energy towards high gravity, high alcohol brews and 
measurements of hops in metric ton increments.  The topic of Barley wines 
and Bocks get far more coverage than ordinary bitters or pilsners, IMHO. 

I understand that some of it has to do with these beers being rare and 
expensive as commercial examples, but I see a trend in it.

I've travelled to a large number of brewpubs, but recently had a chance 
to sample beers on tap at an English style pub.  The beers I had were 
Fuller's ESB, Courage, and Guinness.  These are the very types of beers 
that inspired me to brew in the first place.  They were fresh, but did 
not have the oomph or sparkle I remember and now associate with micro- 
brews.

I don't think their taste has changed, but my perception has.

Recently, I have heard judges relate to benchmark beers like Bass, 
Newcastle and Guinness as watery, insipid and undrinkable.  The 
preference is for fuller bodied beers, that are delicious, but are at the 
extreme top of style if not over.  This indicates that our collective 
judgement of "balance" is changing to something that is much different.

A friend of mine made the observation that this may be an extreme 
pendulum swing away from the budmilloors and that the further the flavor 
and texture is, the better.

While I do like full bodied beers, I don't want to continue on a trend 
where the winning stout is the one that tastes like espresso with alcohol, 
or the winning light ale is hopped enough to be used as cologne. 

I would like other brewers comments on this.

Kev.

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Date:     Wed, 4 May 94 9:23:36 EDT
From: "Darren L. Ward" (FSAC-FCD) <dward at PICA.ARMY.MIL>
Subject:  Hard vs. Soft H2O

	I'd like to know if there's been a consensus made regarding brewing
using soft or hard water.  Which will provide the best product?  Does it
make sense to use bottled water if your tap water seems fine?  Should I cart
water from my parents house where they have a softener for their well water?
If the differences are minor, that information is appreciated as well.

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Date: Wed, 4 May 94 09:36:26 EDT
From: dipalma at sky.com (Jim Dipalma)
Subject: RE: Wyeast Hangover


    Hi All,

    In HBD#1415, Rich Larsen continues the discussion of Wyeast Scottish:

>Perhaps it is the yeast itself.  The effect went away after about a week
>more in the keg.  In short the yeast settled out.  I would suspect that the
>concentration of the yeast in suspension from your "secondary" sample, would
>be as high or higher than my impatient tapping of the keg.

    I suspect it does have something to do with the yeast.  I was going to
post, asking about the flocculation characteristics of this yeast.  After
8 days in primary, I racked to secondary and left it for another 18 days.
Despite the lengthy secondary, the beer was quite cloudy at that point, it
seems to be a very poor flocculator.  I should add the wort was crystal
clear going into the fermenter.
    I placed the keg in a fridge at 40F, figuring that a period of cold
conditioning would help settle out the yeast.  After about a week, I tapped
it.  The beer had cleared considerably, I consumed a pint, and felt fine the
next day.

    Rich continues:

>>Then Coyote Writes :
>>
>>But really- Hops are know to induce sleep.  You can drink a hop tea, or stuff
>>a pillow with hops to help insomnia- I mean to reduce, eliminate...make sleep!

>It may be that the higher concentration of hop components in young beer may
>cause the effect also?  I really don't think it would have enough influence
>to maintain over through most of the next day.  Also more commonly higher
>hopped beers would cause this problem.

    I don't think hops have anything to do with it, either. This beer was
hopped very lightly in accordance with the style, I estimate 22 IBUs.  Also,
the IPAs I brew are ~1.060 and very highly hopped, and I don't experience
this effect.
    The seeming poor flocculation and "sleepy time" effect aside, the yeast
did produce a slightly smoky/peaty flavor and a bit o' diacetyl, makes a
very nice Scotch ale indeed.  Comments?

       Cheers,
          Jim

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Date: Wed, 04 May 94 09:57:44 EDT
From: efrainm at aol.com
Subject: Honey Priming

I use honey extensively in my brewing, I love the crisp, herbal flavor that
honey adds to my beer. I've used honey several times to prime. I reccomend
that you use 3/4 cup not 1/2, a half cup seems to leave the beer somewhat
under carbonated. Make sure to boil the honey for 5 - 10 minutes. Most
important of all expierement all you want, after all that is the reason
homebrewing is such a fun hobby. 

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Date: Wed, 04 May 1994 10:00:29 -0500 (EST)
From: Doug Lukasik <LUKASIK_D at sunybroome.edu>
Subject: Beginners Strange Brews

In HBD 1415 Jeff Benjamin notes that many new brewers are making "strange" 
brews and wonders why.  Perhaps like myself they realized that their is a 
very large world of beer out there that they had never experienced before and
want to jump right into it.  Perhaps it is due to drooling while listening
to the more experienced brewers discussing some of the same strange brews.

