HOMEBREW Digest #1624 Fri 06 January 1995

Digest #1623 Digest #1625

		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

  attenuation/carbonation: what happened to it? (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
  New Brew Pub (t.duchesneau)
  Propane cookers (TPuskar)
  Using honey (M_MACADAMS)
  Kegging and Sanitation (CC21B) RUST" <CCMAIL.PRUST at A50VM1.TRG.NYNEX.COM>
  U Brew opening in Chicago (Paul Sovcik)
  BJCP EXAM and PREP SESSIONS (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
  pH 4.01 reference solution ("Christopher V. Sack")
  Brewing With Rye (Fred Waltman)
  Brew clubs in Seattle. (Jason Petteway)
  Beer Software for Windows (Ben Piela)
  Water Analysis ("KEVIN FONS Q/T BPR X7814)
  Leaky 5liter keg tap (Scott Walls)
  Boy, is my face red!  Sorry (uswlsrap)
  Coyote ("Julie Cody")
  HSA / Rye / Brewsack / Icebocks ("Palmer.John")
  kegging and dispensing pressure ("KEVIN A. KUTSKILL")
  water chemistry (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
  "Microwave" (molloy)
  Boston<tm-not> Beer<tm-not> (uswlsrap)
  Lager yeast with stout (DONBREW)
  Pilsner Urquell (Michael McGuire)
  bitterness loss in blowoff/starters (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
  Inverted Fermenters (M. Blind, Man of Vision)
  temperature controllers (Dan Sherman)
  Brown Malt (Bob Jones)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 4 Jan 95 19:50:00 GMT From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) Subject: attenuation/carbonation: what happened to it? Lenny writes: >Subject: prematurely attenuating cider >Well, after 6 days SG was 1.045 and the bubbling has slowed down >considerably. This means 5% alcohol, 6% to go. I expected the >fermentation to be vigorous until at least 80-90% of the sugar was gone, >not 50%. Is this destined to be a very, very sweet 5-6% alcohol cider? >Is there any reason why champagne yeast should be better than cote des >blancs wine yeast? First of all, I think you may be misusing the term "attenuating." Perhaps what you meant to say is "prematurely expiring yeast." Attenuation is a measure of the percentage of sugars that a particular yeast will eat. An attenuative yeast will tend to eat bigger (more complex) sugars in addition to the simpler sugars that all yeasts can eat. Also, while different yeast strains have different tolerances for alcohol and different attenuations, oxygen plays an even more important role than yeast strain. If you simply plunk a package of virtually any yeast into a poorly aerated batch of 1100 wort, you'll be lucky if the gravity makes it down to 1050. However, if a big yeast starter is made (like 2 to 3 liters - -- yes, you can pour-off the spent starter wort, if you wish) and the wort is WELL AERATED, then you can expect the final gravity to be more like 1030 or even 1025 with some yeasts. Now, I don't know much about cider or mead, but I *do* know that if you aerate apple juice, it oxidizes and turns brown. I believe that some cidermakers add ascorbic acid (vitamin C) to prevent this, but it seems to me that this would be counter-productive to a good fermentation -- the ascorbic acid would take oxygen out of solution and away from the yeast, no? So what should we do? How can we give yeast the oxygen they need without aerating the juice? Answer: aerate the starter... A LOT! You can do this with multiple feedings of your starter yeast, each time pouring off the spent wort after the yeast have settled and then adding more, cooled and aertated wort. Another way to do it is to crop the yeast from a previous batch of beer/cider/mead, but it is recommend that yeast from high-alcohol ferments not be reused (according to brewers like Sierra Nevada, high-alcohol ferments have lots of mutations and thus they never reuse the yeast from their Bigfoot Barleywine or Celebration Ale batches -- I believe that Celebration has an OG of 1066, so that gives you an idea of what they believe is a high-alcohol ferment). ********** Steve writes: >The bottles have good carbonation at room >temperature and if quick cooled in the freezer for 20-30 minutes. If the >bottles are left in the freezer for 40+ minutes or left in the refrigerator >overnight the beer is totally flat. This is a matter of physics. More CO2 will dissolve in colder beer than in warmer beer. If you get it too cold, when you open the bottle, the beer will be undercarbonated. 3/4 cup of corn sugar should be enough to provide decent carbonation even at 40F so perhaps some of your caps poorly sealed and this was just a coincidence? Or could it be that you conditioned (let sit to carbonate) the beer at too cold a temperature? If so, then warm it up and give it a few more weeks. Could you have shocked the yeast (i.e did you immediately stick all the bottles into the fridge after bottling and then later pull them out after remembering that you needed them to carbonate)? If so, then again, warm up the bottles (65-70F) and give them a few weeks for the yeast to revive and carbonate -- it may help to give the bottles a shake every couple of days to resuspend that shocked yeast). Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 95 11:05:00 UTC From: t.duchesneau at genie.geis.com Subject: New Brew Pub I posted this to the GEnie Zymurgy Roundtable a couple days ago and decided that it might be of interest here also: I just realized that I hadn't posted anything about my Christmas eve discovery. I was having a brew or two at the Vermont Pub & Brewery in Burlington that afternoon and talking to the guy next to me. I mentioned that I was going to my sister's in Stowe and he asked if I knew about the new brew pub there at The Shed, a popular restaurant that burned to the ground about a year ago and had recently re-opened. That evening found me the only one at the front bar at The Shed, so I got to talk to the bartender while I sipped at my sampler. They had four of their own ales, a golden, a pale, a brown, and a winter. In addition, they had ld Thumper and Blue Fin Stout from Shipyard Brewery in Portland ME. All six were excellent - I think the house Winter was my favorite. The bartender told the brewmaster that I was there and after he finished his dinner, I got a personal tour of the brewery. The mashing and cooking are done at bar level, the rest of the brewery is in the basement. They have a 7 barrel capacity and ferment open using Ringwood yeast. If you're going north skiing, this is definitely worth a stop. ...Tom Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 07:47:01 -0500 From: TPuskar at aol.com Subject: Propane cookers Thanks to everyone who replied to my request for info on propane cookers. I rec'd more than 20 Emails and several posts. The consensus of opinions of users is that these things are the greatest things going for homebrewing--right behind hops & yeast. No one who has tried them seemed to badmouth them. A few people mentioned that burner control sensitivity could be improved upon. Just about everyone agrees that they should not be used indoors without substantial ventilation. Ventilation systems ranged from two or more open windows to fans with open windows. There are apparently a lot of garage brewers and back porch brewers as well. Bottom line is as long as you use them close to outside and with plenty of airflow and ventilation, they are great additions to a home brewery. Thanks again to all who replied. I'll be buying one next trip to Sam's Club. It's 18 degrees F with a wind chill of -8 here in Jersey today so I think I'll mess up the kitchen one more time. ; - ) Happy brewing, Tom Puskar Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 1995 09:03:22 -0500 From: M_MACADAMS at Mail.Co.Chester.PA.US Subject: Using honey Hello, I am considering using honey in an upcoming brew and was wondering how much to use and when to use it. What I would like is to add a little honey flavor to a lager, I'm not really interested in increased alcohol content. Should I add the honey instead of priming sugar or is it best to add it to the wort? If I add it instead of priming sugar, should I make and boil a honey-water mixture before adding it to the beer to avoid contamination? Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks, Mike Return to table of contents
Date: 05 Jan 1995 08:38:08 GMT From: "PETER (CC21B) RUST" <CCMAIL.PRUST at A50VM1.TRG.NYNEX.COM> Subject: Kegging and Sanitation I have acquired an old refrigerator, converted it to a "beer-fridge" and started to keg my beer. I have a few questions on sanitation. How often must I clean the beer-out line and faucet. I use the faucet once or twice during the week and daily on weekends. I have noticed that beer dries up inside the faucet during the week. I have beer line cleaner that I plan to put into a spare keg (when I get one) and drive through the beer-line and faucet with CO2. Any other suggestions on how to keep the system clean or how frequently to do this procedure? Has anyone had an infection develop in the dispensing side and migrate back into the keg? Also, I would appreciate feedback from anyone who has purchased kegs from the ad in the magazines: 5 gallon reconditioned kegs for $29.95 - 1-800-YOUR KEG, or recommendations for other suppliers that can provide near-perfect-condition kegs. Feel free to E-Mail or post your response. Thanks Pete Rust ccmail.prust at nynex.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 95 10:05:49 CST From: Paul Sovcik <U18183 at UICVM.UIC.EDU> Subject: U Brew opening in Chicago In regards to U Brews: There will be a U Brew opening in Chicago in late January. Apparently it will be located in one of the more "upscale" neighborhoods in Chicago (Lincoln Park) and will be brewing 15 gal batches starting at $85 or so. No affiliation.... Im not even sure I'll be a customer... -Paul Paul Sovcik Chicago Ill pjs at uic.edu Return to table of contents
