FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  cheap water pump ("Ted B. Simpson")
  Advanced Brewers course in DC (sadvary)
  Please remove me from your mailing list (Neil Pruchansky)
  Seattle area Brewpubs/micros (Mark Evans)
  Re: "Jurassic Beer" ("Thomas Aylesworth")
  Hop family tree/ CP's OG calculations (Gary Bell)
  Refrigerator trouble (JTFinnell)
  St. Louis, hot-cold Breaks (HOMEBRE973)
  Wort Pump (dsanderson)
  RE:phenols and unitanks (Jim Busch)
  brewing (KALLMON)
  brewing Soda Pop questions (dbrigham)
  Wort Pumps (Bryan Dawe)
  Annual HVHB Homebrew Competition (Greg Holton)
  flaked rice (PRYBAK)
  Constant Stirred Mash / stains / chiller pump / Miller Celis Deal / acid washing (Rich Larsen)
  CLUB ADDRESS UPDATES--Is ZYMURGY listing correct for your club? (uswlsrap)
  4th Central ILL HBC Results (Tony McCauley)
  "Free" carboys/Freezing yeasts (TPuskar)
  pellet dryhopping/"stuck" ferment/magnetic SS/hop tree/DMS yeast (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
  Holy Bananas (as I recall) (Tim Fields)
  Re: Flat beer (Dave Coombs)



******************************************************************
* NEW POLICY NOTE: Due to the incredible volume of bouncing mail,
* I am going to have to start removing addresses from the list
* that cause ongoing problems. In particular, if your mailbox
* is full or your account over quota, and this results in bounced
* mail, your address will be removed from the list after a few days.
* 
* If you use a 'vacation' program, please be sure that it only
* sends a automated reply to homebrew-request *once*. If I get
* more than one, then I'll delete your address from the list.
******************************************************************
 
Send articles for __publication_only__ to homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
  (Articles are published in the order they are received.)
Send UNSUBSCRIBE and all other requests, ie, address change, etc.,
  to homebrew-request@ hpfcmi.fc.hp.com, BUT PLEASE NOTE that if
  you subscribed via the BITNET listserver (BEER-L at UA1VM.UA.EDU),
  then you MUST unsubscribe the same way! 
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
Please don't send me requests for back issues - you will be silently ignored.
For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at novell.physics.umr.edu
ARCHIVES:
  An archive of previous issues of this digest, as well as other beer
  related information can be accessed via anonymous ftp at
  ftp.stanford.edu.  Use ftp to log in as anonymous and give your full
  e-mail address as the password, look under the directory
  /pub/clubs/homebrew/beer directory.  AFS users can find it under
  /afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer.  If you do not have
  ftp capability you may access the files via e-mail using the ftpmail
  service at gatekeeper.dec.com.  For information about this service,
  send an e-mail message to ftpmail at gatekeeper.dec.com with the word
  "help" (without the quotes) in the body of the message.


----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 07:06:32 -0700 (MST)
From: "Ted B. Simpson" <tsimpson at du.edu>
Subject: cheap water pump

Two quick things: First, the best source for a cheap water pump (free, in 
my case) is old dishwasher pumps. They are stone simple pumps, designed 
to handle all sort of particulate garbage, and come complete with motor 
controller and bypass/dump solenoid if you are so inclined. I used one 
mounted under a small "table" affair with an inverted plastic carboy with 
the bottom removed to make a super immersion chiller. The carboy is the 
reservoir, ice is added (I have two brew fridges so I have excess freezer 
capacity. I freeze bricks of ice in tupperware and use it all on brewday 
to cool wort.) along with water, the pump shots it through hose to 1/2" 
copper tubing immersed in hot wort and the return water, now warm, is 
shunted aside for the first few minutes, then later water is 
recirculated, chilled by ice, and so on. The cheap pump is the heart; all 
this wouldn't be worth it if cost was high. This pump is designed to chew 
up food, so ice chips don't phase it. Frankly, I can't find any 
drawbacks-just use a GFI to safety yourself, and don't pump any fluid 
that will ever be consumed by humans-these pumps come really fouled with 
years of spooge!

Second, I also made a counterflow chiller (wanted to use a hopback, so 
immersion was out) of hose, male adapters, and non-valved "Y" fittings. I 
forgot who mentioned this earlier, but great and beery minds must move 
together, because this system works cheaply and well. One thing I did 
find out was that you can use plastic washer nozzles (just a cheap cone 
of plastic sold for washing walks and so forth and available in the lawn 
and garden section of the hardware) as the thimbles (?) for the 3/8" 
copper where it exits from the "Y". Drill the nozzle out almost to size, 
use a tapered reamer to slowly remove plastic until copper is a tight 
slip fit through nozzle. Slide nozzle over tubing, screw onto "Y" and all 
done. I didn't even have to silicone it. No leaks.

This counterflow chiller is being hooked up to the recirculating ice 
water pump system above. I have put another "Y" in line with the water 
line from the pump through the chiller. This "Y" has valves and the other 
side flows back to the water resrvoir. The result is that I can determine 
the flow rate of ice water through chiller using a shunt bypass rather 
than a motor speed control. The pump is never overloaded and with a 
thermometer probe inline with the chilled wort I can "dial-in" the exact 
temp I want the wort chilled to prior to pitching.

Enough BW... Happy Brews to you!

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 07 Mar 95 09:11:52 -0500
From: sadvary at netmon.dickinson.edu
Subject: Advanced Brewers course in DC


Being that the Advanced Brewing course offered by the Brewers Guild is sold
out for this weekend (3/11 - 3/12) in D.C., I was wondering if there are any
folks that can't attend and wish to "sell" their slot?  I'm sure we could do
the exchange through the Guild people.

