FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  Mercury (kit.anderson)
  Re: drinking water safe hoses? (Dion Hollenbeck)
  What are the best gas stoves to buy (small/camp-type)??? (Kenneth K Goodrow)
  Ageing (Jeff Wolf)
  Caring for copper brew kettles. (Kenneth K Goodrow)
  CO2-N2/Weizens/pressing?/mash temps/fermentability for extract brewers (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
  Re: Electric stovetop brewing (Dave Hensley)
  Yeast for fruit beers. (Jeff Guillet)
  Brewcap Brainstorm (Robert Spackleheim Nonstraflarbenstamus)
  Yeast starter/Lurking (BierDude)
  Jackson at the GCHC (Carlo Fusco)
  Yeast slant file on Stanford (David Draper)
  Corn sugar/To boil or not to boil/Two Dogs (Alan Keig)
  irish moss (Andy Walsh)
  U.S. Open V Competition Results ("Keith Royster")
  Spirit of Free Beer Results (Delano Dugarm EDITS 36478)
  Re: Creamy beers (Jim Busch)
  Re: High Gravity All Grain Mashing (spencer)
  Guinness Stout (BOB)
  Small and Tiny competition (spencer)
  Re: Looking for small ale recipe (spencer)
  Re: Grain Bed (Craig Amundsen)
  Securing CO2 upright/lagering in regular 'fridge (Brian Pickerill)
  Unmalted wheat (John DeCarlo              )
  Re: Coconuts and Copper (Brian J Walter (Brewing Chemist))



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----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Mon, 22 May 95 14:00:30 -0500
From: kit.anderson at acornbbs.com
Subject: Mercury


                             


H>  Toxic...like it or not! (DocsBrew)

>Sweden has recently outlawed mercury amalgams, and Germany has 
>outlawed them on pregnant women - don't you think that means 
>something?  Whether the ADA says so or not, lots of research has 
>shown dental amalgams to be quite toxic. Many dentists are refusing 
>to use them, and many patients are having them removed.

The reason mercury amalgam fillings are illegal in Sweden is that it 
is illegal to use mercury of any sort in that country. Since you need 
to use elemental mercury in the manufacture of dental amalgam, you 
therefore can't use mercury containg amalgam.

As far as health claims about the toxicity of dental amalgam, the 
evidence is lacking. When '60 Minutes' aired their piece, I was 
inundated with people wanting their fillings changed. That has 
thankfully fallen off. I had one patient with MS that was convinced 
that her amalgams were the cause of her disease. She demanded all her 
fillings replaced as well as any metal under crowns. She wouldn't 
listen to me. After thousands of dollars, her MS didn't 'clear up' and 
she wanted her money back. I told her to call '60 Minutes".

As far as I am concerned, claims of mercury/amalgam toxicity are good 
for business but bad for the patient. So which side is more credible?

I would rather not have to use material that uses mercury because it 
gets into the environment when it is in its elemental form during the 
manufacturing process. We occasionally spill some in the office. But 
until something better comes along, it is the best option. A gallium 
amalgam is being introduced this year. We will keep our fingers 
crossed.

Kit "Travels With Chiles" Anderson
Bath, Maine
<kit.anderson at acornbbs.com>
*

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Date: Mon, 22 May 95 13:44:43 PDT
From: hollen at megatek.com (Dion Hollenbeck)
Subject: Re: drinking water safe hoses?

>>>>> "Steve" == Steve Peters <stevep at pcx.ncd.com> writes:

Steve> I am fortunate in being able to move from my 5 gallon stovetop
Steve> system, to a 10 gallon, propane fired, all-grain brewery in my
Steve> basement where it doesn't matter what I spill on the floor.  To
Steve> bring the system to full-functionallity I need to move my
Steve> brewing water from my laundry sink to the brewery which is a
Steve> good 20-30 feet away.  In the stores lately I have seen
Steve> "drinking water safe" garden hose being sold.  This seems like
Steve> it would be a good solution for filling my sparge kettle, etc.
Steve> Has anyone used a product like this, or have any other
Steve> knowledge of whether or not it imparts off-flavors?

I have been using one for about a year and cannot tell any off
flavors.  I open the tap with hot water only, so this is the worst
case possible.  If you were sending boiling liquid through it, then it
may be different, but as hot as your water heater can output, no
problem so far (or maybe my taster is shot).

dion

- -- 
Dion Hollenbeck (619)675-4000x2814     Email: hollen at megatek.com
Staff Software Engineer     Megatek Corporation, San Diego, California

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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 16:10:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kenneth K Goodrow <goodrow at merlin.etsu.edu>
Subject: What are the best gas stoves to buy (small/camp-type)???


I would like to know what the best types of small stoves are for taking 
the wort to full boil.  I have an electric now, but it is a pain and in a 
bad location in the kitchen.  Someone please send all you know about 
what's worked best for you -- size, price, etc.  I would like to save as 
much $$$ as possible (grad. student, you know how it is), but would like 
to pick up a stove that would last & last, etc.

Thanks a bunch.

Kenn Goodrow


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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 17:05:24 -0400
From: jwolf at penril.com (Jeff Wolf)
Subject: Ageing

Here is a good one for the beer chemists out there that came to me as I was 
enjoying a well aged (3 months) Fuller's ESB clone!  

What exactly is taking place when beer ages.  As it goes from the "green" 
taste to a fabulous, mellow ale?  I mean, chemically, what changes are 
taking place? This is the one question I am asked for which I have no idea 
of a reply.