Date: 5 Jan 95 16:19:00 GMT From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) Subject: BJCP EXAM and PREP SESSIONS Chicagoland area BJCP Certification Exam and associated Prep Sessions BJCP Certification Exam Sunday, February 12th, 1995, starting at 12 Noon, at Lion's Head Ale House (13301 South Olde Western Avenue, Blue Island, IL) Preparation Sessions (choose one): Wednesday, January 11th, 1995, from 7pm to 9pm ***OR*** Wednesday, January 18th, 1995, from 7pm to 9pm at Sheaf & Vine Brewing Supply in Countryside, Illinois (western burb of Chi). For more info, please call: 708-430-HOPS, evenings or weekends. Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 12:06:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Christopher V. Sack" <cvsack at mailbox.syr.edu> Subject: pH 4.01 reference solution I read in the last issue of HBD, that a 0.5M solution of potassium hydrogen phthalate (PHP) gave a 4.01 pH reference mixture. This is not quite correct. It should be a 0.05M solution. This works out to 10.21g of PHP per liter of distilled water (or 1.021g/100mL). Most chemistry and biology labs should have the compound. For those who are worried about chemicals in their kitchen, the Merck Index gives the following info on phthalic acid (PHP + HCl, ie. stomach acid) Human Toxicity: Moderately irritating to the skin and moucous membranes. LD50 (orally in rats): 8.0g/kg (or about 600g for a 165lb human) Christopher Sack, Homebrewer and organic chemist Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 09:28:03 -0800 (PST) From: Fred Waltman <waltman at netcom.com> Subject: Brewing With Rye Robert Mech askes about brewing with rye: Both flaked rye and malted rye are available at many homebrew shops. Last fall I made a beer with malted rye. The receipe was 40% malted rye, 60% pilsner malt, 1 oz Hallertau (5%?) pellets for 60 min, Wyeast 1056. I purposly kept things "bland" to let any rye character come thru. The result was interesting. It was very much like a wheat beer, but with a little "spice" in the background. I have been meaning to try it again with more rye and maybe a wheat yeast, but have not had time. On another subject if anybody has recommendations on a cheap (but clean!) place to stay in Dusseldorf or Cologne, please email me. Ditto for beer sites not mention in Micheal Jackson (or for that matter, places to avoid). Thanks in advance. Fred Waltman Culver City Home Brewing Supply Co. waltman at netcom.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 09:32:55 -0800 (PST) From: Jason Petteway <jasonp at u.washington.edu> Subject: Brew clubs in Seattle. I am a relative newcomer to homebrewing and am getting ready to bottle my third batch. I would be really be into getting together with other homebrewers in the Seattle area, either formally (as in a brew club) or informally (as in getting together with others and drinking). Both would be great since I am sure I could benefit from other brewer's experience. Thanks alot Jason Petteway UW Dept. of Urology jasonp at u.washington.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 95 09:26:41 EST From: ben at fcmc.com (Ben Piela) Subject: Beer Software for Windows Hello all fellow homebrewers, In the issue of Zymurgy magazine featuring Special Ingredients and Indigenous Beer, I noticed three advertisements for Beer software for Windows. Since I have just purchased a PC and I am still in that purchasing mood, I was wondering if anyone has had any experience with any of the packages and maybe wouldn't mind ellaborating on those experiences either to the digest or to my personal email. The packages are 1) Brew Master from Abita Software in CA for $39+$3P&H 2) Brewer's Calculator from Regent Software in CA for $39+$3P&H 3) Brew Wizard from ANTROM Associates in MD for $59.00+FREE P&H All three products of features such as Recipe Formulation for many styles of brewing, Inventory Databases, Batch Logging, and "Much More!" Any and all info will be greatly appreciated. Thank you very much, Ben Piela ben at fcmc.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 1995 11:45:05 -0500 (CDT) From: "KEVIN FONS Q/T BPR X7814 <KFONS at china.qgraph.com>" <KFONS at china.qgraph.com> Subject: Water Analysis Hi,=20 Here is the water analysis information for Milwaukee, WI. Where = do I start? I brew ales for the most part (everything from Weiss to Stout= ), however, I will be brewing Lagers soon. My beer is mainly extract wi= th some grain added. I haven't been able to locate Millers book yet, so any = help would be appreciated.