I know there are future course offered, but a friend is going down and I could
room with him and save $$$.

 -Bill Sadvary
 Carlisle, PA 
 717 245 1610

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 09:22:36 -0500 (EST)
From: Neil Pruchansky <npruchan at keene.edu>
Subject: Please remove me from your mailing list 

Please remove me Npruchan at newpisgah.keene.edu  from your mailing list.  
thanks

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 08:34:32 -0600
From: evanms at lcac1.loras.edu (Mark Evans)
Subject: Seattle area Brewpubs/micros

Hope this isn't being too redundant. (I won't be going to Anacortes or the
San Juans... although I would love to!)
I will be visiting Seattle the third week of March and want some
suggestions on Micros or brewpubs worth visiting.  Private e-mail is fine.


(and no, I will not be going on the tour of Kurt Cobain's neighborhood.)

Brewfully
Mark



Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 07 Mar 95 10:12:26 -0500
From: "Thomas Aylesworth" <t_aylesworth at lfs.loral.com>
Subject: Re: "Jurassic Beer"

Jeff Hewit (jhewit at freenet.vcu.edu) comments on Flag Porter and
Norvig Ale and asks:

>Does anyone know more about these beers?  How much is true, and
>how much is pure marketing BS?  BTW, neither appears to have
>any yeast sediment to use as a starter for "Jurassic" Homebrew.

I went to a beer dinner last November at the Brickskeller in DC 
where Alan Eames, the beer historian/anthropologist, was speaking 
about these beers.  He has something (although I'm not sure exactly 
what) to do with their now being available commercially.  The 
stories as you posted them are the same stories he told, and I have 
no reason to doubt their truth.

The yeast for the Flag Porter came from a bottle that was found in
a ship recovered from the English Channel.  The bottle was taken
to a lab, and they discovered it was beer which still contained
viable yeast.  They managed to culture it.  Eames also claimed that
the beer used a "traditional 1850" porter recipe - but really 
didn't go into much detail on how he got this.  He did claim that
his research had convinced him that the original porter was made
with beans as part of the grist - this was the only part of his
story that I found highly dubious, although I suppose it is possible.
He did say that the Flag Porter did not contain beans.

As for the Norvig Ale, that story also is as you say, and Michael
Jackson's influence has been documented by MJ in a letter to the
Barleycorn.  The Norwegian beer making tradition apparently involves
passing down "beer totems" from generation to generation.  These
totems are used to stir the fermenting beer, thus picking up yeast
(and numerous bacteria) that is added to the next batch when it is
stirred.  Michael Jackson managed to come into possession of a totem
that had been passed down for many generations, had a lab culture
the yeast, and, again, a beer was made using it.  I don't know what
the recipe is based on, but it is not very hoppy, and definitely
contains what we would now call "off-flavors", although I suppose
that they could also be described as "a rare taste of the ancient
Scandinavian ales of legend" - depending on your perspective.

It was an interesting speech, and I always enjoy reading and
listening to Mr. Eames, although I do always try to keep a healthy
dose of skepticism.  Still, he has done more research on traditional
brewing methods than anyone of whom I am aware.

As for the beers, I agree completely with your assessment of the
Flag Porter - interesting, but not exceptional and certainly not
worth the price I've seen in stores.  The Norvig Ale was complete
swill, IMO, and only interesting for the story behind it.  Now that
I have heard the stories, I don't feel the need to buy either of
these products!  :-)

- -------------------------------------------------------------------
Thomas Aylesworth                     |  t_aylesworth at lfs.loral.com
Space Processor Software Engineering  |  
Loral Federal Systems, Manassas, VA   |  (703) 367-6171


Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 07:23:42 -0800
From: gbell at ix.netcom.com (Gary Bell)
Subject: Hop family tree/ CP's OG calculations

In HBD #1673:

Don posted a family tree for hops. This is a great idea, and looks 
interesting. I'm particularly interested in the Fuggles line. Don states 
that Fuggles or Hallertauer are the root of all hops. I was under the 
impression Cluster was the oldest hop variety and was perhaps the 
ancient ancestor. I'm also wondering where all the older bittering 
varieties such as Bullion and Northern Brewer fit into this scheme.

*****
Ralph is understandably confused about Charlie's calculations of the 
contribution of successive pounds of DME to wort OG. I, too, am starting 
to wonder if Charlie is from the Delta Quadrant. Look at the table on 
Page 268 and you will find that 1 lb/gal. gives 40 points, a second 
pound adds another 30 points, the third pound adds another 40 points, a 
fourth pound adds only 20 points, and a fifth pound adds 20 points. What 
kind of strange polynomial equation predicts this kind of relationship?

DME contributes about 42 points per pound per gallon. Thus if you add 10 
pounds of DME to 5 gallons you get 42 X 10 / 5 = 84 points, giving you 
an OG of 1.084. This is what Suds calculates. Adding your 1/2 lb of 
Crystal (24 points/lb/gal) and 1/4 lb of Chocolate (20 pts/lb/gal) would 
give you 84 + 2.4 + 1 = 87.4 points (1.087). No rocket science.

Cheers,
Gary

- -- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary Bell             "Laxo, non excrucio, poto cervisia domestica."
Lake Elsinore, CA  

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 10:29:45 -0500
From: JTFinnell at aol.com
Subject: Refrigerator trouble

Hello:

***Warning - slightly off Homebrew Topic ***
 -but still related-

Our used refrigerator, circa 1975, finally died.  I would like to have a
spare refrigerator for lagering and storage of my brew.