Private Email is fine, but the collective may want to see the answers to 
this one.  Keep up the good work, and TIA.

Jeff Wolf
jwolf at penril.com 
_________________________________________________________________________

Jeff Wolf                              Penril Datability Networks
jwolf at penril.com                       1300 Quince Orchard Blvd
Voice (301) 921-8600 X8829             Gaithersburg, MD 20878-4106
FAX   (301) 921-0161                   USA


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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 16:20:29 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kenneth K Goodrow <goodrow at merlin.etsu.edu>
Subject: Caring for copper brew kettles.


What are the best methods/wive's tales, etc. for taking care of coppers?  

As well, anyone have any toll-free numbers/addresses for copper kettle 
suppliers.  I haven't seen any around at the supply stores I have 
frequented, and I am not familiar with their use regularly.

Hope you can cook up some helpful info.  Thanks

Kenn Goodrow 

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Date: 22 May 95 16:40:00 -0500
From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
Subject: CO2-N2/Weizens/pressing?/mash temps/fermentability for extract brewers

Todd writes:
>What is the "correct" mix of N2 to CO2 in "draft mix"?

It depends on the length of your lines and other mathematical things.
Basically, what you want to do is to dispense your stout at high pressure,
but to not overcarbonate it.  N2 is virtually insoluble in beer.  If your
normal (100% CO2) pressure is 12 psi for your line length/diameter, and
you are using 75% N2 / 25% CO2 mix, then you want to use 48 psi.  To your
beer, this will look like 12 psi of CO2 and the beer will stay carbonated.

>        What is the effect of different mixtures?

I heard of 85/15, 75/25 and 70/30 mixes, but there may be others.
line length and diameter determines which you want.

>        What characteristics are the two gasses responsible for?

The CO2 is for maintaining the carbonation and the N2 (along with the
CO2) is for pushing the beer out at a high pressure.

>What is the correct pressure to tap beer (stouts) with draft mix?

Actually, my above statement is backwards (the one about the 48 psi).
I don't know what pressure you want the mix at -- ask any bar that
serves Guinness or the supplier of the keg.  What you want to do is
to choose the gas mix that, at the pressure you need to use, say 48 psi,
your beer sees the proper pressure of the CO2-portion of the gas.
Clear as stout?  If not, email me.

>        Is that different from CO2?  Why?

See above.

>Is the flow control faucet used on Guiness and Oatmeal at bars essential?

It has a perforated disk in it that causes the beer to foam and create that
head.  You can probably get away with just opening your regular tap just
a little bit.  The constriction will cause the turbulence you desire (this,
incidentally, is partly due to the venturi effect).

>        Why?  Is it essential due to increased pressure?

Not really, but there is an additional regulator on it, which probably
makes it easier for you to tune the system.  There are a lot more factors
at work here than in a regular system.

>If I had separate CO2 and N2 cylindars how would I determine the 
>pressures necessary to obtain a certain ratio of gasses in the mixture?  

I don't know if this will work.  I believe that the lower-pressure
regulator would not allow gas through at all.  There may be some
special regulators for this type of application.  If you are choosing
the mixed gas however, here's how you select it:

Find the pressure at which the distributor says to dispense the mix.
Next, determine the pressure of CO2 which, at your serving temperature
would produce the amount of carbonation you desire.  Subtract the CO2
pressure from the total pressure.  Let's call this result X and the
CO2 pressure Y.  The ratio of X to Y is the ratio of N2 to CO2 you
want.  The regulator for the mixed gas would be set to X plus Y.  You
will probably need to adjust your line lengths and line diameters, but
I don't know offhand how to determine them for a mixed-gas, high-pressure
system.

***
Russ writes:
>Third, I don't know if Schneider's does this, but several commercial 
>weissbeers are filtered from their special (S. Delbruckii) yeast, then 
>primed with a regular S. Cerevisiaeou(and sometimes y) yeast.

I've read that Schneider is one of the breweries that does NOT do this,
and it's not S. Cerevisiae, but S. Uvarum (lager yeast) that most other
brewers add.  Rumour has it that it is more stable than ale yeast.

***
Norm writes:
>Troy Howard asks about Kirin's "pressing" in the lautering process.  Coors
>uses presses to separate the grain from the liquor.  They are long SS
>machines and I believe they literally squeeze the grain while rinsing it with
>sparge water.  At least that's the impression I got from a recent tour.

I believe there is no pressing involved.  What Coors uses are called a "mash
filter" which looks like plate and frame filters -- they literally filter the
spent grain out of the wort.
 
Perhaps someone at Kirin explained the old methods of batch laeutering and
their current method of continuous laeutering and then the ad person mucked
it all up.  I think they also mixed up the term "pressings" with the term
"runnings."  Maybe it was a matter of translation?

***
Russel writes:
> It seems to me as though the rest at 140 F does virtually nothing at all,
> and the entire conversion is taking place at 158 F, hence the high FG's.
> This is the logic which prompted me to increase the 2nd rest to 145 F.  

To which Steve responds:
>This leads me to wonder if perhaps your thermometer is reading too high?  If
>your 140/158 rests were really at 136/154, then the initial rest may be doing
>very little.  You would then be following it with a short saccharification rest
>at 154F, producing a dextrinous wort.  This would also explain why boosting the
>140 rest to 145 helps.