=20 Thank You, Kevin Fons <KFONS at QGRAPH.COM> - ---------------------------------------------------------------------= - --- HOWARD AVENUE PURIFICATION PLANT (Milwaukee Wisconsin) 1993 TYPICAL SANITARY CHEMICAL ANALYSES IN MILLIGRAMS PER LITER Water is purified using Chlorine Gas Determination Physical Color Units=09=09=09=09=091 pH=09=09=09=09=09=097.50 Residue 103 - 105 C, Filterable =09=090 Residue 103=97105 C, Nonfilterable =09=09160 Residue 103 - 105 C, Total =09=09=09160 Specific Conductance, micromhos/cm =09=09250 Taste Units Temperature F =09=09=09N=20 Temperature F=09=09=09=0950 Threshold Odor Units Turbidity N.T.U. =092 Turbidity=09=09=09=09=090.1 Chemical Alkalinity, Total*=09=09=09=09107 Aluminum=09=09=09=09=090.03 Carbon Dioxide (Free) =09=09=098.1 Chlorides=09=09=09=09=0916.0 Chlorine Residual, Total=09=09=090.92 Copper=09=09=09=09=090.01 Fluoride=09=09=09=09=091.10 Hardness, Calcium*=09=09=09=0996 Hardness, Magnesium*=09=09=09=0947 Hardness, Total*=09=09=09=09143 Iron=09=09=09=09=09=090.04 Langelier Saturation Index =09=09=09-0.49 Manganese=09=09=09=09=090.01 Nitrogen, Ammonia=09=09=09=090.20 Nitrogen, Nitrate=09=09=09=090.47 Nitrogen, Nitrite=09=09=09=090.001 Nitrogen, Organic=09=09=09=090.26 Oxygen, Dissolved=09=09=09=0911.0 Soluble Phosphate as P=09=09=090.01 Silica (SiO2) =09=09=09=091.91 Sodium=09=09=09=09=097.0 Sulfate=09=09=09=09=0926.2 Sulfide=09=09=09=09=09--- Total Phosphorus as P=09=09=09=090.02 Zinc=09=09=09=09=09=090.03 *As Calcium Carbonate=20 (+) Tendency to Form a Deposit=20 (-) Tendency to Corrode Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 95 14:04:26 EST From: walls at e7sa.epi.syr.ge.com (Scott Walls) Subject: Leaky 5liter keg tap In the past there has been some discussion in HBD on the 5 liter kegging systems that are available. I have a friend of mine who has one of these systems and it leaks. When dispensing beer the tap leaks at the base and makes a puddle of beer on top of the keg. He has the metal tap (supposedly the top of the line)a. Some questions I have are: 1.) Are these systems used to dispense only and not store beer? 2.) Anyone had a problem with a leaky tap? 3.) Should you avoid opening the CO2 Regulator all the way? Can this damaage the tap and cause it to leak at lower pressures? 4.) Could he be doing anything wrong that would cause this? He has gone through 2 taps now and they both leak. Any helpful suggestions or experiences would be appreciated. Thanks, Scott Walls walls at e7sa.epi.syr.ge.com Brewerton, NY --near Syracuse Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 1995 14:33:05 EST From: uswlsrap at ibmmail.com Subject: Boy, is my face red! Sorry - -------------------- Mail Item Text Follows ------------------ To: I1010141--IBMMAIL From: Bob Paolino Research Analyst Subject: Boy, is my face red! Sorry Yesterday, I asked about what I thought was a long since abandoned thread about starting a high gravity brew with one yeast, and then pitching Champagne yeast in secondary to finish the job. I wondered how one would do that given the obvious problem with oxidation. If you were to do it, you'd need a pretty big starter, but how big? Well, I didn't find an answer to the "how much" question, but when I was reading through one of the accumulated HBDs that piled up while I was out of town for the holidays, I noted a related question, to which Jim Busch suggested NOT doing it except as a last resort, that you certainly shouldn't PLAN to do it that way. The lesson, of course, is to keep up on your reading before hitting the keyboard after an absence. Sorry. Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino / Disoriented in Badgerspace /uswlsrap at ibmmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: 5 Jan 1995 14:03:06 U From: "Julie Cody" <jcody at acadresources.mda.uth.tmc.edu> Subject: Coyote Minimalist Mail Coyote What's happened to John Wyllie (aka COYOTE)? It sure would be nice to have some of that ol' anarchy and humor again... Julie Cody jcody at acadresources.mda.uth.tmc.edu Houston, Texas "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." -- Hunter S. Thompson Return to table of contents