1. Is it worth a service call to find out what is wrong, or should I just
junk the thing ?

2. Is there anything that I could check to service the thing myself ?

3. Is there a better forum/listserv that someone knows about to find out the
answers to these questions ?

TIA
private email is best.

John Finnell
Fresno, CA

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 10:50:56 -0500
From: HOMEBRE973 at aol.com
Subject: St. Louis, hot-cold Breaks

I will be in St. Louis for 5 days (Union Station Area) starting March 12, and
would be interested in brew pubs, breweries, homebrew shops,  and beer
related activities in the area.  Please reply by e-mail to save bandwidth.

Kinney Baumann  mentioned that he would hate to leave hot break in the
fermenter but that cold break was no problem.  Please correct me if I am
mistaken, but I was under the impression that hot and cold break were
basically the same thing-- coagulated proteins--, and it was just a matter of
degree or amount of break material that precipitates out with temperature
changes.

Dan McC posted a method for using a spectrophotometer for estimating hop
bitterness using isooctane and octyl alcohol.  Is it really as simple as it
sounds, and is it reproducible with worts of different colr and densities?

Thanks,
Andy Kligerman

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 07 Mar 95 10:48:19 EST
From: dsanderson at msgate.cv.com
Subject: Wort Pump


 I've been seeing allot of questions regarding Wort Pumps with most 
people pursuing Aquarium solutions.

 May I suggest a boat bilge pump. They're small, portable, plastic, 
submersible, cheap and move plenty of volume. They'll push from 450 GPH 
to over 1000 GPH depending on model. A 450 GPH version will cost around 
$20. Some are available with a built in float switch that will turn them 
on and off in the presence of fluid.

 They run on 12 VDC, use very little current and can be powered from 
battery or power supply. Could be the perfect solution.

 Dave


Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 11:06:59 -0500 (EST)
From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Subject: RE:phenols and unitanks

David asks:

<I noted with interest Jim B's comments about a low-temp rest increasing 
<the content of precursors of 4-vinyl-guaicol.  Jim, does this mean that 
<these precursors are there, but can only be made into bona fide phenols 
<provided the proper yeast is working on them (e.g. a Bavarian weizen 
<yeast)?  I ask because I really dislike phenolic flavors (yup, denying me 
<the bliss of Bavarian wheat beers) and want to be able to make US-style 
<wheats that do not have phenolics, but wish to make use of low-T rests as 
<part of my mash program.

Note that I specifically quoted Warner on this, this is where I first 
heard of it, but Im quite certain that Eric knows of what he speaks.  I
feel there are two issues going one here, the first is providing the 
required precursor, ferrulic acid, in the wort.  The second is providing
a yeast strin that can consume this and decarboxylize this into 4-vinyl
guaiacol.  This second part is the key to your question, as you noted.
Certainly, using a yeast like Wyeast 1056 in an american wheat ale (yuck!)
will not result in a phenol beer.  So, go ahead and do a low temp rest to
handle all those gums in wheat but use a clean yeast.

Kirk writes:

<I guess there was a mis-understanding somewhere (me or Jim B) regarding
the fermenter concepts.

Mostly on my end, I think!

>If you're going to this amount of effort, ditch the keg idea and go all
>out and have a ... SS sheet rolled to make the top

<By "top" do you mean the cylinder portion of the tank (vice the lid)?
<If so it sounds like you're suggesting an advantage to custom building
<an entire cc fermenter.  The idea was to have a cone added to an
<existing unit (for maybe $100) as opposed to buying a complete unit
<off-the-shelf (a minimum of over $400).  I already have the cylinder,
<why buy another one (and custom fab it, at that)?  In fact, the beer
<keg cylinder design is better than one I could have built (at any
<reasonable cost, because it already has a chine and partial keg-end at
<the top for strength, and the sides already have strengthening ribs in
<then for shape retention.  These features would easily double the cost
<of a simple rolled cylinder, eh?  What did I miss?

I did mean the cylinder part.  I dont like the idea of going to the 
effort of welding a cone onto a keg.  I guess it can be done, especially
if you are a welder or know a cheap, good one.  Just buying and rolling a
cone is not cheap. I think it is a lot better to weld to a more sturdy
and thicker sidewall than a keg.  If you use 304 SS, 12-14 guage it will
be plenty strong enough.  I just think you need to carefully consider all
the costs and then make a tradeoff decision.  Maybe if you get the welding
done cheap enough, and find a cheap way to get a cone, you might get it 
done for $200.  Id be suprised if it can be done for $100, assuming you
are paying for a welder.  Also, dont neglect to include the work required
to polish the interior welds to a sanitary finish.  If you dont do this, 
its not worth doing.  Dont get me wrong, the keg may be a great way to
go, but you might end up paying 75% of the cost of something that will 
be a better fermenter.  Also, consider a simple open fermenter made from
a cylinder, you can still harvest yeast from the top or the bottom after
you rack/keg the beer.

<I interpreted Will's suggestion (HBD #1667) to mean he wanted to have a 
<bottle in place into which the yeast/trub would collect on a *continuous* 
<basis--not just something to drain the fermenter into on a batch basis.

I dont see the advantage of this over just opening and closing a valve when
needed.  You save one fitting this way.  

Jim Busch
busch at mews.gsfc.nasa.gov

"DE HOPPEDUIVEL DRINKT MET ZWIER 'T GEZONDE BLOND HOPPEBIER!"