As a brewer that began in December 1993 I have personally completed 14 batches 
of brew (12 ales, 2 lagers), have brewed the first from a kit, the next 8 from
extract only, and the last 5 as partial mashes, and have experimented with all 
kinds of adjuncts.  The range in alcohol goes from 3.5% to 10% (a dopple bock 
that ended up being a barley wine - quite good actually), and there are a total
of 10 styles completed.  Part of the reason in brewing different styles was to 
find the brew that I would truely enjoy....the other part was that I started to 
sample all sorts of commercial brew and then just *had* to try and brew one 
that was similar.  All in all I have found that I really love robust porter and 
pale ale - after three attempts I am extremely close to having a great clone of 
Anchor Liberty Ale (side by side they are hardly discernable), batch 4 ought 
to be the match.

To suggest that new brewers stick to the basics because the art of brewing is
so complicated is like suggesting that when learning to cook we should stick to 
boiling hotdogs because the use of spices is to tricky.  Playing with recipes
and trying out new avenues is part of what teaches a new brewer how to brew 
better beer.  It also allows us to find a style that we like and then modify it
to suit our tastes just like the experienced brewer does.  In addition, those 
of us with NET access have all you HBDers to help us out when we run into 
trouble.

Finally I would probably agree that not all new brewers end up brewing a batch 
every week, month after month, but some of us really get involved very early 
on.  Next fall I am planning the move to all grain brewing, expanding my lager
styles (still in search of that perfect beer for me), and continuing my ale
brewing adventure.  With experimentation also comes a few failures (I have 
actually contaminated a batch with metal (luckily we drank most of this one
green before it manifested itself) and have a very disappointing Olde Ale 
that even my experienced brewing friends don't know what is wrong with).  But 
I beleive it is from our failures and furthered experimentation that we learn 
to better our brewing and ultimately our drinking pleasure.

(Of course all of this could just be my own personality quirk as I also got 
43 chickens a month ago (nothing like starting small) and am actually 
contemplating brewing "Cocks Ale" ;^)

Good brewing, better drinking,

Doug.  <lukasik_d at sunybroome.edu> 

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Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 06:57:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: gummitch at teleport.com (Jeff Frane)
Subject: Barleywine yeast

Bob Tattershall writes:

> I am about to attempt my first barleywine. It appears that some pitch just an
> Ale yeast, others pitch a Champagne yeast, while even others pitch an Ale
> yeast and then later pitch a Champagne yeast in the same batch. What is the
> proper procedure? What are the advantages of any one method over the other?
> 
In my extreeeeemely humble opinion (Frane's famous Uriah Heep
impression), the correct yeast for barleywine is a healthy ale yeast.
The important factors are alcohol tolerance, very high pitching rate,
and high rate of aeration at pitching.  I've found that most of the
commercially-available ale strains work well enough (Wyeast's 1056 is an
example) and that the most successful method is to first brew a
normal-gravity ale and then either pitch fermenting beer or the entire
volume of yeast from the bottom of the ale fermentation.

Bear in mind that a barleywine shouldn't finish bone-dry, but also
shouldn't end up at 1035!  You might also bear in mind that one can
produce a mighty fine barleywine without starting out at 1.100.  You are
more likely to get positive results (and avoid sickly sweet, unfinished
beer) if you start at around 1.090.

- --Jeff


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Date: Wed, 4 May 94 10:21:07 EDT
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: Thermostat for heat & cool

Hmm.  How about a 3PDT switch to cut out the unused side of the
thermostat?  Like this:



               thermostat  +o\       heater        SPDT switch
			   |  \
                   o-------+  |\o-/\/\/\/\/\/--------o  heat
                   /       	                      \
                S /         o |- - - - - - - - - - - - \ S       S=swinger
 AC Hot ---|-----o         	                        o-------
                            o\|                                |
                              \                                |
                   o-------+   \o----[ frig ]--------o  cool   |
                           |                                   |
                           +o                                  |
AC Neut ---|----------------------------------------------------

Of course, 3PDT switches rated for fridge-type loads aren't so easy to
come by.  But it would be safer.  

=S

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Date: 4 May 1994 07:38:27 U
From: "Palmer.John" <palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com>
Subject: Mashing Breakfast Cereal

Am I out of my mind?! Well, popular opinion aside, I have been wondering about
this. Mashing breakfast cereal that is. So far my candidates are Grape Nuts,
Cheerios, and of course Quaker Oatmeal. Captain Crunch w/ Crunchberries could
be considered for a specialty beer I suppose. 