Date: 5 Jan 1995 12:28:41 U From: "Palmer.John" <palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com> Subject: HSA / Rye / Brewsack / Icebocks Hi Group, James had unfortunate luck with HSA this past batch and wondered why. The cause was right there in your procedure James. You added cold water directly to the Hot Wort. The water contained dissolved oxygen; whether you pour hot wort in cold water or vice versa, the result will be the same. Cool the wort first before diluting and you won't have that problem. *** Rob Mech asks about Rye: There is a pretty complete article on using Rye in the Sept/Oct 1993 issue of Brewing Techniques. (Havent used it myself). *** Doland got a Brewsack for Christmas: My brother in law made one last year and said it was good (dubious-JP). I would say that your best bet is to watch your fermentation temperature. Keep it in the low to mid 60s, as you really dont know what kind of yeast it is. Don't get your hopes up. Those things are a real comprimise of all the brewing processes. *** Eric had a similar experience with his lager freezing on him. If you let it thaw, it should be okay. I am probably going to force carbonate mine, so I wont be worrying about tired yeast for carbonation. I also considered krausening it with an active starter of the same yeast culture. That would probably be a good idea if you cant force carbonate. *** John J. Palmer - Metallurgist for MDA-SSD M&P palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com Huntington Beach, California *Brewing is Fun* Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 09:44:12 PST8PDT From: <IAN at cppus.com> Subject: BAKED BEER? Fellow Homebrewers: I am having a problem driving enough heat through my wort to get a nice full rolling boil. Right now, I am short on cash and I am not able to buy a "King Kooker" or similar unit. So, my question is: "can I put my kettle (enamel on steel) in the oven and bake the wort? If I can, is there a temperature I should be shooting for?" TIA for your input. E-mail is fine but highly discouraged. BTW, the HBD has been a great help to me in every facet of my brewing education. Keep up the wonderful dialogue. ***************SOLI DEO GLORIA, even beer******************** Return to table of contents
Date: 05 Jan 95 17:02:40 EST From: "KEVIN A. KUTSKILL" <75233.500 at compuserve.com> Subject: kegging and dispensing pressure Here's a problem for the collective wisdom of the hbd experts-- What is the correct dispensing pressure for my kegged homebrew? I have a cornelius keg and a new regulator/gauge set-up (so I know the pressure is right). I am using the picnic tap for dispensing. With the style of beer that I have been drinking lately, I force carbonate with a pressure of 16 PSI at 44 degrees for 3-5 days, which carbonates the beer perfectly. However, if I dispense the beer at this pressure, I get a mug of foam :-( If I dispense at a pressure of 3-4 PSI, it dispenses perfectly--but the beer gets flat if left at that pressure. Am I condemed to blowing off CO2 from a pressure of 16 PSI down to 4 PSI, then re-pressurize back up to 16 PSI everytime I want a homebrew? TIA, Kevin Kutskill, Clinton Twp, MI 75233.500 at compuserve.com Return to table of contents
Date: 5 Jan 95 20:24:00 GMT From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) Subject: water chemistry Jim writes: >My understanding is that the number for total hardness is comprised of the >temporary hardness and permanent hardness. The former is that which is caused >by the presence of carbonates and can be removed by boiling, whereas permanent >hardness is due to the presence of sulfate and cannot be removed by boiling. Not quite. My knowledge of water chemistry is not as strong as I would like it to be, but there are some things of which I'm quite sure. Permanent hardness is primarily from the calcium and the magnesium in the water. The fact that calcium is most often added by brewers (and most often occurs) as Calcium Sulphate (Gypsum) is why "hard water" is usually high in sulphates. However, high sulphates are not really "desirable" (unless you are trying to brew Burton Ales), and acidifying with acids (lactic, phosphoric, acid blend, etc.) or adding calcium via Calcium Chloride is probably a better choice for all but making Burton-style Ales or, if memory serves correctly, Dortmunders. >BTW, you cannot use gypsum to acidify *sparge* water. It works in the mash >due to a reaction between the calcium and phosphorous that is naturally >present in the grain (I'm a little fuzzy on the details of this reaction - >somebody help me out here), but will not work when added to water. I'm fuzzy here too and would like someone to clear this up. I was under the impression that adding calcium (as Gypsum or as Calcium Chloride) indeed does not "acidify" the water (i.e. it does not add H+ ions as true acidification would), but rather buffers it and keeps the pH low. My understanding is also that carbonates have a very strong ability to lower the pH and thus simply adding gypsum to high-carbonate water will not lower pH, nor will it keep the pH from getting too high. >Here I must disagree. My first few attempts at pale ales using this type of >water had a horribly harsh bitterness. I eventually traced the problem to >high carbonate levels and hopping levels that were appropriately high for >the style (30-35 IBUs). Are you sure Jim? Consider that Dublin water is very, very high in carbonates and that Guinness is quite