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 12:46:11 -0500
From: KALLMON at aol.com
Subject: brewing

I am interested in starting to brew my own beer, and was wondering if you
guys could give me some helpful tips.  Thanks

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 07 Mar 95 11:26:10 EST
From: dbrigham at nsf.gov
Subject: brewing Soda Pop questions

1)      forgive this post if it strays too far from the home brewing
        topic

2)      forgive me if I haven't managed to look in all the correct
        FAQ files and back issues

- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Some Questions on Making Soda Pop at home with Home Brewing
                            Equipment

    -   for Christmas my wife ordered me a home brewing kit being
    sold at a discount through the Damark mail order catalog.  This
    kit inlcuded the equipment needed to brew app. 3.5 gallons of
    beer - plastic fermentor, caps, capper and some canned extract
    with dry generic 'beer yeast'.  It also included a bottle of
    root beer 'extract', a package of dry Red Star yeast and
    instructions on making the root beer.  I made the root beer
    according to the instructions - basically: mix up warm water
    with sugar, add extract, prepare Red Start yeast with some warm
    water then add to mix - then bottle right away and store in the
    dark at app. 65 degrees F.  Worked great.  Now I have gone and
    purchased from a local homebrew supplier some more soda extracts
    and tried one batch, using the extract instructions (same as the
    ones with my kit) and the homebrew store guy sold me Nottingham
    dried ale yeast to use.  Well, what is happening is the ale
    yeast is 'top fermenting' in the bottles and leaving a nasty
    ring and residue at the top of the soda as well as dropping to
    the bottom of the bottles.  I have given the bottles over 6
    weeks now, some warm and some cold and the scum on the top of
    the bottles just sits there.  My original batch with the Red
    Star yeast (didn't say anything more than that on the label)
    did not have this problem - all the yeast residue ended up on
    the bottom of the bottle and I don't remember seeing anything
    at the top of the bottle during the process.  From watching my
    own ales ferment I realize this scum at the top is what shows
    up with the beer, which leads me to the question (I know - long
    winded!):

    -   should I be using something other than ale yeast (like 
    whatever that Red Star strain was)?

    -   should I be letting it do its thing in the fermenter for a
    day or two then siphon into bottles to avoid the scum?  (would
    this produce some alcohol?)

    Thanx for any and all information!!!

    Dana Brigham - National Science Foundation - dbrigham at nsf.gov


Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 11:33:36 MST
From: Bryan Dawe <bryand at gr.hp.com>
Subject: Wort Pumps


Don Put asked about wort pumps in hbd1673:

> There are a couple magnetic drive pumps listed in the Grainger catalog--one 
> made by Little Giant and one by TEEL--but both of these have "glass-filled
> polypropylene parts" that contact the liquid.

I have used the TEEL 1/25 HP magnetic drive pump listed in the Grainger
catalog to pump 200 degree F wort into my CF wort chiller for about 15
five gallon batches.  My guess is that my application is a bit more
demanding than the one Mr. Put described in his HBD article.  This pump
has performed flawlessly in every single use.  I open the pump head
(after I have rinsed it by pumping fresh water through the system)
following each use to dry it off and inspect the pump.  The pump still
shows no sign of wear.  I have no reason to think that this pump will
not serve me for fifty years.

> In the back of the catalog, there's a list of materials and their
> reactions to various liquids.  One of the liquids is beer and it
> states that polypropylene is "satisfactory to 72F" in contact with
> beer.  Now, I know that the wort's pH is higher than that of the
> beer, the wort will be chilled to about this temp, and that the
> contact time while I'm transferring the wort will be fairly short,
> so I don't think the contact with the polyporpylene parts will really
> be an issue.  Will it?

Absolutely *not* an issue.  That table has an error or two in it.
And one of those errors is in the "Beer" row.  Think about it.  What
is in beer?  Water, sugar, ethyl alcohol, some organic acids, and a
several other compounds in incredibly small amounts.  What does the
table say about water and polypropylene?  No effect.  Sugar solutions?
No effect.  Ethyl (or methyl, propyl, isopropyl, and hexyl for that
matter) alcohol?  No effect.  What about acids?  Check out acetic,
carbonic, lactic, phosphoric, sulphuric, nitric, and hydrochloric
acids.  No effect.

Check out the "Whiskey and Wines" row in that table.  No effect on
polypropylene.  Kind of makes one wonder just what was in that "beer"
that had a "Severe effect - Not Recommended (satisfactory up to 72F)"
on polypropylene.  Must have been Miller Lite.  :-)  In any event, it
isn't anything that *brewers* need to be concerned with.

The fact is that glass reinforced ("glass-filled") polypropylene is
pretty tough stuff until you put it into some seriously nasty organic
solvents, none of which are going to get anywhere near your beer.

Some other useful properties of glass reinforced polypropylene (from a 
Special issue of a Materials Engineering peridical that I keep around):

        Water Absorption (24hr):        0.02% - 0.05%
        Heat Deflection Temp:           275F  - 310F  at  66  psi
                                        250F  - 300F  at  264 psi
        Continuous Use Temp:            250F

The heat deflection temperature is the temperature/pressure combination
required to cause a permanent deformation of the material.  The 264 psi
pressure value is applicable in this application since the pump impeller
does experience quite a bit of pressure.  The moisture absorption
*might* be an issue if you were planning to use the pump continuously.
In this case there is the possibility of slightly increased pump head
wear over *years* of use.  In any event, few homebrewers (or microbrewers
for that matter) need be concerned with continuous use of their pumps.