A too-short rest at 154F will not make for a highly dextrinous wort, but
rather leave unconverted starch in the mash.  A rest at 136 or 140 *does*
do something.  It converts long proteins to medium-sized proteins.  30
minutes at 140 will not result in much beta-amylase activity, indeed.  If
your FG is too high, you can reduce it by adding a rest in the 145F-150F
range and/or by adding a rest at 122F.

***
Guy writes:
>Having a wort with too high a proportion of unfermentables is only one 
>cause of stuck ferments (and, I should note, one cause which does 
>_not_ apply to extract brewers!).

Absolutely not.  Selection of extract (e.g. Laaglander is very high in
unfermentables) _is_ under the control of the extract brewer and as such
_does_ apply.  Also, crystal malts add unfermentables and their additions
are certainly under the control of extract brewers.  I feel that far too
many people look down on extract brewers -- even many extract brewers
appologize for being extract brewers.  There are almost as many variables
under the control of extract brewers as there are under the control of
allgrain brewers.  Excellent beer can be made either way.  Although I
currently brew about 75% of my batches using allgrain, that still leaves
25% extract brewing, right?  I bring both types to club meetings and get
compliments on the extract batches as well as the allgrain.  Although
there are a few limitations, there is no shame in brewing with extract!

Al.

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Date: Mon, 22 May 95 16:41:04 CDT
From: Dave Hensley <dhensley at ttsi.tandem.com>
Subject: Re: Electric stovetop brewing

In HBD 1736 and 1732 the upsides and downsides of electric stovetop brewing
have been discussed. I brewed on an electric stove for about 3 years, using
an 8 gallon canning pot as boiler, stradling two burners. I replaced two
burners, and finally had the burner receptacle on the large burner kind of
deteriorate, resulting in a 220v arc. At $20-30 a pop for burners, plus the
$27 for the receptacle, this got pricey and I recently got a propane cooker.
I think the long-term heat buildup on the stovetop causes the components to
age a lot faster than in normal cooking. YMMV.
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave Hensley                            Tandem Telecom
Phone: (214) 516-6295                   1255 West 15th, #7060 MS 4
Fax:   (214) 516-6804                   Plano, TX  75075
Email: dhensley at ttsi.tandem.com


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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 20:21:00 GMT
From: jeff.guillet at lcabin.com (Jeff Guillet)
Subject: Yeast for fruit beers.


Bob Sinnema wrote:

H>        I'm planning to make a blueberry-wheat beer and am curious
H>about  yeasts that others have used when making wheat-based fruit
H>beers.  There  would seem to be little advantage to using a weizen
H>yeast since one is  not looking for the unique clove/banana/spice
H>aroma of a weizen.   Nevertheless, most of the recipes I've seen call
H>for weizen yeast.  So  tell me, why shouldn't I use a garden variety
H>ale yeast?  

I'm in the process of making a clone of Pyramid's Apricot Hefeweizen.  I 
used Wyeast #1338 European because of it's low attenuation.  This should 
make for a slightly sweeter beer which lends itself to the fruit flavor.  
I find that most of the actual fruit essence comes from aroma, not 
flavor so you don't want the yeast's characteristics to compete.  You do 
want some residual sweetness in your wheat beer, however.

 -=Jeff=-   Pacifica, CA
jeff.guillet at lcabin.com

* CMPQwk 1.42-R2 * Reg #1757 *

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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 15:02:13 -0700
From: Robert Spackleheim Nonstraflarbenstamus <android at rahul.net>
Subject: Brewcap Brainstorm


I posted a message a little while back asking for information about Kinney
Baugham's Brewcap, and got a lot of great input on the subject.  I haven't
used the thing, but it sounds to me like the biggest problem people have
with it is in yeast sticking to the sides of their fermenting chamber
carboy.  Nobody wants to have to worry about agitating their brew >every
single day< to keep this from happening, so why couldn't some sort of
automatic system be made to do this?  Some ideas that came to mind were
sitting the carboy on a hacked-apart lazy susan and having a motor or
solenoid set up with an arm to jiggle the carboy once or twice a day,
or perhaps building an ultrasonic wave generator to keep the yeast away
from the sides to begin with.  I don't know about the cost or the effect-
iveness of these ideas, but I just thought I'd throw them out for y'all
to chew up.  Maybe you could just play really loud music next to it all
the time, and that would jiggle it loose..  ;-)  Keep the carboy mounted
on the hood of your car..  Send it across town via UPS once a week..
Make a head-mount for it and wear it like a hat..

Rev. Android
android at rahul.net


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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 18:02:24 -0400
From: BierDude at aol.com
Subject: Yeast starter/Lurking

A question to the collective:

  I am about to start my first batch with liquid yeast and have a question.

   I got a smack-pac of liquid weizen/ale yeast from my distributor.  I
followed the instructions on the package but decided to make a starter to
increase the amount of yeast.  I made a starter by boiling DME with water
(S.G. 1.040 approx).  I added the yeast from the smack-pac to the starter and
it took off in about 3 hours.  It hasn't hit high kreusen yet but it looks
like it will be ready tomorrow p.m.

  My question is - at the 4 hour mark there is alot of sediment at the bottom
of the bottle.  When I pitch - do shake the bottle to resuspend the sediment
or not??

  Private E-Mail to BierDude at aol.com is fine, but a public post might help
others out there lurking.

BTW - Now that I have posted, can I go back to just lurking?  There is some
perverse (voyeuristic) joy in just stay out here and lurking.