Seriously, I have heard that the Quaker Instant Oats are easier to convert than
the Old Fashioned, for making Oatmeal Stout (or Oatmeal Porter in my case).
Would Grape Nuts- the all-natural wheat and barley cereal, be mashable? Might
it lend a "crunchy, nutty" flavor? And would Cheerios give a Toasted Oat
flavor? How about Wheaties or Rice Krispies? This might be a good way to get
rid of all those extra boxes in the cupboard that nobody will eat.

Its something to think about. What's Science if you don't push the envelope?
palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com   OR
palmer#d#john.ssd-hb_#l#15&22#r# at ssdgwy.mdc.com



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Date: Wed, 4 May 94 7:38:38 PDT
From: MRS1%CRPTech%DCPP at bangate.pge.com
Subject: Chest Freezers

	I'd like to add one more post about Glenns querry on converting a 
chest freezer to accomidate a beer tap. I have an old Sears chest freezer that 
I just converted this weekend. What I did was remove the cheapo plastic handle 
insert and lock from the lid of the freezer. This allowed access into the lid.
I then drilled a hole into the plastic inner lid liner and routed my 
dispensing line up into the lid and out the rectangular hole where the handle 
used to be. I then attached the line to the tap which is fixed onto a piece of 
wood large enough to hold a drip tray. The whole mess is attached to the lid.
By mounting it this way it takes up little space in front, and does not cause 
a clearance problem when lifting the lid.

		------------------------------|__
			Lid		      |	|
                                       ____--------X-\Tap
		                      /    ---------\ \
		---------------------/--------| |
		                    /	      | |
				   /	      | |Mounting Panel		
				Line in	      | |
					      | |
					      |-----------Tray
					      |
					      | Freezer front
		
Marty Sanders
mrs1 at pge.com

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Date: Wed, 4 May 94 9:43:00 CDT
From: Mark Youman <marky at admin.stedwards.edu>
Subject: scotch ale in decline

My extract based Scotch ale is 3 months in the bottle 
and the taste is going downhill.  I'm noticing a 
substantial amount of trub-like stuff at the bottom 
of the bottles that pours out into the glass if I'm 
not careful.  This stuff was *not* present when the
beer was at its prime (2 months in the bottle).

Is it flucocolated yeast?

Is this the cause of the unpleasant metallic-like 
flavor that has developed?

e-mail or post  very appreciated

mark



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Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 10:51:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: Henry E Kilpatrick <hkilpatr at mason1.gmu.edu>
Subject: corking sparkling cider

Re: Corby's question on corking sparkling cider:

The first thing you need to do is to obtain champagne style corks and the
wire attachments (I don't know what they're called) that secure the cork
to the bottleneck.  Plastic "corks" from a home winemaking shop will work. 
Real cork needs to be soaked in water before going into the bottle.  I am
not familiar with capping procedures for champagne with real corks, but it
is likely that you will need a special capper.  Unless the procedure has
changed recently, the plastic corks can be inserted by hand.  After you
secure the cork with the wiring, you can store the bottles on their 
sides.  Also, note that you need champagne bottles instead of regular 
wine bottles or the wiring will not hold. 

When bottling uncarbonated wine or cider, you should leave the bottles 
upright for a day or two in case
there is too much pressure in some of the bottles.  If any corks rise, 
you replace them.  After that, bottles should be stored on their sides 
until a day or two before you drink the wine.   

If you use regular corks instead of wine corks, don't use the the wire 
attachments, use regular wine bottles, and store your sparkling cider on its 
side, you will probably lose most of it unless you consume it before there 
is much pressure buildup in the bottle (although, maybe you could keep it 
refrigerated at fairly low temperatures).  

Buddy Kilpatrick  hkilpatr at mason1.gmu.edu

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Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 10:51:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: Eugene Sonn <eugene at sccs.swarthmore.edu>
Subject: firestone kegs

Hi to all you in HBD land,
	I threw a party this past week and served a local beer 
(Yuengling).  The beer came in firestone kegs, which despite being quite 
beat up, worked better than any sankey kegs I've used.  I've been 
pondering buying/not returning a keg in the near future to put homebrew 
in.  Does anyone have an good/bad experience with firestone kegs?  I know 
firestone taps are harder to find, but they seem to keep a seal better 
because they screw on rather than slip on.  Thanks in advance.

Eugene
eugene at sccs.swarthmore.edu

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Date:     Wed, 4 May 94 10:51:23 EDT
From: Steven W. Schultz <swschult at cbda9.apgea.army.mil>
Subject:  Barley in the Ancient Near East

An archeology student that I know thru the "net" has requested information on 
the uses of barley for brewing in Near East.  He knows all about the agricultur-
al uses of barley, its place in commerce, etc., but he wants information on 
brewing.  The best I could do for him was to refer him to The New Complete Joy
of Home Brewing by Papazian.  Anyone out there who can help, please send me
private posts.  Thanks in advance for your assistance.

Steve Schultz

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1416, 05/05/94