The temperature specification on the magnetic drive pumps in the 
Grainger catalog is not there for the materials in the pump head,
but for the cooling characteristics of the *motor* used to drive
the pump.  All of those motors in the pumps are fan cooled.  Fan
cooling looses its effectiveness when you have a hot fluid flowing
past the motor housing.

Not to worry, however, the motors used to drive these pumps have
built in thermal protection.  The worst that will happen is the pump
will shut off if it gets too hot, just like your hair dryer.  Not that
this matters in Mr. Put's application since he expects to pump cooled
wort.

The pump I use is rated for use with fluids up to 180F.  I use it to
pump 200F wort for about 15 minutes when I brew.  The pump is only
starting to grow warm by the time I am finished using it.  Remember,
these specifications are written by engineers, and, for a variety of
good reasons, engineers write incredibly conservative specifications.
I should know.  I'm an engineer.

I am planning to move to a 10 gallon brew length soon.  I plan to use
this same pump in the same fashion for the larger brew length.  I have
no reason to think that it will not be able perform its job for many
years to come in this even more demanding application.

Hope this information helps someone.

Bryan P. Dawe
bryand at hpgriy.gr.hp.com


Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 14:22:31 -0500 (EST)
From: holton at kgn.ibm.com (Greg Holton)
Subject: Annual HVHB Homebrew Competition

Hudson Valley HomeBrewers,inc.
AHA Sanctioned
5th Annual Homebrew Competition

Saturday March 25th, 1995
at
River Station Restaurant
25 Main Street
Poughkeepsie, New York 12601

Schedule of Events
 8:00   River Station opens to Judges and Stewards
 9:00   Calibration Beer, Judging to follow
12:30   Break for Lunch - Restaurant opens 10am to Public
 1:00   Resume Judging
 3:00  Best of Show - Judging Area Open to Public
 3:30   Announcement of Raffle Winners
 3:45   Competition Prizes to be Awarded
 4:00   Distribution of Remaining Beer Entries for Sampling

Participation Open to All Non-Commercial Brewers
How to Enter:
        Entries accepted: March 1st  to March 18th, 1995 (5pm)
        3 bottles: 10-14 Ounces (No raised glass or labels) per entry
        (Entry Information and Restrictions inside)
PRIZES
1st, 2nd and 3rd places in each category: Ribbons and Certificates.
1st in each category: 
Hudson Valley Homebrewers Tee-Shirt 
and $15 Gift Certificate 
2nd in each category:  $7.50 Gift Certificate 
3rd in each category:   $5.00 Gift Certificate
1st, 2nd and 3rd in Club Awards: 
$30 for 1st, $20 for second, 
and $10 for 3rd 
BREWMASTERS CUP Trophy and Brewing Session at Matthew Vassar's Brew House
Best of Show:   1st - Case of Alexanders Malt donated by Party Creations
                2nd - Woodstock Brewing Company Sweatshirt and glasses 
                      Colonna Capper & Corker
                3rd - Case of Brewferm Malts 
Top Hudson Valley HomeBrewers Club Member  (Total Points) - 
   $100 Family Portrait from Concept Photography

Entries may be UPS directly to Party Creations only

Party Creations
RD 2 Box 35 Rokeby Road
Red Hook, NY 12571
(914) 758-0661

 Entry Information & Restrictions

ENTRY REQUIREMENTS
1. Entry must be home brewed ... NO commercial brew allowed, Amateurs only!
2. Entry fee is $5.00... five(5) or more entries are $4.00 for each entry.
                Make all checks payable to Robert Carter.
3. Brewers may enter only one (1) beer per SUBCATEGORY.
4. Brewers must submit 3 (three) bottles, 10-14 ounces per entry 
   with no distinguishing marks, raised glass (NO
   GROLSCH) or labels (painted  or otherwise).
   Caps should be plain or any writing blacked out.
5. Each bottle must have a completed bottle tag fastened by rubber bands only. 
   NO TAPE ALLOWED!
6. Please fill out only one entry/recipe form per entry.
7. If subcategory indicates multiple styles (e.g. Pilsener, Bohemian or German)
   please indicate which style you would like it judged as on the brewers 
   comment line on the recipe form.
8. Entries should be dropped off or shipped to addresses listed on cover page. 
   All entry fees, and recipe forms must accompany entries when submitted No 
   entry will be returned and all entries become the property of the
   Hudson Valley Homebrewers, inc.
9. ENTRY DEADLINE IS 5:00PM, SATURDAY, MARCH 18, 1995. This allows time for 
   settling and processing of your entry. Call ahead for any other entry 
   or delivery arrangements.

CONTEST RULES
1. All forms required by the rules must be completed by entrant.
2. Beers will be judged in the category entered. Reassignment of beers entered 
   in wrong categories is prohibited.
3. Decision of the judges is final.
4. Only beers rated GOOD (scoring 25 points or higher) will qualify for awards 
   and prizes.
5. Categories with less than six (6) entries will be collapsed to category that
   most closely resembles its style.
6. First place winners in each category will compete for Best of Show.
7. Club quality awards will be calculated from the top three winners of each
   category.
8. Score sheets will be returned as soon as possible - Including a self-
   addressed, stamped envelope will speed them on their way to you.
9. Any entry not meeting the above guidelines will be disqualified.

SHIPPING
PACK YOUR ENTRIES WELL! We recommend shipping by United Parcel Service. If 
asked the contents of your package by UPS tell them Bottles, but they are 
double-boxed and well padded. Be sure to ship them to Party Creations with 
the required entry fee, recipe form and bottle labels rubber-banded.