TIA

BierDude at aol.com



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Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 19:56:35 -0500
From: Carlo Fusco <fusco at io.org>
Subject: Jackson at the GCHC

Hello All,

As I stated several months ago, we (that is The Canadian Amateur Brewers
Association) will be hosting Micheal Jackson at the 1995 Great Canadian
Homebrew Conference in June. Below, is a brief description of the 2 day
event. If you wish to attend the event, please email me at fusco at io.org
and I will send you a complete information package via email.

Cheers
Carlo

*************

1995 Great Canadian Homebrew Conference & Beer Festival
June 10th and 11th, 1995
Toronto, Ontario


Thanks to the generous sponsorship of the Brewers Association of Canada,
the Canadian Amateur Brewers Association is proud to present it's 11th
annual Great Canadian Homebrew Conference & Beer Festival featuring the
"Beer Hunter" himself, Michael Jackson, author of "The Pocket Guide to
Beer" and "The Beer Companion".

On Saturday June 10, we will be celebrating Beer along with it's
relationship to food, with informative talks on Beer Tasting, Cooking
with Beer, and The Future of Beer in Canada.  We will be serving up some
extraordinary meals, including fresh oysters with stout!  Michael
Jackson will lead a tasting of unique Canadian beers, and will entertain
us with tales from the World of Beer.

On Sunday June 11, the theme will revolve around homebrewing and
Brew-on-Premise brewing, with talks on Brewing Gadgets, Draught Systems
and Recipe Development.  Several first rate homebrews will be available
for tasting and analysis.  In addition, local BOP establishments will
have their products available for tasting and will be vying for the
"Peoples Choice" award.  The grand finale will be the awarding of the
1995 GCHC Competition Awards.

The weekend event will take place on June 10th and 11th at the Royal
Canadian Legion, Branch 101 (Longbranch), located at 3850 Lakeshore
Blvd. West in Etobicoke (just west of Browns Line).  Read on for more
detailed information.  See registration form for fees.


- --
Carlo Fusco   Aurora,Ontario,Canada          Certified Beer Judge (BJCP)
              fusco at io.org <- best bet       Canadian Amateur Brewers
              ab779 at freenet.toronto.on.ca    Association Board Member

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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 11:33:52 +1000 (EST)
From: David Draper <ddraper at laurel.ocs.mq.edu.au>
Subject: Yeast slant file on Stanford

Dear Friends, awhile back I put together a document on using slants to 
culture yeast that I emailed to people, posted to r.c.b., and through the 
good graces of Spencer's Beer Page and The Brewery, made web-accessible.  
Still, several have contacted me to suggest that it be put on the 
stanford archives, so I did.  It is in:

pub/clubs/homebrew/beer/docs

and the filename is using_slants.Z (it is one of those compressed files 
we've heard a bit about lately).  Basic instructions for accessing the 
stanford ftp site are listed in the header to every HBD.  Thanks to all 
those whose input made the file possible.

Cheers, Dave in Sydney
- --
"I can't be bought for a mere $3.50." ---Jeff Renner
******************************************************************************
David S. Draper, School of Earth Sciences, Macquarie University, NSW 2109
Sydney, Australia. email: david.draper at mq.edu.au fax: +61-2-850-8428
             ....I'm not from here, I just live here....


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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 12:05:36 -0800
From: akeig at library.adelaide.edu.au (Alan Keig)
Subject: Corn sugar/To boil or not to boil/Two Dogs

G'day.
First, thanks to all the friendly folk who replied by personal e-mail to my
first post in HBD 1729.
I reckon it is worth summarising what I've found out from these letters and
also from some local sources here in Adelaide, just to set the record
straight:

American 'corn sugar' seems to be exactly the same as what we in Australia
know as 'white
sugar'/'table sugar'/'sucrose' -- in other words, that white crystalline
stuff that you can use to sweeten your coffee.
Australians (and English) use the word 'corn' to mean 'wheat' where
Americans use it in the American Indian Maize sense. So, American corn
sugar is Maize (corn) sugar (fermentable), or sucrose. In Australia,
sucrose is derived from sugar cane, rather than maize, and I believe that
in Europe they use sugar beet to produce the same product.

According to the packet, Dried Corn Syrup is a 'hydrolysed starch made from
wheat or corn. It is only 30% fermentable and therefore mostly remains in
solution in the beer, adding body and improving the head'. It is a fine
white powder, and appears to be the same substance that you in the USA know
as Malto-Dextrin.

I actually use Dextrose [often called 'Brewers' Sugar in Australia] in my
brews [I got a bit carried away when I said aka Sucrose :^( - blame the
excitement of my very first post!]. Domenick Venezia put it succintly in a
letter to me:

"Dextrose is NOT sucrose.  Dextrose (aka D-glucose, +-glucose, blood
sugar) is a monosaccharide (monomer).  Sucrose (table sugar) is a
disaccharide (polymer) consisting of a D-glucose molecule connected to a
D-fructose molecule.

Sucrose is C12H22O11; D-glucose is C6H12O6; D-fructose is C6H12O5."

I use sucrose to prime my bottles. [Actually it is a finer form of table
sugar known here as Caster sugar, but I hesitate to say much about it
except that it dissolves a bit quicker].