highly hopped (50 IBUs comes to mind, but don't quote me on this) and is certainly not harshly bitter. I believe that the flavour effect of carbonates in beer is to reduce the sourness that can occur with dark malts. >The hardness in the water at Burton-on-Trent, home >of the pale ale style, is due to high *sulfate* content. The sulfate content >of the water emphasizes hop bitterness and flavor in a clean, pleasant manner. Hmmm? Again, I'm not sure I agree. The hardness in the water of Burton- on-Trent is due to the calcium and, since this apparently comes from Gypsum in the ground, the sulphate levels are correspondingly high. I do love the beers of Burton-on-Trent and agree their bitterness is different from that of a Bohemian Pilsner, which is made from very soft water and high hop rate, but I would say that the difference is more in how the hop bitterness fades in the finish. In a low-sulphate beer, the bitterness ends quite abruptly whereas in a high-sulphate beer, the bitterness extends into a long, dry, lingering finish. This seems a good time to post the results of my query on acid and CaCl2 additions, but I'll break it up into two posts, cause this is already too long. Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 16:36:10 -0500 From: molloy at tcpcs3.dnet.etn.com Subject: "Microwave" I had my third batch of Brew go bad and decided that all the time I had spent making it justified my not being relaxed any more! I had heard recently that a microwave oven will kill bacteria in womans underpants who have yeast infections. Yes it is stupid but true. So what does this have to do with Beer? I use the quick clean methods of sterilization so any easy extra methods I can do, help. After a quick bleach wash I use the microwave to sanitize hard to clean parts like spickets, hoses, hose ends, etc... My last two batches have been outstanding! Thank you. *** WARNING *** Do not cook to long, parts will melt, trust me! P. Molloy Kalamazoo MI. "Newcomer to the Net" Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 1995 17:41:42 EST From: uswlsrap at ibmmail.com Subject: Boston<tm-not> Beer<tm-not> - -------------------- Mail Item Text Follows ------------------ To: I1010141--IBMMAIL From: Bob Paolino Research Analyst Subject: Boston<tm-not> Beer<tm-not> Okay, here I go at the keyboard again without having read all the back issues from December, but here goes--an answer to the question about the BBC v. BBW case. First, you really don't have to go to Boston to do the research--any law library will do. But for those of you too lazy to do even that, here's the citation: 9 F3d 175, decided 16 Novembeer 1993. BBC went to U.S. District Court to get an injunction against BBW, was denied, appealed to U.S. Court of Appeals, First Circuit, which affirmed the lower court ruling. What BBC wanted was to prevent BBW from using the words "Boston" and "Beer" in the names of their products on the grounds that it was similar to those used for BBC products and would confuse and mislead the public. The courts both said that the use of the words was not distinctive and not entitled to trademark protection. One interesting note in the case was a survey of two different groups of beer drinkers asked to identify whether various products were made by the BBC (the other group was asked about BBW). Both groups responded in similar numbers which might appear to support BBC's case were it not for the within group differences. 36% correctly identified "Samuel Adams" as a product of the BBC (a similar percentage in the other group recognised it (incorrectly) as a product of the BBW. But note that only 4% identified "Boston Ale" as a BBC product. Not very distinctive, eh? The court also noted the use of the name Boston Beer Company in advertising is much less prominent than "Samuel Adams," "Best Beer in America," et cetera. Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino / Disoriented in Badgerspace /uswlsrap at ibmmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 18:27:45 -0500 From: DONBREW at aol.com Subject: Lager yeast with stout >- > >Date: Wed, 4 Jan 1995 09:06:33 -0500 >From: sematkos at mailbox.syr.edu (Steve Matkoski) >Subject: Lager yeast with Stout? > >Hi, >Has anyone tried doing this? It is very cold up here right now and >I wanted to brew up a nice stout. I cant keep the temp in the house >steady enough for ale yeast, I thought maybe I could try a Lager >yeast. What do you think? > > -steve. I had the same idea back in November, I now have a nice looking 1.089 "super" stout almost ready to bottle. It was also my second attempt at doing a real lager, so I'm not expecting spectacular results, the first was just bottled last week, so I don't know about it either. Don donbrew at aol.