Competition questions should be directed to:
Robert Carter
34 Townsend Ave.
Newburgh, N.Y. 12550
(914) 565-3921

Judging questions should be directed to:
Paul Stolarski
37 Shaker Lane
Hyde Park, N.Y. 12538
(914) 229-7316

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 15:48:48 -0500
From: PRYBAK at aol.com
Subject: flaked rice

Hi!  I have about a pound of flaked rice and would like to use it in an
extract batch.  Is it possible to mash the rice without any grains?
If so what mash schedule should I use?

Thanks - email okay!
Paul Rybak

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 16:18:33 -0600
From: rlarsen at squeaky.free.org (Rich Larsen)
Subject: Constant Stirred Mash / stains / chiller pump / Miller Celis Deal / acid washing

Have the results of the constant stirred mash ever been posted?
I.E.  Did it increase astrigency, extract rate.  How was the beer?
____________

>From: dweller at GVSU.EDU (RONALD DWELLE)

Reminded me about streaking walls.  This is due to the humidity produced 
when boiling the wort.  The brown/colored streaks are due to dripping 
moisture.  The solution?  Wash the walls occasionally.  (no jab at anyone's 
cleanliness)

Ronald also says he has a wood burning stove.  The dirt on his walls is 
probably soot from the stove.  Smokers will also notice a marked increase in 
this phenomenom.
_______________

>From: Pulsifer at aol.com writes :
>
   
>    My wife decided to come over and see what this contraption was.  She
>wanted to know it worked.  I told here you put it in the pot and ran water
>through it for 15 to 20 minutes.  She thought it would use "too much" water.
>I told here that I could get a pump and recicrulate ice water from the other
>section of the sink (sounds like approval to spend more money).
>
>    I found what could be a very good solution.  I was going to get an
>aquarium power head.  They are completely submersible, have suction cups for
>attaching to side of sink and some have a plastic filter over the intake
>(keeps ice chunks out of the pump).  

ummm... if you are planning on running the hot output from the chiller over 
the ice and recirculating it through the chiller in a "closed" system you 
are going to melt all your ice in the first few minutes.  The initial output 
from a immersion chiller actually steams.

I suggest you slow your water flow down a bit and stir the wort constantly 
during the chilling.  Granted I have a 50 foot coil of 3/8 copper tube, but 
I chill 7 gallons of boiling liquid down to pitching temperature in around 5 
minutes using this method.
_____________________

On the Miller - Celis deal:
I'm probably opening myself up as flame bait with this one, but a similar 
deal was struck with Linenkugels a while ago and as far as I noticed it has 
done nothing but helped Linenkugels business.  

I'm hoping that Miller will help Celis distribute more of his good product 
to more areas that he couldn't reach before, thus helping to educate the 
unninitiated just that much more.

Now if AB had bought him out... that would be a different story.
_____________________

>Date: Mon, 06 Mar 1995 02:25:19 -0800 (PST)
>From: PGILLMAN at POMONA.EDU asks


>does anyone know the ph levels that commercial breweries use when they
>wash yeast with tartaric acid to remove the trub and contaminants?
>i tend to brew batches back to back, and would like to attempt this
>procedure in order to extend the number i can do using a single yeast.

You want to get as close to a ph of 2.0 as possible.  This will knock out 
most of the bacteria, but will not do anything to the wild yeasts or trub.
___________
=> Rich <rlarsen at squeaky.free.org>
________________________________________________________________________
Rich Larsen, Midlothian, IL.  Also on HomeBrew University (708) 705-7263
   Variety is the spice of life.
________________________________________________________________________


Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 07 Mar 1995 16:57:23 EST
From: uswlsrap at ibmmail.com
Subject: CLUB ADDRESS UPDATES--Is ZYMURGY listing correct for your club?  

We'd like to be able to update our mailing/newsletter-exchange list.  If your
present club address is NOT the same as the most recent AHA/ZYMURGY club list,
please let me know.  Although I'm sure we're not the only ones interested in
such information, out of consideration for digest bw, make it private email.
I suppose if you're posting something anyway, another line for an address
correction wouldn't hurt, but certainly don't post to the digest just to give
an address correction.  And while you're writing to me, let me know if you
want to designate a club email contact.

Now go have a beer,

Bob Paolino / Disoriented in Badgerspace / uswlsrap at ibmmail.com
"If I could see...if I could See all the symbols, unlock what
they mean, Maybe I could, maybe I could, maybe I Could meet the
artists, and get to know them personally."-Those crazy WPG boys

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 16:06:14 -0600 (CST)
From: afmccaul at rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Tony McCauley)
Subject: 4th Central ILL HBC Results

The ABNormal Brewers hosted the 4th Annual Central Illinois Homebrew
Competition on March 4, 1995.  The competition drew 98 entries in 14
flights.

Congratulations to all of the winners.