____________________
Thanks to Ruth Hegelson and Kirk Fleming, I can now admit to being -only-
an extract brewer, but I make great use of different adjuncts and love to
experiment [in the past 10 years or so, I can remember only one batch that
even I couldn't drink ;^( and only a handful that I wouldn't offer to my
mates].
Can I pose a question to my fellow extract HBDers:
Here's how I make up a 'normal' batch: I sit the can of extract in a small
pan of simmering water, (after making a small hole in the lid with my can
opener). This is to make the contents flow more easily. While this is
happening I dissolve the Dextrose, Dried Malt Extract, Dried Corn Syrup,
Lactose [proportions vary according to what style of beer I'm making] in 4
litres of either tap water or rainwater [again, depends what I'm making]
heated up in an aluminium jam making pot [I know! I know!! - I'm risking
the introduction of coriander flavours, but it's all I've got].
When all the goodies are dissolved I open the can of extract and pour it
in, sluicing around some more hot water in the can to get the last of it.
Now here's where the experts divide. Some say to bring this mixture to the
boil and continue boiling for a time before pouring into a fermenter,
topping up with cold water and pitching etc. etc.
Other experts say not to boil but simply pour the warm wort into the
fermenter and carry on as above.
Does anyone have any thoughts on whether to boil the wort or not, and if
so, for how long? Since the extract that I use has, I guess, already been
through all those arcane mashing and steeping procedures that I read about
in HBD, I wouldn't imagine that boiling would do anything useful, but I'd
be grateful for any feedback.
____________________
BTW I've only been reading HBD since March and I don't know if anyone has
told the wonderful story of the alcoholic lemonade called Two Dogs which is
brewed right here in Adelaide. If not, I'd be glad to share it and also
report on my attempt to make it myself.

Cheers!                 Alan from Adelaide







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Date: Tue, 23 May 95 19:45:57 EDT
From: awalsh at pop03.ca.us.ibm.net (Andy Walsh)
Subject: irish moss

Hello.
Matt Melton reckons Irish Moss and gelatin are useless. Fair enough;
I must admit I often wonder whether the ritual irish moss sprinkle actually
achieves anything worthwhile. Sometimes I forget but still get clear beer.
I do find, however, that gelatin helps yeast to settle out faster. I guess
if you're keeping the beer cool in a secondary for 3 weeks that provides
ample time to drop the yeast out. I'm just not that patient!

I have a story about irish moss some might find interesting.

A friend of mine is doing a brewing course. Recently they did their first
trial batch. They did not use irish moss but a product called Copper
Clear, which he described as tablets (or granules) of processed 
irish moss. First they made up a solution by scraping the tablets and
disolving in a jug of water.
After boiling the (unmossed) wort, they took 12 wort samples
in measuring cylinders. They then mixed varying amounts of the
Copper Clear solution to each. The samples were allowed to cool
naturally to room temperature.
The next day they checked the cylinders of wort for clarity. They 
discovered that some were as clear as anything, and others were
cloudy. There was an optimum concentration of this stuff that produced
clear wort - either too much or too little resulted in cloudy wort.
(the control, with nothing added, was cloudy too).

Now this says nothing really about chill haze, but the stuff certainly
did something most would regard as beneficial. I believe I get
clearer beers by minimising crud transfer at each stage of the
brewing process. 

The trouble with the irish moss question, is that everyone has
their own opinion  based on subjective criteria. How can
you really be sure it works unless you do some sort of scientific
test? Do you grind it up? Do you rehydrate? When do you add it to 
the boil? I don't think many of us would be keen to do the
work necessary to really answer these questions.

I for one will get hold of Copper Clear. In the meantime I'll
continue to use irish moss and cross my fingers. After all,
it can't hurt, can it?
*****************************
////     Andy Walsh from Sydney
////     awalsh at ibm.net
////     phone 61 2 369 5711
*****************************

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Date:          Tue, 23 May 1995 08:54:05 EST
From: "Keith Royster" <Royster at mro.ehnr.state.nc.us>
Subject:       U.S. Open V Competition Results

U.S. Open V Competition Results
Carolina BrewMasters - Charlotte, North Carolina
April 29, 1995

192 Entries

Wheat Beer					Stout
Weizen		Steve Peeler					Al Clayson
Weizenbock	Mark Bailey		Classic Dry	Al Clayson
Weizen		Steve Peeler		Imperial		Jessica & Bruce Pitner

Porters						Pale Ales
Robust Porter	David Pappas		ESB			Tom Wedegaertner
Brown		Steve Peeler		IPA			Craig Duncan
Brown		Bob Heckman/		ESB			David Pappas
			Linda Glitz

O'fest/Ca Common				Specialty
Ca Common		Tom Wedegaertner	Coriander Ale	Mark Bailey
O'fest		Steve Peeler		Pumpkin Pale	Craig Duncan
O'fest		Barry Delzell		Smoke Ca. Com.	Bryan Blossfeld

Am. Pale Ale					Cont. Pilsner
APA			David Pappas		German		Mike Lelivelt
APA			Tom Wedegaertner	German		Bob Gross
APA			John Mitchell		Bohemiam		Keith Houck

Barleywine					Strong Ales
Barleywine	Mark Bailey		Strong Scotch	Bryan Cronk
Barleywine	David Pappas		Strong Scotch	Robert Wolff
Barleywine	Keith Houck		Old Ale		Mike Lelivelt

Kolsch/Alt					Brown Ales
Alt			Bob H./Linda G.	American		Mike Lelivelt
Kolsch		Bob H./Linda G.	Eng. Mild		Wendell Bowling
Kolsch		Bob H./Linda G.	Eng. Brown	Mike Weeks

Bock							Belgian
Dopplebock	Bill McKenzie		Ale			Steve Peeler
Dopplebock	Bob Hall			Wit			Mark Hall
Dunkel		Mike Lelivelt		Framboise		Ralph Thieleman

Meads
Melomel/sparkling		Greg Buckwolter
Metheglin/sparkling		David Sprange
Melomel/sparkling		Greg Buckwolter

Best of Show - Mike Levivelt - Brown Ale
Congratulations Mike!!