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 95 17:53:18 CST From: mcguire at hvsun21.mdc.com (Michael McGuire) Subject: Pilsner Urquell HI, 2 3 I've got some basic questions that I have been 4 unable to answer with the archives. I bought Pazaian 5 and Miller's books on HB. Up until now, I've been only 6 brewing ales. But, now with cool weather I'm attempting a 7 Pilsner Urquell style lager. First, where can I order Laaglanders 8 pale extract(miller is rather specific)? I've heard that 9 Alexanders extracts are not suggested in pale beers? 10 11 I thought using the Bohiemian (wyeast) would be 12 the way to get the slight diastatic flavor(archives suggest it is 13 one of the four? Pilsner Urquell yeasts), but Miller suggests 14 2308. Also when the net discusses Pilsner Urquell as being 15 lagered for months, what do you guys mean. Does the PRIMARY 16 fermentation 17 take months or are you letting it sit in the secondary for 18 months?? I was thinking to subsitute 6.6#Briess golden extract for 19 the Alexanders and Laaglanders, use Boheimian lager yeast with *Lots* 20 of Saaz hops(bittering, finishing,dry hopping). Will this give 21 me the 22 results I'm after?? 23 24 Best Regards 25 Michael mcguimp at vpcs.msfc.nasa.gov Return to table of contents
Date: 6 Jan 95 00:17:00 GMT From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) Subject: bitterness loss in blowoff/starters Please excuse the untimeliness of these topics, but I ran across them at times when I was behind in my reading and wanted to make sure that 20 people had not already beat the topic to death. Norm writes: > Another question: Mark Garetz contends that the hop resins that get pushed > to the top of the krauesen during fermentation become oxidized and insoluble, > so that even if they fall back in the wort they are lost in terms of > their bitterness contribution. I don't quite understand this, as it seems > that by the time high krauesen occurs, the environment in the top of the > fermenter should be quite oxygen-free. Any comments? I asked Mark about this in private email, months ago, and I believe, if I recall correctly, Mark's assertion was that the oxygen was coming from the wort itself and not from the headspace, which answers Norm's question, but does not explain why there is a significant difference in bitterness between blowoff and non-blowoff batches. I am not able to be any more specific at this time, but there is an article in an upcoming Zymurgy that will provide more details on quantitative analysis of blowoff versus non-blowoff beers. *************** Steve writes: >When someone says, '...a 2 qt starter...', are they referring to the total >volume of the starter or the volume of the dregs that are harvested/collected >and pitched. They are referring to the total volume of the starter. To build up 2 quarts of yeast slurry would be quite a feat for a homebrewer! ************ Jim writes: >People have been giving a lot of useful anecdotal information about using >yeast starters recently, but it's less useful than it might be. A "one >quart starter" doesn't tell all: >What was the OG of the starter? To first approximation, a 1.020 starter >allows half as much total yeast growth as a 1.040 starter. Is a one-quart >1.040 starter equivalent to a two-quart 1.020 starter? There are conflicting opinions both on HBD and in the literature as to what the proper OG should be for a starter. To summarize the two sides of this debate, those who prefer to use 1.020 worts for starters do so to avoid stressing the yeast in the starter -- i.e. not asking too much of them; just giving them lots of O2 and some food and not asking them to create a 5%abv environment. Those who believe in higher-gravity starters argue that it is better to let the yeast grow initially in an environment similar to that they will be expected to perform their main job. Mind you, it has been mentioned recently in HBD that high-alcohol ferments tend to increase mutation. Therefore, even the high-gravity starter supporters usually only use 1.040 or 1.050 worts. I theorize that perhaps a hybrid of the two methods would be best: start with 100ml of 1.020 wort, stepping up to 500ml of 1.030 wort, then finally 2L of 1.040 wort on the way to a 1.050 or higher main wort. Since we're on the topic of starters, let me mention that some brewers like to use hops in their starters for their antibacterial properties. It is true that hops do inhibit some bacteria (some strains of lactobaccilus, for example), but do nothing to others (like pediococcus cerevisiae or acetobacter). Personally, I don't use them. >Was an airlock used on the starter? Aerobic and anaerobic growth of >starters give different results. (Brewers Resource suggests aerobic >growth with their yeast starter kit, with only a sheet of aluminum foil >over the top of the flask. Others have suggested anaerobic