Brown Ale - 7 entries

1st -- Dave Lubertozzi - Brewers of South Suburbia
2nd -- Ed Wolfe & Carol Ligouri - THIRSTY
3rd -- Ed Wolfe & Carol Ligouri - THIRSTY

English Pale Ale - 5 entries

1st -- Roger Meridith - Central Illinois Brewers Assoc
2nd -- Tom Fitzpatrick - Chicago Beer Society
3rd -- John Griffiths - Fayettesvill Lovers of Pure Suds

American Pale Ale - 10 entries

1st -- Mark Kellums - Central Illinois Brewers Assoc
2nd -- Steve Stacy - Missouri Assoc. of Serious Homebrewers
3rd -- Eddie Brian - THIRSTY

English Bitters & Scottish Ales - 6 entries

1st -- Mike Hansen - THIRSTY
2nd -- J.D. Eichman - Inland Empire Brewers
3rd -- Ed Wolfe & Carol Ligouri - THIRSTY

Porter - 5 entries

1st -- Bob DeVries - not affiliated
2nd -- Roger Meridith - Central Illinois Brewers Assoc
3rd -- Steven Solick - not affiliated

Barley Wine, English and Scotch Strong Ale & Imperial Stout - 8 entries

1st -- Dennis Davison - Chicago Beer Society
2nd -- Dennis Davison - Chicago Beer Society
3rd -- John Yoder - ABNormal Brewers

Stout - 8 entries

1st -- Mark Soboleski - Beer Brewers of Central Connecticut
2nd -- Dennis Flaherty - not affiliated
3rd -- Dave Beedle - ABNormal Brewers

German Lager & Classic Pilsener - 9 entries

1st -- Tim Artz - Brewers United for Real Potables
2nd -- Bob DeVries - not affiliated
3rd -- Steven Solick - not affiliated

Bock, Bavarian Dark & Vienna, Marzen/Oktoberfest - 5 entries

1st -- John Griffiths - Fayettesvill Lovers of Pure Suds
2nd -- Dave Lubertozzi - Brewers of South Suburbia
3rd -- Micheal Garcia-Gualdoni - not affiliated

American Lager & California Common - 7 entries

1st -- J.D. Eichman - Inland Empire Brewers
2nd -- Mike Riddle - Marin Society of Homebrewers
3rd -- Ed Wolfe & Carol Ligouri - THIRSTY


German Ale - 5 entries

1st -- Tom McDaniel - THIRSTY
2nd -- Thomas Grant - Merrimack Valley Brewers
3rd -- Dave Holsclaw - ABNormal Brewers

German Wheat & American Wheat - 7 entries

1st -- Dennis Davison - Chicago Beer Society
2nd -- J.D. Eichman - Inland Empire Brewers
3rd -- Ed Wolfe & Carol Ligouri - THIRSTY

Belgian Beers, Fruit Beers, Herb Beers & Speciality Beers - 9 entries

1st -- Eddie Brian - THIRSTY
2nd -- Tim Artz - Brewers United for Real Potables
3rd -- Jay McNiel - not affiliated

Traditional Mead & Fruit Mead

1st -- Dennis Davison - Chicago Beer Society
2nd -- Alan Carder - ABNormal Brewers
3rd -- Dave Holsclaw - ABNormal Brewers


Best of Show  -- Dennis Davison -- Berliner Weisse
2nd BOS       -- Dennis Davison -- Still Cranberry Mead
3rd BOS        -- Roger Meridith -- English Pale Ale

The BOS judges quickly cut the field to 4 beers before the tough
negotiating started.  The first beer to get cut was Dennis Davison's
Imperial Stout.  Dennis came very close to a sweep of the BOS round.
Needless to say, Dennis was gloating.

Congratulations on the fine showing, Dennis.

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 17:14:48 -0500
From: TPuskar at aol.com
Subject: "Free" carboys/Freezing yeasts

Somewhere over the past week or so I read that both photo processing shops
and metal finishing shops get various chemicals and reagents in glass carboys
and often pitch them out after using the chemicals.  I can't find the
original post/article to respond to the poster.  Does anyone have any info on
this?  Can we really get "free" carboys?  I don't know what chemicals might
be delivered in these things but would be concerned about cleaning.  Anything
that phjot developers use probably won't do a homebrew much good.
Frugal Brewer are you out there?  Any comments?

I've just been given a yeast sample that has been described as
"irreplaceable" and would like to store it for posterity.  I'm afraid that it
might mutate is kept only on slants or plates and was thinking about freezing
it in glycerol.  Like my home autoclave, my liquid nitrogen tank is on the
fritz <g> so I was going to just freeze it in the better halfs freezer--if I
can find room amongst the hops!  ;-)  Can anyone tell me if normal household
glycerol is acceptable.  Does it have to be treated, read sanitized, in any
way before adding the yeasties?  Should I just scrape as much off a slant or
plate as I can and mix real well or can I take some slurry from the bottom of
a starter and mix it about 2:1 (in favor glycerol) and freeze that.  Any
comments would be appreciated.  Apologies to Dominick Venezia--I know you
commented on this once before, but that was when I was just getting started
and I can't find your post.

Finally, what category does ouatmeal stout fall into for the AHA style based
competitions?  Is it in the classic dry category or can it vary by sponsor
definition?

TIA
Tom Puskar


Return to table of contents


Date: 7 Mar 95 15:03:00 -0600
From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
Subject: pellet dryhopping/"stuck" ferment/magnetic SS/hop tree/DMS yeast

Tracy writes:
>Al's comment that "his [friend's] beer did smell great" 
>upon dryhopping with pellets leads me to ask if you have 
>found other hop forms, particularly plugs, offer a poorer 
>quality?

I've had several packages of extremely bad plugs, but they
were few and far between.  The distributor did not hesitate
to replace them.  Their quality was obviously bad upon opening.
In stead of the wonderful, familiar hop aroma they smelled
cheezy or like hay.