(I apologize for any transcription errors)

+------------------------------+-------------------------+
| Keith Royster, E.I.T.        | Intuition (n): an       |
| Environmental Engineer       | uncanny sixth sense     |
| NC-DEHNR / Air Quality       | which tells people      |
|    (704) 663-1699            | that they are right,    |
| Royster at mro.ehnr.state.nc.us | whether they are or not.|
+------------------------------+-------------------------+


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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 12:42:00 -0500 (EST)
From: Delano Dugarm EDITS 36478 <ADUGARM at worldbank.org>
Subject: Spirit of Free Beer Results

     Brewers United for Real Potables held the Third Annual 
Nation's Capital Spirit of Free Beer Homebrew Competition at the 
Potomac River Brewing Company on Saturday, May 20, 1995.  Thanks 
go to our hosts; to Rick Garvin, the Judge Coordinator; to Debbie 
Parshall, Barb Stevens and Jamie Langlie, the Cooler Ladies; to 
all of our sponsors, and especially to the judges and stewards.  I 
am happy to say that we had 100% attendence by judges, and better 
than that by stewards.  
     This year we had 206 entries, divided into twelve classes.  
The winners are: 

1. Light Lager  		13 Entries
1st Lindsay Weiford  		German Pilsner
2nd Wendell Ose  		Bohemian Pilsner
3rd Fred Hardy   		Dortmunder/Export

2. Amber and Dark Lager 	7 Entries
1st Delano DuGarm  		Schwartzbier
2nd Ed Janiak and Dan Wright  	Munich Dunkel
3rd Ed Cosgrove  		Marzen

3. Bock 			9 Entries
1st Francis Parks  		Doppelbock
2nd Tim Artz   			Doppelbock
3rd Alan Czeszynski  		Traditional Bock

4. British and German Ale	33 Entries
1st Scott Bickham  		Alt
2nd Larry and Trish Koch   	English Special
3rd Fred Hardy   		English Special

5. American Style Ale		28 Entries
1st Scott Bickham  		IPA
2nd Bob Crandall  		American Pale Ale
3rd Jeff Savadel  		IPA

6. Brown Ale			15 Entries
1st Eric Nudelman 		English Brown
2nd Joseph Demko  		English Brown
3rd Andrew Duke  		American Brown

7. Porter			14 Entries
1st Keith Chamberlin 		Robust Porter
2nd Robert Stevens etc. 	Robust Porter
3rd Robert Dawson  		Brown Porter

8. Stout			22 Entries
1st Joy Hanson   		Foreign Style
2nd Rob Crandell  		Foreign Style
3rd Peter Talmadge  		Imperial Stout

9. Strong Ales 			12 Entries
1st Joy Hansen   		Barley Wine
2nd Ed Cosgrove  		Old Ale
3rd Dave and Becky Pyle 	Old Ale

10. Belgian Ales		14 Entries
1st Scott Bickham   		Fruit Lambic (Framboise, Kriek)
2nd Tim Artz   			Flanders Brown
3rd Bob Grossman  		Fruit Lambic (Framboise, Kriek)

11. Novelty			33 Entries
1st Dot Steller and Tim Artz	Fruit
2nd Tim Artz   			Herb Beer
3rd Jim Blue  			Classic Style Specialty

12. German Wheat		6 Entries
1st Janet Crowe, etc.   	Weizen
2nd A.J. DeLange  		Weizenbock
3rd Andrew Henckler  		Weizenbock

Best of Show
1st Delano DuGarm  		Schwartzbier
2nd Dot Steller and Tim Artz	Fruit
3rd Joy Hansen   		Barley Wine

Judging sheets will be mailed on Thursday, May 25.  Ribbons and 
prizes will be awarded at the June 1995 BURP meeting.  Ribbon 
winners should contact Delano DuGarm at (703) 516-9659 or 
adugarm at worldbank.org for more information.


Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 09:30:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Re: Creamy beers

Micah writes:
> Subject: CO2/N2 & Guiness
> 
> For my 2 cents worth on this subject, it is the faucet not the gas
> that makes the creamy pour. I have three of those Guiness faucets
> on my home draft setup and they pour almost any beer with that same texture
> of foam. I am dispencing with premixed 70% N2, 30% CO2 gas.

This seems contradictory.  It doesnt matter, but all the beer is
dispensed using N2/CO2 premix?  Of course it matters.  Take a can
of Guinness draught and pour it.  No sparkler in the can, very creamy
taste.  This is a direct consequence of the low soluability of N2.  Also 
note that CO2 will lend a more acidic taste to the beer.  Having just
returned from a beer hunt that included Britain, it is a huge factor,
the entire N2/CO2 mix and the dispense methods and the saturation of
the beer.  Of note in Britain is also that brewing methods differ 
between the southern flater bitters dispensed with no sparkler and
the northern creamy bitters served with swan neck and sparkler.  