growth.) I use a glass airlock on my starters so I can pressure-cook it along with the flask and the starter wort (don't try this on a plastic airlock!). Yeast Propagators, used by commercial yeast growers, have aerators in them, I'm told, as well as incremental feeding (possibly similar to the scenario I've mentioned above) so the yeast are indeed grown aerobically. Covering the top of the flask with aluminum foil will not, I'm afraid, result in aerobic yeast growth since as soon as CO2 begins to be produced, it will purge out the air whether you cover the flask with an airlock or foil. No, to provide aerobic environment for the yeast in the starter, you need some kind of active air or oxygen injection system and it had better be sterile air or oxygen. Personally, I believe that as long as you aerate your starter media well initially, I don't think you need to mess around with aeration during fermentation. Incidentally, I use 1.030 unhopped wort made from Munton and Fison plain light dried malt extract and make up a 500-750ml starter for lower gravity ales (below 1.050) and a 1-2L starter for higher gravity ales (above 1.050). For lagers, double these amounts would not be overkill. For gravities above 1.090, I think even a 4 liter starter would not be too big (yes, you can pour off the spent wort), and in fact, the slurry from a lower gravity 5-gallon batch would be even better. Just a reminder about pitch timing, according to an article in the ASBC Proceedings, the proper time to pitch a starter is just AFTER the yeast has settled. See back issues of HBD for a summary of the article -- search for "glycogen." Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 20:18:16 -0500 (EST) From: gtd862a at prism.gatech.edu (M. Blind, Man of Vision) Subject: Inverted Fermenters I'll keep this short... What I would like is some sort of info on inverted fermenters, like how to build one with a minimum of equipment or cash expenditure. What I'm looking at is some way use my 5-gal carboy in this design... would it be stupid of me just to flip the sucker over? I know this topic has popped up every now and then, I guess I was just unconscious or drunk at the time. Private e-mail is fine. If others are interested, I'll post the suggestions and my own design here later. TIA, Matt - -- | "What'll you have, Norm?" M. Blind | "Fame, fortune, and fast women." gtd862a at prism.gatech.edu | "How 'bout a beer?" | "Even better." -normism Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 18:03:42 -0800 (PST) From: dsherman at sdcc3.UCSD.EDU (Dan Sherman) Subject: temperature controllers I was looking for a temperature controller about a month ago & did a search of the 1994 HBD. Here are the model numbers of temperature controllers I found in several posts: Honeywell #T6031A 1029 Johnson Controls #A319ABC-24-01 Grainger #2E834 Dayton #2E399 I found the Honeywell and Johnson Controls temperature controllers at a local heating/cooling wholesaler. They were both about $35. Both have temperature ranges from less than 0 degrees F to around 100 degrees F. Both have adjustable temperature differentials. I decided on the Johnson Controls unit for 2 reasons: 1) The temperature sensor is connected to the unit by a wire, not a copper tube, so it is much easier to run under the refrig. door gasket & place the sensor wherever I want. The instructions say that the sensor can be run up to 800ft. from the unit!! The 8ft. sensor wire supplied is good enough for me. 2) The lowest differential setting is 1 degree F, where the lowest setting for the Honeywell unit is 3.5 degrees F. I hopes this helps. Dan Sherman San Diego, CA dsherman at ucsd.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 1995 19:53:26 +0800 From: bjones at bdt.com (Bob Jones) Subject: Brown Malt >I recently bought 10lbs of Hugh Baird Brown Malt to use in some ESBs? and >Porters. Does anyone have some idea of typical amounts to use for a five gallon >batch, assuming 1.050 and the use of 2 Row as a base Malt? 1/2 lb? 1? 2? 5?? > >Thanks! >John J. Palmer > Watch out for this stuff John, the general experience several of us around here has had is user beware. The malt has an interesting flavor profile if its kept subtle in Porter and Brown Ale recipes. I'm talking about less than 1 pound in 10 gallons. Some brewers in my homebrew club pushed the usage up to several pounds and the flavors were pretty unpleasant. There is also a problem with haze formation when using this malt, so you might restrict yourself to darker styles. I use about a pound of it along with chocolate malt and a little black patent for color, in a 10 gallon Porter and I really like the result. Good luck, just sneak up on the quantity to use. Bob Jones bjones at bdt.com Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1624, 01/06/95