Well-packaged hops of all types (pellets, plugs, whole) all
have fine aromatic properties.  Actually, pellets seem to have
the most intense aroma.  This is not surprising since the lupulin
glands have been broken open during the pelletizing.  No, actually,
what I meant was, that despite all the troubles my friend had
bottling (he had put the pellets into his keg and they clogged
the diptube), the beer had a great aroma.  The one time I used
pellets was in the primary and I think that I may have put them
in too early.  Shortly after I added the pellets, they sank and
then were covered up by settling yeast.  The resulting beer had
a rather faint hop nose, far weaker than a similar beer made with
whole hops.

>I will admit to having tried dryhopping with plugs 
>and not caring for the _flavor_ (don't recall aroma problems).  
>It seemed to add a slight resiny character.  It was not a 
>flaw with the beer to start with, honest!  I don't believe it 
>to have been the hop variety either.  I did talk to one other 
>person who felt that they noticed this same effect.  Has 
>anyone else noticed this effect?

"Resiny" is a term I use to describe the nose on several varieties
of hops, most notably East Kent Goldings, British Columbian Goldings,
Styrian Goldings and Nugget.  Did you use one of these hops?  Also,
flavour and aroma are rather intimately linked.  Without our noses,
we can only sense four flavours, the ones we call "tastes."  Combined
with our sense of smell, the four tastes linked with the hundreds of
aromas we can distinguish are what we term as "flavours."

*****
David writes:
>The yeast began to work almost immediately and blew off gasses hard for 24 
>hours.  After it slowed I removed the blowoff and attached the airlock late 
>that evening.  The next morning the bubbles were already at one per minute.  
>What caused this sudden reduction in activity?  I checked the temperature 
>and it was at 75, I dropped the temp to around 70 but no activity resumed.  
>What can I do now?

Wait a week for the yeast to settle and bottle.  It's just about done.  At
75F it is not uncommon for a batch of beer to completely ferment in two to
three days.  This is the most common question I answer from beginners.  They
are surprised that beer can be done in a few days.  Often they miss the
fermentation completely.  They pitch the yeast and then come back to look at
the airlock two days later and there is no activity.  Yes, but... there is
almost always a brown ring of crud in the fermenter, just above the level of
the beer.  This ring is what I ask the brewers to look for (I'm usually
answering these questions on the phone) and inevitably it's there.  I tell
them that they simply missed the main part of the action and that the ale
should be ready to bottle in about a week or so.

****
Lee writes:
>stainless.  Magnet.  Nope, wasn't stainless.

There are some types of stainless steel that are ferromagnetic.

****
Don writes about the Hop Family Tree.

In some cases it does help to know the genetic relationships of hops,
but in most cases, it does not.  Cascades, for example, were an attempt,
if memory serves correctly, to be a Fuggle replacement.  You can smell
that as a Fuggle replacement it was a catastrophic failure, but I personally
love the grapefruity aroma of Cascades and am glad that the the experiment
went astray.  Also, consider that Fuggles and Styrian Goldings are related,
but in my opinion, Styrian Goldings have a resiny aroma that has more in
common with East Kent Goldings than the woody, earthy Fuggles.  If indeed
Chinook is related to EKG, then that was another experiment that took an
unexpected turn -- the two hops couldn't smell more different.

****
Mario writes:
>Has anyone had trouble with Wyeast California Lager producing DMS?

I have not.  Some yeasts have a tendancy to produce sulphury aromas,
but none that produce DMS.  DMS can be produced by bacteria, however.
You may have gotten a bacterial infection that took till conditioning
time to reach sensory threshold.

Al.

Return to table of contents


Date:    Tue, 07 Mar 95 18:27:00 EST
From: TIMF at RELAY.RELAY.COM (Tim Fields)
Subject: Holy Bananas (as I recall)

 I tried to reply to the recent posting here in HBD regarding
 banana flavors using Wyeast 1214 - but I ran afoul of the
 message length limit :).

 Whomever you are, pls drop me an email note with an address
 and I will send you some good info re this yeast in particular,
 and re Belgian ales in general.  It was compiled by members of
 a local bew club here (BURP).  It should be available via HBD
 archives as well (or so it indicates).

Tim Fields
timf at relay.relay.com

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 07 Mar 95 18:25:28 -0500
From: Dave Coombs <coombs at cme.nist.gov>
Subject: Re: Flat beer 

larrymerkel at i-link.net (Larry Merkel) has a few flat beers in an
otherwise consistently carbonated batch (unless I misread).

>> now).  Any ideas? Some possibilities:
>> 
>>         The caps didn't seal well on the flat ones.

That has happened to me.  I finally thought ot look at the cap and
saw that the seal had come loose from the metal (probably during
boiling) and therefore hadn't seated properly.  I just soak caps in
bleach now.

>>         The priming sugar didn't distribute well in the carboy.

This is possible.  I usually put the priming solution in the bottom
of the bottling vessel just as I start racking into it from the
fermenter.  The beer jet from the siphon mixes it all quite nicely.

>>         The bottles that were flat had some infection that killed the yeast
>> and kept those from carbonating.  The bottles were sanitized for 4 hours in
>> 15 gallons of water and 3/4 cup bleach.  They were all clean to the naked
>> eye before being sanitized.

It's possible that was too much bleach, but if most of the batch was
fine, I doubt this is your problem.

dave
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave Coombs					 david.coombs at nist.gov	
National Institute of Standards & Technology	 Tel:	(301) 975-2865	
Intelligent Systems Division   			 FAX:	(301) 990-9688	
Building 220  Room B-124			 recep:	(301) 975-3441
Gaithersburg MD  20899  USA      http://isd.cme.nist.gov/staff/coombs/

Return to table of contents

End of HOMEBREW Digest #1675, 03/09/95