Kirk asks:

> I'd like to hear your comments on these issues...as well on one more:
> 
> I think everyone's heard the story: the husks fall to the bottom of the 
> grain bed and provide a filter bed that small particles get trapped in.
> Is this another Momism?  Has anyone allowed the grain bed to drain for 
> several hours, then actually attemped to section it and look at the 
> particle size distribution?  Do I have the Momism wrong, or is it just 
> me that has never seen any evidence of such a distribution?

It does occur.  It is in a continuum between the top and bottom, as the
bed gets deeper, a higher propartion of the bed is composed of husks.
Dig a vertical shaft in the the lauter tun after lautering and this can
be observed.  It is a greater phenomenon in a looser grain bed, where the
husks can be forced down easier.

Mark writes:

>It is a waste of time to use Irish moss, and worse than nothing to use gelatin.

While Im not a IM user, many will disagree with this statement.  IM is a
very effective kettle coagulant, it is an issue of overall brewing systems
whether it is a useful adjunct.  By overall, I mean grain choice, mashing
choices, ale vs lagers, isinglass vs nothing, etc.

Jim Busch

"DE HOPPEDUIVEL DRINKT MET ZWIER 'T GEZONDE BLOND HOPPEBIER!"

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Date: Tue, 23 May 95 09:30:53 EDT
From: spencer at med.umich.edu
Subject: Re: High Gravity All Grain Mashing

kegster at genie.geis.com wrote about High Gravity All Grain Mashing: 
 :  What is it that prompts brewers to use only the first runings of a mash to
 : make a strong beer?

The desire to not have to boil forever, of course!

If I take just the first runnings from a 1.5:1 (qts/lb) mash, I get a
gravity going *in* to the boil of about 1.090, and a gravity coming
out of over 1.100 (1.122 is my "record", so far).  If I were to try to
do the same with a standard sparge, I'd have to boil from maybe 10
gallons down to 5.

So I make a big beer with the first runnings, and a smaller beer with
the second.  My most recent brew produced 3 gallons of 1.100
barleywine, and 5 gallons of 1.045 special bitter.  The whole process
took about 6 hours (an extra benefit -- two beers for slightly more
than the time cost of one).

=Spencer Thomas in Ann Arbor, MI        (spencer at umich.edu)

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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 08:33:16 -0600 (CST)
From: BOB <RJMONSON at STTHOMAS.EDU>
Subject: Guinness Stout

  
I was reading some Jack Higgins the other
night, and he mentioned the tradition of
pouring Guiness directly over the thumb
holding the glass. Some sort of insiders
tradition. Does anyone know what this is 
about?  
Thanks
Bob Monson
  

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Date: Tue, 23 May 95 09:43:23 EDT
From: spencer at med.umich.edu
Subject: Small and Tiny competition

The entry deadline for the Small and Tiny competition has been
extended to 17 June.  E-mail me for forms, or find them on the Web at
<http://guraldi.hgp.med.umich.edu/Beer/AABG/Small_and_Tiny.html>.

If you've already requested forms, they are in the mail.

=Spencer Thomas in Ann Arbor, MI        (spencer at umich.edu)

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Date: Tue, 23 May 95 09:58:26 EDT
From: spencer at med.umich.edu
Subject: Re: Looking for small ale recipe

You didn't specify all-grain or extract.  This one is all-grain.

I made this recently.  It came out very nicely.  It's a nice recipe
because you can make 10 gallons on the stove top.

My Mild 
(after Darryl Richman's Mild from the Cat's Meow)
for 10 gallons

6 lbs Belgian (DWC) Pale Malt
5 lbs Belgian (DWC) Aromatic Malt
1 lb English (M&F?) 50L crystal
1 lb light brown sugar
0.25 lb Malted wheat
(0.25 lb Flaked Barley -- oops forgot to add it!)
0.1 lb Chocolate malt

Mash-in at 50C for a 15 minute protein rest (1.5 gallons water  at  66C)
Raise to 68C with 1.75 gallons of boiling water, hold for 60 mins.
Mash-out by bringing 1 gallon of liquid to a boil and returning to
	mash (70C, not high enough).
Sparge with 6 gallons of water at 80C.  (Collected about 7 gallons)

Boil:
1 ounce Northern Brewer pellets  at  9% (60 min)
0.5 oz Fuggles plug  at  4.3% (30 min)
0.5 oz Fuggles plug at end of boil

CF chilled to 20C for pitching.

Mix with 5 gallons of pre-boiled, cooled & aerated water.

The yeast was one of:
	* YeastLab A03, several generations repitched, or
	* Cultured from the bottom of a Coopers Stout bottle

Unfortunately, my notes & my memory disagree on which yeast I ended up
using (don't ask :-).

Fermented in an open bucket for 2 days, then "dropped" (racked) into
carboys.  For one, I siphoned with normal care to avoid aeration.  For
the other, I deliberately let the beer fall from the neck of the
carboy to the bottom to get some aeration.  The second batch (with
aeration) had a "rounder", more pleasant (IMHO) flavor, with a nice
hint of butterscotch (diacetyl).

OG 1.034, FG 1.010.

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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 08:54:16 -0500 (CDT)
From: Craig Amundsen <amundsen at biosci.cbs.umn.edu>
Subject: Re: Grain Bed

> flemingk at usa.net (Kirk R Fleming) writes:

> I'd like to hear your comments on these issues...as well on one more:

> I think everyone's heard the story: the husks fall to the bottom of the 
> grain bed and provide a filter bed that small particles get trapped in.
> Is this another Momism?  Has anyone allowed the grain bed to drain for 
> several hours, then actually attemped to section it and look at the 
> particle size distribution?  Do I have the Momism wrong, or is it just 
> me that has never seen any evidence of such a distribution?

Here's my $0.02 (mmmm! copper...). It's been a while since I read this part
of _The Practical Brewer_. Those guys at the Master Brewers Association of the
Americas really have examined a cross section of a grain bed. As I recall, the 
husks are actually at the top of the lauter tun after everything settles out. 
All the other gunk is more dense than the husks and sinks faster. This implies 
that a certain amount of recirculation is required in order to let the husks 
do their filter thing on the small particles that make it through the false 
bottom or manifold.

I hope I remembered correctly; if not I'm sure I'll hear about it.
 - Craig
+-----------------------------+------------------------------------------------+
| Craig Amundsen              | DILBERT - Sometimes I wonder if it's ethical   |
| amundsen at biosci.cbs.umn.edu |           to do these genetic experiments. But |
| (612) 624-2704              |           I rationalize it because it will     |
| 250 Biological Sciences     |           improve the quality of life.         |
| 1445 Gortner Avenue         | DOGBERT - What are you making?                 |
| Saint Paul, MN 55108        | DILBERT - Skunkopotamus.                       |
+-----------------------------+------------------------------------------------+

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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 09:19:49 -0600
From: 00bkpickeril at bsuvc.bsu.edu (Brian Pickerill)
Subject: Securing CO2 upright/lagering in regular 'fridge

Hi,

I have a new corny keg setup!  Now I'm debating wether to put the CO2
can in the fridge or drill a CO2 line hole in the side of the fridge 
and mount the CO2 can in a cabinet.  I want to do the latter I guess, 
but I don't have any type of grommet for the fridge wall.  (I need 
something secure because I have a 4 year old son.)  I'm not sure if
I can securely fasten the CO2 can upright inside the fridge.  A
small screw in the plastic inside the fridge probably wouldn't
hold it that well.  I am planning to purchase a 10 lb cylinder today
to complete the setup.  Any suggestions?  TIA.

Also, I have been wondering lately why so many people seem to need
the Hunter airstats ect... for lagering.  My normal "brew fridge" in
the garage works great for lagers.  I can control the temp from about 
33 to 49 F. and it stays quite constant.  Especially in the fermenter.
There is some change in the ambient air temp inside, but the temp of
the carboy stays completely constant.  No worries.  If you have not
lagered because you don't have one of these temp control devices, I'd
certainly encourage you to try it if you have a spare 'fridge.  (Of
course, I do understand you need a controler for a freezer!)

Looking forward to my first draft homebrew,

- --Brian K. Pickerill <00bkpickeril at bsuvc.bsu.edu>


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Date: Tue, 23 May 95 10:31:40 EST
From: John DeCarlo <jdecarlo at homebrew.mitre.org>
Subject: Unmalted wheat

Marla Korchmar writes:
>>Unmalted wheat seems to be widely available in health food stores
>>both in the cracked and uncracked form.  Will using the already-
>>cracked version negatively effect the my flavor of my wit?

Kit Anderson writes:
>Health food stores also carry wheat flakes. These are unmalted and
>precooked so they don't need to be boiled or crushed. Just add them to
>the mash. I use 50% pale, 40% malted wheat, and 10% wheat flakes for
>wits.

Well, I thought this was addressed fully several months ago, but what the hey.

You don't need to boil or otherwise gelatinize unmalted wheat for a Belgian 
Wit.  Just mash with the typical Wit temperature schedule.

I crushed uncracked wheat for my first Wit and then bought cracked wheat for 
the next one.  I didn't notice any difference attributable to the wheat, but 
it was certainly a lot easier on my mill and arm <grin>.  And the packages at 
the organic food store didn't have a date on them.

John DeCarlo, MITRE Corporation, McLean, VA--My views are my own
Fidonet:  1:109/131  Internet:  jdecarlo at mitre.org


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Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 08:28:47 -0600 (MDT)
From: walter at lamar.ColoState.EDU (Brian J Walter (Brewing Chemist))
Subject: Re: Coconuts and Copper

> > copper ... copper ... copper ... copper../
> Well then.  Anyone have any first-hand experience tossing a couple pennies
> into the boil or fermenter?  I was considering using pennies as "boiling
> stones" a couple batches ago, but I was worried about copper getting into my
> beer.  (Oops.)  Next batch, I'll give it a shot, maybe with a 'split batch'.

Pennies have been 97.6% zinc, 2.4% copper since December 17, 1981.  The 
copper is used as a coating on the surface of the coins.  Before that 
they were made from an alloy which was 95% Copper/5% Zinc.  (Dave 
Miller's Column in BT, Sept/Oct 1993.  He got his info from the US Mint 
in Philly).

Miller suggests using older pennies or pieces of copper tubing if you 
want to add copper to your wort.  The latter is what I have used as boiling 
stones on occaision.  Miller also mentions that it is unlikely for an 
all-malt wort to be deficient in trace minerals such as copper or zinc.

Good Day,
- --bjw
Brian J Walter     Chemistry Graduate Student     walter at lamar.colostate.edu
RUSH Rocks Best    Homebrewer & AHA/HWBTA Beer Judge                Go Pack!
         "If I were Satan, I would have a mountain bike" - Butthead

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1739, 05/24/95